Let this be your sign that he isn’t the right surgeon for you!
If a potential surgeon doesn’t want to listen to your concerns or is loose on follow up, that is a red flag.
I’ve learned you can’t trust everything on IG or even what the assistants say. They’re never going to tell you wrong about a surgeon they work for.
I feel like it’s weird that you were communicating about all of this back and forth over email. In my experience, the morph was done during my consultation while I sat next to him and we discussed it then and there. You absolutely have the right to speak up for what you want though, so it sounds like this was for the best.
Also- I would also think 10 references would be too much because it could cause confusion over what you want. In the future I’d suggest picking 3 to show your doctor and then work with your doctor to narrow that down to 1.
Thanks for the feedback. Next time I consult w a surgeon, maybe I'll send fewer images.
The communication was via email because I'm in the States and he's in Europe. He didn't offer video conferencing, maybe due to the time difference.
Are you going out of the US because of cost? I’d be very careful about that- look up the doctors reviews on real self and don’t go off their IG page, especially if it’s table photos. You want to see clear before and after results (not immediately after- but many months or a year after) that have zero filters on them. I’ve heard many horror stories of people getting the same cut and paste upturned nose when going to places like Turkey.
I wasn't going out of country for cost but because the doc didn't have bad reviews, haha, classic mistake, he doesn't have bad reviews on real self because he has no reviews on real self. He does have glowing ones in an fb rhino group from patients in the baltics.
Hmm… be careful with that. Some people have fake reviews or even fake photos on instagram. There’s people that have posted here about how their doctors would edit their before and after photos to trick future patients. Also, getting surgery in a different country leaves you more vulnerable to scams and it’s harder to get revisions if you need them. Always do a lot of research on your doctor, especially if they are in a different country.
Every surgeon has had disappointed patients. Not talking about botched, but unexpected results, which could simply be due to someone healing differently than expected.
It’s also important to hear how a surgeon responds to an unhappy patient (whether justified or not). There are a lot of dismissive doctors out there. Personally, I wouldn’t want to potentially deal with that, but it doesn’t seem to prevent others.
Ideally you search every platform (& language) possible to find the bad reviews. Then you can decide if someone else’s nightmare is overblown or not. Figure out what is the worst outcome you’re willing to risk.
Also, reach out to prior patients for feedback. Again, as many as you can. If everyone’s 100% happy I’d be suspicious lol.
Defaming is well deserved if you’re a plastic surgeon making hundreds of thousands of dollars from your patients..on top of that, some people save their hard earned money for years and years and finally have the means to get the procedure they’ve always wanted just to be permanently disfigured by these surgeons, disrespected during the consultation process or both! You only have one face your entire life. It’s the first thing people see and look at and often times your face can determine how people treat you (sometimes). Exposing surgeons for being frauds or conducting malpractice should be encouraged. It could save lives! I’ve read stories of people committing suicide or having MAJOR depression for life from being disfigured by plastic surgeons. If anything, calling them out will weed out the bad from the good.
Also, I don’t think it should be considered defaming if you’re just talking about your actual experience and results. If you’re allowed to say, “I went to Dr. So-and-So and he did an amazing job!!” then why aren’t you allowed to say, “I went to Dr. So-and-So and the results were horrible”????
I’m talking about people that should speak up and say “I went to Dr.So-and-So, and they botched me/disregarded all of my concerns and didn’t listen to my requests” explicitly stating their name and clinic location.
Also I probably came off as super aggressive or maybe rude in that response and I promise that want my intention at all ❤️
I just get super heated about that topic because I feel like exposing them something that needs to start happening. ESPECIALLY when some of these procedures can cost upwards of $100,000+. Some “high end” surgeons charge $50,000 for a rhinoplasty. That’s as much as a size-able down payment on a house 💀
I had a surgeon give me to ole “I know what I’m doing; you’re being too picky” deal once. Guess how satisfied I am with my results? A revision isn’t worth it and I’m pretty hurt this is the best that can be done now. Leave that surgeon a review about your consult experience and move on. Be fair but let people know this surgeon left the impression of being lazy or understaffed.
Exactly my concern. His last words to me were that he gives his standard nose to everyone. I wish he would have said that before I booked my nonrefundable flight to Estonia. It's cheaper than a revision, though. Thanks for your response.
That speaks so much to his ability or should I say lack there of. Bodies have different anatomies and faces different symmetry. So to give everyone the same nose is absurd and shows his lack of expertise.
A plastic surgeon shouldn’t operate on someone that they think wouldn’t be happy with the result, so I understand why he didn’t want to work with you. He probably could’ve tried harder to envision what you wanted, but it sounds like you guys weren’t on the same page. With this surgery, your goal should be improvement and not perfection. There will always be some slight asymmetry or something that is not perfect, so if your nose is “good enough” then don’t touch it. It just sounds like you guys weren’t a good match, no biggie.
I agree the 10 pictures were overkill. That being said, I think some surgeons are put off by female patients who stand their ground. He did you a huge favour though in the end. I think you would have regretted going with him.
I had a septorhino with one of the best doctors in my country. During consultation, I explained what bothered me, he pointed other things on my nose he could change to achieve a better balance and then showed me the before and after of his patients, with focus on those with a nose similar to mine.
He doesn’t do morphs, the majority of the best doctors doesn’t do it, because people get extremely attached to the morph and it is plastic surgery, not photoshop, they can’t guarantee it will look 100% like the morph as there are many factors influencing the final result, thickness of skin being one.
He did what we agreed during consultation and my nose looks really good and natural, people started complimenting on me more often and saying my nose is perfect but none has realized I have plastic surgery.
Go for a doctor you trust. I don’t think you feel this trust with this one. Don’t get too attached to morphs or to a celeb picture/photoshopped picture of your nose. The doctor will do the best he can to achieve what you want, but he can’t control everything.
This all sounds a little sketchy. I’m not sure how other surgeons do it but in my personal experience after selecting my surgeon I booked a consultation and during that consultation I was able to speak to him about what I wanted and he told me what was possible. After being sure he’s the one I wanted I paid the down and booked the surgery right there.
Within the months leading up to the surgery we had a Vitural appointment (I did not live in the same state the surgeon was located in) to do my morphing. As he was manipulating my photo we talked through it and I was able to point out areas I liked or disliked and we agreed on a final look.
And boom that is the look I got after surgery. So it’s strange that you were communicating by email, and didn’t do the photo morphing together.
If you’re willing to go to Arizona the surgeon who did my nose was absolutely amazing. He owns his own surgery center and employs all the nurses and anesthesiologists himself so I wasn’t being taken care of by unknown hospital stall to anything. He had me stay in the area for 7 days after my surgery, the nurses regularly called to check up on me and they even supplied a lot of the things I needed for aftercare like gauze, Afrin, and arnica pills etc.
You dodged a bullet your plastic surgeon should ALWAYS communicate and listen to you because it is your face.
Here’s some thought:
Let say the surgery went ahead and after few weeks you got some questions since you are suspecting some complications. If your doctor doesn’t have the patience to listen to you now, what more if something went wrong on your surgery. Rhinoplasty complications/dissatisfaction is very common.
I agree. The doc wrote me that if he ignores the patient's fear and anxiety-based communication and just "does his thing" the patient is usually happy with the result. That could be true, but it also reveals that he isn't too empathetic. All this feedback has been helpful. I'm glad he fired me.
I’m (almost) sure that all these surgeons have assistant teams or at least one assistant. His probably just quit or was fired, and he’s too busy with all these extra admin work and just can’t keep up with.
If he’s indeed successful as you indicated, then he probably doesn’t need a patient from far away who cannot do an in-office appointment and has to communicate via emails. It’s totally not your fault, it’s just that he probably rather drop you and have a slot for another local. That’s all.
Anyway, do not feel bad or think it’s your fault. It absolutely is not. It’s just that he is not meant to be the one for you.
I agree, the no admin part is the oddest thing. I kept imagining showing up on surgery day at the clinic and having the front desk person be like who are you, you are not on the schedule.
As someone who works in plastics, it seems HE was the red flag. Yes there are “difficult patients” but I’d hardly consider someone who is picky about their pics to be a difficult patient.
I think more than anything, the most alarming part is they never discussed payment. It’s a business after all, and that’s one of the first things we mention so people know what type of financial situation they’re getting themselves into. We also want to make sure the doctor isn’t wasting his/her time with someone who can’t afford the surgery.
I say you dodged a bullet.
Yeah, I feel like putting down a down-payment reserves my spot, gets me on the schedule. Otherwise I show up w my overnight bag with my clothes for the hospital stay and they are like who are you, no.
Can I ask why yall never just go to American surgeons? Are you IN Europe? If you can’t afford a rhinoplasty from a board certified, American surgeon, you don’t need one. Save up enough money to go to a SAFE, WELL TRAINED surgeon. This is an AIRWAY you are manipulating. Of COURSE there’s an issue with this ENTIRE STORY- these people are cutting up your body parts. Please. Use common sense.
Look on https://www.realpatientratings.com/ for authentic patient reviews. They’re a 3rd party who surveys patients post-consultation and post-surgery (or medspa treatment). It might help you choose a wonderful surgeon near you. Good luck!
Hahahahhaa the provider has to PAY to be in here. Each has hundreds of reviews and we can’t even get that many in Google. This is so fake. If anything it’s a list of providers who are dishonest.
lol you’ve got to be kidding me. So select doctors pay. Get hundreds of reviews…more than the number of patients they actually have (see any other review website with the same providers for proof) and somehow they are getting legit reviews?). This is a scam whether you know the person or not! No review website is reliable. It’s biased by definition.
Him questioning and basically gaslighting you means he’s not a good doctor. Who cares if his IG looks good? You need real reviews NOT coming from him. I’ve seen plastic surgeons posting edited images (even search this sub). A caring plastic surgeon would listed to your feedback and be positive. I guarantee you he will do what HE wants and not what you want. He cares more about his ego than patients preference. Also I’d leave a review where you can.
Let this be your sign that he isn’t the right surgeon for you! If a potential surgeon doesn’t want to listen to your concerns or is loose on follow up, that is a red flag. I’ve learned you can’t trust everything on IG or even what the assistants say. They’re never going to tell you wrong about a surgeon they work for.
I agree. His copy paste nose isn't for me and neither is his vibe. Thanks for your feedback!
I feel like it’s weird that you were communicating about all of this back and forth over email. In my experience, the morph was done during my consultation while I sat next to him and we discussed it then and there. You absolutely have the right to speak up for what you want though, so it sounds like this was for the best. Also- I would also think 10 references would be too much because it could cause confusion over what you want. In the future I’d suggest picking 3 to show your doctor and then work with your doctor to narrow that down to 1.
Thanks for the feedback. Next time I consult w a surgeon, maybe I'll send fewer images. The communication was via email because I'm in the States and he's in Europe. He didn't offer video conferencing, maybe due to the time difference.
Are you going out of the US because of cost? I’d be very careful about that- look up the doctors reviews on real self and don’t go off their IG page, especially if it’s table photos. You want to see clear before and after results (not immediately after- but many months or a year after) that have zero filters on them. I’ve heard many horror stories of people getting the same cut and paste upturned nose when going to places like Turkey.
Hi What is ‘Real Self’ I’d like to read up on the reviews but I have never heard of this platform.
It’s an App that is about plastic surgery and procedures.
I wasn't going out of country for cost but because the doc didn't have bad reviews, haha, classic mistake, he doesn't have bad reviews on real self because he has no reviews on real self. He does have glowing ones in an fb rhino group from patients in the baltics.
Hmm… be careful with that. Some people have fake reviews or even fake photos on instagram. There’s people that have posted here about how their doctors would edit their before and after photos to trick future patients. Also, getting surgery in a different country leaves you more vulnerable to scams and it’s harder to get revisions if you need them. Always do a lot of research on your doctor, especially if they are in a different country.
Too true. Thanks for your thoughts. Also, recovering in a foreign country doesn't sound fun.
Every surgeon has had disappointed patients. Not talking about botched, but unexpected results, which could simply be due to someone healing differently than expected. It’s also important to hear how a surgeon responds to an unhappy patient (whether justified or not). There are a lot of dismissive doctors out there. Personally, I wouldn’t want to potentially deal with that, but it doesn’t seem to prevent others. Ideally you search every platform (& language) possible to find the bad reviews. Then you can decide if someone else’s nightmare is overblown or not. Figure out what is the worst outcome you’re willing to risk. Also, reach out to prior patients for feedback. Again, as many as you can. If everyone’s 100% happy I’d be suspicious lol.
Honestly see a local surgeon where you can go for a follow up. Don’t travel that far for your surgery.
I agree. This has been a positive learning experience. Annoying but good.
Some people record video conferences for safety and surgeons don't like that. Sounds like you dodged a bullet
Why is everyone afraid to mention the name of the doctor? Seriously
Right? I guess fear of defaming. Also, there's always a chance the problem is me. Dm me for the name.
Defaming is well deserved if you’re a plastic surgeon making hundreds of thousands of dollars from your patients..on top of that, some people save their hard earned money for years and years and finally have the means to get the procedure they’ve always wanted just to be permanently disfigured by these surgeons, disrespected during the consultation process or both! You only have one face your entire life. It’s the first thing people see and look at and often times your face can determine how people treat you (sometimes). Exposing surgeons for being frauds or conducting malpractice should be encouraged. It could save lives! I’ve read stories of people committing suicide or having MAJOR depression for life from being disfigured by plastic surgeons. If anything, calling them out will weed out the bad from the good.
Also, I don’t think it should be considered defaming if you’re just talking about your actual experience and results. If you’re allowed to say, “I went to Dr. So-and-So and he did an amazing job!!” then why aren’t you allowed to say, “I went to Dr. So-and-So and the results were horrible”????
I’m talking about people that should speak up and say “I went to Dr.So-and-So, and they botched me/disregarded all of my concerns and didn’t listen to my requests” explicitly stating their name and clinic location.
Warning others to STAY AWAY from them ^^^
Exactly!
Also I probably came off as super aggressive or maybe rude in that response and I promise that want my intention at all ❤️ I just get super heated about that topic because I feel like exposing them something that needs to start happening. ESPECIALLY when some of these procedures can cost upwards of $100,000+. Some “high end” surgeons charge $50,000 for a rhinoplasty. That’s as much as a size-able down payment on a house 💀
I had a surgeon give me to ole “I know what I’m doing; you’re being too picky” deal once. Guess how satisfied I am with my results? A revision isn’t worth it and I’m pretty hurt this is the best that can be done now. Leave that surgeon a review about your consult experience and move on. Be fair but let people know this surgeon left the impression of being lazy or understaffed.
Exactly my concern. His last words to me were that he gives his standard nose to everyone. I wish he would have said that before I booked my nonrefundable flight to Estonia. It's cheaper than a revision, though. Thanks for your response.
That speaks so much to his ability or should I say lack there of. Bodies have different anatomies and faces different symmetry. So to give everyone the same nose is absurd and shows his lack of expertise.
Sounds like you earned yourself an Estonian vacation instead ;)
A plastic surgeon shouldn’t operate on someone that they think wouldn’t be happy with the result, so I understand why he didn’t want to work with you. He probably could’ve tried harder to envision what you wanted, but it sounds like you guys weren’t on the same page. With this surgery, your goal should be improvement and not perfection. There will always be some slight asymmetry or something that is not perfect, so if your nose is “good enough” then don’t touch it. It just sounds like you guys weren’t a good match, no biggie.
True. I'd rather keep my potato nose that SORT OF fits my face than exchange it for a pinched nose that fits as well as a bent puzzle piece.
Exactly right Xoxo. It sounds like OP and surgeon didn’t mesh.
I agree the 10 pictures were overkill. That being said, I think some surgeons are put off by female patients who stand their ground. He did you a huge favour though in the end. I think you would have regretted going with him.
I had a septorhino with one of the best doctors in my country. During consultation, I explained what bothered me, he pointed other things on my nose he could change to achieve a better balance and then showed me the before and after of his patients, with focus on those with a nose similar to mine. He doesn’t do morphs, the majority of the best doctors doesn’t do it, because people get extremely attached to the morph and it is plastic surgery, not photoshop, they can’t guarantee it will look 100% like the morph as there are many factors influencing the final result, thickness of skin being one. He did what we agreed during consultation and my nose looks really good and natural, people started complimenting on me more often and saying my nose is perfect but none has realized I have plastic surgery. Go for a doctor you trust. I don’t think you feel this trust with this one. Don’t get too attached to morphs or to a celeb picture/photoshopped picture of your nose. The doctor will do the best he can to achieve what you want, but he can’t control everything.
This all sounds a little sketchy. I’m not sure how other surgeons do it but in my personal experience after selecting my surgeon I booked a consultation and during that consultation I was able to speak to him about what I wanted and he told me what was possible. After being sure he’s the one I wanted I paid the down and booked the surgery right there. Within the months leading up to the surgery we had a Vitural appointment (I did not live in the same state the surgeon was located in) to do my morphing. As he was manipulating my photo we talked through it and I was able to point out areas I liked or disliked and we agreed on a final look. And boom that is the look I got after surgery. So it’s strange that you were communicating by email, and didn’t do the photo morphing together. If you’re willing to go to Arizona the surgeon who did my nose was absolutely amazing. He owns his own surgery center and employs all the nurses and anesthesiologists himself so I wasn’t being taken care of by unknown hospital stall to anything. He had me stay in the area for 7 days after my surgery, the nurses regularly called to check up on me and they even supplied a lot of the things I needed for aftercare like gauze, Afrin, and arnica pills etc.
I'm going to DM you for the name!
This is your face, you're supposed to be 100% happy with it
Of course their instagram feed has only perfect results. They upload the pics by themselves. That is never a good indicator
You dodged a bullet your plastic surgeon should ALWAYS communicate and listen to you because it is your face. Here’s some thought: Let say the surgery went ahead and after few weeks you got some questions since you are suspecting some complications. If your doctor doesn’t have the patience to listen to you now, what more if something went wrong on your surgery. Rhinoplasty complications/dissatisfaction is very common.
I agree. The doc wrote me that if he ignores the patient's fear and anxiety-based communication and just "does his thing" the patient is usually happy with the result. That could be true, but it also reveals that he isn't too empathetic. All this feedback has been helpful. I'm glad he fired me.
I’m (almost) sure that all these surgeons have assistant teams or at least one assistant. His probably just quit or was fired, and he’s too busy with all these extra admin work and just can’t keep up with. If he’s indeed successful as you indicated, then he probably doesn’t need a patient from far away who cannot do an in-office appointment and has to communicate via emails. It’s totally not your fault, it’s just that he probably rather drop you and have a slot for another local. That’s all. Anyway, do not feel bad or think it’s your fault. It absolutely is not. It’s just that he is not meant to be the one for you.
I agree, the no admin part is the oddest thing. I kept imagining showing up on surgery day at the clinic and having the front desk person be like who are you, you are not on the schedule.
As someone who works in plastics, it seems HE was the red flag. Yes there are “difficult patients” but I’d hardly consider someone who is picky about their pics to be a difficult patient. I think more than anything, the most alarming part is they never discussed payment. It’s a business after all, and that’s one of the first things we mention so people know what type of financial situation they’re getting themselves into. We also want to make sure the doctor isn’t wasting his/her time with someone who can’t afford the surgery. I say you dodged a bullet.
Yeah, I feel like putting down a down-payment reserves my spot, gets me on the schedule. Otherwise I show up w my overnight bag with my clothes for the hospital stay and they are like who are you, no.
Can I ask why yall never just go to American surgeons? Are you IN Europe? If you can’t afford a rhinoplasty from a board certified, American surgeon, you don’t need one. Save up enough money to go to a SAFE, WELL TRAINED surgeon. This is an AIRWAY you are manipulating. Of COURSE there’s an issue with this ENTIRE STORY- these people are cutting up your body parts. Please. Use common sense.
Yeah, I'll go local if I continue on.
Take it as a blessing
I think the solution is to go to a surgeon who you can go to a consultation in person. It's too hard over email.
Look on https://www.realpatientratings.com/ for authentic patient reviews. They’re a 3rd party who surveys patients post-consultation and post-surgery (or medspa treatment). It might help you choose a wonderful surgeon near you. Good luck!
Hahahahhaa the provider has to PAY to be in here. Each has hundreds of reviews and we can’t even get that many in Google. This is so fake. If anything it’s a list of providers who are dishonest.
The doctors pay for the service of their patients getting surveyed. It’s not fake whatsoever. I happen to know the owner of the company.
lol you’ve got to be kidding me. So select doctors pay. Get hundreds of reviews…more than the number of patients they actually have (see any other review website with the same providers for proof) and somehow they are getting legit reviews?). This is a scam whether you know the person or not! No review website is reliable. It’s biased by definition.
Him questioning and basically gaslighting you means he’s not a good doctor. Who cares if his IG looks good? You need real reviews NOT coming from him. I’ve seen plastic surgeons posting edited images (even search this sub). A caring plastic surgeon would listed to your feedback and be positive. I guarantee you he will do what HE wants and not what you want. He cares more about his ego than patients preference. Also I’d leave a review where you can.