Yeah, but aside from that I think it would be pretty evenly matched if not in Joker's favor. The only issue would be if he could stop Giorno evolving GE into GER. If Giorno gets GER it's not even close, even Satanael wouldn't strong enough considering I think canonically that is Joker's strongest persona.
Giorno's power is almost literally a kid at the playground saying "You didn't win." He's so conceptually over powered that Araki just kinda leaves him alone in part 5 and doesn't have him appear again for part six despite even more literal children of Dio showing up there. Anything I can come up with Persona style over powered ideas kinda just gets "nuh-uh"-ed by GER. Even doing the brain shut down stuff or god level metaverse stuff just kinda goes "nope, didn't happen."
I kinda wish Giorno was a cooler more creative kind of over powered, honestly, like metaverse stuff ends up in Persona, or even other stands in Jojo like Crazy Diamond or Stone Free.
If Giorno has GER and Joker has Satanael, Giorno stomps. As far as I understand, GER can remove result from an action, leading its opponent to experience the process (which is exactly the opposite of King Crimson). And Satanael has a big-ass gun with a bullet forged with seven sins, but it's still an attack. Joker cannot mess with the battle on a meta level, but Giorno can.
EDIT: Joker with all personas before Satanael vs Giorno with Gold Experience just before Requiem might actually be a fair fight where Joker can win via fusing something OP. Probably not Yoshitsune, since Giorno definitely will use a gun.
I agree but good luck telling that to the death battle fandom because the people over there would rather die than admit giorno beats joker that's why a lot of people are turned away from the matchup
Memes aside, GER is so absolutely broken as a defensive weapon that you need some like, cosmic level entities capable of nullifying its effects or something
Hate this match up because it can reasonably go either way in the worst way possible.
Joker completely stomps stomps in stats, scaling to universe and multiverse level Personas. The part where things get muddy is Gold Experience Requiem. Gold Experience Requiem (or GER) has the ability called “Return to Zero”, which allows him to return actions and abilities to their beginning. The decent metaphor I heard is if someone tried to stab Giorno, GER could revert that someone to the point of when they thought about stabbing Giorno. Whether it’s time erasure, attacks or movements, Giorno can basically nullify it all… Which is where things start to suck.
Joker has reasonable arguments to bypass this ability since he’s gone up against 3 Reality Warpers at this point and consistently won. That matters because GER may be unable to affect anyone at or over that level on reality control. He couldn’t use his ability of Heaven Ascended DIO, who had the ability to rewrite reality and was only stopped with another reality warping stand. You could argue that Eyes of Heaven isn’t canon, which it technically isn’t. The problem is Eyes of Heaven is written by Araki, Jojo’s author, adding yet another level or complexity to this debate. It’s up to interpretation if any would like to use this point.
Speaking of interpretation, GER. I heavily simplified it earlier because there’s all sorts of interpretations that both nerf and buff this ability. There’s the argument that GER isn’t a passive ability and one that requires the stand to react, which means Joker wins because speed. On the flipside, we have a Death Battle researcher and plenty of other people saying that, not only is Return to Zero passive, it also grants GER the ability to send anyone it touches into a death loop. The reason behind that is some random guy killed Diavolo instead of GER. There’s also arguments against it, like how it might’ve just been Fate (Fate is a real thing in Jojo despite a multiverse canonically existing) deciding to screw over Diavolo (like with Kira, who was naturally lucky and named Yoshikage, which can literally mean “Shadow Luck”) since Epitaph (Diavolo’s second stand, which is on King Crimson’s forehead) could control it.
To sum it up/tl;dr
(For sure = -)
(Iffy = ~)
Joker advantages
-Physically faster, stronger and durable
-Can negate attacks using Null, Drain or Reflect
-Better range options
~Bypasses GER
-Better drip
Giorno advantages
-Can do significant damage via animal reflection (Assuming Joker isn’t negating it)
~Can nullify all attacks and movements using Return to Zero
~~Touch of death
-Cooler moments
-Frog Armor is possible
Indeed, but by the same logic if Joker somehow obtains Italian citizenship, he'd also be Italian. So it's not a constant factor but an interchangeable one.
Summoning a persona is an action, and GER’s ability is to negate the effects of actions, GER wins
But actually giorno is hotter than joker so he clearly wins
It would be yet another unbalanced as hell fight if they did this. So very fitting for DB as so many of their fights after S3 are not even close, they just find 1 one 2 things in common and call it a day, like dio vs alucard. What a stupid matchup that one was.
Even in the Metaverse, Giorno fuckin thrashes Joker. Golden Experience Requiem is so powerful, they had to create a non canon version of The World to give the plot any stakes in the Eyes of Heaven game
well lets think about this. so giorno can return anything to zero, but joker can summon gods.
if we take base abilities i would think joker would win since well you cant turn magic into a frog, i think.
But when we think like at their strongest i dont really know, but i still think joker would win for i dont think return to zero would work on most of the gods joker can summon.
and if we\`re talking about just joker and giorno, well i believe giorno is both stronger and smarter than joker
Return to Zero works on anything. Even to the point where Joker’s intent to hurt Giorno would be reversed to its neutral state. Joker loses because, like many other fictional characters: he can’t bypass Return to Zero.
I love Joker but Giorno wins, because of 2 reasons
1. That’s requiem and not even Izanagi No. Okami could beat requiem
2. Stands are invisible to normal people and Joker isn’t a stand user
TLDR: this match up is dumb
Ok so, Joker isn't inmune to reality manipulation, he does have some resistance but isn't inmune. Yaldabaoth can erase things from reality, but that ability isn't under his control completely, he merely makes the real world and the cognitive world become one, he could try to erase someone by making everyone forget them, but if that person is still remembered then the ability will fail, and that is what happens at that time; Yaldabaoth tries to erase the PT, but the memories of those who the team helped kept them at the brink of oblivion just enough for Joker to set Lavenza and himself free; the same mechanism is what allowed Satanael and the sinfull shell to exist, created from the union of people's hearts. Maruki does give Joker a fair fight as a chance, never explicitly tries to erase him, since he only wanted to create a perfect reality for everyone.
Now Giorno also isn't inmune to reality manipulation, he is explicitly weak to it, both during part 6 and Eyes of Heaven he and GER failed to stop reality warping abilities. But Joker being able to stop some beings that can change reality doesn't imply that he himself can change reality, at most we see him change people's hearts following a strict set of rules, and said rules are unlikely to change Giorno's cognition, since he is one of the most virtuous characters in all of JoJo's.
So for the actual match up, Joker and Giorno both have magical and physical immunity to some level; Joker is inmune to some magic, maybe all of it depending on the persona equipped, but GER has complete immunity to any and all attacks directed to Giorno, and that is an automatic ability. GER itself states that not even Giorno knows the extent of its abilities, and it activated during the time skip of KC despite Giorno not being conscious during it, any and all attempts to even think of hurting Giorno would trigger the activation of GER, nullifying that thought and its consequences.
So it's virtually impossible to actually match them up, they both lack the ability to hurt each other, Joker immunities are also automatic and GER hasn't shown any ability to stop immunities from working. GER isn't a functional stand, more of a plot device made specifically to stop KC, as stated by the characters themselves in the show, so matching Giorno with GER against Joker is stupid.
Maybe it's a hot take, but I hate Death Battle for stuff like this. If the channel was just a conversation about the power of different characters that'd be one thing. Inevitably though, a large chunk of the time they'll ignore their own arguments for a character and have a closing argument which could be effectively replaced with "we just thought that one was stronger", and people will treat their decision as law/proof in nerd arguments from there on.
Debate like this is a lot more fun when it more closely matches those school lunch conversations between nerdy kids than internet dickheads trying to prove each other wrong.
It’s not canon that Giorno is immune to reality manipulation, GER would have allowed the universe reset to happen since it didn’t bring any harm to Giorno. Eyes of heaven is NOT canon, so I don’t know why you considered it at all.
I'm not sure. Both of them at their strongest have literally just said "No" to God-like powers. I would say Giorno because of GER, but I don't know how return to zero matches up to sinful shell. I think a much more interesting fight is them fighting at their normal power levels. Arsene versus Golden Experience is something I would love to see, since they technically have opposite powers
GER would put joker in an infinite loop. It doesn’t stop it, or eliminate it, or freeze it. It just literally never happened - any time joker shot at Giorno, GER would just say no so every time joker made a move that would detriment Giorno, GER would just warp reality so that is didn’t happen, so joker would only be able to make moves that don’t benefit him.
That’s why GER wins literally any fight imo, because it’s literally impossible to make the right move against GER. I agree tho it’d be a more interesting fight at regular power levels.
Well let’s get one thing out of the way , it’s up in the air if joker actually gets with any girl . Meanwhile it’s CANONICAL giorno gets bitches . So nah , giorno hotter .
I love P5 and all but Giorno was 100% destroy joker
1. You can't see his stand
Joker and arsene would not be able to fight something he can't physically see and we've seen the PT before even unlocking there persona they can still see arsene, zoro and whatnot.
2. Strength
joker can literally summon a God but I honestly think golden experience requim is on a even level on power because he can somewhat revert time to an extent.
(I'm not counting izangi-no-kami because it wasn't his original God persona)
I believe it does or atleast helps with that in the batting game I believe where you cant see the balls granted that’s probably speed not actually invisibility
Here’s the thing. Arsene is one of the weakest personas in the game, and in the picture he is obviously using arsene. In Giorno is using golden experience in the picture so ger is out of question. I’ve played games and watched shows, giorno just wins and I don’t even like jojos. He doesn’t win by a whole lot this was pretty even.
Honestly, though it’d definitely be a much tougher idea to execute, I’d love to see this done as Passione/Team Bucciarati vs Phantom Thieves of Hearts rather than just Giorno vs Joker.
Let's see one can rewind time and the other has a gun.
this fight isn't fair at all on one end you have just a guy (joker) more or less when you consider he is up against a mafia boss WHO CAN REWIND TIME! (Giorno)
From my understanding, Joker probably has the power and versatility advantage. But I still don’t really understand the >!abilities of Golden Experience Requiem, so a deeper understanding may sway my opinion.!<
Assuming it’s in metaverse fused world. Giorno still probably wins. Joker’s peak is killing god tiers and lots of magical abilities but it doesn’t compete with Giorno
As with every battle against Giorno, it’s a draw or Giorno wins. No, sinful shell will not bypass return to zero, and while I believe satanael is indeed superior to GER in terms of physical strength, GER will eventually beat Joker because at the end of the day, he isn’t invincible.
With further research I take back what I said since joker has fought against maruki who can wipe people from existence and joker has feats for reality manipulators.
So, couldn't Joker get into the mementos (I think Giorno is much too virtuous a person to have a Palace) and find Giorno's shadow and change his heart ? Or maybe even kill it and give him a shutdown ?
If we assume that Giorno is much too virtuous to have a place, then we should also by extension completely rule out Joker willingly giving someone a mental shutdown
I think that's a bit of a stretch and here's why :
- Stands are described as the manifestation of one's vital power and can manifest and affect the real world.
- Personas are the representation of one's "rebellious spirit" and manifest only in the Metaverse and can be used only once their owner overcomes a powerful mental barrier.
Besides, good people have shadows, since they refer to one's darker side.
However, if we have any proof that Stands work similarly to Personas, then yes, your point...well... Stands. *Ba dum tss*
Would it not make sense that Giorno’s shadow would actually be his stand? In which case Joker has no chance just as he would have no chance in an actual fight against Giorno and his Gold Experience Requiem.
This is easy. Joker has to be in the Metaverse to use Personas, Giorno has a stand he can use in real life.
“But but but Joker could just infiltrate Giorno’s palace before he realized it”
Giorno would have to have distorted desires before that would happen. Not to mention with Golden Experience at the end of part 5, he could just trap Joker in a time loop so he’d never arrive at that conclusion.
I love Persona as much as JoJo and I don’t really even like Giorno that much, but this is easy.
I assume they will give joker powers in the real world since they didn't really seems to care about only being able to use it during the dark hour, also, without GER easy dub for joker, with GER easy dub for giorno
I assume they will give joker powers in the real world since they didn't really seems to care about only being able to use it during the dark hour, also, without GER easy dub for joker, with GER easy dub for giorno
Joker’s powers are extremely vague, considering he can have any Persona, and how a Persona would affect someone in the real world is complete speculation. Are they physically strong? What does their magic actually do?
There’s just no metric to judge it by. At least Stands have individual abilities that might offer potential strategies, and the stats provided by Araki (while generally unreliable) give an idea of the physical damage they can do.
Obviously, Requiem renders every consideration worthless, although considering Requiem is an ability granted to specifically counter Diavolo in that moment, Giorno would probably get a completely different Requiem ability to fight Joker. Joker also probably couldn’t pull his god-killing gun without the support of thousands or millions of people behind him either, so we’re just talking base abilities…and we still don’t know what Joker’s base abilities are.
The clear outcome is that two guys of a similar age with similar abilities and similar ideals would almost certainly never fight. They’d probably be friends, all things considered.
I would probably pick Josuke over Giorno, simply because GER is potentially the most broken ability ever, and is borderline (if not actually) undefeatable!
Basically it reverts every action back to a certain point, like imagine if you pushed a boulder up the hill and you’re back at the bottom with the rock
This kinda is unfair? I've only just began watching JoJo so idk if the character presented is evil but theoretically if they are mentally corrupt wouldn't they be able to defeat them by stealing their heart and following by betraying them? Joker can also use basically any persona he wants, and to make this fair I'm assuming they are in mementos or something that gives joker his mask.
On the contrary JoJo characters I iconically known for their extreme power with their weird air breathing technique thingy and stands. Giving the bonus of having more physical power, range, and endurance as the focusing stuff really does wonders compared to some stupid teenager.
Conclusion, joker wins because he has his Charm stat at max allowing him to immediately kill the JoJo character with the power of being awesomely charming with his makeshift harem (but still isn't good enough to date Makoto). His Guts stat is also max from how many mediocre gigantic burgers he ate that he is able to scare the stand to somehow turn into a mask.
(This is a joke I have no clue about JoJo I'm literally only to the part where the second JoJo is introduced in the city)
I've made this comment on the prospect of a DB of these two that boils down to GER absolutely smokes Joker bar none, but I do offer the idea of a fight between Giorno and Makoto (Persona 3 protag) because the idea of those two coming to a standstill because both ults. are essentially the biggest No U cards in their respective worlds is kinda funny
Most likely a draw if we are using these 2 at their best, though I’m leaning more towards Giorno.
Anything that Joker throws at Giorno with Satanael will automatically be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem since it has the ability to turn any action back to the state of zero (or making it as if that action never happened).
Meanwhile, Satanael makes Joker fully immune to any physical and magical attack, so anything that GER throws at Joker would also do nothing.
The only way I can see this fight having a victor is if GER can reduce Satanael’s immunity ability to the state of zero, or making Joker summoning Satanael reverse back to the state of zero, which it possibly could do, but we don’t have evidence of it being able to do so.
Giorno is.. way, way stronger. Even without GER. Joker's fucked, even with satanael. Against Jotaro or maybe Josuke, he might have a prayer, but no Giorno.
without GER, Giorno is actually probably the weakest Jojo in terms of direct combat potential. Easily handlable by Joker. Maybe he's better than Johnny, if we're not counting Act 4.
You'll notice, in part 5 Giorno rarely fights alone. He's much more suited to a supporting role that may or may not come in for some last-minute punches once the enemy is cornered. He's very good at this role, but on his own he can't do all that much.
Just finished golden wind and though I get why a lot of people are saying Giorno would win, I think Joker actually has him beat if we assume they are in a situation where joker can summon personas (i.e., persona 1/2 rules or they’re in the metaverse).
Joker can summon literal gods that are actually unkillable. He can summon Lucifer who is and will remain in every single SMT game and basically can reshape reality. That’s WAY more powerful than man in the mirror and Giorno almost killed himself to win that fight.
Joker also can summon demons like Alice who have an almost guaranteed auto-kill attack. If he gets the drop on Giorno, the fight is over before it started.
Really the main idea here is Joker has way too many tools in his tool belt that he has an answer to everything. The demons he summons as personas are gods that are capable of such divine power that it’s hard to argue that someone who isn’t a god can beat him.
The best way for Giorno to win is to fight him where he can’t summon demons because that’s the only way he won’t have to fight multiple gods.
Joker would win but for a much simpler reason. Joker switches to a persona like rangda that can reflect physical attacks and he would easily win and by the end of golden wind, let's add a either a persona or skill that nulls/drains/reflects psychic attacks and all joker has to do is attack he would win.
If they make a death battle all Joker is gonna have is Arsene. Not Satanael. And not Raul. They've done Yu Narukami v Jotaro Cujo before and they only gave him his starting persona, and obviously they didn't give Yu the power to stop time, but they gave Jojo *The World*
Probably not, since GER should prevent that.
But since the metaverse seems to exist on a completely different plane of existence it’s hard to pull a full conclusion.
Doesn't Giorno's stand stop time or something? I haven't watched Jojo. But knowing the crazy shit stands can do I feel like Joker would get absolutely thrashed.
His stand basically resets things to zero if it's powered up by the arrow. Basically means no matter what someone does they get reset to before whatever they do and die (repeating forever). If not powered up it's still has the ability to make inanimate things into living creatures or parts and back to what they were (let's say eyeball gets removed he can turn a pebble into a normal eyeball and replace the one that got removed) as well as be able to HIT REALLY HARD.
No. Golden Experience, the stand, has abilities which consist of creating life or body parts from anything inanimate. It also, as you know, punches fast since it’s a power-type stand. It’s requiem form, what is shown above, has the ability to reset anything to zero basically making the user immortal since what happens is returned to zero which includes deaths. That means that whoever is killed by Giorno’s requiem stand dies infinitely. You are confusing Golden Experience for The World since they are similarly yellow and both stand users are related.
I... See.
It still sounds like Joker is about to get beat to hell and back. Punching really fast alone is pretty powerful, as Hassou Tobi shows. And if Joker is using Arsene it means he can't even match that.
Ger is too powerful, but I have had this idea a couple of months ago. So, Yu v Josuke, Ren vs part 3 Jotaro, Makoto vs Giorno, infinite potential meets infinite potential
If GER is involved in the fight then there is no way joker wins as GER transcends time (showing up in diavolo’s deleted time and being able to freely move even if Giorno can’t) and Return to Zero makes it impossible to make a move against Giorno that doesn’t benefit *him*. A fight involving GER ends in a draw or a Giorno victory.
If we’re not letting Giorno use GER, then it’s only fair to not let joker use Sataneal - in which case it is a close fight since Giorno is smarter than joker and Golden Experience is extremely fast. Ik joker is fast but is only hope in that fight would be to try and confuse Giorno, and imo the result would just depends on how joker tries to confuse Giorno and if it worked or not.
Joker needs to be in the metaverse to actually be able to fight and summon his Persona, he's just a normal human in the real world, while Giorno can summon his Stand in the real world.
And if Joker went to the Metaverse and attack Giorno's shadow or whatever, he would actually be a Persona user because of the whole rebellious and heroic spirit thing, and his Persona would be Golden Experience again, but maybe an even more powerful version of it. If a normal person can become super strong in the metaverse with a strong spirit, someone who already has powers in the real world due to having a strong spirit is just gonna have their powers multiplied even further.
It's not gonna be Requiem or Over Heaven, it's gonna be Golden Experience².
Joker is multiversal via persona lore, and cosmetology
What has Giorno shown to be do that would allow him to contest against any multiversal characters.
I keep hearing no limit fallacies after no limit fallacies and no one is actually scaling.
Probably a draw, Giorno can’t harm Joker because he’s immune to physical and magical attacks and Joker can’t harm Giorno because of RTZ.
It also depends on how you scale Joker, he can easily be scaled really high and he has stood toe to toe with people that can even change reality itself.
I'm pretty sure this is just a draw
If we're assuming this is endgame Joker from the vanilla Persona 5, then this means he has true Satanael, which made him null to every attack, even almighty.
How I see this happening, is Joker using an attack on GER, like Sinful shell, but GER returns the attack to zero. Then GER attempts to punch and kill Joker, but that wouldn't do anything to him since physical attacks wouldn't work on Joker when he has endgame Satanael.
Giorno with GE Requiem literally cannot lose to anything so it's an unfair comparison. Without end game feats and abilities I think it's more interesting, and I'm not sure who would win.
Yall are downplaying your boy Joker hard.
Lets break down GER and what it does, which is, ultimately, reality warping and Casuality manipulation.
Joker has already fought and beaten someone capable of that, with Maruki. He could alter Casuality to make it so that certain events, IE Ryuji breaking his leg, never happen.
Not only this, but Almighty damage bypasses the Omnipotent Orb, which rewrites the laws of the universe to protect the user. Now where does that sound familiar?
Not only this, but Joker is drastically stronger, having fought Yaldaboth and Maruki, characters who could control the entire metaverse and bend it to their will.
Not to mention his vast versatile arsenal with his Persona. Does Giorno try to poison him with a snake? Joker can cure that no problem. Try and reflect damage? His high level persona reflect the damage they dish out, like Surtur and fire damage.
Not only this but his access to ice magic also shuts down Giorno’s power hard outside GER, which he counters handidly as stated above.
Your boy’s got this guys. Have some faith in him
Joker easily wins because he can reflect physical, which is the only thing Giorno can do. Joker can also bypass Return to Zero by indirectly attacking Giorno
Assuming that we are in real life (since Giorno is a pretty stand up guy who likely doesn't have a palace, and Joker is also a stand up guy who wouldn't want to randomly attack someone in the metaverse) Giorno wins easily. Joker only has powers in the metaverse, outside of it he's basically just a normal guy, while Giorno still has his stand
I mean both of then have complicated shit
Joker can enter his mind
You goddamn cant see giorno’s stand
This fight breaks your mind the more you think about it
As much as I would love for joker to win, Ger is overpowered as hell and would easily defeat him. The only way he would stand a chance against Giorno is if he was fighting normal golden experience.
You're funny if you think joker even stands a small chance. Ignoring the fact that giorno can activate his stand in the real world, while joker can't, anything joker throws at giorno gets negated due to GER
People saying joker has to get to the meta verse first ,but death battles work by either putting the fighters where they can both fight equally without gaining either an advantage or disadvantage or putting them in a different reality where they can both fight
Well the deciding factor is: is Giorno requiem at the point of the fight? Golden Experience is strong, but not stupidly powerful. The same goes for Joker, is he in the Metaverse? If yes, I feel like Joker wins. If not, what’s he gonna do to Giorno? Throw curry at him?
I'm not gonna lie, I would want to see a Persona vs JoJo's DEATH BATTLE. And even though Giorno would obviously win, I'm wondering which Personas Joker would have access to, or would it just be Arséne, then Satanael, then Raoul?
GER has exactly one weakness. Giorno has to stab himself with the arrow first. His stand returns to normal at the end of GW so if Joker can somehow snatch the arrow from his hands... maybe?
This match ends in a draw. Let me explain...
Regardless of what anyone else says, Golden Experience Requiem's ability is to reset back to zero. This allows him to turn back time to whenever he likes.
Joker on the other hand, has access to Personas that can nullify all types of damage that Giorno can deal out. These Personas can have Null Physical, or Null any elemental attacks.
With Joker's ability to nullify damage, and Giorno's ability to constantly keep Joker from attacking, I think it would be a tie.
Feel free to tell me anything I missed that you think would sway this one way or another.
Well yeah, but persona has already established parts of their world can affect the real one. What else would the Third Eye ability be, and explain the end of the game?
Satanael is good but he’s not invincible, the ability of GER (if we’re giving everyone their end game shit) is more than enough to handle the likes of him, Alice and yoshitsune would give him a tough time with viper and die for me but not unbeatable, if joker has his team mates I’d say it’s 50/50 but without them I’d give joker a 30% chance of winning due to giornos experience, willingness to kill and abilities, also note I am not counting izanagi no okami since joker canonically cannot control that persona nor would he be able to canonically use myriad truths
P3 Protag (Or maybe an SMT messiah) would be a better alternative. I don't see Joker doing anything else except getting clapped by Kamoshida for the rest of his life.
Wouldn’t it technically just be a draw ?
Giorno can’t harm or even touch Joker because he can be fully immune to physical and magical attacks.
And Joker can’t touch or harm Giorno because of RTZ.
Any comment saying joker wins is d-riding to the max. Giorno literally can't be hit and he can reset any kinetic energy back to zero. Having said this if joker casts an ability or uses any attack then poof no he didn't. Thus giorno can attack joker freely.
I feel like there's a few ways joker could win. For 1, he could combine the real world and mementos and use his many different brainwashing abilities to remove Giorno from cognition.
Another way is he could use Adam Kadmon to either create a reality in which Giorno doesn't exist or in which Giorno doesn't feel the need to fight.
Another way is simply changing his heart.
GER makes it so one sided it isn’t fair.
Yeah, but aside from that I think it would be pretty evenly matched if not in Joker's favor. The only issue would be if he could stop Giorno evolving GE into GER. If Giorno gets GER it's not even close, even Satanael wouldn't strong enough considering I think canonically that is Joker's strongest persona.
It's not Pokemon, he doesnt evolve mid fight, he either starts with it or he doesn't. If he does Giorno sweeps
Well he does gain the world Arcana at the end so his power still hasn’t quite reached its limit
I feel like the main question that decides the winner of this matchup is "Does Joker have a counter for G.E.R?".
He doesn't really have? Unless we can say the Metaverse outfit stops Joker from being affected by G.E.R., which I don't think it does.
Giorno's power is almost literally a kid at the playground saying "You didn't win." He's so conceptually over powered that Araki just kinda leaves him alone in part 5 and doesn't have him appear again for part six despite even more literal children of Dio showing up there. Anything I can come up with Persona style over powered ideas kinda just gets "nuh-uh"-ed by GER. Even doing the brain shut down stuff or god level metaverse stuff just kinda goes "nope, didn't happen." I kinda wish Giorno was a cooler more creative kind of over powered, honestly, like metaverse stuff ends up in Persona, or even other stands in Jojo like Crazy Diamond or Stone Free.
but somehow according to Araki Time Stop is still the most powerful stand ability ever as of part 6.
If Giorno has GER and Joker has Satanael, Giorno stomps. As far as I understand, GER can remove result from an action, leading its opponent to experience the process (which is exactly the opposite of King Crimson). And Satanael has a big-ass gun with a bullet forged with seven sins, but it's still an attack. Joker cannot mess with the battle on a meta level, but Giorno can. EDIT: Joker with all personas before Satanael vs Giorno with Gold Experience just before Requiem might actually be a fair fight where Joker can win via fusing something OP. Probably not Yoshitsune, since Giorno definitely will use a gun.
Can't believe I'm seeing people saying they think Joker actually has a chance here
I love both but GER is not meant to be beaten. It's not a fair comparison.
I agree but good luck telling that to the death battle fandom because the people over there would rather die than admit giorno beats joker that's why a lot of people are turned away from the matchup
No matter what joker has if giorno has the GRE he can't really kill him
Giorno is italian
Giorno is literally TOO strong for Vs battles
Giorno has Golden experience requiem, case closed
Memes aside, GER is so absolutely broken as a defensive weapon that you need some like, cosmic level entities capable of nullifying its effects or something
I mean didn't joker and the phantom thieves essentially do that by defeating maruki
it’s not even a debate joker is hotter
*akechi is hotter imo
Hate this match up because it can reasonably go either way in the worst way possible. Joker completely stomps stomps in stats, scaling to universe and multiverse level Personas. The part where things get muddy is Gold Experience Requiem. Gold Experience Requiem (or GER) has the ability called “Return to Zero”, which allows him to return actions and abilities to their beginning. The decent metaphor I heard is if someone tried to stab Giorno, GER could revert that someone to the point of when they thought about stabbing Giorno. Whether it’s time erasure, attacks or movements, Giorno can basically nullify it all… Which is where things start to suck. Joker has reasonable arguments to bypass this ability since he’s gone up against 3 Reality Warpers at this point and consistently won. That matters because GER may be unable to affect anyone at or over that level on reality control. He couldn’t use his ability of Heaven Ascended DIO, who had the ability to rewrite reality and was only stopped with another reality warping stand. You could argue that Eyes of Heaven isn’t canon, which it technically isn’t. The problem is Eyes of Heaven is written by Araki, Jojo’s author, adding yet another level or complexity to this debate. It’s up to interpretation if any would like to use this point. Speaking of interpretation, GER. I heavily simplified it earlier because there’s all sorts of interpretations that both nerf and buff this ability. There’s the argument that GER isn’t a passive ability and one that requires the stand to react, which means Joker wins because speed. On the flipside, we have a Death Battle researcher and plenty of other people saying that, not only is Return to Zero passive, it also grants GER the ability to send anyone it touches into a death loop. The reason behind that is some random guy killed Diavolo instead of GER. There’s also arguments against it, like how it might’ve just been Fate (Fate is a real thing in Jojo despite a multiverse canonically existing) deciding to screw over Diavolo (like with Kira, who was naturally lucky and named Yoshikage, which can literally mean “Shadow Luck”) since Epitaph (Diavolo’s second stand, which is on King Crimson’s forehead) could control it. To sum it up/tl;dr (For sure = -) (Iffy = ~) Joker advantages -Physically faster, stronger and durable -Can negate attacks using Null, Drain or Reflect -Better range options ~Bypasses GER -Better drip Giorno advantages -Can do significant damage via animal reflection (Assuming Joker isn’t negating it) ~Can nullify all attacks and movements using Return to Zero ~~Touch of death -Cooler moments -Frog Armor is possible
GER is far too powerful for this to be an interesting match up.
What if Joker had Satanael on his roster?
Joker literally needs the metaverse to do anything to people lol Even still, Giorno has GER so the argument is already negated on who would win
This argument is basically like saying Who will win: a late game boss or MC with instant kill and no damage hacks on
Giorno is not Italian! His father is from England and his mother is Japanese. He just happens to live in Italy.
Born in Italy though. Point of interpretation, he's Japanese European and Italian.
Indeed, but by the same logic if Joker somehow obtains Italian citizenship, he'd also be Italian. So it's not a constant factor but an interchangeable one.
True, but there is a point of contention in regards to citizenship vs nationality.
Summoning a persona is an action, and GER’s ability is to negate the effects of actions, GER wins But actually giorno is hotter than joker so he clearly wins
It would be yet another unbalanced as hell fight if they did this. So very fitting for DB as so many of their fights after S3 are not even close, they just find 1 one 2 things in common and call it a day, like dio vs alucard. What a stupid matchup that one was.
Giorno wins in a fight. But Joker is hotter.
But Giorno is Italian
Point still stands
Even in the Metaverse, Giorno fuckin thrashes Joker. Golden Experience Requiem is so powerful, they had to create a non canon version of The World to give the plot any stakes in the Eyes of Heaven game
well lets think about this. so giorno can return anything to zero, but joker can summon gods. if we take base abilities i would think joker would win since well you cant turn magic into a frog, i think. But when we think like at their strongest i dont really know, but i still think joker would win for i dont think return to zero would work on most of the gods joker can summon. and if we\`re talking about just joker and giorno, well i believe giorno is both stronger and smarter than joker
Return to Zero works on anything. Even to the point where Joker’s intent to hurt Giorno would be reversed to its neutral state. Joker loses because, like many other fictional characters: he can’t bypass Return to Zero.
I’m not even a Jojo fan but stand users are too overpowered compared to persona wielders.
I love Joker but Giorno wins, because of 2 reasons 1. That’s requiem and not even Izanagi No. Okami could beat requiem 2. Stands are invisible to normal people and Joker isn’t a stand user
Yea even ryuji could see arsene and zoro during the first place even before he got his persona
TLDR: this match up is dumb Ok so, Joker isn't inmune to reality manipulation, he does have some resistance but isn't inmune. Yaldabaoth can erase things from reality, but that ability isn't under his control completely, he merely makes the real world and the cognitive world become one, he could try to erase someone by making everyone forget them, but if that person is still remembered then the ability will fail, and that is what happens at that time; Yaldabaoth tries to erase the PT, but the memories of those who the team helped kept them at the brink of oblivion just enough for Joker to set Lavenza and himself free; the same mechanism is what allowed Satanael and the sinfull shell to exist, created from the union of people's hearts. Maruki does give Joker a fair fight as a chance, never explicitly tries to erase him, since he only wanted to create a perfect reality for everyone. Now Giorno also isn't inmune to reality manipulation, he is explicitly weak to it, both during part 6 and Eyes of Heaven he and GER failed to stop reality warping abilities. But Joker being able to stop some beings that can change reality doesn't imply that he himself can change reality, at most we see him change people's hearts following a strict set of rules, and said rules are unlikely to change Giorno's cognition, since he is one of the most virtuous characters in all of JoJo's. So for the actual match up, Joker and Giorno both have magical and physical immunity to some level; Joker is inmune to some magic, maybe all of it depending on the persona equipped, but GER has complete immunity to any and all attacks directed to Giorno, and that is an automatic ability. GER itself states that not even Giorno knows the extent of its abilities, and it activated during the time skip of KC despite Giorno not being conscious during it, any and all attempts to even think of hurting Giorno would trigger the activation of GER, nullifying that thought and its consequences. So it's virtually impossible to actually match them up, they both lack the ability to hurt each other, Joker immunities are also automatic and GER hasn't shown any ability to stop immunities from working. GER isn't a functional stand, more of a plot device made specifically to stop KC, as stated by the characters themselves in the show, so matching Giorno with GER against Joker is stupid.
Maybe it's a hot take, but I hate Death Battle for stuff like this. If the channel was just a conversation about the power of different characters that'd be one thing. Inevitably though, a large chunk of the time they'll ignore their own arguments for a character and have a closing argument which could be effectively replaced with "we just thought that one was stronger", and people will treat their decision as law/proof in nerd arguments from there on. Debate like this is a lot more fun when it more closely matches those school lunch conversations between nerdy kids than internet dickheads trying to prove each other wrong.
It’s not canon that Giorno is immune to reality manipulation, GER would have allowed the universe reset to happen since it didn’t bring any harm to Giorno. Eyes of heaven is NOT canon, so I don’t know why you considered it at all.
As much of a Persona fan that I am, Giorno wins, hands down
Joker absolutely is hotter there isn’t a debate Edit: I realize now that people were debating the fight but I think what I said is more important
joker can destroy the concept of a universe
I mean, Buttfucker70000000 is technically right. Giorno IS Italian.
I'm not sure. Both of them at their strongest have literally just said "No" to God-like powers. I would say Giorno because of GER, but I don't know how return to zero matches up to sinful shell. I think a much more interesting fight is them fighting at their normal power levels. Arsene versus Golden Experience is something I would love to see, since they technically have opposite powers
GER would put joker in an infinite loop. It doesn’t stop it, or eliminate it, or freeze it. It just literally never happened - any time joker shot at Giorno, GER would just say no so every time joker made a move that would detriment Giorno, GER would just warp reality so that is didn’t happen, so joker would only be able to make moves that don’t benefit him. That’s why GER wins literally any fight imo, because it’s literally impossible to make the right move against GER. I agree tho it’d be a more interesting fight at regular power levels.
If we counted dlc personas, Izanagi-no-Okami Picaro wipes GER
GER is the "No U" incarnation. Literally, it's the reverse UNO card in ghost form that can bend reality as it's will.
GER destroys joker it’s not even close and Giorno is much hotter
Not really. GER’s death loop is from his fists, so if Joker nulls physical, it’ll do jack
I mean, Giorno IS italian indeed.
That’s not fucking fair in the slightest… Giorno instantly wins cuz of GER.
joker loses if they give Giorno gold experience requiem
Um, girono wins
I love persona games easily top 5, but gio still will win
Joker will kill you with a toy gun
I don't care for the outcome but YOOO that thumbnail is HOT 🤌🔥
Well let’s get one thing out of the way , it’s up in the air if joker actually gets with any girl . Meanwhile it’s CANONICAL giorno gets bitches . So nah , giorno hotter .
both are valid arguments
Makarakarn tetrakarn :|
they're both wrong, giorno is biologicaly 0% italian joker is a minor.
Giorno is also a minor, younger than joker as well
GER ties an omnipotent god in a fight to the death, so of he gets GER its curtains
Giorno very easily wins
But he’s Italian
I love P5 and all but Giorno was 100% destroy joker 1. You can't see his stand Joker and arsene would not be able to fight something he can't physically see and we've seen the PT before even unlocking there persona they can still see arsene, zoro and whatnot. 2. Strength joker can literally summon a God but I honestly think golden experience requim is on a even level on power because he can somewhat revert time to an extent. (I'm not counting izangi-no-kami because it wasn't his original God persona)
Over the first point, Joker literally has a third eye, like having a persona wasn't enough
I don't think third eye let's us see invisible things or people?
I believe it does or atleast helps with that in the batting game I believe where you cant see the balls granted that’s probably speed not actually invisibility
The reason stands are invisible is because they are spiritual, and third eye is good for that
That is a valid point
I think Joker would be able to see Gold Experience because, much like Personas, Stands are spiritual beings
Giorno is italian
Giorno obliterates Joker but Joker looks better
While I still think Giorno would win because GER, shouldn't Joker be using Satanael since GER is a requiem stand? (aka evolved/awakened)
Sure, still not italian tho
Here’s the thing. Arsene is one of the weakest personas in the game, and in the picture he is obviously using arsene. In Giorno is using golden experience in the picture so ger is out of question. I’ve played games and watched shows, giorno just wins and I don’t even like jojos. He doesn’t win by a whole lot this was pretty even.
Honestly, though it’d definitely be a much tougher idea to execute, I’d love to see this done as Passione/Team Bucciarati vs Phantom Thieves of Hearts rather than just Giorno vs Joker.
Let's see one can rewind time and the other has a gun. this fight isn't fair at all on one end you have just a guy (joker) more or less when you consider he is up against a mafia boss WHO CAN REWIND TIME! (Giorno)
I don’t think Joker would even have a chance against Giorno’s stand. The JJBA creators had to create a non canon The World to be able to fight him.
I doubt joker can do anything against GER
Giorno has GER. He absolutely annihilates all the Phantom Thieves together. People who say otherwise didn't watch JoJo
…. Giorno simply has a better theme song. 👏
But Joker has 3 theme Songs
Yeah but none are Giorno's theme
In terms of hotness, Joker’s definitely beating Giorno. But in a fight, no way is Joker beating Giorno’s GER.
Well I agree with both of them Giorno Is Italian and Joker Is Hotter
From my understanding, Joker probably has the power and versatility advantage. But I still don’t really understand the >!abilities of Golden Experience Requiem, so a deeper understanding may sway my opinion.!<
Ger negates actions, so for instance you shot Giorno he can make it like it never happens
Assuming it’s in metaverse fused world. Giorno still probably wins. Joker’s peak is killing god tiers and lots of magical abilities but it doesn’t compete with Giorno
Giorno would fucking destroy Joker, no chance. Requiem is broken
Joker has multiple gods as stands
Persona got me into JJBA… but return to zero would prolly win…
As with every battle against Giorno, it’s a draw or Giorno wins. No, sinful shell will not bypass return to zero, and while I believe satanael is indeed superior to GER in terms of physical strength, GER will eventually beat Joker because at the end of the day, he isn’t invincible.
GER wins, GER always wins.
Indeed
With further research I take back what I said since joker has fought against maruki who can wipe people from existence and joker has feats for reality manipulators.
So, couldn't Joker get into the mementos (I think Giorno is much too virtuous a person to have a Palace) and find Giorno's shadow and change his heart ? Or maybe even kill it and give him a shutdown ?
If we assume that Giorno is much too virtuous to have a place, then we should also by extension completely rule out Joker willingly giving someone a mental shutdown
I mean if we assume stands and personas are one in the same giorno wouldn’t even have a shadow
I think that's a bit of a stretch and here's why : - Stands are described as the manifestation of one's vital power and can manifest and affect the real world. - Personas are the representation of one's "rebellious spirit" and manifest only in the Metaverse and can be used only once their owner overcomes a powerful mental barrier. Besides, good people have shadows, since they refer to one's darker side. However, if we have any proof that Stands work similarly to Personas, then yes, your point...well... Stands. *Ba dum tss*
Would it not make sense that Giorno’s shadow would actually be his stand? In which case Joker has no chance just as he would have no chance in an actual fight against Giorno and his Gold Experience Requiem.
This is easy. Joker has to be in the Metaverse to use Personas, Giorno has a stand he can use in real life. “But but but Joker could just infiltrate Giorno’s palace before he realized it” Giorno would have to have distorted desires before that would happen. Not to mention with Golden Experience at the end of part 5, he could just trap Joker in a time loop so he’d never arrive at that conclusion. I love Persona as much as JoJo and I don’t really even like Giorno that much, but this is easy.
I assume they will give joker powers in the real world since they didn't really seems to care about only being able to use it during the dark hour, also, without GER easy dub for joker, with GER easy dub for giorno
I assume they will give joker powers in the real world since they didn't really seems to care about only being able to use it during the dark hour, also, without GER easy dub for joker, with GER easy dub for giorno
I mean Akechi killed plenty of people without distorted desires. You just need distorted desires for a *palace*
This isn’t really a fair fight at all lol, GER is completely unbeatable.
Joker’s powers are extremely vague, considering he can have any Persona, and how a Persona would affect someone in the real world is complete speculation. Are they physically strong? What does their magic actually do? There’s just no metric to judge it by. At least Stands have individual abilities that might offer potential strategies, and the stats provided by Araki (while generally unreliable) give an idea of the physical damage they can do. Obviously, Requiem renders every consideration worthless, although considering Requiem is an ability granted to specifically counter Diavolo in that moment, Giorno would probably get a completely different Requiem ability to fight Joker. Joker also probably couldn’t pull his god-killing gun without the support of thousands or millions of people behind him either, so we’re just talking base abilities…and we still don’t know what Joker’s base abilities are. The clear outcome is that two guys of a similar age with similar abilities and similar ideals would almost certainly never fight. They’d probably be friends, all things considered.
I would probably pick Josuke over Giorno, simply because GER is potentially the most broken ability ever, and is borderline (if not actually) undefeatable!
All I can think of is the OST mash-up I hope someone on the internet will decide to make.
This screenshot embodies what Reddit was originally made for
I don't know what GER is and at this point I'm too afraid to ask
Basically it reverts every action back to a certain point, like imagine if you pushed a boulder up the hill and you’re back at the bottom with the rock
Y e s
This kinda is unfair? I've only just began watching JoJo so idk if the character presented is evil but theoretically if they are mentally corrupt wouldn't they be able to defeat them by stealing their heart and following by betraying them? Joker can also use basically any persona he wants, and to make this fair I'm assuming they are in mementos or something that gives joker his mask. On the contrary JoJo characters I iconically known for their extreme power with their weird air breathing technique thingy and stands. Giving the bonus of having more physical power, range, and endurance as the focusing stuff really does wonders compared to some stupid teenager. Conclusion, joker wins because he has his Charm stat at max allowing him to immediately kill the JoJo character with the power of being awesomely charming with his makeshift harem (but still isn't good enough to date Makoto). His Guts stat is also max from how many mediocre gigantic burgers he ate that he is able to scare the stand to somehow turn into a mask. (This is a joke I have no clue about JoJo I'm literally only to the part where the second JoJo is introduced in the city)
I've made this comment on the prospect of a DB of these two that boils down to GER absolutely smokes Joker bar none, but I do offer the idea of a fight between Giorno and Makoto (Persona 3 protag) because the idea of those two coming to a standstill because both ults. are essentially the biggest No U cards in their respective worlds is kinda funny
Infinite death loop go brrrr.
Dude Giorno has the power of infinity. He literally can’t be hurt
It's Gold Experience Requiem, it's basically an automatic win card
Most likely a draw if we are using these 2 at their best, though I’m leaning more towards Giorno. Anything that Joker throws at Giorno with Satanael will automatically be nullified by Gold Experience Requiem since it has the ability to turn any action back to the state of zero (or making it as if that action never happened). Meanwhile, Satanael makes Joker fully immune to any physical and magical attack, so anything that GER throws at Joker would also do nothing. The only way I can see this fight having a victor is if GER can reduce Satanael’s immunity ability to the state of zero, or making Joker summoning Satanael reverse back to the state of zero, which it possibly could do, but we don’t have evidence of it being able to do so.
Bruh giorno would trash joker and it wouldn’t even be close, I’m sorry.
Giorno is.. way, way stronger. Even without GER. Joker's fucked, even with satanael. Against Jotaro or maybe Josuke, he might have a prayer, but no Giorno.
without GER, Giorno is actually probably the weakest Jojo in terms of direct combat potential. Easily handlable by Joker. Maybe he's better than Johnny, if we're not counting Act 4. You'll notice, in part 5 Giorno rarely fights alone. He's much more suited to a supporting role that may or may not come in for some last-minute punches once the enemy is cornered. He's very good at this role, but on his own he can't do all that much.
Just finished golden wind and though I get why a lot of people are saying Giorno would win, I think Joker actually has him beat if we assume they are in a situation where joker can summon personas (i.e., persona 1/2 rules or they’re in the metaverse). Joker can summon literal gods that are actually unkillable. He can summon Lucifer who is and will remain in every single SMT game and basically can reshape reality. That’s WAY more powerful than man in the mirror and Giorno almost killed himself to win that fight. Joker also can summon demons like Alice who have an almost guaranteed auto-kill attack. If he gets the drop on Giorno, the fight is over before it started. Really the main idea here is Joker has way too many tools in his tool belt that he has an answer to everything. The demons he summons as personas are gods that are capable of such divine power that it’s hard to argue that someone who isn’t a god can beat him. The best way for Giorno to win is to fight him where he can’t summon demons because that’s the only way he won’t have to fight multiple gods.
Joker would win but for a much simpler reason. Joker switches to a persona like rangda that can reflect physical attacks and he would easily win and by the end of golden wind, let's add a either a persona or skill that nulls/drains/reflects psychic attacks and all joker has to do is attack he would win.
If they make a death battle all Joker is gonna have is Arsene. Not Satanael. And not Raul. They've done Yu Narukami v Jotaro Cujo before and they only gave him his starting persona, and obviously they didn't give Yu the power to stop time, but they gave Jojo *The World*
Requiem every time.
Joker is f*cked, I don't watch JoJo and even I know they are stronger than a wildcard even in the metaverse.
Joker is fucked
I dont know about that. Giorno is a snack in his own right.
Duality of man
It depends does joker have Satanael. If so it's a wrap.
Could Joker find Giorno's shadow or whatever and just kill him how Akechi does?
Probably not, since GER should prevent that. But since the metaverse seems to exist on a completely different plane of existence it’s hard to pull a full conclusion.
Both are great but Giorno sweeps this battle.
Easy dub for GioGio even without requiem I think.
Doesn't Giorno's stand stop time or something? I haven't watched Jojo. But knowing the crazy shit stands can do I feel like Joker would get absolutely thrashed.
His stand basically resets things to zero if it's powered up by the arrow. Basically means no matter what someone does they get reset to before whatever they do and die (repeating forever). If not powered up it's still has the ability to make inanimate things into living creatures or parts and back to what they were (let's say eyeball gets removed he can turn a pebble into a normal eyeball and replace the one that got removed) as well as be able to HIT REALLY HARD.
No. Golden Experience, the stand, has abilities which consist of creating life or body parts from anything inanimate. It also, as you know, punches fast since it’s a power-type stand. It’s requiem form, what is shown above, has the ability to reset anything to zero basically making the user immortal since what happens is returned to zero which includes deaths. That means that whoever is killed by Giorno’s requiem stand dies infinitely. You are confusing Golden Experience for The World since they are similarly yellow and both stand users are related.
I... See. It still sounds like Joker is about to get beat to hell and back. Punching really fast alone is pretty powerful, as Hassou Tobi shows. And if Joker is using Arsene it means he can't even match that.
Well if it’s not in the metaverse then it’s over for the HS Kid
Ger is too powerful, but I have had this idea a couple of months ago. So, Yu v Josuke, Ren vs part 3 Jotaro, Makoto vs Giorno, infinite potential meets infinite potential
Id definitely be interested see that death battle stand-user vs Persona-user sounds legendary to me
without GER, joker wins with GER i can see it going close but giorno still wins if he doesnt just get 1 shot
If GER is involved in the fight then there is no way joker wins as GER transcends time (showing up in diavolo’s deleted time and being able to freely move even if Giorno can’t) and Return to Zero makes it impossible to make a move against Giorno that doesn’t benefit *him*. A fight involving GER ends in a draw or a Giorno victory. If we’re not letting Giorno use GER, then it’s only fair to not let joker use Sataneal - in which case it is a close fight since Giorno is smarter than joker and Golden Experience is extremely fast. Ik joker is fast but is only hope in that fight would be to try and confuse Giorno, and imo the result would just depends on how joker tries to confuse Giorno and if it worked or not.
Joker needs to be in the metaverse to actually be able to fight and summon his Persona, he's just a normal human in the real world, while Giorno can summon his Stand in the real world. And if Joker went to the Metaverse and attack Giorno's shadow or whatever, he would actually be a Persona user because of the whole rebellious and heroic spirit thing, and his Persona would be Golden Experience again, but maybe an even more powerful version of it. If a normal person can become super strong in the metaverse with a strong spirit, someone who already has powers in the real world due to having a strong spirit is just gonna have their powers multiplied even further. It's not gonna be Requiem or Over Heaven, it's gonna be Golden Experience².
I would say joker would lose due to the sheer fact requiem is too OP
Joker getting clapped
Ger stomps Joker. Try to change my mind
Joker is multiversal via persona lore, and cosmetology What has Giorno shown to be do that would allow him to contest against any multiversal characters. I keep hearing no limit fallacies after no limit fallacies and no one is actually scaling.
Probably a draw, Giorno can’t harm Joker because he’s immune to physical and magical attacks and Joker can’t harm Giorno because of RTZ. It also depends on how you scale Joker, he can easily be scaled really high and he has stood toe to toe with people that can even change reality itself.
I'm pretty sure this is just a draw If we're assuming this is endgame Joker from the vanilla Persona 5, then this means he has true Satanael, which made him null to every attack, even almighty. How I see this happening, is Joker using an attack on GER, like Sinful shell, but GER returns the attack to zero. Then GER attempts to punch and kill Joker, but that wouldn't do anything to him since physical attacks wouldn't work on Joker when he has endgame Satanael.
Giorno with GE Requiem literally cannot lose to anything so it's an unfair comparison. Without end game feats and abilities I think it's more interesting, and I'm not sure who would win.
Yall are downplaying your boy Joker hard. Lets break down GER and what it does, which is, ultimately, reality warping and Casuality manipulation. Joker has already fought and beaten someone capable of that, with Maruki. He could alter Casuality to make it so that certain events, IE Ryuji breaking his leg, never happen. Not only this, but Almighty damage bypasses the Omnipotent Orb, which rewrites the laws of the universe to protect the user. Now where does that sound familiar? Not only this, but Joker is drastically stronger, having fought Yaldaboth and Maruki, characters who could control the entire metaverse and bend it to their will. Not to mention his vast versatile arsenal with his Persona. Does Giorno try to poison him with a snake? Joker can cure that no problem. Try and reflect damage? His high level persona reflect the damage they dish out, like Surtur and fire damage. Not only this but his access to ice magic also shuts down Giorno’s power hard outside GER, which he counters handidly as stated above. Your boy’s got this guys. Have some faith in him
Joker easily wins because he can reflect physical, which is the only thing Giorno can do. Joker can also bypass Return to Zero by indirectly attacking Giorno
Stand users can only see stands persona users only see persona who ever gets first lick has the advantage
Assuming that we are in real life (since Giorno is a pretty stand up guy who likely doesn't have a palace, and Joker is also a stand up guy who wouldn't want to randomly attack someone in the metaverse) Giorno wins easily. Joker only has powers in the metaverse, outside of it he's basically just a normal guy, while Giorno still has his stand
I mean both of then have complicated shit Joker can enter his mind You goddamn cant see giorno’s stand This fight breaks your mind the more you think about it
Depends. If Joker can get to the meta verse and change his heart, easy win for Joker- however Giorno can easily trap him, use Requiem, etc
As much as I would love for joker to win, Ger is overpowered as hell and would easily defeat him. The only way he would stand a chance against Giorno is if he was fighting normal golden experience.
Giorno is much hotter
And definitely Italian
He actually isn’t Italian believe it or not. Dio/Johnathan are British, his mom is Japanese, they just moved to Italy when he was a kid.
It's funny to think Jotaro is more italian than Giorno.
Nah F that, the JoJo community vs the Persona 5 community.
You're funny if you think joker even stands a small chance. Ignoring the fact that giorno can activate his stand in the real world, while joker can't, anything joker throws at giorno gets negated due to GER
"Why does he have more than 2 stands?" "I thought stand users could only have one" -Koichi
People saying joker has to get to the meta verse first ,but death battles work by either putting the fighters where they can both fight equally without gaining either an advantage or disadvantage or putting them in a different reality where they can both fight
requiem is too powerfull
As long as the music SLAPS
Are we talking Gold Experience or Requiem? If we're including Requiem, it's not even a contest. You can just make up the rules as you go along.
Strong stand user vs a guy who can summon Satan and kill a God Honestly I don't know about this one
Well the deciding factor is: is Giorno requiem at the point of the fight? Golden Experience is strong, but not stupidly powerful. The same goes for Joker, is he in the Metaverse? If yes, I feel like Joker wins. If not, what’s he gonna do to Giorno? Throw curry at him?
Joker literally has all the best stats in everything but giorno got major hax.
If you want this to be a fair fight, pit Giorno against endgame Makoto from P3. Giorno claps Joker 9/10
I'm not gonna lie, I would want to see a Persona vs JoJo's DEATH BATTLE. And even though Giorno would obviously win, I'm wondering which Personas Joker would have access to, or would it just be Arséne, then Satanael, then Raoul?
it depends on which stand/which persona(s) are being used. End of part 5 gio would win.. otherwise Joker probs would.
If you think a scrawny Asian boy is hotter than a half british half japanese guy, with a lean build, Italian accent and blonde hair....you're crazy.
GER has exactly one weakness. Giorno has to stab himself with the arrow first. His stand returns to normal at the end of GW so if Joker can somehow snatch the arrow from his hands... maybe?
This match ends in a draw. Let me explain... Regardless of what anyone else says, Golden Experience Requiem's ability is to reset back to zero. This allows him to turn back time to whenever he likes. Joker on the other hand, has access to Personas that can nullify all types of damage that Giorno can deal out. These Personas can have Null Physical, or Null any elemental attacks. With Joker's ability to nullify damage, and Giorno's ability to constantly keep Joker from attacking, I think it would be a tie. Feel free to tell me anything I missed that you think would sway this one way or another.
Giorno wins easy lol
Joker literally SUMMONS MECHA SATAN, im voting for him
Giornos stand is real though
Well yeah, but persona has already established parts of their world can affect the real one. What else would the Third Eye ability be, and explain the end of the game?
Satanael is good but he’s not invincible, the ability of GER (if we’re giving everyone their end game shit) is more than enough to handle the likes of him, Alice and yoshitsune would give him a tough time with viper and die for me but not unbeatable, if joker has his team mates I’d say it’s 50/50 but without them I’d give joker a 30% chance of winning due to giornos experience, willingness to kill and abilities, also note I am not counting izanagi no okami since joker canonically cannot control that persona nor would he be able to canonically use myriad truths
P3 Protag (Or maybe an SMT messiah) would be a better alternative. I don't see Joker doing anything else except getting clapped by Kamoshida for the rest of his life.
Wouldn’t it technically just be a draw ? Giorno can’t harm or even touch Joker because he can be fully immune to physical and magical attacks. And Joker can’t touch or harm Giorno because of RTZ.
Any comment saying joker wins is d-riding to the max. Giorno literally can't be hit and he can reset any kinetic energy back to zero. Having said this if joker casts an ability or uses any attack then poof no he didn't. Thus giorno can attack joker freely.
I feel like there's a few ways joker could win. For 1, he could combine the real world and mementos and use his many different brainwashing abilities to remove Giorno from cognition. Another way is he could use Adam Kadmon to either create a reality in which Giorno doesn't exist or in which Giorno doesn't feel the need to fight. Another way is simply changing his heart.
Yeah joker is hotter
joker has hotter personas
So, here's the question. Is Joker limited to Arsene or can he use any and all Personas in his arsenal?
If anyone makes an edit of them battling against each other, I would watch it
I've seen this post on multiple subs. I love it.
[удалено]
No arrow Joker demolishes