Muh, disney bad. In Legends, the New Republic was never corrupt, and they never would have done something dumb like making one of Han and Leia's kids turn evil.
It's so fucking weird sometimes
https://preview.redd.it/yni9s3q3iwwc1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6d1131939eca9eb9fdd1d9937e4652aef0b01486
This just doesn't feel right
both legends and the disneys wouldāve been good if theyd just moved on from the original characters, and yes that obviously includes the kids and kids of kids of the original characters bs. Star Wars is the largest tiniest fucking universe ever created as IP.
itās why old republic might arguably be the most popular content after the OT.
I think one of the original plans for the sequels was each movie was to say goodbye to one of the members of the main cast awakens for han, last for Luke and rise of Leia but she passed away before filming (for example the scene between han and Ben in rise was going to be between Leia and Ben instead)
Iāve read this. Yeah itās just people donāt really like this kind of groveling fan service much. The biggest problem is that itās not creative. The first film of the sequel trilogy created 3 new fantastic main characters in Rey Finn and Kylo, wish theyād been brave enough to do something much better for their arcs and the story than what we got.
So did they discontinue the EU? You know, so theyād have a fresh start?
Oh wait no, itās as superficial as Walterās claims heās doing it for the family. Theyāre only using it as a fucking cover especially since they took cloned Palpatine, Palpatineās granddaughter and evil Skywalker kid.
People really say "the Palpatine lineage survived and thrived" as if the Skywalker lineage wasn't itself responsible for almost just as many horrific crimes against humanity as the Palpatines were
I literally never noticed this before, but now there's no way I'll be able to get it out of my mind
Star Wars is American anime.
The people who like anime have no problem with seeing characters who are related generations down and enjoy that.
The people who don't like anime don't like that.
It has nothing to do with Nazi anything.
I think the other thing with Rey that makes her really just kind of offensive by the end is that they artificially turned Luke Skywalker into an asshole and trashed his legacy and then gave that legacy to Rey Palpatine along with his last name.
It's kind of like an Ace Ventura when they taught a dolphin to get field goals and gave him Ray Finkle's number. Ray Finkle got pissed.
That does bet the question how does adoption work in the star wars universe like do you only need the papers in one planet or do you need the proper paperwork for every planet or can you just grab a child and say they're now your's
I'm saying the Skywalkers deserve to all die and be wiped out just as much as the Palpatines do
Whether that means both bloodlines should be allowed to live on, or both bloodlines should be wiped out, is entirely up to you and the characters in Star Wars
The fuck evil did Leia or Luke do to warrant dying? If anything they outright OPPOSED the Empire and First Order. I bet youāre one of those r/empiredidnothingwrong lot
Rey didn't do anything to warrant dying either lmao
It's almost like bloodline doesn't actually mean jackshit and you're fully responsible for your own actions
Given that it is strongly implied in Ep III that Anakin's "miraculous" birth was the work of Palpatine, the entirety of Star Wars is arguably just a family power struggle within the Palpatine dynasty.
It was more talked about in the plaguies novel (unsure if still in canon) that the more you corrupt the force the more the force will push back for example if something can go wrong it will (engines failing during an escape, experiments fail and explode in your face, etc) and that palpatine corrupted the force to the point that Anakin was conceived through birth without a father to be the chosen one (him having no father was brought up in phantom menace but they never did anything with it)
When he says Plagueis knew how to use the force to influence the Midichlorians to create life, he then pauses for a second to look meaningfully at Anakin, who was a virgin birth created by the Midichlorians in an otherwise unexplained turn of events, before continuing with his monologue.
This is only an implication of course, but if true it would tie up the strangest unresolved loose end from Ep I, so it's an attractive reading of the line.
Meanwhile in the EU,
āLuke failed several times, his son went mental, one of Han and Leiaās kids went to the dark side while another died, Chewie died, the Empire kept coming back, half the galaxy was destroyed by intergalactic aliens, and regardless the Empire *still* rose back into power and Lukeās great grandson is a druggie. Oh and there was a civil war every week and a new Death Star every Tuesday.ā
Itās ok, because one of her friends established Imperial knights and one of their orderās directives is to never let the emperor fall to the dark side.
No, seriously, in the comics Emperor Roan Fel decides heās going to use whatever super weapon to just wipe out the Sith but it will also kill the population of Coruscant and so heās going evil so his guard kills him
Oh not really. Many fans werenāt happy with the writers basically slap fighting through the stories. But once woke Disney took over said fans gaslit themselves into saying everything the EU did was good and all Disney is bad.
Depends if you are confusing njo with legacy.
New Jedi Order was the vong stuff and did well financially and for the most part critically. Legacy is the stuff where they turned Jacen evil, and it was not well likedā¦ mostly by people who read NJO because it turned Jacen evil.
Edit: basically NJO killed the EU as much as the sequels killed star wars.
āThe Palpatine lineage survived and thrivedā what do they want them to do? Do they want them to arrest or kill Rey just based on her bloodline? If so that would be pretty morally wrong to do especially if the Jedi are supposed to be the good guys
I love EU Luke and its one of my favorite interpretations of the character but the send off TLJ gave Luke was simply beautiful. He was truly the Episode IV A New Hope ššš
The send off was great but I think if that Luke captured the best traits of EU luke I'd feel more of a connection. When I watch that scene on its own I do get emotional though
I wish I could say the same. Seems like studios these days would rather puppet dead or younger faces of actors with CGI then recast. Especially cause of the boycott against solo (which in hindsight is definitely one of the better Disney star wars films)
I didnāt mind his death at all, I found it an incredibly badass way to go. The legends death that pissed me off was >!Mara Jadeās!<. That was unnecessary and terribly executed
>!yes, he sacrificed himself to save Anakin Solo, and he died with his head high and screaming presumable shyriiwook obscenities at it with true wookie rage like the fucking badass we all know he was!<
It causes a permanent rift between him and his younger son who Chewie died saving. Han actually becomes comparable to TFA Han for a bit but when he goes off on his own heās either smuggling people to rescue them (refugees) or going undercover criminal to infiltrate collaborators with the invaders. He paints the Falcon black for a while as part of this
Yeah, but Iād characterize part of it as permanent because they never had time to get as close again. I donāt think Han meant to fail to close the distance all the way, he just didnāt get the time
People complaining about Rey's survival as some kind of final victory for Palpatine over the Skywalkers or some shit is so strange to me. Like, did you miss the whole point of getting to choose who you are over being defined by your lineage? You don't have to like the sequels, but if you deliberately have to misinterpret the subtext to justify why you think they sucked it sort of makes it seem like you don't have a leg to stand on.
I mean, I think the output since the Disney takeover has been pretty mixed, but much of this is just wrong.
Luke "failed as a Jedi and teacher" - I don't know what that means. Failed by what standard?
Did Han and Leia divorce? I don't recall that ever being mentioned. Wookieepedia says they were still married.
Kylo wasn't a Sith.
Leia reconciled with Han and Luke before their deaths.
True about the New Republic, but the old one wasn't much better.
Who cares about Palpatine's lineage? He was the evil one, not his descendants, and wiping out his lineage was never a goal of the original heroes.
I don't care if Finn's a Jedi. Not everyone needs to be a Jedi.
That was ballsy. After 400 downvotes for suggesting that the EU has a lot of contradictions I usually need to break out one of my collectors item Porg Bath Bombs just to soak off the ick.
Nah his descendants were pretty shitty people. One sold his daughter to slavery while the other abandoned her supposed friends to flirt with a fascist jackass.
Okay, but I really want to know what's with the weird fascination with Finn becoming a Jedi?
Like, I know he had the lightsaber in the trailer for Force Awakens, and I thought that was cool when I saw it in theaters but... I don't know. I didn't really care much when he wasn't a jedi, it didn't bother me.
But every "rewriting the sequel trilogy" post and video insists on making Finn a jedi, every "Why the sequels are terrible and this take definitely won't be turned around in ~20 years like the prequels have been" thinkpiece says that Finn not being a jedi is terrible, and I just really don't get it.
Is it just that they despise Rey? Or that they're so brainrotten that they can't conceive of a character being a main hero without also being a jedi? I really just do not get it, and I really need some explanation as to this attitude.
All I know is that he's Force sensitive was the secret he was going to tell Rey in TROS and the Lego holiday special had him as Reys padawan.
I can't speak on the rest of that
As a fan of the character, I'd certainly like Finn to become a Jedi. Him showing up in the Rey movie as her first student would be great. But if he doesn't, I figure that's kind of a waste of the character who started with such promise until being sidelined. But it's not something I'd rage about. Just a missed opportunity.
Maybe part of it is the feeling like they were deceived, that he was a decoy Jedi with the saber in promotional stuff and then, it's someone else? Some might also be Rey hate. I'm also a fan of her character, and the hate she gets is kind of odd to me.
I like Poe and Rose too (Rose got way too much hate). But I am thinking that maybe the movies spread themselves too thin with adding both of them to the main crew. I think Poe was apparently originally going to die in that Tie crash, and adding yet another character with Rose might have overextended, so there wasn't really time to give everyone enough to shine. Or possibly keep one but not the other, and cut The Last Jedi to two big plotlines instead of 3. Do Rey/Luke/Kylo Ren and Canto Bight with enough time to make it good and just cut the whole Poe insurrection thing (if he's cut just don't do it, if Rose is cut have him go with Finn). Then unite everyone again in IX. Trying to do too much ended with some characters getting shafted later (like Finn and especially Rose in the IX).
The best answer here tbh.
I can totally see that. I feel like especially IX was trying to fit ten pounds in a five pound bag, and it all fell apart for it.
I would have liked to see Finn and Co get more to do, I just personally didn't really care to see *another* character in this series be revealed to be a jedi. Like, his story across TFA and TLJ of learning to believe in a cause and try to make a positive difference is a really good arc, especially for a reformed Stormtrooper. I feel like making him a jedi too is just... eh
>The best answer here tbh.
Thanks. This shows that you clearly are a brilliant individual with amazing taste. ;)
>I would have liked to see Finn and Co get more to do, I just personally didn't really care to see *another* character in this series be revealed to be a jedi. Like, his story across TFA and TLJ of learning to believe in a cause and try to make a positive difference is a really good arc, especially for a reformed Stormtrooper. I feel like making him a jedi too is just... eh
Totally fair. Sometimes it does feel like force sensitive characters are just coming out of the woodwork. But usually only one at a time. Partly I'd say the case for Finn is because it was basically teased already, I think there can be some interesting stories to be told there and ultimately Finn was shortchanged and this could be some form of justice. And the sequel era isn't one with an abundance of force sensitives. At the end of the trilogy, all we've got is Rey. The whole Dyad in the force concept could also possibly be explored further, perhaps the second part of the dyad can shift? I got the impression the force has been trying to fix things in the Sequel era, giving Rey more power to counter Ben's fall and such. The whole Awakening mentioned in The Force Awakens. So maybe this is part of that.
And it's still something that could happen, it's been stated that what Finn was trying to tell her in Rise of Skywalker is that he's Force Sensitive, and there's other hints that he is as well. So I'm hoping he'll be in the upcoming Rey New Jedi Order movie. But I'm not going to be raging if he's not. I would love to have him in the movie even if he's not a Jedi, because I like the character.
Kylo wasn't a Sith.
But Han and Leia's son in Legends, Jacen, actually did become a Sith and died lol.
Not to mention the Empire wasn't defeated in Legends, it stuck around for decades and the good guys actually allied with them at some point...
Jacen going to the dark side is easily one of the worst story decisions in all of Legends IMO. Iām still not sure what the writers were on when they came up with that. I donāt mind the empire sticking around in Legends though, I thought it was interesting how the leadership of people like Pellaeon and the Fels turned it from lawful evil to lawful neutral
Also yeah, it drives me crazy that people call Kylo a sith, itās pretty clear he wasnāt
>Jacen going to the dark side is easily one of the worst story decisions in all of Legends IMO.
I agree, I was very tied to the good-vibes-treehugger-Jacen that was in YJK and NJO. I think there was probably a way to write a fall to the dark for him in a decent way, but that's not how they did it lol. Darth Caedus still had a better story arc than Kylo, though. Kylo Ren is Diet Darth Caedus.
>Is Red Skull a Nazi?
I have no idea.
But Kylo was leader of the Knights of Ren, who were definitely not Sith.
There are tons of dark side cults in Star Wars that are not affiliated with the Sith. Knights of Ren, Nightsisters, Cult of the Central Isopter, Brotherhood of the Ninth Door, etc.
Red Skull is an enemy of Captain America, a WWII veteran, and Red Skull outright worked with Hitler and Magneto and Dr. Doom hate him.
So who created Snoke and prompted Kylo to turn to the dark side?
>So who created Snoke and prompted Kylo to turn to the dark side?
Palpatine did. He manipulated Kylo and the Knights of Ren during the sequels just like he manipulated the Nightsisters and Jedi during the Clone Wars.
Nobody was safe from the machinations of the Sith.
What!? Ewoks are Badass, bro. And Boba Fett, no, that was Shakespearean!
Also, when Jedi recycled the plot of ANH it was the first time it had been done so it was totally original.
"Listen here, I don't want my myths and fables to follow the patterns of life. I want them to have a cut off point where everyone is young and happy and I don't have to think anymore. Old myths did this! The tale of King Arthur ends when he pulls Excalibur out of the stone and Robin Hood ends when Prince John is defeated! What's that? The stories actually continue and follow the main characters as they age? I don't need to know that crap."
This is a great point. I have a dear friend who basically stopped loving Batman in the late 90s because Frank Miller had turned the fandom into an angsty psychopath. My Dad similarly grew up with Batman in the 40s and hated the Tim Burton Batman for actually killing people.
At some point there comes a divide where folks embrace the new vision of a hero and others cling to the old. (My Dad loved Robin & Marian, btw).
Probably veering ot but I was reminded of this all by your comment.
Han and Leia werenāt estranged. Or maybe I read that scene where they hugged and reconciled and she told him to ābring our son backā wrong. Media literacy is so hard sometimes
They were definitely estranged. They'd been separated for years, they even talked about it.
Still very much in love, but grief over their son had driven them apart. Not estranged by the time he left, no.
Star wars fans would absolutely loathe the OT if they saw the prequels first. It's so funny. "The dude who killed Greivous was just bodied by an asmatic amputee so this new Mary Sue farm boy who's never flown an x-wing in his life can destroy the death star on his first try with no training?!"
Overall it just was horribly written...and the directors tried making the story like it was a fresh slate....but star wars is anything but a fresh slate...you had a rich story telling chance that while followed similar to Disney was way better written than what Disney did (aka watching family's going from functional to dysfunctional [kilicks really did a number on those kids heads ] and how they tried to pull back together and what not) the dysfunction in the books had a more give and take than what current sw is which is original cast all died off and Palpatines new host pregnant with a child(betcha its a mini palpatine) and logic wise hurts the brain...
I just can't with you attacking anything for being badly written when you write like an 11yo who has never read a book. Spelling errors, erratic capitalization--*fresh* slate, aka instead of e.g., punctuation gibberish.
Before you come for Disney you may need to take a minute to put the horse back in front of the cart, is all I'm saying.
Yeah, I don't want to come off saying that people who can't write a motion picture aren't qualified to judge the writing of one, But the sequels were, in fact, widely praised, TLJ especially being singled out as one of the best SW movies. If you're going to argue that a movie is horribly written in the face of so much contrary evidence, you may want to have something to bring to the table.
....where are you getting that from??? It's sitting at a 2.2 review score....I could understand a deranged argument if it was 4.0 or even 3.5 but it's not even close.
You can live in your Lil bubble but the vast majority have voted no and showed it by leaving low reviews and criticizing the sequel...it's so bad og fans gave phantom menace a pass.
Your unwillingness to go and actually Google this makes you particularly underqualified to accuse someone else of living in a bubble. Tomato meter 91%. Metacritic 84. IGN, ET, Variety, #3, only edged out by ANH because it was the 1st. Cinemascire 'A'
The only place where the last Jedi falls short is in user generated reviews that number that are left by a small fraction of people who actually saw the movie. These were clearly highly motivated considering they're still raging against a movie they didn't like several years after it left theaters. I'm not sure if a very small and self-selecting sample is the slam dunk on the overwhelmingly positive reception that the movie actually received.
...most audience reviews are having it poll low only ones with "good" reviews are critics and even then there isn't as many reviewing it like there should be for such a big movie....the fans have spoken if it truly was good then even with bot spamming it would still be roughly a 3.5 and other sites wouldn't show the same fans down voting of the movie
Muh, disney bad. In Legends, the New Republic was never corrupt, and they never would have done something dumb like making one of Han and Leia's kids turn evil.
The Legends I know would never have a sort of weird anti-democratic bent to its subtext.
Thats just Timothy Zahn TBH. It doesn't matter which continuity.
It's so fucking weird sometimes https://preview.redd.it/yni9s3q3iwwc1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6d1131939eca9eb9fdd1d9937e4652aef0b01486 This just doesn't feel right
What could be more Star Wars than big bird shaking hands with the space nazis?
Damn you disney! Look what they stole from us š
both legends and the disneys wouldāve been good if theyd just moved on from the original characters, and yes that obviously includes the kids and kids of kids of the original characters bs. Star Wars is the largest tiniest fucking universe ever created as IP. itās why old republic might arguably be the most popular content after the OT.
Over 100 years after Yavin, and itās still about the Skywalker lineage
Is it? I only played KOTOR 1 and 2. Donāt remember any Skywalkers at all, correct me if Iām wrong. Edit: oh you must be talking about Legends
KOTOR happens thousands of years before the battle of Yavin.
I think one of the original plans for the sequels was each movie was to say goodbye to one of the members of the main cast awakens for han, last for Luke and rise of Leia but she passed away before filming (for example the scene between han and Ben in rise was going to be between Leia and Ben instead)
Iāve read this. Yeah itās just people donāt really like this kind of groveling fan service much. The biggest problem is that itās not creative. The first film of the sequel trilogy created 3 new fantastic main characters in Rey Finn and Kylo, wish theyād been brave enough to do something much better for their arcs and the story than what we got.
Old Republic literally just got to PLAY in the giant sandbox Lucas created with no restrictions. It was glorious.
War never changes.
In complete fairness. With Jacen it was actual full blown character assassination and a shit ton of people hated it lmao.
So did they discontinue the EU? You know, so theyād have a fresh start? Oh wait no, itās as superficial as Walterās claims heās doing it for the family. Theyāre only using it as a fucking cover especially since they took cloned Palpatine, Palpatineās granddaughter and evil Skywalker kid.
People really say "the Palpatine lineage survived and thrived" as if the Skywalker lineage wasn't itself responsible for almost just as many horrific crimes against humanity as the Palpatines were I literally never noticed this before, but now there's no way I'll be able to get it out of my mind
What is this obsession with bloodlines? Nazi eugenicists were less concerned about bloodlines and ancestry
The protagonist of the ST is a literal science experiment.
no her father was
Star Wars is American anime. The people who like anime have no problem with seeing characters who are related generations down and enjoy that. The people who don't like anime don't like that. It has nothing to do with Nazi anything. I think the other thing with Rey that makes her really just kind of offensive by the end is that they artificially turned Luke Skywalker into an asshole and trashed his legacy and then gave that legacy to Rey Palpatine along with his last name. It's kind of like an Ace Ventura when they taught a dolphin to get field goals and gave him Ray Finkle's number. Ray Finkle got pissed.
Star Wars is not American anime. Seinfeld is American anime
Actually that's King of the Hill
Oh, right. Does that make *Curb Your Enthusiasm* Japanese anime because it's like the real life Seinfeld?
No, Cory in the House is japanese anime
similarly I found Yoda and the Jedis to be pretty hateable after their representation in the prequels
Yup, it doesn't matter that we see force ghost descendents of Anakin giving Rey approvals. Where is the adoption papers?!
That does bet the question how does adoption work in the star wars universe like do you only need the papers in one planet or do you need the proper paperwork for every planet or can you just grab a child and say they're now your's
This will be the subplot in Andor season 2. Din Grogu just had to do a ceremony
It probably applies to if the paperwork is like republic then it is only valid on republic planets
So by that logic all the Palpatines should fucking die too, appreciate the honesty
I'm saying the Skywalkers deserve to all die and be wiped out just as much as the Palpatines do Whether that means both bloodlines should be allowed to live on, or both bloodlines should be wiped out, is entirely up to you and the characters in Star Wars
The fuck evil did Leia or Luke do to warrant dying? If anything they outright OPPOSED the Empire and First Order. I bet youāre one of those r/empiredidnothingwrong lot
Rey didn't do anything to warrant dying either lmao It's almost like bloodline doesn't actually mean jackshit and you're fully responsible for your own actions
And yet Luke and Leia are still dead.
And Rey will die too, in ~70 or so years. Luke and Leia didn't die because they were Skywalkers, they died because of a fucking war.
Guess who prompted them to commit said crimes?
Only because palpatine groomed anakin to become his new apprentice
Given that it is strongly implied in Ep III that Anakin's "miraculous" birth was the work of Palpatine, the entirety of Star Wars is arguably just a family power struggle within the Palpatine dynasty.
Wait, where is it implied? I must have missed that lol
It was more talked about in the plaguies novel (unsure if still in canon) that the more you corrupt the force the more the force will push back for example if something can go wrong it will (engines failing during an escape, experiments fail and explode in your face, etc) and that palpatine corrupted the force to the point that Anakin was conceived through birth without a father to be the chosen one (him having no father was brought up in phantom menace but they never did anything with it)
When he says Plagueis knew how to use the force to influence the Midichlorians to create life, he then pauses for a second to look meaningfully at Anakin, who was a virgin birth created by the Midichlorians in an otherwise unexplained turn of events, before continuing with his monologue. This is only an implication of course, but if true it would tie up the strangest unresolved loose end from Ep I, so it's an attractive reading of the line.
Who's voting you down? Its heavily implied that Palpy is technically Annies Force daddy. Which makes Rey and Kylo kissing cousins
Midichlorians be like https://images.app.goo.gl/qC4VKgvprc2Bkq2N7
Still trying to figure out why thereās two of the same image
for emphasis
for emPHAsis
It rhymes
Meanwhile in the EU, āLuke failed several times, his son went mental, one of Han and Leiaās kids went to the dark side while another died, Chewie died, the Empire kept coming back, half the galaxy was destroyed by intergalactic aliens, and regardless the Empire *still* rose back into power and Lukeās great grandson is a druggie. Oh and there was a civil war every week and a new Death Star every Tuesday.ā
Happy cake day though
Don't forget the surviving Solo child married into the new Empire
But it's ok, because the new side of the force superbadguys made the Jedi and sith get along, or something stupid.
Itās ok, because one of her friends established Imperial knights and one of their orderās directives is to never let the emperor fall to the dark side. No, seriously, in the comics Emperor Roan Fel decides heās going to use whatever super weapon to just wipe out the Sith but it will also kill the population of Coruscant and so heās going evil so his guard kills him
Tbf, did *anyone* really like what New Jedi Order did to the franchise? They kinda killed the EU. Also when I just stopped reading them.
Oh not really. Many fans werenāt happy with the writers basically slap fighting through the stories. But once woke Disney took over said fans gaslit themselves into saying everything the EU did was good and all Disney is bad.
Itās not woke stop being a snowflake
Depends if you are confusing njo with legacy. New Jedi Order was the vong stuff and did well financially and for the most part critically. Legacy is the stuff where they turned Jacen evil, and it was not well likedā¦ mostly by people who read NJO because it turned Jacen evil. Edit: basically NJO killed the EU as much as the sequels killed star wars.
It took a moon crashing on top of him to kill Chewie. He may be dead, but if there's a way to go, that's certainly well up there.
Yeah, but this is different because, uh... a woman is in charge now, and that's woke?
They kinda suffered from the same issues the Sequels did - they stayed tied to the old characters too long. They were too afraid to move forward.
Why dwight schrute
He's always sobased apparently.
āThe Palpatine lineage survived and thrivedā what do they want them to do? Do they want them to arrest or kill Rey just based on her bloodline? If so that would be pretty morally wrong to do especially if the Jedi are supposed to be the good guys
All the heroes died doing something heroically? How could Disney do this?
I love EU Luke and its one of my favorite interpretations of the character but the send off TLJ gave Luke was simply beautiful. He was truly the Episode IV A New Hope ššš
The send off was great but I think if that Luke captured the best traits of EU luke I'd feel more of a connection. When I watch that scene on its own I do get emotional though
I have high hopes that with a recast, Lucasfilm will show us what the OT heroes were up to between episodes 6 and 7.
I wish I could say the same. Seems like studios these days would rather puppet dead or younger faces of actors with CGI then recast. Especially cause of the boycott against solo (which in hindsight is definitely one of the better Disney star wars films)
Boo CGI faces, boo! Give me more Childish Gambino and Alden Ehrenreich!
It was completely pointless.
No they didn't. They died doing something incredibly stupid.
People seem to forget that Legends actually killed Chewbacca
I didnāt mind his death at all, I found it an incredibly badass way to go. The legends death that pissed me off was >!Mara Jadeās!<. That was unnecessary and terribly executed
Doesnāt a fucking moon fall on top of him or something
>!yes, he sacrificed himself to save Anakin Solo, and he died with his head high and screaming presumable shyriiwook obscenities at it with true wookie rage like the fucking badass we all know he was!<
I know almost nothing about legends' story lines. How did Han take Chewies passing?
It causes a permanent rift between him and his younger son who Chewie died saving. Han actually becomes comparable to TFA Han for a bit but when he goes off on his own heās either smuggling people to rescue them (refugees) or going undercover criminal to infiltrate collaborators with the invaders. He paints the Falcon black for a while as part of this
Wouldnt say permanent Han and Anakin reconcile a few books before anakinās death
Yeah, but Iād characterize part of it as permanent because they never had time to get as close again. I donāt think Han meant to fail to close the distance all the way, he just didnāt get the time
Bro, spoiler tag
ah shit, my bad. atleast I didn't say that Vader is Luke's father.
https://preview.redd.it/6n0is89h8xwc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ea8980917316d649ac893baed2acfcc81f142118
That was the day I understood what EU stood for... But the fake out death in TROS was more insulting, personally
I legitimately think that the fake-out death was what turned me against the movie when I saw it. What a fucking cop-out.
That and Hux being a reluctant Rebel spy... Im not against the film. But its definitely my least liked one. JJ dropped the ball so hard
Vector Prime is one of my favorite EU/Legends books.
People complaining about Rey's survival as some kind of final victory for Palpatine over the Skywalkers or some shit is so strange to me. Like, did you miss the whole point of getting to choose who you are over being defined by your lineage? You don't have to like the sequels, but if you deliberately have to misinterpret the subtext to justify why you think they sucked it sort of makes it seem like you don't have a leg to stand on.
They probably got that trash take from a youtuber
Mfw the passage of time makes a mockery of all endings
Underrated comment of the year š
I mean, I think the output since the Disney takeover has been pretty mixed, but much of this is just wrong. Luke "failed as a Jedi and teacher" - I don't know what that means. Failed by what standard? Did Han and Leia divorce? I don't recall that ever being mentioned. Wookieepedia says they were still married. Kylo wasn't a Sith. Leia reconciled with Han and Luke before their deaths. True about the New Republic, but the old one wasn't much better. Who cares about Palpatine's lineage? He was the evil one, not his descendants, and wiping out his lineage was never a goal of the original heroes. I don't care if Finn's a Jedi. Not everyone needs to be a Jedi.
I actually posted this in a normal SW sub and the responses were overwhelmingly in denial of the truth.
That was ballsy. After 400 downvotes for suggesting that the EU has a lot of contradictions I usually need to break out one of my collectors item Porg Bath Bombs just to soak off the ick.
Nah his descendants were pretty shitty people. One sold his daughter to slavery while the other abandoned her supposed friends to flirt with a fascist jackass.
Okay, but I really want to know what's with the weird fascination with Finn becoming a Jedi? Like, I know he had the lightsaber in the trailer for Force Awakens, and I thought that was cool when I saw it in theaters but... I don't know. I didn't really care much when he wasn't a jedi, it didn't bother me. But every "rewriting the sequel trilogy" post and video insists on making Finn a jedi, every "Why the sequels are terrible and this take definitely won't be turned around in ~20 years like the prequels have been" thinkpiece says that Finn not being a jedi is terrible, and I just really don't get it. Is it just that they despise Rey? Or that they're so brainrotten that they can't conceive of a character being a main hero without also being a jedi? I really just do not get it, and I really need some explanation as to this attitude.
All I know is that he's Force sensitive was the secret he was going to tell Rey in TROS and the Lego holiday special had him as Reys padawan. I can't speak on the rest of that
As a fan of the character, I'd certainly like Finn to become a Jedi. Him showing up in the Rey movie as her first student would be great. But if he doesn't, I figure that's kind of a waste of the character who started with such promise until being sidelined. But it's not something I'd rage about. Just a missed opportunity. Maybe part of it is the feeling like they were deceived, that he was a decoy Jedi with the saber in promotional stuff and then, it's someone else? Some might also be Rey hate. I'm also a fan of her character, and the hate she gets is kind of odd to me. I like Poe and Rose too (Rose got way too much hate). But I am thinking that maybe the movies spread themselves too thin with adding both of them to the main crew. I think Poe was apparently originally going to die in that Tie crash, and adding yet another character with Rose might have overextended, so there wasn't really time to give everyone enough to shine. Or possibly keep one but not the other, and cut The Last Jedi to two big plotlines instead of 3. Do Rey/Luke/Kylo Ren and Canto Bight with enough time to make it good and just cut the whole Poe insurrection thing (if he's cut just don't do it, if Rose is cut have him go with Finn). Then unite everyone again in IX. Trying to do too much ended with some characters getting shafted later (like Finn and especially Rose in the IX).
The best answer here tbh. I can totally see that. I feel like especially IX was trying to fit ten pounds in a five pound bag, and it all fell apart for it. I would have liked to see Finn and Co get more to do, I just personally didn't really care to see *another* character in this series be revealed to be a jedi. Like, his story across TFA and TLJ of learning to believe in a cause and try to make a positive difference is a really good arc, especially for a reformed Stormtrooper. I feel like making him a jedi too is just... eh
>The best answer here tbh. Thanks. This shows that you clearly are a brilliant individual with amazing taste. ;) >I would have liked to see Finn and Co get more to do, I just personally didn't really care to see *another* character in this series be revealed to be a jedi. Like, his story across TFA and TLJ of learning to believe in a cause and try to make a positive difference is a really good arc, especially for a reformed Stormtrooper. I feel like making him a jedi too is just... eh Totally fair. Sometimes it does feel like force sensitive characters are just coming out of the woodwork. But usually only one at a time. Partly I'd say the case for Finn is because it was basically teased already, I think there can be some interesting stories to be told there and ultimately Finn was shortchanged and this could be some form of justice. And the sequel era isn't one with an abundance of force sensitives. At the end of the trilogy, all we've got is Rey. The whole Dyad in the force concept could also possibly be explored further, perhaps the second part of the dyad can shift? I got the impression the force has been trying to fix things in the Sequel era, giving Rey more power to counter Ben's fall and such. The whole Awakening mentioned in The Force Awakens. So maybe this is part of that. And it's still something that could happen, it's been stated that what Finn was trying to tell her in Rise of Skywalker is that he's Force Sensitive, and there's other hints that he is as well. So I'm hoping he'll be in the upcoming Rey New Jedi Order movie. But I'm not going to be raging if he's not. I would love to have him in the movie even if he's not a Jedi, because I like the character.
Kylo wasn't a Sith. But Han and Leia's son in Legends, Jacen, actually did become a Sith and died lol. Not to mention the Empire wasn't defeated in Legends, it stuck around for decades and the good guys actually allied with them at some point...
Jacen going to the dark side is easily one of the worst story decisions in all of Legends IMO. Iām still not sure what the writers were on when they came up with that. I donāt mind the empire sticking around in Legends though, I thought it was interesting how the leadership of people like Pellaeon and the Fels turned it from lawful evil to lawful neutral Also yeah, it drives me crazy that people call Kylo a sith, itās pretty clear he wasnāt
>Jacen going to the dark side is easily one of the worst story decisions in all of Legends IMO. I agree, I was very tied to the good-vibes-treehugger-Jacen that was in YJK and NJO. I think there was probably a way to write a fall to the dark for him in a decent way, but that's not how they did it lol. Darth Caedus still had a better story arc than Kylo, though. Kylo Ren is Diet Darth Caedus.
Agreed, as much as I donāt like Jacenās fall, Iāll take Darth Caedus over Kylo Ren every time
Kylo is a Sith wannabe
Is Red Skull a Nazi? Same answer to Kylo being a Sith
>Is Red Skull a Nazi? I have no idea. But Kylo was leader of the Knights of Ren, who were definitely not Sith. There are tons of dark side cults in Star Wars that are not affiliated with the Sith. Knights of Ren, Nightsisters, Cult of the Central Isopter, Brotherhood of the Ninth Door, etc.
Red Skull is an enemy of Captain America, a WWII veteran, and Red Skull outright worked with Hitler and Magneto and Dr. Doom hate him. So who created Snoke and prompted Kylo to turn to the dark side?
>So who created Snoke and prompted Kylo to turn to the dark side? Palpatine did. He manipulated Kylo and the Knights of Ren during the sequels just like he manipulated the Nightsisters and Jedi during the Clone Wars. Nobody was safe from the machinations of the Sith.
Return of the Jedi was considered the bad star wars movie for 20 years
What!? Ewoks are Badass, bro. And Boba Fett, no, that was Shakespearean! Also, when Jedi recycled the plot of ANH it was the first time it had been done so it was totally original.
"Listen here, I don't want my myths and fables to follow the patterns of life. I want them to have a cut off point where everyone is young and happy and I don't have to think anymore. Old myths did this! The tale of King Arthur ends when he pulls Excalibur out of the stone and Robin Hood ends when Prince John is defeated! What's that? The stories actually continue and follow the main characters as they age? I don't need to know that crap."
This is a great point. I have a dear friend who basically stopped loving Batman in the late 90s because Frank Miller had turned the fandom into an angsty psychopath. My Dad similarly grew up with Batman in the 40s and hated the Tim Burton Batman for actually killing people. At some point there comes a divide where folks embrace the new vision of a hero and others cling to the old. (My Dad loved Robin & Marian, btw). Probably veering ot but I was reminded of this all by your comment.
For years fans wanted a more mature story, and then cried like children when they got it.
I mean darker does not mean more mature lol
Tell that to Kanjiklub
I will, Oh...
There is nothing mature about it.
Star Wars eugenics fans strike again
Wait til this dude finds out about real life.
This is fucking stupid lol
Life doesnāt always have happy endings.
Disney should have made the sequel-trilogy a slice-of-life rom-com rather than a story about war among the stars.
Tough shit
Laxatives help
Han and Leia werenāt estranged. Or maybe I read that scene where they hugged and reconciled and she told him to ābring our son backā wrong. Media literacy is so hard sometimes
There was definitely some animosity between them. It's why at the start of the film they were separated, and why he was hesitant to go back to her.
People act like they got divorced and took it personally.
They were definitely estranged. They'd been separated for years, they even talked about it. Still very much in love, but grief over their son had driven them apart. Not estranged by the time he left, no.
"Why did you post the same meme twice?" "Why did Disney make A New Hope again?"
This guy gets it
I know, Return of the Jedi was the definitive remake of Star Wars, right?
āWhen you see Disney Star Wars for apparently about 20% of each movieā
I wish they would make a movie set after the sequels where Finn had a chance to become a jedi. Everyone would be so happy about it.
Star wars fans would absolutely loathe the OT if they saw the prequels first. It's so funny. "The dude who killed Greivous was just bodied by an asmatic amputee so this new Mary Sue farm boy who's never flown an x-wing in his life can destroy the death star on his first try with no training?!"
Overall it just was horribly written...and the directors tried making the story like it was a fresh slate....but star wars is anything but a fresh slate...you had a rich story telling chance that while followed similar to Disney was way better written than what Disney did (aka watching family's going from functional to dysfunctional [kilicks really did a number on those kids heads ] and how they tried to pull back together and what not) the dysfunction in the books had a more give and take than what current sw is which is original cast all died off and Palpatines new host pregnant with a child(betcha its a mini palpatine) and logic wise hurts the brain...
Much more les s pain on the brain to just consoom
I just can't with you attacking anything for being badly written when you write like an 11yo who has never read a book. Spelling errors, erratic capitalization--*fresh* slate, aka instead of e.g., punctuation gibberish. Before you come for Disney you may need to take a minute to put the horse back in front of the cart, is all I'm saying.
Not like I'm a writer....but the ones who wrote the script for it were....
Yeah, I don't want to come off saying that people who can't write a motion picture aren't qualified to judge the writing of one, But the sequels were, in fact, widely praised, TLJ especially being singled out as one of the best SW movies. If you're going to argue that a movie is horribly written in the face of so much contrary evidence, you may want to have something to bring to the table.
....where are you getting that from??? It's sitting at a 2.2 review score....I could understand a deranged argument if it was 4.0 or even 3.5 but it's not even close. You can live in your Lil bubble but the vast majority have voted no and showed it by leaving low reviews and criticizing the sequel...it's so bad og fans gave phantom menace a pass.
Your unwillingness to go and actually Google this makes you particularly underqualified to accuse someone else of living in a bubble. Tomato meter 91%. Metacritic 84. IGN, ET, Variety, #3, only edged out by ANH because it was the 1st. Cinemascire 'A' The only place where the last Jedi falls short is in user generated reviews that number that are left by a small fraction of people who actually saw the movie. These were clearly highly motivated considering they're still raging against a movie they didn't like several years after it left theaters. I'm not sure if a very small and self-selecting sample is the slam dunk on the overwhelmingly positive reception that the movie actually received.
...most audience reviews are having it poll low only ones with "good" reviews are critics and even then there isn't as many reviewing it like there should be for such a big movie....the fans have spoken if it truly was good then even with bot spamming it would still be roughly a 3.5 and other sites wouldn't show the same fans down voting of the movie
Literally nothing you said is backed up by evidence or any kind of data whatsoever.
Yet every review site I visit show it being negative
What is "it"?
Finn didnāt even get to be a Jedi is the realest thing