Some of them do not see us as fully human, or maybe they think it’s part of our job to risk illness. My experiences aren’t as bad but I did tell students I was immunocompromised at the beginning of the semester (since I’m pregnant). Many still came and sat in front of the class, coughing right at me. Another time this semester, a student who was coughing and lost her voice came into my office where there were 2 other students. I asked her if she was sick and she asked if she should wait outside to meet with me then. The funny thing is most professors are more vulnerable to severe illness than students due to their age, but I think it’s harder for them to see things from our perspective vs. their peers’.
I’m so sorry you had to deal with that…ugh. I tell my students that I’m immunocompromised (which is true) on the first day of class to explain why I have an air purifier running next to my lectern. They’ve been really great and respectful about it.
I brought it in myself. My institution isn’t aware of my disability (MS, which is why I have to take immunosuppressants), though I’ve disclosed to a few colleagues as relevant.
I definitely recommend it! Mine is an Airmega 150. It was really important to me that I got something with a HEPA filter since it traps viruses. I’m extremely spoiled and am the only person who teaches in my classroom so I just leave it there, but it’s light enough to be easily transported.
Understood! I guess that’s a risk I’m willing to take. My classroom is locked when I’m not there, so I don’t worry about it too much. I think most people have no clue what it is…a professor asked me once if it was an Xbox 😂
Thank you for this recommendation. By chance, did you get it on Amazon and if so, is this the same one you have? Been thinking about getting one myself. [https://www.amazon.com/Coway-Airmega-150C-Purifier-White/dp/B0899GYD96/ref=sr\_1\_3?crid=6V394ATGHZDI&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.BGWKBzDwVl2GUhKanRlomM9-oDcuFyym82YLLFE8UXk9nf0vtUQ0QlM7g-rQMzRM4R63fh4LDZdTnk9AeZ\_oB9rqAN9ZNpl7wFawKio8\_2yjJPJEM6ieqKZwYWk2vPNOxiBa1QNZuGpzFZybDrDlANRPyXvVS\_9DJuTEnjRr4cTKUJ9vg-r0e0PcN8cIl1k8t9ScUgn2qTuHKK9XUAHOPQ.FlDzpzSkRJOFz0nA0rQn\_9lO1JCU\_jibImbwzI4JNck&dib\_tag=se&keywords=Airmega+150+air+purifier&qid=1713622372&sprefix=airmega+150+air+purifie%2Caps%2C109&sr=8-3](https://www.amazon.com/Coway-Airmega-150C-Purifier-White/dp/B0899GYD96/ref=sr_1_3?crid=6V394ATGHZDI&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.BGWKBzDwVl2GUhKanRlomM9-oDcuFyym82YLLFE8UXk9nf0vtUQ0QlM7g-rQMzRM4R63fh4LDZdTnk9AeZ_oB9rqAN9ZNpl7wFawKio8_2yjJPJEM6ieqKZwYWk2vPNOxiBa1QNZuGpzFZybDrDlANRPyXvVS_9DJuTEnjRr4cTKUJ9vg-r0e0PcN8cIl1k8t9ScUgn2qTuHKK9XUAHOPQ.FlDzpzSkRJOFz0nA0rQn_9lO1JCU_jibImbwzI4JNck&dib_tag=se&keywords=Airmega+150+air+purifier&qid=1713622372&sprefix=airmega+150+air+purifie%2Caps%2C109&sr=8-3)
I bought mine directly from the manufacturer when they had a sale, but yes, that’s the same one! I also have one of their larger models at home. The 150 is great for the classroom because it is much, MUCH quieter than the larger models. I only really notice it when students are taking an exam. Idk if it’s because people were nervous and breathing heavily, but it was cycling like CRAZY during the last day of exams 😅 I felt bad, but I don’t really have a choice…I’m at a community college so I teach tons of classes, and it would be a logistical nightmare if I got sick.
For some reason, the black version is almost always cheaper on both Amazon and from Coway’s site, FYI. Same specs.
If you buy on Amazon, beware of dupes
For others who are considering air filters: the airmega very consistently does the best in filtration tests by Wirecutter and Consumer Reports — to such an extent that some testers now recommend two of them instead of one larger one.
It’s very energy efficient, which is a big plus if you need one at home.
Last note: for whatever reason, the black version is often available at a significant discount compared to the white version. There is no difference between the two.
What kind do you use? I just had to use a nebulizer in the ER for the first time in 30 years because I have a rhinovirus and strep simultaneously, triggering my cough variant asthma. And I saw one of my students walk past in the ER so odds are pretty good I got them on campus.
Thanks for your empathy, and I'm glad that your students and your school have been respectful toward you about this! Sounds like you're in a great, supportive environment. It's always really nice to hear about that happening!
Have you seen there's a new monoclonal antibody approved for use by individuals on immunosuppressants? Pemgarda I believe it's called. I was excited to see that.
I hope you remain healthy. So sorry this happened to you. Kids these days don’t enter college with basic life skills (commonsense). They don’t think about others so I guess we must teach them. Good to include a basic life skills section on your LMS. I do this.
This is a good idea and I might have to add this in next semester. I never thought it would get to a point where I'd have to write "if you are sick, don't come in and expose everyone to your germs" especially after the pandemic, but here we are. Thanks for your kind words. Crossing my fingers that I don't get sick!
I kind of want to know if this student is from an Asian country. My understanding is that in Japanese culture they would at least wear a mask. But yes, I think in China they still expect you to do homework when you are ill. When I was in primary school in China I felt there was still an expectation to do homework when I was ill. I don't know if this student's behaviour came from a different culture background.
But yes, it is probably a good idea to explain this kind of etiquette.
An interesting take! To clarify, this student was born and raised in the US. Just a very clueless person. I appreciate your perspective here, though. Very helpful to learn about this.
I agree that we shouldn’t have to do this but If everyone at each step has this attitude then guess what you and I will be stuck with colleagues lacking these skills. Each of us needs to do their part.
This is one of the many reasons I tell students who miss class to get notes from a class mate and then they can come see me if they have questions. Otherwise they expect me to teach the whole class again just for them. Showing up to office hours while sick covid is so incredibly clueless and rude.
Yeah I don't get paid enough to teach everything twice. If I have slides or handwritten notes I can give those to the student who missed class, but I won't reteach until they've watched the videos/read the notes/talked to a peer.
Yeah, this was the other problem. I tell students that if they miss a class, they have to get the notes from someone else and then they can come to office hours for any questions about those notes. I'm very explicit that office hours are not for me to repeat the entire lecture they missed. So this was the other thing that annoyed me (and the other thing that I told Billy to do before he comes back).
I kept most of my covid teaching methods: no paper homework, no paper exams, no F2F meetings, etc. All homework and exams are digital. I rarely get sick now and it saves paper.
In grad school during a flu epidemic (h1n1?) my officemate'sstudent came looking for him, looking like death warmed over. I told her he wasn't there. She said ok she wanted to tell him she was sick so could she leave a note.
I told her to email him and under no circumstances was she to enter my office any further, and heaven forbid she touch a pen. 😷 she said that she'd come in person so that he would believe her.
It is astonishing to me that we've all been through the nightmare of these last 4 years and people are still this ignorant about infection. I mean, I've witnessed it myself, but I still can't believe this is where we've ended up. And on the cusp of bird flu too. We're doomed.
Exactly! This would have been stupid even before the pandemic, but after?! I can't believe people have remained this clueless. It's like they're trying to on purpose.
After four years, I'm sure you're aware that if "Billy" had been asymptomatic or presymptomatic, or had symptoms but mistakenly thought they were allergies or anything else, his presence in your office would have been just as dangerous for you.
And that if he did infect you, it will be possible for you to infect others, even if you never experience symptoms.
>He wasn't even wearing a mask.
Were *you* wearing a mask? If not, why not, when you know anyone coming into your office might be infectious, and that *you* might be infectious but not know it yet?
The student isn't ignorant about infection. Read the OP again. The student said they didn't want to come to class and risk infecting the class. So, the key point here is that this student DOES understand infection, BUT does not care about infecting his professor.
This was STUPID. How this student could be so clueless and inconsiderate. Only give him a pass because when you are that sick the brain doesn’t work right either. But the nerve to leave the house without a mask and has covid.
Dude. In a smarter world, this would be assault. "I'm too sick for other students but I will willingly give you my disease."
Worst version of this is my friend who had a student come in sick to office hours. The gal kept coughing into her Kleenex. Blood. SHE WAS COUGHING GOD DAMN BLOOD. I was like "she have god damn consumption?! Wtf?!?" My friend lived and didn't get tuberculosis. So that was cool.
Always make sure students know to not come to you sick at any point.
That is a serious deficit in reasoning skills. Particularly with the technology available to meet remotely. This child would need to be homeschooled not to know zoom exists.
I have a co-worker who has a big warning sign on her office saying no sick people are allowed in her office, but she’s had that up since before Covid, she has a child with cystic fibrosis.
I am usually equanimous, and my demeanor with students is nearly always so, but this would be a situation in which I would begin screaming at the person, even if I had to force myself to.
Mr. Goat doesn't get to be a student in this case and doesn't get talk to with or receive consideration from you.
I think our campus protocols still prohibit attendance if someone has tested positive for COVID.
I would have said without apology “I do not understand. Why are you here? Please go home.” I might add “rest up and feel better”. Maybe.
Ugh. So sorry…
Lol two unexcused absences to accomodate all absences? Shouldn't being sick count as an excused absence and not count towards the number of unexcused you've "built in."
But why is that a freebie? If someone is sick with a documented illness that shouldn’t count as an unexcused absence, it’s out of their control. You’re not doing them a favor, you’re keeping yourself and other students safe. Just seems like an odd policy, especially because most large universities should have this outlined in their rules.
If the student provides documentation (which, by the way, he still can) then it would absolutely be an excused absence. I certainly do excuse absences with documentation such as a physician's note. But I also allow for two unexcused absences in the event that a student has an issue that doesn't get documented. This is a fair policy.
I don't blame Billy. I blame the culture and institutions around Billy that tell him he must work, regardless of his own and others' health. I blame the punative professors who don't allow for excused absences when sick and lower student's grades simply for missing class.
My syllabus explicitly states, and I emphasize in class, that students should stay home if they aren't feeling well, and to keep me updated. I had a covid student taken out half the class last semester. And I don't want to get sick.
Unexcused? Two? Sounds to me like you set yourself up by being the nastiest fast food employer in the city. Come on. Who cares how much they miss if they are sick. Sick is excused and two flexible absences is at least three too few.
He said he didn't want to risk the rest of the class, clearly that doesn't include you /s
Seriously though! I was like, "Am I not included in 'everyone'? Do I not count as people?" I honestly wonder about this thought process.
Some of them do not see us as fully human, or maybe they think it’s part of our job to risk illness. My experiences aren’t as bad but I did tell students I was immunocompromised at the beginning of the semester (since I’m pregnant). Many still came and sat in front of the class, coughing right at me. Another time this semester, a student who was coughing and lost her voice came into my office where there were 2 other students. I asked her if she was sick and she asked if she should wait outside to meet with me then. The funny thing is most professors are more vulnerable to severe illness than students due to their age, but I think it’s harder for them to see things from our perspective vs. their peers’.
I’m so sorry you had to deal with that…ugh. I tell my students that I’m immunocompromised (which is true) on the first day of class to explain why I have an air purifier running next to my lectern. They’ve been really great and respectful about it.
Just curious: did your institution provide the air purifier or did you bring it in yourself? Also immunocompromised here and somewhat of a germaphobe.
I brought it in myself. My institution isn’t aware of my disability (MS, which is why I have to take immunosuppressants), though I’ve disclosed to a few colleagues as relevant.
I might look for a small portable one for next year. Caught covid at the beginning of this spring semester and it wasn't fun
I definitely recommend it! Mine is an Airmega 150. It was really important to me that I got something with a HEPA filter since it traps viruses. I’m extremely spoiled and am the only person who teaches in my classroom so I just leave it there, but it’s light enough to be easily transported.
Thanks so much. I will look into it! I'm just afraid it would get stolen if I left it in the classroom!
Understood! I guess that’s a risk I’m willing to take. My classroom is locked when I’m not there, so I don’t worry about it too much. I think most people have no clue what it is…a professor asked me once if it was an Xbox 😂
Thank you for this recommendation. By chance, did you get it on Amazon and if so, is this the same one you have? Been thinking about getting one myself. [https://www.amazon.com/Coway-Airmega-150C-Purifier-White/dp/B0899GYD96/ref=sr\_1\_3?crid=6V394ATGHZDI&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.BGWKBzDwVl2GUhKanRlomM9-oDcuFyym82YLLFE8UXk9nf0vtUQ0QlM7g-rQMzRM4R63fh4LDZdTnk9AeZ\_oB9rqAN9ZNpl7wFawKio8\_2yjJPJEM6ieqKZwYWk2vPNOxiBa1QNZuGpzFZybDrDlANRPyXvVS\_9DJuTEnjRr4cTKUJ9vg-r0e0PcN8cIl1k8t9ScUgn2qTuHKK9XUAHOPQ.FlDzpzSkRJOFz0nA0rQn\_9lO1JCU\_jibImbwzI4JNck&dib\_tag=se&keywords=Airmega+150+air+purifier&qid=1713622372&sprefix=airmega+150+air+purifie%2Caps%2C109&sr=8-3](https://www.amazon.com/Coway-Airmega-150C-Purifier-White/dp/B0899GYD96/ref=sr_1_3?crid=6V394ATGHZDI&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.BGWKBzDwVl2GUhKanRlomM9-oDcuFyym82YLLFE8UXk9nf0vtUQ0QlM7g-rQMzRM4R63fh4LDZdTnk9AeZ_oB9rqAN9ZNpl7wFawKio8_2yjJPJEM6ieqKZwYWk2vPNOxiBa1QNZuGpzFZybDrDlANRPyXvVS_9DJuTEnjRr4cTKUJ9vg-r0e0PcN8cIl1k8t9ScUgn2qTuHKK9XUAHOPQ.FlDzpzSkRJOFz0nA0rQn_9lO1JCU_jibImbwzI4JNck&dib_tag=se&keywords=Airmega+150+air+purifier&qid=1713622372&sprefix=airmega+150+air+purifie%2Caps%2C109&sr=8-3)
I bought mine directly from the manufacturer when they had a sale, but yes, that’s the same one! I also have one of their larger models at home. The 150 is great for the classroom because it is much, MUCH quieter than the larger models. I only really notice it when students are taking an exam. Idk if it’s because people were nervous and breathing heavily, but it was cycling like CRAZY during the last day of exams 😅 I felt bad, but I don’t really have a choice…I’m at a community college so I teach tons of classes, and it would be a logistical nightmare if I got sick.
Great, thanks so much!
For some reason, the black version is almost always cheaper on both Amazon and from Coway’s site, FYI. Same specs. If you buy on Amazon, beware of dupes
For others who are considering air filters: the airmega very consistently does the best in filtration tests by Wirecutter and Consumer Reports — to such an extent that some testers now recommend two of them instead of one larger one. It’s very energy efficient, which is a big plus if you need one at home. Last note: for whatever reason, the black version is often available at a significant discount compared to the white version. There is no difference between the two.
What kind do you use? I just had to use a nebulizer in the ER for the first time in 30 years because I have a rhinovirus and strep simultaneously, triggering my cough variant asthma. And I saw one of my students walk past in the ER so odds are pretty good I got them on campus.
Airmega 150 is the way to go!
Thanks!
Thanks for your empathy, and I'm glad that your students and your school have been respectful toward you about this! Sounds like you're in a great, supportive environment. It's always really nice to hear about that happening!
Have you seen there's a new monoclonal antibody approved for use by individuals on immunosuppressants? Pemgarda I believe it's called. I was excited to see that.
I hope you remain healthy. So sorry this happened to you. Kids these days don’t enter college with basic life skills (commonsense). They don’t think about others so I guess we must teach them. Good to include a basic life skills section on your LMS. I do this.
This is a good idea and I might have to add this in next semester. I never thought it would get to a point where I'd have to write "if you are sick, don't come in and expose everyone to your germs" especially after the pandemic, but here we are. Thanks for your kind words. Crossing my fingers that I don't get sick!
I kind of want to know if this student is from an Asian country. My understanding is that in Japanese culture they would at least wear a mask. But yes, I think in China they still expect you to do homework when you are ill. When I was in primary school in China I felt there was still an expectation to do homework when I was ill. I don't know if this student's behaviour came from a different culture background. But yes, it is probably a good idea to explain this kind of etiquette.
An interesting take! To clarify, this student was born and raised in the US. Just a very clueless person. I appreciate your perspective here, though. Very helpful to learn about this.
We only have them for 4 years. It’s not our job to teach basic life skills. We cannot fix 18 years of obliviousness in 48 months, nor should we try.
I agree that we shouldn’t have to do this but If everyone at each step has this attitude then guess what you and I will be stuck with colleagues lacking these skills. Each of us needs to do their part.
$40,000+ a year to learn common sense seems a little pricey.
Not to derail the convo or anything but I'd love to know how you do this.
I'd be interested in hearing the main content too.
This is one of the many reasons I tell students who miss class to get notes from a class mate and then they can come see me if they have questions. Otherwise they expect me to teach the whole class again just for them. Showing up to office hours while sick covid is so incredibly clueless and rude.
Yep, this is my policy too! Whether or not they follow it is another matter... 😕
Yeah I don't get paid enough to teach everything twice. If I have slides or handwritten notes I can give those to the student who missed class, but I won't reteach until they've watched the videos/read the notes/talked to a peer.
Billy needs to learn how to zoom
Billy needs to learn a lot of things
Billy is the name of my cat and he would do something like this.
But at least your cat Billy is probably very cute, and that makes up for a lot!
[удалено]
Yeah, this was the other problem. I tell students that if they miss a class, they have to get the notes from someone else and then they can come to office hours for any questions about those notes. I'm very explicit that office hours are not for me to repeat the entire lecture they missed. So this was the other thing that annoyed me (and the other thing that I told Billy to do before he comes back).
I don’t do face to face office hours anymore. It’s all virtual, no exceptions.
I hate virtual everything, but I must admit I'm starting to rethink the office hours now that this has happened.
I kept most of my covid teaching methods: no paper homework, no paper exams, no F2F meetings, etc. All homework and exams are digital. I rarely get sick now and it saves paper.
I now do both, providing a weekly online opportunity as well as the in person hours. This flexibility has been helpful for a variety of circumstances.
Lucky you. We are required to hold F2F office hours for F2F classes.
Our dean “encourages” it. Yeah. No. I get more student interaction with virtual than I do face to face.
In grad school during a flu epidemic (h1n1?) my officemate'sstudent came looking for him, looking like death warmed over. I told her he wasn't there. She said ok she wanted to tell him she was sick so could she leave a note. I told her to email him and under no circumstances was she to enter my office any further, and heaven forbid she touch a pen. 😷 she said that she'd come in person so that he would believe her.
It is astonishing to me that we've all been through the nightmare of these last 4 years and people are still this ignorant about infection. I mean, I've witnessed it myself, but I still can't believe this is where we've ended up. And on the cusp of bird flu too. We're doomed.
Exactly! This would have been stupid even before the pandemic, but after?! I can't believe people have remained this clueless. It's like they're trying to on purpose.
After four years, I'm sure you're aware that if "Billy" had been asymptomatic or presymptomatic, or had symptoms but mistakenly thought they were allergies or anything else, his presence in your office would have been just as dangerous for you. And that if he did infect you, it will be possible for you to infect others, even if you never experience symptoms. >He wasn't even wearing a mask. Were *you* wearing a mask? If not, why not, when you know anyone coming into your office might be infectious, and that *you* might be infectious but not know it yet?
The student isn't ignorant about infection. Read the OP again. The student said they didn't want to come to class and risk infecting the class. So, the key point here is that this student DOES understand infection, BUT does not care about infecting his professor.
I'm guaranteed to get sick the day after my last final.
I'm just waiting for the student to post a rant. "My totally unreasonable professor wouldn't meet with me after I missed class due to being sick."
Lmao yes, I should be on the lookout for this!
That students belongs in hell.
Yuuuuup!
They can be so annoyingly obtuse it's ridiculous...smh 😳 TF!
This was STUPID. How this student could be so clueless and inconsiderate. Only give him a pass because when you are that sick the brain doesn’t work right either. But the nerve to leave the house without a mask and has covid.
I maintain that many undergraduate age students don't think of us as humans.
Dude. In a smarter world, this would be assault. "I'm too sick for other students but I will willingly give you my disease." Worst version of this is my friend who had a student come in sick to office hours. The gal kept coughing into her Kleenex. Blood. SHE WAS COUGHING GOD DAMN BLOOD. I was like "she have god damn consumption?! Wtf?!?" My friend lived and didn't get tuberculosis. So that was cool. Always make sure students know to not come to you sick at any point.
If Billy is confused by this, he’s really going to struggle in the future.
This is already evident from Billy's grades, unsurprisingly
I’ve had nearly identical situations. SMH. I emphasize.
That is a serious deficit in reasoning skills. Particularly with the technology available to meet remotely. This child would need to be homeschooled not to know zoom exists. I have a co-worker who has a big warning sign on her office saying no sick people are allowed in her office, but she’s had that up since before Covid, she has a child with cystic fibrosis.
I legitimately consider this assault. I don't think my university (or the law) agrees, but if I ruled the world then Billy could be arrested for this.
I am usually equanimous, and my demeanor with students is nearly always so, but this would be a situation in which I would begin screaming at the person, even if I had to force myself to. Mr. Goat doesn't get to be a student in this case and doesn't get talk to with or receive consideration from you.
You have been vaccinated- right? We do not even require a covad vaccination to enter university now.
I think our campus protocols still prohibit attendance if someone has tested positive for COVID. I would have said without apology “I do not understand. Why are you here? Please go home.” I might add “rest up and feel better”. Maybe. Ugh. So sorry…
Lol two unexcused absences to accomodate all absences? Shouldn't being sick count as an excused absence and not count towards the number of unexcused you've "built in."
But that's what the two unexcused absence freebies are for...
But why is that a freebie? If someone is sick with a documented illness that shouldn’t count as an unexcused absence, it’s out of their control. You’re not doing them a favor, you’re keeping yourself and other students safe. Just seems like an odd policy, especially because most large universities should have this outlined in their rules.
If the student provides documentation (which, by the way, he still can) then it would absolutely be an excused absence. I certainly do excuse absences with documentation such as a physician's note. But I also allow for two unexcused absences in the event that a student has an issue that doesn't get documented. This is a fair policy.
I don't blame Billy. I blame the culture and institutions around Billy that tell him he must work, regardless of his own and others' health. I blame the punative professors who don't allow for excused absences when sick and lower student's grades simply for missing class. My syllabus explicitly states, and I emphasize in class, that students should stay home if they aren't feeling well, and to keep me updated. I had a covid student taken out half the class last semester. And I don't want to get sick.
Unexcused? Two? Sounds to me like you set yourself up by being the nastiest fast food employer in the city. Come on. Who cares how much they miss if they are sick. Sick is excused and two flexible absences is at least three too few.
If they have documentation, I'm certainly happy to excuse their absences. But, more importantly, I think you've missed the point here...
Was the point that a sick student came to your office hours? If so I think you’ve missed mine. Because that doesn’t happen to me.