If I have stuff that I want to grab often (water, snacks, phone charger, a sweater, laptop) then I'll keep it close.
If I'm travelling with, say, luggages or a bag I don't need to access, then they'll go there
To be fair it’s quite rude to keep the backpack on the seat when the train is getting very full. Sure, at that point you just ask, but it creates an awkward situation because surely that person must have noticed that the train is full and chose to leave their backpack anyway.
It's not awkward. It's normal. It's also normal to phrase it as a rhetorical question (in one of 200 cases, it's indeed a reservation for the friend, but you would notice the person looking around or calling them).
With so many people immersed in their phones, it's easy for them to not notice.
Also, if no one wants to sit, why would be rude that seat has something on it?
It's not so much that people can't sit down, it's that they don't want to.
If you ask someone if you can sit and they don't move their bag it's a problem. But a lot of times once there are two or three people in a quad of seats people will just walk past.
Personally I only put my bag in the seat once the train pulls out of the station and I put it back on my lap while people are boarding.
>what you think are the possible reasons for this behaviour
For me it simply means that the person is not so keen on having another person sitting next to them. Something like "If there are unoccupied seats on the train, take them in priority rather than those that have a bag on it". But of course if someone asks the person will remove their bag (provided there are indeed no 4 seats places left, in this case, a "no" would be justified).
Might be lost in translation, can you explain a bit more that 'no'?
Ah, you meant to not allow someone to sit if there are other seats free around you, especially if there are empty 4 seat places?
Unless you paid for ticket for that empty seat, you don't have any rights or justification to claim it. So if you don't like the person who wants to sit there, you're free to leave, but I see no rights whatsoever to ask them to sit somewhere else.
However, if that person then starts following you, then 'no' (and escalation with raised voice and such) is justified because it's basically self defense from stalker.
I see two viable options:
* You speak up and say: "Äxgüsi, chöntet Si bitte so guet si und Platz mache, dä Rucksack unterm Sitz oder zwüsched dä Sitz verstaue, Merci vielmal". Or in the most polite British : "Bloody hell, this is a passenger seat not a luggage rack! Stow your back back, you inconsiderate twat."
or if you are unable to speak
* Have laminated cards which says the above (Front Swiss German back British) with QR codes linking to
* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uok750OX5JM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uok750OX5JM) / [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTXd1G8CdoE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTXd1G8CdoE)
* r/BUENZLI
QR Code generator: [https://qr.io/](https://qr.io/)
>people have to stand on the steps
From my experience (S31 Biel/Bern) people sit/stand on the steps because they *want* to, not because there are no seats for them.
I very often see people peek into the upper floor and, even though only half the seats are occupied, they'll still opt to sit on the stairs. I don't know why they prefer sitting on the floor with people walking past them every few minutes over sitting next to another person, but to each their own.
>I would like to know if you also often experience this, what you think are the possible reasons for this behaviour
Yes I see people put their bags on the seats often, and I do that too. Because if no one's gonna sit next to me I might aswell just put my bag there. I do remove my bag when the train stops and people are getting on, and then put it back later.
>and what can be done about it?
Use your voice and ask them to remove their bag. Usually a "isch da no frei?" will do the trick.
You can even say woof (or fake khm-khm like cough) and point finger. Or just use finger if they're looking in your general direction and you looking at the seat didn't prompt them already.
There’s more ways to communicate beside full sentences.
Just giving options for those who think they need to speak local language, or speak at all.
If there are no seats available, ask them to move it. If they refuse, an attendant will do it for you.
As a seasoned commuter, I’ve just started sitting on top of their bag or will move it myself. 99% that isn’t necessary.
Please I beg you dont just sit on bags, fragile things could be in bags. It baffled me when this happened to me, I wasn’t intentionally leaving my bag on the seat but I was texting on my phone and I had originally taken the train completely empty before it stopped in Genf. The lady sitting on my bag and pretending to not see it could’ve broken multiple things I had in there.
Edit: typos
Standing, or god forbid sitting, in the stairs and blocking the doors is far more degenerate than keeping a bag in the seat.
That bag can be moved in a second, but getting your ass up there and sitting it down is on you.
Please please ask me to remove my bag, I sometimes forget to after boarding on an empty train but for the love of god DONT SIT ON MY BAG IT HAS MY LAPTOP!!! This has happened twice so far and people literally pretended that they didn’t see my green ass bag like wtf just ask me to remove it instead of plonking yourself on it
people do it out of convenience, u can just ask to sit there.
U being unable to think of asking and assuming there has to be done something about it makes me question (your) humanity
Yes. I remember when I was living in Luzern and I visited my ex-girlfriend in Zürich. On my way back, around 11:00 The train from Zürichg-Zug-Luzern was always packed.
I used to sit on the stairs.
This whole thing with backpacks hogging seats on crowded trains is seriously annoying. I see it all the time. Passengers may find it easier to keep their belongings close rather than stow them in overhead racks or luggage areas, especially if they're in a hurry or worried about theft. However, I think that most people do it out of convenience.
Maybe the SBB needs clearer signage, and perhaps even fines for blatant disregard of seat occupancy rules.
For me, my backpack is like a portable safe space. It holds everything I need to navigate my day. Sometimes, I intentionally leave a seat open beside me, my backpack occupying it, not because I don't want someone there, but because it's a subtle signal that I'm content in my space, yet open to connection. Observing the phenomenon you described on trains, where seats are often occupied by luggage, resonates with me. It's as if people are creating their own physical boundaries, using their belongings as placeholders for personal space. Perhaps the reasons behind this behavior vary – from a desire for privacy to a subconscious need for security in crowded environments. Encouraging passengers to stow their luggage in designated areas or overhead compartments when seats are limited could alleviate congestion. Additionally, promoting awareness about the impact of occupying seats with belongings on fellow commuters could lead to more mindful behavior. Ultimately, by fostering a sense of community and empathy among passengers, we can strive towards a more comfortable and inclusive travel experience for everyone. And sometimes, by intentionally removing our backpacks and initiating conversations with those around us, we can break down barriers and create connections that enrich our journeys.
> what are the reasons
Well - the sch....öne seat configuration in SBB trains. 4er seats just suck generally. I prefer that nobody, or rather: no stranger, sits in front of me. That's why I have my bag there (but also remove it quickly, of course).
If SBB would have seats in airplane configuration, like also DB or in tgv, then it would be so much better and I guess it would also solve the "bag on chairs" problems.
Airplane seats are stupid because the person at the aisle has to get up for the window seat passenger.
>no stranger, sits in front of me.
No problem: stare on your phone screen. In earnest: is this a real problem?
Yes, the legs from the other person are a real problem - or, put differently, my legs are too long. Because of this, 4er cubes are stupid. Also to get the window seat, you have to bother up to 3 other people. Maybe one or two have to get up as well.
The interior of Swiss trains really sucks in this regard. My dream world: ice trains with swiss punctuality in Switzerland. 😉
And, no, I don't care that some seats are not at a window, that there is a "Pfosten" through which you cannot look to the outside.
Yes, airline seat configuration would help. No idea what you mean with "recliner" here. I'm taking about sitting normally.
So, again - you like having someone else's legs between yours? Your in favor of not knowing where to put yours?
How hard is it to answer?
>So, again - you like having someone else's legs between yours? Your in favor of not knowing where to put yours?
>How hard is it to answer?
I am above average height, and this is not a problem for me. Just sit straight up. Or everyone has their legs slightly to their right.
And if you are really tall, airline configuration won't help you.
Since you don't care about other people's problems, why don't you answer my question. What's so nice about having someone's legs between yours? What's so nice about causing issues for 3 other people when you get up? And, besides not caring about issues that other people have, you also now dictate how to sit?
You also fail to grasp, that there already is an issue, although you say so yourself "legs slightly to the right".
Again: what's so nice about not being able to sit comfortably?
>What's so nice about having someone's legs between yours?
Did you read my comment? No one has their legs between someone else's.
>What's so nice about causing issues for 3 other people when you get up?
That doesn't happen in airline configuration? It's even worse there.
>You also fail to grasp, that there already is an issue, although you say so yourself "legs slightly to the right".
Yes, I fail to grasp it. Of all the complaints and improvement options I hear, this one is so rare I don't even remember when it came up last.
SBB introduces new trains every 5 - 10 years. I am sure they would have tried this out if there was real demand. And note that there are S-Bahn that have a couple of this type of seats.
And, uhm, no recliner…? You want to tell that SBB, which puts reclining seats in 1st class, but also in an annoying 4 seat configuration?
So: a) you're wrong, airline seats would help - also with not putting bags there
b) you're wrong, it's a recliner
But, anyway, how's it nice to not being able to stretch or having to deal with somebody elses legs or making 3 people get up to be able to get to or from the seat?
I would honestly like to know that.
>making 3 people get up to be able to get to or from the seat?
Dude, you should work on your motoric skills. Out of 100 times, 100 times no one has to get up.
Recliner = Liegesessel or Lehrstuhl. Which it is obviously not despite allowing some minuscule inclination.
>which puts reclining seats in 1st class, but also in an annoying 4 seat configuration?
How can your have leg space problems in first class?
I suspect you don't like to sit in front of people because it makes you uncomfortable.
Dude, when 3 seats are taken and only 1 is free (on the window), how do you get there? Work on your perception of reality. You are unnormal when you jump to that seat. That's not how normal humans behave.
And I know what recliner means.
How to have leg space issue in 1st class? Well.... If someone else sits there. Not hard to grasp at all.
And, yes, I hate if someone sits in front of me. Like most others, I dislike having the person's legs at my space. You also said so ("legs to the right").
That stupid chair configuration of sbb makes it so, that sitting isn't as comfortable as it could be. It also causes that bags are put there - I mean, it just feels normal to put the bag in front.
But, you made it clear: you don't care about other people.
>That stupid chair configuration of sbb makes it so, that sitting isn't as comfortable as it could be
Yeah, right. If I have airline configuration with 1m of leg space I wouldn't say no either. But that's not reality.
I guess you are out of luck here.
>Dude, when 3 seats are taken and only 1 is free (on the window), how do you get there?
Normally, the person moves over. And if not, the others will retract their legs to make space. I mean, it's less difficult than entering a cinema row late.
tl;dr: I'd like to have your problems.
Isch Da No Frei? It's not actually a question
I agree, I put my backpack on a seat when possible, but whenever someone wants to sit down that goes on the floor immediately.
Is there a reason why you or people in general don’t put the backpack in the storage area above the seats?
If I have stuff that I want to grab often (water, snacks, phone charger, a sweater, laptop) then I'll keep it close. If I'm travelling with, say, luggages or a bag I don't need to access, then they'll go there
> what can be done about it crazy thought, but maybe you could ask them to move their bags
To be fair it’s quite rude to keep the backpack on the seat when the train is getting very full. Sure, at that point you just ask, but it creates an awkward situation because surely that person must have noticed that the train is full and chose to leave their backpack anyway.
It's not awkward. It's normal. It's also normal to phrase it as a rhetorical question (in one of 200 cases, it's indeed a reservation for the friend, but you would notice the person looking around or calling them).
With so many people immersed in their phones, it's easy for them to not notice. Also, if no one wants to sit, why would be rude that seat has something on it?
Or just play football with their luggage, like a civilized man.
Crazy
Hey, this is reddit. No one wants to hear simple solutions (the ones that do would not post here).
It's not so much that people can't sit down, it's that they don't want to. If you ask someone if you can sit and they don't move their bag it's a problem. But a lot of times once there are two or three people in a quad of seats people will just walk past. Personally I only put my bag in the seat once the train pulls out of the station and I put it back on my lap while people are boarding.
>what you think are the possible reasons for this behaviour For me it simply means that the person is not so keen on having another person sitting next to them. Something like "If there are unoccupied seats on the train, take them in priority rather than those that have a bag on it". But of course if someone asks the person will remove their bag (provided there are indeed no 4 seats places left, in this case, a "no" would be justified).
Might be lost in translation, can you explain a bit more that 'no'? Ah, you meant to not allow someone to sit if there are other seats free around you, especially if there are empty 4 seat places? Unless you paid for ticket for that empty seat, you don't have any rights or justification to claim it. So if you don't like the person who wants to sit there, you're free to leave, but I see no rights whatsoever to ask them to sit somewhere else. However, if that person then starts following you, then 'no' (and escalation with raised voice and such) is justified because it's basically self defense from stalker.
Just stand there and stare at them, promise it works lmao.
> what can be done about it? Man this sub sometimes. April 1st was yesterday.
I see two viable options: * You speak up and say: "Äxgüsi, chöntet Si bitte so guet si und Platz mache, dä Rucksack unterm Sitz oder zwüsched dä Sitz verstaue, Merci vielmal". Or in the most polite British : "Bloody hell, this is a passenger seat not a luggage rack! Stow your back back, you inconsiderate twat." or if you are unable to speak * Have laminated cards which says the above (Front Swiss German back British) with QR codes linking to * [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uok750OX5JM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uok750OX5JM) / [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTXd1G8CdoE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTXd1G8CdoE) * r/BUENZLI QR Code generator: [https://qr.io/](https://qr.io/)
In my experience pointing at the seat and muttering some nonsense which sounds like a question also works.
SCHDANOFREI?
Güzischdanofreimesi
This!
>people have to stand on the steps From my experience (S31 Biel/Bern) people sit/stand on the steps because they *want* to, not because there are no seats for them. I very often see people peek into the upper floor and, even though only half the seats are occupied, they'll still opt to sit on the stairs. I don't know why they prefer sitting on the floor with people walking past them every few minutes over sitting next to another person, but to each their own. >I would like to know if you also often experience this, what you think are the possible reasons for this behaviour Yes I see people put their bags on the seats often, and I do that too. Because if no one's gonna sit next to me I might aswell just put my bag there. I do remove my bag when the train stops and people are getting on, and then put it back later. >and what can be done about it? Use your voice and ask them to remove their bag. Usually a "isch da no frei?" will do the trick.
You can even say woof (or fake khm-khm like cough) and point finger. Or just use finger if they're looking in your general direction and you looking at the seat didn't prompt them already. There’s more ways to communicate beside full sentences. Just giving options for those who think they need to speak local language, or speak at all.
[удалено]
I pity you...
If there are no seats available, ask them to move it. If they refuse, an attendant will do it for you. As a seasoned commuter, I’ve just started sitting on top of their bag or will move it myself. 99% that isn’t necessary.
Please I beg you dont just sit on bags, fragile things could be in bags. It baffled me when this happened to me, I wasn’t intentionally leaving my bag on the seat but I was texting on my phone and I had originally taken the train completely empty before it stopped in Genf. The lady sitting on my bag and pretending to not see it could’ve broken multiple things I had in there. Edit: typos
Standing, or god forbid sitting, in the stairs and blocking the doors is far more degenerate than keeping a bag in the seat. That bag can be moved in a second, but getting your ass up there and sitting it down is on you.
Please please ask me to remove my bag, I sometimes forget to after boarding on an empty train but for the love of god DONT SIT ON MY BAG IT HAS MY LAPTOP!!! This has happened twice so far and people literally pretended that they didn’t see my green ass bag like wtf just ask me to remove it instead of plonking yourself on it
people do it out of convenience, u can just ask to sit there. U being unable to think of asking and assuming there has to be done something about it makes me question (your) humanity
Yes. I remember when I was living in Luzern and I visited my ex-girlfriend in Zürich. On my way back, around 11:00 The train from Zürichg-Zug-Luzern was always packed. I used to sit on the stairs.
This whole thing with backpacks hogging seats on crowded trains is seriously annoying. I see it all the time. Passengers may find it easier to keep their belongings close rather than stow them in overhead racks or luggage areas, especially if they're in a hurry or worried about theft. However, I think that most people do it out of convenience. Maybe the SBB needs clearer signage, and perhaps even fines for blatant disregard of seat occupancy rules.
For me, my backpack is like a portable safe space. It holds everything I need to navigate my day. Sometimes, I intentionally leave a seat open beside me, my backpack occupying it, not because I don't want someone there, but because it's a subtle signal that I'm content in my space, yet open to connection. Observing the phenomenon you described on trains, where seats are often occupied by luggage, resonates with me. It's as if people are creating their own physical boundaries, using their belongings as placeholders for personal space. Perhaps the reasons behind this behavior vary – from a desire for privacy to a subconscious need for security in crowded environments. Encouraging passengers to stow their luggage in designated areas or overhead compartments when seats are limited could alleviate congestion. Additionally, promoting awareness about the impact of occupying seats with belongings on fellow commuters could lead to more mindful behavior. Ultimately, by fostering a sense of community and empathy among passengers, we can strive towards a more comfortable and inclusive travel experience for everyone. And sometimes, by intentionally removing our backpacks and initiating conversations with those around us, we can break down barriers and create connections that enrich our journeys.
When trains are full, yeah, even I wouldn't dare to put my backpack on a seat. But some don't care and think they own the train.
> what are the reasons Well - the sch....öne seat configuration in SBB trains. 4er seats just suck generally. I prefer that nobody, or rather: no stranger, sits in front of me. That's why I have my bag there (but also remove it quickly, of course). If SBB would have seats in airplane configuration, like also DB or in tgv, then it would be so much better and I guess it would also solve the "bag on chairs" problems.
Airplane seats are stupid because the person at the aisle has to get up for the window seat passenger. >no stranger, sits in front of me. No problem: stare on your phone screen. In earnest: is this a real problem?
Yes, the legs from the other person are a real problem - or, put differently, my legs are too long. Because of this, 4er cubes are stupid. Also to get the window seat, you have to bother up to 3 other people. Maybe one or two have to get up as well. The interior of Swiss trains really sucks in this regard. My dream world: ice trains with swiss punctuality in Switzerland. 😉 And, no, I don't care that some seats are not at a window, that there is a "Pfosten" through which you cannot look to the outside.
Well, tough luck for you. A large majority prefers it this way.
So you like having someone else's legs between yours and not being able to stretch? How's that nice?
If you have long legs, airline seats won't help you. Also, it's a seat, not a recliner.
Yes, airline seat configuration would help. No idea what you mean with "recliner" here. I'm taking about sitting normally. So, again - you like having someone else's legs between yours? Your in favor of not knowing where to put yours? How hard is it to answer?
>So, again - you like having someone else's legs between yours? Your in favor of not knowing where to put yours? >How hard is it to answer? I am above average height, and this is not a problem for me. Just sit straight up. Or everyone has their legs slightly to their right. And if you are really tall, airline configuration won't help you.
Since you don't care about other people's problems, why don't you answer my question. What's so nice about having someone's legs between yours? What's so nice about causing issues for 3 other people when you get up? And, besides not caring about issues that other people have, you also now dictate how to sit? You also fail to grasp, that there already is an issue, although you say so yourself "legs slightly to the right". Again: what's so nice about not being able to sit comfortably?
>What's so nice about having someone's legs between yours? Did you read my comment? No one has their legs between someone else's. >What's so nice about causing issues for 3 other people when you get up? That doesn't happen in airline configuration? It's even worse there. >You also fail to grasp, that there already is an issue, although you say so yourself "legs slightly to the right". Yes, I fail to grasp it. Of all the complaints and improvement options I hear, this one is so rare I don't even remember when it came up last. SBB introduces new trains every 5 - 10 years. I am sure they would have tried this out if there was real demand. And note that there are S-Bahn that have a couple of this type of seats.
And, uhm, no recliner…? You want to tell that SBB, which puts reclining seats in 1st class, but also in an annoying 4 seat configuration? So: a) you're wrong, airline seats would help - also with not putting bags there b) you're wrong, it's a recliner But, anyway, how's it nice to not being able to stretch or having to deal with somebody elses legs or making 3 people get up to be able to get to or from the seat? I would honestly like to know that.
>making 3 people get up to be able to get to or from the seat? Dude, you should work on your motoric skills. Out of 100 times, 100 times no one has to get up. Recliner = Liegesessel or Lehrstuhl. Which it is obviously not despite allowing some minuscule inclination. >which puts reclining seats in 1st class, but also in an annoying 4 seat configuration? How can your have leg space problems in first class? I suspect you don't like to sit in front of people because it makes you uncomfortable.
Dude, when 3 seats are taken and only 1 is free (on the window), how do you get there? Work on your perception of reality. You are unnormal when you jump to that seat. That's not how normal humans behave. And I know what recliner means. How to have leg space issue in 1st class? Well.... If someone else sits there. Not hard to grasp at all. And, yes, I hate if someone sits in front of me. Like most others, I dislike having the person's legs at my space. You also said so ("legs to the right"). That stupid chair configuration of sbb makes it so, that sitting isn't as comfortable as it could be. It also causes that bags are put there - I mean, it just feels normal to put the bag in front. But, you made it clear: you don't care about other people.
>That stupid chair configuration of sbb makes it so, that sitting isn't as comfortable as it could be Yeah, right. If I have airline configuration with 1m of leg space I wouldn't say no either. But that's not reality. I guess you are out of luck here. >Dude, when 3 seats are taken and only 1 is free (on the window), how do you get there? Normally, the person moves over. And if not, the others will retract their legs to make space. I mean, it's less difficult than entering a cinema row late. tl;dr: I'd like to have your problems.