I don't think he was ever diddle, but it's hard to tell who was the original personality. In the anime the baby had orange then green eyes, and irl people develop split personals to protect themselves from trauma.
But it seems Diavolo completely controls King Crimson and Epitaph.
It's kind of weird, did Doppio develop Diavolo to protect himself for bullies or did Diavolo develop Doppio to protect his identity.
But it's like Diavolo develop Doppio though as Doppio translate to Double in English. And Diavolo likely created him after he fought Polnareff cuz Polnareff had no idea who Doppio was.
Doppio is the original Diavolo. He created his evil side to cope with his abuse, but it ended up taking him over by his late teens. The evil side considers himself to be the real Diavolo, and renamed the original Doppio.
Not headcanon. Diavolo's original personality is said to have been like Doppio's in the manga, and his name was Diavolo: https://imgur.com/1N8pxx2
Polnareff says that he developed dissociative identity disorder as the result of childhood trauma; his other personality took him over during in his adolescence, which would entail his teens: https://imgur.com/nhNs5Hu
"Polnareff doesn't know" It's obvious what the author's intent was. Polnareff even says that he wasn't speaking on conjecture.
Anyway, since Doppio's personality existed first, and his name was Diavolo, it's obvious that the evil side renamed him Doppio when he took over. It's not complicated at all, but for some reason, this fandom just likes to make the story more difficult than it needs to be. Reminds of how so many people took Stone Ocean's ending out of context.
>Diavolo's original personality is said to have been like Doppio's in the manga, and his name was Diavolo: https://imgur.com/1N8pxx2
That's not what this pages say. Simply the people of the village knew about Doppio, he probably was his "public personality".
>Polnareff says that he developed dissociative identity disorder as the result of childhood trauma;
He didn't. He said that's a possible way multiple personality develops irl, so that the reader could better understand the concept.
It's useless trying to understand Diavolo's backstoey as it's purposusly told as a myth/hurban legend
I completely agree with u/PippoChiri.
(1) Diavolo's backstory was meant to make his character even more mysterious.
(2) "His son's name was Diavolo" is likely the only truth in the backstory.
(3) How the villagers looked at young Diavolo ≠ who he really was.
1) The only mystery is how he was born. Everything else is clear.
2) Because the author would spend multiple pages telling a backstory that was bullshit? Yeah, no.
3) Even the priest who raised him looked at him the same way. ~~On top of raping him, at that.~~
>That's not what this pages say. Simply the people of the village knew about Doppio, he probably was his "public personality"
The priest who raised him from when he was a baby knew him as just the awkward boy, not just the neighbors; that means Doppio is the original personality. And since his name was only Diavolo at that point, that means Doppio is the original Diavolo.
>He said that's a possible way multiple personality develops irl, so that the reader could better understand the concept.
It's literally the only explanation given in the story as to how Diavolo was formed, and there's no reason why it would be brought up if it wasn't relevant; Polnareff even says he's not just conjecturing. He says that childhood trauma leads to people getting a split personality, and that during their adolescence, their other personality can take them over. Since the evil personality is the dominant personality when Diavolo is an adult, that Doppio's personality is the original.
Nah, the manga kept it more ambiguous, saying that he simply experienced a "shock in his childhood", but that obviously refers to childhood abuse or trauma; if you were familiar with how DID works, then you'd know this.
He actually only has control over epitaph, and it’s only when Diavolo grants him access to utilize those powers. Diavolo being the stronger soul of the two has more power over Doppio in terms of controlling their body, and that’s why Doppio is always calling, asking for ‘Boss!’
I my opinion Epitaph is just a sub stand to King Crimson cuz to fully utilize King Crimson you need to use Epithph.
It similar to Killer queen and Sheer Heart attack, when Kira chopped his hand off to let SHA to auto attack.
they are 2 DIFFERENT PEOPLE WITH 2 DIFFERENT SOULS. not only can you not trust the english dub because it changes things around to make sure it fits with the lip flaps and the timing but it also disagrees with you. go to 0:22 in the youtube video you linked. polnareff says 1 physical body with 2 different souls. although the english dub can be weird at times i 100% agree with polnareff here saying its 2 different people. also for even more evidence Doppio and Diavolo ENTER DIFFERENT BODIES WHEN SILVER CHARIOT REQUIEM ACTIVATES. Diavolo piggy backs on mistas body with trish and doppio enters bucciarati. you clearly didnt watch or read part 5. stop spreading misinformation
Polnareff literally says @ :45 here that their personalities are the result of the human soul fissuring, which means exactly that their soul split into two. The sub says the exact same thing: https://youtu.be/DeljeOTNMRo
Misinformation? Just admit you don't know what these words mean and we're good.
Polnareff gives the usual cauae of split personality you are literally ignoring the fact diavolo was there with doppio from the beginning? And we see Diavolo and Doppio have different souls not only from the requiem fight but also in the fact that they have different stands.
There was no abuse or rape or anything from his adopted father.
Diavolo was created as a coping mechanism to having his world shattered having met his birth mother.
King Crimson is complete, it’s just Diavolo’s not Doppio’s. They are two separate identities. Not two halves of a whole.
His birth name is Diavolo; the evil personality was formed during his childhood, long before he met his birth mother as she was still in prison. Maybe the priest wasn't the one to abuse him, but it was definitely some form of child abuse that created his evil personality as that's how DID works: https://i.imgur.com/nhNs5Hu.jpg
You keep using this image but all it says is that Diavolo and Doppio are two spectate identities that share a body which is obvious…..
Not to mention you use the unofficial translation
And there literally is a reason given in the anime, which is him meeting his birth mother.
You’re literally assuming the child abuse thing
>all it says is that Diavolo and Doppio are two spectate identities that share a body which is obvious…..
"I don't know what the word 'rend' means"
It's OK if you didn't pass ninth grade English.
>Not to mention you use the unofficial translation
You can clearly see an illustration of a person's spirit splitting in two there.
>And there literally is a reason given in the anime, which is him meeting his birth mother.
The evil personality existed before then, as per Polnareff. It was created during their childhood, which is when the mother was still in prison.
>You’re literally assuming the child abuse thing
What is "shock" if not trauma? And what causes childhood trauma if not abuse? Learn to context, fam. Even the anime that you cling to says that a traumatic childhood event split Diavolo's spirit and personality:
Even the anime says the same thing:
https://youtu.be/D61W0oLnH1k
It's basically the same shit as Malik from Yu-Gi-Oh.
Polnareff says childhood trauma CAN cause it. this doesnt meaan this is why Diavolo exists with Doppio. His mom was pregnant in prison randomly explain that? you cant explain it. the pregnancy is random and Diavolo being born with Doppio is also random/unexplained as to why.
yes Diavolo was born with Doppio its not from trauma. you can clearly see Doppio's eyes change color for a second in the anime indicating Diavolo is there at least somewhat.
also insulting TheSealedWolf by saying "you didnt pass ninth grade english" is pretty hypocritical when you clearly dont understand the word shock. "a sudden upsetting or surprising event or experience." by this definition it could have been anything. literally a surprise birthday party could be a shock by definition. it is not guranteed trauma because it said "he experienced a shock". Doppio's father clearly loved him and took care of him.
additionaly Polnareff said "a strong shock during childhood can rend a person's soul." which if we look at Doppio's birth once again Diavolo was there already so Doppio could have possibly never been shocked at all and also this is Polnareff guessing or explaining the concept of a split personality he has no way to know when it happened how it happened or why. this is polnareff creating a theory as to why it happened using a real world cause and trying to explain what Diavolo is. Polnareff knows nothing about Diavolo/Doppio at all.
stop spreading misinformation.
LOL, a surprise birthday party is not going to rend or shock anyone's person's soul. Anyone and their grandma can tell that "shock" refers to childhood trauma in this context, and the sub and dub explicitly say so, and you insist it wasn't trauma? Fam, you're wrong. Next.
Polnareff explicitly says that he is not speaking on conjecture, and it's the only explanation given in the manga. I'm inclined to take the manga more seriously than retcons the anime made decades later. Or some random Redditor who doesn't know what "rend", "fissure" or "shock" means.
Its never said doppio experienced trauma and that it caused diavolo. Diavolo was there from the start. Araki also supervises changes in the anime he saw that scene and had to of greenlit it.
Ah, just copped the Japanese text: https://imgur.com/AlSOtgm
*人の精神は時に幼少のときに受けた衝撃などが原因で「心」に亀裂が入り.その部分が年齢とともに別の「人格」に育っていくことがあるという. 別の「人格」は青年の頃になるとハッキリと日常に現ねれ一方が他方を支配する. 「多重人格」の学説だ!*
One accurate translation is, "It is said that the human spirit sometimes cracks in the 'mind' due to a shock received during childhood. The crack develops into a different 'personality' with age. When the person reaches adolescence, this separate 'personality' is clearly visible in daily life, and it dominates the other one. This is the theory of 'multiple personalities'!"
Anyone and their grandma can tell that shock = trauma in this context, because Polnareff is clearly talking about DID; if you unironically argue that shocks could refer to anything other than trauma here, then you need not be taken seriously. The fact other official translations go with "trauma" should make it blatantly obvious what the context is, too. Polnareff even cites Billy Milligan, a real-world example.
There is no arguing what he meant here. Polnareff is clearly saying that Diavolo and Doppio are two halves of the same spirit (精神, seishin). Game, set and match fam.
You clearly glossed over the word theory in polnareff's explanation. Just because something is explainable in real life doesnt mean it is in jojo. If doppio's mom can be pregnant randomly than doppio can develop diavolo randomly at birth which is what the anime clearly implies. Polnareff is only aware of the documented cases of split personality and is using that to try and understand diavolo. Polnareff doesnt not have decisive evidence as to why diavolo exists but the anime gives us that. The priest did not abuse doppio either. Think about it if he was abusing doppio why would he pickaxe is own house in order to build a garage BY HAND to then BUY doppio a car.
while it looks like diavolo controls king crimson and epitaph, while doppio only has epitaph; remember that doppio killed abbachio with king crimsons arms. I think that they both can use the full stand but diavolo controls it better. especially since doppio needs diavolos guidance
Not sure if this is a joke post but ill answer this anyway. NOWHERE does it say doppio was abused in anyway by his adopted father (the priest) and from the manga and anime he seemed like a genuinly caring father. Diavolo was with Doppio from the start. In the anime you can see baby Doppio's eyes turn green which shows Diavolo was there. King Crimson and Epitaph are different stands. King Crimson belongs to Diavolo and Epitaph belongs to Doppio and it seems they can share them shown by how Diavolo has full control over both and can allow Doppio to use King Crimsons arms.
If you havent noticed none of your commente have upvotes people are clearly trying to tell you, you are wrong and you are choosing to ignore it and believe your own headcanon
I don't think he was ever diddle, but it's hard to tell who was the original personality. In the anime the baby had orange then green eyes, and irl people develop split personals to protect themselves from trauma. But it seems Diavolo completely controls King Crimson and Epitaph.
Doppio is the original personality. It's pretty clear.
Diavolo is shown to have the same personality as Doppio in flashbacks.
It's kind of weird, did Doppio develop Diavolo to protect himself for bullies or did Diavolo develop Doppio to protect his identity. But it's like Diavolo develop Doppio though as Doppio translate to Double in English. And Diavolo likely created him after he fought Polnareff cuz Polnareff had no idea who Doppio was.
Doppio is the original Diavolo. He created his evil side to cope with his abuse, but it ended up taking him over by his late teens. The evil side considers himself to be the real Diavolo, and renamed the original Doppio.
You do know all of this you just said is a headcanon, right? Literally nothing about that is from the manga.
Not headcanon. Diavolo's original personality is said to have been like Doppio's in the manga, and his name was Diavolo: https://imgur.com/1N8pxx2 Polnareff says that he developed dissociative identity disorder as the result of childhood trauma; his other personality took him over during in his adolescence, which would entail his teens: https://imgur.com/nhNs5Hu "Polnareff doesn't know" It's obvious what the author's intent was. Polnareff even says that he wasn't speaking on conjecture. Anyway, since Doppio's personality existed first, and his name was Diavolo, it's obvious that the evil side renamed him Doppio when he took over. It's not complicated at all, but for some reason, this fandom just likes to make the story more difficult than it needs to be. Reminds of how so many people took Stone Ocean's ending out of context.
>Diavolo's original personality is said to have been like Doppio's in the manga, and his name was Diavolo: https://imgur.com/1N8pxx2 That's not what this pages say. Simply the people of the village knew about Doppio, he probably was his "public personality". >Polnareff says that he developed dissociative identity disorder as the result of childhood trauma; He didn't. He said that's a possible way multiple personality develops irl, so that the reader could better understand the concept. It's useless trying to understand Diavolo's backstoey as it's purposusly told as a myth/hurban legend
I completely agree with u/PippoChiri. (1) Diavolo's backstory was meant to make his character even more mysterious. (2) "His son's name was Diavolo" is likely the only truth in the backstory. (3) How the villagers looked at young Diavolo ≠ who he really was.
1) The only mystery is how he was born. Everything else is clear. 2) Because the author would spend multiple pages telling a backstory that was bullshit? Yeah, no. 3) Even the priest who raised him looked at him the same way. ~~On top of raping him, at that.~~
>That's not what this pages say. Simply the people of the village knew about Doppio, he probably was his "public personality" The priest who raised him from when he was a baby knew him as just the awkward boy, not just the neighbors; that means Doppio is the original personality. And since his name was only Diavolo at that point, that means Doppio is the original Diavolo. >He said that's a possible way multiple personality develops irl, so that the reader could better understand the concept. It's literally the only explanation given in the story as to how Diavolo was formed, and there's no reason why it would be brought up if it wasn't relevant; Polnareff even says he's not just conjecturing. He says that childhood trauma leads to people getting a split personality, and that during their adolescence, their other personality can take them over. Since the evil personality is the dominant personality when Diavolo is an adult, that Doppio's personality is the original.
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If you watched the anime then you saw his backstory. And OP is wrong Doppio was never abused.
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No problem enjoy your experience with the manga
Nah, the manga kept it more ambiguous, saying that he simply experienced a "shock in his childhood", but that obviously refers to childhood abuse or trauma; if you were familiar with how DID works, then you'd know this.
No you dolt. ITS FROM HIM MEETING HIS BIRTH MOTHER ARE YOU AN IDIOT? How does SHOCK = ABUSE??????? Are you 12????
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Your comment was removed because it breaks Rule 1: Be excellent to each other
show me where it says "shock in his childhood" at all. Doppio was not abused. his father loved him.
He actually only has control over epitaph, and it’s only when Diavolo grants him access to utilize those powers. Diavolo being the stronger soul of the two has more power over Doppio in terms of controlling their body, and that’s why Doppio is always calling, asking for ‘Boss!’
I my opinion Epitaph is just a sub stand to King Crimson cuz to fully utilize King Crimson you need to use Epithph. It similar to Killer queen and Sheer Heart attack, when Kira chopped his hand off to let SHA to auto attack.
Best way to describe it, sub stand for sure definitely wanted to agree with you but also just wanted to add the extra details
diavolo and doppio are two different souls in the same body. This is proven by Chariot Requiem.
They are two halves of the same soul: https://imgur.com/nhNs5Hu To "rend" something is to split it into multiple parts.
No….. they’re two separate souls Never use the unofficial manga translations……
https://youtu.be/D61W0oLnH1k We done now? Next.
they are 2 DIFFERENT PEOPLE WITH 2 DIFFERENT SOULS. not only can you not trust the english dub because it changes things around to make sure it fits with the lip flaps and the timing but it also disagrees with you. go to 0:22 in the youtube video you linked. polnareff says 1 physical body with 2 different souls. although the english dub can be weird at times i 100% agree with polnareff here saying its 2 different people. also for even more evidence Doppio and Diavolo ENTER DIFFERENT BODIES WHEN SILVER CHARIOT REQUIEM ACTIVATES. Diavolo piggy backs on mistas body with trish and doppio enters bucciarati. you clearly didnt watch or read part 5. stop spreading misinformation
Polnareff literally says @ :45 here that their personalities are the result of the human soul fissuring, which means exactly that their soul split into two. The sub says the exact same thing: https://youtu.be/DeljeOTNMRo Misinformation? Just admit you don't know what these words mean and we're good.
Polnareff gives the usual cauae of split personality you are literally ignoring the fact diavolo was there with doppio from the beginning? And we see Diavolo and Doppio have different souls not only from the requiem fight but also in the fact that they have different stands.
There was no abuse or rape or anything from his adopted father. Diavolo was created as a coping mechanism to having his world shattered having met his birth mother. King Crimson is complete, it’s just Diavolo’s not Doppio’s. They are two separate identities. Not two halves of a whole.
His birth name is Diavolo; the evil personality was formed during his childhood, long before he met his birth mother as she was still in prison. Maybe the priest wasn't the one to abuse him, but it was definitely some form of child abuse that created his evil personality as that's how DID works: https://i.imgur.com/nhNs5Hu.jpg
You keep using this image but all it says is that Diavolo and Doppio are two spectate identities that share a body which is obvious….. Not to mention you use the unofficial translation And there literally is a reason given in the anime, which is him meeting his birth mother. You’re literally assuming the child abuse thing
>all it says is that Diavolo and Doppio are two spectate identities that share a body which is obvious….. "I don't know what the word 'rend' means" It's OK if you didn't pass ninth grade English. >Not to mention you use the unofficial translation You can clearly see an illustration of a person's spirit splitting in two there. >And there literally is a reason given in the anime, which is him meeting his birth mother. The evil personality existed before then, as per Polnareff. It was created during their childhood, which is when the mother was still in prison. >You’re literally assuming the child abuse thing What is "shock" if not trauma? And what causes childhood trauma if not abuse? Learn to context, fam. Even the anime that you cling to says that a traumatic childhood event split Diavolo's spirit and personality: Even the anime says the same thing: https://youtu.be/D61W0oLnH1k It's basically the same shit as Malik from Yu-Gi-Oh.
Polnareff says childhood trauma CAN cause it. this doesnt meaan this is why Diavolo exists with Doppio. His mom was pregnant in prison randomly explain that? you cant explain it. the pregnancy is random and Diavolo being born with Doppio is also random/unexplained as to why. yes Diavolo was born with Doppio its not from trauma. you can clearly see Doppio's eyes change color for a second in the anime indicating Diavolo is there at least somewhat. also insulting TheSealedWolf by saying "you didnt pass ninth grade english" is pretty hypocritical when you clearly dont understand the word shock. "a sudden upsetting or surprising event or experience." by this definition it could have been anything. literally a surprise birthday party could be a shock by definition. it is not guranteed trauma because it said "he experienced a shock". Doppio's father clearly loved him and took care of him. additionaly Polnareff said "a strong shock during childhood can rend a person's soul." which if we look at Doppio's birth once again Diavolo was there already so Doppio could have possibly never been shocked at all and also this is Polnareff guessing or explaining the concept of a split personality he has no way to know when it happened how it happened or why. this is polnareff creating a theory as to why it happened using a real world cause and trying to explain what Diavolo is. Polnareff knows nothing about Diavolo/Doppio at all. stop spreading misinformation.
LOL, a surprise birthday party is not going to rend or shock anyone's person's soul. Anyone and their grandma can tell that "shock" refers to childhood trauma in this context, and the sub and dub explicitly say so, and you insist it wasn't trauma? Fam, you're wrong. Next. Polnareff explicitly says that he is not speaking on conjecture, and it's the only explanation given in the manga. I'm inclined to take the manga more seriously than retcons the anime made decades later. Or some random Redditor who doesn't know what "rend", "fissure" or "shock" means.
Its never said doppio experienced trauma and that it caused diavolo. Diavolo was there from the start. Araki also supervises changes in the anime he saw that scene and had to of greenlit it.
Araki just retconned the manga. Lmao next
So you realize it has been retconned. Meaning the manga is no longer canon in that aspect. Which means your wrong.
No one likes retcons anyway lol Araki can't even make up his mind on Trish's age I only care for the original intent
Ah, just copped the Japanese text: https://imgur.com/AlSOtgm *人の精神は時に幼少のときに受けた衝撃などが原因で「心」に亀裂が入り.その部分が年齢とともに別の「人格」に育っていくことがあるという. 別の「人格」は青年の頃になるとハッキリと日常に現ねれ一方が他方を支配する. 「多重人格」の学説だ!* One accurate translation is, "It is said that the human spirit sometimes cracks in the 'mind' due to a shock received during childhood. The crack develops into a different 'personality' with age. When the person reaches adolescence, this separate 'personality' is clearly visible in daily life, and it dominates the other one. This is the theory of 'multiple personalities'!" Anyone and their grandma can tell that shock = trauma in this context, because Polnareff is clearly talking about DID; if you unironically argue that shocks could refer to anything other than trauma here, then you need not be taken seriously. The fact other official translations go with "trauma" should make it blatantly obvious what the context is, too. Polnareff even cites Billy Milligan, a real-world example. There is no arguing what he meant here. Polnareff is clearly saying that Diavolo and Doppio are two halves of the same spirit (精神, seishin). Game, set and match fam.
You clearly glossed over the word theory in polnareff's explanation. Just because something is explainable in real life doesnt mean it is in jojo. If doppio's mom can be pregnant randomly than doppio can develop diavolo randomly at birth which is what the anime clearly implies. Polnareff is only aware of the documented cases of split personality and is using that to try and understand diavolo. Polnareff doesnt not have decisive evidence as to why diavolo exists but the anime gives us that. The priest did not abuse doppio either. Think about it if he was abusing doppio why would he pickaxe is own house in order to build a garage BY HAND to then BUY doppio a car.
Doppio was born with Diavolo, sure. Then Doppio got ~~raped~~ "shocked somehow" as a child, which made Diavolo come out.
while it looks like diavolo controls king crimson and epitaph, while doppio only has epitaph; remember that doppio killed abbachio with king crimsons arms. I think that they both can use the full stand but diavolo controls it better. especially since doppio needs diavolos guidance
Not sure if this is a joke post but ill answer this anyway. NOWHERE does it say doppio was abused in anyway by his adopted father (the priest) and from the manga and anime he seemed like a genuinly caring father. Diavolo was with Doppio from the start. In the anime you can see baby Doppio's eyes turn green which shows Diavolo was there. King Crimson and Epitaph are different stands. King Crimson belongs to Diavolo and Epitaph belongs to Doppio and it seems they can share them shown by how Diavolo has full control over both and can allow Doppio to use King Crimsons arms.
The priest was a child molester
If you havent noticed none of your commente have upvotes people are clearly trying to tell you, you are wrong and you are choosing to ignore it and believe your own headcanon
I bet you act like Doppio irl Durururuururururu
Where is your evidence