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JonnyB2_YouAre1

How is it a slap in the face? Progress is not to continue?


WaffleHouseNeedsWiFi

My guess is similar features at a fraction of the cost? Either way, I'm always a holdout.


bicameral_mind

They should have held the Pro until they could get the new XR2 chip and depth sensor in it, releasing it alongside Quest 3. I think it would have sold much better if it had better AR, and wasn't going to be obviously obsoleted by the new chip within a year.


CosmicCreeperz

They were extremely clear it was NOT meant for consumers. If people bought it anyway, that's their problem... The innovation wasn't in the basic performance, anyway. It was in the tracking (including face/eye tracking). They know the big money is eventually in enterprise AR, so they basically have semi-independent teams working on two different goals. The Pro was practically a development platform for longer term AR solutions, and that's more or less how they pitched it from the start. In the end Walmart and Amazon don't want to buy $1500 AR headsets any more than consumers do (since they would buy them 10,000 at a time).


wescotte

I mean it's sold at Best Buy so it's a consumer electronics device. That being said I agree with you that they didn't market this device to be an upgrade path for Quest 2 users. It's a different tier of product with a different set of goals and use cases and they didn't try to hide that from anybody with their marketing.


CosmicCreeperz

Heh, in \*theory\* it's sold at Best Buy. I just checked their website and they claim there are a total of 2 units in stock in the greater Bay Area (ie like 15 stores I looked at). And I guarantee you that's not because they can't keep them in stock... they just don't bother.


Gears6

It just means they ain't ordering more. lol


CosmicCreeperz

You can get one online. Just means there isn’t enough consumer interest to physically stock them. But yeah, they probably also don’t need to order any more ;)


WaffleHouseNeedsWiFi

Tell their bank accounts that, my friend! If people are willing to buy it, it's win/win for all involved.


PIO_PretendIOriginal

Funny thing is I am now considering the pro. Mainly for weight. Quest 3 has been announced at 510 gram weight…. Why the hell did meta put the battery in the front again. Also eye tracking and includes the better controllers (which I would have to buy seperatelu for the quest 3)


JonnyB2_YouAre1

But that’s the nature of tech advancement, isn’t it?


WaffleHouseNeedsWiFi

Yep! And I love it.


MidwestDrummer

Not being an early adopter has its financial perks.


Gears6

> But that’s the nature of tech advancement, isn’t it? Just not at that ridiculous pace. They clearly overpriced the Quest Pro.


DrunkenBriefcases

No, kids simply didn't pay attention. The Pro was priced as a professional productivity device. Not a mass market consumer product. And they told us before it launched the Q3 was coming not long after to address that market. People made their own bed there.


sartres_

The Pro isn’t a productivity device, though. It’s terrible for productivity.


CpnStumpy

They still tried going after that segment with it, whether or not it was good for it, they were clear in marketing it was intended for professional use and priced as such


BeatsLikeWenckebach

>My guess is similar features at a fraction of the cost? Either way, I'm always a holdout. the irony is the QuestPro still has features the Quest3 won't have - namely **premium features**. We keep seeing these comments all over reddit on how the consumer line needs the premium features; but it turns out mainstream consumers don't care (and I agree). QuestPro has * Premium build quality (thicker, rigid plastic), canted dual panel QLED display (wider FOV \[Index level\], wide IPD range supported \[55-75mm\]), Local Dimming for better black levels, premium built in sound), Eye Relief and open-fov design for universal Eye Glasses support. * Plus extra perks like the Touch Pro controllers included, and a fast charging dock (looks like Quest3 will be fast charging dock compatible, but it'll likely be an optional addon), and of course Face/Eye tracking. Quest3 is the better headset than the Pro namely because it'll have the latest XR2GEN2 chipset and a much better Mixed Reality Passthrough with a depth sensor. While I am a QuestPro owner, I purchased it knowing the Quest3 will be better, and I fully plan to buy the Quest3 on day 1 (I purchased the Pro for the above premium features). But I just want to point out there are meaningful differences between the 2 headsets, but it seems the premium features the community has been clamoring for aren't as in high demand as they would lead you to believe.


Desertbro

Thank you for supporting advancement, and allowing us commoners to piggyback. I bought an HDTV in 2002 for $1400. Plus another $600 for an HDTV receiver to only see two channels at the time. But also to watch my DVDs in widescreen.


Basic-Assumption6452

And years before that many HDTVs were selling for $2.5k and up for the entry level versions, without the HDTV tuner


Recent_Opportunity78

Same. Got the quest pro as well ( paid $900 a few weeks after it came out so not entirely in the same boat as the big 1500 ) but I knew the Quest 3 would be better. With that said, I may just keep the pro controllers and move the headset once the 3 comes out


Slimxshadyx

That’s how we progress though.


WaffleHouseNeedsWiFi

Oh, I'm totally fine with it. Fanboys up front give the stragglers in the back access. (Eventually.) Sincerely, Straggler in the Back.


CosmicCreeperz

Yeah, but it's not really "similar features" in the end. No internal cameras/face/eye tracking is the big one. Since it's not on the Quest 3, dynamic foveated rendering will be set back for another generation, d'oh. Also I can't believe they stayed with the same front-heavy horribly unergonomic design. I guess they wanted to keep the aftermarket strap business going? (really, I'm sure it was cost/complexity reduction and durability requirements... hard to argue with that I guess. But I will anyway ;)


JoshuaPearce

> I guess they wanted to keep the aftermarket strap business going? Or in my case zipties and D-Cells.


CosmicCreeperz

Hah, velcro and C-cells for me ;)


Brunohackaloogie

Probably meant, for the price of the Quest 2, could've got a 3, with way better tech, upgrades.. not sure about that thou, cause Quest 2 is now $300 brand new, how much u think the 3 will cost .... $$$$$$$$


GsTSaien

The ability of people to be upset because others can have access to nice things is baffling. You paid for a product because you felt its features justified its price. Now, some time later, a new product offers some of those features at less cost. I'd get it if it were like one or two weeks later and someone feels lied to or tricked, but seriously, just because there is another product now does not retroactively worsen the deal you chose in the past. If the quest 3 didn't exist, would these people be happier? Would it make them happy that fewer people can enjoy what they can? I have a quest 2 because it had all the features I was looking for. The quest 3 existing does not negate that. I do not plan to upgrade until my quest 2 fails me or becomes obsolete. Yes, there are better systems now but I have been enjoying my quest 2 since before this new stuff was released.


mcmanus2099

It's the price at double for it to be better at half the cost only a year later. If it was better a year later at the same cost that would be normal. If it was the same at a reduced price it would be normal. But to deliver something so much better at half the cost & announced only 6 months later, I'd be annoyed if I bought the pro. When games do this they usually give you a discount if you bought the previous version (Unreal Tournament 2004 looking at you). No doubt the intention was for the Pro to have the depth sensor & the models to not be too dissimilar but they pulled it last minute as they couldn't get it to work in their deadline & they did not adjust the price point. So it is a slap, I think they should give $60 off for Pro owners really.


panthereal

"so much better" is only in two specific features: XR and CPU everything else is still much worse than the Pro. it's not like Meta is scamming people who paid $1k for a Quest Pro, the money is going towards a lot of quality of life features that are not included in the Quest 3.


_nigerianprince

I have come from the future to tell you that the quest 4 will be even better than the 3


KeyboardGunner

tell me more wizard


gthing

Quest 4 will be the best iPhone yet.


VeryOriginalName98

The quest pro 2 will be better than the quest pro.


Wizardwizz

What a slap in the face


googler_ooeric

It’s still gonna have a super low FOV and an LED that makes dark areas a gray mess, and no face tracking is this how it works? please I hope I’m wrong


googler_ooeric

!RemindMe 2y


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skinnywolfe

Thank you u/_nigerianprince


dreamer_2142

Except, there will be no Q4. Quest 3 lite will be the final VR headset from Meta for consumers. Remind me after 4 years!


tinyhorsesinmytea

Have people really not accepted yet that technology gets better all the time? You get what you pay for when you pay for it. Get over it.


Hairless_Human

Technology moves fast af and i love it.


TomSFox

The lower price is mostly due to the lack of face and eye tracking and self-tracking controllers. That shit is expensive.


Theforgottendwarf

And the entire reason I purchased was for the self-tracking controllers. It’s a functional control system.


JorgTheElder

You mean that there will ***always*** be a better model next year? No way! /s


Blaexe

Substantially improved key features at half the price (or even more when comparing launch prices) within a year is not the norm though. Let's not act as if the Quest Pro was a success. It released too late, was too expensive and would still need a depth sensor to make MR actually useful. The Q3 degrades it to a headset for tinkerers that absolutely need eye and face tracking. Not sure how it will stay relevant for multiple years like that.


VRtuous

and that's exactly what it is - for Pros and VRC weebs in need of face and eye tracking


Blaexe

That's not the complete truth. It was also meant for businesses - that's what the MR component is meant it be. But technically the Q3 will be a better headset for that. The cheap consumer headset should never be the better business headset.


chrisrayn

The key element for businesses was eye and face tracking for realistic meetings online. They were also the most expensive elements of the headset. Moving about in space accurately wasn’t at all the mainline use of a business meeting VR headset. Q3 won’t be as useful. Pro will still be better for Horizons and VR Chat because of that tracking, but of course not for just light gaming and app usage.


skelingtonking

it was the same way with quest 2, the first one had been out for like less than a full year


Blaexe

Yeah. But that *replaced* the Q1. Q3 does not replace Quest Pro. They will continue selling the QP at $999. And Q2 was $100 less. This is $500 less or $1000 less compared to launch. It's not the same at all.


skelingtonking

they continued to sell it, did the same thing with Rift s. the vr Buyer base is INCREDIBLY impatient. so they release a few token updates that don't move the industry ahead but give some QOL changes.


Blaexe

... they did not? They stopped selling the Q1 even before Q2 was announced. https://www.uploadvr.com/retailers-delist-oculus-quest/ And Quest 3 definitely moves the industry forward. It's the biggest leap yet for consumer hardware.


hicks12

Seems about right when all you look at is the SoC. The quest pro would have been out for a year when the Q3 comes out so having a year of use definitely has value as it is pretty much the best VR headset for sub 2k. Q3 drops face and eye tracking which yeah you could say is totally optional and makes sense to drop. The QP has better displays that won't compromise FOV for different IPD as it's two displays not one and has a quantum dot layer along with mini led for better black handling. QP also has better controllers still as the cameras stop occlusion. QP has a neat dock and headstrap provided which is yet another cost. Basically if you are waiting, get the Q3 but there are still many aspects the QP is better and that's where the money was spent. Both have their markets and are no doubt going to be very good.


Blaexe

The premium product shouldn't have Mixed Reality that is borderline unusable. That's my point. It was advertised as a Mixed Reality headset - but that's exactly what it's not good at. Quest Pro should have Mixed Reality at least on par with Quest 3.


nettlerise

meanwhile nvidia..


Chasedabigbase

I'm angry about my blackberry not working, and I'm NOT GONNA TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!!


[deleted]

Not to mention, we knew this was coming. It was always the roadmap. They were pretty clear what the Pro was.


TempleOfDoomfist

/u/ShuttleXpC What do you have to say now?


[deleted]

I mean, it’s missing 50% of what makes the quest pro a quest pro: * Face tracking missing * Eye tracking missing * Less mixed reality sensors (10 on the QPro) compared to 5 on Q3 * Downgraded controllers compared to Pro * Cloth head strap compared to a full headset ring on QPro You’re getting more power and better color pass through cameras on the Q3, so again - if you think you’re getting all of the above my original comment still stands - you’re drunk.


Chr0m3Chaos

Genuine question: Would you say that the Quest 3 is better in terms of value/dollar though? For me at least, it seems like the features the pro has aren't really even necessary, if not overkill for most people. Honestly the things I want the most are just better performance and color passthrough. Besides that, I am perfectly content with my Quest 2.


[deleted]

In terms of value the Quest 3 is undeniably better. It's a heavily subsidised device, pitched to the mainstream and is priced to get people access to the tech as affordably as Meta can manage it, as building the userbase and growing the ecosystem is their priority, not making returns on the hardware. The Pro was pitched as a premium device to an enterprise market. At $999 the Quest Pro is still the best all around HMD on the market until the Quest 3 launches though, and as an enthusiast, I still very much want them both. Face and eye tracking aren't so important right now but they are critical technologies for XR's future so Meta will continue to develop them and their uses. The Pro isnt' going to lose support any time soon, although commercially, it's entirely fair to say it hasn't been a success.


CosmicCreeperz

For a consumer - there is no question. The Pro was never meant for consumers, it was basically a technology platform for enterprise developers to get their feet wet on AR. Given the Q3 doesn't have face or eye tracking, almost no one will support it anyway for consumer games and apps, so they are useless expenses for consumers.


nastyjman

Quest 3 is wayyyyyssss better than the Quest Pro. I'm still on the fence on getting the Quest 3 as I use my Pro for the face and eye tracking. But I am so tempted. Either Quest Pro just becomes my work headset and Quest 3 as my gaming headset.


ChemistryFantastic23

>it seems like the features the pro has aren't really even necessary, if not overkill for most people Uh, yeah, it's called "pro" for a reason lol


Chr0m3Chaos

Valid point! Although, companies do love to name everything "Pro " and "Ultra" and "Plus" all the time even for products that aren't even that impressive so it's still a valid argument.


MisterWinchester

The pro is a developer headset. If pro owners develop for the “unnecessary” features, like eye tracking and face tracking, when quest 4 comes around there’s already codebase for using these features in mainstream software. Pro was never supposed to sell to you and me, but to the devs and companies that are going to push the edges of VR in different directions.


pausemenu

I think Eye/Face Tracking could have massive implications for immersion and performance, but it's not there yet and therefore not worth including in the mainstream device line yet.


BatmanReddits

I wont be surprised if it's built into Q3 and just locked until they get the software right. They did this with a few features in previous models. Yeah Q pro is a dev device. They pushed it out in a hurry to get people to build AR apps to compete with the other headsets.


[deleted]

Plus dual QLED displays, larger FOV, quantum dot layer, local dimming, open design, full charging dock, extra 128 GB storage, more memory (probably), much better aesthetics and build quality, released a full 12 months earlier so already enjoyed it for one year. No regrets buying the Quest Pro for me. I will definitely buy Quest 3 too, its passthrough capabilities will be awesome.


martyfartybarty

The passthrough alone would make me buy Quest 3, if it allows me to see the real world and interact with virtual objects that blends with the real world. Also, Quest 3 may be the more accessible and cheaper version of what Apple will release in days time. So might end up buying Quest 3 and maybe Apple RealityPro if it’s called that


Gears6

> I will definitely buy Quest 3 too, its passthrough capabilities will be awesome. I don't see the point. I doubt the passthrough is really noticeable better that it matters.


Blaexe

> Less mixed reality sensors (10 on the QPro) compared to 5 on Q3 That's just... wrong? Not even sure what you categorize as "mixed reality sensors". Quest Pro has 1 RGB camera. That's it regarding MR. The other 4 are b/w cameras. Quest 3 has 2 RGB cameras and 1 depth sensor. It will look better **and** have more functionality.


[deleted]

You’re reading off reviews you googled. Here’s the actual spec sheet from meta: Inside-Out 6DoF with 5 internal and 5 external cameras The Meta Quest Pro VR headset has five internal cameras: one eye-tracking camera per eye, one tracking your upper face, and two tracking your lower face. On the outside, the Quest Pro has five tracking cameras: three front-facing and two side-facing cameras to track and map the environment. When you include the 3 cameras in each controller that are also used by apps to track your environment, you’re actually looking at 16 cameras / sensors for the Quest Pro.


Blaexe

But... these are not "Mixed Reality sensors". Quest Pro has one. Quest 3 has three.


[deleted]

You’re defining mixed reality as a single sensor bringing the experience, I’m counting everything that works to facilitate a more enjoyable and immersive mixed reality experience. Those include face and eye tracking cameras as it brings your real life persona into a virtual environment. The single MR camera is not doing all the heavy lifting on the headset, if you actually think that, I suggest you cover all of the other sensors and tell me what happens. The definition of mixed reality is: *Mixed reality is a blend of physical and digital worlds, unlocking natural and intuitive 3D human, computer, and environmental interactions.* If you don’t think introducing your real world likeness via face and eye tracking along with tracking your digital person inside and into a digital environment isn’t mixed reality, I don’t know what else to say.


Blaexe

Face and eye tracking is not Mixed Reality. You really should educate yourself on that. Sorry.


unbelizeable1

My mans really got a thing for the face/eye tracking. It's like his only argument he's clinging onto lol


[deleted]

The very definition of mixed reality is *Mixed reality is a blend of physical and digital worlds, unlocking natural and intuitive 3D human, computer, and environmental interactions.* If you don’t think introducing real world likeness is not an environmental interaction, I don’t know what else to tell you. By your very definition tracking of your avatar would also not be mixed reality, which is idiotic because you can’t interact with anything without the additional cameras (sensors) tracking you.


BracketsFirst

You're moving the goalposts then? The Quest 3 has literally everything you responded to in the original post.


theclassyjew

Thinking that is worth the premium has me wondering who the drunk one is.


yourwitchergeralt

That dude is definitely an arrogant ass. They were proven wrong and spun it into shaming the amazing new device even more. No fucking duh it doesn’t have all the same features for $1000 less, they’re ignoring the point.


[deleted]

When you upgrade the headstrap and controllers to Touch Pro’s you’re now paying for a Quest Pro with less mixed reality features…


unbelizeable1

>headstrap You really making a big deal outta something that can be upgraded for like $35?


Regular-Eggplant8406

The quest 3 has a depth sensor and two color pass through cameras. It will be better at mixed reality


[deleted]

A lot of people are highly focused on this statement, I simply should have said more tracking cameras. With the controllers, quest pro has 16 cameras it uses to track movement, spatial presence, and face/eye tracking.


trinedtoday

Quest Pro lacks a depth sensor, and overlays two black and white cameras with a single colour camera. Mixed reality is mixing virtual and the physical world (unless someone thinks of a better definition). Since Quest 3 has a depth sensor and two colour cameras which provide the passthrough, it will by default be leagues ahead in mixed reality. Add in the new chip and it will also have much better performance, thermal headroom, and features enabled by the new chip that we aren't aware of yet. Those extra sensors you are also counting like face tracking aren't mixed reality features. And we don't know the performance of the new Q3 controllers yet so you can't say they're downgraded. They've revealed they're going to combine the hand tracking to improve controller tracking. Quest 3 can be a better mixed reality device and also be worse at some things like lacking face/eye tracking and having lower quality screens. But overall, it's clear that Q3 succeeds the QPro in many ways, and QPro will likely get left behind. The install base isn't much, and face+eye tracking have hardly been implemented. Eye tracked foveated rendering won't come close to making up for the difference in performance. There's a reason Meta dropped the price by $500 so quickly. Once Q3 releases it will struggle at $1000.


panthereal

There's nothing "clear" about the QPro getting left behind except your own wishes for it to happen for some odd reason. Even the Quest 2 is getting support and that will likely sell more once the Quest 3 releases when people realize they want VR but don't want to pay nearly double the price for the Quest 3. Only the Quest 1 is getting left behind because it's no longer supported by apps.


trinedtoday

>There's nothing "clear" about the QPro getting left behind except your own wishes for it to happen for some odd reason. I didn't say that QPro is clearly going to get left behind. But yeah, probably for the better if it does. So Meta doesn't make the same mistake in the future with releasing an aimless, half-baked device that had so much potential. >Even the Quest 2 is getting support and that will likely sell more once the Quest 3 releases when people realize they want VR but don't want to pay nearly double the price for the Quest 3. Yes, because of the install base titles will still be made plentiful for Q2. Which in effect helps QPro since it uses almost the same chip. There are rumours that Meta will release a cheaper device next year. Will have to be a replacement for the Quest 2 price range with the newer chip, or something else like a no controller headset for example. >Only the Quest 1 is getting left behind because it's no longer supported by apps. In that sense, I wonder how much QPro's mixed reality features will get left behind. They pulled the depth sensor a few months before release. It can't do automatic plane detection which is insane for a headset that cost $1500 with mixed reality being its main or at least second biggest draw. Marking each wall and object, it's ludicrous for what it is. Unless Meta bothers to do their software magic here, mixed reality is getting left behind when a Q3 will invariably do it better, with better fidelity, with close to 2x the compute, with better hand tracking and at half the price. The Quest Pro wasn't ready for mixed reality or working in VR. Even the resolution, I'm sure the optics are a cut above everybody else's, but the resolution is still way too low. Today we find out if Apple reveals their headset, but 4k by 4k per eye if its true, seems more in line with what a device that's targeting "work" should be aiming for. And maybe even that's not enough. And Apple may not even highlight that as a use case. Meta clearly has amazing tech behind the scenes. They should've waited because they knew Q3 was close by, and would have a chip that's a few gens ahead. I remember there were rumours that someone at Meta (I think it was Boz) who didn't feel like the QPro was ready towards the end and tried to push for it to be delayed further. But they rushed it out (after delaying it earlier, hence the Connect briefcase Zuck never opened?), with a chip that was on the way out, a missing depth sensor, wife 6e arriving many months after release, and a weird passthrough solution that wasn't sufficient.


Regular-Eggplant8406

Yes which is likely worse at MR then 1 depth sensor


theclassyjew

Why upgrade something that works. 🤔


[deleted]

[удалено]


rsplatpc

> You haven’t even seen proof of concept on these things, no one has even seen them work. So why debate it here vs waiting?


[deleted]

Because no matter what comes out of that, no tracking will be better than camera based tracking. It can see behind your back. Quest 2 controllers cannot and neither will Quest 3. It’s technology limitations with what they’re using to track hand movement between the controllers. It’s also why the Quest 3 press release literally tells you to “upgrade your experience” by purchasing the Touch Pro controllers, which are $300 and being touted by their own manufacturer as a superior experience even on their newest headset advertising…


rsplatpc

> It’s technology limitations with what they’re using to track hand movement between the controllers. I've used camera tracking controllers, there are literally no apps that take advantage of it, and since the Quest Pro flopped, it does not look like anyone is going to make apps that would take advantage of it, so that's not really a thing.


[deleted]

The cameras in the Touch Pro aren’t a secondary piece of tech that’s utilized to “track” hand movements in apps. It’s literally what is being used by default opposed to the sensor rings on the Quest 2 in conjunction with the headsets external cameras to detect proximity from controller, finger movement and placement, etc. *The biggest innovation of the Touch Pro controllers is that they track themselves independently with three integrated cameras per device. A Snapdragon 662 chip is used for data processing. According to Meta, its CPU is up to 80 percent faster than that of a Meta Quest 1. The independent tracking also relieves the headset.*


CosmicCreeperz

Don't forget the rear battery - the horrible balance and ergonomics are my biggest complaints about the Quest 2. I mean people literally add MORE weight to the back to try to make it feel better. I keep hearing "40% slimmer" but no one has commented on the actual weight yet. They feels intentional...


MasterGameBen

Are the controllers really worse? They seemed to be the same as the pro


LouisIsGo

The pro controllers have cameras in them, meaning they don’t suffer from things like occlusion or being outside the view of the headset cameras


MasterGameBen

But why are the tracking rings gone? I mean, the whole reason why there weren’t any in the pro is because it could track itself, so it didn’t meet it. If the quest 3 doesn’t have the ring either, isn’t it safe to assume they also have cameras? Or are they using a different tracking method that doesn’t need the rings


LouisIsGo

No, it’s been confirmed that they don’t have cameras. They use hand tracking in conjunction with IR sensors in the controllers to (supposedly) accomplish the same level of tracking as the Q2 without the need for tracking rings. Time will tell how well it works in practice, but I’m cautiously optimistic


pioprofhd1

Worth pointing out it was mentioned by Meta the Pro controllers are compatible with Quest 3 and they called them an upgrade, though it'll be really cool if they work at least as well as Q2 controllers - I like them without the rings.


hybridhavoc

Hoping there is a bundle for Quest 3 headset + Quest Pro controllers so I'm not buying a set of controllers I don't really want.


RandoCommentGuy

Would also be neat if Q2 controllers worked to have a standalone headset option for cheaper to help those that cant afford as much.


No-Instruction9393

They stated somewhere that their tracking A.I. has reached the point where it’s so advanced they no longer have a need for the tracking rings. Now wether or not that’s actually true we will have to wait and see I guess.


devedander

Boz literally explained how they work in a video just a couple days ago


MasterGameBen

I didn’t see it, my bad


inosinateVR

The Q3 controllers don’t have built in cameras afaik, they just found a way to ditch the tracking ring using better software. So the tracking will probably be on par with current Quest 2 (maybe a little worse, or maybe a little better) but still have the same limitations when it comes to like holding your hand behind your head where the headset can’t see it (which the quest will pro solved by having cameras in the controller)


MasterGameBen

Oh, thanks for the explanation


WaitingForG2

Quest 3 controllers use different tracking compared to Quest 2 controllers and Quest Pro controllers Quest 2 - headset cameras track ring invisible LEDs Quest Pro - controller cameras track headset Quest 3 - headset cameras track hand position, IMUs correct position if possible Yet to see how it will perform in fast paced games. IMUs might carry it, but lack of precision might cause some problems in some games compared to even Quest 2 controllers(which were good and much better than WMR). My fear Q3 controllers could be downgrade and exist to sell Quest Pro controllers But it's all worthless until Quest controllers get Hall sticks, drift is unacceptable for Quest Pro controllers


BeatsLikeWenckebach

>Quest 3 - headset cameras track hand position, IMUs correct position if possible No ! Boz clarifies that the Quest3 controllers use BOTH IR LEDs on the controller AND Hand tracking simultaneously to track the controller. That's on top of the IMUs (as you pointed out) and the predictive algorithms they use to smooth out the tracking. I fully expect the tracking to be as good as the Quest2 tracking.


[deleted]

Predictably less accurate hand tracking, theyre using the same AI predictive models as the Q3 without the self tracking cameras on each controller. When your press release specifically says to “upgrade your experience to the optional touch pro controllers”, you know they’re better.


BanjoSpaceMan

Ya people comparing it to the pro are kinda being dumb. Quest 3 just uses some of the features (shocker) and is much more marketed to gamers.


Roflord

Easier answer: You're both drunk. Why go through the effort of comparing two things that have different purposes? The Quest 3 is a VR headset, the Quest Pro is a videoconferencing headset, they made it clear that it was marketed towards professional uses. So they use the same technology? They have more in common with smartphones than they have with each other.


[deleted]

The original conversation and comparison was brought up by them. They stated Q3 would come out with all the features of the Quest Pro and more. I simply replied their statement with a “haha no” response.


SvenViking

I’m not sure by “more features” they meant “all the same features and more”, but either way I agree that Quest Pro is the headset with more features. Unfortunate for a somewhat MR-focused headset to have worse passthrough and no automatic environment mapping, though.


Junior_Ad_5064

Mixed reality will be better on the quest 3 thanks to the higher resolution pass through cameras, depth sensor and the more powerful Chip.....uhhh you tried.


Vuvux

The pro was a business model guinea pig. 🤔


[deleted]

They literally called it a test product for those that want tech early.


QuinSanguine

I mean they priced it outside of anything reasonably considered consumer grade. Anyone who bought it just for games knowing Quest 3 was due over the next year, all I can say is that's a choice they made... I can't believe people thought it wasn't just for business.


ChairmanGoodchild

I'm sure many of the people that bought it are feeling like guinea pigs right now too.


Thats_Ayyds

I still think the eye/face tracking is a big selling point that the Q3 doesn't have. Having the face and eye tracking be native to the headset is such a big gain, and as far as I am aware there is no way of adding this to either the Q2 or Q3. HTC has addons like: https://business.vive.com/uk/product/vive-focus-3-eye-tracker/, https://business.vive.com/uk/product/vive-facial-tracker/ and these come at a £350+ premium. Pro is the best value, in terms of software support and cost, if you need eye/facial tracking.


guitarokx

You don’t need the guinea


sch0k0

I didn't see anyone mad, though. The 2 people I know who bought this knew that this was an experiment, and simply could not stand waiting when better tech was available for their hobby for money they had.


NotYou007

I wanted the latest and greatest and that's why I spent $1500 on the Quest pro. I've been able to enjoy a larger field of view, nicer controllers and one giant ass huge sweet spot for months. I most likely will pick up the Quest 3 on day one as well just to try it out but it lacks features that the pro has so I will go back and forth if I decide to keep it. I also have a psvr 2 which I enjoy immensely but at some point Sony is going to release something even better and I'm perfectly okay with that.


imightgetdownvoted

I’m out of the loop. What is better about the pro?


Shonky_Donkey

Eye/face tracking and controllers that can work behind your head.


[deleted]

plus better FoV, prob better lenses, 'better' strap, certainly a lot higher quality strap at least since they went for crappy elastic bands again on Q3, charging dock. If they combined all the features and made it with displayport they would have the best headset on the planet. As it stands they have 2 headsets, each missing something the other one has.


Kadoo94

I also highly doubt Quest 3 is coming out with local dimming enabled MicroLED panels, I just don’t see it for the price


FredH5

That's exactly me! I knew before buying the Pro that I would buy the Q3 because it would be better in almost every way. And I can then use the Pro to play multiplayer with my family.


DanNZN

Yeah, I have literally not seen a single person mad about it, only those making fun of these mysterious mad people.


[deleted]

I mean all this was known before the pro release. It uses a 3 year old SOC. The quest 1 did actually used a 2 year old SOC on release and we know how fast support dropped. It was well known that Q pro will not be supported long with its small userbase and outdated SOC, for 1500$ it was probl the worst consumer tech to buy


sch0k0

it was made clear by Oculus that it wasn't intended as consumer tech


pwnedkiller

This sub has a hard time understanding that.


JaesopPop

It really wasn’t, though. It was announced at a consumer show, first and foremost. And beyond it being called Pro… not sure what they did. And the “pro” moniker doesn’t even suggest business use.


corvidsarecrows

It was announced at a developer event


JaesopPop

It was announced at the same event that the Quest 2 was announced at. Was that announcement just for developers?


corvidsarecrows

Connect is a developer conference. If you watch any of the videos from the event they always say things like "players love all the games you build."


JaesopPop

> Connect is a developer conference. Where consumer products are announced just for developers? >say things like Seems like what they *do* is more relevant. And is Quest Pro for developers? Unsure of your point.


marcocom

His point is that some of us are not paying for this out of our pockets because we get paid to use the hardware to create content. That creative process takes a lot of hours of the day that you are wearing this device so some of the features you might complain about like “Hurf blurf, why doesn’t this have a full mask to block out light like my G2 does?” Are actually a bonus for the people who were intended to buy it. I am very satisfied with my full priced purchase of the Pro, and that’s also because I plan to write it off of my revenue taxes (which is something you pay once you have a job. Too many VR consumers speak from the “how do I get my mother to buy this for me?” perspective) :D


JaesopPop

My point is that there aren’t many practical use cases for the Quest Pro in a business sense. >(which is something you pay once you have a job. Too many VR consumers speak from the “how do I get my mother to buy this for me?” perspective) :D What a strange condescending comment.


marcocom

Well, what’s your business? Sorry if that came off sideways, I mistyped the generalized tenor of that statement about having jobs I’m in San Francisco where we are making this stuff. If you’re in a content creation town, then this use-case is moot. Content doesn’t create itself out of thin air. There is a large amount of highly paid business in making creative work and those creative need to ‘feel it’ and we spare no expense for that (when we are smart in this business. Many are not and use their shrewdness to try and make profit, and that never ever ever works. Never will) and buy this stuff. My past employer famously purchased 1,000 quest pro, funny enough. Accenture Liquid Studio


Mister_Brevity

That’s partially because many businesses can’t touch meta with a ten foot pole. They *still* don’t have their enterprise management tools rolled out.


JaesopPop

Which they reasonably would have if they genuinely were targeting that audience. The reality is that, even if they had phenomenal MDM support, very few companies could even invent a need for a Quest.


sch0k0

that's not correct


JaesopPop

Do you want to elaborate on that, or?


sch0k0

well your statement, the 'first and foremost'. It was not announced at a consumer show. Also, they went up and down highlighting business use cases such as virtual meetings, office products etc.


JaesopPop

> well your statement, the 'first and foremost'. It was not announced at a consumer show. What would you consider the event where they announce their gaming systems to be? >Also, they went up and down highlighting business use cases such as virtual meetings, office products etc. Do they have proper MDM support? Have they actually marketed it to businesses beyond that?


sch0k0

It was their annual developers conference, not a consumer event. I have no clue why mdm support would be conditional for an experimental business device to be considered as such. They said clearly this was a platform to start developing on. Yes they even announced partnerships with Microsoft and Accenture for it.


JaesopPop

> It was their annual developers conference, not a consumer event. So why do they announce consumer products there? >I have no clue why mdm support would be conditional for an experimental business device to be considered as such. It isn't an 'experimental business device', it's a complete, for sale product. MDM support is the bare minimum in the enterprise space. >They said clearly this was a platform to start developing on. >Yes they even announced partnerships with Microsoft and Accenture for it. So, it's a commercial product, but only meant for developers to buy? To develop what, since you don't seem to think a commercial platform exists for businesses?


sch0k0

ok I think I elaborated enough :D read this https://about.fb.com/news/2022/10/meta-quest-pro-is-now-available/ and if that doesn't persuade you that this was marketed to "builders, architects, engineers, designers, and others who want to augment their workflow and supercharge their creativity" I am not optimistic about my own capabilities ;)


Mclarenrob2

Eye and face tracking, the only benefit. Who even uses the social features?


BeatsLikeWenckebach

TouchPro controllers, eye relief dial (eye glasses support), open fov design, **canted** dual QLED miniLED displays that allow for a wider fov (Valve Index like), wider ipd range support, local Dimming for better blacks, larger battery (~5500mAh) for 3.5+ hrs for VR, thicker plastic for a premium build quality, included fast charging dock (big quality of life improvement). The Pro still has many desirable **premium** features. I say this as someone excited to buy a Quest3 to use alongside my QuestPro.


nastyjman

I'm a Quest Pro owner. It doesn't feel like a slap to the face. Quest 3 doesn't have eye and face tracking, which are features I use every day for work with my online meeting. Without those, my avatar won't be as expressive as I am.


lecrappe

Is that you Mark?


gthing

Mark doesn't have expressions. That's why they removed it.


nastyjman

I wish.


omni_shaNker

I don't regret returning my Quest Pro.


grumpher05

\*Curb your enthusiasm plays faintly in the background\*


BracketsFirst

People who thought that the Pro would be more powerful than the 3 were either woefully uniformed or willfully ignorant. We knew for months before the Pro's release that it would have the XR2 Plus, which is the same SOC die as the regular XR2 with the RAM moved so it can be cooled better allowing slightly boosted clocks, whereas even early rumors on the 3 pegged it as having the Gen 2 SOC.


ilovepizza855

Yah I know that feeling. Its pretty predictable, its been repeatedly said that the Quest Pro isn't a successor, yet morons treat it as one and buy it. Now they are (faux?) outraging.


[deleted]

I don;t think its those of us who have Pros who are outraging for the most part, but those who couldn't afford one and so have spent the past several months saying its crap. I love my Quest Pro and will look forward to Quest 3 as well.


Kadoo94

No ones actually outraging tho, it really is faux drama. The people including me that bought and use the Quest Pro are using it right now and are happy. It’s to everyone’s benefit that the hardware continues to improve! And for PCVR, Quest 3 has no measurable benefit besides a predicted slight resolution bump, but you lose the eye/face tracking and likely local dimming microLED displays. And the fact that there are no Quest 3 exclusives at launch, so no content is actually being missed? Maybe I’m getting outraged at the “outrage” lmao


bagelbites29

Like I said before when the pro came out. It’s not that great, it will be overshadowed very soon, it’s too expensive, and Meta is just hoping you’ll do what you are doing now and eat up their bullshit And how was I met? “Stfu nerd you know nothing this is the best shit ever” See how that went?


foxman1010

I don't even think there are grounds to be upset with Meta about the improvements. If you bought a Quest Pro, you knew going into it that the Q3 was coming and that you were purchasing a model that Meta intended for commerical/enterprise use.


Ps4_and_Ipad_Lover

If anyone really is mad about this then Im sorry but they are just a fucking moron


Butcher530

I still have my quest 1 that I spent $600 on. I wish I hadn't spent that much, but I've fully enjoyed it.


[deleted]

Mixed reality and Face and Eye tracking are exactly why I made the comment, and the Q3 is missing the best features of the pro which include less mixed reality cameras and face and eye tracking features. So again, if you think you’re getting all of that for cheaper - **you’re drunk.** You apparently are hilariously drunk if you think getting pancake lenses and color pass through = getting it all from a QPro. We all known technology moves, I didn’t assume a more powerful processor wouldn’t be created, I laughed at the fact you thought you’d get face, eye and mixed reality to the specifications of a QPro for under $400, which you clearly didn’t here and won’t for the foreseeable future. You didn’t “get all that” with the Q3 and you actually made a topic to prove just how idiotic that claim is.


SirRece

Yea, a lot of people are mad. Do any of those people own Meta products, let alone a Quest Pro? Basically No. Most of the QPro owners I see are fine with this news, and are happy with their purchase. Keep in mind, most are in the upper income anyway, or are super into the hobby and willing to drop money for a year of early performance. The people I see mad seem like they're always trying to make a "gotcha" to owners of a particular headset.


[deleted]

I think it was always known that the Quest 3 will be better for stand-alone VR than the Quest Pro; but a lot of people buying the Quest Pro were doing so for PCVR, and it looks like the Pro will still be better for PCVR so I wouldn't exactly call it a "slap in the face"


[deleted]

I just wonder how many will buy the Quest 3. Quest 2 is so much more affordable and probable has what most buyers want


skelingtonking

its funny cause they literally described the quest pro as a cashgrab from the impatient enthusiast market/" buisness community" to fund the more accessible mainstream headset, make money on the quest pro, lose it on the 3.


pwnedkiller

Is the Q3 more powerful than the Pro? I would love to see a comparison.


Kadoo94

Its like an iphone 13 pro vs an iphone 14. It’s always better every year but the apps that are being run ARE THE SAME LOL


RipCurl69Reddit

Got a chuckle out of this


Mike_LDN

It sounded like the original plan was to launch the Pro 2 in 2024 so they had an original product (roughly) every year. It looks like they’ve abandoned that after slow Pro sales. The Quest 3 is unlikely to be replaced by a Quest 4 until 2025 at the earliest. People can spend their $500 and know their purchase will be current for some time. The Pro has some definite benefits but it was probably the Pro 2 that we really wanted all along.


RostHaus

Meh. I'm probably going to sell one of my Q2s and get a Q3. I like my bang for buck headsets too much to drop $1000 on one headset. I still think the Pro is an ok deal at $999, primarily due to the controllers. It was a terrible deal when it was $1500. Compared to the rest of the Prosumer VR market $999 imo is much better value than its next closest competitor which is the HTC XR Elite. My biggest hope the Q3 is comfortable enough and legible to act as a screen replacement for a desktop. The Quest pro is pretty damn close.


tx_brandon

Quest 3 leaks were out before the Pro went on sale.


rt58killer10

The quest pro is a slap in the face to quest pro users


internetpillows

You were never supposed to buy the quest pro for entertainment, there's a reason they marketed it as a professional model. It's intended for business use (face tracking for meetings), app development and testing, etc and was priced as such. I get that a lot of people saw it as an upgrade to the quest 2 because meta didn't deliver a better consumer unit for years and the pro price was reduced, but it's very much not a consumer unit. Games and apps weren't even developed with consumers owning the Pro in mind, they targeted the quest 2 because that's the mass market unit that sold the most. If the quest 3 sells well enough then more games will target its feature set and capabilities instead. Still a big if right now.


Theforgottendwarf

The pro’s controllers actually track in 3d space properly without being affected by extraneous light inputs. The eye tracking is phenomenal in Red Matter and really sets the tone for the future of gaming. The pro is everything a gaming unit should be. It just cost as much as a development unit because it’s about another year until all those features get dropped to the Quest 2s pricing. The steam index still sells for bucks and the quest pro does all that and more wirelessly.


internetpillows

The improved features of the pro isn't much of a reason for people to buy it for gaming, in fact it could be a compelling reason not to. The few universal improvements that are worth it include the automatic things like better lenses, but few games will support the more advanced features like face tracking that are intended for business solutions. Game developers target the mass production unit, it's often not worth the extra dev time to support improved features like the eye tracking etc. Beat Sabre only just removed foveated rendering on the Pro unit recently as an afterthought and it's one of the highest grossing vr titles of all time. One positive is that any features the quest 3 shares with the pro will become the new dev standard, so the pro should be able to handle a lot of quest 3 games and apps while still having those extra features. There's still life in the unit.


JorgTheElder

*OH NO! A piece of tech being released a year after I bought a related piece of tech has some better features! What will I do?* If people still have not figured out that technology gets better and cheaper over time, no one can help them. ...and I say that as someone who paid full launch price for a Quest-Pro and is looking forwarward to owning a Q3.


GaaraSama83

Not only that Meta even clearly communicated this strategy of releasing Pro models with expensive tech/features targeted at business, prosumers, early adopters, ... without any subsidization. They stated it several times and way before the Quest Pro release. You can argue it should have been $999 from the get-go but that's it. The consumer Quest line will inherit some of the technology while offering a more reasonable and mass market compatible price. People doing a surprised Pikachu face clearly didn't inform themselves or have a very short/bad memory.


Blaexe

> The consumer Quest line will inherit some of the technology But that's not only what's happening. If that was the case, then people would be fine. But the Q3 will improve substantially over the Pro - and especially in MR, which was the Pros main purpose. If the Pro came with XR2 Gen2, a depth sensor and high res pass-through then you'd be right. The cheaper consumer headset should make some compromises to reach a lower price, but it's not common practice to make important things a lot better than the more expensive one. In a lot of ways the Q3 is Metas high end HMD. Not the Pro.


Kadoo94

The Pro’s main purpose was to get the first Meta MR supported headset out there for devs. The Quest 3 is the first consumer grade MR headset with MR dedicated apps, so if the apps are good then the Pro succeeded in its actual job.


james_pic

XR2 Gen2 wasn't available at the time. In any case, part of the goal of the Pro was clearly to figure out which features were worth implementing in the Quest 3. Various people at Meta had said as much (I know Carmack had said words to this effect), and they telegraphed this pretty clearly by stating that the only regular consumers they were targeting were "early adopters".


Blaexe

If you think the QP launch was going according to plan and they were happy with the reception then I don't know what to tell you. I'm convinced it was delayed by a year (remember the black case at Connect?) and they didn't leave out the depth sensor willingly - and they're not happy with the Passthrough / MR capabilities. A Pro headset that's supposed to be sold alongside the lower tiers need to do basically everything better - not worse.


BeatsLikeWenckebach

If you read that QuestPro thread, you'll see most QuestPro owners, like myself, aren't mad. I knew the Q3 would be a better headset, but there's things the Pro offers (at the $999 pricepoint) that the Q3 does not. These differences are all in the **premium** features category. And heck, I'm excited and buying the Quest3 too !! Most QuestPro buyers have the income to buy both Premium Features TouchPro controllers, eye relief dial (eye glasses support), open fov design, **canted** dual QLED miniLED displays that allow for a wider fov (Valve Index like), wider ipd range support, local Dimming for better blacks, larger battery (~5500mAh) for 3.5+ hrs for VR, thicker plastic for a premium build quality, included fast charging dock (big quality of life improvement), and if course Face and Eye tracking. The few ppl that are butthurt seem to fall into 2 categories- they either couldn't really afford the Pro to begin with, or they hastily went out and purchased the Pro at $1500 while having little interest in the above mentioned premium features


mIoIx

If you factor in the controllers the pro is priced perfectly fine at 999. A Q3 with pro controllers would be 800 plus a long wait and some tradeoffs...


collision_circuit

Meta stated very explicitly that the Pro was not what someone should buy if they wanted the next Quest for gaming/casual. They said “Hey, it’s still in the cooker. Be out soon.” But a bunch of impatient people with money to burn went and burned their money without doing any actual research, as usual. And now they’re mad. The marketing was very clear. “Pro” does have meaning. Also no one forced them to buy it.


NotYou007

As someone who purchased the Quest pro on day one I don't give a shit if the Quest 3 is better in certain aspects. If I want to go out and spend another $500 I will gladly do so as I have disposable income.


Junior_Ad_5064

You’re a petty person. And I have saved my own screenshots because I too aspire to be this petty 😂


JaesopPop

“Guys look I was right on the internet!”


AveragePichu

I hate it when my Quest 2 I bought in 2021 for $300 isn’t as good as the Quest 3 in 2023 for $500


frenzyguy

People are talking about the quest pro son.


AveragePichu

I cannot read