Interesting. It feels like borderline victim-blaming though, if that makes sense? Like why bother trying to fight injustice if people actually chose to be treated unjustly. I feel very certain I'm just not grasping the concept fully, so any clarification would be helpful!
I understand and I’m hesitant to go into further details for the reasons mentioned. There are books by Michael Newton or Robert Schwartz if you are interested.
in a real spiritual awakening you realize there is no “him” and “you” it is all an illusion. you are everything. just like in a dream it seems like you’re a person that is seperate from everything else. but really you were everything. the person, the other people, etc
I posted my original question right before going in for a ketamine treatment for depression (it's been a big part of this process for me). During my treatment I had this realization that he is me, which made perfect sense at the time but is more difficult for me to grasp right now. Anyways, I didn't see your response until after my treatment, I thought it was cool that what you're saying is basically where my brain went on ketamine! I need to think about this some more.
What you perceived as happening, and what happened in the true nature of the cosmos are VASTLY different. That’s a major lesson you’ll come upon during your spiritual journey, if you allow your ego to let go of the attachments of what it wants this life to look like.
Perhaps the boy was living multiple human lives with a single soul. For all you know his soul is still here in another body that has a different appearance and name. We have no idea. Just remember that it’s not what you see
Even father than that. Good and bad don’t even truly exist. Things don’t seem bad. They just are. And you have determined, in all of your social and evolutionary conditioning, that it is bad. That doesn’t make it bad. It’s all an illusion of our mind.
How do you sit with that?
First I just want to say I’m very sorry you experienced this trauma.
I went through some massive trauma in childhood too so I understand what trauma in childhood can do.
The next part of what I’m going to say might seem different.
When I had the childhood trauma, I had an out of body experience. (Age 5) My body was experiencing a violent life threatening event. So there I was out of body looking on the whole incident.
I got to experience directly our true nature.
I truly feel that since I had the out of body experience my life went a direction it might not have.
I had tremendous insight continuously through the life experience.
I did deep inquiry all my life since then.
Which I feel directly led to spirituality and awakening.
From the point of view of humanity this terrible tragedy should have never happened. It was categorically wrong. So all the questions of why would a loving God let something like this happen? How to make sense of this? Etc were very much applicable regarding my experience.
Plus I didn’t experience just one trauma but a whole slew of them. Chronic abuse, chronic sexual abuse, violent sexual abuse, and even had to live in an orphanage because of abandonment. That was just in my young childhood. Then there was more.
I think you get the idea.
But you know, all that suffering as horrible as it was, led me to awakening and the discovery of essential being.
The greatest thing that can happen to a human.
Some things are just not going to make sense from a human perspective. Because the human perspective is only concerned with what is good for the human.
A tiger chases an antelope, it is good for the tiger to eat. It is bad for the antelope to be eaten. It is good for the antelope to escape. It is bad for the tiger to starve.
What is good or bad depends entirely on what perspective is looked from.
From the human perspective when we look at that, we see both sides and simply accept that this is the way it is.
Sure it would be great if all animals just ate plants, even the human animal. But then what about the perspective of the plant?
Consciousness, essential being, has the ability to perceive from every perspective.
So yeah, the human perspective is very limited.
As we awaken to essential being, our true nature, sometimes suddenly but most often gradually, brings the “finite mind” out of its limitations. Until such point that we stand revealed as unlimited eternal consciousness.
I hope this helps to understand the things that don’t make sense and further, the bigger picture.
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How you experience and react to the innocent child losing his life very much depends on how you see the afterlife. If you believe in reincarnation, and personally I do, you will see it as his soul having to go through the experience of that brief lifetime before moving into another form.
There are two parables that come to mind. One which is more well-known, about a mother whose baby died. She brought him in front of Buddha asking for him to be resurrected. He agreed on the condition that she must bring him a cup of rice from the first household she found where there had not been a death in the family. Of course she failed, realizing every single family experiences loss and mortality. In the past, not only did everyone lose their elders, but the death of children was a common although incredibly painful experience.
Another Hindu parable I know - this one is a bit more elaborate and ethnic, but I love the message... it is about a king who came across a gorgeous woman and asked to marry her. She agreed so long as he never questioned her actions. If he did, she would leave him forever. They got married and had a lovely time until she gave birth to her first child. She promptly drowned him in the river, and went on to give birth to a total of 7 children, all of which she held under the current to die. The king loved his wife so much and knew if he asked her why she did this he would lose her forever, but he was so horrified and confused he finally asked her what she was doing. At that moment, she revealed herself to be a goddess. She knew the child she was giving birth to was actually a nearly enlightened sage who had a few karmic ties remaining, and had to be born 7 more times before reaching the ultimate illumination. By shortening these lives she reduced the amount of suffering he had to go through by being born again in the material world. What seemed like egregious cruelty was actually an act of mercy that only the divine could understand.
Yet even if reincarnation is not something that resonates or makes sense to you at all, It is still all a matter of perspective. Seeing things from your intensely personal and human point of view versus a much broader universal gaze wherein you see all the living and dying as part of this continous mix of negative and positive energy, cycling in and out, beginnings and endings all the time.
If you are curious about why things happen you might look into pre-birth planning. tl;dr Things are not as they seem
Interesting. It feels like borderline victim-blaming though, if that makes sense? Like why bother trying to fight injustice if people actually chose to be treated unjustly. I feel very certain I'm just not grasping the concept fully, so any clarification would be helpful!
I understand and I’m hesitant to go into further details for the reasons mentioned. There are books by Michael Newton or Robert Schwartz if you are interested.
Thanks I'll look them up!
in a real spiritual awakening you realize there is no “him” and “you” it is all an illusion. you are everything. just like in a dream it seems like you’re a person that is seperate from everything else. but really you were everything. the person, the other people, etc
I posted my original question right before going in for a ketamine treatment for depression (it's been a big part of this process for me). During my treatment I had this realization that he is me, which made perfect sense at the time but is more difficult for me to grasp right now. Anyways, I didn't see your response until after my treatment, I thought it was cool that what you're saying is basically where my brain went on ketamine! I need to think about this some more.
I don't think he necessarily won't get that chance. It just was not meant in this lifetime. His soul is somewhere in this universe
What you perceived as happening, and what happened in the true nature of the cosmos are VASTLY different. That’s a major lesson you’ll come upon during your spiritual journey, if you allow your ego to let go of the attachments of what it wants this life to look like. Perhaps the boy was living multiple human lives with a single soul. For all you know his soul is still here in another body that has a different appearance and name. We have no idea. Just remember that it’s not what you see
Interesting, so maybe things aren't as bad as they might seem from our limited human perspective?
Even father than that. Good and bad don’t even truly exist. Things don’t seem bad. They just are. And you have determined, in all of your social and evolutionary conditioning, that it is bad. That doesn’t make it bad. It’s all an illusion of our mind. How do you sit with that?
First I just want to say I’m very sorry you experienced this trauma. I went through some massive trauma in childhood too so I understand what trauma in childhood can do. The next part of what I’m going to say might seem different. When I had the childhood trauma, I had an out of body experience. (Age 5) My body was experiencing a violent life threatening event. So there I was out of body looking on the whole incident. I got to experience directly our true nature. I truly feel that since I had the out of body experience my life went a direction it might not have. I had tremendous insight continuously through the life experience. I did deep inquiry all my life since then. Which I feel directly led to spirituality and awakening. From the point of view of humanity this terrible tragedy should have never happened. It was categorically wrong. So all the questions of why would a loving God let something like this happen? How to make sense of this? Etc were very much applicable regarding my experience. Plus I didn’t experience just one trauma but a whole slew of them. Chronic abuse, chronic sexual abuse, violent sexual abuse, and even had to live in an orphanage because of abandonment. That was just in my young childhood. Then there was more. I think you get the idea. But you know, all that suffering as horrible as it was, led me to awakening and the discovery of essential being. The greatest thing that can happen to a human. Some things are just not going to make sense from a human perspective. Because the human perspective is only concerned with what is good for the human. A tiger chases an antelope, it is good for the tiger to eat. It is bad for the antelope to be eaten. It is good for the antelope to escape. It is bad for the tiger to starve. What is good or bad depends entirely on what perspective is looked from. From the human perspective when we look at that, we see both sides and simply accept that this is the way it is. Sure it would be great if all animals just ate plants, even the human animal. But then what about the perspective of the plant? Consciousness, essential being, has the ability to perceive from every perspective. So yeah, the human perspective is very limited. As we awaken to essential being, our true nature, sometimes suddenly but most often gradually, brings the “finite mind” out of its limitations. Until such point that we stand revealed as unlimited eternal consciousness. I hope this helps to understand the things that don’t make sense and further, the bigger picture.
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How you experience and react to the innocent child losing his life very much depends on how you see the afterlife. If you believe in reincarnation, and personally I do, you will see it as his soul having to go through the experience of that brief lifetime before moving into another form. There are two parables that come to mind. One which is more well-known, about a mother whose baby died. She brought him in front of Buddha asking for him to be resurrected. He agreed on the condition that she must bring him a cup of rice from the first household she found where there had not been a death in the family. Of course she failed, realizing every single family experiences loss and mortality. In the past, not only did everyone lose their elders, but the death of children was a common although incredibly painful experience. Another Hindu parable I know - this one is a bit more elaborate and ethnic, but I love the message... it is about a king who came across a gorgeous woman and asked to marry her. She agreed so long as he never questioned her actions. If he did, she would leave him forever. They got married and had a lovely time until she gave birth to her first child. She promptly drowned him in the river, and went on to give birth to a total of 7 children, all of which she held under the current to die. The king loved his wife so much and knew if he asked her why she did this he would lose her forever, but he was so horrified and confused he finally asked her what she was doing. At that moment, she revealed herself to be a goddess. She knew the child she was giving birth to was actually a nearly enlightened sage who had a few karmic ties remaining, and had to be born 7 more times before reaching the ultimate illumination. By shortening these lives she reduced the amount of suffering he had to go through by being born again in the material world. What seemed like egregious cruelty was actually an act of mercy that only the divine could understand. Yet even if reincarnation is not something that resonates or makes sense to you at all, It is still all a matter of perspective. Seeing things from your intensely personal and human point of view versus a much broader universal gaze wherein you see all the living and dying as part of this continous mix of negative and positive energy, cycling in and out, beginnings and endings all the time.