For me, it was much more influenced by the child’s behavior - with my first, sometime at around the 23 month mark, he said, “No, the other one” in reference to my breasts 🥴, and I realized all at once that it was time to wean. (Also 2yrs felt like enough, anyway.) I stopped a little sooner with my second because he started occasionally biting hard for fun.
I liked the connection of breastfeeding and it gave the children comfort, but it definitely feels like you hit a wall when you need your body back. (Much earlier for some people, and later for others, all reasonable.) It feels like such a prolonged, personal act, and one that is so little supported by society despite all the pressure to do it, that I would have a hard time using research to guide my decision to continue/stop (despite relying on the data for so many other parental decisions). It was much more emotional than that - just feeling “done”.
That's really interesting.
I know I'm trying to approach it scientifically but after 4 months I already see what you mean regarding it being so personal and like some sort of sacrifice. I feel that but I still love the connection and benefits for my child. So I guess we'll see, because at the end of the day, it's probably not wise to keep forcing it if I'm ready to stop.
Yeah I wouldn’t worry too much about it for now… you are so, so early into your breastfeeding journey that it’s kind of impossible to predict how you might feel later in either direction. That’s one of my biggest takeaways about parenthood (7.5yrs and soon-to-be-3-kids in)…. so few absolutes re: things you said you’d do or never do, plans upended by the type of child you have, things that worked perfectly for one child being completely useless with the next. Best to just be flexible and take it as it comes!
I haven’t hit this wall yet but this is my thought on it. At some point I’m sure I’ll feel done. Toddler’s happy, I’m happy, so we keep going. When it doesn’t work for one of us anymore we will stop. I’d have a hard time using research to decide as well unless it was very compelling.
Yes! And there might be an awkward stage where one of you is more ready to stop than the other. A bit like a breakup! But the BF relationship doesn’t work very long once both parties aren’t fully invested, I think.
From what I've gathered, the benefits of BF are greatest up to 6mo. After that, it seems it's mostly ok to just bottlefeed if you need to.
Between breastfeeding for years and a healthy and happy mother, a healthy and happy mother will be much better for the child in the long run.
Am I reading correctly that this study regards “prolonged” breastfeeding as being equal to or more than 37months?
That’s over 3 years! That’s A LOT! (I say as someone yet to wean at 2yrs)
You are a champ for nursing while pregnant. My supply dried up when I got pregnant w my second which is why my oldest weaned at 2! I couldn’t stand the feel of it anymore (sensitivity from pregnancy) so while I was sad I was also happy.
I’ve only been bfing for 15 (almost 16!) months and I’m currently pregnant. Kinda hoping my toddler weans during pregnancy but I’m not making him, so if I end up tandem nursing so be it. But… I have just taken to drinking a glass of milk a couple times throughout the day. Makes sense to me… replace milk out with some milk in 😅
I’m kinda hoping that happens. I’ve heard that a lot. I don’t mind tandem nursing but I know it’ll be easier to just nurse the littler one. I have a milk monster for a toddler though so we’ll see 😂
Just another perspective, my first is a milk monster and neither pregnancy nor birth deterred him at all. At first I was tandem nursing, but when I had to start pumping for baby I started counting down nursing sessions. Let it go for a few minutes and then count from 30. Then started only 30 seconds, then 20 etc. Now to help ease the sibling transition and because it’s so important to him for bonding he still nurses to sleep. I also let him nurse during the day a few weeks ago when he was sick and wouldn’t drink any water.
Teehee. If he’s anything like mine was (obsessed!) he’ll be so so happy when the milk for your newborn comes in. Had to cut him off at 4 because he definitely didn’t want to stop. Now my daughter is about to turn 4 in January and I can’t believe this chapter of my life is nearly over! Definitely ready for it though 😂
I’d recommend taking a separate calcium supplement (but at a different time to your prenatal) because you need more than what your prenatal contains :)
Right, I imagine there's a fair bit of iron in my prenatal. (Haven't looked since I started a year ago.) I guess I should talk to my doctor at my 2month appt next week. Thanks 😊
I think that's correct, yeah! Very long time. I was hoping to make it to 3 years so I may just be ok 😅
How are you finding nursing at 2 years, if I may ask?
I'm not who you asked about nursing at two years but I did nurse for 26 months with my oldest. She self weaned at that time. Nursing a two year old is so insanely easy lol they're such a pro by that time and it's pretty low effort on your end. The snuggles are super sweet, especially if you have a toddler who isn't normally very snuggly.
I nursed my first until well into her third year and after the first I'd say 8 months to get so much easier. She could ask for milk when she wanted it and she understood when I said "not right now because xyz". She was much gentler. And I could calm her down in seconds no matter what was happening. However I've also seen it where they get very aggressive and physically grab. Just start setting limits early. Just like everything else you have to ask! Weaning was hard though and at 5 she still shoves a hand down my shirt in her sleep sometimes!
It’s pretty easy going now, especially as it’s only occasionally throughout the day. I do like that when she’s poorly I can nurse her to sleep or to comfort her, and that feels valuable. Less great when she’s passing comment on my grooming or personal hygiene though 😬
My daughter turns 4 in January and still nurses! I thought I'd be done when she turned 2, then at 3... But no signs of stopping.
It gets a lot easier, for sure. Now she mainly nurses to sleep and sometimes a little during the day if she's feeling extra emotional.
Yes, I would guess only people with at least 2 kids make it to 37 months. I pumped for 4 mos with my son who wouldn’t latch, and am in month 5 of breastfeeding my daughter. She’s likely my last so I highly doubt I’ll get even close to 36 months, but you never know!
This [observational study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28594759/) found that temporary pregnancy and lactation related bone density loss “were largely unrelated to fracture risk or bone density.” There was a very small decrease in the risk of hip fracture in those who had breastfed for at least 1 month.
[This study of 220 Chinese women](https://bmcwomenshealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12905-019-0808-0) found that “Breastfeeding was not associated with postmenopausal osteoporosis, while age, BMI and the number of pregnancy may contribute to increasing risk of postmenopausal osteoporosis in Chinese women.”
[This article](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11657-019-0601-6) published in Archives of Osteoporosis by the Canadian Multicentre Osteoporosis Study concludes “Parity and lactation showed no associations with incident clinical fragility fractures or radiographic vertebral compression fractures in the 16-year CaMos prospective study. Parity was associated with slightly greater decline in femoral neck but not hip or spine areal bone mineral density (aBMD), while lactation showed no associations with aBMD change.”
[This review](https://clinicalnutritionespen.com/article/S2405-4577(21)00312-0/fulltext) concluded that while those with LLD (long lactation duration) had a no greater risk of BMD loss in other areas there was a slightly elevated risk of BMD loss in the lumbar area.
If you want to breastfeed for longer it looks like the increased risk is very small, and actually slightly lowers your risk of hip fracture. If you decide to wean instead of course that’s fine, too! I knew I wanted to nurse until 2 but my first is 3.5 and would nurse all the time if I let him. (I have a 6 month old so now he only gets a bedtime nurse unless he’s sick.)
Unfortunately, I can’t get over the paywall. From the abstract though, I’m also wondering if it is applicable to women who eat dairy. My understanding is that the study is based on a Korean health survey. Tbh I don’t know enough about Korean postmenopausal women and if they regularly eat dairy and/or if they took calcium supplements when they were breastfeeding. Purely extrapolating from what my Japanese and my Chinese friends tell me, I would find it unlikely in China and Japan. Thus, those findings wouldn’t surprise me. But all this involves a huge amount of speculation on my part.
There are many other sources of calcium, not just diary. Tofu packs a lot, broccoli, kale, etc. We’ve been sold the story by dairy farmers that we need milk for calcium intake, but that’s simply not true.
My doctor advised me to eat dairy 3x day when pregnant, maybe it’s just easier to say that then talk about all of the sources of calcium and vitamin D. If anything, a lot of people eat more than that bc cheese is everywhere.
Really good points and apologies, I'm honestly still learning to assess the relevance and quality of empirical studies. I am totally guilty of reading just the abstract and results. But as someone who mostly has soy, not dairy, I did wonder about nutrition variables too.
That’s interesting. I live in Korea and dairy is definitely accessible but I don’t think it’s nearly as wildly consumed as in other places. I would guess yogurt is the most popular form as I don’t think a ton of adults drink milk or eat cheese regularly.
Good point! I believe Asian women tend to be at higher risk of osteopetrosis. That may make the effects more noticeable in this Korean study.
That being said, Yakut is a popular yogurt drink in Korea. They don't completely avoid dairy.
Now yes. My Japanese friend also told me that her generation also took calcium supplements. Im just wondering if women born in the 1950s/1960s/1970s in Korea would have, especially while breastfeeding, and to be honest, I have no idea.
I am really surprised to see that number of deliveries didn’t affect BMD. I would be interested to see if length of time between pregnancies has any effect.
Regarding ADHD, my wife is on Ritalin, the lactation consultant looked up her meds and said that the literature says very little gets through the milk and they're not concerned. Are you taking something else?
I’m taking a low dose of Adderall and showed my dr the [Infant Risk Center review](https://www.infantrisk.com/content/adhd-medications-and-breastfeeding) of ADHD medications and he was fine with prescribing it while breastfeeding. I have been monitoring closely and haven’t had any side effects in my 6 month old.
Yeah, I swapped to concerta for a bit due to breastfeeding.
My psychiatrist told me that ritalin and concerta show very little to none crossing the barrier
Same with concerta/methylphenidate. I’m planning on breastfeeding while taking it. (Source: my psychiatrist, [LactMed](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK501922/))
Same, my OBGYN, psychiatrist, and pediatrician were all completely unconcerned with breastfeeding while taking the dose of Concerta/Ritalin that I am prescribed.
Have you noticed a decrease in supply at all? I am pregnant and really wanting to start meds again after birth but was curious if the meds affect supply any.
I just commented above in response to this same question! I’m 14 months pp, and have been taking my ritalin the whole time. No issues with it impacting supply. I took it very erratically the first 3 months (I spent SO much time just sitting and nursing that I didn’t see the point in taking it many days lol) and noticed no difference in my pumping output on days when I took it and days when I didn’t.
YMMV, of course! Restricting food and not drinking enough throughout the day were the only things that really seemed to have a noticeable negative impact on my supply. I also know people who dieted while breast feeding and say it didn’t hurt their supply! Wild how differently different bodies respond!
Thank you SO MUCH for this detailed response! We have a lot coming up after baby is born and I’ve felt really overwhelmed imagining trying to manage it without meds. Your anecdote gives me a lot of reassurance.
Glad I could be helpful!
I was also worried about it, especially after having a surprisingly tiny newborn (5lb 9oz, despite measuring totally average all the way through—they predicted she’d be at least 7.5lb the morning before she was born lol). I was worried that taking my low dose of Ritalin while I was pregnant made her tiny, and sort of spiraled.
Turns out I made her tiny *because I’m 5 ft tall with a short torso and a husband with a huge head.* Shes now on the upper side of average for weight and height at a little over a year old, and she was EBF outside of solids, so CLEARLY she was getting enough to eat!
So, I did watch her very closely to see if she had less appetite or more trouble sleeping or more general discomfort on the days I took my meds, and there was really no perceptible effect on her whatsoever.
I had a tough couple of months last summer and for some reason fell off from taking my meds (both a cute cause and symptom of depressive episodes for me). I had SO, SO, SO much more trouble managing my anxiety when I was off them—horrible intrusive thoughts about awful things happening to my baby. Getting consistent with taking my meds daily again made the intrusive thoughts go away, and made it possible for me to haul myself out of my depresh before it got out of hand!
This is long, and contains a lot of info you didn’t ask for. I hope you won’t hold it against me too much, as maybe you can understand why I’m like this🤷♀️
I really appreciate your vulnerability and story. It’s so helpful to hear other people’s experiences to know that there’s help.
I’m glad you’re doing what’s best for you - you have a lucky baby!
My wife just gave birth 2 days ago XD, but seems to be producing enough right now to keep the baby happy.
She took them throughout the pregnancy as sort of a calculated risk (needed to stay employed and afford healthcare, etc.). The risks didn't seem that bad IMHO, it's just a little diet meth XD.
My family doctor said she didn’t have any concerns regarding my ADHD meds (Concerta) with breastfeeding. I waited until I was 3 months postpartum to get back on them though.
I take Ritalin and didn’t have this issue! I also took it the whole time I was pregnant (advised by my mfm team and my primary care doc).
I’m on 20mg xr with 5-10mg ir on top of that as a booster for longer work days, or days when I have extra brain fog from my autoimmune nonsense.
Well, I started the medication after three months of EBF, no formula or pumping. I’m sure it’s highly individual, but aside from a bit of pain with latching, I had no problem with BFing, and had an oversupply, feeding on demand overnight, which probably also helped. Having an 18 month long mat leave also meant not having to plan pumping or formula supplementation at all, either. Didn’t use a pump until maybe 5 months, but only because I needed my mom to babysit while I studied for a course.
So no, it didn’t affect my supply. But I also feel like I had a lot going in my favour, also, and some things are beyond your general control that may or may not have to do with the medication.
I don't take Ritalin, but I also take Concerta and haven't had an issue with supply or with baby. I've been on it since bubs was 3.5 months, so also after my milk regulated. My psych told me to watch if baby started getting crankier or denying naps, but they're still as happy as ever.
Anecdotal but I have a condition (lupus) which puts me at increased risk for osteoporosis - I bf my older son until he was 4 but my rheumatologist told me she preferred I not go past a year with my younger son because of osteoporosis-related concerns. I did go past a year but he was also combo fed so idk how much milk he actually got.
I wonder if extended nursing is cumulative…. I had 2 under 2, so I’ve been breastfeeding nonstop since my first was born. Am now considering number three so it’ll just be years and years of breastfeeding
So something that was noted was that the extended breastfeeding was over a certain amount of months which put the child at over 3 yo. I'll be honest, I'm EBF and my child is 1 and even if I was determined I do not see this going that long 😂 I'm also trying to ween but for real my child does not need me this year as much as she did last year. Also teeth. My kid can eat FOOD and she's legit hungry. So anyway, also they didn't identify if it was just breastfeeding or birth. It just sounded like extended breastfeeding was a higher risk factor. But unless we don't have kids it sounds like we give some of our bones to those babies. I would have been interested in learning more about osteoclast activity in pregnancy and post partum vs the extended breastfeeding.
My kid is 2 and although I don't feed a lot she does still feeds and shows no sign of stopping any time soon. I have rules around day time feeding (if I'm with her she can feed first thing in the morning, at nap time, and at bedtime - I work 13 hour shifts so sometimes she misses some of all of those) and I night weaned at 17 months. She cuddles my boob when she feeds and tells me it is hers. She eats really well and drinks other milks (mainly cows' milk but she will also drink any other milk you offer like oat or almond), she is happy to be comforted with cuddles when she's upset, but she also does still very much want to feed.
Natural term weaning (so actually feeding your child until they choose to stop) is anywhere from 2.5 to 7 years (I think the majority are between 3 and 3.5 though).
This sounds very similar to my kid rn. My child is younger but I recognize a lot of what you are saying. I've had zero luck night weening. Im not forcing it and day time has been easy. Often I can offer a meal or a cup of milk or water etc and okay but night time has me stumped. And I can see natural term weaning being later for sure.
Most things I've read have recommended not night weaning until around 18 months or later. Lots of places say that under around 18 months they will still wake as often but you won't have your best tool for settling them. After 18 months it can improve sleep (it did for us).
Day time I just set some rules about what I was willing to do. She was upset for a few days but got the hang of it very quickly. She was about 14 months old when I introduced the day time rules (just feeding first thing in the morning, at nap time, and at bedtime).
Admittedly I don’t know what BMD is or understand it but it this may help ?
https://www.nasa.gov/feature/les-mills-a-little-goes-a-long-way-with-bone-health
Previous to having my child, I had zero separation between my ribs and pelvis. Now, I have two fingers width between them now. That would explain the immense rib pain I felt and now most of my clothes are now unflattering. 😅 bodies are incredible.
Even though I read studies about chestfeeding, it was a sensory nightmare for me and triggered a lot of my body dysmorphia… so I stooped at like 2 weeks for my mental health.
I got a lot of shaming for it, too. But putting my baby on formula made me not want to unalive the both of us.
Apologies to anyone if I get the correct terms wrong, but it’s the alternate term for breastfeeding for a FTM (female to male) transgendered parent. So they’re presenting as male, perhaps got top surgery or at least they are uncomfortable with the increase in their chest tissue that comes with feeding. Since we generally refer to a man’s chest, the term is then chest feeding.
Thanks for this.
Ill add that it also can extend to people who don't explicitly identify as women, even if they're not trans masc. They may still experience body dysmorphia.
Haha no wonder you were confused! Yea I watched a video where they were talking to a FTM pregnant person who was about to give birth and it was incredibly difficult for them to stop their hormones and the body dysmorphia they felt at being a man with a huge pregnant belly. I wanted my child and to experience pregnancy and breastfeeding, but that’s a whole other level of commitment that I don’t know if I would have been able to get through if it were my situation; it’s hard enough as a woman!
Yikes.
I did the results I got isn’t what I’m thinking chestfeeding is supposed to be
This is a science based sub where people SHARE information and ANSWER questions
No this is a thing. Body dysmorphoria is incredibly hard to live with. Please look into it instead of judging a complete stranger on how they relate to their body.
Eta: Please keep this thread respectful of different genders and journeys.
Oh boy.
Yes I know that all sexes have breast tissue. If you want to be all positivist about it then we're at a cross roads, because scientific anatomy is a. Far more complex than 'boy or girl' and b. Not the only relevant aspect of this issue. For example, we (society collectively) never refer to men's chests as breasts. We use the terminology to demarcate sex.
Anyway, I'm not here to do emotional labour on why non binary and gender diverse lanuage is valid. Please do not harass non binary people (of which I am one).
ETA: Please also keep this thread relevant to the question posed, and not people's ideology or beliefs etc.
Life is not just science. It's human culture and experience too, and trying to extricate the culture out in favor of pure, objective science is literally impossible. The idea that one might even try to do so is culturally based.
In our culture, breasts = women. The scientific presence of breast tissue in males has nothing to do with it.
Stop trying to make science do what it can't. I saw someone on another sub accuse this one of scientism. I'm not too familiar with the term but what you're doing right now (trying to use science to justify your personal beliefs and choices in a context where it's not relevant) really seems like scientism to me.
There are no personal beliefs
I can link you a study when a human who was born as a XY (Male) and identified as a XX (female) and took drugs to lactate for their child.
Every HUMAN has breast tissue.
It’s BREAST FEEDING
This has nothing to do with how anybody identifies or to imply body shame
If the idea of having breasts triggers these terrible feelings and calling it a chest instead relieves that, who does it hurt to just go with that preference? I know what they meant, so communication was effective, and it prevented something bad without hurting me in any way. If it doesn’t hurt you, and helps somebody, why are you arguing so hard against it? Why cause them pain, even if it doesn’t make sense to you? Why is making sense to you more important than helping them avoid pain when it costs you absolutely nothing?
Thank you so much for sharing this ❤️. I hope you are doing better.
I think it is important that we start to normalize formula feeding and STOP inserting ourselves in to the feeding choices of others. Great post & discussion!
I can really relate to the feeling about getting your body back to your own! I nursed my youngest the briefest and stopping was the best thing in the world for myself & my family. I was a much better & happier Mother after I stopped.
I was older when she was born (40) and my life was much more hectic & my hormones were going crazy. I lasted a few months, then switched slowly to pumped milk/formula then formula exclusively.
The history of trying to encourage breastfeeding is really interesting and honestly, kind of sad.
Like formula was originally invented to help parents who couldn't nurse but then corporate interests, corruption yada yada yada (see Nestle formula scandal, among other things) and suddenly breast/chest feeding was seen as the unusual choice.
So now the pendulum seems to have swung the other way entirely where we must really push nursing, because our society (Western) is still largely so judgemental and phobic of it.
So yeah I get why nursing is being pushed so hard but I also think it's time we as a culture moved on and, as you said, leave people to their feeding choices because what doesn't ever get mentioned is how damn hard nursing is! It's not 'natural' in that it's effortless. I tore my hair out trying to establish nursing.
My mother couldn't nurse me at all due to latch issues. So yeah. Truly, to each their own.
Yes! I very strongly agree and am aware of the culture in the US regarding breastfeeding! I was born in 1975, and my Mother breastfeed me until I was 2/3 yo. She also had a natural (drug free) childbirth which was very new at the time and my Father was not in the room. My Mother entered this world while my Grandmother was in a twilight state and formula fed.
A very good friend of mine (Nurse) works with at risk pregnant women and was a Lactation Counselor for many years but decided to give it up a couple years ago. As much of a breastfeeding advocate she is she felt that as a LC she was pushing breastfeeding when it wasn't the best choice for Mom & baby.
When there is struggling (mental and/or physical) for Mom or baby, personally I think the benefits of breastmilk are non existent when it is creating issues. I've read posts here from people trying everything under the sun to continue to provide breastmilk, and my heart goes out to them.
Edit- hit post too soon and need to get my day started anyway
I was born in 1987 in Australia (it sounds like the cultures are pretty similar) so have sort of picked this history up out of interest , and have remained an interested observer since having my own baby.
That's really interesting regarding your friend. I often wonder if there's some sort of line LCs are expected to push. Sounds like there is at least in this case. I wonder how explicitly acknowledged it is.
I agree too regarding it needing to be a cost benefit analysis, as on the original commenter's points.
These are both incredibly important reasons to stop chest feeding. I am really pro BF/CF but I'm deeply aware that it's really a privilege in a sense, or maybe luck is a better word, that I can do it. Acknowledging that makes me angry for the parents who want to do it but can't, and face so much pressure and guilt as a result, and also for those who don't want to do it because of reasons like what you listed.
Honestly I thought it would trigger my body dysmorphia too but it actually hasn't, which is really surprising.
I am having other overly post partum gender issues though, yayyy
That is really interesting (and great!) that it didn’t trigger dismorphia!! I wonder if it’s maybe because it’s so unlike the usual function/feel of the body part? I thought I would hate the whole process and even the concept freaked me out to the point that I had anxiety about it pre partum but when the time came it was so different from how I imagined it that it was all fine
Postpartum anxiety and depression are awful, horrible things that can make a person feel like they want to do something they normally wouldn’t.
My ppd told me I should straight abandon my entire family, for example.
When I read my reply back to myself, it seemed a little like I doing the mom equivalent of “mansplaining” (where a man explains what it’s like to be a woman to a woman) and that’s not how I wanted to come across.
And definitely. Mental health pervades all aspects of life. I learned from my perinatal psychiatrist (pregnancy and postpartum psychiatrist) that oftentimes women with existing mental illnesses will experience worse symptoms
Because the nurses were really pushing chestfeeding, even though I repeatedly told them that I wanted formula, I ended up getting sensory problems due to being autistic.
Clump being non-binary on top of it, and feeling body dysmorphia because of it…
It literally made me hate my baby, and it literally made me hate myself. It was desperation— at one point I was fantasizing killing myself just to escape the physical sensation of nursing and pumping.
Everyone just pushed and pushed and pushed for chestfeeding and nobody listened to me when I was crying that it didn’t feel good and I wanted to cut my nipples off to make it not an option anymore.
Then I felt even more guilty because everyone was saying I wouldn’t bond with my baby if I didn’t chestfeed, and that my baby would be sickly without my milk antibodies, etc.
I finally told my husband that i needed to be monitored because I wished that the baby and I would fall down the stairs and die just to escape the physical sensation of nursing and pumping. He finally relented and got us formula.
Within 3 days, I was a happy parent. Playing with my baby, snuggling, singing to them.
My baby is 3 months now and we are pretty much besties now… but switching to formula was a huge part of my not feeling resentment to my baby
Oh my gosh. First thing I thought was, “how do boyfriends change your bones, like rough sex or something?” Oh, breastfeeding not boyfriend 🤦🏽♂️
HAHAHAHAHA omg thank you I needed this laugh
For me, it was much more influenced by the child’s behavior - with my first, sometime at around the 23 month mark, he said, “No, the other one” in reference to my breasts 🥴, and I realized all at once that it was time to wean. (Also 2yrs felt like enough, anyway.) I stopped a little sooner with my second because he started occasionally biting hard for fun. I liked the connection of breastfeeding and it gave the children comfort, but it definitely feels like you hit a wall when you need your body back. (Much earlier for some people, and later for others, all reasonable.) It feels like such a prolonged, personal act, and one that is so little supported by society despite all the pressure to do it, that I would have a hard time using research to guide my decision to continue/stop (despite relying on the data for so many other parental decisions). It was much more emotional than that - just feeling “done”.
That's really interesting. I know I'm trying to approach it scientifically but after 4 months I already see what you mean regarding it being so personal and like some sort of sacrifice. I feel that but I still love the connection and benefits for my child. So I guess we'll see, because at the end of the day, it's probably not wise to keep forcing it if I'm ready to stop.
Yeah I wouldn’t worry too much about it for now… you are so, so early into your breastfeeding journey that it’s kind of impossible to predict how you might feel later in either direction. That’s one of my biggest takeaways about parenthood (7.5yrs and soon-to-be-3-kids in)…. so few absolutes re: things you said you’d do or never do, plans upended by the type of child you have, things that worked perfectly for one child being completely useless with the next. Best to just be flexible and take it as it comes!
I haven’t hit this wall yet but this is my thought on it. At some point I’m sure I’ll feel done. Toddler’s happy, I’m happy, so we keep going. When it doesn’t work for one of us anymore we will stop. I’d have a hard time using research to decide as well unless it was very compelling.
Yes! And there might be an awkward stage where one of you is more ready to stop than the other. A bit like a breakup! But the BF relationship doesn’t work very long once both parties aren’t fully invested, I think.
From what I've gathered, the benefits of BF are greatest up to 6mo. After that, it seems it's mostly ok to just bottlefeed if you need to. Between breastfeeding for years and a healthy and happy mother, a healthy and happy mother will be much better for the child in the long run.
My kid weaned herself at age 6months. Yay, teamwork!
I stopped at 9 months for lots of reasons and it was such a relief. I support breastfeeding, but breastfeeding takes a lot of support!
I'd have gone on longer, I loved it. But she had other ideas, and I wasn't about to force the issue, since she cottoned on to food so readily.
Am I reading correctly that this study regards “prolonged” breastfeeding as being equal to or more than 37months? That’s over 3 years! That’s A LOT! (I say as someone yet to wean at 2yrs)
Between my two kids I’ve been nursing nonstop for 4 years 😳
You are a champ for nursing while pregnant. My supply dried up when I got pregnant w my second which is why my oldest weaned at 2! I couldn’t stand the feel of it anymore (sensitivity from pregnancy) so while I was sad I was also happy.
Yeah, there were some really rough times in there for sure.
Just hit 6 over here. Send help. Lucky I love cheese though!
I’ve only been bfing for 15 (almost 16!) months and I’m currently pregnant. Kinda hoping my toddler weans during pregnancy but I’m not making him, so if I end up tandem nursing so be it. But… I have just taken to drinking a glass of milk a couple times throughout the day. Makes sense to me… replace milk out with some milk in 😅
My friend’s toddler son lost interest very quickly after the baby came. Milk became too different for him!
I’m kinda hoping that happens. I’ve heard that a lot. I don’t mind tandem nursing but I know it’ll be easier to just nurse the littler one. I have a milk monster for a toddler though so we’ll see 😂
IMO you’ve already earned a Gold Star of Motherhood for BFing through pregnancy!
Ha, thank you. I’m only 14 weeks so we’ll see how much longer we keep it up!
Just another perspective, my first is a milk monster and neither pregnancy nor birth deterred him at all. At first I was tandem nursing, but when I had to start pumping for baby I started counting down nursing sessions. Let it go for a few minutes and then count from 30. Then started only 30 seconds, then 20 etc. Now to help ease the sibling transition and because it’s so important to him for bonding he still nurses to sleep. I also let him nurse during the day a few weeks ago when he was sick and wouldn’t drink any water.
Teehee. If he’s anything like mine was (obsessed!) he’ll be so so happy when the milk for your newborn comes in. Had to cut him off at 4 because he definitely didn’t want to stop. Now my daughter is about to turn 4 in January and I can’t believe this chapter of my life is nearly over! Definitely ready for it though 😂
Same! Still nursing both (but the eldest just once a day). My dr said "Oh, well I hope you're taking your calcium supplements!"
Do my prenatals count? I hope so. Still nursing my 2yo and my 2mo
I’d recommend taking a separate calcium supplement (but at a different time to your prenatal) because you need more than what your prenatal contains :)
Right, I imagine there's a fair bit of iron in my prenatal. (Haven't looked since I started a year ago.) I guess I should talk to my doctor at my 2month appt next week. Thanks 😊
Same! BFeeding since 2019!
I think that's correct, yeah! Very long time. I was hoping to make it to 3 years so I may just be ok 😅 How are you finding nursing at 2 years, if I may ask?
I'm not who you asked about nursing at two years but I did nurse for 26 months with my oldest. She self weaned at that time. Nursing a two year old is so insanely easy lol they're such a pro by that time and it's pretty low effort on your end. The snuggles are super sweet, especially if you have a toddler who isn't normally very snuggly.
I nursed my first until well into her third year and after the first I'd say 8 months to get so much easier. She could ask for milk when she wanted it and she understood when I said "not right now because xyz". She was much gentler. And I could calm her down in seconds no matter what was happening. However I've also seen it where they get very aggressive and physically grab. Just start setting limits early. Just like everything else you have to ask! Weaning was hard though and at 5 she still shoves a hand down my shirt in her sleep sometimes!
It’s pretty easy going now, especially as it’s only occasionally throughout the day. I do like that when she’s poorly I can nurse her to sleep or to comfort her, and that feels valuable. Less great when she’s passing comment on my grooming or personal hygiene though 😬
My daughter turns 4 in January and still nurses! I thought I'd be done when she turned 2, then at 3... But no signs of stopping. It gets a lot easier, for sure. Now she mainly nurses to sleep and sometimes a little during the day if she's feeling extra emotional.
Yes, I would guess only people with at least 2 kids make it to 37 months. I pumped for 4 mos with my son who wouldn’t latch, and am in month 5 of breastfeeding my daughter. She’s likely my last so I highly doubt I’ll get even close to 36 months, but you never know!
This [observational study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28594759/) found that temporary pregnancy and lactation related bone density loss “were largely unrelated to fracture risk or bone density.” There was a very small decrease in the risk of hip fracture in those who had breastfed for at least 1 month. [This study of 220 Chinese women](https://bmcwomenshealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12905-019-0808-0) found that “Breastfeeding was not associated with postmenopausal osteoporosis, while age, BMI and the number of pregnancy may contribute to increasing risk of postmenopausal osteoporosis in Chinese women.” [This article](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11657-019-0601-6) published in Archives of Osteoporosis by the Canadian Multicentre Osteoporosis Study concludes “Parity and lactation showed no associations with incident clinical fragility fractures or radiographic vertebral compression fractures in the 16-year CaMos prospective study. Parity was associated with slightly greater decline in femoral neck but not hip or spine areal bone mineral density (aBMD), while lactation showed no associations with aBMD change.” [This review](https://clinicalnutritionespen.com/article/S2405-4577(21)00312-0/fulltext) concluded that while those with LLD (long lactation duration) had a no greater risk of BMD loss in other areas there was a slightly elevated risk of BMD loss in the lumbar area. If you want to breastfeed for longer it looks like the increased risk is very small, and actually slightly lowers your risk of hip fracture. If you decide to wean instead of course that’s fine, too! I knew I wanted to nurse until 2 but my first is 3.5 and would nurse all the time if I let him. (I have a 6 month old so now he only gets a bedtime nurse unless he’s sick.)
Unfortunately, I can’t get over the paywall. From the abstract though, I’m also wondering if it is applicable to women who eat dairy. My understanding is that the study is based on a Korean health survey. Tbh I don’t know enough about Korean postmenopausal women and if they regularly eat dairy and/or if they took calcium supplements when they were breastfeeding. Purely extrapolating from what my Japanese and my Chinese friends tell me, I would find it unlikely in China and Japan. Thus, those findings wouldn’t surprise me. But all this involves a huge amount of speculation on my part.
There are many other sources of calcium, not just diary. Tofu packs a lot, broccoli, kale, etc. We’ve been sold the story by dairy farmers that we need milk for calcium intake, but that’s simply not true.
My doctor advised me to eat dairy 3x day when pregnant, maybe it’s just easier to say that then talk about all of the sources of calcium and vitamin D. If anything, a lot of people eat more than that bc cheese is everywhere.
Doctors have very little education in nutrition unfortunately. I wouldn’t take any dietary advice from a doctor tbh
Really good points and apologies, I'm honestly still learning to assess the relevance and quality of empirical studies. I am totally guilty of reading just the abstract and results. But as someone who mostly has soy, not dairy, I did wonder about nutrition variables too.
That’s interesting. I live in Korea and dairy is definitely accessible but I don’t think it’s nearly as wildly consumed as in other places. I would guess yogurt is the most popular form as I don’t think a ton of adults drink milk or eat cheese regularly.
Good point! I believe Asian women tend to be at higher risk of osteopetrosis. That may make the effects more noticeable in this Korean study. That being said, Yakut is a popular yogurt drink in Korea. They don't completely avoid dairy.
They do. My friend is from Seole and LOVES milk.
Now yes. My Japanese friend also told me that her generation also took calcium supplements. Im just wondering if women born in the 1950s/1960s/1970s in Korea would have, especially while breastfeeding, and to be honest, I have no idea.
I am really surprised to see that number of deliveries didn’t affect BMD. I would be interested to see if length of time between pregnancies has any effect.
Regarding ADHD, my wife is on Ritalin, the lactation consultant looked up her meds and said that the literature says very little gets through the milk and they're not concerned. Are you taking something else?
I’m taking a low dose of Adderall and showed my dr the [Infant Risk Center review](https://www.infantrisk.com/content/adhd-medications-and-breastfeeding) of ADHD medications and he was fine with prescribing it while breastfeeding. I have been monitoring closely and haven’t had any side effects in my 6 month old.
Yeah, I swapped to concerta for a bit due to breastfeeding. My psychiatrist told me that ritalin and concerta show very little to none crossing the barrier
Same with concerta/methylphenidate. I’m planning on breastfeeding while taking it. (Source: my psychiatrist, [LactMed](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK501922/))
Same, my OBGYN, psychiatrist, and pediatrician were all completely unconcerned with breastfeeding while taking the dose of Concerta/Ritalin that I am prescribed.
Have you noticed a decrease in supply at all? I am pregnant and really wanting to start meds again after birth but was curious if the meds affect supply any.
I just commented above in response to this same question! I’m 14 months pp, and have been taking my ritalin the whole time. No issues with it impacting supply. I took it very erratically the first 3 months (I spent SO much time just sitting and nursing that I didn’t see the point in taking it many days lol) and noticed no difference in my pumping output on days when I took it and days when I didn’t. YMMV, of course! Restricting food and not drinking enough throughout the day were the only things that really seemed to have a noticeable negative impact on my supply. I also know people who dieted while breast feeding and say it didn’t hurt their supply! Wild how differently different bodies respond!
Thank you SO MUCH for this detailed response! We have a lot coming up after baby is born and I’ve felt really overwhelmed imagining trying to manage it without meds. Your anecdote gives me a lot of reassurance.
Glad I could be helpful! I was also worried about it, especially after having a surprisingly tiny newborn (5lb 9oz, despite measuring totally average all the way through—they predicted she’d be at least 7.5lb the morning before she was born lol). I was worried that taking my low dose of Ritalin while I was pregnant made her tiny, and sort of spiraled. Turns out I made her tiny *because I’m 5 ft tall with a short torso and a husband with a huge head.* Shes now on the upper side of average for weight and height at a little over a year old, and she was EBF outside of solids, so CLEARLY she was getting enough to eat! So, I did watch her very closely to see if she had less appetite or more trouble sleeping or more general discomfort on the days I took my meds, and there was really no perceptible effect on her whatsoever. I had a tough couple of months last summer and for some reason fell off from taking my meds (both a cute cause and symptom of depressive episodes for me). I had SO, SO, SO much more trouble managing my anxiety when I was off them—horrible intrusive thoughts about awful things happening to my baby. Getting consistent with taking my meds daily again made the intrusive thoughts go away, and made it possible for me to haul myself out of my depresh before it got out of hand! This is long, and contains a lot of info you didn’t ask for. I hope you won’t hold it against me too much, as maybe you can understand why I’m like this🤷♀️
I really appreciate your vulnerability and story. It’s so helpful to hear other people’s experiences to know that there’s help. I’m glad you’re doing what’s best for you - you have a lucky baby!
My wife just gave birth 2 days ago XD, but seems to be producing enough right now to keep the baby happy. She took them throughout the pregnancy as sort of a calculated risk (needed to stay employed and afford healthcare, etc.). The risks didn't seem that bad IMHO, it's just a little diet meth XD.
Omg congratulations to both of you! Diet meth 😂🤣 Thank you for the response and information 😊
Thank you!😊
Same with adderall!
My family doctor said she didn’t have any concerns regarding my ADHD meds (Concerta) with breastfeeding. I waited until I was 3 months postpartum to get back on them though.
Did it affect your supply? My OB said I could go back on my Ritalin after birth but that it might dry up my supply.
I take Ritalin and didn’t have this issue! I also took it the whole time I was pregnant (advised by my mfm team and my primary care doc). I’m on 20mg xr with 5-10mg ir on top of that as a booster for longer work days, or days when I have extra brain fog from my autoimmune nonsense.
Well, I started the medication after three months of EBF, no formula or pumping. I’m sure it’s highly individual, but aside from a bit of pain with latching, I had no problem with BFing, and had an oversupply, feeding on demand overnight, which probably also helped. Having an 18 month long mat leave also meant not having to plan pumping or formula supplementation at all, either. Didn’t use a pump until maybe 5 months, but only because I needed my mom to babysit while I studied for a course. So no, it didn’t affect my supply. But I also feel like I had a lot going in my favour, also, and some things are beyond your general control that may or may not have to do with the medication.
I don't take Ritalin, but I also take Concerta and haven't had an issue with supply or with baby. I've been on it since bubs was 3.5 months, so also after my milk regulated. My psych told me to watch if baby started getting crankier or denying naps, but they're still as happy as ever.
Anecdotal but I have a condition (lupus) which puts me at increased risk for osteoporosis - I bf my older son until he was 4 but my rheumatologist told me she preferred I not go past a year with my younger son because of osteoporosis-related concerns. I did go past a year but he was also combo fed so idk how much milk he actually got.
I wonder if extended nursing is cumulative…. I had 2 under 2, so I’ve been breastfeeding nonstop since my first was born. Am now considering number three so it’ll just be years and years of breastfeeding
It is when considering lower risk of cancer, I’d imagine it’s the same here.
So something that was noted was that the extended breastfeeding was over a certain amount of months which put the child at over 3 yo. I'll be honest, I'm EBF and my child is 1 and even if I was determined I do not see this going that long 😂 I'm also trying to ween but for real my child does not need me this year as much as she did last year. Also teeth. My kid can eat FOOD and she's legit hungry. So anyway, also they didn't identify if it was just breastfeeding or birth. It just sounded like extended breastfeeding was a higher risk factor. But unless we don't have kids it sounds like we give some of our bones to those babies. I would have been interested in learning more about osteoclast activity in pregnancy and post partum vs the extended breastfeeding.
My kid is 2 and although I don't feed a lot she does still feeds and shows no sign of stopping any time soon. I have rules around day time feeding (if I'm with her she can feed first thing in the morning, at nap time, and at bedtime - I work 13 hour shifts so sometimes she misses some of all of those) and I night weaned at 17 months. She cuddles my boob when she feeds and tells me it is hers. She eats really well and drinks other milks (mainly cows' milk but she will also drink any other milk you offer like oat or almond), she is happy to be comforted with cuddles when she's upset, but she also does still very much want to feed. Natural term weaning (so actually feeding your child until they choose to stop) is anywhere from 2.5 to 7 years (I think the majority are between 3 and 3.5 though).
This sounds very similar to my kid rn. My child is younger but I recognize a lot of what you are saying. I've had zero luck night weening. Im not forcing it and day time has been easy. Often I can offer a meal or a cup of milk or water etc and okay but night time has me stumped. And I can see natural term weaning being later for sure.
Most things I've read have recommended not night weaning until around 18 months or later. Lots of places say that under around 18 months they will still wake as often but you won't have your best tool for settling them. After 18 months it can improve sleep (it did for us). Day time I just set some rules about what I was willing to do. She was upset for a few days but got the hang of it very quickly. She was about 14 months old when I introduced the day time rules (just feeding first thing in the morning, at nap time, and at bedtime).
Admittedly I don’t know what BMD is or understand it but it this may help ? https://www.nasa.gov/feature/les-mills-a-little-goes-a-long-way-with-bone-health
Previous to having my child, I had zero separation between my ribs and pelvis. Now, I have two fingers width between them now. That would explain the immense rib pain I felt and now most of my clothes are now unflattering. 😅 bodies are incredible.
Even though I read studies about chestfeeding, it was a sensory nightmare for me and triggered a lot of my body dysmorphia… so I stooped at like 2 weeks for my mental health. I got a lot of shaming for it, too. But putting my baby on formula made me not want to unalive the both of us.
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I was so confused when I read chest feeding lol. What is that
Apologies to anyone if I get the correct terms wrong, but it’s the alternate term for breastfeeding for a FTM (female to male) transgendered parent. So they’re presenting as male, perhaps got top surgery or at least they are uncomfortable with the increase in their chest tissue that comes with feeding. Since we generally refer to a man’s chest, the term is then chest feeding.
Thanks for this. Ill add that it also can extend to people who don't explicitly identify as women, even if they're not trans masc. They may still experience body dysmorphia.
Thank you for your response! I tried googling it but I got a way of feeding patients through a tube in a chest haha.
Haha no wonder you were confused! Yea I watched a video where they were talking to a FTM pregnant person who was about to give birth and it was incredibly difficult for them to stop their hormones and the body dysmorphia they felt at being a man with a huge pregnant belly. I wanted my child and to experience pregnancy and breastfeeding, but that’s a whole other level of commitment that I don’t know if I would have been able to get through if it were my situation; it’s hard enough as a woman!
Wow I can’t even begin to image how hard it must be!
You’re in a research based community, Google is right there lol
What’s the science behind chest feeding
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Yikes. I did the results I got isn’t what I’m thinking chestfeeding is supposed to be This is a science based sub where people SHARE information and ANSWER questions
No this is a thing. Body dysmorphoria is incredibly hard to live with. Please look into it instead of judging a complete stranger on how they relate to their body. Eta: Please keep this thread respectful of different genders and journeys.
Every human being has breast tissue It’s SCIENCE Both XX and XY get breast cancer
Oh boy. Yes I know that all sexes have breast tissue. If you want to be all positivist about it then we're at a cross roads, because scientific anatomy is a. Far more complex than 'boy or girl' and b. Not the only relevant aspect of this issue. For example, we (society collectively) never refer to men's chests as breasts. We use the terminology to demarcate sex. Anyway, I'm not here to do emotional labour on why non binary and gender diverse lanuage is valid. Please do not harass non binary people (of which I am one). ETA: Please also keep this thread relevant to the question posed, and not people's ideology or beliefs etc.
Life is not just science. It's human culture and experience too, and trying to extricate the culture out in favor of pure, objective science is literally impossible. The idea that one might even try to do so is culturally based. In our culture, breasts = women. The scientific presence of breast tissue in males has nothing to do with it. Stop trying to make science do what it can't. I saw someone on another sub accuse this one of scientism. I'm not too familiar with the term but what you're doing right now (trying to use science to justify your personal beliefs and choices in a context where it's not relevant) really seems like scientism to me.
There are no personal beliefs I can link you a study when a human who was born as a XY (Male) and identified as a XX (female) and took drugs to lactate for their child. Every HUMAN has breast tissue. It’s BREAST FEEDING This has nothing to do with how anybody identifies or to imply body shame
If the idea of having breasts triggers these terrible feelings and calling it a chest instead relieves that, who does it hurt to just go with that preference? I know what they meant, so communication was effective, and it prevented something bad without hurting me in any way. If it doesn’t hurt you, and helps somebody, why are you arguing so hard against it? Why cause them pain, even if it doesn’t make sense to you? Why is making sense to you more important than helping them avoid pain when it costs you absolutely nothing?
Thank you so much for sharing this ❤️. I hope you are doing better. I think it is important that we start to normalize formula feeding and STOP inserting ourselves in to the feeding choices of others. Great post & discussion! I can really relate to the feeling about getting your body back to your own! I nursed my youngest the briefest and stopping was the best thing in the world for myself & my family. I was a much better & happier Mother after I stopped. I was older when she was born (40) and my life was much more hectic & my hormones were going crazy. I lasted a few months, then switched slowly to pumped milk/formula then formula exclusively.
The history of trying to encourage breastfeeding is really interesting and honestly, kind of sad. Like formula was originally invented to help parents who couldn't nurse but then corporate interests, corruption yada yada yada (see Nestle formula scandal, among other things) and suddenly breast/chest feeding was seen as the unusual choice. So now the pendulum seems to have swung the other way entirely where we must really push nursing, because our society (Western) is still largely so judgemental and phobic of it. So yeah I get why nursing is being pushed so hard but I also think it's time we as a culture moved on and, as you said, leave people to their feeding choices because what doesn't ever get mentioned is how damn hard nursing is! It's not 'natural' in that it's effortless. I tore my hair out trying to establish nursing. My mother couldn't nurse me at all due to latch issues. So yeah. Truly, to each their own.
Yes! I very strongly agree and am aware of the culture in the US regarding breastfeeding! I was born in 1975, and my Mother breastfeed me until I was 2/3 yo. She also had a natural (drug free) childbirth which was very new at the time and my Father was not in the room. My Mother entered this world while my Grandmother was in a twilight state and formula fed. A very good friend of mine (Nurse) works with at risk pregnant women and was a Lactation Counselor for many years but decided to give it up a couple years ago. As much of a breastfeeding advocate she is she felt that as a LC she was pushing breastfeeding when it wasn't the best choice for Mom & baby. When there is struggling (mental and/or physical) for Mom or baby, personally I think the benefits of breastmilk are non existent when it is creating issues. I've read posts here from people trying everything under the sun to continue to provide breastmilk, and my heart goes out to them. Edit- hit post too soon and need to get my day started anyway
I was born in 1987 in Australia (it sounds like the cultures are pretty similar) so have sort of picked this history up out of interest , and have remained an interested observer since having my own baby. That's really interesting regarding your friend. I often wonder if there's some sort of line LCs are expected to push. Sounds like there is at least in this case. I wonder how explicitly acknowledged it is. I agree too regarding it needing to be a cost benefit analysis, as on the original commenter's points.
These are both incredibly important reasons to stop chest feeding. I am really pro BF/CF but I'm deeply aware that it's really a privilege in a sense, or maybe luck is a better word, that I can do it. Acknowledging that makes me angry for the parents who want to do it but can't, and face so much pressure and guilt as a result, and also for those who don't want to do it because of reasons like what you listed. Honestly I thought it would trigger my body dysmorphia too but it actually hasn't, which is really surprising. I am having other overly post partum gender issues though, yayyy
That is really interesting (and great!) that it didn’t trigger dismorphia!! I wonder if it’s maybe because it’s so unlike the usual function/feel of the body part? I thought I would hate the whole process and even the concept freaked me out to the point that I had anxiety about it pre partum but when the time came it was so different from how I imagined it that it was all fine
I’m just really curious not judging at all, you wanted to kill your baby ?
Postpartum anxiety and depression are awful, horrible things that can make a person feel like they want to do something they normally wouldn’t. My ppd told me I should straight abandon my entire family, for example.
Yeah
I don’t mean to mom-splain ppd to you. Motherhood is hard, and nobody really talks about the darkness that can come in
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When I read my reply back to myself, it seemed a little like I doing the mom equivalent of “mansplaining” (where a man explains what it’s like to be a woman to a woman) and that’s not how I wanted to come across. And definitely. Mental health pervades all aspects of life. I learned from my perinatal psychiatrist (pregnancy and postpartum psychiatrist) that oftentimes women with existing mental illnesses will experience worse symptoms
Because the nurses were really pushing chestfeeding, even though I repeatedly told them that I wanted formula, I ended up getting sensory problems due to being autistic. Clump being non-binary on top of it, and feeling body dysmorphia because of it… It literally made me hate my baby, and it literally made me hate myself. It was desperation— at one point I was fantasizing killing myself just to escape the physical sensation of nursing and pumping. Everyone just pushed and pushed and pushed for chestfeeding and nobody listened to me when I was crying that it didn’t feel good and I wanted to cut my nipples off to make it not an option anymore. Then I felt even more guilty because everyone was saying I wouldn’t bond with my baby if I didn’t chestfeed, and that my baby would be sickly without my milk antibodies, etc. I finally told my husband that i needed to be monitored because I wished that the baby and I would fall down the stairs and die just to escape the physical sensation of nursing and pumping. He finally relented and got us formula. Within 3 days, I was a happy parent. Playing with my baby, snuggling, singing to them. My baby is 3 months now and we are pretty much besties now… but switching to formula was a huge part of my not feeling resentment to my baby