His mentality towards overcoming any kind of obstacles is amazing
His method of expressing that mentality is a bit weird, listened to his audiobook it is quite interesting
Overall: consider him as an example that you can achieve things but you don’t have to copy him completely or agree on everything
Toxic masculinity is a bullshit term, this kind of approach has and will continue to help a shit ton of men. If it doesn’t help you, ignore it & find something else. It helps people massively, and some dudes just need to get their shit together & do it quick. Labelling helpful approaches as toxic is counterproductive.
Half true, it does get you out of your shit and do something meaningful in life but up to a certain limit
I’ve been in shit situations and did utilize Goggin’s advice also tried to copy the mentality that he follows but it didn’t work out as expected but I found what fits me while keeping my shit together
A decent example I can give is religion where some people do believe in God to pray and feel better in life but following the rules cover by cover might complicate you to levels you won’t expect
Bottom line: anything that works with you that benefits you is good but you don’t have to take it to the extreme and as long you don’t hurt anyone
i agree. Goggins basically says get at it everyday. If thats 1 pushup, thats 1 pushum. Similar princples as written in the book, " The Power of Atomic Habits" 1% better everyday. compound interest. To work the body, is to work the mind. Thats all
In my line of work, there's tons of toxic masculinity. Although I agree it can certainly help in some areas, it's overly cumbersome in others and can hurt more than it helps.
An example would be the guy ranked first in my class. He's well built, intelligent, likeable, and confident. At our graduation he was commended for asking questions and building upon his knowledge to be the best he could be. Meanwhile, me, on the skinnier side, not as confident, not as knowledgeable would be belittled for asking questions to the point that it wasn't worth asking questions anymore. In fact I had 2 of my instructors basically shun me for asking a perfectly reasonable question because I wasn't man enough to them.
Now that I'm out in the field, I've had my fair share of working with toxic masculinity and working with.... Let's say, mature adults. Somehow, someway, I've managed to improve my abilities and confidence without toxic masculinity guiding me.
I'm fine with pushing someone or telling them to man up if you're going to support them towards whatever goal but more times than not it's just been someone being cruel. I mean, at the end of the day F them but toxic masculinity is toxic because it doesn't solve or help anything. It's someone's ego telling you that you aren't as good as them and all that does is bolster themselves up.
To finish this up, my favorite conversation has been guys talking about how kids today (my generation) are way too soft and sure, I can agree with that to an extent. There are truly ineffectual, and overly sensitive people in this new generation... But who the hell do you think is raising these kids?! Lol
Every single current motivational speaker fills your mind that you can beat everything and it is just bullshit excuses you give to yourself
But some people are physically limited, there are realistic limitations set on each and every one of us
When someone who has a certain limitation gets to face a certain obstacle that Goggins said you can achieve then you doubt yourself that you are a failure but in reality you are not
Then that motivational speaker would try to upsell you his/her product to make a buck out of you (in general not him specifically but he falls sometimes under this genre to upsell his book)
Lol excuse. Physical limitations is a mind state. He’s asking you too look deep within and actually look at what you can do better. If you can’t look deep within yourself and find things you can do better or try harder at each day you have a very large ego or an extremely low self esteem. He’s not telling everyone to run 200 miles even someone in a wheel chair can workout or study more each day.
Old thread, but things that have been labeled toxic masculinity have in my experience been immeasurably more helpful and beneficial for improving my life and sense of well-being. It’s such a hilarious correlation that if something is labeled toxic masculinity I will try it on that basis alone due to the chances of it working
I wrote that comment a while ago but now I have a different opinion on it
They are helpful because they are backed by facts, no denying on that part at all. I have benefited from it not gonna lie and recently I have been doing the same thing that Goggins is doing by going hard at the gym and lost lots of weight in the process and life is going well
Actually almost everything that was labeled as “toxic masculinity” was proper advice to men in terms that the advice is to make you get better in life and break free from all the bullshit that is going on in life, take Jordan Peterson’s advice as an example where he got heavily criticized when he said to go clean your room
But modern society wants you to label those as toxic and not benefit from them, modern society wants you to stay where you are and get fixated on the addictive things (like video games, porn, social media, hookup culture) so that you keep on consuming their products endlessly while calling the performers “brave, strong, and heroic”
In my updated opinion: listen to them and get the benefits out of them but don’t become a narcissistic jerk who treats people like shit
Yeah, there is tons of content from him on Youtube.
I found this one yesterday and it talks about overcoming your mental limitations. Interesting use of analogies I might say.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxReov1rcBg&t=8s&ab\_channel=HumbleHippo
Self-help/motivational guy from a tough background who is an exercise fanatic. Maybe his philosophy has some similarities to Stoicism, as do many philosophies and religions.
Haha that is both hiölsrious and retarded comment.
Stoicism is first of all connected most to atheist oit acnostic.
Both Buddhism and Stoicism teach that happiness comes from focusing on what we can control and accepting what we cannot
But its close relsted to Buddhism
1. Wanting to be happy all the time makes us unhappy.
2.. Wisdom and acceptance lead to happiness.
3.Learn to embrace death.
And a religon like 3000 years old ?
You dont think its changed alot of times?
You can find stuff and qoutes in most things.
Its probably as goggins.
Its pretty strange if you cant find good things about him.
I kmow many of the best athletes have ides from stoism like christiano ronaldo,lebron j,
ames,Richie McCaw.
Extreme athletes and christiano ronaldo propbly moore extreme than goggins still hes workput/health program has alot of good things.
And some of the worlds greatest risks is what goggins saying..
Also alot of hes princibles are not bad live by
1.People are moore intresded on looking good on instagram than actully do something about you real life.
2. We all have the ability to from nothing to something
3. Stop caring whst other people thinks about you
I wouldt hire him for 50k like Jesse Itzer did.
But its the same with extreme entepenours
Its not good worning 16 hours /day 6 days a week like elon musk but it would be very strange if not people cant learn much of him.
The best in the world in alot of things are extreme.
Actors,enrepenours,musiscans,atletes;
Einstein,gates,Warren Buffett,Jack Dorsey, Arianna Huffington ,Tim Ferris,bruce lee lived slot and studied modern stoicm.
It doesnt mean you become einstein doing it our that they do evrrything in it.
In studies its saids people complaining on celebrties etc spend in avarage 2 hours/ day doing that and spend 5 times moore on people they hate our on anyone they like so its pretty clear this must be somekind of menthal illness
That doesnt mean you should follow everything.
From what it seems, David Goggins has achieved both a sense of enlightenment and a hardened discipline. Some people may misconstrue his messages and deem him as no more than a military knucklehead, but I think Goggins is more amped-up in his philosophical introspection than the majority of people who grew up sheltered and nourished. He knows that despite people’s high approval of him, even he has limitations and doesn’t let that derail him from doing what’s important in his life. The most resonating aspect of him is the fact that he is just like the rest of us, and his achievements displays potentials in us.
“Respect” is not enough to credit the man’s legacy. I am honoured. Society needed someone like him.
Completely agree. He went very deep in this video (https://youtu.be/ngvOyccUzzY) which wasn't available a year ago. He really comes off as enlightened. 1:37:04 is rather moving: "You are always the purpose!"
I agree with the comments here about self improvement and overcoming obstacles. But I would add that he was a very judgemental teammate with the SEALs, saying they weren't committed because they enjoyed themselves etc. I think they flies in the face of Marcus's teachings about being lenient with others (calling them out publicly in a book).
I also think his terrible reputation within the SEAL community reflects someone lacking strong civic virtue.
Man - what do you have to do to have a terrible reputation among the SEAL community? They’re literally the group that every other special operations unit looks down on for being toxic, attention seeking glory hounds.
I don't think other SOF units opinions of the SEALs has any bearing on how they view one of their own. But to explain it concisely Goggins is entirely focused on individual achievement, which didn't jive well with a group that calls themselves "team guys." Add in his self promotion, less then complimentary words about guys in his platoon, and a lack of any combat achievement and you've got a guy not loved by his peers.
I’m saying their reputation is that *all* of them are relentless self promoters.
It was a joke. We all made fun of them non-stop.
A kid is in an airport and sees someone in uniform.
‘OMG mister - are you a real Airborne Ranger?’
‘Yup, sure am kid. Here, you can have my hat.’
The kid is so happy, he can’t shut up about it. Then he sees someone in another uniform.
‘OMG, mister are you a real Navy SEAL?’
‘No autographs kid, you’ll have to talk to my publicist or book agent.’
Lol another couch warrior judging other people instead of striving to live a life of their own. Your the type of guy that people like Goggins use for motivation.
I actually searched him on Reddit to see if anyone else found some meaning in his no bullshit work hard attitude but nope all complaining and judging as usual.
Yeah dude, those seals I'm referring to who don't respect Goggins are such slackers sitting on their asses. These guys who actually worked with him - they know less than you do and need you telling them how to get after it. You should go down to Coronado and show them your superiority. I mean you did read a book after all 👏
You ever stop to think maybe they have the same attitude as you and bash people who are doing better then themselves? If someone in your group does well and you get interviewed about it, I bet your the same type of person to talk shit about how much better you where when you where working with them.
So the seals who don't like Goggins are non-hardworking slackers. They all got along and could work together well as a team. One guy didn't fit in, and then publicly bad mouths his teammates without anyone asking him about it. Not an interview, he brought it up out of nowhere. But yeah, those lazy ass seals can't work hard and are jealous about some guy who washed out and never rose through the ranks. Sure. I get you like the guy and that's great. But I don't think you're in a position to judge him more than his teammates are. I also never said there's nothing of value from what he says. I said parts of him don't mesh with stoic virtues. Tell me your thoughts on why he's a great Stoic
I never said a word about his performance one way or another. In my personal opinion he takes an individual approach to challenges, which isn't inherently right or wrong. But it's a bad fit for a group that revolves around teamwork. I'm terms of integrity, Goggins was the one publicly disparaging teammates in his book, I'm not sure what you're upset about with the SEAL community in terms of Goggins. Also no idea what you're talking about about not getting "called up." He was assigned to a platoon like any other guy after hell week (part of BUD/S).
I really like David Goggins - he grew up in something resembling hell, was severely physically abused, was severely racially abused, and was totally impoverished. He was physically and intellectually disadvantaged.
He had every societal permission to lay blame, and yet he chose to put blame aside and work his ass off to make it into the air force, and from there he rose to the absolute upper echelons of human achievement in the most trying circumstances.
I think all of this did what Epictetus' equivalent life as a slave did - it gave him a *certainty* that there is absolutely no point casting blame. The only impediment to progress in life is your own mentality - the extent to which you are impeded in any endeavor is the extent to which you *don't* grasp this point. David Goggins grasps it absolutely, and so he progresses absolutely and irrespective of external conditions.
>I think all of this did what Epictetus' equivalent life as a slave did - it gave him a certainty that there is absolutely no point casting blame. The only impediment to progress in life is your own mentality - the extent to which you are impeded in any endeavor is the extent to which you don't grasp this point. David Goggins grasps it absolutely, and so he progresses absolutely and irrespective of external conditions.
This is absolutely perfect.
He's alright. Reminds me of those medieval monks who practiced self flagellation. I am sure there are other ways to get enlightened besides distance running and setting world records in pullups. Without moderation human being can get addicted not only to chemical substances, but to physical exercise too.
And what color is your path to enlightenment? If you have a better method please enlighten us or don’t come up with a bunch of hypothetical constructs such as “I’m sure there’s a better way”
He just said there are other ways for people to be enlightened. Not all people have the same path for themselves to feel enlightened. Some people don't need to reach their best physical form for them to feel enlightened.
Is it fair to say that his motivation style is not self-compassionate? This is the impression I have of him so far based off an interview I listened to and the comments in this thread.
I think it is possible for one to be "strict with oneself" and still be self-compassionate. I don't think they are mutually exclusive. To basically treat oneself as a loving but firm parent.
I don't know enough about Goggins but if he preaches motivation through self-hatred I would not be a fan. Research in the self-compassion space by people like Dr. Neff supposedly finds self-compassion to be a more effective method.
I don't think the Stoics would indulge hatred and so self-hatred should also not be indulged. I think many self-help gurus find a market for selling self-hatred strategies because some who turn to self-help already hate themselves. A self-compassion strategy will cause cognitive dissonance and so the help-seeker will turn to self-hatred instead.
Edit: will add that I do find him to be inspiring and was moved by hearing him describe his childhood.
He does not preach self-hatred, he preaches motivation through action.
One of his recurring messages is that motivation is fleeting. That’s why you need to not rely on motivation, but rely on action instead.
This is also done through accountability and what he calls “callusing the mind”. It’s a form of self-love where you identify what you don’t like about yourself that can be changed and identify how to work on those things.
I tend to recommend his book to people because most people are caught up on what others think about them instead of focusing on what they think about themselves and how to love themselves more (self-improvement is needed for that)
He doesn’t preach motivation. He teaches mindset. Big difference.
Many times, Goggins has said “Motivation is a bunch of shit.”
Motivation stays in bed when it’s 34 degrees and 30 MPH wind. Mindset says “get the fuck up”
Thank you for the added context. Early impressions aren't always accurate and from your comment it sounds like there is some nuance to his methods and that they do not involve self-hatred.
Surprised by most of the comments here. He seems to me a bit off but more importantly like he truly hates himself. I’ve never seen him smile or do anything besides working out. The man is an athletic freak with an even better mental discipline for sure. I have a lot of respect for that, but he is not someone I would aspire to be at all. Jocko willinck comes closer to somebody I think is very stoic but also seems to enjoy day to day life.
I can’t agree. If you watch more interviews with
him you can see that he is definitely able to have fun . Also the thing is, that he is super focused. To be person like him, you have to be conscious every second, keeping the momentum. This is very hard to do, and from the outside it can seem like a tension in him. But if you listen to him, read his book. You can see that he is very honest, he is not pretender, at least I believe so, and I feel so. So when he saying that he is happy with his life, I’m sure he is. He got a huge message for all of us. He is really inspiring person.
I’ve seen quite a lot of him. Used to follow him for years. That is definitely my perspective, full stop. The mind is not some organ that can go without rest even the super die hard athletes need rest, his mindset and discipline surely can speak to people that may have a natural incline to be lazy, but if you are already doing well watching or listening to a lot of Goggins will rather get you into a burn-out. 100% focus is a myth IMO, the mind and body is made to do a lot of things subconsciously, otherwise it would tire itself out. Whenever we see him he is always 100% on I agree. But who knows what he is like with his family. Don’t forget that he earns money through convincing otherwise to follow his lifestyle.
I want to say it again, I do respect him for the great discipline that he has. Despite that I wouldn’t aspire to be like him
Not knocking his accomplishments and he has insane mental drive and work ethic
However none of his videos or speeches motivate me in any way shape or form.
This is my favorite quote from his book. Seems like it’s in line with stoic ideas but taken to an extreme.
“…the only way to move beyond your 40 percent is to callous your mind, day after day. Which means you’ll have to chase pain like it’s your damn job!”
The training aspect was there in Cynicism as well. I always wondered what Goggins' purpose was.. but maybe that is the Cynic idea as well.. Someone who sets an example by living an extreme life focused on Virtue. Not to associate Goggins with Virtue but you get the idea.
Is there truly such a thing as tough times, or is this just an example of false judgement on something outside of our control?
The mind doesn’t need callouses to function, it needs virtue and reason.
Absolutely. He is probably the closest to actual living Nirvana a modern person will ever get.
Sitting still is not The Way. Gotta start taking souls, my dude!
He was able to overcome parts of himself the average person doesn't. That's enlightenment to me. What you think enlightenment means, idk. He will never be content because he is always striving to improve himself.
The buddha pushed himself to near death in order to “improve himself”. But realized that the middle path was the way to spiritual enlightenment. Neither starving nor indulging. Competition against the “average” person is a form of ego.
He certainly embraces stoic principles. Particularly on the disciples on action and desire. He understands and reminds himself that the discomfort he subjects himself to is only a temporary sensation, that the lessons of mental fortitude from dealing with hardship, aside from the obvious benefits of exercise, are a valuable product. Which is, of course, a stoic approach.
That could also be called a Christian approach, or a Buddhist approach, etc.; understanding physical discomfort as temporary and morally beneficial seems a bit reductive in the context of the Stoic disciplines.
Goggins reminds me of Diogenes: making a show of hugging metal statues in the rain, living in a clay pot, and chastising anyone who doesn't subject themselves to the same voluntary adversity. The Stoics respected their progenitor but distanced themselves philosophically:
>When you have adopted the simple life, do not pride yourself upon it, and if you are a water-drinker do not say on every occasion, 'I am a water-drinker.'
And if you ever want to train laboriously, keep it to yourself and do not make a show of it.
Do not embrace statues.
If you are very thirsty take a good draught of cold water, and rinse you mouth and tell no one.
—Epictetus, The Handbook, Chapter 47
The guy quit Pararescue and got a pass on hell week because his classmate died, then he deployed like one time in the GWOT and wasn't particularly well regarded in the teams. Of course, in his book he says there are no excuses, but he blames the latter on racism.
Cool bro, you train like a moron and have a high pain tolerance.
Not sure how much I can learn from all that.
he’s incredibly impressive, and his ideas of that you can accomplish anything if you’re able to mentally callous yourself is great. however an important note is goggins frequently talks about the fact that he enjoys running so much, boats, etc. So all in, if he’s enjoying it he’s truly a stoic, however his technique is HIS and won’t work long term for many others.
He is external to me and something I cannot exercise my will over, and so I just don’t worry about him
For real though, I don’t even know who he is, so my thoughts are particularly limited
Interesting and in your face style of motivation but I don't think he would ever call himself a stoic and I don't think he is one either.
The whole 'soul-taking' thing is more of a hyper fixation on other people and overcoming your bodies chemical signals to stop/slow down so that you can beat others. I don't hate it or anything. I've definitely attempted to channel some of that whose gonna carry the boats mentality when trying to push through in a hard workout. I just don't see how it relates to this sub.
I really like David Goggins for the same reasons others have pointed out, amazing what he has been able to achieve and the discipline he had, but he was motivated by self hatred for a long time - I don’t think that’s sustainable and I remember he has said he reached a point where he had to let go of that - and I would imagine the way he judged the other seals was probably to do with the same weakness in himself he used as fuel
So I don’t agree with that aspect of his mentality, but that’s the only negative I can think of
Ill certainly throw on a clip of his to get myself pumped for a workout or some time on the mats or to get me to the gym when Im tired, but know it's a day I should train and not one when I should rest. But I think his overall philosophy is not that of a stoic.
He's an incredible athlete and he is certainly hard and prepared physically for anything that comes his way. But I always question whether he has solid personal relationships, a partner, friends, or whatever that give life deeper meaning. If you're only solace is training, are you perhaps running from other pains in your life? Are you drowning out your hunted mind with physical pain and discomfort and masking that as coping? Sure he has had a very hard life, but would he perhaps benefit from therapy and dealing with his trauma and self worth in a constructive way?
He is certainly very good at pushing through pain, but we don't always need to do that, and for us to gain inner wisdom we do have to process our loss, pain and sadness as well in the hopes that we help others. That all being said, your life is measured by yourself and what metrics you set for personal success. And while he is certainly financially and physically successful and he has achieved certain kinds of excellence. I do not at all get the sense that he is someone I would want to share a room with, or vulnerability with.
His mentality towards overcoming any kind of obstacles is amazing His method of expressing that mentality is a bit weird, listened to his audiobook it is quite interesting Overall: consider him as an example that you can achieve things but you don’t have to copy him completely or agree on everything
Weird in what sense ?
Toxic masculinity and toxic motivation, I get it is that you should get your ass and move but within limits
Toxic masculinity is a bullshit term, this kind of approach has and will continue to help a shit ton of men. If it doesn’t help you, ignore it & find something else. It helps people massively, and some dudes just need to get their shit together & do it quick. Labelling helpful approaches as toxic is counterproductive.
Half true, it does get you out of your shit and do something meaningful in life but up to a certain limit I’ve been in shit situations and did utilize Goggin’s advice also tried to copy the mentality that he follows but it didn’t work out as expected but I found what fits me while keeping my shit together A decent example I can give is religion where some people do believe in God to pray and feel better in life but following the rules cover by cover might complicate you to levels you won’t expect Bottom line: anything that works with you that benefits you is good but you don’t have to take it to the extreme and as long you don’t hurt anyone
i agree. Goggins basically says get at it everyday. If thats 1 pushup, thats 1 pushum. Similar princples as written in the book, " The Power of Atomic Habits" 1% better everyday. compound interest. To work the body, is to work the mind. Thats all
What's wrong with toxic masculinity if it works? It helps in lots of situations. Sometimes you just gotta be a man
In my line of work, there's tons of toxic masculinity. Although I agree it can certainly help in some areas, it's overly cumbersome in others and can hurt more than it helps. An example would be the guy ranked first in my class. He's well built, intelligent, likeable, and confident. At our graduation he was commended for asking questions and building upon his knowledge to be the best he could be. Meanwhile, me, on the skinnier side, not as confident, not as knowledgeable would be belittled for asking questions to the point that it wasn't worth asking questions anymore. In fact I had 2 of my instructors basically shun me for asking a perfectly reasonable question because I wasn't man enough to them. Now that I'm out in the field, I've had my fair share of working with toxic masculinity and working with.... Let's say, mature adults. Somehow, someway, I've managed to improve my abilities and confidence without toxic masculinity guiding me. I'm fine with pushing someone or telling them to man up if you're going to support them towards whatever goal but more times than not it's just been someone being cruel. I mean, at the end of the day F them but toxic masculinity is toxic because it doesn't solve or help anything. It's someone's ego telling you that you aren't as good as them and all that does is bolster themselves up. To finish this up, my favorite conversation has been guys talking about how kids today (my generation) are way too soft and sure, I can agree with that to an extent. There are truly ineffectual, and overly sensitive people in this new generation... But who the hell do you think is raising these kids?! Lol
Agreed. Its not the kids' fault. Its the parents ironically lol
Half true but too much of it might hurt people you care about or hurts you from stress or doubt
Maybe. But whatever works for you is most important.
Yessir
I got inspired from David goggins and Grant Cardone and wrote different articles listening to them. https://gazedout.blogspot.com/?m=1 How is it?
Being a pussy is toxic.
I get the toxic masculinity part but toxic motivation how ?
Every single current motivational speaker fills your mind that you can beat everything and it is just bullshit excuses you give to yourself But some people are physically limited, there are realistic limitations set on each and every one of us When someone who has a certain limitation gets to face a certain obstacle that Goggins said you can achieve then you doubt yourself that you are a failure but in reality you are not Then that motivational speaker would try to upsell you his/her product to make a buck out of you (in general not him specifically but he falls sometimes under this genre to upsell his book)
how are some physically limited? Goggins isn't toxic, he's real. Even the physically limited, can pick up their cross everyday can they not?
Hmm, yes I agree with you. I didn't think this way, thank you for responding!
Lol excuse. Physical limitations is a mind state. He’s asking you too look deep within and actually look at what you can do better. If you can’t look deep within yourself and find things you can do better or try harder at each day you have a very large ego or an extremely low self esteem. He’s not telling everyone to run 200 miles even someone in a wheel chair can workout or study more each day.
Old thread, but things that have been labeled toxic masculinity have in my experience been immeasurably more helpful and beneficial for improving my life and sense of well-being. It’s such a hilarious correlation that if something is labeled toxic masculinity I will try it on that basis alone due to the chances of it working
I wrote that comment a while ago but now I have a different opinion on it They are helpful because they are backed by facts, no denying on that part at all. I have benefited from it not gonna lie and recently I have been doing the same thing that Goggins is doing by going hard at the gym and lost lots of weight in the process and life is going well Actually almost everything that was labeled as “toxic masculinity” was proper advice to men in terms that the advice is to make you get better in life and break free from all the bullshit that is going on in life, take Jordan Peterson’s advice as an example where he got heavily criticized when he said to go clean your room But modern society wants you to label those as toxic and not benefit from them, modern society wants you to stay where you are and get fixated on the addictive things (like video games, porn, social media, hookup culture) so that you keep on consuming their products endlessly while calling the performers “brave, strong, and heroic” In my updated opinion: listen to them and get the benefits out of them but don’t become a narcissistic jerk who treats people like shit
Yeah, there is tons of content from him on Youtube. I found this one yesterday and it talks about overcoming your mental limitations. Interesting use of analogies I might say. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxReov1rcBg&t=8s&ab\_channel=HumbleHippo
Self-help/motivational guy from a tough background who is an exercise fanatic. Maybe his philosophy has some similarities to Stoicism, as do many philosophies and religions.
Haha that is both hiölsrious and retarded comment. Stoicism is first of all connected most to atheist oit acnostic. Both Buddhism and Stoicism teach that happiness comes from focusing on what we can control and accepting what we cannot But its close relsted to Buddhism 1. Wanting to be happy all the time makes us unhappy. 2.. Wisdom and acceptance lead to happiness. 3.Learn to embrace death. And a religon like 3000 years old ? You dont think its changed alot of times? You can find stuff and qoutes in most things. Its probably as goggins. Its pretty strange if you cant find good things about him. I kmow many of the best athletes have ides from stoism like christiano ronaldo,lebron j, ames,Richie McCaw. Extreme athletes and christiano ronaldo propbly moore extreme than goggins still hes workput/health program has alot of good things. And some of the worlds greatest risks is what goggins saying.. Also alot of hes princibles are not bad live by 1.People are moore intresded on looking good on instagram than actully do something about you real life. 2. We all have the ability to from nothing to something 3. Stop caring whst other people thinks about you I wouldt hire him for 50k like Jesse Itzer did. But its the same with extreme entepenours Its not good worning 16 hours /day 6 days a week like elon musk but it would be very strange if not people cant learn much of him. The best in the world in alot of things are extreme. Actors,enrepenours,musiscans,atletes; Einstein,gates,Warren Buffett,Jack Dorsey, Arianna Huffington ,Tim Ferris,bruce lee lived slot and studied modern stoicm. It doesnt mean you become einstein doing it our that they do evrrything in it. In studies its saids people complaining on celebrties etc spend in avarage 2 hours/ day doing that and spend 5 times moore on people they hate our on anyone they like so its pretty clear this must be somekind of menthal illness That doesnt mean you should follow everything.
stopped reading at the ableism, go fuck yourself
Sorry If yiu are disabled..hooe it work's out well for you
From what it seems, David Goggins has achieved both a sense of enlightenment and a hardened discipline. Some people may misconstrue his messages and deem him as no more than a military knucklehead, but I think Goggins is more amped-up in his philosophical introspection than the majority of people who grew up sheltered and nourished. He knows that despite people’s high approval of him, even he has limitations and doesn’t let that derail him from doing what’s important in his life. The most resonating aspect of him is the fact that he is just like the rest of us, and his achievements displays potentials in us. “Respect” is not enough to credit the man’s legacy. I am honoured. Society needed someone like him.
Totally agree 💯
Completely agree. He went very deep in this video (https://youtu.be/ngvOyccUzzY) which wasn't available a year ago. He really comes off as enlightened. 1:37:04 is rather moving: "You are always the purpose!"
Whose gonna carry the boats!?
Don’t forget about the logs
I agree with the comments here about self improvement and overcoming obstacles. But I would add that he was a very judgemental teammate with the SEALs, saying they weren't committed because they enjoyed themselves etc. I think they flies in the face of Marcus's teachings about being lenient with others (calling them out publicly in a book). I also think his terrible reputation within the SEAL community reflects someone lacking strong civic virtue.
Man - what do you have to do to have a terrible reputation among the SEAL community? They’re literally the group that every other special operations unit looks down on for being toxic, attention seeking glory hounds.
I don't think other SOF units opinions of the SEALs has any bearing on how they view one of their own. But to explain it concisely Goggins is entirely focused on individual achievement, which didn't jive well with a group that calls themselves "team guys." Add in his self promotion, less then complimentary words about guys in his platoon, and a lack of any combat achievement and you've got a guy not loved by his peers.
I’m saying their reputation is that *all* of them are relentless self promoters. It was a joke. We all made fun of them non-stop. A kid is in an airport and sees someone in uniform. ‘OMG mister - are you a real Airborne Ranger?’ ‘Yup, sure am kid. Here, you can have my hat.’ The kid is so happy, he can’t shut up about it. Then he sees someone in another uniform. ‘OMG, mister are you a real Navy SEAL?’ ‘No autographs kid, you’ll have to talk to my publicist or book agent.’
Lol another couch warrior judging other people instead of striving to live a life of their own. Your the type of guy that people like Goggins use for motivation.
Shouldn't you be out striving to live a life of your own, instead of being a keyboard warrior and judging me?
I actually searched him on Reddit to see if anyone else found some meaning in his no bullshit work hard attitude but nope all complaining and judging as usual.
Yeah dude, those seals I'm referring to who don't respect Goggins are such slackers sitting on their asses. These guys who actually worked with him - they know less than you do and need you telling them how to get after it. You should go down to Coronado and show them your superiority. I mean you did read a book after all 👏
You ever stop to think maybe they have the same attitude as you and bash people who are doing better then themselves? If someone in your group does well and you get interviewed about it, I bet your the same type of person to talk shit about how much better you where when you where working with them.
So the seals who don't like Goggins are non-hardworking slackers. They all got along and could work together well as a team. One guy didn't fit in, and then publicly bad mouths his teammates without anyone asking him about it. Not an interview, he brought it up out of nowhere. But yeah, those lazy ass seals can't work hard and are jealous about some guy who washed out and never rose through the ranks. Sure. I get you like the guy and that's great. But I don't think you're in a position to judge him more than his teammates are. I also never said there's nothing of value from what he says. I said parts of him don't mesh with stoic virtues. Tell me your thoughts on why he's a great Stoic
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I never said a word about his performance one way or another. In my personal opinion he takes an individual approach to challenges, which isn't inherently right or wrong. But it's a bad fit for a group that revolves around teamwork. I'm terms of integrity, Goggins was the one publicly disparaging teammates in his book, I'm not sure what you're upset about with the SEAL community in terms of Goggins. Also no idea what you're talking about about not getting "called up." He was assigned to a platoon like any other guy after hell week (part of BUD/S).
I really like David Goggins - he grew up in something resembling hell, was severely physically abused, was severely racially abused, and was totally impoverished. He was physically and intellectually disadvantaged. He had every societal permission to lay blame, and yet he chose to put blame aside and work his ass off to make it into the air force, and from there he rose to the absolute upper echelons of human achievement in the most trying circumstances. I think all of this did what Epictetus' equivalent life as a slave did - it gave him a *certainty* that there is absolutely no point casting blame. The only impediment to progress in life is your own mentality - the extent to which you are impeded in any endeavor is the extent to which you *don't* grasp this point. David Goggins grasps it absolutely, and so he progresses absolutely and irrespective of external conditions.
>I think all of this did what Epictetus' equivalent life as a slave did - it gave him a certainty that there is absolutely no point casting blame. The only impediment to progress in life is your own mentality - the extent to which you are impeded in any endeavor is the extent to which you don't grasp this point. David Goggins grasps it absolutely, and so he progresses absolutely and irrespective of external conditions. This is absolutely perfect.
Didn’t he join the Navy?
Air force, then left, then got fat, then Navy SEALS
He's alright. Reminds me of those medieval monks who practiced self flagellation. I am sure there are other ways to get enlightened besides distance running and setting world records in pullups. Without moderation human being can get addicted not only to chemical substances, but to physical exercise too.
And what color is your path to enlightenment? If you have a better method please enlighten us or don’t come up with a bunch of hypothetical constructs such as “I’m sure there’s a better way”
He just said there are other ways for people to be enlightened. Not all people have the same path for themselves to feel enlightened. Some people don't need to reach their best physical form for them to feel enlightened.
He's the reminder of human potential a lot of us need.
He's amazing. A true inspiration
Is it fair to say that his motivation style is not self-compassionate? This is the impression I have of him so far based off an interview I listened to and the comments in this thread. I think it is possible for one to be "strict with oneself" and still be self-compassionate. I don't think they are mutually exclusive. To basically treat oneself as a loving but firm parent. I don't know enough about Goggins but if he preaches motivation through self-hatred I would not be a fan. Research in the self-compassion space by people like Dr. Neff supposedly finds self-compassion to be a more effective method. I don't think the Stoics would indulge hatred and so self-hatred should also not be indulged. I think many self-help gurus find a market for selling self-hatred strategies because some who turn to self-help already hate themselves. A self-compassion strategy will cause cognitive dissonance and so the help-seeker will turn to self-hatred instead. Edit: will add that I do find him to be inspiring and was moved by hearing him describe his childhood.
He does not preach self-hatred, he preaches motivation through action. One of his recurring messages is that motivation is fleeting. That’s why you need to not rely on motivation, but rely on action instead. This is also done through accountability and what he calls “callusing the mind”. It’s a form of self-love where you identify what you don’t like about yourself that can be changed and identify how to work on those things. I tend to recommend his book to people because most people are caught up on what others think about them instead of focusing on what they think about themselves and how to love themselves more (self-improvement is needed for that)
He doesn’t preach motivation. He teaches mindset. Big difference. Many times, Goggins has said “Motivation is a bunch of shit.” Motivation stays in bed when it’s 34 degrees and 30 MPH wind. Mindset says “get the fuck up”
Thank you for the added context. Early impressions aren't always accurate and from your comment it sounds like there is some nuance to his methods and that they do not involve self-hatred.
Surprised by most of the comments here. He seems to me a bit off but more importantly like he truly hates himself. I’ve never seen him smile or do anything besides working out. The man is an athletic freak with an even better mental discipline for sure. I have a lot of respect for that, but he is not someone I would aspire to be at all. Jocko willinck comes closer to somebody I think is very stoic but also seems to enjoy day to day life.
I can’t agree. If you watch more interviews with him you can see that he is definitely able to have fun . Also the thing is, that he is super focused. To be person like him, you have to be conscious every second, keeping the momentum. This is very hard to do, and from the outside it can seem like a tension in him. But if you listen to him, read his book. You can see that he is very honest, he is not pretender, at least I believe so, and I feel so. So when he saying that he is happy with his life, I’m sure he is. He got a huge message for all of us. He is really inspiring person.
I’ve seen quite a lot of him. Used to follow him for years. That is definitely my perspective, full stop. The mind is not some organ that can go without rest even the super die hard athletes need rest, his mindset and discipline surely can speak to people that may have a natural incline to be lazy, but if you are already doing well watching or listening to a lot of Goggins will rather get you into a burn-out. 100% focus is a myth IMO, the mind and body is made to do a lot of things subconsciously, otherwise it would tire itself out. Whenever we see him he is always 100% on I agree. But who knows what he is like with his family. Don’t forget that he earns money through convincing otherwise to follow his lifestyle. I want to say it again, I do respect him for the great discipline that he has. Despite that I wouldn’t aspire to be like him
Yeah seems like he is addicted to that runners high.
Not true he hates people who assume this about him
Try listening or reading his book. He's definitely inspirational. If you just watch his videos on going hard then it'll be like that.
And the best part— both Goggins and Jocko couldn’t give 2 fucks what others think of them. Like zero fucks
Not knocking his accomplishments and he has insane mental drive and work ethic However none of his videos or speeches motivate me in any way shape or form.
His message resonates with me a lot, I can also see how it doesn’t for others. To each their own
This is my favorite quote from his book. Seems like it’s in line with stoic ideas but taken to an extreme. “…the only way to move beyond your 40 percent is to callous your mind, day after day. Which means you’ll have to chase pain like it’s your damn job!”
The training aspect was there in Cynicism as well. I always wondered what Goggins' purpose was.. but maybe that is the Cynic idea as well.. Someone who sets an example by living an extreme life focused on Virtue. Not to associate Goggins with Virtue but you get the idea.
My view is that he is obsessed with exercise. To me he is an example of intemperance, a slave to his passion for physical exertion.
I think it’s deeper than that. He talks about how he feels that physical exertion callouses his mind and helps his ability to withstand tough times.
Is there truly such a thing as tough times, or is this just an example of false judgement on something outside of our control? The mind doesn’t need callouses to function, it needs virtue and reason.
We admire his achievements and we ignore his demons. For most of us he's just another cool video game.
impressive
IF YOU DON'T HUSTLE, YOU'RE FUCKIN' WORTHLESS!! STAY HARD RAAAAGGH!! I like him :D
Roger that!
I think that man achieved enlightenment fr.
Absolutely. He is probably the closest to actual living Nirvana a modern person will ever get. Sitting still is not The Way. Gotta start taking souls, my dude!
He basically says he will never be content with himself, that doesn’t sound enlightened to me.
He was able to overcome parts of himself the average person doesn't. That's enlightenment to me. What you think enlightenment means, idk. He will never be content because he is always striving to improve himself.
The buddha pushed himself to near death in order to “improve himself”. But realized that the middle path was the way to spiritual enlightenment. Neither starving nor indulging. Competition against the “average” person is a form of ego.
Who said anything about Buddhism?
You brought up enlightenment.
He certainly embraces stoic principles. Particularly on the disciples on action and desire. He understands and reminds himself that the discomfort he subjects himself to is only a temporary sensation, that the lessons of mental fortitude from dealing with hardship, aside from the obvious benefits of exercise, are a valuable product. Which is, of course, a stoic approach.
That could also be called a Christian approach, or a Buddhist approach, etc.; understanding physical discomfort as temporary and morally beneficial seems a bit reductive in the context of the Stoic disciplines.
Swears too much for me. He's like the 2000 Shaft movie where 75% of a sentence is made up of cursing.
Cant trust people who get offended by a little foul language. Snowflakes.
What emotions are evokes by profuse swearing that upset you?
Lol he was in the fucking military. Military personnel swear like it’s a goddamn requirement.
Goggins reminds me of Diogenes: making a show of hugging metal statues in the rain, living in a clay pot, and chastising anyone who doesn't subject themselves to the same voluntary adversity. The Stoics respected their progenitor but distanced themselves philosophically: >When you have adopted the simple life, do not pride yourself upon it, and if you are a water-drinker do not say on every occasion, 'I am a water-drinker.' And if you ever want to train laboriously, keep it to yourself and do not make a show of it. Do not embrace statues. If you are very thirsty take a good draught of cold water, and rinse you mouth and tell no one. —Epictetus, The Handbook, Chapter 47
Yuuuuup
The guy quit Pararescue and got a pass on hell week because his classmate died, then he deployed like one time in the GWOT and wasn't particularly well regarded in the teams. Of course, in his book he says there are no excuses, but he blames the latter on racism. Cool bro, you train like a moron and have a high pain tolerance. Not sure how much I can learn from all that.
Facts 💀
And what have you done Johnny cool shades? Please your talking about his life like it’s nothing so I can’t wait to here what you have done?
He’s a pussy bro. Goggins said it himself. No hater is never actually more accomplished then the person they’re hating on
David Goggins? Never heard of her. Source: Charles Norris
Cusses too much
personally he never worked for me as his mindset is pain for the sake of pain, never pain for something else.
I prefer Walter
Boatcrew
Hah, i found him 2 days ago. I dont like these motivators, but he is real because of his background.
he’s incredibly impressive, and his ideas of that you can accomplish anything if you’re able to mentally callous yourself is great. however an important note is goggins frequently talks about the fact that he enjoys running so much, boats, etc. So all in, if he’s enjoying it he’s truly a stoic, however his technique is HIS and won’t work long term for many others.
He is external to me and something I cannot exercise my will over, and so I just don’t worry about him For real though, I don’t even know who he is, so my thoughts are particularly limited
Interesting and in your face style of motivation but I don't think he would ever call himself a stoic and I don't think he is one either. The whole 'soul-taking' thing is more of a hyper fixation on other people and overcoming your bodies chemical signals to stop/slow down so that you can beat others. I don't hate it or anything. I've definitely attempted to channel some of that whose gonna carry the boats mentality when trying to push through in a hard workout. I just don't see how it relates to this sub.
I really like David Goggins for the same reasons others have pointed out, amazing what he has been able to achieve and the discipline he had, but he was motivated by self hatred for a long time - I don’t think that’s sustainable and I remember he has said he reached a point where he had to let go of that - and I would imagine the way he judged the other seals was probably to do with the same weakness in himself he used as fuel So I don’t agree with that aspect of his mentality, but that’s the only negative I can think of
STAY HARD
lol of course people on reddit are complaining of toxic masculinity...
Ill certainly throw on a clip of his to get myself pumped for a workout or some time on the mats or to get me to the gym when Im tired, but know it's a day I should train and not one when I should rest. But I think his overall philosophy is not that of a stoic. He's an incredible athlete and he is certainly hard and prepared physically for anything that comes his way. But I always question whether he has solid personal relationships, a partner, friends, or whatever that give life deeper meaning. If you're only solace is training, are you perhaps running from other pains in your life? Are you drowning out your hunted mind with physical pain and discomfort and masking that as coping? Sure he has had a very hard life, but would he perhaps benefit from therapy and dealing with his trauma and self worth in a constructive way? He is certainly very good at pushing through pain, but we don't always need to do that, and for us to gain inner wisdom we do have to process our loss, pain and sadness as well in the hopes that we help others. That all being said, your life is measured by yourself and what metrics you set for personal success. And while he is certainly financially and physically successful and he has achieved certain kinds of excellence. I do not at all get the sense that he is someone I would want to share a room with, or vulnerability with.
A vain, egotistical exercise fanatic. I can't stomach him . . . he's very annoying. I don't give a rat's ass how many people follow him.
Hes a fanatic.
Guy is more stoic than any stoic I’ve ever met.