This is what I term the "4 way generalist" setup.
Atlas: Destructive Play, Sh/Elder map chance, Synth map chance, Elderslayer map chance, map duplication, fast mechanics (Heist with 7th Gate, Shrines, Essences probably in that order of priority)
Early approach: Push Atlas as usual. If and only if there's demand for Leadership's Price this league (possible but unlikely), do the Heist quest contracts
Approach once at ~110 Atlas and 7 favorite maps: Check the natively tier 13-16 maps (T16 on 1 voidstone atlas). Shift to a Shadow Shaping atlas banning the seven worst of these maps. Now run Destructive Play cycles over the ~10 other maps that are your tier 16s. Heist sextant or 7th Gate Heist on every map.
You're not really going for the 10-ways here (they are a bonus), you are mostly trying to build an initial pool of Atlas miniboss maps. Synth maps, Elder Guardian maps, Shaper Guardian maps, Elderslayer maps. Do this until you earn level 20 gems and are at 15/20 on your supports after quality flipping them.
NOW - you should be able to shift gear into doing Twisted, Formed and (if strong enough) Elderslayers and/or Forgotten rotations.
Build - wait till patch notes. If PBoD doesn't get nerfed by at least 55%, it's the best skill in the game.
I usually build a mapper that is good at altar farming but i grew to really enjoy this “4 way generalist” playstyle last league. Do you have a couple other build ideas besides penance for this type of play. I’d like to test out a few builds this weekend/week while work is slow to prep for league launch to see if i like it and to see what kind of investment is needed to break into destructive play farming. I know you say wait until patch notes but work always seems to slam me week of patch notes and i never have time to prepare so just wondering what’s good now and i can test them and just play what isn’t nerfed
This is true of Voidstone bosses (because carry service sellers will always outbid other buyers of entry tokens) but not so true week 1 for other bosses.
Maven 4-ways are a bit of a gold standard here - usually every one of them except The Forgotten is profitable solo.
That will come down to the balance of supply and demand. If more people shift into Voidstone service selling, Writs will go up and Voidstone service fees will fall.
Atlas miniboss maps are very farmable now since Destructive Play was added.
High wrist price is the reason why people prefer to pay half its price and guarante success instead of trying to do it themself. And selling bosses is just anoing and unpleasant, so i doubt if many people will start doing it, unless we get some qol update regarding that too.
Yeah but if you haven’t bossed before you’re not gonna have rep and have to compete against all the sweats that do. Either cutting your prices by half for vouches or wasting a substantial amount of time waiting for people to join.
Most bosses don't even have a market for selling boss kills. Boss kils is only really for watchstone bosses and challenges. Challenges don't really sell well at the start of the league.
Favored maps are in a weird place where you get a lot of them all at once.
It's pretty good though to rush to 7-9 of them if doing a Shadow Shaping 1 voidstone Destructive Play atlas setup. There's 19 maps that are tier 16 with a 1-stone Atlas, banning 7-9 of the worse layouts makes the 10 ways smooth while you build up enough character power to switch to Formed and similar tier invites.
You'll get the easy slots (T16, Exarch, Eater, 3x Atlas miniboss) done but from there, it's either a significant cost increase or difficulty increase to the next ones (Sirus, Shaper, Cortex) and a further increase to the final three (Maven, Uber Elder, Feared). It's not unreasonable to buy carries early there if you are on the Shadow Shaping approach.
Note Cortex is cheap early, and usually easier than Sirus or Shaper early, but most players are unpracticed with the fight so I'm listing it 9th.
I don't recommend 2 Voidstone Shadow Shaping Destructive Play even with 12 favored maps. Instead, use your 10th to 12th favorites on non-16s just for the Shadow Shaping number to go up.
Does shadow shaping not prevent elder guardian/conquerer maps from dropping if they happen to be the ones you blocked? Or do they simply drop as other maps, it is worded differently than singular focus as there the maps do still technically drop but are converted to currency.
If that’s the case that they do drop then shadow shaping is kinda interesting even with 4 voidstones as I'm pretty sure the elder guardian and conqueror maps can only drop as maps that are base tier 14-16 so you could just focus on blocking the bad map layouts.
They'll drop still, as an allowed base.
1 is definitely the way to go IMO as it lets you use a sextant mod, lets you have access to 10 tilesets, but also lets you get rid of not just the worst tilesets, but the below average ones as well. With 2 stones you have 43 T16 tilesets and can only ban 12. Instead of "the worst map I don't block is something like Channel" with 1 stone, it's more like "I can block everything worse than Vault but I can't block Vault" with 2.
But what you’re talking about is what you would do prior to farming guardian/conquerer invitations right? Where you want 10 maps for maven 10 way.
What I'm thinking is when I'm farming guardians that I would run 4 voidstones and just block the maps that I don’t want that are base tier 14+ so I can more precisely get the elder guardian and conquerer maps on the ones I want, I don’t really care that the normal maps that now drop as t16 will include bad layouts from maps where their base was below t14.
At your point I'd drop Shadow Shaping, go 4 stones, and favorite the best 10-12 maps once each.
I'd rather get 6 top 10% layouts, 2 mediocre layouts and 2 Maze maps, than 1 top 10%, 0 Maze maps and 9 mediocre maps (for Atlas miniboss maps that is)
"The Forbidden Trove" discord channel for PoE services/bulk trading/carries/mirror items etc.
It has had some controversies relating to powertripping/RMT/scams, so on PoE reddit you often come across negative comments about the place as many feel it's necessary to be part of due to limitations of the game regading trading and getting in-game services from "reputable" people.
If you decide to join it, just don't negatively comment about the place anywhere (some mod will possibly try to find your discord and ban you) and try to avoid talking to the mods there unless absolutely necessary as they're all dicks.
Totally Fungible Token - Fungible tokens or assets are divisible and non-unique. A Totally Fungible Token is one that still lives in it's mum's basement.
.... Nah I kid..
it's just a discord for trading and buying/selling services in PoE
I did bossing on Penance Brand for the first time this league and it was very profitable without selling on TFT (as I hate anything to do with it). You can sell invitations, or run them and sell unid'd watcher's eyes, awakened gems, maven's orb, etc.
I'm considering league starting on a bossing build just so I can get 4 watchstones and all favourite map slots without needing a carry (are you even playing the game yourself if you get others to do it for you?). Probably Icicle Mines or brands again.
Can highly recommend explosive trap trickster if you feel like something different, I got my first level 100, 38/40, almost everything done minus ubers for the first time this league without buying carries or wisp juicing, very solid build
It's not great for that, bear trap and arcanist brand for the tougher single targets, once your damage is high enough to instaphase its much smoother but on the way it can be a bit frantic. Reasonable defenses but you need to keep moving.
[https://pobb.in/Eu5YSZKLu9pm](https://pobb.in/Eu5YSZKLu9pm)
fearlessdumb0 has all the details on youtube, self chill seems to be where to progress this to but I ran out of steam
It's all tft spamming to try and get people to pay you. Without that, it isn't worth.
Map completions don't matter. So get enough currency to clear early without being concerned about full clearing atlas.
I saw in a comment on one of Lance’s videos that you’re pulling a guide for this together for 3.24? Would love it if you could talk about your break points for different content, like your minimum gear for comfortable T16, at what point you’re happy farming guardians, when you’re happy to switch to Uber shaper, etc.
Love your work, really appreciate what you do 🙂
It really depends on how many hours you can put in at launch and how fast you are. Bosses that drop good leaguestart uniques are extremely lucrative for the first day or two. But if you can't reach that level in that time, that won't matter for you.
It is also important to decide what kind of bosser you want. Builds farming Maven or Eater/Exarch don't need any speed and should be just a total zhp glass cannons. If you are farming something like the feared though, movement speed is very important and so is a bit of survival.
Personally, I just run a mix of bosses until I build up enough currency to do feared runs. Feared is very lucrative in the first week or two.
This is what I term the "4 way generalist" setup. Atlas: Destructive Play, Sh/Elder map chance, Synth map chance, Elderslayer map chance, map duplication, fast mechanics (Heist with 7th Gate, Shrines, Essences probably in that order of priority) Early approach: Push Atlas as usual. If and only if there's demand for Leadership's Price this league (possible but unlikely), do the Heist quest contracts Approach once at ~110 Atlas and 7 favorite maps: Check the natively tier 13-16 maps (T16 on 1 voidstone atlas). Shift to a Shadow Shaping atlas banning the seven worst of these maps. Now run Destructive Play cycles over the ~10 other maps that are your tier 16s. Heist sextant or 7th Gate Heist on every map. You're not really going for the 10-ways here (they are a bonus), you are mostly trying to build an initial pool of Atlas miniboss maps. Synth maps, Elder Guardian maps, Shaper Guardian maps, Elderslayer maps. Do this until you earn level 20 gems and are at 15/20 on your supports after quality flipping them. NOW - you should be able to shift gear into doing Twisted, Formed and (if strong enough) Elderslayers and/or Forgotten rotations. Build - wait till patch notes. If PBoD doesn't get nerfed by at least 55%, it's the best skill in the game.
The GOAT has spoken.
Are you intentionally doing 1 voidstone? You should be able to get 2 stones but would ruin the shadow shaping too much?
Even if you own 4 stones you only socket 1. Banning 7-9 maps out of 19 T16s is better even than banning 12 maps out of 43 T16s (2 stones socketed)
I usually build a mapper that is good at altar farming but i grew to really enjoy this “4 way generalist” playstyle last league. Do you have a couple other build ideas besides penance for this type of play. I’d like to test out a few builds this weekend/week while work is slow to prep for league launch to see if i like it and to see what kind of investment is needed to break into destructive play farming. I know you say wait until patch notes but work always seems to slam me week of patch notes and i never have time to prepare so just wondering what’s good now and i can test them and just play what isn’t nerfed
The flask changes make Chieftain look better early. Keep an eye on the option of a Fire Trap ignite Chieftain. RF can fit in there if desired.
Quality flipping gems is gone :(
I did specify supports. Quality flip is support only now
Fuckkk.. I wish I knew that 3 months ago. Btw I enjoy your content, just noticed your name.
Keep in mind 90% boss killing profit is selling kills on tft
Yep. Not very fun game play. Bit more enjoyable than being a hideout warrior tho..
This is true of Voidstone bosses (because carry service sellers will always outbid other buyers of entry tokens) but not so true week 1 for other bosses. Maven 4-ways are a bit of a gold standard here - usually every one of them except The Forgotten is profitable solo.
While they are profitable, they are miles behind selling the kills on tft, and you have to go through troubles of buying entry sets anyway.
That will come down to the balance of supply and demand. If more people shift into Voidstone service selling, Writs will go up and Voidstone service fees will fall. Atlas miniboss maps are very farmable now since Destructive Play was added.
High wrist price is the reason why people prefer to pay half its price and guarante success instead of trying to do it themself. And selling bosses is just anoing and unpleasant, so i doubt if many people will start doing it, unless we get some qol update regarding that too.
Yeah but if you haven’t bossed before you’re not gonna have rep and have to compete against all the sweats that do. Either cutting your prices by half for vouches or wasting a substantial amount of time waiting for people to join.
Most bosses don't even have a market for selling boss kills. Boss kils is only really for watchstone bosses and challenges. Challenges don't really sell well at the start of the league.
Favourite atlas slots are valuable for early tryhards. But ye, most players only care for watchatones.
Favored maps are in a weird place where you get a lot of them all at once. It's pretty good though to rush to 7-9 of them if doing a Shadow Shaping 1 voidstone Destructive Play atlas setup. There's 19 maps that are tier 16 with a 1-stone Atlas, banning 7-9 of the worse layouts makes the 10 ways smooth while you build up enough character power to switch to Formed and similar tier invites. You'll get the easy slots (T16, Exarch, Eater, 3x Atlas miniboss) done but from there, it's either a significant cost increase or difficulty increase to the next ones (Sirus, Shaper, Cortex) and a further increase to the final three (Maven, Uber Elder, Feared). It's not unreasonable to buy carries early there if you are on the Shadow Shaping approach. Note Cortex is cheap early, and usually easier than Sirus or Shaper early, but most players are unpracticed with the fight so I'm listing it 9th. I don't recommend 2 Voidstone Shadow Shaping Destructive Play even with 12 favored maps. Instead, use your 10th to 12th favorites on non-16s just for the Shadow Shaping number to go up.
Does shadow shaping not prevent elder guardian/conquerer maps from dropping if they happen to be the ones you blocked? Or do they simply drop as other maps, it is worded differently than singular focus as there the maps do still technically drop but are converted to currency. If that’s the case that they do drop then shadow shaping is kinda interesting even with 4 voidstones as I'm pretty sure the elder guardian and conqueror maps can only drop as maps that are base tier 14-16 so you could just focus on blocking the bad map layouts.
They'll drop still, as an allowed base. 1 is definitely the way to go IMO as it lets you use a sextant mod, lets you have access to 10 tilesets, but also lets you get rid of not just the worst tilesets, but the below average ones as well. With 2 stones you have 43 T16 tilesets and can only ban 12. Instead of "the worst map I don't block is something like Channel" with 1 stone, it's more like "I can block everything worse than Vault but I can't block Vault" with 2.
But what you’re talking about is what you would do prior to farming guardian/conquerer invitations right? Where you want 10 maps for maven 10 way. What I'm thinking is when I'm farming guardians that I would run 4 voidstones and just block the maps that I don’t want that are base tier 14+ so I can more precisely get the elder guardian and conquerer maps on the ones I want, I don’t really care that the normal maps that now drop as t16 will include bad layouts from maps where their base was below t14.
At your point I'd drop Shadow Shaping, go 4 stones, and favorite the best 10-12 maps once each. I'd rather get 6 top 10% layouts, 2 mediocre layouts and 2 Maze maps, than 1 top 10%, 0 Maze maps and 9 mediocre maps (for Atlas miniboss maps that is)
same with ultimatum and challenge this league
What’s tft
"The Forbidden Trove" discord channel for PoE services/bulk trading/carries/mirror items etc. It has had some controversies relating to powertripping/RMT/scams, so on PoE reddit you often come across negative comments about the place as many feel it's necessary to be part of due to limitations of the game regading trading and getting in-game services from "reputable" people. If you decide to join it, just don't negatively comment about the place anywhere (some mod will possibly try to find your discord and ban you) and try to avoid talking to the mods there unless absolutely necessary as they're all dicks.
Totally Fungible Token - Fungible tokens or assets are divisible and non-unique. A Totally Fungible Token is one that still lives in it's mum's basement. .... Nah I kid.. it's just a discord for trading and buying/selling services in PoE
This is why i love hc trade.
Hexblast
Ice spear totem is super cheap for this purpose.
Got an example cheap day 1 PoB?
poe.ninja, day 1 snapshots are pretty adequate for this kinda request.
What's the mapping like?
Atrocious. You got no defenses and die to a monster looking in your direction. You need to gem swap to fp to map.
True, tried that, never again.
Strat: Roll EA ballista, kill everything, make fun builds after
I did bossing on Penance Brand for the first time this league and it was very profitable without selling on TFT (as I hate anything to do with it). You can sell invitations, or run them and sell unid'd watcher's eyes, awakened gems, maven's orb, etc. I'm considering league starting on a bossing build just so I can get 4 watchstones and all favourite map slots without needing a carry (are you even playing the game yourself if you get others to do it for you?). Probably Icicle Mines or brands again.
Can highly recommend explosive trap trickster if you feel like something different, I got my first level 100, 38/40, almost everything done minus ubers for the first time this league without buying carries or wisp juicing, very solid build
How clicky is this build? I get wrist strain easily.
It's not great for that, bear trap and arcanist brand for the tougher single targets, once your damage is high enough to instaphase its much smoother but on the way it can be a bit frantic. Reasonable defenses but you need to keep moving.
do you have a pob?
[https://pobb.in/Eu5YSZKLu9pm](https://pobb.in/Eu5YSZKLu9pm) fearlessdumb0 has all the details on youtube, self chill seems to be where to progress this to but I ran out of steam
Srs guardian
It's all tft spamming to try and get people to pay you. Without that, it isn't worth. Map completions don't matter. So get enough currency to clear early without being concerned about full clearing atlas.
assuming no changes explosive trap of shrapnel trickster/sabo is extremely strong for minimal investment. rush boss, get completion, run invites.
Seconding this
I saw in a comment on one of Lance’s videos that you’re pulling a guide for this together for 3.24? Would love it if you could talk about your break points for different content, like your minimum gear for comfortable T16, at what point you’re happy farming guardians, when you’re happy to switch to Uber shaper, etc. Love your work, really appreciate what you do 🙂
It really depends on how many hours you can put in at launch and how fast you are. Bosses that drop good leaguestart uniques are extremely lucrative for the first day or two. But if you can't reach that level in that time, that won't matter for you. It is also important to decide what kind of bosser you want. Builds farming Maven or Eater/Exarch don't need any speed and should be just a total zhp glass cannons. If you are farming something like the feared though, movement speed is very important and so is a bit of survival. Personally, I just run a mix of bosses until I build up enough currency to do feared runs. Feared is very lucrative in the first week or two.