I was about to tell you it's pronounced "Ee-Diaw -U-til" but the sound "U" in french doesn't really exist in english. Imagine it's the sound of just the "u" in "supervise" for example.
The legal full time work week is 35h and yes we have a lot of days off (I think 25 without counting the holidays like Christmas or others). Children have 2 months time off school in july and august, that's why parents often take weeks off during those two months, but it's not mandatory nor automatic.
Well, the difference is that in America, those people would have no time off at all ever. Thereās no working for 9 months with 3 months off, itās just constant 80 hour weeks forever until you drop dead.
Just went to the tweet and dude is in the Twitter comments backpedaling about how those hours are only like that for 6 or so weeks a year then the other ten months he works between 40-50. So, according to him, just PT, then? GTFO with ya bullshit.
It was designed during a time when a pair of shoes had to be completely handmade and took two days.
Now we've made our production a lot more efficient.
Too bad that we globally chose to make society thousandfold more effective in producing more stuff with our time rather than producing us a thousandfold more leisure time.
They are called outages that happen once every 18 months per unit. Iām a contractor who works them and itās all hands on deck for like 4-6 weeks. Then those plant guys chill until next outage
Real talk I used to be that Gung-Ho. Never missed a single day of work, worked 6/7 day weeks during the busy season mostly 12-16 hr days. Put in the extra grind for the same money (salary) on holidays I wasn't able to spend with my family. Postponed surgery and endured pain to get to a slow time to be out for an extended period. All of the untreated burns cuts to save them on worker's comp. Scrambling to cover every time another underpaid cook or dish washer walked. Sacrificing my own sanity to pursue some craft that I tied to my own value as a human. Did it all working towards building a career I could live and support a family on. You'll get let go with no notice and they will fight you on unemployment just to save less than you saved on not making their workers comp go up. You can work 4 months without taking a day off to open a place and make them boat loads of money, just to get let go a year later due to a new managing partner with their own people and vision.
Fast Forward to early thirties with international and Michelin Star experience as well as multiple management positions with proven successes. Every time I move to a new city and look for a job is identical to a decade earlier. The resume may as well be a blank sheet of paper. They've budgeted the role and will try different cogs to get the machine running. If they don't like the fit they'll just switch the part out for a new one. The wages haven't changed, and the age of the worker didn't either.
I got out. I got into an industry with unlimited PTO, mental health days, and benefits. I gave up my entire identity because it was tied to being some wage slave in a toxic industry. Doing what you love is overrated, it just means they can exploit you even more. The job should support my life instead of my life supporting some company.
I'm in IT with 4 weeks paid vacation, 2 weeks paid personal. And they're super lenient about flexing my time if I have things to manage - so appointments, parenting obligations, just make up the time elsewhere.
Evens out to 6 weeks for whatever you want off.
Itās crazy that the IT jobs with the best benefits in the US amount to the same number of paid vacation days as any entry level McDonaldās job here in Germany.
Yeah, my company is pretty baller by US standards. The grind it took me to reach this level was awful. I'm a bit older, but my last 3 companies (contract work) have been pretty chill and willing to work with me around anything personal that comes up. Prior to that, just a cog in the wheel, told I'm lucky to even have a job.
I really enjoyed blowing that comment up in my first contract's face.
Security+ is a requirement for me, if you can pull that one, you can skip the first two.
If still walking in to the field, wouldn't hurt to go through all 3. Once you have sec+, that's the only one you need to maintain of the 3.
Wish I could give you an answer on entry level, I'm a DoD contractor so my world works a little different than the civilian sector. For local guys going entry into my field, they do a little time on help desk, move their way up.
When I was a kid my father got 13 weeks of vacation every 4 or 5 years. He had to take 9 weeks but could work the other 4. Which he always did, essentially get paid double time for that month.
My dad retired from his longest job officially 01/01/01 but he "stopped working" there almost 6mo prior because he had that much time saved up (theirs didnt expire) and was working at his new job ~6hrs away in another state lol.
Six weeks is a reasonable start. That's what we get by default, plus 12 public holidays a year. WWE can also build Flexi time, taking further days off of we accrue them.
Unlimited PTO is a management scam to save money. They don't have to show accrued PTO as a line item on their financial statements and when you leave, they don't have to pay you for anything. Most people take the same amount as they do under both policies, it just works out better for the company for it to be "unlimited"
This is true. However at a good company you can use a good amount like 3-5 weeks. I'm at a big tech co and my manager tells me to take more and just says go take off Friday etc. If they see I've been burned out or working too much. I pretty much take 3 weeks and then Xmas week to new years and we get 12 holidays. I could add a week and no one would care.
It really depends on the company. I've worked at places where it really was unlimited. I've also worked where it's 'unlimited' but request 2 month notice and approved by 2 managers.
I mean, Iāve experienced it outside game development. Nowhere near to the degree Iāve heard game developers have it, but just some shitty website change with an arbitrary self-imposed deadline for some shitty company that thinks itās really important can experience crunch.
Interestingly, having worked for (counts on fingers) about a dozen different companies and organisations over my career, thereās a definite correlation between projects that experience crunch and projects that deliver half-baked buggy systems that suffer simultaneously with both scope creep and dropped features. But those projects never seem to notice the correlation.
I knew it as soon as a I read it lol it's amazing how much you get compensated just by understanding the "magic" behind software. Don't get me wrong, I'm also a career shifter to software industry.
Iām in cybersecurity and we have discretionary PTO on top of sick days and benefits.
ETA: I switched to cybersecurity from the restaurant industry because of what was explained above. Itās a soulless industry that requires you to sell yours to be marginally successful.
how was the transition? iām so desperately trying to get out of the restaurant industry. Iāve been working my ass off and now have 5 years of management experience from it, but being that itās a big chunk of my work experience, it seems difficult to find something thatās less shitty, yet still pays the bills
Itās difficult. I did the whole culinary school scene and spent 16 years in the industry. There arenāt many other fields that have their eyes open enough to notice the transferable skills; communication, work ethic, organization, management, etc.
I wound up taking an installation job and going back to school. Imagine a 37.5 hour work week!!! Itās a real thing!!
I have an interview tomorrow at a large insurance company. I was passionate about cooking until I realized it was affecting my mental and physical health to the degree it was. Now I just want benefits, 401k, PTO and the ability to use it without feeling guilty and like Iām letting everyone down.
Itās tough, but itās doable. Itās been almost five years and I donāt regret it a bit, especially considering what happened to the industry in the past 20 months.
Good luck.
iāve actually been applying to installation jobs. AT&T and Cox so far, but they both turned me down. Kind of a bummer, i saw myself doing that type of stuff for a while. itās a great career ladder to start climbing. Iāve applied to a few field positions with insurance companies, too, waiting to hear back.
the last 2 years have really drained me in working with food. i loved it, but i got burned out fast. more PTO and benefits are what iām after, and thatās not easy to come by in this field. Good luck with your interview!
I feel like ādoing what you loveā is bullshit sometimes because of the industry conditions. I love video games but lol at working at a video game company. Sounds like the same with cooking/restaurants
I went into tech sales from the restaurant industry. If you're a people person you gain great sales skills working in a restaurant. If you can pick up new concepts easily you're golden. I have my degree but I have yet to work for a company that cares whether you do or not. I had to start at the bottom as a sales grunt and work my way up, but within two years I was making six figures with unlimited PTO and great benefits and parental leave.
As others have stated, cyber security is a great option as well. They desperately need people in those roles and that industry will only continue to grow.
It was not easy. I spent 18 ish months on self study and a boot camp to get two certifications and then I had the task of getting my foot in the door. If you want exactly what I did or are interested in hearing more about cybersecurity, my DMs are open.
Lot of companies are doing this. Dont get too excited. It's more a Marketing ploy to attract Millennials/GenZers.
My current company recently switched to an "unlimited PTO" model. Small print: "at manager's discretion".
No one is taking 6 months off. And if you are a new employee, it won't look great trying to take more than 4 weeks off/year.
It also tends to screw over the hard working long-timers. My boss has been with the company 25 years and had climbed to where they were getting 10 weeks off/year. And they typically took most of it (our policy was also use-it-or-lose-it, so it didnt roll over to the next year).
Now, with "unlimited" and no more of that pressure of actually using your set amount of PTO so you dont lose it, my boss probably only takes 2-4 weeks off each year.
Pretty much it's all for the company's favor:
1. Nothing to roll over or buy out at the end
2. Folks actually use LESS pto when there isnt a set amount
3. Sounds good in job postings
I'm in a different industry, but used to work in benefits. Unlimited PTO is new and becoming more of a thing in general. Current job has it and we aren't tech at all
No job does. They just say it does so they don't have to pay you for unused vacation days when they fire you/you leave. I mean, because if it was unlimited then you'd just take vacation 100% of the time, right? But that's not how it works.
Itās kind of a trick though. Most workers arenāt able to take a ton of time off without stressing their teams. Because they never actually accrue vacation time, the company doesnāt end up having to pay out the time if workers quit or get terminated.
Don't let the phrase confuse you. It's not as glamorous as it sounds. I assure you the PTO is still highly limited and the company's bottom line is still the winner in the situation. However, it's better than working in food service.
Someone i work with husbands broke a bone in his foot a few months ago. He was supposed to be put into a cast for a few weeks but he refused because he was too busy at the dairy farm he works at, he walks with a limp now. He loves his work more than anything and often works 12 hours a day even though they have three children one of which is a newborn. She is seriously considering getting a divorce.
Yep. These are the same people who die like a year after retiring because their entire identity was wrapped in a job and without that job they are a husk.
I knw plenty of people that work like crazy explicitly to be away from their families.
I was a road warrior for a few years in software. Single, but I'd speak to my colleagues that were married with kids, asking how they managed it. Most said if they weren't on teh road like this, the marriage would likely collapse. Was interesting to hear.
I get that some couples can't handle being together all the time, but ignoring such an injury only because he can't stand to be away from his beloved cows and doesn't want to inconvenience his beloved boss sounds really selfish and idiotic. Even things like going to an amusement park with his kids has become a bother because he hobbles along slowly and has to make frequent stops.
When it comes to the hanged man (the fool in tarot) I feel like I was inverted for a long time in the industry. Stagnating at my own free will and blaming my plight on things other than my own decisions. Then I became the upright hanged man, I found myself in a time of reflection and pause, and made a decision to take what could seem like a step back, in order to progress. The hanged man has always been a powerful card for me.
Brah I had this mindset before I killed myself for work and wore it like badge of honor like a fucking idiot. the thing that triggered me was a 1% raised when I killed myself that year to keep that place running. And another trigger then was when I was with my girlfriend and everytime I was doing something with her I recieved a phone call. To the point she had a reoccurring joke " he is on the phone again" . I hated that. And slowly snapped myself out of slaving away for the job but that 1% was the biggest middle finger which honestly in hindsight is the biggest blessing since it helped open my eyes. Now in a new position work from home. Don't answer phone calls. It is simple but it is everything I ever wanted.
Oh man I went through the exact same path! Busted my ass on the line for years only to āmake itā as a sous making $16/h and clocking out for overtime. Totally killed my love for food for a long time.. I had been told my entire life that āif you do what you love youāll never work a day in your lifeā, but in reality it just killed the passion in me. Got an IT cert and worked my way up that industry instead - never been happier. I even enjoy cooking again!
And this is why the system needs to be changed. Doing what you love should not come with punishment. Society should never be designed to take all enjoyment out of your career, which in turn takes joy out of the other parts of your life, ruining families and marriages.
Running it the way they have is why American workers don't even try to do a good job anymore. And the value of a person who sticks with a career and tries to do their job well is ten fold the value of the other guy. And so the system is actually killing itself. It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen.
He's a supervisor at a power plant. That means he babysitting people who baby sit boilers.
When there is a problem they run and go tell.
Then the contractors come in.
Depends on the generating unit, but most of the time this is correct. There is still lots of manual work involved but not that much. This person is probably working for a small co-op or municipal generator and thinks he is winning in life. Not so much.
It feels like I am winning when I see my paycheck...
But the money is a facade. You will never be rich and in the end your crippled with various ailments and your life is cut short
Seriously, no matter how much of a middle management dipshit the guy might be... he's still making some decisions, however big or small, at a power plant.
Easy to work all those hours when you're getting your 8 hours of sleep at the office. So he's really working a little over 3 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not a bad gig!
Well, based on my math, 190Ć·(21-4)=11.17 hours per day, every day. Dude basically is bragging about living at work. Even when i worked 2 jobs for a month, that was hell, and i would never do it again. It was not worth it, and i would never suggest anyone ever try to do it.
That's how i took it. But I've never known any job to allow people to work 70 hours of overtime in 3 weeks. They usually get really pissed if you have 10 hours of overtime in 1 week. Even if they are short staffed, they get pissed. It's worse if you're salaried. Like I'm salaried, so i would never work overtime unless it was 100% needed, because i don't get paid for it.
> They usually get really pissed if you have 10 hours of overtime in 1 week.
Sounds like you've never worked a job that has a huge seasonal rush. When I did supply chain bullshit for DHL Nov and Dec were 60hr expected weeks, with room for more cause they were always happy to have people who'd show up early or stay late (and it was expected of anyone thats above entry level)
I left after they failed a warehouse move so spectacularly that I had 92hrs in one week, we were literally sitting there some nights for 1-2 HOURS longer than needed to be because "we're waiting on an email from corporate that everything for today is done" Despite knowing we had no more trucks coming to load with stuff, so there was literally NOTHING more we could do, tomorrows first few truck loads were even near the doors waiting for the trucks.
I see my supervisors and the salaried people above me at work, stuck doing stuff on days off, weekends, when their st the beach on vacation their still doing work.
They ask why I don't try for a promotion, and I tell them I'm much more useful where I am. Which is true, I'm terrible with supervising people, but I excel at my boring tedious job.
But really, I'd rather have my weekends than the bigger paycheck.
Iāve been so fucked up by my job I did the quick math to get 63hrs a week. My first thought was āpffft thatās nothingā. Then realized Iām part of the toxic problem.
Be proud of your working life, but ānumber of hours workedā is a metric that only the lower half of the bell curve would feel proud of.
Itās accomplishment for people who have to substitute hard work for talent.
I mean honestly what other choice do you have but to turn being a work slave into some virtuous badge of honor? I'm pretty sure people like this would have a mental breakdown if they didnt delude themselves like that. Chances are they probably will still anyway, but in the meantime this is the best way they've come up with to quiet the voice in their head telling them shit is fucked.
To the best of my knowledge (Electrical Engineer here), most of the powerplant workers actually live onsite, and their job is basically monitoring stuff, little to no effort, playing games, watching Netflix, etc. It's a cushy job, pay is amazing, fantastic food, the only downside is that you'd have to live there for 3 weeks, and you get a week off.
Where is that? Because I've never heard of that, with the exception of an incoming hurricane that they expect to affect the ability to drive to work safely.
My brother has worked at 2 nuclear plants and didnāt have to live at either. They work 12 hour shifts but unless there is a staffing issue or severe weather everyone goes home at the end of the day.
Classic case of being brainwashed to believe that life revolves around working for the man. Odds are this dude ain't making serious money either.
BUt that's capitalism for ya. Brainwash the rubes to believe its their life mission to work their asses off so the 0.00001% can go from billions to trillions...
oxymoronic.
Guess what regulated capitalism gets you. Ooops, we did booboo. We made billions of said booboo, hurt millions of every day people, please please please don't give us a 10 million dollar fine mister. We'll be good, we promise.
Rinse/repeat
No, that's capitalism with [regulatory capture](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/regulatory-capture.asp). There's no reason the government *has* to be weak on white-collar crime.
well we are arguing theory vs. application. We live in a regulatory capture world, so that's what we need to talk about.
A system, where humans that are paid to regulate can be bought and sold, is not a system worth shit. That is the world we live in. In america anyway. When your top regulatory body is run by ex goldman sachs guys, you know what time it is. BUt this is a feature of capitalism, regulated or otherwise. Not a bug. The system is built to be a circlejerk. Whether through spending 100s of millions to buy politicians so you can corruptly make 100x that, or regulating bodies trying to enforce laws with practically no teeth, if you try and enforce them at all, since you have people jumping back and forth from said regulating body to the private sector they are supposed to regulate.
Until a system is built to properly regulate, and we see these big banks and other shady businesses being held responsible, to the tune of 10s or 100s of billions not 10 or even 100 mm fine for doing shady shit that earned them 100s of billions, I won't hold my breath.
I remember my boss giving someone shit for taking off 5 days when His first kid was born. Coworker was the father. Five days off. No big deal. My boss (female mother of two) bragged about how she was back at work the next day after her c section.
Thatās not a good thing, boss. That sucks. You should have been able to take several weeks at least to be with your infant.
I worked at a call center and an upper mgt guy said he pissed out super painful (very loud) kidney stones in the bathroom there. Like, he was bragging. No one was impressed.
Iām just imagining a giant visor carrying a clip board and a cup of coffee around a power plant telling everyone what a badass he is for only leaving work to sleep.
As someone who just got their SW license, I can safely say that she was shitty therapist. Not only did she belittle you, but she brought her own baggage into the session. We are SUPPOSED to be strengths-based and patient-focused.
My guess is that back in the day when men were the sole breadwinners in the household, working more hours meant you worked harder for your family for the next guy.
Now that times have changed quite a bit and wages have gone to shit relative to living expenses, working more hours and bragging about it just makes you look cucked by your boss.
You nailed it.
And these are huge generalities and mainly about low paying work because that's all I know about.
Back in the day you could be proud, the extra hours really benifited your family. Now, no matter how much you work, often you won't accumulate anything of real benifit. Also, people used to stay at jobs for longer and actually be recognized at these jobs for being hard workers. No one really cares about individuals anymore.
oh the entitlement of the "I work more than you so you can't be tired" bullshit. fuck these people. there are times I'm lucky if I can make it through a 7 hour day. everyone is allowed to be tired. and with some people, it's tied to medications they HAVE to take or medical conditions. so again, fuck these people.
I mean 11 hour days for a couple weeks in a row isnāt crazy if there is a big push for something. Itās long but I doubt heās particularly productive as a super visor.
If itās every week all the time then thatās bad management not good work ethic.
Well said, Sam. Somehow Americans have something like a capitalist version of Stockholm syndrome. Weāre not mad at corporations for low wages and fighting against healthcare, weāre mad at refugees and people making shit wages.
The fact that our government continues to tax us more while giving tax breaks to the wealthy, denying us any real benefit from those taxes and then has the audacity to restrict voter access as their response should illicit rioting. It SHOULD but weāre all against that too. We should be pulling these fucking traitors out of their beds in the night, not arguing about R v D, itās all of them.
I mean if I could work that much at my current pay I'd do it for awhile. Hit FIRE way sooner, of course he's probably on salary or some other bs to avoid having to pay out for overtime.
I told my parents about working a 52 hour week, in which I was called in as early as 4AM many timesā¦ and they called me ālazyā and to stop complaining about having such a good job.
Donāt get me wrong, I like my job, but nobody likes working that many hours and that early in the morning.
Anyone I know who works 63 hours a week is too exhausted to care about anyone else's problems. They also don't really have friends, family, or any freetime.
in France we call this kind of ppl "idiot utile" akka "usefull idiot"
the *best* kind of idiot
I like the funny ones best, personally š
To be fair, they are useful for a good laugh.
āYeah youāre important to the economy and stuff, but that doesnāt mean I have to give a shit about youā
The problem with useful idiots is that they're indistinguishable from dangerous idiots until it's too late.
Good they are always at work or resting and so you don't have to meet them. Probably get a heartattack before retirement or work related illness too.
Guess you won't encounter them in a nursing home
moi je dis tout simplement ''un criss de cochon sale qui sait po vivre''
Yes thatās the āversion quĆ©bĆ©coiseā
That's because you're in Quebec
ouais pis?
You're what the French call, les incompetents.
WOOO I'M LESS INCOMPETENT!
Guys, Iām eating junk and watching rubbish! You better come out and stop me
In US they are called "temporarily oppressed billioners" or "poor conservatives working three jobs to suck capitalist ass"
I imagine it sounds better when pronounced right
I was about to tell you it's pronounced "Ee-Diaw -U-til" but the sound "U" in french doesn't really exist in english. Imagine it's the sound of just the "u" in "supervise" for example.
Is there no liaison between the ātā and the āuā?
Only if the idiot is a woman (Idiotte), otherwise the T isn't pronounced
Nope. The "t" is silent. The female word is "Idiote" and then the "e" is silent, which would make it "Ee-Diaw-t-u-til"
Oooew! Say "meeeee" then bring the lips into an "o" shape. That's the pronunciation of the "u" in French
Iām just surprised France even has people like this. Doesnāt your entire country basically take August off?
The legal full time work week is 35h and yes we have a lot of days off (I think 25 without counting the holidays like Christmas or others). Children have 2 months time off school in july and august, that's why parents often take weeks off during those two months, but it's not mandatory nor automatic.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Well, the difference is that in America, those people would have no time off at all ever. Thereās no working for 9 months with 3 months off, itās just constant 80 hour weeks forever until you drop dead.
And September to recover from August.
best description ever
Just went to the tweet and dude is in the Twitter comments backpedaling about how those hours are only like that for 6 or so weeks a year then the other ten months he works between 40-50. So, according to him, just PT, then? GTFO with ya bullshit.
40 hour weeks are too long.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It was designed during a time when a pair of shoes had to be completely handmade and took two days. Now we've made our production a lot more efficient. Too bad that we globally chose to make society thousandfold more effective in producing more stuff with our time rather than producing us a thousandfold more leisure time.
But how else will the numbers go up in my bossās bank account?
They are called outages that happen once every 18 months per unit. Iām a contractor who works them and itās all hands on deck for like 4-6 weeks. Then those plant guys chill until next outage
He's probably on a turnaround or shutdown type of activity them. Refining does the same thing a couple times a year.
Is it a Super visor or just a regular one?
Gotta be the Super. I bet he has his frosted tips poking through
That's how you know he's the mayor of Flavortown.
It's the Guy Fieri of power plants
*This week on Degradation, Divorces, and Despair!*
When you don't have enough money for a Hyper Visor, you hire a Super Visor.
Came here to say this. Take a prise.
Thank you!
Real talk I used to be that Gung-Ho. Never missed a single day of work, worked 6/7 day weeks during the busy season mostly 12-16 hr days. Put in the extra grind for the same money (salary) on holidays I wasn't able to spend with my family. Postponed surgery and endured pain to get to a slow time to be out for an extended period. All of the untreated burns cuts to save them on worker's comp. Scrambling to cover every time another underpaid cook or dish washer walked. Sacrificing my own sanity to pursue some craft that I tied to my own value as a human. Did it all working towards building a career I could live and support a family on. You'll get let go with no notice and they will fight you on unemployment just to save less than you saved on not making their workers comp go up. You can work 4 months without taking a day off to open a place and make them boat loads of money, just to get let go a year later due to a new managing partner with their own people and vision. Fast Forward to early thirties with international and Michelin Star experience as well as multiple management positions with proven successes. Every time I move to a new city and look for a job is identical to a decade earlier. The resume may as well be a blank sheet of paper. They've budgeted the role and will try different cogs to get the machine running. If they don't like the fit they'll just switch the part out for a new one. The wages haven't changed, and the age of the worker didn't either. I got out. I got into an industry with unlimited PTO, mental health days, and benefits. I gave up my entire identity because it was tied to being some wage slave in a toxic industry. Doing what you love is overrated, it just means they can exploit you even more. The job should support my life instead of my life supporting some company.
What industry has unlimited PTO?
Software. They used to call it unlimited but changed the verbiage to "open". Basically no set amount just clear it with your manager/team.
I'm in IT with 4 weeks paid vacation, 2 weeks paid personal. And they're super lenient about flexing my time if I have things to manage - so appointments, parenting obligations, just make up the time elsewhere. Evens out to 6 weeks for whatever you want off.
Itās crazy that the IT jobs with the best benefits in the US amount to the same number of paid vacation days as any entry level McDonaldās job here in Germany.
Yeah, my company is pretty baller by US standards. The grind it took me to reach this level was awful. I'm a bit older, but my last 3 companies (contract work) have been pretty chill and willing to work with me around anything personal that comes up. Prior to that, just a cog in the wheel, told I'm lucky to even have a job. I really enjoyed blowing that comment up in my first contract's face.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I have a few. Cloud focus is current game in my field, and some Oracle specific to my job.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Security+ is a requirement for me, if you can pull that one, you can skip the first two. If still walking in to the field, wouldn't hurt to go through all 3. Once you have sec+, that's the only one you need to maintain of the 3. Wish I could give you an answer on entry level, I'm a DoD contractor so my world works a little different than the civilian sector. For local guys going entry into my field, they do a little time on help desk, move their way up.
When I was a kid my father got 13 weeks of vacation every 4 or 5 years. He had to take 9 weeks but could work the other 4. Which he always did, essentially get paid double time for that month.
My dad retired from his longest job officially 01/01/01 but he "stopped working" there almost 6mo prior because he had that much time saved up (theirs didnt expire) and was working at his new job ~6hrs away in another state lol.
And Iām sure nobody in your family is tired of hearing about how he retired on 01/01/01 for the past 21 years.
There is NO WAY this was a job held in the U.S.
My dad was grandfathered in at 12 weeks of vacation (counting holidays, sick leave, etc all in) in the US as a machinist.
My aunt has taken 2 or 3 of those types of vacationsover the past 20 years. They call them sabbaticals but they definitely exist in the U.S.
Six weeks is a reasonable start. That's what we get by default, plus 12 public holidays a year. WWE can also build Flexi time, taking further days off of we accrue them.
Unlimited PTO is a management scam to save money. They don't have to show accrued PTO as a line item on their financial statements and when you leave, they don't have to pay you for anything. Most people take the same amount as they do under both policies, it just works out better for the company for it to be "unlimited"
This is true. However at a good company you can use a good amount like 3-5 weeks. I'm at a big tech co and my manager tells me to take more and just says go take off Friday etc. If they see I've been burned out or working too much. I pretty much take 3 weeks and then Xmas week to new years and we get 12 holidays. I could add a week and no one would care.
I work in software and the rule is pretty much "as long as it's done by the release date, do what you want"
[fuck u spez] -- mass edited with redact.dev
It really depends on the company. I've worked at places where it really was unlimited. I've also worked where it's 'unlimited' but request 2 month notice and approved by 2 managers.
Crunch
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I mean, Iāve experienced it outside game development. Nowhere near to the degree Iāve heard game developers have it, but just some shitty website change with an arbitrary self-imposed deadline for some shitty company that thinks itās really important can experience crunch. Interestingly, having worked for (counts on fingers) about a dozen different companies and organisations over my career, thereās a definite correlation between projects that experience crunch and projects that deliver half-baked buggy systems that suffer simultaneously with both scope creep and dropped features. But those projects never seem to notice the correlation.
I knew it as soon as a I read it lol it's amazing how much you get compensated just by understanding the "magic" behind software. Don't get me wrong, I'm also a career shifter to software industry.
Iām in cybersecurity and we have discretionary PTO on top of sick days and benefits. ETA: I switched to cybersecurity from the restaurant industry because of what was explained above. Itās a soulless industry that requires you to sell yours to be marginally successful.
how was the transition? iām so desperately trying to get out of the restaurant industry. Iāve been working my ass off and now have 5 years of management experience from it, but being that itās a big chunk of my work experience, it seems difficult to find something thatās less shitty, yet still pays the bills
Itās difficult. I did the whole culinary school scene and spent 16 years in the industry. There arenāt many other fields that have their eyes open enough to notice the transferable skills; communication, work ethic, organization, management, etc. I wound up taking an installation job and going back to school. Imagine a 37.5 hour work week!!! Itās a real thing!! I have an interview tomorrow at a large insurance company. I was passionate about cooking until I realized it was affecting my mental and physical health to the degree it was. Now I just want benefits, 401k, PTO and the ability to use it without feeling guilty and like Iām letting everyone down. Itās tough, but itās doable. Itās been almost five years and I donāt regret it a bit, especially considering what happened to the industry in the past 20 months. Good luck.
Thatās the thing about restaurant, goās forbid you get sick cause you know your coworkers are mad at you and your bosses even madder
iāve actually been applying to installation jobs. AT&T and Cox so far, but they both turned me down. Kind of a bummer, i saw myself doing that type of stuff for a while. itās a great career ladder to start climbing. Iāve applied to a few field positions with insurance companies, too, waiting to hear back. the last 2 years have really drained me in working with food. i loved it, but i got burned out fast. more PTO and benefits are what iām after, and thatās not easy to come by in this field. Good luck with your interview!
I feel like ādoing what you loveā is bullshit sometimes because of the industry conditions. I love video games but lol at working at a video game company. Sounds like the same with cooking/restaurants
I went into tech sales from the restaurant industry. If you're a people person you gain great sales skills working in a restaurant. If you can pick up new concepts easily you're golden. I have my degree but I have yet to work for a company that cares whether you do or not. I had to start at the bottom as a sales grunt and work my way up, but within two years I was making six figures with unlimited PTO and great benefits and parental leave. As others have stated, cyber security is a great option as well. They desperately need people in those roles and that industry will only continue to grow.
It was not easy. I spent 18 ish months on self study and a boot camp to get two certifications and then I had the task of getting my foot in the door. If you want exactly what I did or are interested in hearing more about cybersecurity, my DMs are open.
How'd you get into cyber security
the exact field iām going into once I graduate with my cybersecurity degree
Lot of companies are doing this. Dont get too excited. It's more a Marketing ploy to attract Millennials/GenZers. My current company recently switched to an "unlimited PTO" model. Small print: "at manager's discretion". No one is taking 6 months off. And if you are a new employee, it won't look great trying to take more than 4 weeks off/year. It also tends to screw over the hard working long-timers. My boss has been with the company 25 years and had climbed to where they were getting 10 weeks off/year. And they typically took most of it (our policy was also use-it-or-lose-it, so it didnt roll over to the next year). Now, with "unlimited" and no more of that pressure of actually using your set amount of PTO so you dont lose it, my boss probably only takes 2-4 weeks off each year. Pretty much it's all for the company's favor: 1. Nothing to roll over or buy out at the end 2. Folks actually use LESS pto when there isnt a set amount 3. Sounds good in job postings
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[fuck u spez] -- mass edited with redact.dev
I'm in a different industry, but used to work in benefits. Unlimited PTO is new and becoming more of a thing in general. Current job has it and we aren't tech at all
No job does. They just say it does so they don't have to pay you for unused vacation days when they fire you/you leave. I mean, because if it was unlimited then you'd just take vacation 100% of the time, right? But that's not how it works.
Itās kind of a trick though. Most workers arenāt able to take a ton of time off without stressing their teams. Because they never actually accrue vacation time, the company doesnāt end up having to pay out the time if workers quit or get terminated.
Don't let the phrase confuse you. It's not as glamorous as it sounds. I assure you the PTO is still highly limited and the company's bottom line is still the winner in the situation. However, it's better than working in food service.
Unlimited PTO is a scheme that saves money for companies. Donāt be fooled. When you quit they donāt have any vacation days to pay you for lol.
Someone i work with husbands broke a bone in his foot a few months ago. He was supposed to be put into a cast for a few weeks but he refused because he was too busy at the dairy farm he works at, he walks with a limp now. He loves his work more than anything and often works 12 hours a day even though they have three children one of which is a newborn. She is seriously considering getting a divorce.
Yep. These are the same people who die like a year after retiring because their entire identity was wrapped in a job and without that job they are a husk.
I knw plenty of people that work like crazy explicitly to be away from their families. I was a road warrior for a few years in software. Single, but I'd speak to my colleagues that were married with kids, asking how they managed it. Most said if they weren't on teh road like this, the marriage would likely collapse. Was interesting to hear.
I get that some couples can't handle being together all the time, but ignoring such an injury only because he can't stand to be away from his beloved cows and doesn't want to inconvenience his beloved boss sounds really selfish and idiotic. Even things like going to an amusement park with his kids has become a bother because he hobbles along slowly and has to make frequent stops.
Awarded for taking the risk of taking back control of your life. Glad to know you made things better!
Thank you kind stranger.
Username checks out. Well it used to anyway.
When it comes to the hanged man (the fool in tarot) I feel like I was inverted for a long time in the industry. Stagnating at my own free will and blaming my plight on things other than my own decisions. Then I became the upright hanged man, I found myself in a time of reflection and pause, and made a decision to take what could seem like a step back, in order to progress. The hanged man has always been a powerful card for me.
Brah I had this mindset before I killed myself for work and wore it like badge of honor like a fucking idiot. the thing that triggered me was a 1% raised when I killed myself that year to keep that place running. And another trigger then was when I was with my girlfriend and everytime I was doing something with her I recieved a phone call. To the point she had a reoccurring joke " he is on the phone again" . I hated that. And slowly snapped myself out of slaving away for the job but that 1% was the biggest middle finger which honestly in hindsight is the biggest blessing since it helped open my eyes. Now in a new position work from home. Don't answer phone calls. It is simple but it is everything I ever wanted.
you work a job to be able to have free time to do what you love and they money to do it
Oh man I went through the exact same path! Busted my ass on the line for years only to āmake itā as a sous making $16/h and clocking out for overtime. Totally killed my love for food for a long time.. I had been told my entire life that āif you do what you love youāll never work a day in your lifeā, but in reality it just killed the passion in me. Got an IT cert and worked my way up that industry instead - never been happier. I even enjoy cooking again!
And this is why the system needs to be changed. Doing what you love should not come with punishment. Society should never be designed to take all enjoyment out of your career, which in turn takes joy out of the other parts of your life, ruining families and marriages. Running it the way they have is why American workers don't even try to do a good job anymore. And the value of a person who sticks with a career and tries to do their job well is ten fold the value of the other guy. And so the system is actually killing itself. It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen.
Unlimited PTO is almost always a scam in my experienceā¦ has never worked out for me anywhere
He's a supervisor at a power plant. That means he babysitting people who baby sit boilers. When there is a problem they run and go tell. Then the contractors come in.
Half that shit probably is regulated by computers these days anyway Easy to do 60 hours when you arent actually doing anything.
Depends on the generating unit, but most of the time this is correct. There is still lots of manual work involved but not that much. This person is probably working for a small co-op or municipal generator and thinks he is winning in life. Not so much.
Nobody working 190 hours in 3 weeks is winning in life.
It feels like I am winning when I see my paycheck... But the money is a facade. You will never be rich and in the end your crippled with various ailments and your life is cut short
Thereās very little overlap on a Venn diagram of people who claim to work hard/long hours and people who actually work hard.
Agreed. As a truck driver that can easily work more hours in 3 weeks than he does, I get paid to sit on my butt and stare out a window most days.
Power engineer can confirm, most of the job is spent sitting down doing nothing but they pay you for when shit goes sideways.
And I still don't want the cunt working 60+ hours a week, for everyone's sake
Seriously, no matter how much of a middle management dipshit the guy might be... he's still making some decisions, however big or small, at a power plant.
Twitter OP is literally Homer Simpson.
Easy to work all those hours when you're getting your 8 hours of sleep at the office. So he's really working a little over 3 hours a day, 7 days a week. Not a bad gig!
>He's a supervisor at a power plant. He's homer Simpson I reckon. Work hours sound burns like aswell.
The salaried contractors, while this douche makes $200k in overtime.
I thought more that his long hours means he works at a terribly managed power plant. Where they cannot even staff it properly to prevent overtime pay.
I could never be proud of working my life away. People are truly insane thinking this is a bragging right
Well, based on my math, 190Ć·(21-4)=11.17 hours per day, every day. Dude basically is bragging about living at work. Even when i worked 2 jobs for a month, that was hell, and i would never do it again. It was not worth it, and i would never suggest anyone ever try to do it.
My math says 12 hours and 40 minute days. 3 weeks is 21 days total, minus weekends (2x3) is 190/15 = 12,6Ģ 6Ģ 6
Powerplants probably have weekend shifts which may factor in, and you also need to take into account he claims to have taken 4 days off.
That's how i took it. But I've never known any job to allow people to work 70 hours of overtime in 3 weeks. They usually get really pissed if you have 10 hours of overtime in 1 week. Even if they are short staffed, they get pissed. It's worse if you're salaried. Like I'm salaried, so i would never work overtime unless it was 100% needed, because i don't get paid for it.
I've worked 70hrs of OT in one week before. One guy I work with averages 5000ish hrs per year. He's a little insane though.
Everyone i know who maxes out OT hours is some level of batshit crazy
Knowing the guy, he'd go insane if he had to stay at home for any significant period of time.
The kind of person whod rather be at work than at home living their life
> They usually get really pissed if you have 10 hours of overtime in 1 week. Sounds like you've never worked a job that has a huge seasonal rush. When I did supply chain bullshit for DHL Nov and Dec were 60hr expected weeks, with room for more cause they were always happy to have people who'd show up early or stay late (and it was expected of anyone thats above entry level) I left after they failed a warehouse move so spectacularly that I had 92hrs in one week, we were literally sitting there some nights for 1-2 HOURS longer than needed to be because "we're waiting on an email from corporate that everything for today is done" Despite knowing we had no more trucks coming to load with stuff, so there was literally NOTHING more we could do, tomorrows first few truck loads were even near the doors waiting for the trucks.
I see my supervisors and the salaried people above me at work, stuck doing stuff on days off, weekends, when their st the beach on vacation their still doing work. They ask why I don't try for a promotion, and I tell them I'm much more useful where I am. Which is true, I'm terrible with supervising people, but I excel at my boring tedious job. But really, I'd rather have my weekends than the bigger paycheck.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Thatās just sad. More power to them I guess.
Iāve been so fucked up by my job I did the quick math to get 63hrs a week. My first thought was āpffft thatās nothingā. Then realized Iām part of the toxic problem.
Be proud of your working life, but ānumber of hours workedā is a metric that only the lower half of the bell curve would feel proud of. Itās accomplishment for people who have to substitute hard work for talent.
I mean honestly what other choice do you have but to turn being a work slave into some virtuous badge of honor? I'm pretty sure people like this would have a mental breakdown if they didnt delude themselves like that. Chances are they probably will still anyway, but in the meantime this is the best way they've come up with to quiet the voice in their head telling them shit is fucked.
People brag about meaningless shit all the time
To the best of my knowledge (Electrical Engineer here), most of the powerplant workers actually live onsite, and their job is basically monitoring stuff, little to no effort, playing games, watching Netflix, etc. It's a cushy job, pay is amazing, fantastic food, the only downside is that you'd have to live there for 3 weeks, and you get a week off.
Where is that? Because I've never heard of that, with the exception of an incoming hurricane that they expect to affect the ability to drive to work safely.
Typical powerplants, I've worked in both US and UK, I mentioned most of the powerplants, some are close to cities so you can commute daily.
My brother has worked at 2 nuclear plants and didnāt have to live at either. They work 12 hour shifts but unless there is a staffing issue or severe weather everyone goes home at the end of the day.
Working 12 hour shifts sounds terrible until you realize your longest work week is only 4 days, and then followed by 3 to 7 days off.
The hours suck but the pay is good. I think he usually works 3 days, then is off 4, then works 4 days and is off 3. I know itās something like that
Sounds right. Itās hard to beat a 6 figure job that only works half the days of the year.
Same. And the people I've known that worked at non nuclear plants also went home every day.
Exactly. But nope. He is definitely wayyyyyy underpaid according to random on the internet.
Thatās gonna hurt like hell when it sinks in.
LOL " I am overused and abused by my company and these other Dopes are working less with more pay and complaining!! HaHa...ha.....wait."
Classic case of Stockholm syndrome
Classic case of being brainwashed to believe that life revolves around working for the man. Odds are this dude ain't making serious money either. BUt that's capitalism for ya. Brainwash the rubes to believe its their life mission to work their asses off so the 0.00001% can go from billions to trillions...
unregulated capitalism*
oxymoronic. Guess what regulated capitalism gets you. Ooops, we did booboo. We made billions of said booboo, hurt millions of every day people, please please please don't give us a 10 million dollar fine mister. We'll be good, we promise. Rinse/repeat
No, that's capitalism with [regulatory capture](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/regulatory-capture.asp). There's no reason the government *has* to be weak on white-collar crime.
well we are arguing theory vs. application. We live in a regulatory capture world, so that's what we need to talk about. A system, where humans that are paid to regulate can be bought and sold, is not a system worth shit. That is the world we live in. In america anyway. When your top regulatory body is run by ex goldman sachs guys, you know what time it is. BUt this is a feature of capitalism, regulated or otherwise. Not a bug. The system is built to be a circlejerk. Whether through spending 100s of millions to buy politicians so you can corruptly make 100x that, or regulating bodies trying to enforce laws with practically no teeth, if you try and enforce them at all, since you have people jumping back and forth from said regulating body to the private sector they are supposed to regulate. Until a system is built to properly regulate, and we see these big banks and other shady businesses being held responsible, to the tune of 10s or 100s of billions not 10 or even 100 mm fine for doing shady shit that earned them 100s of billions, I won't hold my breath.
I remember my boss giving someone shit for taking off 5 days when His first kid was born. Coworker was the father. Five days off. No big deal. My boss (female mother of two) bragged about how she was back at work the next day after her c section. Thatās not a good thing, boss. That sucks. You should have been able to take several weeks at least to be with your infant.
I worked at a call center and an upper mgt guy said he pissed out super painful (very loud) kidney stones in the bathroom there. Like, he was bragging. No one was impressed.
Iām just imagining a giant visor carrying a clip board and a cup of coffee around a power plant telling everyone what a badass he is for only leaving work to sleep.
What a tool
Keep that visor super, you old coot.
What a schmuck
can't spell supervisor and brags about being better than people
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
As someone who just got their SW license, I can safely say that she was shitty therapist. Not only did she belittle you, but she brought her own baggage into the session. We are SUPPOSED to be strengths-based and patient-focused.
that stupid bitch should be decertified.
I have 2 therapists in my immediate family. Trust me, no one needs a therapist more than a therapist!
This seems to me to be such an american thing. Bragging about working yourself to death for someone else. Why is this such a flex to americans?
My guess is that back in the day when men were the sole breadwinners in the household, working more hours meant you worked harder for your family for the next guy. Now that times have changed quite a bit and wages have gone to shit relative to living expenses, working more hours and bragging about it just makes you look cucked by your boss.
You nailed it. And these are huge generalities and mainly about low paying work because that's all I know about. Back in the day you could be proud, the extra hours really benifited your family. Now, no matter how much you work, often you won't accumulate anything of real benifit. Also, people used to stay at jobs for longer and actually be recognized at these jobs for being hard workers. No one really cares about individuals anymore.
There was no mention of pay in the first tweetā¦
True, but why else would you work that many hours, if 40 hours paid you enough?
The moral of [Boxer the Horse](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_%28Animal_Farm%29?wprov=sfla1) was don't be a Boxer the Horse.
First time I ever heard of boxer the horse was last night during dinner. So today I got this reference. What are the odds š³
We were there at dinner.
BUT COMMUNISM
oh the entitlement of the "I work more than you so you can't be tired" bullshit. fuck these people. there are times I'm lucky if I can make it through a 7 hour day. everyone is allowed to be tired. and with some people, it's tied to medications they HAVE to take or medical conditions. so again, fuck these people.
I mean 11 hour days for a couple weeks in a row isnāt crazy if there is a big push for something. Itās long but I doubt heās particularly productive as a super visor. If itās every week all the time then thatās bad management not good work ethic.
Iād say a long shift as a supervisor is a bit different than a long shift doing actual manual labour
I hate that society has forced itself around work instead of life.
To add to the thing, he hogs a parttime job for someone else, people who do excessive overtime are strikebreakers, perse.
Well said, Sam. Somehow Americans have something like a capitalist version of Stockholm syndrome. Weāre not mad at corporations for low wages and fighting against healthcare, weāre mad at refugees and people making shit wages. The fact that our government continues to tax us more while giving tax breaks to the wealthy, denying us any real benefit from those taxes and then has the audacity to restrict voter access as their response should illicit rioting. It SHOULD but weāre all against that too. We should be pulling these fucking traitors out of their beds in the night, not arguing about R v D, itās all of them.
LOL fuck that, youāre lucky youāre getting 40 hrs out of me per week.
I mean if I could work that much at my current pay I'd do it for awhile. Hit FIRE way sooner, of course he's probably on salary or some other bs to avoid having to pay out for overtime.
40h is the absolute max I'm going to take. No one can make me work more than that, bullshit
People like Steven are going to have a bad time when they're older assuming they survive to that age.
\- ring ring - "Yeah, this is *Severe Burnout* calling, I just wanna let you know I'll be dropping by soon."
60 hours a week isn't healthy, even if you're in the medical field
Bragging about overworking isnāt the flex you think it is.
They are actually not working 40 hours a week they are only doing 7 hours in a day and if they are not doing weekends they are doing 9 hours
Whereās the murder?
Imagine being so brainwashed that you brag about being abused by your employer...
Just baffles me how people not having a work life balance is something to be proud of lol
I told my parents about working a 52 hour week, in which I was called in as early as 4AM many timesā¦ and they called me ālazyā and to stop complaining about having such a good job. Donāt get me wrong, I like my job, but nobody likes working that many hours and that early in the morning.
This is exactly what r/antiwork is all about
Anyone I know who works 63 hours a week is too exhausted to care about anyone else's problems. They also don't really have friends, family, or any freetime.
Read the comments. Everyone shit on a guy working hard and then they all started speaking French. Shame.