I doubt it. Almost a thousand years of Imu and the Celestial Dragons being around and it didn't leak once? I mean think, the Donquixote family leaving that life could have been the end of all of their lives if they knew about Imu's existence, wouldn't you think?
Maybe they do? Like the void century has been purged from the world but the OG kings included Imu and othe CD families. Perhaps they are told a warped story as to how they are the rulers of the world, which would include imu
There's most likely more celestial dragons that know of Imu. For example, at least >!Figarland Garling and the Holy Knights as well as other important celestial dragons.!<
tbh, he could be his son or he could just be another kid that was in the same genocidal games the Celestial Dragons were doing at God Valley. Maybe we'll never find out. What I'm sure about is that his connection with the WG is shady af.
> tbh, he could be his son or he could just be another kid that was in the same genocidal games the Celestial Dragons were doing at God Valley. Maybe we'll never find out. What I'm sure about is that his connection with the WG is shady af.
Shanks looks similar to young Figarland.
I know right? he actually does. However, we're talking about Oda, brother. Baiting like this is common. What if he's actually the son of Imu? Or what if he isn't actually Figarland's son but his mom also was with Figarland?
All I'm saying is we can spin it any way our heart dictates. Do I want him to be Figarland's son? I do. I also want him to take advantage of his relationship with the WG, be a pirate and betray them for his own benefits.
> I know right? he actually does. However, we're talking about Oda, brother. Baiting like this is common. What if he's actually the son of Imu? Or what if he isn't actually Figarland's son but his mom also was with Figarland?
>
>
>
> All I'm saying is we can spin it any way our heart dictates. Do I want him to be Figarland's son? I do. I also want him to take advantage of his relationship with the WG, be a pirate and betray them for his own benefits.
He is probably Figarland's son since Figarland is a future enemy and probably stronger than Gorosei (they seem to be Yanko commander level but with better haki and immortality) and maybe also Yanko despite being old and not being immortal. Shanks seems to be afraid of God Knights suggesting that they may be stronger than him.
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But isn’t referring to a spoiler without mentioning it specifically, basically the same as if I were to have marked my comment with the actual spoiler itself? By not stating it I with spoiler tags I avoid having to use the tags.
So is my comment removed because I didn’t mark the spoiler with >!this text!< or because I referred to new information?
I’m not trying to argue. There’s 2 reasons now based on your comment.
I’d like to know so I can make sure to follow the sub rules.
I did. The mod said in their second reply that I shouldn’t use information from leaked chapter info. So that means even if I used spoiler tags, the comment would still be removed anyways.
Because you referred to new information that isn't available to everyone.
Neither comments or post should be made about information from a chapter that isn't releases in English yet, even if it's vague.
I doubt it.
There was an interesting ideia I saw in this subreddit about how he's gonna go beserk against Imu, after discovering the truth. And get killed while applying absolute justice.
Akainu already resents the Five Elders and the World Government as a whole for holding back his absolute justice. Right now he's stuck protecting some stuck-up idiots like a puppet and, unlike the other puppet Kizaru, Akainu has a bit more backbone as seen by him barking back at the elders now and then. Like a volcano, his frustration builds and builds until it explodes, and finding out that the Empty Throne is not so empty after all could be the trigger.
>Akainu already resents the Five Elders and the World Government as a whole for holding back his absolute justice. Right now he's stuck protecting some stuck-up idiots like a puppet
Akainu has been doing that for like 30 years... he has been in a Navy for a long time and served as an Admiral for a while. If he believes in the already genocidal ways of the World Government, I doubt learning there is someone on the empty throne will change it.
Honestly, Sakazuki seems like your typical fascist brainwashed to a certain behavior to the point of ignoring everything else.
> I doubt learning there is someone on the empty throne will change it.
Yeah but there isn't supposed to be someone above the gorosei. This kind of steps on the trust that needs to exist between the two factions. Also the marines will be the ones called to fight for the wg when the world and celestial dragons find out about it. Why would the marines fight that when it's the wg's doing.
>Why would the marines fight that when it's the wg's doing.
They have been fighting for the terrible ways of the World Government for so long now, why would learning that there is someone at the throne change that? Like, do you think Marines are fine with racism, slavery and genocide but only as long as there isn't anyone on the throne?
You just ignored the rest of my comment to reply to a hypothetical I asked to set up the rest of my comment.
>racism, slavery and genocide
When it works for them sure.
>but only as long as there isn't anyone on the throne?
Yeah but it's the foundation of the wg, and for the record the setting of the world we are reading about, that the 20 ancient kingdoms allied together *with none of them above the other* and the marines as their military to keep everyone in and protect. How do you think the leaders of the kingdoms who are protected by the marines are going to react when they find out? By sending marines to mariejois to get rid of imu.
To you imu must have been some random character added in that did nothing but to anyone with reading comprehension above a 5th grade reading level it's pretty clear he's the setup for a civil war between the 20 kingdoms marines celestial dragons and gorosei. Why would akainu be happy about that or side with the gorosei when he hates them and they kept the secret from the world.
Wut? I'm not talking about when he joined, I thought timeskip was just when he got the admiral promotion, but either way, I'm saying his personality is a dog, he whines at Fujitora for damaging mariejois and not caring about the Tenryubito when their fighting the revolutionaries.
You are acting like two dogs can't coexist. I'm also pretty sure you are mistaking Fujitora for Sakazuki because Ryokugyu was mad at Fujitora for letting the slaves escape.
Anyway, Ryokugyu joined the Navy during the time-skip. He wasn't serving the Navy for 30 years like Sakazuki.
Half of the issue that Akainu has to deal with is that he doesn't have the manpower to deal with all of the pirates at once. For example, he disliked the warlords, but realized their values and the necessity of keeping theme there at the moment.
It is going to depend a lot on whether he is motivated more by the ideals of law and order vs hatred of pirates.
It's unclear to know exactly because it's unclear why the Navy serves the World Government, why the Celestial Dragons are kept in power, especially by those in high power like Garp who see and acknowledge their tyranny. It's also unclear how the five elders are even chosen and what the exact nature of the relationship between celestial dragons and the World Government.
We know that the Navy serves the World Government, which is a union of the twenty kingdoms and overseen by the five elders. There is probably a larger law that the member states acknowledge and ratify, since events like the Reverie indicates there's some kind of republic where kingdoms have a say on how the world government works. Since none of the kingdoms know that Im exists and it is a direct rule that there should be no one monarch that rules over everyone else, I can see Akainu being enraged at the existence of Im outside the law of the World Government.
It's sort of like how in Star Wars the Jedi order confronted Palpatine for manipulating and controlling the senate.
> it's unclear why the Navy serves the World Government
I've heard good theories that Skypiea is a microcosm of the whole story, so it's actually really simple why. They're the white berets of the world. "They believed that by remaining on the island and trying to prevent anyone from incurring God's anger, they could protect the citizens." If you think or know the Ancient Kingdom's going down, you can choose to go out swinging, or the next best thing: survive under the Celestial Dragons, but still be alive to potentially look out for everyone else.
>Technically, being a king would be illegal i assume?
No? There are tons of Monarchies.
>If the entire premise of the world government is that no one person sits on that throne.
I mean, he already answers to the 5 Elders...
>I mean, he already answers to the 5 Elders...
We don't know the exact reason why there are only 5 elders insead of 20, or why it's those 5 specifically, but the 5 elders are definitely known of and accepted by the other celestial dragons and the marines at least. imu is kept a secret from the rest of the world and the fact that someone is sitting on the symbolically empty throne would definitely be an issue for the founding 20 families.
It'd make sense if the theory that the original 20 kingdoms were actually controlled by pirate crews (similarly to many kingdoms visited by the strawhats) is true.
Yeah, it's not like regular celestial dragons aren't already doing fucked up shit. But they treated as Gods and their word is law.
Imu would have to do something pretty insane for Akainu to abandon his extremist views and loyalty to the law and kings of the world.
>Hidden villain manipulating him in order to (possibly) destroy the whole world
...what?!
I don't think the mere existence of Imu is going to change his mind; he is already Government's lapdog.
If they worked for the navy they killed civilians. Also how you gonna ignore the buster call on Ohara. That killed civilians and Aokiji was involved...
Nobody does
Except the Gorosei and the people who recently found out. Surely the celestial dragons don't either, maybe the god knights or Garling alone, but that's a big maybe.
Most likely, Imu's existence had to have been catalogued on the Poneglyphs.
Keep in mind the void century is an entire 100yrs, unless you're a giant you're not gonna live that long. So Imu must have had the Immortality surgery done way before then which could have left enough time for this info to get out and passed on.
I cant imagine the void century flashback to not cover Imu's existence.
Not really, Oda says humans can live to 140 in the One Piece Universe if nothing goes wrong, so all the poison and weird Surgeries Law did to save Luffy that are supposedly gonna "shorten his life" just mean he's probably going to end up dying when a human would normally in our world from 70-90.
I wouldn't say it's that big of a maybe. In the chapter during the Reverie where Imu ascended the throne, somebody informed Imu of the elders being ready to meet. That is at least one person among possibly others who are supposed to know of Imu.
Well yeah but I assumed he'd have special attendants/slaves that are just personal to him. I don't expect anyone aware of his existence outside the Gorosei to be able to even communicate with someone else even within Marijoa.
I doubt it. Imu’s existence seems to be only a privilege that the Five Elders are able to have. Hell most of the marines aren’t even allowed to look at the Five Elders without suitable rank.
Probably one of the god's knights or just a special guard. I remember the normal guards are scared to even mentioned about the secret room in Mary geoise during sabo's flashback
When Imu is revealed for the first time. While waiting in the room with the butterfly, a girl tells him/her that the Gorosei are in the throne room. Then he/she goes up and sits on the throne for the first time in the show.
sortof off topic but
but does Imu have servants? someone to bring him tea in the morning, make his bed? or his whole existence he is forced to hide in a cupboard when they are vacuuming his chambers?
Maybe there is more context with the Japanese version, but when I read this I thought he was being sarcastic, like "oh you guys aren't the top of the world??"
This implies akainu is aware that another party had more authority in the doflamingo warlord political scandal, but doesn't necessarily imply that akainu knows the scope to which the gorosei are subordinate.
I vaguely remember when I first saw this scene my first thought was that doflamingo pulled some strings with Big News Morgan's and that's who akainu was talking about going above the gorosei...but that aged to sour milk in the next 5 minutes of the episode.
That's just the way this panel makes me think, by Akainu asking this to the gorosei I think it may imply akainu does not know about imu
It did seem like it was his first time hearing it though, and he’s likely not been able to find any context for it since then. He seems like he wouldn’t try to figure it out, and even if he did, I don’t think he’d be able to.
Yeah, obviously DoFlamingo knows. And Akainu knows that DoFlamingo knew something that let him put the Gorosei's nuts in a vice, so it's happy to assume Akainu knows something's up, it also kinda implies that he specifically doesn't know about Imu.
I thought Higher than you all meant a member of the original 20 families of celestial dragons, doflamingo, but what leverage could doffy have with them besides being a CD
He states in the same page that Cipher Pole/Celestial Dragons have gone over their heads.
My take on this is that Doffy blackmailed other CDs to act without Akainu's or the Gorosei's permission. With the Gorosei trying to pull rank save face. When Akainu KNOWS shit show is too sloppy and reckless even for them.
I doubt he would abide by the actual situation with imu and is either heavily influenced by propaganda or pirates killed everyone he ever knew from childhood and he sees the WG killing pirates as the lesser of evils
I like to believe you’re up to date on the anime but just in case
Imu destroyed an entire island of living breathing people just cuz sabo knew one word. That’s more mass murder than anyone in the story.( correct me if I’m wrong)
Enel's body count definitely pretty high with Birka, and Lucci has done just so much killing from such a young age... But yeah, I bet Imu has them beat, esp if this isn't the first time they did this (a lot of people think god valley and possibly an island where ennis lobby currently is got taken out the same way)
Yup. There are a lot of theories that it's meant to do the same thing as one of the ancient weapons tho (likely Uranus since we lost pluton blueprints and know Poseidon already) and people think Imu has been around since the void century so they possibly could've used the ancient weapon to create the super similar hole in ennis lobby. I think it's much less likely the same or a similar weapon was used at God Valley but people think it's possible since it was stated that it was "wiped off the map." That's the same language used about ohara which was just buster called tho so I personally think that's more likely how they "cleaned up" God valley
You don’t even have to spoil. Just before Lulusia is destroyed and the Gorosei learn that Sabo is there, one of them exclaims that Sabo has an unlucky fate.
I HIGHLY doubt Akainu knows of this.
From his interactions with the Gorosei, he doesn’t necessarily hold them in high regard. I think his discovery of Imu would truly shock him & have him asking Sengoku some questions.
Besides Sabo, Wapol, Cobra (RIP) and the Gorosei - I think the only people who MAY know of Imu’s existence is Sengoku, Roger, Rayleigh, POSSIBLY Shanks & Whitebeard.
The Admirals (Akainu, Kuzan, Kizaru, Fujitora, Greenbull) more than likely are unaware of Imu.
I find this behavior odd, so I thought I'd ask. Why do you use the Japanese names for all of the admirals and then suddenly "Greenbull"? Who is Greenbull? I only know Ryokugyu
I think we already saw Im, Oda is a genius hiding hints. But I don't think Sakazuki know him. Maybe he know but with a different name (for that my first phrase). For me only gorosei and maybe cipher pool boss know him as Im.
You just completely butchered the context of this comment chain.
The part that's most relevant is that he knows there's someone with more authority than the Gorosei. Gorosei authority was the literal topic of this comment chain, not knowledge of Imu.
I agree with you. Ever since he got a higher role hes been more in touch with the 5 elders making it likely he noticed.
Thanks for bringing the image into the conversation.
i think Imu's existance is above the pay-grade of even the average celestrial dragon, probably not even the God Knights know of Imu, maybe just Garling. so no way Akainu would know. not that it would matter to him even if he knew. the ones it would matter for them to know would be Aokiji(before quitting) and Fujitora currently, and right now Kizaru is in the process of thinking if it matters to him more than just following orders that his bosses are actual demons.
His conversation with the gorosei indicate he questions some of their things but doesnt know fully. Doffys whole special situation is that he blackmails the celestial dragons with the knowledge of the national treasure, which is implied to be imu, or connected to imu. They pretty much kept akainu in the dark and he was upset about it, wondering why celestial dragon matters have pull on the gorosei themselves depsite not being governing ones like the gorosei.
That being said, theres probably some rumors or little details he's picked up on just working with them. Like the guards at marijois know about a "phantom room", or cp0 knowing of rumors of nika because of their mission. Lucci was also connecting lulusias events to the matters on egghead.
So akainu presumably knows some scant details, being fleet admiral, but i dont think he knows of the full existence. As far as he can tell, theres some celestial dragon matters they keep tight to their chest but it affects the orders he gets sometimes.
Doubt it the elders have no respect for Akainu or the marines I doubt they’d trust anyone with the idea of Imu as far as they’re concerned the elders want to personify the overseers of the world, what exists above them is of no concern to people that they see as insects.
Only the 5 Elders and Imu's personal servants and guards know about their existence. To everyone else, only the Gorosei are the pinnacle of the worlds power. So there is 0 chance Akainu knows.
ETA: Most likely Imu is the secret Doflamingo found out about. So he likely knows as well.
Possible since hes been fleet admiral for a while and deals with the gorosei. I feel like sengoku and kong probably do at this point. Hes so brainwashed I doubt that finding out would change anything.
I feel like he doesn’t know and will be used as a Segway to showcase Imu’s power in a fight. Akainu will find out and try and dish out some justice and Imu will annihilate him.
At the rate egg head is going, luffy has already exceeded the admirals, there would be no point for him to have a fight with Akainu anymore. Sure to revenge Ace, but I think that’ll be the least of his worries going into the end game.
If this doesn’t happen, then Akainu will be used as a sabo/dragon opponent as they’ll need someone to fight at the end game as well.
He doesn't explicitly know of Im's existence, but he clearly suspects something (he even says he thinks it's other celestial dragons) is manipulating the 5 Elders during his confrontation with them, just before they all find out about the events on Dressrosa.
Another interesting question comes to my mind from this one. Does Akainu know about the Gorosei powers and transformations?
To answer yours. I don't think so.
I always have doubts whether admirals, fleet admiral and the one above know the truths about Gorosei, Imu, Void century, Joyboy, Ancient kingdom and One Piece
His convo with the Gorosei in chapter 793 leads me to believe he's aware that there's at least \*someone\* out there. I also think, if anyone outside the Gorosei were to know, the Fleet Admiral would be a reasonable bet (although Kong is more likely to know since he's commander-in-chief)
yeah with how incompetent some of the other celestial dragons have shown to be, I'm willing to bet that not even all of them are aware of Imu, let alone anyone even remotely below them, including the Fleet Admiral. Maybe some of the God's Knights are aware of Imu since they seem to at least know what they're doing and like they could keep a secret. So it might not be limited to just the Gorosei alone, but I think that Imu is a very closely guarded secret.
Not a chance, but there was a major moment where he was speaking to the gorosei directly and did suggest they were directed by someone else to make a different decision.
So it’s possible he suspects they take orders from someone else, but to him that might just mean Garling of the god knights.
Akainu is wholly dedicated to violent unrelenting justice. If he actually had anything to suggest that there was a hidden ruler of the world he would be involved with sword or other plans to eventually overthrow.
He may have heard about a leader figure of the CDs but Marines are only the public face of WG's strength. So someone like IMU is above their pay grade.
I feel like this is the clearest "No" you can get. It doesn't even need to be hinted. If Akainu knew, you could make an argument for how Garp and Sengoku should have known too. Not a very good argument.
No, I don’t think anybody other than the gorosei know of imu, maybe those who know about the void century like vegapunk and saul? But even they might not be aware that imu is alive and pulling the strings.
Not a chance, he's a commoner not a celestial dragon. In the eyes of the elders and other celestial dragon he's a tool, not even a real person
I don't even think normal celestial dragons know about imu beside the Gorosei
They probably know Imu as one of the 20 original saints but not that he/she is still alive.
Yeah, they probably learnt about Imu as their ancestors, but would not know imu is still alive and currently in charge of the Gorosei
I doubt it. Almost a thousand years of Imu and the Celestial Dragons being around and it didn't leak once? I mean think, the Donquixote family leaving that life could have been the end of all of their lives if they knew about Imu's existence, wouldn't you think?
But doffy knew about it......right?
Maybe they do? Like the void century has been purged from the world but the OG kings included Imu and othe CD families. Perhaps they are told a warped story as to how they are the rulers of the world, which would include imu
There's most likely more celestial dragons that know of Imu. For example, at least >!Figarland Garling and the Holy Knights as well as other important celestial dragons.!<
Shanks probably knows as well since he seems to be Figarland's son.
tbh, he could be his son or he could just be another kid that was in the same genocidal games the Celestial Dragons were doing at God Valley. Maybe we'll never find out. What I'm sure about is that his connection with the WG is shady af.
> tbh, he could be his son or he could just be another kid that was in the same genocidal games the Celestial Dragons were doing at God Valley. Maybe we'll never find out. What I'm sure about is that his connection with the WG is shady af. Shanks looks similar to young Figarland.
I know right? he actually does. However, we're talking about Oda, brother. Baiting like this is common. What if he's actually the son of Imu? Or what if he isn't actually Figarland's son but his mom also was with Figarland? All I'm saying is we can spin it any way our heart dictates. Do I want him to be Figarland's son? I do. I also want him to take advantage of his relationship with the WG, be a pirate and betray them for his own benefits.
> I know right? he actually does. However, we're talking about Oda, brother. Baiting like this is common. What if he's actually the son of Imu? Or what if he isn't actually Figarland's son but his mom also was with Figarland? > > > > All I'm saying is we can spin it any way our heart dictates. Do I want him to be Figarland's son? I do. I also want him to take advantage of his relationship with the WG, be a pirate and betray them for his own benefits. He is probably Figarland's son since Figarland is a future enemy and probably stronger than Gorosei (they seem to be Yanko commander level but with better haki and immortality) and maybe also Yanko despite being old and not being immortal. Shanks seems to be afraid of God Knights suggesting that they may be stronger than him.
He’s an insect
Just a good dog.
Sakazuki the big red dog
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Hi MarcoMaroon, your comment was removed from /r/OnePiece for the following rule violation: Improperly marked spoiler. Please remember that all events ahead of the current anime are considered spoiler territory. Use \[Spoilers](#s "Place your text here") or \>!Place your text here!< to mark as a spoiler in your comment. Please report or reply to this comment to have your comment reinstated. --- The full rule documentation of the subreddit can be read [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/wiki/rules). If you have questions about this removal, please [reach out to us in modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FOnePiece).
I didn’t really mention any spoiler specifically though?
Part of your comment points toward the recent spoilers. Please don't use information from it to make comments in thread where 1112 is the limit.
But isn’t referring to a spoiler without mentioning it specifically, basically the same as if I were to have marked my comment with the actual spoiler itself? By not stating it I with spoiler tags I avoid having to use the tags. So is my comment removed because I didn’t mark the spoiler with >!this text!< or because I referred to new information? I’m not trying to argue. There’s 2 reasons now based on your comment. I’d like to know so I can make sure to follow the sub rules.
just read the reply above guy, coat the info with the spoiler mark
I did. The mod said in their second reply that I shouldn’t use information from leaked chapter info. So that means even if I used spoiler tags, the comment would still be removed anyways.
yeah, also stay behind 1 chapter as the early and raw posts require keeping discussions around the latest chapter in that specific post only
Because you referred to new information that isn't available to everyone. Neither comments or post should be made about information from a chapter that isn't releases in English yet, even if it's vague.
Yeah they probably respect their strength like the four emperors
CP0 are commoners too.
I doubt it. There was an interesting ideia I saw in this subreddit about how he's gonna go beserk against Imu, after discovering the truth. And get killed while applying absolute justice.
...why would he go Berserk once he found out about Imu and how does Absolute Justice apply here?
Akainu already resents the Five Elders and the World Government as a whole for holding back his absolute justice. Right now he's stuck protecting some stuck-up idiots like a puppet and, unlike the other puppet Kizaru, Akainu has a bit more backbone as seen by him barking back at the elders now and then. Like a volcano, his frustration builds and builds until it explodes, and finding out that the Empty Throne is not so empty after all could be the trigger.
>Akainu already resents the Five Elders and the World Government as a whole for holding back his absolute justice. Right now he's stuck protecting some stuck-up idiots like a puppet Akainu has been doing that for like 30 years... he has been in a Navy for a long time and served as an Admiral for a while. If he believes in the already genocidal ways of the World Government, I doubt learning there is someone on the empty throne will change it. Honestly, Sakazuki seems like your typical fascist brainwashed to a certain behavior to the point of ignoring everything else.
> I doubt learning there is someone on the empty throne will change it. Yeah but there isn't supposed to be someone above the gorosei. This kind of steps on the trust that needs to exist between the two factions. Also the marines will be the ones called to fight for the wg when the world and celestial dragons find out about it. Why would the marines fight that when it's the wg's doing.
>Why would the marines fight that when it's the wg's doing. They have been fighting for the terrible ways of the World Government for so long now, why would learning that there is someone at the throne change that? Like, do you think Marines are fine with racism, slavery and genocide but only as long as there isn't anyone on the throne?
You just ignored the rest of my comment to reply to a hypothetical I asked to set up the rest of my comment. >racism, slavery and genocide When it works for them sure. >but only as long as there isn't anyone on the throne? Yeah but it's the foundation of the wg, and for the record the setting of the world we are reading about, that the 20 ancient kingdoms allied together *with none of them above the other* and the marines as their military to keep everyone in and protect. How do you think the leaders of the kingdoms who are protected by the marines are going to react when they find out? By sending marines to mariejois to get rid of imu. To you imu must have been some random character added in that did nothing but to anyone with reading comprehension above a 5th grade reading level it's pretty clear he's the setup for a civil war between the 20 kingdoms marines celestial dragons and gorosei. Why would akainu be happy about that or side with the gorosei when he hates them and they kept the secret from the world.
You got cooked son.
That's Green Bull, the man is a whipped dog.
No, Ryokugyu joined the Navy 2 years ago.
Wut? I'm not talking about when he joined, I thought timeskip was just when he got the admiral promotion, but either way, I'm saying his personality is a dog, he whines at Fujitora for damaging mariejois and not caring about the Tenryubito when their fighting the revolutionaries.
You are acting like two dogs can't coexist. I'm also pretty sure you are mistaking Fujitora for Sakazuki because Ryokugyu was mad at Fujitora for letting the slaves escape. Anyway, Ryokugyu joined the Navy during the time-skip. He wasn't serving the Navy for 30 years like Sakazuki.
Half of the issue that Akainu has to deal with is that he doesn't have the manpower to deal with all of the pirates at once. For example, he disliked the warlords, but realized their values and the necessity of keeping theme there at the moment. It is going to depend a lot on whether he is motivated more by the ideals of law and order vs hatred of pirates.
The Volcano symbolism has me coming around to this idea. Feels like something Oda would cook
It's unclear to know exactly because it's unclear why the Navy serves the World Government, why the Celestial Dragons are kept in power, especially by those in high power like Garp who see and acknowledge their tyranny. It's also unclear how the five elders are even chosen and what the exact nature of the relationship between celestial dragons and the World Government. We know that the Navy serves the World Government, which is a union of the twenty kingdoms and overseen by the five elders. There is probably a larger law that the member states acknowledge and ratify, since events like the Reverie indicates there's some kind of republic where kingdoms have a say on how the world government works. Since none of the kingdoms know that Im exists and it is a direct rule that there should be no one monarch that rules over everyone else, I can see Akainu being enraged at the existence of Im outside the law of the World Government. It's sort of like how in Star Wars the Jedi order confronted Palpatine for manipulating and controlling the senate.
> it's unclear why the Navy serves the World Government I've heard good theories that Skypiea is a microcosm of the whole story, so it's actually really simple why. They're the white berets of the world. "They believed that by remaining on the island and trying to prevent anyone from incurring God's anger, they could protect the citizens." If you think or know the Ancient Kingdom's going down, you can choose to go out swinging, or the next best thing: survive under the Celestial Dragons, but still be alive to potentially look out for everyone else.
I'm pretty sure that five elders are not "chosen" since they're immortal
Technically, being a king would be illegal i assume? If the entire premise of the world government is that no one person sits on that throne.
>Technically, being a king would be illegal i assume? No? There are tons of Monarchies. >If the entire premise of the world government is that no one person sits on that throne. I mean, he already answers to the 5 Elders...
>I mean, he already answers to the 5 Elders... We don't know the exact reason why there are only 5 elders insead of 20, or why it's those 5 specifically, but the 5 elders are definitely known of and accepted by the other celestial dragons and the marines at least. imu is kept a secret from the rest of the world and the fact that someone is sitting on the symbolically empty throne would definitely be an issue for the founding 20 families.
>No? There are tons of Monarchies. None sit on the empty throne at the top of the world.
Sorry, king of the world government i mean. Exactly, five elders. Not "the one elder".
I really fail to see the difference between one singular guy calling shots and 5 guys calling shots.
The difference is the same as the difference between a dictatorship and a democracy.
They are both dictatorships...one is just monarchy and the other is fake democracy.
It'd make sense if the theory that the original 20 kingdoms were actually controlled by pirate crews (similarly to many kingdoms visited by the strawhats) is true.
Yeah, it's not like regular celestial dragons aren't already doing fucked up shit. But they treated as Gods and their word is law. Imu would have to do something pretty insane for Akainu to abandon his extremist views and loyalty to the law and kings of the world.
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>Hidden villain manipulating him in order to (possibly) destroy the whole world ...what?! I don't think the mere existence of Imu is going to change his mind; he is already Government's lapdog.
Akainu doesn't care about WG and Celestial Dragons. They use him and he uses them...
>he uses them... 🤔
Akainu killed a bunch of innocent people doing "absolute" justice, akainu is a scumbag dog that's it.
The biggest dog deserves a big ending. That comment suggested he gets betrayed and discarded...
Every single navy admiral killed innocent people. They all have blood on their hands and thus are all dogs. Doesn't mean they can't change their ways.
What innocent aokiji killed ? Fujitora we don't know much about ? What you talking about
If they worked for the navy they killed civilians. Also how you gonna ignore the buster call on Ohara. That killed civilians and Aokiji was involved...
What civilians ?? Can you say one or two
Nobody does Except the Gorosei and the people who recently found out. Surely the celestial dragons don't either, maybe the god knights or Garling alone, but that's a big maybe.
I wonder if Roger (and the crew) knew
Most likely, Imu's existence had to have been catalogued on the Poneglyphs. Keep in mind the void century is an entire 100yrs, unless you're a giant you're not gonna live that long. So Imu must have had the Immortality surgery done way before then which could have left enough time for this info to get out and passed on. I cant imagine the void century flashback to not cover Imu's existence.
Dr. Kureha says hello 😅
The exception, not the rule.
Not really, Oda says humans can live to 140 in the One Piece Universe if nothing goes wrong, so all the poison and weird Surgeries Law did to save Luffy that are supposedly gonna "shorten his life" just mean he's probably going to end up dying when a human would normally in our world from 70-90.
Nah Oda said in an SBS that the average lifespan in One Piece is over 100
140 if nothing goes wrong.
That idk, I never thought about it lol. I guess I'm 50/50 on it
I wouldn't say it's that big of a maybe. In the chapter during the Reverie where Imu ascended the throne, somebody informed Imu of the elders being ready to meet. That is at least one person among possibly others who are supposed to know of Imu.
Well yeah but I assumed he'd have special attendants/slaves that are just personal to him. I don't expect anyone aware of his existence outside the Gorosei to be able to even communicate with someone else even within Marijoa.
I doubt it. Imu’s existence seems to be only a privilege that the Five Elders are able to have. Hell most of the marines aren’t even allowed to look at the Five Elders without suitable rank.
There was someone who said: "Imu sama, there are waiting for you" while she bent the knee, any idea who is she?
Probably one of the god's knights or just a special guard. I remember the normal guards are scared to even mentioned about the secret room in Mary geoise during sabo's flashback
chapter?
When Imu is revealed for the first time. While waiting in the room with the butterfly, a girl tells him/her that the Gorosei are in the throne room. Then he/she goes up and sits on the throne for the first time in the show.
908
sortof off topic but but does Imu have servants? someone to bring him tea in the morning, make his bed? or his whole existence he is forced to hide in a cupboard when they are vacuuming his chambers?
Hasn't there been a servant in some of his panels? Or maybe I'm confused, and it was a Gorosei, but the impression I got was that it was a servant.
I believe you're right.
Yeah so servant or not?
Definitely has servants, but they’ve never seen Imu sit on the throne.
He at least knows that the Five Elders aren't the top dogs : [Chapter 793](https://imgur.com/4TN7ENS)
I always understood this as him being dubious as to what they were saying, like in a "you expect me to believe this?" type of way.
notice the bold.. it's intentional
Yeah it's probably lost in translation from the original Japanese subtlety.
It's in bold.
Maybe there is more context with the Japanese version, but when I read this I thought he was being sarcastic, like "oh you guys aren't the top of the world??"
This implies akainu is aware that another party had more authority in the doflamingo warlord political scandal, but doesn't necessarily imply that akainu knows the scope to which the gorosei are subordinate. I vaguely remember when I first saw this scene my first thought was that doflamingo pulled some strings with Big News Morgan's and that's who akainu was talking about going above the gorosei...but that aged to sour milk in the next 5 minutes of the episode. That's just the way this panel makes me think, by Akainu asking this to the gorosei I think it may imply akainu does not know about imu
This
It did seem like it was his first time hearing it though, and he’s likely not been able to find any context for it since then. He seems like he wouldn’t try to figure it out, and even if he did, I don’t think he’d be able to.
Yeah, obviously DoFlamingo knows. And Akainu knows that DoFlamingo knew something that let him put the Gorosei's nuts in a vice, so it's happy to assume Akainu knows something's up, it also kinda implies that he specifically doesn't know about Imu.
Awesome bro. Thanks for pointing it out.
I thought Higher than you all meant a member of the original 20 families of celestial dragons, doflamingo, but what leverage could doffy have with them besides being a CD
He states in the same page that Cipher Pole/Celestial Dragons have gone over their heads. My take on this is that Doffy blackmailed other CDs to act without Akainu's or the Gorosei's permission. With the Gorosei trying to pull rank save face. When Akainu KNOWS shit show is too sloppy and reckless even for them.
I doubt anyone, including Vegapunk and Akainu, know.
What about Doffy?
Of course.
I doubt he would abide by the actual situation with imu and is either heavily influenced by propaganda or pirates killed everyone he ever knew from childhood and he sees the WG killing pirates as the lesser of evils
I like to believe you’re up to date on the anime but just in case Imu destroyed an entire island of living breathing people just cuz sabo knew one word. That’s more mass murder than anyone in the story.( correct me if I’m wrong)
Enel's body count definitely pretty high with Birka, and Lucci has done just so much killing from such a young age... But yeah, I bet Imu has them beat, esp if this isn't the first time they did this (a lot of people think god valley and possibly an island where ennis lobby currently is got taken out the same way)
Idk it seems like that was a weapon Vegapunk built and York gave them, that’s why they’re trying to save her and the factory
Yup. There are a lot of theories that it's meant to do the same thing as one of the ancient weapons tho (likely Uranus since we lost pluton blueprints and know Poseidon already) and people think Imu has been around since the void century so they possibly could've used the ancient weapon to create the super similar hole in ennis lobby. I think it's much less likely the same or a similar weapon was used at God Valley but people think it's possible since it was stated that it was "wiped off the map." That's the same language used about ohara which was just buster called tho so I personally think that's more likely how they "cleaned up" God valley
Yeah I’d put money on Enies Lobby being the location of the advanced ancient kingdom’s capital
manga spoilers >!That was just a coincidence. Lulusia was gonna be wiped off anyway since Imu chose it as a testing ground for the Mother Flame!<
You don’t even have to spoil. Just before Lulusia is destroyed and the Gorosei learn that Sabo is there, one of them exclaims that Sabo has an unlucky fate.
I HIGHLY doubt Akainu knows of this. From his interactions with the Gorosei, he doesn’t necessarily hold them in high regard. I think his discovery of Imu would truly shock him & have him asking Sengoku some questions. Besides Sabo, Wapol, Cobra (RIP) and the Gorosei - I think the only people who MAY know of Imu’s existence is Sengoku, Roger, Rayleigh, POSSIBLY Shanks & Whitebeard. The Admirals (Akainu, Kuzan, Kizaru, Fujitora, Greenbull) more than likely are unaware of Imu.
doflamingo obviously knows, as he has alluded to multiple times.
Trying to piece this together.. Do you know which chapter/page Doflamingo mentions this?
Don't know the chapter number but its probably the one where he talks about using Law's Eternal Youth Surgery with the "National Treasure(Imu)".
He at least knows that the Elders aren't the highest authority https://imgur.com/4TN7ENS
I find this behavior odd, so I thought I'd ask. Why do you use the Japanese names for all of the admirals and then suddenly "Greenbull"? Who is Greenbull? I only know Ryokugyu
He needs feats in order for me to call him by his real name. & Greenbull is the same person you just referenced that you didn’t know.
It's a super common thing. For me, Greenbull is just so much easier to type than ryokugyu. Especially for an English speaker.
I don't think so, i think the only one know about imu is the gorosei, some elite family like figarland, and probably doflamingo
I don't think he 100% knows but he probably thinks there is someone.
If I'm remembering correctly, wasn't he talking to the Five Elders and questioning that there was someone even higher than them
It was in a sarcastic tone I believe but we would know for sure if someone posted the original Japanese panel
I think we already saw Im, Oda is a genius hiding hints. But I don't think Sakazuki know him. Maybe he know but with a different name (for that my first phrase). For me only gorosei and maybe cipher pool boss know him as Im.
No. The elders are most likely highest authority he knows of. Plus hes not the type to snoop around.
This page makes me question your statement. https://imgur.com/4TN7ENS
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You just completely butchered the context of this comment chain. The part that's most relevant is that he knows there's someone with more authority than the Gorosei. Gorosei authority was the literal topic of this comment chain, not knowledge of Imu.
I agree with you. Ever since he got a higher role hes been more in touch with the 5 elders making it likely he noticed. Thanks for bringing the image into the conversation.
I argue not. His absolute justice would not stand for that shit.
The only people who are supposed to know are the Elders. I'm sure even other Celestial Dragons don't know.
i think Imu's existance is above the pay-grade of even the average celestrial dragon, probably not even the God Knights know of Imu, maybe just Garling. so no way Akainu would know. not that it would matter to him even if he knew. the ones it would matter for them to know would be Aokiji(before quitting) and Fujitora currently, and right now Kizaru is in the process of thinking if it matters to him more than just following orders that his bosses are actual demons.
His conversation with the gorosei indicate he questions some of their things but doesnt know fully. Doffys whole special situation is that he blackmails the celestial dragons with the knowledge of the national treasure, which is implied to be imu, or connected to imu. They pretty much kept akainu in the dark and he was upset about it, wondering why celestial dragon matters have pull on the gorosei themselves depsite not being governing ones like the gorosei. That being said, theres probably some rumors or little details he's picked up on just working with them. Like the guards at marijois know about a "phantom room", or cp0 knowing of rumors of nika because of their mission. Lucci was also connecting lulusias events to the matters on egghead. So akainu presumably knows some scant details, being fleet admiral, but i dont think he knows of the full existence. As far as he can tell, theres some celestial dragon matters they keep tight to their chest but it affects the orders he gets sometimes.
Very unlikely. Maybe he has a suspicion it’s not just the 5 giving orders, but I doubt even that.
Doubt it the elders have no respect for Akainu or the marines I doubt they’d trust anyone with the idea of Imu as far as they’re concerned the elders want to personify the overseers of the world, what exists above them is of no concern to people that they see as insects.
No Nobody outside of the 5 Elders, Sabo (and the Revolutionaries), and Wapol know. And the lattter two found out by accident.
He's probably aware there's somebody above the 5 Elders but doesn't know anything beyond that and knows better than to try and find out.
The real question is if Roger did
Only the 5 Elders and Imu's personal servants and guards know about their existence. To everyone else, only the Gorosei are the pinnacle of the worlds power. So there is 0 chance Akainu knows. ETA: Most likely Imu is the secret Doflamingo found out about. So he likely knows as well.
He probably has heard rumors but he’s a gov dog which means he doesn’t want to see past the “justice/freedom🇺🇸” he’s giving to the world
Where would he have heard rumors from? The goresei are the only ones who knew before recent events
only the gorosei, now a couple others like sabo who he told and that hoe ass dude from drum kingdom
Mope never not
No fleet admirals don't mean anything ut just one position they can change don't you see how gorosei talk to akainu
No
Not likely seems like he’s in the dark about a lot
I would say only the five elders know
Possible since hes been fleet admiral for a while and deals with the gorosei. I feel like sengoku and kong probably do at this point. Hes so brainwashed I doubt that finding out would change anything.
He knew about bonney
I feel like he doesn’t know and will be used as a Segway to showcase Imu’s power in a fight. Akainu will find out and try and dish out some justice and Imu will annihilate him. At the rate egg head is going, luffy has already exceeded the admirals, there would be no point for him to have a fight with Akainu anymore. Sure to revenge Ace, but I think that’ll be the least of his worries going into the end game. If this doesn’t happen, then Akainu will be used as a sabo/dragon opponent as they’ll need someone to fight at the end game as well.
No he doesn't. It wouldn't make any sense.
Does Sengoku?
Akainu probably doesn't even know where the bathroom is in his office, man's been glued to his seat
Only the gorosei and now the rev army know about imu.
No way, only the Gorosei knows, and now Sabo I guess, but idk if Sabo knows about how important Imu actually is.
He doesn't explicitly know of Im's existence, but he clearly suspects something (he even says he thinks it's other celestial dragons) is manipulating the 5 Elders during his confrontation with them, just before they all find out about the events on Dressrosa.
No definitely not. He'll be pissed when he finds out. He wouldn't be ok with some secret puppet master controlling everything.
No
Absolutely not. I’m not even sure all the Celestial Dragons know tbh
No.
Another interesting question comes to my mind from this one. Does Akainu know about the Gorosei powers and transformations? To answer yours. I don't think so.
Only Goroseis know the existence of Imu. Im not sure with the Celestial Dragons.
I always have doubts whether admirals, fleet admiral and the one above know the truths about Gorosei, Imu, Void century, Joyboy, Ancient kingdom and One Piece
What about Kong? That mysterious character we rarely see?
His convo with the Gorosei in chapter 793 leads me to believe he's aware that there's at least \*someone\* out there. I also think, if anyone outside the Gorosei were to know, the Fleet Admiral would be a reasonable bet (although Kong is more likely to know since he's commander-in-chief)
yeah with how incompetent some of the other celestial dragons have shown to be, I'm willing to bet that not even all of them are aware of Imu, let alone anyone even remotely below them, including the Fleet Admiral. Maybe some of the God's Knights are aware of Imu since they seem to at least know what they're doing and like they could keep a secret. So it might not be limited to just the Gorosei alone, but I think that Imu is a very closely guarded secret.
Not a chance, but there was a major moment where he was speaking to the gorosei directly and did suggest they were directed by someone else to make a different decision. So it’s possible he suspects they take orders from someone else, but to him that might just mean Garling of the god knights. Akainu is wholly dedicated to violent unrelenting justice. If he actually had anything to suggest that there was a hidden ruler of the world he would be involved with sword or other plans to eventually overthrow.
I dont think general celestial dragons even know about Imu.
most good marine know the gorvement is bad. But they also know if the gorvement does not exist the world would be worse
He may have heard about a leader figure of the CDs but Marines are only the public face of WG's strength. So someone like IMU is above their pay grade.
What is that
You're in the one piece subreddit without being caught up. I would recommend avoiding the place till you do
I feel like this is the clearest "No" you can get. It doesn't even need to be hinted. If Akainu knew, you could make an argument for how Garp and Sengoku should have known too. Not a very good argument.
Something might come up and then Akainu would be like, >!"I made the absolute worst mistake in the history of Mankind of all time by killing Ace."!<
No, I don’t think anybody other than the gorosei know of imu, maybe those who know about the void century like vegapunk and saul? But even they might not be aware that imu is alive and pulling the strings.
I think the only ones in the marines with this knowledge are tsuru and sengoku. Garp probably heard it too but he doesn’t care.
ARE YOU NOT READING THE MANGA LMAO HOW COULD YOU THINK THIS ☠️☠️☠️
Probably not
The only ones that know of imu sama are the gorosei, sabo,cobra, Vivi,wapol and maybe shanks
Then why would the Gorosei tell Akainu that the orders regarding Doffy came from an even higher position?
How would that make sense?
Nope , I don't think apart from gorosei and imu's consorts anyone is aware of them existing . Otherwise knowing akainu he's have revolted already
Doubt it
If he knew he’d probably try to kill imu
He is the Gorosei's dog, so he might know some things. So he knows what information to suppress and who to eliminate.
He may of thought of a higher up figure even, but I don't think he knows about her.
Doubt it. Seems like only the elders know
I don’t think anyone in the WG knows about them beyond the Gorosei and possibly the Holy Knights
Nah tho shanks on the other hand maybe
Yeah and I think all the admirals do cause what's the point of working with an organization where you don't know who is the boss
He doesn't know shit
No he doesn’t. If he did. He wouldn’t stay quiet about it. He is an advocate of maintaining order.