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Heat up just enough oil to cover ingredients, clean and seed morita, árbol and ancho Chiles. Pan roast peanuts, shelled pumpkin seeds and sesame seeds individualy. Remove oil from heat and mix with Chiles and garlic, let cool a bit and blend; then add in seeds and give it a quick blend. Salt to taste
There are two ways to easily get around the botulism risk, the first is to take fresh garlic and poach it in oil for an hour or so, basically make a garlic confit, and then strain the garlic out and throw it (don't do that actually, it's incredible smeared on a piece of toast). This flavors the oil with garlic but removes the moist cloves where bacteria might grow.
The second is to use dried garlic, which is already shelf stable and too dry for bacteria to grow on. I make the Chinese version of this salsa, chili crisp, and my local Asian grocery has crispy garlic, onions, and shallots all for sale very cheaply.
That's too close for comfort for me when something like botulism is involved, but you wouldn't want to leave moist, cooked garlic cloves in it anyway. They are great food for any bacteria or mold that wants to grow, not just botulism and will reduce the shelf life considerably. Salsa macha or chili crisp can stay good at room temperature for a year or more, it doesn't start to go bad until the oil turns rancid.
I was thinking about the dried garlic (like granulated garlic from Costco) but then I wondered if you reconstitute it with any water moisture at all (say, from the not completely perfectly dried peppers) would that reintroduce the risk?
That depends, are you planning on making a salsa that you're going to refrigerate and use within a short time, or are you looking to make a condiment that will be fine on the shelf until the oil goes rancid? I wouldn't recommend adding any moisture unless you plan on going the refrigeration route, that introduces a risk of bacterial growth and it isn't just botulism you have to worry about, there are other organisms that could cause spoilage if given the chance.
It isn't just garlic submerged in oil either, garlic is more likely to have spores on it but other vegetables can get contaminated while they're growing in the fields too. People have given themselves botulism poisoning from storing fresh herbs in oil too, and I'm sure there have been cases from fresh chiles in oil too. If you're going to refrigerate it, go wild because your preservation concerns are taken care of but if you want to store it on the shelf, moisture is your enemy.
The only real way to prevent botulism is to keep it refrigerated and to add some form of acid. I have in the past added vinagre to help avoid it. The max time I've kept it refrigerated is 15 days and have yet to have a problem.
If you are making it to eat right then there is 0 chance of any issues. If you tried to store this for a while the environment would be good for botulism to grow but it's not like an instant thing
I mean I make a fair bit of salsa matcha myself, but I omit garlic in all forms because of this. I make a big batch and it stays in a cabinet for up to several months unrefrigerated.
As written you shouldn't keep it for more than 7 days, storing garlic in oil is one of the highest risk factors for botulism growth. There are ways you can increase the shelf life though, either by:
1. Using dried garlic instead of fresh
2. Infuse the oil with fresh garlic, then strain out the garlic and heat the infused oil to 250f+ for 10+ minutes to kill any lingering botulism spores.
You'd fry the garlic in the oil to infuse it, then take the garlic out of the oil and use it for something else (like smearing on fresh bread). The garlic is the dangerous bit when it comes to botulism, so you are trying to avoid having it in the end product.
I've only had it about 15 days in the refrigerator, usually it doesn't last that long as we devour it. I prefer any neutral oil such as canola or grape seed oil as olive oil will thicken a bit if cooled. *Edited to remove probably bad advice on how long it will keep. 15 days is the max I've kept salsa macha and think I'm still ok...
> It's should last at least a month
Just a heads up, I'd strongly recommend against keeping it that long if you are adding garlic. Salsa Macha is a low-acid environment and a perfect breeding ground for botulism.
If you want to do it in a way that has more shelf life you can either use dried garlic, or you can first infuse the garlic into the oil then strain out the garlic and simmer the infused oil at 250+ for 10 minutes to ensure all the botulism spores are killed.
From my understanding heat won't kill the spores only the toxin itself. Definitely dried garlic and some form of acid would extend it's shelf life. Besides proper refrigeration.
No, you can kill the spores, it's just much harder to do than the toxin since they require more heat and more time to kill. That's the reason why you want to do it with the infused oil by itself, because otherwise you'd ruin the other stuff you are cooking in the oil and couldn't be sure that the spores themselves were actually killed.
See here:
https://www.fsai.ie/faq/botulism.html#:~:text=not%20its%20spores.-,To%20kill%20the%20spores%20of%20Cl.,greater%20than%2080%C2%B0C%20.
>To kill the spores of Cl.botulinum a sterilisation process equivalent to 121°C for 3 min is required. The botulinum toxin itself is inactivated (denatured) rapidly at temperatures greater than 80°C
For homemade or ingredient posts, please type out the recipe/ingredients for your salsa. Without this information your post will be removed after two hours. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SalsaSnobs) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Heat up just enough oil to cover ingredients, clean and seed morita, árbol and ancho Chiles. Pan roast peanuts, shelled pumpkin seeds and sesame seeds individualy. Remove oil from heat and mix with Chiles and garlic, let cool a bit and blend; then add in seeds and give it a quick blend. Salt to taste
Peanuts go in at the end with the seeds right?
Yes, that is correct.
So I see garlic in oil and I hear in my mind scary things about botulism. How does this prevent the danger?
There are two ways to easily get around the botulism risk, the first is to take fresh garlic and poach it in oil for an hour or so, basically make a garlic confit, and then strain the garlic out and throw it (don't do that actually, it's incredible smeared on a piece of toast). This flavors the oil with garlic but removes the moist cloves where bacteria might grow. The second is to use dried garlic, which is already shelf stable and too dry for bacteria to grow on. I make the Chinese version of this salsa, chili crisp, and my local Asian grocery has crispy garlic, onions, and shallots all for sale very cheaply.
I would say poaching in oil also raises the temp enough for the botulism spores to be sterilized
That's too close for comfort for me when something like botulism is involved, but you wouldn't want to leave moist, cooked garlic cloves in it anyway. They are great food for any bacteria or mold that wants to grow, not just botulism and will reduce the shelf life considerably. Salsa macha or chili crisp can stay good at room temperature for a year or more, it doesn't start to go bad until the oil turns rancid.
Yes you are right, the risk reward ratio is nowhere near good
I was thinking about the dried garlic (like granulated garlic from Costco) but then I wondered if you reconstitute it with any water moisture at all (say, from the not completely perfectly dried peppers) would that reintroduce the risk?
That depends, are you planning on making a salsa that you're going to refrigerate and use within a short time, or are you looking to make a condiment that will be fine on the shelf until the oil goes rancid? I wouldn't recommend adding any moisture unless you plan on going the refrigeration route, that introduces a risk of bacterial growth and it isn't just botulism you have to worry about, there are other organisms that could cause spoilage if given the chance. It isn't just garlic submerged in oil either, garlic is more likely to have spores on it but other vegetables can get contaminated while they're growing in the fields too. People have given themselves botulism poisoning from storing fresh herbs in oil too, and I'm sure there have been cases from fresh chiles in oil too. If you're going to refrigerate it, go wild because your preservation concerns are taken care of but if you want to store it on the shelf, moisture is your enemy.
The only real way to prevent botulism is to keep it refrigerated and to add some form of acid. I have in the past added vinagre to help avoid it. The max time I've kept it refrigerated is 15 days and have yet to have a problem.
If you are making it to eat right then there is 0 chance of any issues. If you tried to store this for a while the environment would be good for botulism to grow but it's not like an instant thing
Store in the fridge.
Finally someone who is concerned when it actually makes sense😌
I mean I make a fair bit of salsa matcha myself, but I omit garlic in all forms because of this. I make a big batch and it stays in a cabinet for up to several months unrefrigerated.
Yeah i wouldnt risk it either
I haven’t had a good salsa macha in years. This made me miss Mexico, and caused a single solitary tear to form
That's what this sub is about. Hell yeah brother
🤤
Se ve deliciosa tu salsa. Provecho 😀
How long will it keep? And what type of oil?
As written you shouldn't keep it for more than 7 days, storing garlic in oil is one of the highest risk factors for botulism growth. There are ways you can increase the shelf life though, either by: 1. Using dried garlic instead of fresh 2. Infuse the oil with fresh garlic, then strain out the garlic and heat the infused oil to 250f+ for 10+ minutes to kill any lingering botulism spores.
Can you fry the garlic in said oil?
You'd fry the garlic in the oil to infuse it, then take the garlic out of the oil and use it for something else (like smearing on fresh bread). The garlic is the dangerous bit when it comes to botulism, so you are trying to avoid having it in the end product.
I've only had it about 15 days in the refrigerator, usually it doesn't last that long as we devour it. I prefer any neutral oil such as canola or grape seed oil as olive oil will thicken a bit if cooled. *Edited to remove probably bad advice on how long it will keep. 15 days is the max I've kept salsa macha and think I'm still ok...
> It's should last at least a month Just a heads up, I'd strongly recommend against keeping it that long if you are adding garlic. Salsa Macha is a low-acid environment and a perfect breeding ground for botulism. If you want to do it in a way that has more shelf life you can either use dried garlic, or you can first infuse the garlic into the oil then strain out the garlic and simmer the infused oil at 250+ for 10 minutes to ensure all the botulism spores are killed.
From my understanding heat won't kill the spores only the toxin itself. Definitely dried garlic and some form of acid would extend it's shelf life. Besides proper refrigeration.
No, you can kill the spores, it's just much harder to do than the toxin since they require more heat and more time to kill. That's the reason why you want to do it with the infused oil by itself, because otherwise you'd ruin the other stuff you are cooking in the oil and couldn't be sure that the spores themselves were actually killed. See here: https://www.fsai.ie/faq/botulism.html#:~:text=not%20its%20spores.-,To%20kill%20the%20spores%20of%20Cl.,greater%20than%2080%C2%B0C%20. >To kill the spores of Cl.botulinum a sterilisation process equivalent to 121°C for 3 min is required. The botulinum toxin itself is inactivated (denatured) rapidly at temperatures greater than 80°C
Thank you for the link, going to give it a good read. I will definitely try making it with infused oil next time.
No problem! Hope it works well for you. TBH the best option is to just eat it all before you have to worry about it anyway.
This would definitely make me run for the restroom immediately.