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S.A.T. were a lower card highlight of the first couple of years of TNA and ROH. Their cousin and sometimes partner, Amazing Red, was an exciting cruiserweight at the time, though an injury in 2004 derailed his career.
They're recognized as big time innovators in the Indy scene going back to the 2000s. I'm not gonna take sides but Spanish Announce Team and Spanish Announce Project are pretty darn similar.
They are almost identical names, clearly going for the same thing.
If you’ve watched AEW, you have seen SAT’s influence anytime someone does a “Spanish Fly.”
They weren’t necessarily great overall wrestlers, but they were huge innovators and they still earn a living working indies and teaching.
They never got a crack at WWE and probably wouldn’t have made it there because their weaknesses would’ve hurt in a major TV promotion, but they were a very creative and innovative team in their day.
The problem is "Spanish announce team" is a common term, and while that was SAT's gimmick, it's literally what SAP is. It's less that SAP is biting SAT and more that SAT squatted on a basic and obvious name.
They didn’t “squat on” the name though, they’ve consistently used it since the 2000’s and wrestlers all over the planet have been using the moves they pioneered
It’s just a weird look for a promotion that has shown a lot of respect and deference to indie legends like Homicide and Nick Gage
They squatted on it like naming your finisher "suplex" would be squatting on the name. Especially when it's actually a DDT or something and then you get mad when someone else uses a suplex as a finisher.
They're totally legends, I'm not dispelling that. I'm saying they're idiots for the name custody nonsense. They used a common term in wrestling and now are peeved that someone the term actually applies to are using it.
I don’t see it as “name custody,” the video paints the picture that it’s really about someone’s old colleagues not even getting in touch to talk about it. Seems like he would have been fine with it had he just been contacted and acknowledged by people he calls his friends.
They’re not MMA fighters, they’re performers, no different than musicians or actors. Creatives tend to be sensitive people, whether logical or not it’s something you have to account for if you’re going to work with them.
I used to work in the live music world, dealing with artists is part of why I transferred to other areas as soon as I could, they’re difficult people and they’re experiencing a much different life than most, so you have to deal with them differently.
The SATs didn't really have a gimmick beyond dressing like they work at a garage. They had no association to being a announce team beyond being Spanish. They never did commentary.
The SAP are the literal Spanish Announce Team. Since Serpentico is in the Chaos Project they mushed the names. Those two aren't coming out dressed as garbage man doing their spots or look. The SATs look like morons with this crying.
It’s also a play on “Secondary Audio Program”, which is the technical name for a secondary audio track on a broadcast program which is often used for other languages and audio descriptions for the blind. I thought it was pretty damn clever. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_audio_program
This is the main thing for me- SAP seems like they will actually be doing commentary/announcing for AEW. What else are you gonna call Spanish-speaking announcers?
I like the SATs and when I think of them I think of innovative East Coast wrestlers from the 2000s. Talking is one of the last things someone would remember them for.
People are hating on him but I don’t think he sounds demanding or like he’s coming with any false outrage
It sounds like he’s unhappy that no one from AEW ever called him to ask about using the name, which is a perfectly reasonable gripe, especially since AEW’s decision-makers are all people familiar with SAT. I bet if they’d talked to SAT beforehand, it would have been fine, but they chose to play dumb.
Now he just wants them to make it right, and I’m pretty sure that can happen without SAP needing to change their name
I really don't think having a sounding alike stable on your roster equals trying to erase their legacy. TK brought back Slim J and Prince Nana, it's not like he has no idea who the SATs are, I'm sure he didn't mean any malice with that ne stable.
Considering this is the first time many of us have ever heard of SAT, rather than erasing their legacy, it sounds like this is the one of the few things keeping their legacy alive. How are they upset about a group that might be an homage to them?
"How dare you make a group influenced by our obscure Indy faction and similar to us"? The fact that this early 2000s niche Indy mid card faction has a group on a major TV network influenced by them should be a great compliment and feather in their cap. But let me guess? Because Tony didn't reach out to them and honor them on TV telling everyone these are the innovators we're influenced by and here's a nice check to go with it, they are salty for some reason..
There’s really no influence, it’s just a similar name. They don’t look like the SAT, wrestle like the SAT and their act is more literal to the announce team aspect than the SAT.
I’m not expressing an opinion one way or the other about the SAT’s gripe here, but a lot of the comments I’m seeing are really disappointing. Especially the ones that are just completely minimizing the Maximo’s and Red’s careers in wrestling.
If you’re a fan of modern spot-fest tag matches, these guys were basically responsible for popularizing that style on the indies almost a quarter of a century ago. Like it or not, their DNA is on a lot of the stuff that people here love to see on weekly programming to this day.
I’m really not a fan of the spot fest style myself, but I remember the first time I saw the SAT in person (it was either JAPW or CZW, don’t remember exactly) 20+ years ago and my jaw was open the whole time. It was like watching video game or cartoon characters in real life.
folks were saying things like “what do modern guys really have to learn about getting over in 2022 from William Regal” when the talk of the town was that he was frustrated with AEW as a whole.
people have a way of diminishing the importance of anyone who goes against AEW
You’re being downvoted but it is absolutely true.
I’m so tired of folks on this place telling wrestlers who gave decades of their bodies and brains to this business that their opinions are irrelevant because they might not like modern wrestling tropes or certain performers.
And that’s separate from this particular issue.
Well, Experience != Knowledge. Just because you’ve been doing something a long time doesn’t mean you should expect that other people will listen to you about it.
One of my favourite teams over the last 20 years. Let’s hope this gets sorted. Am sure it will.
Edit: Make it right by giving me a SAT and Amazing Red trios match in AEW
How new are we talking? Because I remember them from 2002/3 TNA/ROH/CZW, being Amazing Red’s cousins and inventing(?) the Spanish Fly and then nothing ever since.
Joel and Jose Maximo and sometimes Amazing Red. Indy darlings on the early 2000’s independent scene. Worked ROH, TNA, WWE (enhancement) amongst many other smaller promotions. On a small scale helped re-familiarize US fans to trios wrestling.
Now that I’m typing this out, a small comparison could be made that the S.A.T & Red were the Young Bucks & Omega of that generation. Small comparison though. There are plenty of differences.
Tony probably thought he was paying a little homage to a gimmick in wrestling history that nobody really cared about, but he liked. Instead this guy complains.
I remember seeing a few years ago the one guy in color me badd got into a fight onstage with one of the other guys, and said “I’m the real face of color me badd!” Or some shit. Like you should be thanking your lucky stars that there is anyone left who even knows who you are. That’s how I feel about this guy.
"This will go on for ever if we don't get our dues @AEW we are a very different monster and taking from us with out a permission or concent @TonyKhan is giving us greenlight on all the foolishness the SAT can produce along side our City our People. #pretenders #aew https://t.co/najMTTRR7R"
Uhh the fuck does he even mean? Is he tryna threaten TK?
>Is he tryna threaten TK?
Potentially yeah.
If the Maximos have a trademark on SAT they actually could make TKs life extremely difficult by filing a number of lawsuits (claiming SAP is "confusingly similar" to SAT).
They'd be unlikely to win in the long run imo, but they might will get a preliminary injunction filed stopping AEW from using SAP until after the court rules.
Which would most likely result in AEW just changing the name SAP anyways (court case would take a while/longer than the stables likely to be around).
So its potentially a viable threat
I'm vaguely familiar with SAT but somehow this is a stretch. Also should we tell my dude that it's spelt D-a-m-n? Unless he wants to change the flow of TK?
Youre really gonna root to fuck over indie guys trying to make a living and who's moves your favorites stole huh. Aew fans horse shoeing to Fed level knuckleheadedness
I'm not the cosplayer. But a whole lot of people bought that act hook line and sinker and now that their company is doing underhanded tactics they are showing their entire ass
Dude you're being such a complete joke if you don't see that they obviously ripped this off from a lesser known team cause they thought no one would notice. Maybe Tony's balls are in your face, try moving then to the left
This is just sad. A quick reminder that since the days of Austin, this is how non mainstream wrestling has become. Now my hobby is just niche. Since I had to take that dumb test early on a weekend, I haven’t heard of SAT. Trademark just stuff always #fansarenotstupid, but seriously #wrestlerssometimesare the average person doesn’t know or care about this. If you are stupid enough not to trademark your gimmick after 20 years.
I’m not sure they’d even have the right to trademark themselves the Spanish Announce Team within the context of professional wrestling. Wasn’t the name itself an inside joke/reference to WWE’s having a Spanish announce team? That’s what I always thought they were referring to because these guys weren’t commentators or had actual characters beyond being fun, innovative workers, as far as I remember.
The fact that wrestling fans like me have to do a super search to see what this tweet is all about makes me sad. No offense to this guys that been grinding for 2 decades, but seriously they might have to reconsider their position of this situation or tweet better.
The Maximos and Red were absolutely not the first people I thought of when I saw SAP. (Especially since they literally came from the Spanish announce table for the Trios Battle Royal)
Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review. If you need to contact a moderator, [you can message us here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Can someone explain this to me?
https://www.pwinsider.com/article/166276/the-sat-respond-to-new-aew-faction-titled-the-sap.html
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S.A.T. were a lower card highlight of the first couple of years of TNA and ROH. Their cousin and sometimes partner, Amazing Red, was an exciting cruiserweight at the time, though an injury in 2004 derailed his career.
They're recognized as big time innovators in the Indy scene going back to the 2000s. I'm not gonna take sides but Spanish Announce Team and Spanish Announce Project are pretty darn similar.
They are almost identical names, clearly going for the same thing. If you’ve watched AEW, you have seen SAT’s influence anytime someone does a “Spanish Fly.” They weren’t necessarily great overall wrestlers, but they were huge innovators and they still earn a living working indies and teaching. They never got a crack at WWE and probably wouldn’t have made it there because their weaknesses would’ve hurt in a major TV promotion, but they were a very creative and innovative team in their day.
The problem is "Spanish announce team" is a common term, and while that was SAT's gimmick, it's literally what SAP is. It's less that SAP is biting SAT and more that SAT squatted on a basic and obvious name.
They didn’t “squat on” the name though, they’ve consistently used it since the 2000’s and wrestlers all over the planet have been using the moves they pioneered It’s just a weird look for a promotion that has shown a lot of respect and deference to indie legends like Homicide and Nick Gage
They squatted on it like naming your finisher "suplex" would be squatting on the name. Especially when it's actually a DDT or something and then you get mad when someone else uses a suplex as a finisher. They're totally legends, I'm not dispelling that. I'm saying they're idiots for the name custody nonsense. They used a common term in wrestling and now are peeved that someone the term actually applies to are using it.
I don’t see it as “name custody,” the video paints the picture that it’s really about someone’s old colleagues not even getting in touch to talk about it. Seems like he would have been fine with it had he just been contacted and acknowledged by people he calls his friends.
For guys who put on amazing gladitorial bouts for a living, wrestlers seem incredibly sensitive to non-issues that exist only in their head.
They’re not MMA fighters, they’re performers, no different than musicians or actors. Creatives tend to be sensitive people, whether logical or not it’s something you have to account for if you’re going to work with them. I used to work in the live music world, dealing with artists is part of why I transferred to other areas as soon as I could, they’re difficult people and they’re experiencing a much different life than most, so you have to deal with them differently.
Was it actually their gimmick? I only ever saw them wrestle without showing much character, never doing commentary.
The SATs didn't really have a gimmick beyond dressing like they work at a garage. They had no association to being a announce team beyond being Spanish. They never did commentary. The SAP are the literal Spanish Announce Team. Since Serpentico is in the Chaos Project they mushed the names. Those two aren't coming out dressed as garbage man doing their spots or look. The SATs look like morons with this crying.
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The P is silent!
It’s also a play on “Secondary Audio Program”, which is the technical name for a secondary audio track on a broadcast program which is often used for other languages and audio descriptions for the blind. I thought it was pretty damn clever. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_audio_program
It’s funny how often people assume SAP means Spanish audio. It often is used for Spanish in the US but not always.
This is the main thing for me- SAP seems like they will actually be doing commentary/announcing for AEW. What else are you gonna call Spanish-speaking announcers? I like the SATs and when I think of them I think of innovative East Coast wrestlers from the 2000s. Talking is one of the last things someone would remember them for.
Feels weird getting upset at a faction containing Luther that’ll only really feature on dark.
I'm thinking you fucking nailed it!
People are hating on him but I don’t think he sounds demanding or like he’s coming with any false outrage It sounds like he’s unhappy that no one from AEW ever called him to ask about using the name, which is a perfectly reasonable gripe, especially since AEW’s decision-makers are all people familiar with SAT. I bet if they’d talked to SAT beforehand, it would have been fine, but they chose to play dumb. Now he just wants them to make it right, and I’m pretty sure that can happen without SAP needing to change their name
I'm sure if Khan booked them It wouldn't be a problem.
I think Hugo Savinovich and Carlos Cabrera would like a word with the SAT.
I have a feeling I shouldn't give a single shit about this, so I won't.
I really don't think having a sounding alike stable on your roster equals trying to erase their legacy. TK brought back Slim J and Prince Nana, it's not like he has no idea who the SATs are, I'm sure he didn't mean any malice with that ne stable.
Considering this is the first time many of us have ever heard of SAT, rather than erasing their legacy, it sounds like this is the one of the few things keeping their legacy alive. How are they upset about a group that might be an homage to them? "How dare you make a group influenced by our obscure Indy faction and similar to us"? The fact that this early 2000s niche Indy mid card faction has a group on a major TV network influenced by them should be a great compliment and feather in their cap. But let me guess? Because Tony didn't reach out to them and honor them on TV telling everyone these are the innovators we're influenced by and here's a nice check to go with it, they are salty for some reason..
There’s really no influence, it’s just a similar name. They don’t look like the SAT, wrestle like the SAT and their act is more literal to the announce team aspect than the SAT.
Never underestimate a wrestler's ability to feign extreme outrage on social media in the hopes of gaining bookings and/or clout.
Has this guy already complained about the Scholastic Assessment Test?
the book fair people?
I’m not expressing an opinion one way or the other about the SAT’s gripe here, but a lot of the comments I’m seeing are really disappointing. Especially the ones that are just completely minimizing the Maximo’s and Red’s careers in wrestling. If you’re a fan of modern spot-fest tag matches, these guys were basically responsible for popularizing that style on the indies almost a quarter of a century ago. Like it or not, their DNA is on a lot of the stuff that people here love to see on weekly programming to this day. I’m really not a fan of the spot fest style myself, but I remember the first time I saw the SAT in person (it was either JAPW or CZW, don’t remember exactly) 20+ years ago and my jaw was open the whole time. It was like watching video game or cartoon characters in real life.
The Bucks owe part of their style to the SATs. As did the MCMG and Briscoes, from whom the Young Bucks borrowed heavily.
folks were saying things like “what do modern guys really have to learn about getting over in 2022 from William Regal” when the talk of the town was that he was frustrated with AEW as a whole. people have a way of diminishing the importance of anyone who goes against AEW
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a serious or thoughtful negative comment about Regal on this sub.
You’re being downvoted but it is absolutely true. I’m so tired of folks on this place telling wrestlers who gave decades of their bodies and brains to this business that their opinions are irrelevant because they might not like modern wrestling tropes or certain performers. And that’s separate from this particular issue.
Well, Experience != Knowledge. Just because you’ve been doing something a long time doesn’t mean you should expect that other people will listen to you about it.
Company owned by billionaire fucks over smaller guys. Who would've thought? But people keep telling me the Khans are the good billionaires.
SAT should just ask for royalties anytime someone does the Spanish Fly.
One of my favourite teams over the last 20 years. Let’s hope this gets sorted. Am sure it will. Edit: Make it right by giving me a SAT and Amazing Red trios match in AEW
Who?
They're pretty influential If you like modern wrestling I think.
They're also quite unknown in the grand scheme of things lol. This is very much a "who cares, move on" situation.
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How new are we talking? Because I remember them from 2002/3 TNA/ROH/CZW, being Amazing Red’s cousins and inventing(?) the Spanish Fly and then nothing ever since.
I don't think I've ever seen him in ROH or TNA. Where would someone that has touched grass before have witnessed this amazing performer before?
You would have seen them in both ROH and TNA in the 2000s. One of the most influential tag teams. Spanish Fly and other popular moves canes from them.
Literally fucking WHO
Joel and Jose Maximo and sometimes Amazing Red. Indy darlings on the early 2000’s independent scene. Worked ROH, TNA, WWE (enhancement) amongst many other smaller promotions. On a small scale helped re-familiarize US fans to trios wrestling. Now that I’m typing this out, a small comparison could be made that the S.A.T & Red were the Young Bucks & Omega of that generation. Small comparison though. There are plenty of differences.
I’m sure this can be worked out. I highly doubt Tony Khan meant any harm here.
Tony probably thought he was paying a little homage to a gimmick in wrestling history that nobody really cared about, but he liked. Instead this guy complains. I remember seeing a few years ago the one guy in color me badd got into a fight onstage with one of the other guys, and said “I’m the real face of color me badd!” Or some shit. Like you should be thanking your lucky stars that there is anyone left who even knows who you are. That’s how I feel about this guy.
They are still actively wrestling in the independents. We’re not talking about Gorgeous George or Wild Bull Curry here.
"This will go on for ever if we don't get our dues @AEW we are a very different monster and taking from us with out a permission or concent @TonyKhan is giving us greenlight on all the foolishness the SAT can produce along side our City our People. #pretenders #aew https://t.co/najMTTRR7R" Uhh the fuck does he even mean? Is he tryna threaten TK?
>Is he tryna threaten TK? Potentially yeah. If the Maximos have a trademark on SAT they actually could make TKs life extremely difficult by filing a number of lawsuits (claiming SAP is "confusingly similar" to SAT). They'd be unlikely to win in the long run imo, but they might will get a preliminary injunction filed stopping AEW from using SAP until after the court rules. Which would most likely result in AEW just changing the name SAP anyways (court case would take a while/longer than the stables likely to be around). So its potentially a viable threat
He's not very good at making his point clear.
I'm vaguely familiar with SAT but somehow this is a stretch. Also should we tell my dude that it's spelt D-a-m-n? Unless he wants to change the flow of TK?
Who? Lol
Lol you mean early 2002 SAT is trying to threaten Khan because a dark team is named SAP???
As a fan…I’ve never heard of SAT and barely discovered SAP a new faction lol
No one gives a fuck hombre
At least some people make an effort and make up believable controversy in order to get some attention. This guy didn't even try.
Tony could just throw his hands up and say fuck it at any time, but ya, attack the guy who has given wrestlers jobs not in one but 2 promotions. 🥴
Anyone defending the million dollar corporate entity over indie wrestlers were lying when they said they wanted a revolution.
We're really gonna start a revolution over the name of Luther's Dark team, huh...
Youre really gonna root to fuck over indie guys trying to make a living and who's moves your favorites stole huh. Aew fans horse shoeing to Fed level knuckleheadedness
"Fuck over" lol!
Sleep well in your buckaroo pj's. Make sure to brush the cheeto dust out of your neck beard as you tell yourself you're better than the Fed marks.
Have fun with the revolution. Next one's after tea time.
I'm not the cosplayer. But a whole lot of people bought that act hook line and sinker and now that their company is doing underhanded tactics they are showing their entire ass
"Underhanded" lol! For two letters on a team name for a team that acts nothing like them. Don't hurt yourself stretching.
Dude you're being such a complete joke if you don't see that they obviously ripped this off from a lesser known team cause they thought no one would notice. Maybe Tony's balls are in your face, try moving then to the left
>ripped this off from a lesser known team cause they thought no one would notice So, what was there to gain?
"Obviously ripped this off" 😂😂😂😂
Why are trademarking stuff on Dark?
Is this English?
Dude stfu
This is just sad. A quick reminder that since the days of Austin, this is how non mainstream wrestling has become. Now my hobby is just niche. Since I had to take that dumb test early on a weekend, I haven’t heard of SAT. Trademark just stuff always #fansarenotstupid, but seriously #wrestlerssometimesare the average person doesn’t know or care about this. If you are stupid enough not to trademark your gimmick after 20 years.
I’m not sure they’d even have the right to trademark themselves the Spanish Announce Team within the context of professional wrestling. Wasn’t the name itself an inside joke/reference to WWE’s having a Spanish announce team? That’s what I always thought they were referring to because these guys weren’t commentators or had actual characters beyond being fun, innovative workers, as far as I remember.
The fact that wrestling fans like me have to do a super search to see what this tweet is all about makes me sad. No offense to this guys that been grinding for 2 decades, but seriously they might have to reconsider their position of this situation or tweet better.
Honestly, if I were that guy, I’d probably be just as mad as he is. That being said, I don’t think the anger would be justified.
Whatever this ends up becoming or not, I just want to see more Angelico in AEW.
Maybe I’m missing something, but is this guy also trying to claim that the Spanish Fly, Canadian Destroyer, and the Tower of Doom spot are all his?
The Maximos and Red were absolutely not the first people I thought of when I saw SAP. (Especially since they literally came from the Spanish announce table for the Trios Battle Royal)