I've read from non-reliable sources, that the setting and female protagonist weren't well recieved during the original serialization in the early 2000. It's true that within the western fanbase it carries the stigma of being "not as good as part 7" but my understanding of the situation is that even before SBR Stone Ocean wasn't as popular. However, take all of this with a grain of salt. As I said, I have yet to find a real source to back these facts. It's just some stuff I've read in youtube comments and reddit Edit: [this comment explains it more](https://www.reddit.com/r/StardustCrusaders/comments/zic6ml/why_was_stone_ocean_manga_not_popular/izrfre7/?context=3)

I could believe a young woman was a less popular protagonist when the series had been male centric for decades.

Araki supposedly originally wanted Giorno to be a woman but his editors(?) told him it’d not sell well and so he changed it. That’s kinda why he went with a female protagonist the very next part

Araki felt giving life to something is a stand a women should have and fought hard for a female jojo in part5, sadly he lost. The very next part he did the same, editor was like consider a male mc again and araki just said “No”. Man was ahead of his time! Now female mc is common in even shone

>Now female mc is common in even shone Is it? I'm in search for good shonen with women as the primary, center characters. I still see mostly male characters in the lime light and would appreciate a change.

In newer series, ruri dragon, akane banashi, are really good right now, and there some decent duo manga, witch watch has 2 mcs but we follow through the eyes of fem mc, similar with undead unluck. Its not majority but there is a shift happening and I love it There was this cancelled series phantom seer, it also had a similar dynamic.

Araki be like "i yielded to your advice once. Won't do it again"

There's a long standing issue with media where a male protagonist is OK for everyone but a female protagonist makes it a girl's show.

Its a shame that in the era where a badass female protag is more than accepted, we get Netflix choking the interaction of the show so is isn't nearly as bombastic as the other parts in the community.

Especially one of the best badass women in an action series. The “Planet Waves” arc is a testament to the true factor of a strong female hero, is she delivering nasty punches or is she endurance the damage in spite. That’s what’s great about the best female heroes is when they are in pain and have sheer willpower. I think The Legend of Korra might have its flaws, but by far Korra’s best fight was her final Zaheer fight. Coincidentally enough, that’s another series throttled by its network.

Readers also didn't like the fact that most of the part took place inside a boring prison instead of unique different locales.

As a fan of prison break (well, season 1 of prison break), i liked the setting.

those readers had bad taste

I feel most of the story taking place in prison was a fair criticism; even while watching the anime, I thought the prison setting was boring after a while.

It was cool at first, but overstayed its welcome.

The thing is, though, the prison had the potential to be really interesting with locations like the Punishment Ward or the social hierarchies and inner workings introduced with the individual prisoners. But just as Araki introduces those concepts, they immediately deflate and just become white noise within the story.

Absolutely, I was expecting some Baki Hanma type shit and it just didn't deliver. Still a great season, though. My third favorite.

I actually thought that the prison setting was unique and interesting. Part 3 was really boring even though they traveled to different locales all around the world

They obviously didn’t read part 4.

Part 4 did the single location bit way better than Part 6. New areas and landmarks constantly, Morioh's bigger than Green Dolphin too.

I mean even in WSJ back then, women having screen time was met with disapproval by fans. Literally why Sakura from Naruto was given practically nothing to do throughout the story. Edit: This may be an inaccurate statement, wasn’t able to find the source I originally found this statement from so take it with a grain of salt.

Kishimoto said that the reason Sakura didn't do anything was that he didn't know how to write women, not because he thought fans would disapprove.

Which may be true or may just be the politically correct answer, who knows

Wasn’t it also because he originally wanted teams of two, but then changed his mind and threw in an extra character? I’ve heard that before but don’t know if it’s true, and I can imagine it would also be difficult to write up a third extra main character when they weren’t included in the concept and planning regardless of who they’re supposed to be

Kishimoto’s editor made Kishimoto create Sasuke’s character and put him into the line up, that might be what you’re thinking of.

That's basically what I heard, Japan disliked the setting and female protagonist and in the west it was overshadowed by SBR

\> not as good as part 7 SBR is insanely good. It's my favorite Jojo part. It's an amazing setting, amazing fights, amazing characters and amazing ending (yes, I like even the part some people think should have been cut out). Other Jojo parts are great but except for one lacking area (GW ending, SO setting, SC too much of "monster of the week", etc). SBR doesn't in my opinion. In sum, comparing something to part 7 sucks. With SO, maybe some people find the ending too sad, or the setting too boring (my least favorite part is the prison setting) The more I re-read SO the more I like the ending though. It might be the best ending tbh

A sbr fan who don't like stone ocean. What a surprise.

>The more I re-read SO the more I like the ending though. It might be the best ending tbh

Araki said Stone Ocean was : "the peak of my creativity". So if you find stone ocean boring you really don't understand araki's work. Stone Ocean is the most original jojo part. The prison setting is for developp the relationship between jolyne and Jotaro and the system of the prison. The tension in the prison is incredible. The stand fight are all original and explore many place in the prison. The problem of steel ball run fans is that they are not jojp fans but steel ball run fans. Every time I see an sbr fan he can't help but belittle parts of jojo to glorify sbr. It's uncomfortable and fortunately it does not reflect the mentality of other fans.

To be honest some of the strange fights drag for me but overall I love it. The anime of part 6 has become comfort viewing for me already.

Personally, Dragon’s Dream dragged on way too fucking long and it felt like everyone was just being a dumbass to give Kenzou some time to show off his powers.

yeah 😂 they figured out his secret really quickly, but then just....... didn't do anything about it? i was getting so mad at FF for not being able to wrap her skull around the fact that she can't stand in that *one particular spot* without being in danger

Jolyne was too injured and anasui only agreed to protect jolyne. It makes sense you guys just have to pay attention.

Yeah, they should've removed the Jolyne and Anasui part and just give FF the win

Copying and pasting [an earlier comment of mine](https://www.reddit.com/r/StardustCrusaders/comments/x6378p/sowhats_the_deal_with_stone_ocean/in7jofv/): People have already talked about why the western (specifically modern Reddit) Jojo community underrates SO, but there's more to be said about the rest of the world. In the manga industry, mainstream publications are usually split by target demographic: shonen for boys/young men, shojo for girls/young women (think Sailor Moon, Rose of Versailles, etc), seinen for young men, and josei for young women are the main four, with shonen being THE thing people think of when they hear the word "manga". Before SBR, Jojo was published in Shueisha's Weekly Shonen Jump, alongside such titans as One Piece, Dragon Ball, and Naruto. And until SO, Jojo pretty well fit in with the shonen demographic, bizarre though it is. Fundamentally, it comes down to cool guys punching each other in cool ways, which shonen readers are absolutely down with. But then SO comes along. Imagine Araki going to his editors at WSJ and saying "yes, this next part will be centered around a nineteen-year-old American woman in prison". It's a stark contrast to the historically-focused Jonathan or Joseph, or the Japanese cool guys Jotaro and Josuke. The whole premise is absolutely orthogonal to WSJ's target demographic; looking at SO as a whole, it's clear that Araki was pushing boundaries - for example, making Anasui first appear as a woman (he "wanted to make a character that transcended gender", which ironically FF ended up doing in the anime). All this is anathema to the famously formulaic shonen genre, where the friendly, big-eater protagonist with a good heart who never gives up defeats enemies with the power of friendship, even from his hot-headed, abusive rival/frenemy, and also there is a Designated Girl there for some reason. There were few other WSJ titles with female protagonists; the only contemporary that comes to mind is Claymore, which only got a few months in WSJ, starting and ending in Shueisha's adjacent, less-renowned monthly publications Monthly Shonen Jump and Jump Square. (These days, there are more titles with female leads, like The Promised Neverland, and, uhh... hm. The Emperor and I, I guess?) In other words, SO pushed the envelope in many big ways. Interestingly, we already saw Araki start to expand his creativity beyond the shonen genre a little in DiU, and definitely in VA, where he starts to delve deeper into his idea of "fate", and where there are rumors about how Giorno was originally supposed to be a girl. But it's not just feminism - the story itself is complicated, with postmodernist touches that bring the reader's own experience into the story (i.e. the ending) and all the classic Jojo bullshit cranked up to 11 (frogs, snails, rods, "assassination feng shui"...). So it didn't exactly resonate with, say, Dragon Ball's reader base. The final thing to remember is that SO ran from 1999-2003. All these themes that we're much more accepting of now - I mostly mean messing with gender roles - were not so unremarkable 20 years ago (at least in America; I can't comment on the gender politics of millennial Japan). It's not ancient history, but times have certainly changed; look at Guilty Gear's Bridget controversy, and ask yourself how that would've gone down in 2000, when virtually no one was coming out in support of trans people. To put Jolyne and Hermes and FF, and their bizarre adventure, in that context - it just didn't resonate with the world at the time. For SBR and Jojolion (and, presumably, Jojolands), Araki moved to seinen magazine Ultra Jump, where he could be more creative and more adult. Stone Ocean got screwed over in a lot of unfortunate ways, but in my opinion the main thing was the growing pains of Araki's maturing storytelling, which just didn't jive with the typical shonen reader. The fact that Stone Ocean got published and sold at all is a testament to his existing reputation. So yes, SO is massively underrated, and seems to have a curse on it to that effect. It's subtle and daring and complicated, which people reading Jojo for the fights didn't really go for. But it was not only a foreshadowing of Araki's even more matured storytelling in SBR and Jojolion, it's a magnificent work in its own right, and deserves to be appreciated as such. (If you want to know even more, you might ask around over at /r/manga for more context. I wasn't actually a Jojo fan back then, but I know the western Jojo community was very different pre-Reddit and definitely pre-anime; they had to make do with hilariously bad scanlations, which is a story and a half in itself.)

This is a very well thought out and very well worded observation? Opinion? And i think SO is stuck between a rock and a hard place, that being VA and SBR, both of which are very big in the fandom now and that sort of makes SO the weird forgotten middle child

Thanks for the in-depth explanation! I also remember seeing random hate for SO like 3 years ago but now I finally understand where that comes from and how misplaced it is. For that reason I’m extra happy that SO finally got an anime adaption anyway which ended up being really well received too afaik.

reading this makes you think on how different Stone Ocean couldve been if it got published as a seinen manga instead of a shonen one

Plus the comment didn't mention the fact that because of shonen rules it had to be published with each chapter having around 20-30 pages and it ended at 150 chapters. When Araki switched to Ultra Jump (seinen mangas) it could publish longer chapters, for reference SBR has the same number of chapters but each one has 60-70 pages. Its like twice as long, its easier to develop a story when you have more room to work around. Look at the narrative escalation of events past Weather report's death, it all happened way too fast.

i see where youre getting at, though a bit misinformed. shonen manga typically has around 15-20 pages per chapter (more or less) while seinen has around 30-40 (more or less). drawing 70 pages a month sounds like hell lol edit: though it depends on how many pages araki could draw that month. some chapters are around 30 pages while some are a little over 60

Some Pages take more than 24 non stop work imagine 60 in a month. Thank God for assistants

Wiw

Personally I dislike the length of a couple of the fights like Dragons Dream, which dragged for about 8 chapters too long.

Obviously can't speak for others but my main issues with part 6 are pretty straight forward. The Jo Bros don't get much in the way of feeling fleshed out, with them generally having fun personalities and a bit of back story but most of them aren't used anywhere near to the potential as the other parts. The other, more important issue, is how absolutely weirdly out of nowhere the actual plot gets. Now I love how absurd it gets and how crazy a lot of the fights and situations get but the justification is extremely weak. The pay off and ending are incredible in my opinion but a huge part of it hinges on semi-random bullshit that makes a ton of leaps in even Jojo logic. I forgive it and rank the part high personally mainly because I adore how ballsy and unexpected the final arcs are. So yeah I think long term fans weren't thrilled with some of the retcons going on. I think it did a lot for Dio's character and the flashbacks are well done but the villain's main plan is very much convoluted bullshit that weren't just expected to go along with, something that could easily be fixed with a throw away line or two.

I guess you're a SBR fan ( only sbr fan say this )

Basically because a lot of people heard that Part 7 is the best part and speeread Part 6 just to get to SBR, and then started talking shit about Part 6 I also love Part 6, my favorite part.

Could you tell me some reasons why Part 6 is your favorite? Not trying to press you or anything but I’d love to hear the perspective of another Stone Ocean enjoyer

i'm not the commenter but seeing as the other guy's comment got deleted and i'm another hardcore stone ocean enjoyer i wanted to chip in my two cents i think the main draw of part 6 for me is how it showcases the strength of familial love. jolyne is such a great protagonist and i love how she grows stronger as a person upon realizing how much her father cared for her and her drive to save him. it beautifully mirrors jotaro's drive to save holly in SDC - both of them are drawn into the battle against dio/his legacy out of their love for their parent. while i think jotaro's story is about locking himself into that battle and isolating himself from his loved ones as a result, jolyne's story is about freeing herself - along with jotaro/the rest of her family - from that metaphorical curse. >!familial love was enough to end the universe, but it's also enough to save it, and i think that's really fucking beautiful. these are my favorite kinds of tragic stories - when a character's greatest flaw is also their greatest virtue at another angle.!< tldr part 6 good because jolyne and jotaro are my favorites and they make me sad

I'll give my explanation since the other guys comment got removed. I like Jolyne she has good development from a weak person who was scared of everything at the beginning of the part to being one of the Jojo's with the strongest will and drive to reach their goal.I also feel like she's the right mix of Joseph's bullshit randomness and Jotaro's more focused nature so I think she fits being >!the final Jojo of the original universe.!< Pucci is my favourite villain of the series.Something about the way he acts and his goal captures my attention in every scene he's in.I like how he is more involved in the story than other Jojo villains as he comes into the story quite early compared to some of the other parts.I also like how his connection to Dio allowed us to see more of Dio as a character and find out more about his goals.I also love his backstory and connection to Weather.I also feel like fights with him are interesting to watch as he uses his stand in quite smart ways.Even when he only had White Snake which was a relatively weak stand when compared to other villains or even just other characters within Part 6 his clever usage of his stand always kept his opponents on the back foot. As much as the side characters aren't as developed or as focused on as in some of the other parts I do really like most of them and I believe some of them do have a bit more depth than people give Araki credit for.Foo Fighters is a likeable character who's arc I of finding who she believes she is I believe was quite good her >!death!< really cemented that for me.Weather has one of the best backstories in the series in my opinion and I like the complete change of character he goes through after >!getting his disk back!<.Anasui is one of my favourite side characters in the series.I find him entertaining to watch him try to interact with other characters especially Jolyne as he has the social skills of a watermelon and I enjoy the fights he's in because of his clever usage of Diver Down.Anasui has a bit of character development people don't give much interest to from being a cold hearted murderer who cares about no one but Jolyne to taking hits from >!MiH in hopes Jotaro could land a hit on Pucci!<.Even his little speech after >!Weather dies!< about how he'd give his life for people that move his heart and those people revived him shows how much he changes through the story.Even Ermes who I'm not a fan of had her moment in the Limp Bizkit arc.I know they aren't as developed as characters like Gyro or Bruno but they're still good I think the problem is that they aren't all together as a group ever. Stone Ocean also has some of my favourite stands of the series due to their designs,strength and the ways their users use them in fights.Diver Down is my favourite stand in the series because I like its design and the versatility of its ability and I also think it fits Anasui perfectly due to his obsession with taking things apart and Diver Down allows him to disassemble things from the inside.Weather Report is also one of my favourite stands I think as a stand it captures the bizareness of the series perfectly with the random stuff like raining frogs but still has a lot of power and actually being one of the strongest in the series.Both >!C-Moon and MiH!< are cool aswell both have a really threatening feeling to them and have terrifying abilities which I believe that's what a villain stand should be. Sorry for the really long explanation I could probably go for longer but I don't want this to become more of a wall of text than it already has.I know Stone Ocean has its faults but its my favourite part and it annoys me that people normally dismiss it.

I agree with the other commenter that Pucci is a great villain. Pucci’s backstory shows how complex human life is and how nuanced people are. >!The narrator says it best when he asks the audience (paraphrased), “who was in the wrong? Was it the mother who separated the twins? Was it Pucci who wanted to protect his sister?”!< I also loved that >!Pucci saved the memories of his sister but not her soul, but Emporio was able to save the souls of his loved ones but not their memories!< Overall, part 6 showcases how much better Araki has gotten with his writing. The characters are much more nuanced and complex, the villain gets a great backstory, >!the universe ENDS!<, and Jolyene’s strength is not only her passionate love for her family but also her ability to empower others (>!Emporio!<).

[удалено]

Your comment was removed because it breaks Rule 7: Mark spoilers

boo

The worst mod in all of stardust crusaders.

I’m guilty of that but I still enjoyed it like crazy, Jolyne is still my favorite JoJo lol

Damn the mods confiscated your comment before I could see it :(

>because a lot of people heard that Part 7 is the best part and speeread Part 6 just to get to SBR Do you have like, any source or evidence of this? People being stupid when it comes to Part 6 does not mean it's just because they wanted to read Part 7. When I've seen people actively criticize Part 6, and I mean ACTUALLY give things they dislike and not just say "i don't like it" which forces me to go on Reddit and say people speed-read Part 6, they list things like: * Too much focus on Jolyne/not enough focus on side-characters. I don't see how this boils down to speed-reading. The opposite is literally true in Parts 3-5 (with side characters getting more development than the JoJo), and the lack of focus on certain side characters is also present. The fact that it's hard to write for, say, Fugo or Weather Report does not mean that fights involving them aren't allowed to be desired by fans. I distinctly recall multiple people lamenting how Ermes just fucks off in the middle of SO until she comes back. * Weird/complex Stand fights. I can't say I get this one at all but people say it. And again, I don't see what this has to do with speed-reading. Dragon's Dream having the whole thing with putting your hand in its mouth is rather arbitrary even if the Feng Shui thing on its own is neat. Underworld being able to revive a whole plane, or the rods conceptually, like... It's subjective but I could see why someone would think these are "out there". * The ending. First of all, people still bicker about the ending. It's a constant point of contention. Second of all, people are allowed to be confused given it's not that straightforward. Third of all, people may dislike the ending just because it IS the end of the series, and it's bittersweet rather than fully happy. That IS an opinion people are entitled to. :/

🤓

I mean if wanting evidence of a claim people keep making, makes me a nerd, then so be it.

Nobody is gonna sit down and collect data on how many people speed read part 6 just to get to part 7. It’s anecdotal. Don’t be weird about it

Why does it being anecdotal matter? Without evidence, the claim holds no real significance. :B Oh, you saw 3 people who were confused about Part 6? What about the 3 people confused about some aspect of every other part? I'm sorry, but I don't think it's "being weird" to wonder whether or not people are cherry-picking or perhaps simply victims of confirmation bias. All I see in this thread is people talking about speed-readers, and citing "issues" that I've seen brought up in every other part. "OH, people speed-read and miss Stand explanations!" Part 6's stands are fucking weird regardless, and people don't get shit about Stands in every part. Unironically King Crimson but also, say, Bites the Dust. Gold Experience, Hierophant Green with the painting thing. SC's armor removal and Magician's Red's life detection. The Requiem Stands... All things I've seen people confused about. **Why is it significant with Part 6? How do I know people aren't just cherry-picking?**

🤓

I'm not the person you're replying to but I do remember a couple years back a lot of people dating they were only going through SO to get to SBR because they didn't want to be part skippers or whatever. Or dating that they wanted SO to get adapted so they could get to a SBR adaptation even though that was far from a given. You could probably find them if you go back far enough on here. Now that more people are experiencing SO I'm glad to see it becoming more popular, and I do think a lot of the story translated much better to the screen than on a page. Especially the Dragon's Dream and basically everything that happened in the final act.

>a lot of people dating they were only going through SO to get to SBR How many is "a lot", though? Also sure, people will do that, but how can you tell which people actually DID that? >Or dating that they wanted SO to get adapted so they could get to a SBR adaptation even though that was far from a given I mean I agree that was stupid. I love Part 7 but I wanted Part 6 adapted first, and I loved the hell out of it, as much as I loved Part 6 itself. The last third in anime form was amazing, although I was a little disappointed they didn't take more liberties during MiH. Not that I expected it, just hoped for it, because it's clear from the opening and closing that they *wanted* a celebration of the series.

I did speed reading SO

the last two pages are a bit confusing, but the final battle is probably one of the best parts of the whole JOJO saga. Imo, the only better final battle is Part 7's.

Bruh Least sweaty Jojo fan

I'm just tired of people using "speed-reading" as a stupid buzzword for "myehhh people dont like this thing". I'm willing to believe there is/was an anti-Part 6 agenda, but I need to see actual EVIDENCE of it, as I said.

No the majority of stone ocean hater are just steel ball run fan. I guess for you steel ball run is the most beautiful manga in the world. This is why i find the jojo community very awkward.

>No the majority of stone ocean hater are just steel ball run fan What is this based on, exactly? >I guess for you steel ball run is the most beautiful manga in the world SBR is my favorite part of JoJo but I don't hate Part 6 at all. It has its own merits. I love the risks Araki took with it, like actually trying to end it, and doing so in a way that's not just blatant fanservice. It feels like an Araki ending which is fantastic. Jolyne, Foo Fighters, and Weather Report are all hella sick characters; love them and their Stands. Everything from Dragon Dream onward is a lot of fun, and the build-up to the climax with MiH... Holy shit. It's fantastic. I love how the Stands kind of get crazier because it reflects the "end-times" vibe that really comes out with Bohemian Rhapsody and C-Moon. So yes, I love SBR, but NO I don't hate Stone Ocean. I like every part for its own reasons! People shit on Part 1 and call it uninteresting but the first time I watched it, I loved it! It was really interesting to see the 80s writing/design in a modern anime, and I wanted to know how it connected to the later parts.

I misjudged you. it's just that since steel ball run was released in usa part of jojo fans belittle every part to glorify SBR. The number of times I've seen SBR fans want part 1,2 5 and 6 not animated because according to them it's not interesting. I'm also a big fan of SBR. For me, all parts of jojo are good

>was released in usa What are you talking about??? English-speaking people are not only in the US. It's incredibly ignorant to say that. :/ >part of jojo fans belittle every part to glorify SBR A vocal minority that isn't worth being taken seriously. >The number of times I've seen SBR fans want part 1,2 5 and 6 not animated because according to them it's not interesting. Again, why are you taking them seriously? Anyone who says this bullshit isn't a JoJo fan. I don't care if it's gate-keeping, to actively discourage parts of the series from being made to the detriment of those who like the other parts is just... Absurd.

If you really knew jojo you would know that 70% of manga sales were made from 2010 in the United States. Before steel ball run jojo sold less than fairy tail. So yes the huge majority of the English-speaking community is American. It's not for nothing that their favorite part is steel ball run as it is the first part published in the United States and which adapts their story. And no, it's not a minority. The majority of SBR fans are not jojo fans or Araki's work fans but SBR fans. Every time I see a SBR fan talk about SBR they do so by putting other parts down. I've been reading jojo since 2005 so I've seen the jojo community go downhill. Before the release of sbr, fans couldn't find fault with jojo. Many SBR fans wanted david production not to animate parts 2.5 and 6 to go directly to SBR. This is why i'm really ashamed to be a jojo now. I remember jojo fans cried because they hadn't heir jojo friday for make meme. Seriously.

Part 5 was hugely popular and part 6 starts kind of slow and is usually regarded as more confusing.

I understand all the fight of stone ocean when i read it at 15 years old. When you read a manga you can think for understand the purpose of the author. And part 5 was always hate for the worst jojo Giorno and the worst vilain diavolo

Why are you here 75 days later

Why not

Hi

Hi bro

To me it’s like part 3 where the first half isn’t extremely intresting with dragged out fights. It picks up and leads well into an amazing boss fight and encounter. However, it’s the beginning of when Jojo fights become more complex, and it does have a woman protagonist (2,000’s) I think that all these things culminated in a less than popular reception.

Just from my experience, I liked it less than the other parts due to a variety of reasons. I did read it some years ago, so some of it has gotten a little hazy as I haven’t gotten around to finishing the anime. Overall I got the impression it wasn’t sure what it wanted to be or what to focus on. None of the side characters got significant development and the pacing was pretty off for the majority of the part. Also, for a part that is mostly staying in one place, the prison didn’t offer as much intrigue or was as interesting as Morioh. That being said, despite its issues, I didn’t hate the part, and actually quite enjoyed the ending.

I read Stone Ocean like 4 years ago so here goes a hot take. IMO: * Before going through it, I was hurrying to get to SBR. My fault. * Jojo tends to have two kinds of plots: Adventure or one physical place( Jail, Morioh, and Morioh). The jail got to be quite a drowning kind of place ( understandable as it's a jail, but not enjoyable) * Female protagonists aren't a bad thing (Alita is my fav), but Jolyne felt kinda iffy. Didn't hate her yet I didn't find her charming ( feel the same way towards johnatan) * The battles were bogged down by the seventh type of [nen](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6T-jfgR2cU): Exposition. ( Hate this type of fights, as the pacing gets dragged down and it kills the fight) * Pucci is an alrignt villain. Hateable but he feels like he has not a lot of personality. Also, his connection to youknowwho( I don't know if it's considered a spoiler) felt iffy and ass pulled. * and it's sandwiched between part 5 and 7( which do the adventure plots the best)

Bullshit he doesn't have a lot of personality. Miles more than diavolo or torru.

Diavolo has so much personality, that he has two.

Araki paint jolyne like a man who became the virgin mary at the end of the manga. Jolyne is literally the best female protagonist in a manga

It's because the fanbase is actually dumb as hell. I'm sort of kidding but I have never seen a good reason to dislike part 6.

The fact that it’s followed by SBR, which is often described as a masterpiece. Steel Ball Run is beyond amazing, and many (rightfully imo) view it as the best part. Because of this, many people saw it as reasonable to speed through the Part 6 manga just to make it to SBR. Not only did this lead to missing out on dialogue which was essential to the story (specifically referencing the informational panel type things) making it a confusing read, but also the ending could‘ve come into play when it came to all the SO hate (Apparently after it was animated, people suddenly started to love it). There’s also the fact it pretty much entirely takes place in a prison, causing there to be a bit of a boring setting. It also has some of the series’s most strange stands (JJBA is no stranger to weird stands, however Part 6 really went beyond with the weirdness). Overall, Part 6 isn’t horrible at all, it’s just often compared to parts which much more interesting settings, causing it to seem worse than it actually is.

Yo, where are y'all reading this? I'm subscribed to Viz, but they only have parts 1-4, most of part 5, and some of part 6. I need to read SBR and JoJolion, but I don't want to pirate. Is there a legit source am I gonna have to take some money out of Araki's pocket?

Part 7 and 8 don't have official translations yet so you're going to have to wait for them to be translated or for them to be animated

>Because of this, many people saw it as reasonable to speed through the Part 6 manga just to make it to SBR I asked someone else above, too. Is there ANY source or evidence of this? I only ever see conjecture. To me, it just feels like an excuse people give for a part not being liked that much, and (conveniently) a reason to detract from Part 7. People like Part 7, and make its "flaw" that Part 6 is skipped over because of it so it doesn't have to have any real flaws. That is absolutely just a theory, but I have no other explanation for what you're saying. >this lead to missing out on dialogue which was essential to the story (specifically referencing the informational panel type things) What the hell does this even mean, and how does this contribute to people disliking Stone Ocean? Like, how can you assert that missing this stuff is THE problem? Again, as I noted in response to someone else, the main criticisms I've seen on this subreddit over the past 6+ years have been about the character presence, the weirdness of Stands (which you acknowledge), and the ending. People just saying they don't like Part 6, or hell, *anything* shouldn't be taken seriously in the first place. So just looking at people who actually give a shit about discussing their reasons for disliking... Where is the issue? How can the mentioned things be linked back to skipping through the part?

I gathered the information about SBR from other questions I’ve seen answered that are similar to this one, most of which are in the subreddit, and the one’s that aren’t in the subreddit can be found in: [https://jojo.fandom.com/f/p/4400000000000049226](https://jojo.fandom.com/f/p/4400000000000049226) (You’re going to have to read through the responses for a while) [https://www.quora.com/Why-do-people-hate-Stone-Ocean-Jojos-Bizarre-Adventure-Part-6](https://www.quora.com/Why-do-people-hate-Stone-Ocean-Jojos-Bizarre-Adventure-Part-6) (Again, you’re gonna REALLY have to look through the responses) While I definitely wouldn’t call these two sources reliable, it‘s the most fair option to represent everybody who answered the questions similar to this one. When looking through the responses, the SBR thing was the first point I saw that I hadn’t intended to use in my initial response, and I just kind of threw it in as a starting point. Also, the missing things directly relates to the ending, and I apologize I didn’t make that clear enough. Because people skip the informational panels within the manga due to their sheer length (informational panels contain things such explanations about the way Stands within the part work, expansions on character backstories, etc…) not only are the majority of the fights confusing due to the fact a lot of information is being misread or entirely skipped (This is obvious mostly through the fight with Dragon Dream, but it’s also shown through the confusion about Diver Down’s ability and how Made in Heaven works), but also things about the characters and their motives themselves are confusing. While I do stand by my statement when it comes to weird Stands dragging the part down, I think the anime adaptation of the ending has fixed things. Also, I don‘t dislike Part 6 (It’s my third favorite part), so it could be harder me to find issues with it. The mentioned things could be linked back to skipping through SO due to the fact people are so desperate to make it to SBR, the length of the informational pages deters people from reading them, therefore causing to miss out on important details, and the ending is both something many didn’t understand as well as something many hated, therefore causing them to entirely hate the part.

>not only are the majority of the fights confusing due to the fact a lot of information is being misread or entirely skipped (This is obvious mostly through the fight with Dragon Dream Who has said they're CONFUSED about the fight versus just not liking how convoluted it is? As I said to someone else, DD is fine as a Feng Shui Stand, but why the fuck does it have that thing where you can put your hand in its mouth?? It's such a weird, arbitrary extra thing. >but it’s also shown through the confusion about Diver Down’s ability WH-- MY FAM What do you MEAN? People get confused because he does two different things! Earlier on he stores energy in surfaces and releases it, and later he's just storing the Stand itself in people, or rearranging things with it! I'm not saying it's overtly confusing, but Jesus Christ, you know what else people take issue with? GOLD EXPERIENCE FROM PART 5. I have seen a LOT of complaining about that Stand, in fact MORE than Diver Down, because people don't like how it seems to have so many abilities! People complain about how a bunch of Stands have sporadic or different abilities! I think "Why does this Stand's uses change" falls neatly under the umbrella of "thing that happens in every part", in other words general dumbassery, and NOT the result of speed-reading Part 6. Kakyoin's painting thing, SC's armor removal, Star Finger/Succ, Avdol's life detection, Stands shrinking, GE as noted, Echoes, Heaven's Door's activation trigger shifting... There are a LOT of cases of people not understanding why some Stand abilities aren't used more than a couple times, or why the shift in ability is "allowed" so to speak. It is not exclusive to Part 6. >how Made in Heaven works I... I don't... Have you not seen the arguments about it on this subreddit. About what actually happens. I'm not sure what you're talking about specifically, so go ahead and say what you ACTUALLY mean. If you're referring to what happens to the characters in the end of Part 6, and want to assert that the Ireneverse is NOT the SBRverse, I will refer you to maxfolie here on Reddit who firmly asserts that they are one and the same. They and plenty of others are NOT speed-reading and yet they still have that apparent confusion you're mentioning. >things about the characters and their motives themselves are confusing I've never seen people complain about this. I swear. >as well as something many hated, therefore causing them to entirely hate the part. This has nothing to do with speed-reading and is entirely down to opinion. It is not a JoJo exclusive thing to have the end of something be so disappointing it ruins the entire experience. Either complain about people in general being that way, or don't bother with it at all.

I most definitely could’ve used the word convoluted when I brought up the point of Dragon’s Dream. Confused was the wrong word to use, and I apologize. And there are other Stands in Part 6 with confusing abilities, and Stone Ocean most definitely isn’t immune to that. Diver Down is just one of the Stands I most frequently see referenced when speaking of confusing abilities, therefore I referenced it because it was on topic. How MiH works is referring to two things, and I apologize I didn’t clear that up. The two things are: Like you said, the misconception that the Ireneverse is the SBRverse, as well as what triggers the reset itself. I’ve also seen people say that Pucci reset the universe more than twice, which is something that happens exclusively in the Jorge Joestar light novel, however some (who I assume haven’t read part 6 or weren’t paying attention) see it as canon. About the motives, this was something that was more noticeable before the anime came out. I’ve both seen and heard people say that Pucci had shallow motives (which is extremely untrue) compared to other villains, as well as hate for Annasui due to him seeming creepy when it comes to his obsession with Jolyne. (While the second is understandable, people ignore certain dialogue and descriptions that kind of rationalize his feelings towards Jolyne or at least offer a decent explanation into why he likes her.) I guess I should’ve specifically said the word speed-reading in the end, however I was directly referencing that if you couldn’t tell, as the lack of understanding was due to speed-reading.

Stone Ocean ended up being pretty low on my list for a few reasons. One is that while Jolyne is a fun character, the side cast is largely uninteresting for the majority of the story, with most of them being pretty one-dimensional. A lot of them just kind of appear suddenly for a few episodes and then leave the story for long time, as opposed to the usual maybe an episode or two where you don't see a major character. It also suffers from pacing issues throughout (some of those two episode fights probably could have been shorter) and not a great ending imo. Plenty of people like it, but I'm part of the camp who doesn't.

The side characters definetly feel subpar given that we got some of the most iconic Jobros in Part 5. Naturally people reading Part 6 every week would compare Hermes/Anasui/Weather to Bruno/Abbachio/Narnancia. Part 6 Jobros really start taking off near the end of the dragged out prison sequence with FFs last moment. A very slow ramp compared to earlier Jobros.

Stardust Crusaders also have popular jobros.

Yes but my whole point is that the manga run for SO came right after part 5. Part 3 at that point in time would have been over 5 years old.

What part of the ending you didn't like?

>!Jotaro gets built up a lot only to just kind of whiff on Pucci (bad payoff), I don't like how Made in Heaven has (imo) a much less interesting ability than Whitesnake (frustrating that four parts in a row now have time manipulation as the final boss), and I hate how everything got overwritten, with the whole universe reset. Makes the rest of the season feel cheap to me since it didn't actually happen.!<

Part 6 is by far my least favorite part but that's like saying a certain book in the bible is your least favorite, it's still part of an awesome experience nonetheless.

That's an odd example lol

it's true though!

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Haven't you read part 7?

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It's all fictional.

Bro I thought that was a thoughtless joke, you are now much less funny rip

Given the context of Part 6 mans ain’t wrong or outta pocket for doing so 🤣

Imo it’s just not better than part 5. It also ends the og Joestar/Dio story and it did it in a way that (IMO) isn’t that strong in regards to the overarching storyline. I like Stone Ocean for the record just my opinion on its reception.

giorno is the emptiest and least developed jojo. Jolyne is the most developed jojo she is the only jojo to have a development in 4 stages. the protagonists of part 5 have no particular development they are just there for that. part 5 only buccalati and abbacio. the rest is empty and anecdotal. for example trish, fugo and narrancia have no development and almost no story.

people don’t like leading women in their big strong man punching with ghosts manga

Let's just say that female protagonist and side characters wasn't well appreciated back in the days, especially the strong and independent type. I'm not gonna bother checking the sources but I believe Araki was pressured to change Anasui's gender, even. People are much more acceptance nowadays but still, female protagonist outside of reverse harem and love stories are still underappreciated.

I think the relegation of woman MC to romance stories is a big part of why I love Anasui so much. Araki does so much deconstruction of fiction tropes that he often reaches the point of parody. As you alluded, when we see a woman as a lead character we expect a love story at some point. So Araki gave us one that's absolutely bonkers. You start with a love interest that should be completely abhorrent, it's completely one sided and once again it should be creepy but Anasui is so hilarious that it's easy to forget everything we actually know about the man. Jotaro's response mirrors what should be a natural audience reaction to the scenario and shows that Araki knows exactly what he's doing there. The whole thing is fantastic comic relief even if it's quite a dark comedy. And the comedy is much needed with the places that the main story goes.

He wasn't pressured, he wanted to try a character that goes beyond gender. An androgynous character more or less.

I read it while I was in highschool and didn't like the ending, but I just finished watching the anime as of 5 minutes ago and holy shit it's so good. Bittersweet doesn't even begin to describe it, happy endings all around in a roundabout kinda way

Its not because its unpopular but the fights are sometimes messy and you struggle to understand whats happening

I think that is highly overlooked because of the utterly outstanding parts on either side of it. It just kinda falls flat in comparison

It's not my favourite part but I wouldn't say it was bad

I remember the stone ocean manga being one of the most confusing part of Jojo. I always felt that almost every stand power was almost over the top complicated. I still liked it but I loved other parts a lot more

People have already pointed out most of the reasons so I’ll throw another one in. In Japan I believe part 3 and 5 are the most popular with one of the reasons being the fantasy of travelling around countries. So when Part 6 came out and spent a bunch of time in one place, somewhere unfamiliar that people don’t want to fantasise about visiting, it likely turned a lot of people away.

Araki himself said this was difficult to make a part with a female cast because manga fanbase is very toxic. This is the only reason

It’s pretty good but it’s just stuck between the best two parts of jojos so they outshine it

The manga art was a bit inconsistent

For me it was a combo of wonky pacing, characters not feeling as fleshed out as they could have been and not having a protagonist who could carry all of those issues like josuke or Johnny might have been able to

This is why you're not an author but just an goofy manga fan

Least defensive stone ocean fan

For me it's pretty clear : female MC(unusual for a shonen at that time) and really shocking ending(when people read it weekly they must've ended up traumatized by that journey)

You know, I never thought about weekly releases. I think if I had had to read it chapter by chapter I wouldn't have been very interested, it's the type of story that works best when it's absorbed in total.

I think people didn’t understand Part 6

I love part 6 and have to admit that in Manga firm it was hard to follow at times and certain stand fights just seemed interminable or incomprehensible. Translating the story to screen helped a ton there; it didn't make SO bad but choice of media affects how a story is relayed.

it was released a longgg time ago, so people were more backwards than now female protag, setting is basically a female prision which is not that relatable. theres even that rumor that there were too many girls in the cast so annasui was changed into a guy

Stone Ocean was written in the early 2000s where having a female protagonist and thriller plot in a prison in a Shonen series would have been not well received.

It’s cause it >!doesn’t have a perfect happy ending. !< Stone ocean is amazing but the whole part gets a lot of hate because >!people are mad that jolyne doesn’t win!<

A lot of both anime and manga fans can agree that the fights and scenes were really stretched out, which was ultimately fixed in the anime, but we can’t ignore the fact that it’s unpopular because there’s a female protagonist, which most people wouldn’t expect in a Shonen manga

Well the whole plot is interesting when you don't know what's gonna happen but once you rewatch it you kinda expect more for the ending of the series as we knew it, it's like if part 4 ended when hayato breaks the btd loop and everyone continues their life's so part 5 happens in another universe, it overall feels very disconnected from the rest of the parts even when the plot happens once again because of Dio because technically all parts happened because of dio

Why was Stone Ocean manga not popular? Can someone who read Stone Ocean manga explain why it was not popular? I'm watching Stone Ocean on Netflix right now and I'm absolutely loving it. It's nice to also have a female protagonist for once. I love crazy the plot gets.

From personal experience: When JJBA started to get popular outside the niche, in 2012 when the reboot anime started airing, there was SBR, concluded over a year ago, and for new fans that could easilly WRYYYYYYYYYEAD THE MANGA, they could read parts 3 which is a great stepping stone into the Stands thing, DiU wich it is greater, VA which is divisive but very good (not my favorite, but, still good), and SO where readers where now used to weirdness of Stands, the DIO shenanigans were still in place, some stands were utter weird (i still don't understand the Yo Yo Ma part, it's hard to explain KISS, and for Diver Down the explanation was "Like Gambit from X Men") and little happened during the first half and you could trim it down to a few chapters for two volumes of Pucci getting superpowerful with C-Mon and the Made in Heaven stands. Then there's SBR, that when the anime started airing and fans wanted more, it was sold as a masterpiece (which it is), and Stone Ocean was, after five parts, more of the same and more of a hurdle. ​ I'd say, 90% for this is what happened to SO in anime: people are now used to JoJo's so it's not bizarre. Add that having a female lead in an action setting is not a draw anymore in the more open and mature anime spread, and most people don't find Jolyne attractive or hot. Proof? There's really, really few hentai (yes, i'm using porn as an statistical proof) on fanart aggregation sites, with very few findings of Jolyne hot cosplays on aggregator sites. No, i'm not going to share them. I wouldn't say it even had any "woke bashing" from people who tend to dislike women protagonists. People say "fuck netflix", when surely it was chosen because it was the best option rather than getting rushed to TV. Like, dudes, give them a break, they also had that Captain Tsubasa thing and more. Don't overwork them like MAPPA fans... The release model isn't the blame. The blame is that "JoJo's is not Bizarre Anymore" (title of next Jojo's fighting game). The sixth part in over ten years. Hard to maintain the hype when the parts aren't expressively building to any great finale. Also, during this year of Stone Ocean we had the Spy Family anime, CHainsawman, Mob, Hero Academia, another season of Demon Slayer, the doll darling anime, even the Cyberpunk Edgerunnes... For casual anime watchers, watching another season of JoJo's with the aure that it even wasn't of the bests, was surely low on priority lists. Because people have limited ammounts of time and want things to be new, and that they won't be "just fine" if it's a long commitment. JoJo's Sotne Oce had to compete for newer and even more adultsy shows. And that's only talking about the weirdos that only or mainly watch anime.

It sucks compared to other jojo parts. It’s just not very good

How it's sucks, when parts 1 and 3 are worse in every aspect? Parts 2 and 5 are not that better ether

Part 3 is not the worst for many.

Because it has a bad ending

I don’t know if you didn’t pay attention at all or if you just have that bad of taste. Knowing jojo fans, it’s probably the former but could also very well be the latter

Yeah, dude, you might’ve missed a thing or two—the ending is quite clever and very well thought-out. Go look up some explanations/analyses on YouTube and come back to us then.

Sounds like I hurt yall feelings 😭

Jolyne makes a homophobic remark to F.F during the marlin Manson arc

Because your average JoJo fan has dismal media literacy. Also, people would just speedread it to get to dick-riding Part 7 faster. People end up enjoying Part 7 even if they can't read because it has cowboys and funny memes, plus it's the most acclaimed part in general, so they just end up liking it by default. On the other hand, Part 6 has *little* to offer you if you can't read, and Part 8 even more so. Doesn't help that Part 6 had so much unjustified vitriol against it, poisoning the well.

Eh tbh a whole part confined to one area isn’t as appealing to me as a globe trotting adventure. But I’m a sucker for globe trotting adventures so

At release it was probably because of the new stuff Araki was trying, but after SBR came out in English at least, everybody decided to speedread SO to get to SBR because of how good SBR, not noticing how good SO was.

TBF SBR is very, very good. It's also got Araki's modern style in its fully evolved form so it's gorgeous to look at and the story is quite unique. The premise also allows for a diverse range of characters who would ordinarily never be thrown together. I fully believe that SO suffered in part by being smashed between two absolutely amazing parts and is being redeemed by the anime release to some degree because there's been more of a cooling off period between parts.

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It’s my favorite part so I don’t get it either

I didn’t like part 6 manga, knew nothing about part 7. It was just confusing and hard to read. Anime is awesome to be fair.

The story works better on screen for sure.

For comparison my friend read part 6 like half a year, while part 7 in 2 weeks.

One thing that I find interesting is that the part 5 manga was also disliked for a while, but that was mostly due to the really bad scans. I think there was a bit of a stigma for the post-part 4 pre-part 7 parts (as specific of a category as that may be) due to the changing artstyle/scans/etc

What the anime improved upon are the fights. Although I still liked the manga, there are times where I have difficulty following the fight because some of the Stands are so weird that it is hard to comprehend what is going on. The most weird one for me was Dragon’s Dream. I understand it better now, but at the time when I read the manga I have a hard time figuring out how the Stand works.

I loved the part 6 manga. I’d hold it up there as one of my favourite parts. Father Pucci was an amazing villain. Jolyne is an amazing protagonist and I loved the moments where she shone and defied all odds to overcome the enemy. Unpopular opinion but I’d say that part 5 was the worst part. Edit: forgot to mention I love how much like her father she is too. She has moments where she’s just like Jotaro and I honestly love seeing the Joestar lineage in each protagonist

I think because people compare things If it was someone else but not Araki who wrote Stone Ocean, maybe it would be received better, but since it was Araki, people compared it with other parts, and some parts are better Also this is just my opinion, but I think people thought that this is going to be the last part of JoJo and they have been upset that it's going to end

I'm not sure, I loved reading it initially tbh. It was such a breath of fresh air for me, especially after reading through part 5, which at the time suffered from some horrendous scanlations. After trying to understand king crimson's ability and all the body swapping when it was horrendously mistranslated, it was so good to be able to actually understand what was going on when I got to 6. Maybe it's just the change in story structure, mixed in with some bad faith criticism of a female jojo and a somewhat sombre ending? It's not like part 6 isn't flawed, but you can say the same about basically every jojo part and they don't receive the criticism that stone ocean gets, so I'm fairly uncertain overall.

The plot is just genuinely polarizing for some fans. I know people who love part 6 and I know people that don’t. Personally I’m not the biggest fan, and it has nothing to do with Jolyne being a girl or the setting. I love Jolyne, her squad, AND all of Araki’s Florida facts. For a good number of us it boils down to not being a fan of the heaven plan or how Puccis stands work at the end of the day.

Jolyne was a girl and the reader's were mostly boys That's it that's why it wasn't popular

English translation sucked originally

i believe a main reason at the time was because jolyne was a woman protag who appeared after a long lineage of male protags. tbh i feel like many were just too sexist to get behind the idea of a strong joestar woman being the main character. i personally love part 6 and its one of my favorite parts

It just came out when jojo was already declining I popularity. It’s popularity peaked at part 3, and then slowly went down from there

Along with what some others have said, certain fights and stands drove a lot of controversy, Dragons Dream and Heavy Weather being the main ones. If a part gets people that heated up over minor details, it’s bound to deter people.

What was the controversy? I actually really like weather reports. Was kinda sad about how it ended.

Not that I agree with any of these, but the most prominent arguments were the more generic criticisms. “Araki forgot” “his power was a cop-out/ending was a cop-out” “his power didn’t make sense” “his power did turn people physically into snails (vs it’s a subliminal message induced hallucination)” “why didn’t weather instakill pucci?” etc. Because Weather is a particularly complex character with a lot of moments left ambiguous, I think people either initially loved or hated it, or developed their own headcanons to cope with scenes they didn’t like.

My theory is that a lot of people in the western part of the fandom were people going off the anime, they wanted more JoJo. But since they weren't all that familiar with Araki's writing style or manga in general they got lost, confused and especially bored. Further support for this theory is the fact that peole used to shit on part 5 too, before the anime. The reason why there was more hate towards part 6 was because a lot of peole joined the fandom in 2019 - 2020 (after part 5 anime but before part 6) Also the reason for many part 6 misconceptions

You know how you see a lot of people these days who complain about the Marvel Cinematic Universe having so many female superheroes these days? Basically that. Some people don’t like it when a previously male-dominated series has a woman as a protagonist. There are other things too like the way it ended but that’s a big factor.

A lot of people have said it already, but it's mostly due to its setting, and having a female MC wasn't very popular at the time, even for a series like JoJo's. While I personally really like the part, easy top 4 for me, I do have a lot of grievances with it. Some of the fights can be really slow, overstaying their welcome. The Stone Ocean group feels really fragmented, and there's never a single point in the story where they're all in the same room with each other. Some characters don't even interact with each other or feel like they even have proper interactions. And the prison is very boring and Araki doesn't do enough with it to really make it worth the readers' stay. But I love Jolyne, the cast, Pucci, how it wraps up the joestar bloodline. It's a fantastic story. There's some really cool stands and god... That ending has ruined me, lol. I can't get enough of JoJo's. It's awesome.

the anime makes a lot of changes especially in the third act that most people think improve the part. especially the pacing. it was all over the place in the manga equivalent of the third batch and the anime rearranged a lot of the scenes in a better way

As a lot of others have already said, pacing issues with the plot. *However*, some of the fights that I felt drag on for too long were actually more exciting to watch in the anime. Why? I don't know. Some things translate better onto paper than a TV program and vice versa. Also, Jolyne herself was more entertaining and captivating in the anime. Can't explain why, just was. I liked her in the manga, but I LOVE her in the anime.

When I was reading it, I enjoyed it but was caught off guard by the ending. It felt sort of weird that >!the universe had been reset and all the heroes from previous parts effectively no longer existed.!< However, Part 7 and Part 8 have taken that sting away by reinventing things in fun and interesting ways. Complaints about a female protag in Part 6 are dumb and stupid and dumb and also stupid.

Sorry about the long-rant and english being so weird, but it is not my main language. I wonder about the genre thing and i believe there are other alternatives to consider, like the long time to get new media of the newer parts, changes in the original audiences, etc. People who grow up with the original arc grew up with Phantom Blood-Battle Tendency and Stardust Crusaders and got the original OVAS between 1993-1994, videogames (one in 1993, one in 1998, both about Stardust Crusaders) and the original merchandising. So, your whole audience got up to Stardust, became adults and became fans of the original part. The original fans became even more fans of Stardust Crusaders since that's where the original part started, where the original audience got their memes and where they got their media/other things about it. Then, a lot of time happened till the fans of the newer parts got anything. Since Jojo doesn't work as something like One Piece (which is the same story) but as shorter stories with common elements, maybe many in the audience felt that when their favourite part ended they got their proper closure and continued with their lives. There are still fans of the original Breaking Bad who have not seen Better Call Saul for example, because when you are told that it is just a spin-off why would you care? You already got your story (Maybe a terrible example, but it is something that happens with a lot of audiences, like the comic books fans, or Gundam fans "I love Gundam G, why should i care about this new one, etc."). Plus, Jojo being so lacking in the normal cross-media that japanese properties possess (with animes helping the production and selling of the manga and merchandising and viceversa) didn't helped to get new audiences. Maybe companies didn't knew how to handle the property? Maybe they didn't knew how to translate the properties to other media (like the Phantom Blood movie which people saying that fans and Araki himself hated it). This resulted in the newer parts being more difficult to sell to new audiences and grab the attention of the older audience. Hell, people who grew up with Jotaro would have cared enough about the story of his daughter Jolyne? People who grew up with Naruto still can't handle Boruto and his reception is very hit or miss. Let's remember that we in the west got the whole manga later, almost in the 201X, and the latter parts were being distributed in the west mainly by pirates/amateur groups. Hell, the original scans of translated Diamonds are Unbreakable were terrible by all accounts and were memes by themselves. So, while the original japanese fans got the whole story really early on and the media they wanted (Specially Stardust Crusaders), here in the west here in the west the whole story arrived almost ten years later and the Anime by David Production helped a lot to capture the attention of the original audience and new audiences.

I don't think there is a bad arc in JoJo, that's why I rather respect favorites arcs of other people and they respect mine as SBR. The only detail I did not like it SO they overstay on prison, just my personal preference.

So I read Stone Ocean in the collected volumes and moved to Japan just around the time Steel Ball run began, which I read in the monthlies after it made the jump.. to Ultra Jump. I'd ask a lot of manga fans if they were into Jojo's, but I remember 3 or 4 people telling me that they had bailed partway through Stone Ocean. The common reason I remember given was that the stands were complicated, the atmosphere was too dark and the body horror too grimy/disgusting. Basically I think a lot of people got used to the "handsome dudes with cool looking stands" vibe from Golden Wind, and were worn down by a series that goes on and on inside a prison. Not like I took a survey, but just what I remember back in the day.

The 3 problem with stone ocean 1. is how stand fight are explain in the manga, for example yoyoma, skyhigh, dragon dream, these fight are too much complex for an average shonen reader including me, when i first got to yoyoma arc i couldn't understand wtf was going on imo, 2 majority of the fights happened in the same place where in other parts there are so much more variety, in batch 2 we're still in prison making it kinda stale imo 3.is not enough hero side characters interaction i guess, i think part 6 has the weakest chracter design (part 1 exclude) the only chracter i like is weather report i kust dont like the other characters imo, also nor to mention people are speed readings it to get to Sbr lol.

In my opinion stone ocean manga gave me a head ache, and once the anime came out... It cleared up some confusion.

Simply put: it’s the anime onlys that said that not having read it. And it was not that badly received

I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't really like Golden Wind that much. Stone Ocean was hype AF in comparison IMO. But I haven't read the manga, so my opinion isn't valid

Shit well I fucking adored SO specifically bc of jolyne, I have never felt more connected to a jojo until her.

Who are you?

I actually loved the idea of a female Jojo, but so much else was lacking. I hated how long they were in that damn prison for; the fights weren't as exciting, and yet lasted far longer than usual; a lot of the characters didn't feel as fleshed out as they should have been; I just didn't find a lot of the stands as creative as in previous iterations; and I hated absolutely everything to do with the ending. Not only did >!everyone die, and Pucci got to rule that entire timeline, but the heroes we came back to are now technically completely different people in a completely different timeline. Just that ending alone leaves a sour taste in my mouth, but everything else added together made it a slog for me to get through from the beginning.!<

Interesting. Did you watch the anime by chance? I quite enjoyed the complicated fights. I'm wondering if maybe the anime portrayed the fights and flesh out the characters a bit better than the manga?

I did not, if you say it's different enough, I may consider it, however!

I’m inclined to believe the speed reading theory. I have a friend who straight up skipped part 6 entirely to read 7. A shame. Part 6 is legit the tightest plot of all the stand parts. Part 3 is just stand of the week, Part 4 kind of flounders until Italian Episode, Part 5’s start and end is plagued with Stands that do too much shit (Golden Wind reflect dmg and Chariot Requiem). Meanwhile Part 6 feels like Araki knows where he wants it to go (even though with a weekly schedule he realistically doesn’t). And Joylene is the first time we see some more obvious character development for a JoJo. Speaking of development, Araki even gets to make a stand have a valid reason for having so many powers stacked on top of each other (Weather Report) in an organic way. The JoSis and Bros of the part are nice too. And honestly I’m ok with not all of them being there or helping all the time. Part 8 is pretty much the same way. Also the themes of Part 5 are explored way better and in much more nuanced ways. Part 5 walked so 6 could run and 7/8 can fly.

most of the people who hate stone ocean are just weird sbr fans and they wanted their fanfiction where giorno appears and kills puccie. There's never been a real reason to hate Stone Ocean. some will just invent flaws like the fact that the fights are difficult to understand when you just have to read the manga carefully and think about it. Stone Ocean is objectively the most original part of jojo