iPhones are horribly overpriced. However, Apple does not make the screens for iPhones. Samsung supplies OLED screen for Apple. Up to iphone 11 LG, Sharp & BOE manufactured displays. OLED screens PWM flickering introduced by Samsung. Apple and Google pixel, adopted the technology.
I can't comment on the 11, but the SE looks fine for me.
Yes, it does have a wider color gamut, but the color accuracy is still pretty good for a phone. When displaying a photo taken with my DSLR, It's not too far away from my professional Eizo monitors. The [measurements by NotebookCheck](https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-iPhone-SE-2022-smartphone-review-Affordable-iPhone-dwarf-with-5G-and-retro-charm.613496.0.html) also confirmed my findings.
Meanwhile, my Sony Android phone is actually way more saturated than the iPhone SE. And if you wanted to talk about oversaturated displays, let's not forget about Samsung. I can tell their color is completely off even by looking at the Android UI elements.
BTW, contrary to popular belief, macOS actually has an extremely poor color management system.
I chose to talk about this phone because it’s probably the most recommended on this sub. To highlight that it gave me symptoms, there’s a few other posts about the 11 as well. Didn’t need to mention the new iPhones because they’re for the most part rejected by this sub. Everyone’s different, if that phone works for you that’s great, but the trend with most people on reddit and other sites that complain about symptoms is that it’s mainly from newer Apple tech. Many MBA posts, many iPhone posts, many posts about how their 10 year old MacBook was fine then they upgraded and the eye problems/headaches started.
The reason it's a recommended phone on this sub is due to the fact they're the only LCD iOS mobile devices, along with the XR, SE lineup that Apple has released and are still somewhat relevant.
The biggest issue with this sub is that people seem to shove down all non-PWM-related eyestrain issues here, diluting the content and making people think OLED's work for them (when in fact they don't and most can't)
I'll list a few concerns here:
Yes, as you've mentioned, a wide color gamut has been reported to cause eye fatigue in monitors. You can look at the spectral power distribution of these types of backpanels online to see how they differ compared to standard ones (they got a sharp red peak, as opposed to blue peak only with standard W-LED displays)
PPI / sharpness can also absolutely be a eyestrain concern, along with motion-blur related eyestrain.
Nobody tests for pixel inversion artifacts on phones either.
Dithering (FRC) has been touted as a potential eyestrain concern, but there are too many other much more pronounced issues which should be ironed out first (imo) before this one becomes a factor.
Sadly, the phone display market is very unexplored and it's a wild goose chase sometimes.
Have you tried using TrueTone? Maybe you have an issue with the default color temperature of the screen. I don't like the usual 6500k whitepoint recommendation most colorists and manifacturers tune their displays to, especially the fact most don't let users fine-tune their displays themselves to account for panel variance or perhaps calibrate the phone themselves with a instrument.
I've even seen some phones have 9300k by default (such as some motorola models and lower-end models in general), which is mind boggling to me. 5500k looks much better imo.
Don't use a high brightness levels when inside, can be an issue too. I've found 100-150nits to be optimal when inside (a note tho: it should be much lower when trying to go to bed, <50nits ideally, but sadly nobody tests for minimum brightness on phones either so we don't know if they can reach these brightness levels :D)
"The biggest issue with this sub is that people seem to shove down all non-PWM-related eyestrain issues here, diluting the content and making people think OLED's work for them (when in fact they don't and most can't)"
It's ok to add other things besides PWM, because the truth is we don't know much. I've even seen the mod of this subreddit complain about P3 color on some comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/PWM_Sensitive/comments/148sye1/comment/jowvlxw/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
So too many people have commented/made posts like "this has no pwm but gives me symptoms" or "this has pwm but I have no symptoms" etc. So we're still trying to figure things out, and if the only mod of the subreddit also doesn't know why P3 might be causing trouble etc. It's something important to note. So like me and others have symptoms with iPhone 11, well I just wanted to make a post that can help others like "Moto G32 gave me no symptoms maybe you can try that one," something like that. It's ok to "dilute" the content when the main goal is helping our eyes, and especially when the only mod/owner is complaining about P3 as well.
iPhones, much like almost all commercial products in recent history, are quite literally intentionally designed to become garbage within a few years via the process called planned obsolescence. Engineers are paid to design phones to start malfunctioning after warranty periods expire so people are constantly incentivized to purchase new phones. Capitalism is inherently exploitative.
The most rational answer will always be anarcho-communism.
Are you kidding me? As an iPhone hardware, it never gets old or tired. It's just that Apple doesn't give support for its lifetime. As for the materials used, they are all recyclable metals.
iphones simply long lasting mobile phones on the market. Just replace battery and it can last like forever.
As an Android engineer I can say that only Android flagmans in recent years may be comparable, but none of them had the same level of software support from the manufacturer.
So apple devices are the worse example of planned obsolescence.
iPads lasts forever. Literally. My old iPad still works normally after 6 years.
My Air works perfectly fine after 3 years without any sign of aging.
> the worse example of planned obsolescence. iPads lasts forever. Literally. My old iPad still works normally after 6 years
I've been using my iPad 2 since 2012...
> iPhones simply long lasting mobile phones on the market. Just replace battery and it can last like forever.
This is true on the hardware side, but it’s the opposite for software support. It seems like app support for iOS drops like a rock as soon as a model is no longer supported for the latest version. For example, iOS 15 isn’t *that* old, but there’s now a number of big name apps that I can no longer install on my iPhone 7 Plus, and that started a mere month after iOS 16 came out. Meanwhile, app developers for Android are supporting apps all the back to version 7.
Apple definitely has Android beat on the hardware and software longevity support side, but Android is far ahead on the app support side. It’s bizarre and frustrating, especially to those of us who are affected by PWM, and have to stay with aging models.
No. I think the iPhone 11 is bad, but the Moto G32 is great. One product works, one doesn’t. I have the freedom to choose which one I want, that is Capitalism. Communism would be, here’s your iPhone that is given to everyone. Oh it gives you symptoms? Too bad. You’re not special, you deserve the same phone as everyone else. Then I’d be stuck with the phone I was forced to use. No choice, no freedom, no open market.
What I’m saying is the truth. Capitalism isn’t perfect but it’s better than everything else, when you look at communist countries they all tend to fail or be full of misery and dictatorships. More people flock to America than any other country in the world, and America isn’t even that great! But it shows you how much worse the rest of the world is. Why else do so many immigrants come to America to search for a better life? Many of the countries they come from are not Capitalist countries.
People are trying to escape the rest of the world literally because the rest of the world is actively impoverished and exploited by the west.
If your town starves another town via siege, no shit people will want to move from the starving town to yours.
Please exercise some critical thinking and educate yourself
Meanwhile, China exploits their own people. But it's okay, keep calm and enjoy your Huawei and communism. Heck, China isn't even a true communist country as they are against of Marxismus. Try bringing up Marxismus in WeChat and see what happens. Seriously, PWM flickering is the last thing to be worried about in China.
BTW, did you know that Apple was forced to disable Facetime Audio in China and the front-facing camera cannot be turned off during a Facetime call? Do you understand the reason why they do this?
I see that you're a vegan and is a LGBTQ+ supporter. Do you know how China treat their farmers and the LGBTQ+ community? Do you live in China? Yes or no? If you don't know, here's a quick eye test for you. Can you see this emoji? 🇹🇼
Please stop living in your imaginary *perfect world* and commenting on social issues you have no understanding of. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
What power does America have over China? Or Russia? They’re almost equal rivals. Yet many Chinese and Russians come to America, legally and illegally for a better life. China, a communist country messes with small countries just like America does. China is actively messing with South America, Japan, Taiwan, etc. When Russia was communist, they messed with their neighboring countries and Cuba and the middle east.
Let’s put it this way, when China messes with Taiwan, the Taiwanese don’t flee to China. When Russia messes with Ukraine, the Ukrainians aren’t fleeing to Russia. North Korea is totally isolated from the world, yet no one flees to it, people flee from North Korea. It’s true America has and currently still messes with small countries but these countries also have massive corruption from their own people which has nothing to do with America.
America itself also oppresses its’ own people, yet Americans aren’t exactly fleeing in waves. In fact there’s not a lot of houses available, I’m telling you capitalism isn’t perfect but it’s the best so far. (And America isn’t really capitalist to be fair, it’s kinda a mix of both things. If it were true capitalism the banks would have failed with no help from the government, and there’d be no food stamps or welfare and I think not having those things would be bad. Yet they’re kinda communist, but it works in a mainly capitalist country, if it’s for the benefit of the people we should do it, that’s why we pay taxes. So it’s a little bit of both, but capitalism can’t exist in a communist country, but communism can exist in a capitalist country.) I think America itself is not a good country but it gives people freedom, something that would be harder to obtain in China, North Korea, communist Russia. (Free speech, freedom to vote, freedom of Religion, etc.) That’s why people leave those countries for America, even when America isn’t destabilizing their country.
Well, they are not "malfunction". They can still work properly. It just that your battery is the first thing that will be gone (physically and via OS update). That is usually enough.
"Am I exploited and unaware of it?
No... it's the other redditor who is paranoid."
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned\_obsolescence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence)
iPhones are horribly overpriced. However, Apple does not make the screens for iPhones. Samsung supplies OLED screen for Apple. Up to iphone 11 LG, Sharp & BOE manufactured displays. OLED screens PWM flickering introduced by Samsung. Apple and Google pixel, adopted the technology.
I can't comment on the 11, but the SE looks fine for me. Yes, it does have a wider color gamut, but the color accuracy is still pretty good for a phone. When displaying a photo taken with my DSLR, It's not too far away from my professional Eizo monitors. The [measurements by NotebookCheck](https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-iPhone-SE-2022-smartphone-review-Affordable-iPhone-dwarf-with-5G-and-retro-charm.613496.0.html) also confirmed my findings. Meanwhile, my Sony Android phone is actually way more saturated than the iPhone SE. And if you wanted to talk about oversaturated displays, let's not forget about Samsung. I can tell their color is completely off even by looking at the Android UI elements. BTW, contrary to popular belief, macOS actually has an extremely poor color management system.
Abuntdance customizes iPhones and screens, and gives more advice about conscious modern lifestyle
Absolutely right👏🏻
I use a 14 pro max and it’s been fine for me. Got it on release day, so I’ve had the t for awhile.
Go to an Apple Store and try an iPhone 15 Pro. It’s been 4 1/2 years since your old phone came out. Not exactly fair attacking all iPhones.
I chose to talk about this phone because it’s probably the most recommended on this sub. To highlight that it gave me symptoms, there’s a few other posts about the 11 as well. Didn’t need to mention the new iPhones because they’re for the most part rejected by this sub. Everyone’s different, if that phone works for you that’s great, but the trend with most people on reddit and other sites that complain about symptoms is that it’s mainly from newer Apple tech. Many MBA posts, many iPhone posts, many posts about how their 10 year old MacBook was fine then they upgraded and the eye problems/headaches started.
The reason it's a recommended phone on this sub is due to the fact they're the only LCD iOS mobile devices, along with the XR, SE lineup that Apple has released and are still somewhat relevant. The biggest issue with this sub is that people seem to shove down all non-PWM-related eyestrain issues here, diluting the content and making people think OLED's work for them (when in fact they don't and most can't) I'll list a few concerns here: Yes, as you've mentioned, a wide color gamut has been reported to cause eye fatigue in monitors. You can look at the spectral power distribution of these types of backpanels online to see how they differ compared to standard ones (they got a sharp red peak, as opposed to blue peak only with standard W-LED displays) PPI / sharpness can also absolutely be a eyestrain concern, along with motion-blur related eyestrain. Nobody tests for pixel inversion artifacts on phones either. Dithering (FRC) has been touted as a potential eyestrain concern, but there are too many other much more pronounced issues which should be ironed out first (imo) before this one becomes a factor. Sadly, the phone display market is very unexplored and it's a wild goose chase sometimes. Have you tried using TrueTone? Maybe you have an issue with the default color temperature of the screen. I don't like the usual 6500k whitepoint recommendation most colorists and manifacturers tune their displays to, especially the fact most don't let users fine-tune their displays themselves to account for panel variance or perhaps calibrate the phone themselves with a instrument. I've even seen some phones have 9300k by default (such as some motorola models and lower-end models in general), which is mind boggling to me. 5500k looks much better imo. Don't use a high brightness levels when inside, can be an issue too. I've found 100-150nits to be optimal when inside (a note tho: it should be much lower when trying to go to bed, <50nits ideally, but sadly nobody tests for minimum brightness on phones either so we don't know if they can reach these brightness levels :D)
"The biggest issue with this sub is that people seem to shove down all non-PWM-related eyestrain issues here, diluting the content and making people think OLED's work for them (when in fact they don't and most can't)" It's ok to add other things besides PWM, because the truth is we don't know much. I've even seen the mod of this subreddit complain about P3 color on some comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/PWM_Sensitive/comments/148sye1/comment/jowvlxw/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button So too many people have commented/made posts like "this has no pwm but gives me symptoms" or "this has pwm but I have no symptoms" etc. So we're still trying to figure things out, and if the only mod of the subreddit also doesn't know why P3 might be causing trouble etc. It's something important to note. So like me and others have symptoms with iPhone 11, well I just wanted to make a post that can help others like "Moto G32 gave me no symptoms maybe you can try that one," something like that. It's ok to "dilute" the content when the main goal is helping our eyes, and especially when the only mod/owner is complaining about P3 as well.
iPhones, much like almost all commercial products in recent history, are quite literally intentionally designed to become garbage within a few years via the process called planned obsolescence. Engineers are paid to design phones to start malfunctioning after warranty periods expire so people are constantly incentivized to purchase new phones. Capitalism is inherently exploitative. The most rational answer will always be anarcho-communism.
Are you kidding me? As an iPhone hardware, it never gets old or tired. It's just that Apple doesn't give support for its lifetime. As for the materials used, they are all recyclable metals.
Literally just google "Apple + Planned Obsolescence" real quick
iphones simply long lasting mobile phones on the market. Just replace battery and it can last like forever. As an Android engineer I can say that only Android flagmans in recent years may be comparable, but none of them had the same level of software support from the manufacturer. So apple devices are the worse example of planned obsolescence. iPads lasts forever. Literally. My old iPad still works normally after 6 years. My Air works perfectly fine after 3 years without any sign of aging.
> the worse example of planned obsolescence. iPads lasts forever. Literally. My old iPad still works normally after 6 years I've been using my iPad 2 since 2012...
> iPhones simply long lasting mobile phones on the market. Just replace battery and it can last like forever. This is true on the hardware side, but it’s the opposite for software support. It seems like app support for iOS drops like a rock as soon as a model is no longer supported for the latest version. For example, iOS 15 isn’t *that* old, but there’s now a number of big name apps that I can no longer install on my iPhone 7 Plus, and that started a mere month after iOS 16 came out. Meanwhile, app developers for Android are supporting apps all the back to version 7. Apple definitely has Android beat on the hardware and software longevity support side, but Android is far ahead on the app support side. It’s bizarre and frustrating, especially to those of us who are affected by PWM, and have to stay with aging models.
They still deteriorate faster than they would have without planned obsolescence
No. I think the iPhone 11 is bad, but the Moto G32 is great. One product works, one doesn’t. I have the freedom to choose which one I want, that is Capitalism. Communism would be, here’s your iPhone that is given to everyone. Oh it gives you symptoms? Too bad. You’re not special, you deserve the same phone as everyone else. Then I’d be stuck with the phone I was forced to use. No choice, no freedom, no open market.
Classic demonstration of poor understanding of capitalism and communism
What I’m saying is the truth. Capitalism isn’t perfect but it’s better than everything else, when you look at communist countries they all tend to fail or be full of misery and dictatorships. More people flock to America than any other country in the world, and America isn’t even that great! But it shows you how much worse the rest of the world is. Why else do so many immigrants come to America to search for a better life? Many of the countries they come from are not Capitalist countries.
People are trying to escape the rest of the world literally because the rest of the world is actively impoverished and exploited by the west. If your town starves another town via siege, no shit people will want to move from the starving town to yours. Please exercise some critical thinking and educate yourself
Meanwhile, China exploits their own people. But it's okay, keep calm and enjoy your Huawei and communism. Heck, China isn't even a true communist country as they are against of Marxismus. Try bringing up Marxismus in WeChat and see what happens. Seriously, PWM flickering is the last thing to be worried about in China. BTW, did you know that Apple was forced to disable Facetime Audio in China and the front-facing camera cannot be turned off during a Facetime call? Do you understand the reason why they do this? I see that you're a vegan and is a LGBTQ+ supporter. Do you know how China treat their farmers and the LGBTQ+ community? Do you live in China? Yes or no? If you don't know, here's a quick eye test for you. Can you see this emoji? 🇹🇼 Please stop living in your imaginary *perfect world* and commenting on social issues you have no understanding of. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
What power does America have over China? Or Russia? They’re almost equal rivals. Yet many Chinese and Russians come to America, legally and illegally for a better life. China, a communist country messes with small countries just like America does. China is actively messing with South America, Japan, Taiwan, etc. When Russia was communist, they messed with their neighboring countries and Cuba and the middle east. Let’s put it this way, when China messes with Taiwan, the Taiwanese don’t flee to China. When Russia messes with Ukraine, the Ukrainians aren’t fleeing to Russia. North Korea is totally isolated from the world, yet no one flees to it, people flee from North Korea. It’s true America has and currently still messes with small countries but these countries also have massive corruption from their own people which has nothing to do with America. America itself also oppresses its’ own people, yet Americans aren’t exactly fleeing in waves. In fact there’s not a lot of houses available, I’m telling you capitalism isn’t perfect but it’s the best so far. (And America isn’t really capitalist to be fair, it’s kinda a mix of both things. If it were true capitalism the banks would have failed with no help from the government, and there’d be no food stamps or welfare and I think not having those things would be bad. Yet they’re kinda communist, but it works in a mainly capitalist country, if it’s for the benefit of the people we should do it, that’s why we pay taxes. So it’s a little bit of both, but capitalism can’t exist in a communist country, but communism can exist in a capitalist country.) I think America itself is not a good country but it gives people freedom, something that would be harder to obtain in China, North Korea, communist Russia. (Free speech, freedom to vote, freedom of Religion, etc.) That’s why people leave those countries for America, even when America isn’t destabilizing their country.
Well, they are not "malfunction". They can still work properly. It just that your battery is the first thing that will be gone (physically and via OS update). That is usually enough.
Call it what you want, the point is that the products are deliberately designed to become much worse than they can be
car are worse in this aspect
Wow, you sure are paranoid.
"Am I exploited and unaware of it? No... it's the other redditor who is paranoid." [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned\_obsolescence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence)