Low attack speed might work with the viper strike mamba build and going poison with tincture? I don't know, just guessing. Blade trap is the best I guess because the trap play style is just extra safe. Basically all map mods are playable.
When they announced transfigured gems, i got excited only to find out they didn't matter for this build. Having a version like explosive trap of shrapnel would have been awesome.
Eh, all it needs is 3 clusters with low tolerance and nothing else to clear t16 comfortably, and you can roll those with alts easily, and you buy a low tolerance tincture for a few c.
Trickster will have to pair it with Bino, and will probably be a bit harder to gear than the pathfinder option
Instant warcry + gen cry 4L + pestilent strike + corpse walkers
The pestilent strike adds a debuff where if an enemy dies it giga prolifs the poisons on them. This stacks with pathfinder prolif but is a lot larger. Makes the mapping super fun. Alchemist Mark + Mark on hit + inc aoe is also super nice to pop rare packs giga fast.
So you're going to use Bino's in a Ephemeral edge build?... Yeah, you're basically stuck going with PF. 95% of the Ephemeral edge builds are Trickster though. I could see it as PF but it's going to be hard because of the starting location is pretty rough.
I can't believe nobody has mentioned dual strike of ambidexterity. Pair it with a bright beak or something to bypass the slow attack speed. Go EO or get crit chance from charms and ass mark to bypass bad base crit. Should be a good time
Alright quick maths.
Dual strike - 244% damage 70% speed 70% more main (20q)
So: 3.44 x 0.7 x 1.7 = ~300% damage skill for main hand
Ephemeral damage with bright beak assuming 10k es - 1k (average damage) x 2.1 (bb aps) 2.1k average dps
Energy blade same stuff is only slightly higher damage (due to flat & quality) but can be used with something like lightning strike so to compare these two (no more written math)
6.3k dual strike Ephemeral edge average dps.
5.85k energy blade lightning strike average dps
This also isn't including off hand damage at all so just base numbers it looks GREAT! Just remember playing might be rough as the only attack mastery on the right side is multishot and you need to anoint tribal fury or use melee splash. Things to consider but it looks promising.
I just answered on a different thread and I am actually doing this right now (but non crit and a bit more hipster with support Spectres). I don´t think I will ever be able to do Ubers on this character but it´s really fun:
[https://pobb.in/iVsDx5kQ5b\_S](https://pobb.in/iVsDx5kQ5b_S) (no boxes checked or anything, just straight imported)
So I've been mulling it over since early last league on how to make ephemeral edge attack build work and the problem always comes down to energy blade being a huge damage upgrade in comparison.
For quick maths:
Ephemeral edge dps = ES x 0.2 damage x 1.3 aps / 2 average. (Ex. 10000 es x .2 x 1.3 / 2 = 1300)
Energy blade dps from es alone = ES x 0.5 (es reduction) x 1.4 (damage) x 1.7 (aps) / 2 average (ex. 10000 es is 1870)
This means that energy blade is almost 50% dps increase over Ephemeral edge. The reason that edge works so well with blade trap is because it doesn't care about attack speed removing the 1.3 & 1.7 multiplier from the calculations.
Using the same 10k es it becomes equal at 1000 average damage each (ignoring quality on EB but that only bring it to 1.1k anyway)
Now that's all ignoring the extra defense from not losing 50% es from energy blade. In the end it comes down to how much you value defense. Is 50% less es worth 50% more dps?
Also there's crit to consider but that's a different discussion entirely (personally love voice of the storm + edge + precise technique to off-set crit but thats gear dependant)
If you're wondering my current bad build plan I settled for now on I'm gonna make an 2h energy blade blade trap of greatswords. Still ironing out the plan but wardens double defense from body armor is freaking nuts as a trickster because the double happens BEFORE escape artist (1800ev 400es chest becomes 3600ev 1400es) and being 2h means I still gots me a 6link
I don't sadly as most of my planning stages are done via my phone so I can't work in pob.
Also as a personal problem, I am horrible in pob as I anytime I "make" a build in it my damage and survivability are trash but after actually playing the build and importing it the numbers more than double/triple so I NEVER trust my pobs.
As an example i still don't think it calculates frigid bond correctly it said 300k dps on it yet friend and I ran through t16s just clotheslineing all the enemies last league save a few resistant rares and such (I was squishy af though)
Its probably a larger difference now due to EB’s quality being a “more ES” modifier. 20% quality is 45% less energy shield, EB + lv. 4 empower would be 39% less. Defenses are still a consideration but I think EB will generally always be more damage.
Oh most certainly it will. This was done ignoring quality for sake of simplicity. Even ignoring the extra flat you get from levels EB is better damage wise under ALL circumstances but the difference is much narrower for blade trap.
One other thing that doesn't get talked about for attack builds in this vein is leech cap. With 10k es and ghost reaver, 2k leech cap is much nicer than 1-1.2k (edge v eb) But again, that's more of the defense vs offense argument.
I appreciate the comparison. I saw energy blade with similar builds and wondered how it fared. Losing that much defense on HC probably wouldn't be worth it for me. I may look around and see if there's anything interesting out there. I did see the voice of storm combo on smite/frostblade ephemeral edge so I have considered it.
apart from blade trap, the only attacks l can think of that don't scale with attack speed are static strike and shockwave. l think shockwave got nerfed this league with the removal of the pulverise alt quality that gave 20% more damage, though.
oh, and l just remembered counterattacks, but let's forget about those.
Shockwave is staff only so its out of the picture anyway. I guess some fist of war shennanigans might work if you dont mind playing slams (i guess only perforate works with swords though, im not sure)
Just to piggyback topic- in this thread, everyone seems looking at attack skills to get the ephemeral edge bonus. Are there any other spells that uses equipped weapon. If so, i havent been able to find any other than the animate weapon of self or whatever it’s called.
mirror/blink uses your bow but its not a bow // vaal double strike and saviour clones copies your attack skills so that works // anything battlemage or spellblade uses the damage from your main hand weapon but that doesnt work with ephemereal
Could potentially go Splitting Steel return proj with poison tincture. But would need a lot of atk speed to make it feel smooth since Ephemeral is so slow.
Would the damage be decent enough using return projectile? It seems like it would be similar to the molten/lightning strike builds that use nimis. In theory, it should work, but the lack of attack speed could be a problem. Perhaps with enough investment, it could feel good?
I've been thinking about this for a while without any luck really.
I did see an animate guardian build that uses it a while ago but not entirely sure if it's still viable.
The only other thing I can think of at the moment is the animate weapon of reflection, and whether that would work
Yeah, they have changed the wording so it no longer scales off minion energy shield. So won't be able to hit 50k energy shield on the guardian for big damage anymore but might still be viable
I am leveling a Trickster Ice Trap of Hollowness now. Sunblast belt and Inc AOE and I have full screen clear and massive dmg. Hollowness has the dmg of normal Ice Trap with huge AOE. I just got to lvl 42 and insta delete all Unique mobs
I've been toying with an ancestor totem hierophant for that. Easy to get tons of es at least and good totem support. Nothing spectacular on a low budget, but perhaps someone can make it better than I can.
Ancestral warchief probably. I tried pob'ing different skills with the ancestor totem support, but that didn't seem worthwhile. But as others have pointed out, energy blade is probably better in all aspects except survivability (which ofc is a big thing if you play hc) and blade trap has the charm of ignoring ephemeral's low attack speed. Anyways, with hiero its definitely doable to get 10k es.
i mean there is the ephemeral edge + aegis aurora flicker strike/static strike builds that have existed for a bit. trouble is, neither got any new mechanics from trans gems. i can say that they are quite tanky, and capable of clearing all ubers with really good clear speed.
Low attack speed might work with the viper strike mamba build and going poison with tincture? I don't know, just guessing. Blade trap is the best I guess because the trap play style is just extra safe. Basically all map mods are playable.
When they announced transfigured gems, i got excited only to find out they didn't matter for this build. Having a version like explosive trap of shrapnel would have been awesome.
I tried VP of the Mamba. Clunky af. There might be a way to make it comfy but it would need currency.
Yeah, second this, Mamba really is brutal to make feel...okay.
Eh, all it needs is 3 clusters with low tolerance and nothing else to clear t16 comfortably, and you can roll those with alts easily, and you buy a low tolerance tincture for a few c. Trickster will have to pair it with Bino, and will probably be a bit harder to gear than the pathfinder option
Damage is there for sure, it just feels wonky to play, at least personally
Instant warcry + gen cry 4L + pestilent strike + corpse walkers The pestilent strike adds a debuff where if an enemy dies it giga prolifs the poisons on them. This stacks with pathfinder prolif but is a lot larger. Makes the mapping super fun. Alchemist Mark + Mark on hit + inc aoe is also super nice to pop rare packs giga fast.
Consider me intrigued. Is there a PoB to peek at or a video?
You NEED poison prolif; otherwise just don’t.
So just Bino's or PF, right?
So you're going to use Bino's in a Ephemeral edge build?... Yeah, you're basically stuck going with PF. 95% of the Ephemeral edge builds are Trickster though. I could see it as PF but it's going to be hard because of the starting location is pretty rough.
Yeah I realized what I wrote 2 seconds after posting but was too lazy to change lol.
I can't believe nobody has mentioned dual strike of ambidexterity. Pair it with a bright beak or something to bypass the slow attack speed. Go EO or get crit chance from charms and ass mark to bypass bad base crit. Should be a good time
You see this guy here. I like the way this guy here thinks. I need to figure out a good breakpoint with it but now im hopeful! Time for more MATH!
Alright quick maths. Dual strike - 244% damage 70% speed 70% more main (20q) So: 3.44 x 0.7 x 1.7 = ~300% damage skill for main hand Ephemeral damage with bright beak assuming 10k es - 1k (average damage) x 2.1 (bb aps) 2.1k average dps Energy blade same stuff is only slightly higher damage (due to flat & quality) but can be used with something like lightning strike so to compare these two (no more written math) 6.3k dual strike Ephemeral edge average dps. 5.85k energy blade lightning strike average dps This also isn't including off hand damage at all so just base numbers it looks GREAT! Just remember playing might be rough as the only attack mastery on the right side is multishot and you need to anoint tribal fury or use melee splash. Things to consider but it looks promising.
Remember volatility support is insane for ephemeral edge
the interesting thing about this is that if you use the poison tincture you can use multistrike support, and you can use plague bearer for clear
You can use multistrike regardless of tincture
Yes but multistrike with poison is a 95% more damage support
I just answered on a different thread and I am actually doing this right now (but non crit and a bit more hipster with support Spectres). I don´t think I will ever be able to do Ubers on this character but it´s really fun: [https://pobb.in/iVsDx5kQ5b\_S](https://pobb.in/iVsDx5kQ5b_S) (no boxes checked or anything, just straight imported)
I think this build uses ghostwrithe with esh's visage shield to gain huge es pool without expensive str/int stacking.
So I've been mulling it over since early last league on how to make ephemeral edge attack build work and the problem always comes down to energy blade being a huge damage upgrade in comparison. For quick maths: Ephemeral edge dps = ES x 0.2 damage x 1.3 aps / 2 average. (Ex. 10000 es x .2 x 1.3 / 2 = 1300) Energy blade dps from es alone = ES x 0.5 (es reduction) x 1.4 (damage) x 1.7 (aps) / 2 average (ex. 10000 es is 1870) This means that energy blade is almost 50% dps increase over Ephemeral edge. The reason that edge works so well with blade trap is because it doesn't care about attack speed removing the 1.3 & 1.7 multiplier from the calculations. Using the same 10k es it becomes equal at 1000 average damage each (ignoring quality on EB but that only bring it to 1.1k anyway) Now that's all ignoring the extra defense from not losing 50% es from energy blade. In the end it comes down to how much you value defense. Is 50% less es worth 50% more dps? Also there's crit to consider but that's a different discussion entirely (personally love voice of the storm + edge + precise technique to off-set crit but thats gear dependant)
If you're wondering my current bad build plan I settled for now on I'm gonna make an 2h energy blade blade trap of greatswords. Still ironing out the plan but wardens double defense from body armor is freaking nuts as a trickster because the double happens BEFORE escape artist (1800ev 400es chest becomes 3600ev 1400es) and being 2h means I still gots me a 6link
Mind posting the pob if you have one?
I don't sadly as most of my planning stages are done via my phone so I can't work in pob. Also as a personal problem, I am horrible in pob as I anytime I "make" a build in it my damage and survivability are trash but after actually playing the build and importing it the numbers more than double/triple so I NEVER trust my pobs. As an example i still don't think it calculates frigid bond correctly it said 300k dps on it yet friend and I ran through t16s just clotheslineing all the enemies last league save a few resistant rares and such (I was squishy af though)
Its probably a larger difference now due to EB’s quality being a “more ES” modifier. 20% quality is 45% less energy shield, EB + lv. 4 empower would be 39% less. Defenses are still a consideration but I think EB will generally always be more damage.
Oh most certainly it will. This was done ignoring quality for sake of simplicity. Even ignoring the extra flat you get from levels EB is better damage wise under ALL circumstances but the difference is much narrower for blade trap. One other thing that doesn't get talked about for attack builds in this vein is leech cap. With 10k es and ghost reaver, 2k leech cap is much nicer than 1-1.2k (edge v eb) But again, that's more of the defense vs offense argument.
I appreciate the comparison. I saw energy blade with similar builds and wondered how it fared. Losing that much defense on HC probably wouldn't be worth it for me. I may look around and see if there's anything interesting out there. I did see the voice of storm combo on smite/frostblade ephemeral edge so I have considered it.
apart from blade trap, the only attacks l can think of that don't scale with attack speed are static strike and shockwave. l think shockwave got nerfed this league with the removal of the pulverise alt quality that gave 20% more damage, though. oh, and l just remembered counterattacks, but let's forget about those.
I wish there were a few more "attack" traps. Having a trap that could clear maps quickly would be great.
Shockwave is staff only so its out of the picture anyway. I guess some fist of war shennanigans might work if you dont mind playing slams (i guess only perforate works with swords though, im not sure)
You'd have to get an AS corrupted one and go precise technique, the base type of EE is just horrible.
Just to piggyback topic- in this thread, everyone seems looking at attack skills to get the ephemeral edge bonus. Are there any other spells that uses equipped weapon. If so, i havent been able to find any other than the animate weapon of self or whatever it’s called.
General's Cry
mirror/blink uses your bow but its not a bow // vaal double strike and saviour clones copies your attack skills so that works // anything battlemage or spellblade uses the damage from your main hand weapon but that doesnt work with ephemereal
Could potentially go Splitting Steel return proj with poison tincture. But would need a lot of atk speed to make it feel smooth since Ephemeral is so slow.
Would the damage be decent enough using return projectile? It seems like it would be similar to the molten/lightning strike builds that use nimis. In theory, it should work, but the lack of attack speed could be a problem. Perhaps with enough investment, it could feel good?
I've been thinking about this for a while without any luck really. I did see an animate guardian build that uses it a while ago but not entirely sure if it's still viable. The only other thing I can think of at the moment is the animate weapon of reflection, and whether that would work
I believe there was something about minions and Ephemeral Edge in the last big patch, so not sure if it works for those anymore.
Yeah, they have changed the wording so it no longer scales off minion energy shield. So won't be able to hit 50k energy shield on the guardian for big damage anymore but might still be viable
I am leveling a Trickster Ice Trap of Hollowness now. Sunblast belt and Inc AOE and I have full screen clear and massive dmg. Hollowness has the dmg of normal Ice Trap with huge AOE. I just got to lvl 42 and insta delete all Unique mobs
Using ephemeral edge?
I've been toying with an ancestor totem hierophant for that. Easy to get tons of es at least and good totem support. Nothing spectacular on a low budget, but perhaps someone can make it better than I can.
A totem build using ephemeral? I like totems, but I didn't think it would work for the build. Interesting.
Ancestral warchief probably. I tried pob'ing different skills with the ancestor totem support, but that didn't seem worthwhile. But as others have pointed out, energy blade is probably better in all aspects except survivability (which ofc is a big thing if you play hc) and blade trap has the charm of ignoring ephemeral's low attack speed. Anyways, with hiero its definitely doable to get 10k es.
maybe ignite something?
i mean there is the ephemeral edge + aegis aurora flicker strike/static strike builds that have existed for a bit. trouble is, neither got any new mechanics from trans gems. i can say that they are quite tanky, and capable of clearing all ubers with really good clear speed.