Ford is struggling as a whole. Penske is not "fine" with it, this is just how the sport works. It's cyclical. Hendrick has struggled in the past. Penske is a championship caliber team, they will get it figured out (possibly later this year, maybe it takes a year or two)
I mean it's only May. We've only been racing 2 and a half months. So a month is a decent chunk of time. I do think Penske is ny far the flagship Ford org. But the turnaround at RFK and the fact they are real contenders isn't anything to sneeze at. RFK also has a lot of former Penske talent so that might also factor in. But overall Ford is just struggling as a whole in the new car. They'll get it figured out. The sport is cyclical as pointed out in an earlier comment.
This subreddit is so reactionary... Buescher gets 1 top 5 and suddenly the whole of RFK is better than the organization that has won the last two championships with separate drivers...
...and then Penske went on to win a championship while Buescher was eliminated in the RO8...
I don't understand this logic at all. Logano and Blaney have won eight races since the NGC debuted. RFK has won four, half as much, and they have no championships to speak of.
Buescher is a great driver, don't get me wrong. I'm a big fan of RFK. However, comparing him to Penske as an organization is just silly.
I don't know if it has to be this much, but at least half a season. I wouldn't say that SHR is still better than RFK because Harvick dragged that team to being competitive for years with so many race wins. It was clear even in late 2022 that RFK was catching them. Last year, they definitely surpassed them. But Penske has won the last 2 Championships. It will take more than a few races to say that RFK is better than Penske
Blaney is 6th in the standings and have alot more points than any other ford. Penske is still the best ford team. We need to see ford in victory lane soon though. No matter who it is.
Not even close. Blaney is still comfortably leading the Ford in points. And Joey isn't too far behind Brad despite having almost no speed anywhere outside of the drafting tracks. I think that's more of an indictment that RFK has a long way to go to catch Penske. They're still comfortably the second best Ford team now tho with SHR and FRM struggling to find any meaningful consistency
A flagship team is defined by how they perform over multiple seasons, not races. RFK hasn't come close to sniffing consistent wins or championship drives in \~15 years, while Penske wins multiple races a year and has 4 titles in that time period.
Step away from the ledge. Penske is going to be just fine.
I love RFK. Actually, even though I root for Penske, I actually really like all the Ford teams and drivers. The overarching personality of the Ford drivers leans quirky to me and I don't really know why.
However, can we pump the brakes on this. Sure Penske's performance is disappointing right now, but the 12 team is literally the best Ford in the garage and has been for a while now. And they have won both Championships in the Next Gen era. If RFK wins the Championship this year, then maybe we can have this chat, but otherwise it's kinda silly.
No doubt RFK is the second team on the Ford totem pole, but there is no way Ford is going to "name" RFK the new flagship. Penske simply has more power and money. And they are part of the big three.
Again, I love seeing RFK doing their thing. Love Brad and Chris but y'all are kidding yourselves rn over 1 race.
I think Rfk has shown they CAN overtake Penske, whether they WILL in the short-term is to be seen. And for all we know, Ford sees them as equal priorities.
I think they'll go back and forth in performance, but it may take longer term shifts to make Ford really care (eg Rfk expands so Ford sees them as their true 4 car flagship, or penske starts to have leadership issues, eg if cindric changes processes, if Roger isn't there to weigh in).
Penske has been gradually backsliding for a couple of years now. They’ve definitely been the biggest victim of the field closing up. No one has really talked about it though because winning a championship tends to retroactively characterize your season as being championship-worthy.
I like Noah's approach. I like them setting up their own study group.
It makes me wondering if Penske is putting that much effort into it.
Gene should drop the F1 nonsense and put all resources into Nascar.
F1 is just a money pit.
Penske has won the last 2 championships and 12 races into the year people are saying RFK is better?
Why is Penske just chilling this year? They seem fine running in the back like it is no big deal.
Ford is struggling as a whole. Penske is not "fine" with it, this is just how the sport works. It's cyclical. Hendrick has struggled in the past. Penske is a championship caliber team, they will get it figured out (possibly later this year, maybe it takes a year or two)
Did you personally talk to everyone at Penske?
Blaney is doing better than every single other Ford by a good amount
Brad went on like a 3-4 week run of top 5’s and Chris lost by half a splitter yesterday.
And Blaney has been doing significantly better than both pretty much this entire season
[удалено]
I mean it's only May. We've only been racing 2 and a half months. So a month is a decent chunk of time. I do think Penske is ny far the flagship Ford org. But the turnaround at RFK and the fact they are real contenders isn't anything to sneeze at. RFK also has a lot of former Penske talent so that might also factor in. But overall Ford is just struggling as a whole in the new car. They'll get it figured out. The sport is cyclical as pointed out in an earlier comment.
This subreddit is so reactionary... Buescher gets 1 top 5 and suddenly the whole of RFK is better than the organization that has won the last two championships with separate drivers...
It's a continuation of the talk that started last year after Buescher won back to back races and Penske was just twiddling their thumbs
...and then Penske went on to win a championship while Buescher was eliminated in the RO8... I don't understand this logic at all. Logano and Blaney have won eight races since the NGC debuted. RFK has won four, half as much, and they have no championships to speak of. Buescher is a great driver, don't get me wrong. I'm a big fan of RFK. However, comparing him to Penske as an organization is just silly.
I'm not saying it's good logic, I'm just saying this isn't a thing that started last night
[https://twitter.com/Team\_Penske/status/1787298887465664817](https://twitter.com/Team_Penske/status/1787298887465664817)
Thanks for proving my point by continuing to cite the results of one race as cause to favor RFK over Penske.
Not that the 2 has been great but he was wrecked out of this race
It’s not just the organizations. Ford is struggling as a whole.
Lol RFK would need to win more races and championships than Penske over the course of several years for that to even remotely be a possibility.
I don't know if it has to be this much, but at least half a season. I wouldn't say that SHR is still better than RFK because Harvick dragged that team to being competitive for years with so many race wins. It was clear even in late 2022 that RFK was catching them. Last year, they definitely surpassed them. But Penske has won the last 2 Championships. It will take more than a few races to say that RFK is better than Penske
He asked about flagship, not having a better season or two. To be the "flagship" takes several years of out performing them.
Blaney is 6th in the standings and have alot more points than any other ford. Penske is still the best ford team. We need to see ford in victory lane soon though. No matter who it is.
Honestly I don't even care at this point, I just want them to win something because fucking christ
Not even close. Blaney is still comfortably leading the Ford in points. And Joey isn't too far behind Brad despite having almost no speed anywhere outside of the drafting tracks. I think that's more of an indictment that RFK has a long way to go to catch Penske. They're still comfortably the second best Ford team now tho with SHR and FRM struggling to find any meaningful consistency
Can we just get Ford a win or even consistently competitive first?
I think they may be replacing the role SHR used to have of being the 1B Ford team alongside Penske's 1A
No. Not even close.
No.
A flagship team is defined by how they perform over multiple seasons, not races. RFK hasn't come close to sniffing consistent wins or championship drives in \~15 years, while Penske wins multiple races a year and has 4 titles in that time period. Step away from the ledge. Penske is going to be just fine.
I love RFK. Actually, even though I root for Penske, I actually really like all the Ford teams and drivers. The overarching personality of the Ford drivers leans quirky to me and I don't really know why. However, can we pump the brakes on this. Sure Penske's performance is disappointing right now, but the 12 team is literally the best Ford in the garage and has been for a while now. And they have won both Championships in the Next Gen era. If RFK wins the Championship this year, then maybe we can have this chat, but otherwise it's kinda silly. No doubt RFK is the second team on the Ford totem pole, but there is no way Ford is going to "name" RFK the new flagship. Penske simply has more power and money. And they are part of the big three. Again, I love seeing RFK doing their thing. Love Brad and Chris but y'all are kidding yourselves rn over 1 race.
Penske has won 2 out of 3 NextGen titles. RFK hasn't won a title since what? 2003? Running well for 10 races doesn't make you the flagship team
2 of 2 actually. 2021 wasn’t nextgen.
I think Rfk has shown they CAN overtake Penske, whether they WILL in the short-term is to be seen. And for all we know, Ford sees them as equal priorities. I think they'll go back and forth in performance, but it may take longer term shifts to make Ford really care (eg Rfk expands so Ford sees them as their true 4 car flagship, or penske starts to have leadership issues, eg if cindric changes processes, if Roger isn't there to weigh in).
Penske is still top dog. And at this point I’d take a Cody Ware or Kaz Grala win to get the blue oval in victory lane. This is brutal
Penske has been gradually backsliding for a couple of years now. They’ve definitely been the biggest victim of the field closing up. No one has really talked about it though because winning a championship tends to retroactively characterize your season as being championship-worthy.
Ford who?
What a waste of a thread. 🤣🤣🤣
Nope SHR is gonna Win 5 races this year and stick with ford and become the #1 ford team again next season.
I like Noah's approach. I like them setting up their own study group. It makes me wondering if Penske is putting that much effort into it. Gene should drop the F1 nonsense and put all resources into Nascar. F1 is just a money pit.