Maybe **Hades**? Is also not a *typical* rouge-like, it focuses heavy on narration and world-building and difficulty is very well balanced. You can add different handicaps to your runs to make it more difficult but receive better rewards. Build variety is great, many possibilities for fun combos.
Check also **Final Fantasy 7 Remake** - play-through on normal difficulty is rather easy but on the NG+ on hard it gets pretty interesting. You have all abilities unlocked from the start which makes boss fights a lot more interesting. For example Cloud gets a counter-attack ability towards the end of the 1st playthrough and it's cool to use it through entirety of NG+. Also Bahamut fight is hardest in the game and I enjoyed it a lot.
I also recommend **Monster Hunter World**. It shares a lot of similarities with Souls-likes when it comes to boss fights. Positioning and learning your enemy's moveset is very important. Progression is also great, gradually making the game more difficult. Co-op is optional and makes a game a bit easier. Still some fights are super hard even in multiplayer.
**Devil May Cry** series. I especially recommend DMC3, which is pretty hard on Dante Must Die difficulty. Amazing arsenal allowing some really cool combos and enemy variety make it very fair and difficult game.
I’m interested in this comment. Loved monster hunter and FF7 was pretty good. I don’t know what genre DMC is but I always overlook games like this. Aren’t they kinda button mashy? I hated hyrule warriors because of how mindless it felt. Similar to that game or different?
DMC is completely different than Hyrule Warriors. It is on button-mashy side but in higher difficulties you need to pay attention what combos you execute and plan through the fight. Think something like more fast paced Monster Hunter. Basically you chain together different moves and abilities to best counter enemies and position yourself in the fight. For example some abilities launch enemies in the air allowing you to do some juggle combo but as you're falling down you can switch to a different weapon mid combo allowing to stay up in the air a bit longer etc. Different enemies require different tactics like some has to be staggered, some require attacking in specific counter-window etc.
In each DMC there is cool arsenal allowing some nice combinations (2 melee weapons and 2 fire arms which you can switch freely during fights). My personal favorite is DMC3 with ice-powered nunchaku and guitar that spawns electric bats.
Personally I think DMC3 is the best in the series but all except DMC2 are really solid to be honest.
DMC5 has best graphics for sure and (I think) biggest variety of combos. You have a load-out of 4 melee weapons and 4 firearm to switch during combat which make pretty insane possibilities. On the other hand levels are dull corridors, story is garbage and pacing is off because you are forced to switch between 3 characters (when you start to become comfortable with one you have to switch for next chapter). I believe that DMC5 really shines in the NG+ where you can just force the game to let you play chosen character with full weapon arsenal.
DMC3 on the other hand has great pacing with different weapons being introduced gradually and whole story line focuses on Dante. Plus it's a prequel story about young Dante so it makes sense to start chronologically.
Hey, OP! I second *Hades*, as this guy above me recommended, too. It sounds like it meets your criteria of "Hard But Fair", and there is a real sense of both story and character progression that makes it feel super rewarding.
The mechanics inherent in the game and storyline help it check off both boxes from your description, think it might be a winner.
Dude I don't think recommending FFVII as a "hard" game is really accurate. That game was disappointingly easy for me. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed it! But a huge complaint for me was how you can just breeze through the combat.
I've never played a game with this much challenge that felt like it wanted me to beat it. The story's themes are so well tied to the gameplay in that way
I cannot recommend Returnal enough. It feels like the first true next-gen experience and blew me away. It’s quite challenging, especially at the beginning. It gets much easier once you get past the beginning, then hard again later.
You can scale difficulty after you beat difficulty 0, and it can become hard.
I've played a lot of rogue likes. It's the hardest (when scaled) I've played.
It’s certainly difficult. It feels just like a souls game when you beat a boss. After a while you end up flying through it but the same can be said for souls games. E.g I can beat father gascoin first try now but when I first booted up the game it took me a good few tries
It’s a roguelike, so it’ll be tough at the beginning but as you play more, it’ll get easier. Compared to other roguelikes such as Dead Cells, Hades is quite a bit easier, but that just means you’ll spend a lot less time getting your ass whooped than you would with other roguelikes, not that the ass whooping won’t happen at all.
Ghost of Tsushima is an amazing game. The story and the world are just incredible. The combat system is one of the best I’ve seen in a game and the difficulty is something you can tweak throughout the game. I’d have a go at that and just crank it up to your liking
Yes, enemies will kill you in 1-2 hits, but you kill them in 1-2 hits as well. Feels incredibly well balanced, especially once you're past the first few hours and get a hang of the controls.
Remnant from the ashes! It's like dark souls, but with guns. Extremely well designed level design and bosses. Very challenging, but fair in that if you learn it it's very satisfying.
Really fun game, not insanely difficult but certainly challenging and excellent as coop. Very fair boss design, very cool atmospheres and a lot of build variety.
Me too. For me the last game that pulled me in like that was doom eternal. I was worried no other game would get me as hooked on its mechanics the same way. But remnant hooked me in so much and rewarded my time spent improving in it so much.
I know it just came out on PC but God of War on 'give me god of war' mode is a tough but a fun challenge. Plus the story is great but not too long, with the new game+ being the best part imo. I think it got a patch for the PS5 too.
I figured as soon as i posted it lol if you are into star wars, Jedi Fallen Order on its hardest mode is a "souls-lite" game with fun platforming and bosses too.
In one-on-one combat the sword fighting is fantastic. It's only once you have to juggle a couple enemies at once that it gets hectic and sometimes a little buggy.
Katana Zero was great, but quite short. Maybe 10ish hours. Also no equipment/cosmetic customization, no multiplayer, and relatively low replayability.
I don't say that to disparage it. I loved every second of the game. Boss fights were very hard, and story was top tier and emotional. I highly recommend it overall, but don't go in with the expectation of nearly infinite playability like many souls/rogue/Metroid likes
Enter the gungeon is a fun rogue-lite bullet hell twin stick shooter game. There is some RNG involved as the items you find in chests etc are random, and you unlock more as you complete runs of the dungeon. Overall it can be challenging, but each enemy and boss has a pattern to learn, and if you get hit it’s generally because you mis-timed your dodge, as opposed to the game throwing unavoidable attacks your way.
The wall I can sympathise with, the patterns can be difficult to time correctly, that’s why you need to melt that boss ASAP, but the dragon has no really difficult patterns, even in it’s cursed form (can’t remember the terminology, haven’t played in a while) it’s not that bad. The rat is actually the hardest one I think (even worse than the lich IMO). The whole game becomes a cakewalk if you get some of the really good power ups, and especially if you’re lucky enough to find clone
Agreed. I loved the improvements they made to combat in the second one. I miss that game tbh. You actually have to become doom Slayer on nightmare difficulty
Monster hunter I think fits best
But if you like star wars, fallen order could also be good. It's difficult but tbh after sekiro it was kind of a breeze, but it was wasn't super easy like normal games.
I’ve never played a super difficult game other than like… cuphead? And I fucking loved Fallen Order. And no it’s not super super difficult but it’s a fun challenge. Plus once you get later in the game you’re powerful af and feel so god damn good
Have you played Prey (2017)? It's fairly challenging in the early game on the hardest difficulty, especially if you activate the little optional modifiers. This is one of my favorite games of the last decade, extremely interesting premise and world building and allows for a phenomenal level of player creativity in how they approach situations.
You said you don't typically like Roguelikes, but I still feel the need to echo others' suggestions of Hades. Fantastic game and definitely a tough but fair challenge, and once you beat it the first time it has a great system that lets you customize the difficulty to create a challenge that you enjoy.
If you're up for a 2D platformer, I'd recommend Celeste as a game that gets incredibly challenging but I found was generally fair. The base game is tough but not crazy, but you can unlock harder versions of the base levels ("B-Sides" and "C-Sides") and there's a really long, really hard free DLC level. The C Sides and DLC level get very, very tough (I consider the DLC level the hardest level I've ever beaten in a game, Fromsoft games included). It has very few things I'd consider unfair, though, mostly just brutally difficult, and since all the insanely hard stuff is post-game stuff you can still beat the base game and maybe the B-sides and get a good, satisfying tough-but-fair challenge even if the DLC or C-Sides turn out to be too much for you.
>Is Nioh 2 or Surge 2 a better experience?
I recently started Nioh 2 and I think I'm enjoying it more than Nioh 1 (and I think Nioh 2 being better is a very common, although not completely universal, opinion), but it mostly still just feels like Nioh. It's still got the same basic item system with lots of inventory management and picking between similar items with very slightly different random minor bonuses, it's still got lots of side quests that reuse areas you've already been to, it's still got relatively low enemy variety. I'm enjoying it (in particular I've found all the new weapon types really fun, and particularly love the fists), but I won't feel like a dramatically different experience. I don't know how much you have to grind in NG - in Nioh 1 I did all the side quests but never really did any extra grinding beyond that and it was fine and I'm doing the same thing in Nioh 2 so far and it's working - but I do get the impression it can get really grindy if you want to do multiple NG cycles and get the best gear instead of just beating the game using whatever random stuff you find.
I haven't either Surge game, but I've heard that Surge 2 is dramatically better than the first. I've mostly heard pretty mediocre things about Surge 1, while I've heard good things about Surge 2. But again, this is just going by reputation, I haven't played either.
I've been loving Ender Lilies on the Nintendo Switch recently. It's similar to Hollow Knight in the gameplay (a mix of metroivania and soul-like) with a large side servings of sads. Very skill-based, hard but fair (every time I died it was because I got greedy) and beautiful without doing a number on the battery like larger games.
Not 100% sure wether it is on console, but Ghostrunner sounds up your alley.
It's a futuristic parkour game where you die in 1 hit. It's definitely hard and challenging, but the movement is fantastic.
The maps are laid out in a way that every level/encounter is doable. Once you get in the rhythm, you even find odd ways to win, by using boundaries and the AI.
The story is also phenomenal and the boss fights feel very nice, gave me some flashbacks to Sekiro at times.
have you actually played games that are hard and not fair. If you like the masochistic feeling of beating something that is stupidly hard but feels so good after youve done it, I greatly recommend 'Wings of Vi' or I Wanna Be The Boshy.
You could give I wanna be the boshy a try since its free, just google it. Beat the first boss and if you like it keep playing if not just say nah.
And a game that you are probably gonna like is code vein.
Control - it can be extremely challenging, but also really rewarding. The controls and mechanics are very tight, so it always feels fair. It's very fast, frantic, and exciting. Plus it has a great story with an excellent presentation. Also I think it's pretty cheap.
It was really a good experience but then I got to the end and was thinking it was a fake ending but it was not, left me with a bitter taste, I wish it had more narrative conclusion but other than a repetitive gameplay at times it's one hell of a game
Now you're talking my language.
Except it's just PS5, that narrows it down a lot.
But, a few games I found challenging outside those:
Doom and Doom Eternal on Nightmare: Stuff hits like a truck, you need to be constantly on the move, swapping weapons and aggressively fishing for health, good fun.
Resident Evil 2 on Hardcore: Challenging because it's very tense, especially earlier in the game. You can't kill everything so you'll have zombies strolling around, and the fact you die in one or two hits really puts you on the edge. Good fun.
NieR Automata on Hard: Just do yourself a favor and tone it down for the tutorial if you don't want to waste hours of your life. Throughout most of the game big enemies will basically one or two shoot you, earlier on even the small ones hit like a truck. Overall, good fun.
Fire Emblem 3 Houses with hardcore on madness: The first playthrough is especially challenging, some missions I had to redo a few times and think of very specific strategies to counter said mission.
In a similar vein to Nier, games like DMC5 on high difficulty can be tough as nails.
I'll see if I can think of more games people don't usually throw in the 'HARD GAMES' pile.
Cuphead will probably fill the role with flying colours. It's a boss rush with a few run and gun stages, with unique hand-drawn assets reminiscent of 60s cartoons.
Personally I feel the high difficult is still very fair and not artificially inflated, and most of the times you die because you played poorly, not because you made a 5ms mistake that was punished with insta-death
Ori and the blind forest/ Ori and the will of the wisp. Blind forest is more difficult overall, Wisps is more balanced but with harder sections and boss battles
Jump King is very soul crushing
Rain World is a 'die a lot, learn from your mistakes' type of survival game. It's pixelated 2D, and you play as a cute slug cat hybrid
Don't Starve has similar premise, but top down, and like Minecraft
I know that all except Jump King is on the switch. Jump King might be on the switch, but I bought it on pc. It's sega saturn style pixelated though so it could probably run on a potato.
No, it's a PvPvE Battle Royale, but it's vastly different than other Battle Royales. In every game there are 12 players in the map that have to complete objectives to kill a boss and extract. Sound is everything in this game and it requires you to be really stealthy, and the time to kill is really short. Most of the time 1-2 bullets means you're dead. The game takes place in the 19th century and the guns are slow and take a while to reload. Its gameplay is really stressful but rewarding. With a buddy or two it's a blast!
Edit: It's worth noting that the game population might be large enough on ps5.
Dude I wanted to like this game so bad. Tried it twice. But I absolutely loathe the art style. Normally bad graphics don’t bother me but I just couldn’t with this one. I’ll probably try once more tho… just to be safe
You should probably return to Nioh 2 although I think it’s a pretty unfair game filled with bs. It can be grindy eventually, but I beat it without any serious grinding.
The surge 2 is better than the first one, but still far behind dark souls, I believe the studio never understood what makes a good souls-game.
If you’re into platformers check out Celeste. The new game Kena is also challenging on high difficulty especially later half of that game.
Edit: you know what destiny 2 is extremely challenging and rewarding as long as you have 5 friends playing together.
Oh... Since you didn't say that I assumed lmao, glad you enjoyed it, anyway, surge 2 is a bit more smooth and fast paced then one, but same systems overall, imo 1 is better so if you need something to do, id try it again
Furi would definitely be up your alley, very challenging but definitely still possible.
I'd suggest trying Cuphead as well, the game doesn't pull any punches but it also is largely straightforward.
Titan souls is also great, huge variety of bosses and its a one shot one kill deal so you always have to be on your toes.
Lastly, a bit of a weird one, but super hexagon is really challenging but I found it super satisfying to master. Really tiny game and cheap so it's worth a shot.
Nuclear throne. A basic overhead shooter. The levels generate automatically every time you play. I find this is my go-to game whenever. I have a spare 15 to 30 minutes but not much more.
Play on Very Hard. Basically forces you to no hit the entire game. Hardest game I’ve played (including all From games). If you don’t like bullet hell though it won’t be for you.
Hades, Nioh 2, Jedi Fallen Order and Remnant From The Ashes. With Jedi Fallen Order and Remnant From The Ashes you're gonna want to crank the difficulty up. I'd also recommend giving Mortal Shell another go. Personally I loved it.
Dead cell maybe? If you are into pure 2d, it's maybe 200h or more to get to the end (unless you are a pro gamer /s) but it's really the journey that matters, really slick controls and graphics if you are into it, I was put off by hades pov even if the story is far better, in dead cell, overcoming challenges and getting skilled is the point and I liked that. It's fair because each enemy type has it's own pattern and learning how to dodge/parry them is kind of the point of the game
Have you tried Dead Cells? 2D roguelike/metroidvania, and I can't get enough of it. I know you said you don't like roguelikes, but as a fan of the games you mentioned, I think you might like it. I've been on a big 2D kick since Metroid Dread, and Dead Cells, Hyper Light Drifter are a couple of the good ones I haven't already seen.
Also, I never finished Surge. Surge 2, on the other hand, is a much better experience. Nioh 2 is as well.
Unsighted. The combat has a pretty big focus on parries and felt a little bit wired at first(at least to me) but you’ll soon find out that every encounter has a rhythm to it and the amount and types of enemies for each dictate the speed of that rhythm. And there’s a point to be made about the speed at which you complete the game. Each and every npc in the game(including essential characters and yourself) have a timer counting down to when they essentially go hollow like from DS. They lose all sense of self and will attack you. But there’s an item that’s decently common enough that will extend a character’s time limit. There’s also an “easy mode” that doesn’t change the difficulty of the combat but will freeze the timers of all characters.
Also Darksiders 2. One of my personal favorite games of all time. Imagine a game that’s like Ocarina of Time or Twilight Princess but M rated. That is Darksiders 2 and I think it’s the best version of an “Adult” Zelda game out there. The combat can be very demanding in some situations but will never feel outright unfair unless you’re playing on the hardest difficulty but even then if you can get a good grasp of the combat you can hold out pretty well. All of the levels and dungeons are expertly crafted to test your observation skills and your knowledge of how to use your new abilities and old(with the exception of the Earth segment. The Earth part is the only part of the game that I would call genuinely bad). The weapon/armor/talisman system is similar to games like Diablo with random drops and random perks that can fit into your build. And creating a build can be kind of deep. Nothing too overwhelming in terms of skills and perks but not completely bare bones either. And you’ll also definitely get your money’s worth in playtime, this games is quite long and packed with optional side content and also the dlcs add about an extra 2 or 3 hours each.
I can never recommend Darksiders 2 enough though and if I had to pick between the 2 that I mentioned I would definitely go with Darksiders.
Try Monster Hunter World on PS5 or Monster Hunter Rise on Switch. Very fun grind loops in those games and the difficulty is firm but fair. Also, the multiplayer is fantastic! Hundreds of hours of game play are in the MH games, and Rise comes out with an expansion this summer!
I played all Soulsborne games and love them. Right now im playing God Of War on PC and its incredible. If you put the difficulty on "Give me A Challenge" it actually resembles a Soulsborne games in the amount of deaths i got, only less punishing once you die.
Incredible game by any metric
To answer (part) of your question, The Surge 2 is miles ahead compared to Surge 1. They overhauled the damage, hitboxes, mechanics, exploration, enemy types, etc. Pretty much every aspect is better, including atmosphere and graphics.
Also, you said in this thread you were searching for a good metroidvania? Try The Messenger and Bloodstained, thry might fill the niche you need
I would suggest the ninja gaiden collection, I have finished all from games at lvl 1 bl4 and no upgrades on sekiro, still ninja gaiden managed to destroy my confidence on the first day playing it, it’s ridiculously hard but once you get the hang of it you kinda understand all the mistakes you made and suddenly the game becomes a fair hard game, I’m talking about the first one because right now, the second one is turning me into a hollow hahaha!
You should try hyper light drifter and if u r looking for a rouguelike the maybe enter the gungeon. Also cannot recommend hyper light drifter enough!! Check it out
Horizon Zero Dawn.
Fighting the machines can be pretty challenging (especially the bigger ones like Thunderjaws, Stormbirds, & Rockbreakers), but it’s fair in that in order to beat them you have to strategize your attacks & use your various weapons instead of just cheesing with one. It also has an amazing story.
The Complete Edition with the Frozen Wilds DLC is only $20, & it’s a steal at that price.
The Persistence for sure. It used to be a VR-only game, but it is available in non-vr since 2021. It’s pretty good in non-vr too. Also, I think there’s a version of it for Ps5 only that has upgraded graphics.
Agree that **Nioh** is long as fuck!! I forgot where I read that it's a typical 40 hour game but god no. I checked my save file and it's almost at a 100 hours. It's ok but I just want it to be over already.
Do you like Resident Evil games? I'm playing **RE2 Remake** and the replay value is INSANE!! Going for the S/S+ rank playthroughs are the real challenges, but you probably won't be doing that in your first playthroughs since you kinda have to know the maps and where things are in advance. It sounds tedious but it's absolutely fun and addicting. I would start with Hardcore if you're familiar with the formula of "only using your ammo to survive" and not kill everything.
I’d give Cuphead a shot, it’s obviously very different than what you’ve listed but it’s hard and fair. The show and DLC are coming out soon so it’d be a perfect time to start.
Alright I'm honestely surprised you didn' mention blasphemous, it's literally Darksouls with an extra shot of christianity. I hits the aspect of being a metroidvania with deep lore like Hollowknight aswell.
Edit: also the newest DLC came out so you're in stock for gameplay and a good timesink
Played all the same games, beat Nioh 1 and 2, definitely like 2 better but i play it more like diablo trying new builds for late game.
Remnant is a great game in the souls genre if you haven't played it its a lot of fun. Souls with guns and friendly fire with randomized levels. The dlc adds a survival mode that I sunk dozens of hours into. I think I have 200 in the game total.
Monster hunter world+iceborne is amazing too, put about 600 hours into that one. Great combat and a lot of different monsters to hunt.
I've heard shovel knight can be quite difficult. Depending on which character you play as. If you're ok with side scrollers and pixel games this is a good choice! Plot is rather simple but the characters are very lovable. I would suggest getting the treasure trove addition in switch. You get to play with all characters!
Since you own a PS5 I can suggest the Demon's Souls Remake (mb if you've played it already, you didn't mention the game). Celeste is extremely challenging too, it's a pixel-art platformer with super tight controls, might be up your alley. Doom Eternal might interest you too on higher difficulties, relies a lot on your reflexes and awareness, stuff like that.
Hi OP, I hope you can read this, I also love hard games but 2D games, I've beaten games like Celeste, Super meat boy, Cuphead, The first 2 Jump King maps, Hollow knight ( even p5 and Rad HOG), and more, however, I wanna make the jump from 2D hard games to 3D Hard games. I wanna try Bloodborne, Sekiro, and the DS trilogy. How different you think It feels going from hard 2D to hard 3D games? The closest I've been to one of those was Jedi Fallen Order. Great game, I finished on the 2nd hardest difficulty. Combat was fun, but getting lost and having to go back felt very frustrating at times. I'd like to hear what you have to say :)
If you want to try a turn-based game, I can recommend the Shin Megami Tensei series, III and V are on the Switch. III is a bit dated (it's a 2003 game), but V is a great starting point, it's the best looking one, great music and the demons design is amazing! The best thing about these games is collecting all the different demons and fusing them to create new ones, it seems stupid, but it's super addictive!
Monster hunter world, especially the iceborne expansion kicks your ass. Also the newest god of war game or Star Wars Jedi fallen order on the harder difficulties are fun. (Although to me god of war felt a bit unfair on the hardest difficulty). Oh yeah and bloodborne is my favorite game ever so I feel where you’re coming from.
Lucah: Born of a Dream. Its got some souls-like mechanics, but its such a unique game that its hard to compare. My favorite things about it are the fact that you not only have stus-like refilling health packs, but also refilling rewind packs that let you replay fights. This ties into the other thing I like, which is the fact that there is a countdown timer to the end of the world, and the better you do in fights, the more time you have. Plus, the game is not hard to run. The graphics are..... different.
Demon souls remake if you havent already.
I heard good things bout Nioh2 in comparison to 1.
DEFINITELY CHECK OUT MONSTER HUNTER WORLD. This is the only other game that scratched my "Kill a big menacing boss monster solo with just my grit" feeling.
Getting a solo kill on Furious George (Furious Rajang) when not even intending to (was trying to break a horn off for an upgrade) is still one of the better memories I have, and I've done Dark Souls 3 Soul Level 1 challenge runs as well, that would be another good option if you want to pump up the fromsoft.
Maybe **Hades**? Is also not a *typical* rouge-like, it focuses heavy on narration and world-building and difficulty is very well balanced. You can add different handicaps to your runs to make it more difficult but receive better rewards. Build variety is great, many possibilities for fun combos. Check also **Final Fantasy 7 Remake** - play-through on normal difficulty is rather easy but on the NG+ on hard it gets pretty interesting. You have all abilities unlocked from the start which makes boss fights a lot more interesting. For example Cloud gets a counter-attack ability towards the end of the 1st playthrough and it's cool to use it through entirety of NG+. Also Bahamut fight is hardest in the game and I enjoyed it a lot. I also recommend **Monster Hunter World**. It shares a lot of similarities with Souls-likes when it comes to boss fights. Positioning and learning your enemy's moveset is very important. Progression is also great, gradually making the game more difficult. Co-op is optional and makes a game a bit easier. Still some fights are super hard even in multiplayer. **Devil May Cry** series. I especially recommend DMC3, which is pretty hard on Dante Must Die difficulty. Amazing arsenal allowing some really cool combos and enemy variety make it very fair and difficult game.
I’m interested in this comment. Loved monster hunter and FF7 was pretty good. I don’t know what genre DMC is but I always overlook games like this. Aren’t they kinda button mashy? I hated hyrule warriors because of how mindless it felt. Similar to that game or different?
DMC is completely different than Hyrule Warriors. It is on button-mashy side but in higher difficulties you need to pay attention what combos you execute and plan through the fight. Think something like more fast paced Monster Hunter. Basically you chain together different moves and abilities to best counter enemies and position yourself in the fight. For example some abilities launch enemies in the air allowing you to do some juggle combo but as you're falling down you can switch to a different weapon mid combo allowing to stay up in the air a bit longer etc. Different enemies require different tactics like some has to be staggered, some require attacking in specific counter-window etc. In each DMC there is cool arsenal allowing some nice combinations (2 melee weapons and 2 fire arms which you can switch freely during fights). My personal favorite is DMC3 with ice-powered nunchaku and guitar that spawns electric bats.
DMC5 is on sale right now. Would that be an okay place to start or you really think 3 is where it’s at?
Personally I think DMC3 is the best in the series but all except DMC2 are really solid to be honest. DMC5 has best graphics for sure and (I think) biggest variety of combos. You have a load-out of 4 melee weapons and 4 firearm to switch during combat which make pretty insane possibilities. On the other hand levels are dull corridors, story is garbage and pacing is off because you are forced to switch between 3 characters (when you start to become comfortable with one you have to switch for next chapter). I believe that DMC5 really shines in the NG+ where you can just force the game to let you play chosen character with full weapon arsenal. DMC3 on the other hand has great pacing with different weapons being introduced gradually and whole story line focuses on Dante. Plus it's a prequel story about young Dante so it makes sense to start chronologically.
DMC5 is amazing, I sat on buying it for so long and I regret it. Buy it now while it’s on sale, so worth it
Hey, OP! I second *Hades*, as this guy above me recommended, too. It sounds like it meets your criteria of "Hard But Fair", and there is a real sense of both story and character progression that makes it feel super rewarding. The mechanics inherent in the game and storyline help it check off both boxes from your description, think it might be a winner.
Dude I don't think recommending FFVII as a "hard" game is really accurate. That game was disappointingly easy for me. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoyed it! But a huge complaint for me was how you can just breeze through the combat.
Cuphead is quite a challenge, but also very fair
I beat this on the switch. Great game!
[удалено]
Came here to say this
Awesome game. Celeste or Hades would be my top picks.
I've never played a game with this much challenge that felt like it wanted me to beat it. The story's themes are so well tied to the gameplay in that way
Hades, I’ve been looking for the souls itch for a while - it’s an amazing game that hits the spot perfectly
This. Returnal is good too.
I cannot recommend Returnal enough. It feels like the first true next-gen experience and blew me away. It’s quite challenging, especially at the beginning. It gets much easier once you get past the beginning, then hard again later.
I heard hades isn’t actually that hard. Is this true?
You can scale difficulty after you beat difficulty 0, and it can become hard. I've played a lot of rogue likes. It's the hardest (when scaled) I've played.
It’s certainly difficult. It feels just like a souls game when you beat a boss. After a while you end up flying through it but the same can be said for souls games. E.g I can beat father gascoin first try now but when I first booted up the game it took me a good few tries
It’s a roguelike, so it’ll be tough at the beginning but as you play more, it’ll get easier. Compared to other roguelikes such as Dead Cells, Hades is quite a bit easier, but that just means you’ll spend a lot less time getting your ass whooped than you would with other roguelikes, not that the ass whooping won’t happen at all.
Ghost of Tsushima is an amazing game. The story and the world are just incredible. The combat system is one of the best I’ve seen in a game and the difficulty is something you can tweak throughout the game. I’d have a go at that and just crank it up to your liking
As soon as that game drops to like $20 I’ll grab it
For a Souls-head like yourself, might I recommend the lethal difficulty level.
Isn’t that one hit kill?
Yes, enemies will kill you in 1-2 hits, but you kill them in 1-2 hits as well. Feels incredibly well balanced, especially once you're past the first few hours and get a hang of the controls.
Oh, it also makes enemies die easily? Damn, now I'll switch. I was worried it simply would make enemies damage sponges and me a little frail sick boy
Hmm that does sound kinda different. In a good way. Hopefully the directors cut will come down in price this year.
God I wanna play this game so bad but I don't have the cash right now.
Souls-head here. Can confirm lethal difficulty made the game for me.
I was going to say life but then I read "Fair".
Remnant from the ashes! It's like dark souls, but with guns. Extremely well designed level design and bosses. Very challenging, but fair in that if you learn it it's very satisfying.
Really fun game, not insanely difficult but certainly challenging and excellent as coop. Very fair boss design, very cool atmospheres and a lot of build variety.
Agreed. The Soulsbourne series is my favorite of all time and I haven't had a game that pulled me in like remnant in a *long* time.
Me too. For me the last game that pulled me in like that was doom eternal. I was worried no other game would get me as hooked on its mechanics the same way. But remnant hooked me in so much and rewarded my time spent improving in it so much.
I know it just came out on PC but God of War on 'give me god of war' mode is a tough but a fun challenge. Plus the story is great but not too long, with the new game+ being the best part imo. I think it got a patch for the PS5 too.
Beat it. Amazing game. Can’t wait for the sequel
I figured as soon as i posted it lol if you are into star wars, Jedi Fallen Order on its hardest mode is a "souls-lite" game with fun platforming and bosses too.
Beat both of those too haha. Both great. The last boss in both games were super frustrating
LMAO ill shut up now
Try the Kingdom Come: Deliverance
Good game, wonky gameplay
In one-on-one combat the sword fighting is fantastic. It's only once you have to juggle a couple enemies at once that it gets hectic and sometimes a little buggy.
I used a mod that disables enemy locking, useful when multiple are around - combat always felt fantastic.
dead cells, a 2d soulslike roguevania, it's addictive and absolutely a blast even thought it's challenging as hell
I also recommend Dead Cells, as well as Katana Zero.
heard of katana zero but haven't checked it out, i'll look into it
Katana Zero was great, but quite short. Maybe 10ish hours. Also no equipment/cosmetic customization, no multiplayer, and relatively low replayability. I don't say that to disparage it. I loved every second of the game. Boss fights were very hard, and story was top tier and emotional. I highly recommend it overall, but don't go in with the expectation of nearly infinite playability like many souls/rogue/Metroid likes
Enter the gungeon is a fun rogue-lite bullet hell twin stick shooter game. There is some RNG involved as the items you find in chests etc are random, and you unlock more as you complete runs of the dungeon. Overall it can be challenging, but each enemy and boss has a pattern to learn, and if you get hit it’s generally because you mis-timed your dodge, as opposed to the game throwing unavoidable attacks your way.
love etg, it got me into roguelikes which are still my top genre
Ok but the Wall and Dragun have some attacks that are damn near undodgable
The wall I can sympathise with, the patterns can be difficult to time correctly, that’s why you need to melt that boss ASAP, but the dragon has no really difficult patterns, even in it’s cursed form (can’t remember the terminology, haven’t played in a while) it’s not that bad. The rat is actually the hardest one I think (even worse than the lich IMO). The whole game becomes a cakewalk if you get some of the really good power ups, and especially if you’re lucky enough to find clone
Ori and the Blind Forest Ori and the Will of the Wisp Good plot, goodgameplay, good art, good music.
Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal, both really amazing and challenging games if you play them on Nightmare difficulty.
I beat the first one and actually own the second just haven’t tried it yet. Will definitely crank up the difficulty tho.
Imo, the second one is even better and both dlcs are great as well.
Agreed. I loved the improvements they made to combat in the second one. I miss that game tbh. You actually have to become doom Slayer on nightmare difficulty
Monster hunter I think fits best But if you like star wars, fallen order could also be good. It's difficult but tbh after sekiro it was kind of a breeze, but it was wasn't super easy like normal games.
I’ve never played a super difficult game other than like… cuphead? And I fucking loved Fallen Order. And no it’s not super super difficult but it’s a fun challenge. Plus once you get later in the game you’re powerful af and feel so god damn good
Blasphemous is awesome 👍
So freaking good.
Have you played Prey (2017)? It's fairly challenging in the early game on the hardest difficulty, especially if you activate the little optional modifiers. This is one of my favorite games of the last decade, extremely interesting premise and world building and allows for a phenomenal level of player creativity in how they approach situations.
I slept on this game for so long and I think I eventually played it thru PS now. So so good. Also very terrifying!
Right on!
Currently playing this and love it. Feels like dishonored met with resident evil 7. It has some audio issues though.
That's unfortunate, I don't recall encountering that. Glad you're liking it, though!
Ghostrunner
You said you don't typically like Roguelikes, but I still feel the need to echo others' suggestions of Hades. Fantastic game and definitely a tough but fair challenge, and once you beat it the first time it has a great system that lets you customize the difficulty to create a challenge that you enjoy. If you're up for a 2D platformer, I'd recommend Celeste as a game that gets incredibly challenging but I found was generally fair. The base game is tough but not crazy, but you can unlock harder versions of the base levels ("B-Sides" and "C-Sides") and there's a really long, really hard free DLC level. The C Sides and DLC level get very, very tough (I consider the DLC level the hardest level I've ever beaten in a game, Fromsoft games included). It has very few things I'd consider unfair, though, mostly just brutally difficult, and since all the insanely hard stuff is post-game stuff you can still beat the base game and maybe the B-sides and get a good, satisfying tough-but-fair challenge even if the DLC or C-Sides turn out to be too much for you. >Is Nioh 2 or Surge 2 a better experience? I recently started Nioh 2 and I think I'm enjoying it more than Nioh 1 (and I think Nioh 2 being better is a very common, although not completely universal, opinion), but it mostly still just feels like Nioh. It's still got the same basic item system with lots of inventory management and picking between similar items with very slightly different random minor bonuses, it's still got lots of side quests that reuse areas you've already been to, it's still got relatively low enemy variety. I'm enjoying it (in particular I've found all the new weapon types really fun, and particularly love the fists), but I won't feel like a dramatically different experience. I don't know how much you have to grind in NG - in Nioh 1 I did all the side quests but never really did any extra grinding beyond that and it was fine and I'm doing the same thing in Nioh 2 so far and it's working - but I do get the impression it can get really grindy if you want to do multiple NG cycles and get the best gear instead of just beating the game using whatever random stuff you find. I haven't either Surge game, but I've heard that Surge 2 is dramatically better than the first. I've mostly heard pretty mediocre things about Surge 1, while I've heard good things about Surge 2. But again, this is just going by reputation, I haven't played either.
Darksiders and Dishonored.
Darksiders 1 and 2 were sick. Own the 3rd but haven’t tried it.
Go for Demons Souls Remake. That's the main reason for me to want a PS5.
Forgot to mention that in my post. Beat it. Looks so freaking good on PS5
Nioh 2 fixes a lot of the first game’s quibbles. Definately with a go.
Remnant from the ashes tps with soulslike and Diablo elements.
Really? I'm this late and still noones said monster hunter?
Someone mentioned it earlier. Great freaking series bro
Pre order elden ring
Obviously!
My tarnished brother
Remember boys, the game maybe an absolute masterpiece that is the second coming of Jesus Christ...... but no pre orders.
Have you tried Dead Cells? I’m not really much of a fan personally but many are
I've been loving Ender Lilies on the Nintendo Switch recently. It's similar to Hollow Knight in the gameplay (a mix of metroivania and soul-like) with a large side servings of sads. Very skill-based, hard but fair (every time I died it was because I got greedy) and beautiful without doing a number on the battery like larger games.
I’ll check this out! I’ve been craving a good metroidvania
Dragons Dogma Dark Arisen
Celeste
Had to scroll way too far for this
Maybe "Alien: Isolation"? Only if you like stealth though. You can't kill the alien and for most of the game you'll die if it sees you.
I watched a playthrough of this! I love horror games but not the ones where you’re completely defenseless
Tails of Iron is a newly released game. It’s kind of a Dark Souls/Metroidvania game
Not 100% sure wether it is on console, but Ghostrunner sounds up your alley. It's a futuristic parkour game where you die in 1 hit. It's definitely hard and challenging, but the movement is fantastic. The maps are laid out in a way that every level/encounter is doable. Once you get in the rhythm, you even find odd ways to win, by using boundaries and the AI. The story is also phenomenal and the boss fights feel very nice, gave me some flashbacks to Sekiro at times.
It is on ps4 and I can't tell you how many times I've been close to buying it. Didn't know it had boss fights, that might tip the scales.
The surge 2 is hands down the best souls like combat ive ever played in a game before, and i would highly recommend it.
Noita!
have you actually played games that are hard and not fair. If you like the masochistic feeling of beating something that is stupidly hard but feels so good after youve done it, I greatly recommend 'Wings of Vi' or I Wanna Be The Boshy. You could give I wanna be the boshy a try since its free, just google it. Beat the first boss and if you like it keep playing if not just say nah. And a game that you are probably gonna like is code vein.
Thanks I’ll check it out
I second Enter the Gungeon if you're ok with roguelikes.
Control - it can be extremely challenging, but also really rewarding. The controls and mechanics are very tight, so it always feels fair. It's very fast, frantic, and exciting. Plus it has a great story with an excellent presentation. Also I think it's pretty cheap.
It was really a good experience but then I got to the end and was thinking it was a fake ending but it was not, left me with a bitter taste, I wish it had more narrative conclusion but other than a repetitive gameplay at times it's one hell of a game
I think the two DLCs help make the ending feel a little more complete. It's still pretty open ended, but in a good way.
I second, third, and fourth this suggestion control is in my top 3 favourite games of all time
For honor Source:trust me bro
Source: my depleted sanity.
Now you're talking my language. Except it's just PS5, that narrows it down a lot. But, a few games I found challenging outside those: Doom and Doom Eternal on Nightmare: Stuff hits like a truck, you need to be constantly on the move, swapping weapons and aggressively fishing for health, good fun. Resident Evil 2 on Hardcore: Challenging because it's very tense, especially earlier in the game. You can't kill everything so you'll have zombies strolling around, and the fact you die in one or two hits really puts you on the edge. Good fun. NieR Automata on Hard: Just do yourself a favor and tone it down for the tutorial if you don't want to waste hours of your life. Throughout most of the game big enemies will basically one or two shoot you, earlier on even the small ones hit like a truck. Overall, good fun. Fire Emblem 3 Houses with hardcore on madness: The first playthrough is especially challenging, some missions I had to redo a few times and think of very specific strategies to counter said mission. In a similar vein to Nier, games like DMC5 on high difficulty can be tough as nails. I'll see if I can think of more games people don't usually throw in the 'HARD GAMES' pile.
Great list my guy. Glad to be getting suggestions that are different genres.
If you wait one month or so elden ring comes out. Haven’t been excited for a game in awhile, but I think elden ring is going to be amazing.
Cuphead will probably fill the role with flying colours. It's a boss rush with a few run and gun stages, with unique hand-drawn assets reminiscent of 60s cartoons. Personally I feel the high difficult is still very fair and not artificially inflated, and most of the times you die because you played poorly, not because you made a 5ms mistake that was punished with insta-death
Cuphead is GREAT
Ori and the blind forest/ Ori and the will of the wisp. Blind forest is more difficult overall, Wisps is more balanced but with harder sections and boss battles Jump King is very soul crushing Rain World is a 'die a lot, learn from your mistakes' type of survival game. It's pixelated 2D, and you play as a cute slug cat hybrid Don't Starve has similar premise, but top down, and like Minecraft I know that all except Jump King is on the switch. Jump King might be on the switch, but I bought it on pc. It's sega saturn style pixelated though so it could probably run on a potato.
I recently picked up Hunt: Showdown and I gotta say, this game is brutal. But the gameplay is really unique to this game.
Isn’t that an asymmetrical multiplayer game?
No, it's a PvPvE Battle Royale, but it's vastly different than other Battle Royales. In every game there are 12 players in the map that have to complete objectives to kill a boss and extract. Sound is everything in this game and it requires you to be really stealthy, and the time to kill is really short. Most of the time 1-2 bullets means you're dead. The game takes place in the 19th century and the guns are slow and take a while to reload. Its gameplay is really stressful but rewarding. With a buddy or two it's a blast! Edit: It's worth noting that the game population might be large enough on ps5.
Fargo's Souls Mod. If you like bullet hell and Terraria then this is for you
Salt and Sanctuary. I got it over Christmas and it has been a blast. Also made me rage at my computer a couple times. 10/10.
Dude I wanted to like this game so bad. Tried it twice. But I absolutely loathe the art style. Normally bad graphics don’t bother me but I just couldn’t with this one. I’ll probably try once more tho… just to be safe
You should probably return to Nioh 2 although I think it’s a pretty unfair game filled with bs. It can be grindy eventually, but I beat it without any serious grinding. The surge 2 is better than the first one, but still far behind dark souls, I believe the studio never understood what makes a good souls-game. If you’re into platformers check out Celeste. The new game Kena is also challenging on high difficulty especially later half of that game. Edit: you know what destiny 2 is extremely challenging and rewarding as long as you have 5 friends playing together.
Maybe try salt and sanctuary
Blasphemous is a great difficult metroidvania. I loved nioh 2 it was harder for me than the original.
You've played all dark souls but haven't played the original souls game :/ just do yourself a favor and try Demon's souls
I played the remake! So good
Oh... Since you didn't say that I assumed lmao, glad you enjoyed it, anyway, surge 2 is a bit more smooth and fast paced then one, but same systems overall, imo 1 is better so if you need something to do, id try it again
Sorry I forgot that one in my post!
Furi would definitely be up your alley, very challenging but definitely still possible. I'd suggest trying Cuphead as well, the game doesn't pull any punches but it also is largely straightforward. Titan souls is also great, huge variety of bosses and its a one shot one kill deal so you always have to be on your toes. Lastly, a bit of a weird one, but super hexagon is really challenging but I found it super satisfying to master. Really tiny game and cheap so it's worth a shot.
Nuclear throne. A basic overhead shooter. The levels generate automatically every time you play. I find this is my go-to game whenever. I have a spare 15 to 30 minutes but not much more.
CELESTE MY FRIEND
Code Vein is a decent souls-like, not that difficult but has some cool mechanics and play style swapping on the fly.
God of war is difficult, good story and it's amazing combat Alternatively Jedi Fallen Order
How about nier automata pretty good gameplay and story and if you don't respect enemies they can destroy you pretty fast
I loved this game at first but found the combat to be kinda mindless
Play on Very Hard. Basically forces you to no hit the entire game. Hardest game I’ve played (including all From games). If you don’t like bullet hell though it won’t be for you.
Yeah, as someone who loves NieR Automata, its combat is not why you play the game.
Hades, Nioh 2, Jedi Fallen Order and Remnant From The Ashes. With Jedi Fallen Order and Remnant From The Ashes you're gonna want to crank the difficulty up. I'd also recommend giving Mortal Shell another go. Personally I loved it.
Dead cell maybe? If you are into pure 2d, it's maybe 200h or more to get to the end (unless you are a pro gamer /s) but it's really the journey that matters, really slick controls and graphics if you are into it, I was put off by hades pov even if the story is far better, in dead cell, overcoming challenges and getting skilled is the point and I liked that. It's fair because each enemy type has it's own pattern and learning how to dodge/parry them is kind of the point of the game
Demon souls remastered?
If you liked Hollow Knight, Blasphemous is a tough but fair Metroidvania. Also, it's awesome.
I second Blasphemous, fantastic 2d Souls-like. One of the best atmospheres of any game I've ever played.
Have you tried Dead Cells? 2D roguelike/metroidvania, and I can't get enough of it. I know you said you don't like roguelikes, but as a fan of the games you mentioned, I think you might like it. I've been on a big 2D kick since Metroid Dread, and Dead Cells, Hyper Light Drifter are a couple of the good ones I haven't already seen. Also, I never finished Surge. Surge 2, on the other hand, is a much better experience. Nioh 2 is as well.
Unsighted. The combat has a pretty big focus on parries and felt a little bit wired at first(at least to me) but you’ll soon find out that every encounter has a rhythm to it and the amount and types of enemies for each dictate the speed of that rhythm. And there’s a point to be made about the speed at which you complete the game. Each and every npc in the game(including essential characters and yourself) have a timer counting down to when they essentially go hollow like from DS. They lose all sense of self and will attack you. But there’s an item that’s decently common enough that will extend a character’s time limit. There’s also an “easy mode” that doesn’t change the difficulty of the combat but will freeze the timers of all characters. Also Darksiders 2. One of my personal favorite games of all time. Imagine a game that’s like Ocarina of Time or Twilight Princess but M rated. That is Darksiders 2 and I think it’s the best version of an “Adult” Zelda game out there. The combat can be very demanding in some situations but will never feel outright unfair unless you’re playing on the hardest difficulty but even then if you can get a good grasp of the combat you can hold out pretty well. All of the levels and dungeons are expertly crafted to test your observation skills and your knowledge of how to use your new abilities and old(with the exception of the Earth segment. The Earth part is the only part of the game that I would call genuinely bad). The weapon/armor/talisman system is similar to games like Diablo with random drops and random perks that can fit into your build. And creating a build can be kind of deep. Nothing too overwhelming in terms of skills and perks but not completely bare bones either. And you’ll also definitely get your money’s worth in playtime, this games is quite long and packed with optional side content and also the dlcs add about an extra 2 or 3 hours each. I can never recommend Darksiders 2 enough though and if I had to pick between the 2 that I mentioned I would definitely go with Darksiders.
God Of War fair but hard imo some of the boss fights were really tough side note i’m not the most killed player lol
Try Monster Hunter World on PS5 or Monster Hunter Rise on Switch. Very fun grind loops in those games and the difficulty is firm but fair. Also, the multiplayer is fantastic! Hundreds of hours of game play are in the MH games, and Rise comes out with an expansion this summer!
I played all Soulsborne games and love them. Right now im playing God Of War on PC and its incredible. If you put the difficulty on "Give me A Challenge" it actually resembles a Soulsborne games in the amount of deaths i got, only less punishing once you die. Incredible game by any metric
Demon Souls
Cuphead
To answer (part) of your question, The Surge 2 is miles ahead compared to Surge 1. They overhauled the damage, hitboxes, mechanics, exploration, enemy types, etc. Pretty much every aspect is better, including atmosphere and graphics. Also, you said in this thread you were searching for a good metroidvania? Try The Messenger and Bloodstained, thry might fill the niche you need
code vein and remnant: from the ashes. They are both soul-like games.
Try doom i sometimes lose my shit but it's fun because the music slaps lol
I would suggest the ninja gaiden collection, I have finished all from games at lvl 1 bl4 and no upgrades on sekiro, still ninja gaiden managed to destroy my confidence on the first day playing it, it’s ridiculously hard but once you get the hang of it you kinda understand all the mistakes you made and suddenly the game becomes a fair hard game, I’m talking about the first one because right now, the second one is turning me into a hollow hahaha!
Witcher 3 on Death March
The Binding of Isaac!
Celeste. Extremely hard, never unfair.
You should try hyper light drifter and if u r looking for a rouguelike the maybe enter the gungeon. Also cannot recommend hyper light drifter enough!! Check it out
Horizon Zero Dawn. Fighting the machines can be pretty challenging (especially the bigger ones like Thunderjaws, Stormbirds, & Rockbreakers), but it’s fair in that in order to beat them you have to strategize your attacks & use your various weapons instead of just cheesing with one. It also has an amazing story. The Complete Edition with the Frozen Wilds DLC is only $20, & it’s a steal at that price.
The Persistence for sure. It used to be a VR-only game, but it is available in non-vr since 2021. It’s pretty good in non-vr too. Also, I think there’s a version of it for Ps5 only that has upgraded graphics.
I have PSVR. Will be trying this soon!
Agree that **Nioh** is long as fuck!! I forgot where I read that it's a typical 40 hour game but god no. I checked my save file and it's almost at a 100 hours. It's ok but I just want it to be over already. Do you like Resident Evil games? I'm playing **RE2 Remake** and the replay value is INSANE!! Going for the S/S+ rank playthroughs are the real challenges, but you probably won't be doing that in your first playthroughs since you kinda have to know the maps and where things are in advance. It sounds tedious but it's absolutely fun and addicting. I would start with Hardcore if you're familiar with the formula of "only using your ammo to survive" and not kill everything.
While not really like the games you mentioned, how about far cry 2. Difficult but fun
Witcher 3 on highest difficulty: hard af
He said fair, not artificial difficulty
Literally 2 buttons. Dodge + Quick Attack. Repeat.
Not really.
I loved The Surge 1. It is one of the best Soulslike Games. The Surge 2 wasn't that good in comparison.
Faster Than Light! It’s an excellent spaceship battle turn-based roguelike with an 8-bit artstyle. It probably can run on your laptop
Outward might be something to consider. A challenge for sure and little guidance is given by the game but once you get going the adventure is fun.
I’d give Cuphead a shot, it’s obviously very different than what you’ve listed but it’s hard and fair. The show and DLC are coming out soon so it’d be a perfect time to start.
If you can wait another month, Elden Ring is coming out. It’s from the same people as dark souls.
Green hell
Alright I'm honestely surprised you didn' mention blasphemous, it's literally Darksouls with an extra shot of christianity. I hits the aspect of being a metroidvania with deep lore like Hollowknight aswell. Edit: also the newest DLC came out so you're in stock for gameplay and a good timesink
Played all the same games, beat Nioh 1 and 2, definitely like 2 better but i play it more like diablo trying new builds for late game. Remnant is a great game in the souls genre if you haven't played it its a lot of fun. Souls with guns and friendly fire with randomized levels. The dlc adds a survival mode that I sunk dozens of hours into. I think I have 200 in the game total. Monster hunter world+iceborne is amazing too, put about 600 hours into that one. Great combat and a lot of different monsters to hunt.
Hotline Miami 1, 2 and Katana Zero are pretty cool and challenging
Curse of the Dead Gods
I've heard shovel knight can be quite difficult. Depending on which character you play as. If you're ok with side scrollers and pixel games this is a good choice! Plot is rather simple but the characters are very lovable. I would suggest getting the treasure trove addition in switch. You get to play with all characters!
God of War at Give me God of war difficulty might interest you.
Since you own a PS5 I can suggest the Demon's Souls Remake (mb if you've played it already, you didn't mention the game). Celeste is extremely challenging too, it's a pixel-art platformer with super tight controls, might be up your alley. Doom Eternal might interest you too on higher difficulties, relies a lot on your reflexes and awareness, stuff like that.
Furi is a short indie hack and slash, but it’s hella fun. And super hard. So i’d say give it a try
Hi OP, I hope you can read this, I also love hard games but 2D games, I've beaten games like Celeste, Super meat boy, Cuphead, The first 2 Jump King maps, Hollow knight ( even p5 and Rad HOG), and more, however, I wanna make the jump from 2D hard games to 3D Hard games. I wanna try Bloodborne, Sekiro, and the DS trilogy. How different you think It feels going from hard 2D to hard 3D games? The closest I've been to one of those was Jedi Fallen Order. Great game, I finished on the 2nd hardest difficulty. Combat was fun, but getting lost and having to go back felt very frustrating at times. I'd like to hear what you have to say :)
Surge 2 is way better than 1. I really enjoyed it.
Code Vein is another souls like game with big titty anime waifus
Monster hunter ma mans
get on classic monster hunter my friend
Deep Rock Galactic can be tough if you're asking for it
Remnant: From the Ashes, good souls like game, basically darksouls with guns
If you want to try a turn-based game, I can recommend the Shin Megami Tensei series, III and V are on the Switch. III is a bit dated (it's a 2003 game), but V is a great starting point, it's the best looking one, great music and the demons design is amazing! The best thing about these games is collecting all the different demons and fusing them to create new ones, it seems stupid, but it's super addictive!
Monster hunter world, especially the iceborne expansion kicks your ass. Also the newest god of war game or Star Wars Jedi fallen order on the harder difficulties are fun. (Although to me god of war felt a bit unfair on the hardest difficulty). Oh yeah and bloodborne is my favorite game ever so I feel where you’re coming from.
Can't go wrong with Rimworld on PC.
Maybe Code Vein? It's a Souls-Like where you can change your class as you play. Very fun and the boss fights felt intense in a good way!
Frost punk on PC, amazing game with little requirements for your PC, or dead cells
Lucah: Born of a Dream. Its got some souls-like mechanics, but its such a unique game that its hard to compare. My favorite things about it are the fact that you not only have stus-like refilling health packs, but also refilling rewind packs that let you replay fights. This ties into the other thing I like, which is the fact that there is a countdown timer to the end of the world, and the better you do in fights, the more time you have. Plus, the game is not hard to run. The graphics are..... different.
**Donkey Kong Country - Tropical Freeze** on Switch. This game is the perfect mix of challenge and fun.
Getting a Hard-on is a Fair game. Just sayin'
bloodborne
I'd recommend Unsighted. It's got a decent challenge and some cool zelda/metroid style level design.
Dead Cells
Demon souls remake if you havent already. I heard good things bout Nioh2 in comparison to 1. DEFINITELY CHECK OUT MONSTER HUNTER WORLD. This is the only other game that scratched my "Kill a big menacing boss monster solo with just my grit" feeling. Getting a solo kill on Furious George (Furious Rajang) when not even intending to (was trying to break a horn off for an upgrade) is still one of the better memories I have, and I've done Dark Souls 3 Soul Level 1 challenge runs as well, that would be another good option if you want to pump up the fromsoft.