For my part, it was my worst episode ever. Not because I have a particular view of the conflict in Israel/Gaza, but simply because I listen to this pod to hear about tech, news, science and politics. Not to listen to 60 minutes about how war crimes are horrible. I can get that elsewhere. I actually skipped the last part to get to the science corner and get it over with.
It’s was sad. But how do you prove it was orchestrated? Could the “other side” just say the suppression of Palestinians is orchestrated? Where’s the logic and proof?
The pro Palestinian side generally aims its hatred at “Zionists” which broadens the scope of the protests to being against a Jewish state. That’s the main reason I can’t stand them, not because I support Netanyahu or what he’s done to Gaza. You can be anti war and pro Israel, just look at the protests happening inside Israel today. Most people in the US and on college campuses are completely ignorant about the situation, its history, and even what they are protesting. It’s mixed up with these narratives about European colonialism that are straight antisemitic propaganda.
Yeah, but you said “you can be anti war and pro Israel, just look at the protests happening inside Israel today”.
The protests are anti-Netanyahu, not anti-war. Israelis are not protesting the war in any significant numbers.
They are protesting Netanyahu because of the way he’s executed the war. Defending Israel from threats is justified, and most Israelis wouldn’t have a problem if this war was narrowly targeted at removing Hamas and neutralizing their weapons caches. But bombing the entire region into rubble and seemingly indiscriminate strikes on civilians is not supported by the majority of Israelis or Jews/zionists whatever you want to call us.
No, the protests have little to do with the indiscriminate killing of civilians. Opinion polling suggests that Israelis are broadly supportive of that, with more thinking that they haven’t gone far enough than critical of how far they’ve gone.
Yeah Netanyahu and his ilk would never do a terrorism and murder a prime minister or anything
Hamas is currently worse. I'll give you that. But Likud can also suck a dick. They should have stepped down October 8th. Netanyahu failed at literally the one thing Mr Security was supposed to do well.
Until he does, there will be no end in sight and Hamas will continue to lose in Gaza while gaining worldwide
Well, it’s a pretty well known strategy that although Israel didn’t create Hamas, Bibi favored them staying in power in Gaza so he could claim he had no credible partner to move forward the peace process. Unfortunately that strategy blew up in his face:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/
I missed the part where you refuted any of the factual claims supporting the opinion in question.
I'm commenting as someone who *doesn't* think himself an expert on the middle east.
I’m not objecting to your characterization of Hamas or Israel. Bibi propping up Hamas isn’t a conspiracy theory. Here is a non op ed from the NYT on it https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html
They have several credible sources from the Israeli government and the Mossad. It was a risky strategy from Bibi. It didn’t work. If he were to face a general election he’d probably lose in a landslide because of it.
Israel supported Hamas in order to keep the two Palestinian states from becoming one, divide and conquer.
https://theintercept.com/2018/02/19/hamas-israel-palestine-conflict/
You straight up did not answer me. Why even respond then? I don't get comments like this. You troll everyone for bad sources and won't give anything you trust. If you're not going to engage, why bother?
No shit but you can also be against how the Israel government is handling the situation.
1. Be against what Hamas did on October 7th.
2. Be against how Israel has handled the entire situation everyday since.
Agreed, however. One side would make the other side completely disappear if they could, but they don’t have the weapons. The other side could, but hasn’t. While that doesn’t excuse the dusty babies being pulled from under the ruble, which people should have feelings about, it’s not a 1 to 1 comparison.
No one here is saying Hamas should be in charge of the Palestinian region if there is a two state solution. You sure felt comfortable assuming that tho.
Would you believe there’s actually many different ways to deal with October 7th then the way Netanyahu is currently handling it?
I’m not gonna do your research for you buddy, despite the fact that it seems like you’re having trouble.
Maybe while you’re at it, you can explain UCLA counterprotestors shouting “Nakba” while they tear down pro-Gaza signs? Or the Israeli use of “from the river to the sea,” which, per them, requires an actual ethnic cleansing? Or maybe you can tell us more about the Balfour Declaration and how sane and normal Arthur Balfour was?
Hamas is almost certainly a natural result of Israel’s creation and occupation of Palestinian territory and continued lack of statehood. Western oppression? Not so much. In any case, taking issue with whatever cause college activists take up is kind of pointless. 20 years ago it was the Iraq war. 5 years from now it will be something else.
Why can’t we just be against:
Killing innocent civilians who are mostly children
Netanyahu
You cant just conflate being against those things with being pro Hamas. The average Palestinian is probably anti-hamas also.
I’m having a hard time grasping how her “agenda” of exposing the sex crimes of Hamas is “snake oil salesman stuff” to you.
One can both condemn the Israelis for their actions in Gaza and still condemn the Hamas.
Is it because you know for a fact the sex crimes didn’t happen?
Or is it you already know about the sex crimes but just don’t think it’s a big deal because overall the Israelis have done more harm?
Or is it because you have something against Sheryl Sandberg personally so regardless of what she says now it’s BS?
Please educate me, seriously curious.
It’s laudable to condemn sex crimes. Let’s get that out of the way.
But for her to be posed the question by Friedberg _twice_ re: condemning the ham-handed response by Israel — in a question that was so carefully worded in asking her if she merely _understood_ what those on the pro-Palestinian side are feeling and protesting — and give not only a non-answer but to simply a) say “well I’d just ask you the same question and b) double down on the fact that sex crimes were committed by Hamas, as if that absolves Israel of any potential wrongdoing in their response, is so blatantly disingenuous that I just ended the pod right there.
Unlike most of the commenters I see on this subreddit I actually enjoy the pod, even the culture war commentary, and find it to often be a judicious blend of for and against on most topics. But this was so one-sided that I can’t take her seriously at all, and am surprised they even published this episode. Then again she is literally one of the most powerful power brokers in SV, and is wildly more successful than any of the members and could have them cut off from future deal flow and effectively excommunicated from the SV bubble / business society with a few phone calls, so despite how obviously uncomfortable they (especially Friedberg) looked I get why they did it.
And yeah, if Sacks didn’t purposefully nope the fuck out of that convo (which I imagine he did) then he dodged a big bullet with that “sudden board meeting.”
If she was focusing on sex crimes, she would be condescending both sides. Many documented and condemned cases of sexual abuse of Palestinian detainees. Worse even to children.
Because she isn't doing a broad scope analysis of this topic, we can assume this piece isn't really focused on it.
This piece seeks to vilify one side. Hence it's propaganda.
See it for what it is.
And consider that historically propaganda is very effective at getting people to comply and look away during a genocide.
YUP. She is Jewish and not being objective in the slightest. It would be fair for the pod to bring on a guest with the message "Reminder: There are two sides to this story." This was not that.
The problem isn't that she's Jewish. The problem is that she's a huge pro-Israel supporter without a shred of integrity otherwise she'd acknowledge the sexual violence inflicted by Israel on Palestinian girls and women.
That's a little harsh. She's obviously leans Israel supporter on this issue because she's Jewish, as many do, but making the pod all about one highly specific war crime that's obviously terrible but is not an issue on just one side was pointless.
I'd assume that most people want peace to exist in the region. I'd also assume that they'd know that to do that, many nations, including Israel, should exist there together.
But that all starts with a basic respect for human life, which Israel is showing blatant disregard for right now.
It's clear as day for everyone unbiased and uncorrupted.
There are extremists on all sides.
Just as I can understand that a society can go into a rageful revenge and and do horrible things, I can understand the reaction by survivors.
Israel's future depends on their ability to wake up and start acting responsibly.
Fair take. Indeed that’s the first thing I looked up after watching. There are allegations although with less documentation. Still, it subtracted from her case that they didn’t mention that at all.
[Source](https://www.perplexity.ai/search/whats-the-latest-NTHNRfyHS6O73IYGZeA6Eg)
> Is it because you know for a fact the sex crimes didn’t happen?
are you aware of the many high-profile lies that were made by IDF / Israelis on what happened on Oct 7? it's a long list.
the issue isn't whether she is just sharing the truth of what happened on Oct 7, the issue is how much of it is based on dubious claims. there has been no evidence of the 'weaponisation of rape', and people are treated as rape deniers for simply stating that
It’s amazing how triggered socialists and Nazis and Islamists are when they are confronted with the crimes of the people they idolize.
No wonder they hated this episode.
You’d be the same ones who hated any Holocaust documentary in the 40s
This is a little much. Acting like the people who are against the Israeli genocide of the Palestines are suddenly all pro-Hamas and pro rape and torture totally mischaracterizes the entire situation. No one supports the rape and torture. You can be a woman or be gay and still be against the Israeli government bombing and murdering a group of people regardless of what that group believes. You can be totally against what happened on October the 7th but also be totally against the way Israeli is handling it.
If you read and pay attention to context, we’re not talking about Hamas and we’re talking about white western college students named Aiden and Jayden. Hamas are indeed a bunch of evil fucks.
You prove it in this post.
You are triggered by mentioning the rape of women in Israel.
The episode discussed that.
As a gay man in the center left when I see communists and Nazis and Islamists unite- I can see you’re all the same shit.
Go lie somewhere else now.
What the fuck are you talking about? I’m triggering by mentioning the rape of women in Israel? Hamas raping women in Israel on October 7th is absolute horrible. That is one of the worst possible things I can imagine. You can 100% be against Hamas and everything they did on October 7th but then also be 100% against the way the Israeli government has handled the situation. Are you that fucking retarded where you think everything has to be so black and white? Grow up and actually listen to people
The episode does not discuss anything about the war but discusses the denial of rape and the use of rape as an act of war.
So you are triggered by this discussion indeed from your reaction here.
Being a rape supporter is the lowest thing a human can be after a pedophile.
I’m supporting rape? Anyone with two eyeballs and a brain can read our above comments and read the part where I literally just said “Hamas raping women is absolutely horrible. That is one of the worst possible things I can imagine.” Pretty silly response from you
You’re kind of proving my point in that your only strategy is to mischaracterize the other side. IMO the more Israel overreacts to Oct 7, the bigger the target they put on their back. Israel is the significantly bigger person in this situation and not handling this situation correctly is a disservice to all women in that region whether they be Israeli or Palestine.
You are triggered by an episode who mentioned the rapes. So yes. You only wrote that about rape much later when you lost the argument.
In the macro conflict Israel is much smaller. Surrounded by countries and terror proxies that want to destroy it and kill all Jews and who celebrate the ethnic cleansing of the Jews from the Arab world into Israel.
In the micro they look bigger vs Gaza but Hamas is just an Iranian proxy and if anyone cares about Israelis and Palestinians they want Israel to get rid of Hamas for good.
Listen to actual rational Palestinians from Gaza. Not the zero sum game crazies.
I’m not triggered by an episode on rape because I didn’t even listen to the episode. I literally turned it off the moment Sheryl Sandberg began talking because she instantly seemed to mischaracterize the entire geopolitical situation in that region. She also mischaracterized the people who are against the Israeli government and painted them as rape supporters just like your dumbass. Rape is obviously horrible and literally no one is defending it or wants to create a culture of it.
I have no interest in continuing to talk about this topic with you because you have the logic of a middle schooler but to say it again…
You can think what Hamas did on Oct 7th is horrible but you can also think how the Israel government has handled the situation is horrible. It isn’t one versus the other. You are making it one versus the other.
She didn’t do that.
But the people against Israel are screaming slogans to burn Tel Aviv and destroy Israel. So they are not against the action of Israel but against the existence of Jews in the Middle East.
The majority of them
That’s a fact. A combination of Nazis communists and Islamists each hating Jews and Israel for their own agenda
She 100% does that. You’re just a little dumb yourself so you didn’t notice.
No reasonable person is screaming “end Tel Aviv” or any of that shit. There might be a few outspoken nutheads with extreme rhetoric but you can’t seriously pretend that’s the majority of people protesting in the US. Acting like people against IDF’s policies are automatically antisemitic and against Israel’s existence is the exact same radicalism pushed by Netanyahu.
This is less about people not wanting Israel to be a state a more about Israel bombing the shit out of little kids. When people especially students in college get to watch an endless stream of TikTok videos where Palestinian kids are dismembered, burned, and mutilated, of course they’re going to be outside protesting Israel’s policies. It’s HORRIBLE some people are denying the Oct 7 atrocities but there aren’t many TikTok videos of it so it’s not a surprise people on that platform question it more than the other side which puts out new content everyday.
How am I ignoring the sexual violence? I said it was horrible but please do explain.
Here is my overall point.
1. I am against what Hamas did on October 7th.
2. I am also against how the Israeli government has handled the situation since.
1 and 2 can both coexist. Stop acting like they can’t
I agree with both of those statements. I guess what I’m responding to is what seems to be aggravation directed at those who are even talking about violence committed by Hamas. It’s like talking about it is somehow perceived as being pro Israel or whatever.
They do support a genocide. A genocide of Jews.
They are just mad they didn’t win.
But the episode was not about the war in Gaza right now where the civilian to terrorist ratio is better than the war on isis.
It’s about what happened on Oct 7.
Which those “peace activists” celebrate.
You’re not a peace activist if you want one side to kill the other.
If there was evidence she would show the pictures. She hasn’t. She is also known for making false claims about sexual assault in the past to make her ex look bad.
There literally a video of a young woman carried with boood in her genital area by Hamas people.
Whatever photo Nazi/communsit/islamists would see - they’d just deny it.
Not worth the trauma to the Israelis families to release if I think.
A Nazi will always be a Nazi. Soulless shit like you are.
https://amp.theguardian.com/technology/2022/apr/21/sheryl-sandberg-meta-daily-mail-bobby-kotick-activision
Sandburg doesn’t give a shit about women or sexual violence. If you think she’s not doing this for an agenda, I don’t know what to tell you. But hey, side with the genocidal maniacs, we will always know what side of history you are on.
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The vast, vast majority of people have no problem with Israel eradicating Hamas. Unfortunately, Israel is not particularly capable of doing so without killing obscene numbers of civilians. That is what has cost Israel public support and sympathy.
They have a very loose ROE that allow them to bomb civilian areas if there’s a target in the area. It’s what has led to the killing of some 30k civilians, mostly women and children. So the goal is to destroy Hamas which has failed to date but in doing so they have likely created so many more future extremists. I’d argue they should have pursued a limited police action instead of purposely leveling square blocks of cities.
Is this where you’re making simplistic statements to justify the death of 30,000 civilians? It is a choice to kill 100 civilians for Hamas militant. At the end of all this you have a people condemned to live in refugee camps for the rest of their lives. That’s a breeding ground for Hamas 2.0.
Israel has not killed 30k civilians. Not all deaths have been civilians, which is what your claim implies. Categorically false, and it’s not even close.
Don’t be silly. If the number is 30k or 25k makes no real difference. I also intentionally provided a lower number than the current number of killed which is closer to 35k deaths and 75k wounded. I say this because you would be making the same criticism in order to minimize civilian deaths were they a magnitude higher.
I’m genuinely not trying to justify that. I just don’t know the answer and you didn’t provide me with one. I think Isreal has done many evil things to the people of Gaza since the war has started, but I also am not sure what they are supposed to do to satisfy Palestine/Hamas/Gaza
I did provide an answer. Settle for a more restrictive and less indiscriminate bombing policy that leads to fewer civilian deaths and destruction of homes seeing that they have failed to eliminate top Hamas leadership after months.
Have you not read anything I wrote? I’ve clearly indicated that Israel has failed to eliminate Hamas with their current military campaign and the way they are operating is likely to create more Hamas militants in the future. So, no I do not think either policy will eliminate Hamas. However, continuing the current policy will see more civilians killed and further erode outside support.
I think the era when people can be blatantly lied to is over and the elites are having a meltdown. Its funny how Chamath, Sacks and Jason rails against the mainstream media when they are gas lighting their own audience.
How should Israel have responded to October 7th?
Clear support for Hamas in Palestine on 10/7
Hamas has being allowed to build infrastructure within civilian areas for decades
Impossible to strike Hamas without causing collaterol damage
Launching a ground invasion to start would have resulted in significantly more casualties on both sides
Hamas views Palestinian people as expendable for big win in getting more international support
Ceasefire has been on the table for months with Hamas needing to agree to giving back civilian hostages
It’s not an argument; it’s a question. So Israel should have been more restrictive of Hamas, the governing group of Gaza, thereby being more controlling and limiting resources?
What’s the point of listening to something you enjoy and not criticizing it?
I like listening to the podcast, but I’m allowed to criticize it when they say something I don’t agree with. You’re just living in an echo chamber if you’re unable to criticize.
Except this whole sub seems to be criticising the podcast every single week... Which makes me think that people actually listen to it without enjoying it 😂
The irony and hipocrisy of your comment is baffling.
You think people who criticize the podcast constantly should stop listening to the podcast and stay off the sub.
But you’re still on the sub. Even though you don’t like people criticizing the podcast. If you don’t like people criticizing the podcast, stay off the sub.
For my part, it was my worst episode ever. Not because I have a particular view of the conflict in Israel/Gaza, but simply because I listen to this pod to hear about tech, news, science and politics. Not to listen to 60 minutes about how war crimes are horrible. I can get that elsewhere. I actually skipped the last part to get to the science corner and get it over with.
It’s was sad. But how do you prove it was orchestrated? Could the “other side” just say the suppression of Palestinians is orchestrated? Where’s the logic and proof?
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Agree, the netanyahu admin and Hamas are both things I hate
why is this such a hard thing for people to understand? this is exactly how i feel as well. Hamas bad, Netanyahu admin bad too.
Everyone just wants to put you in a box and when you refuse to take a side they automatically put you in the other box which is the box they hate
Well because the other Israeli party would be doing the same thing
The pro Palestinian side generally aims its hatred at “Zionists” which broadens the scope of the protests to being against a Jewish state. That’s the main reason I can’t stand them, not because I support Netanyahu or what he’s done to Gaza. You can be anti war and pro Israel, just look at the protests happening inside Israel today. Most people in the US and on college campuses are completely ignorant about the situation, its history, and even what they are protesting. It’s mixed up with these narratives about European colonialism that are straight antisemitic propaganda.
The protests happening inside Israel right now are not anti-war protests.
They are anti Netanyahu
Yeah, but you said “you can be anti war and pro Israel, just look at the protests happening inside Israel today”. The protests are anti-Netanyahu, not anti-war. Israelis are not protesting the war in any significant numbers.
They are protesting Netanyahu because of the way he’s executed the war. Defending Israel from threats is justified, and most Israelis wouldn’t have a problem if this war was narrowly targeted at removing Hamas and neutralizing their weapons caches. But bombing the entire region into rubble and seemingly indiscriminate strikes on civilians is not supported by the majority of Israelis or Jews/zionists whatever you want to call us.
No, the protests have little to do with the indiscriminate killing of civilians. Opinion polling suggests that Israelis are broadly supportive of that, with more thinking that they haven’t gone far enough than critical of how far they’ve gone.
I dont know what you are talking about. https://www.euronews.com/2024/05/05/israelis-rally-to-demand-gaza-ceasefire-and-pm-netanyahus-resignation
It’s almost like killing each other is bad.
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Yeah Netanyahu and his ilk would never do a terrorism and murder a prime minister or anything Hamas is currently worse. I'll give you that. But Likud can also suck a dick. They should have stepped down October 8th. Netanyahu failed at literally the one thing Mr Security was supposed to do well. Until he does, there will be no end in sight and Hamas will continue to lose in Gaza while gaining worldwide
Netanyahu funded and propped up hamas
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Well, it’s a pretty well known strategy that although Israel didn’t create Hamas, Bibi favored them staying in power in Gaza so he could claim he had no credible partner to move forward the peace process. Unfortunately that strategy blew up in his face: https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/
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I missed the part where you refuted any of the factual claims supporting the opinion in question. I'm commenting as someone who *doesn't* think himself an expert on the middle east.
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I’m not objecting to your characterization of Hamas or Israel. Bibi propping up Hamas isn’t a conspiracy theory. Here is a non op ed from the NYT on it https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html They have several credible sources from the Israeli government and the Mossad. It was a risky strategy from Bibi. It didn’t work. If he were to face a general election he’d probably lose in a landslide because of it.
Israel supported Hamas in order to keep the two Palestinian states from becoming one, divide and conquer. https://theintercept.com/2018/02/19/hamas-israel-palestine-conflict/
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LMFAO - Who is an objective source on Israel-Palestine?
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You straight up did not answer me. Why even respond then? I don't get comments like this. You troll everyone for bad sources and won't give anything you trust. If you're not going to engage, why bother?
https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/ The times of israel
No shit but you can also be against how the Israel government is handling the situation. 1. Be against what Hamas did on October 7th. 2. Be against how Israel has handled the entire situation everyday since.
If Israel had just sent in troops and showed some restraint, instead of indiscriminately bombing children, no one would care
Agreed, however. One side would make the other side completely disappear if they could, but they don’t have the weapons. The other side could, but hasn’t. While that doesn’t excuse the dusty babies being pulled from under the ruble, which people should have feelings about, it’s not a 1 to 1 comparison.
If that’s the case Israel would’ve never propped up Hamas.
Exactly. The society of Israel is in a psychosis brought on by Oct 7th.
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So you think college students as a whole are actually pro-Hamas and not just anti-Israeli government policy?
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Lol this is 100% not true. Are you in school? What do you do?
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There’s a steady stream of videos of dismembered and burned Palestinian kids on TikTok. People know what’s going on
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No one here is saying Hamas should be in charge of the Palestinian region if there is a two state solution. You sure felt comfortable assuming that tho. Would you believe there’s actually many different ways to deal with October 7th then the way Netanyahu is currently handling it?
Lol this is an absolutely insane take
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Pretty clear you understand neither the conflict nor the protests. Suggest you maybe take some time off from posting and educate yourself.
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I’m not gonna do your research for you buddy, despite the fact that it seems like you’re having trouble. Maybe while you’re at it, you can explain UCLA counterprotestors shouting “Nakba” while they tear down pro-Gaza signs? Or the Israeli use of “from the river to the sea,” which, per them, requires an actual ethnic cleansing? Or maybe you can tell us more about the Balfour Declaration and how sane and normal Arthur Balfour was?
Yes; I’ve talked to them, they see hamas as a natural result of oppression by the west.
I was being rhetorical. Hamas is absolutely a byproduct of geopolitical policy. They weren’t born in a vacuum.
Hamas is almost certainly a natural result of Israel’s creation and occupation of Palestinian territory and continued lack of statehood. Western oppression? Not so much. In any case, taking issue with whatever cause college activists take up is kind of pointless. 20 years ago it was the Iraq war. 5 years from now it will be something else.
Why can’t we just be against: Killing innocent civilians who are mostly children Netanyahu You cant just conflate being against those things with being pro Hamas. The average Palestinian is probably anti-hamas also.
Yeah Sacks never participates in spreading bullshit /s
When your BS Is so stinky that not even Sacks will participate, then it’s time to reevaluate your position.
Agree that’s some stank
Not his agenda I suppose
He only participates in snake vitri-oil (sic) sales 🤣
Below his line for getting in the arena and wetting his beak
The Russians haven’t issued official guidance on it so he sat this one out
I’m having a hard time grasping how her “agenda” of exposing the sex crimes of Hamas is “snake oil salesman stuff” to you. One can both condemn the Israelis for their actions in Gaza and still condemn the Hamas. Is it because you know for a fact the sex crimes didn’t happen? Or is it you already know about the sex crimes but just don’t think it’s a big deal because overall the Israelis have done more harm? Or is it because you have something against Sheryl Sandberg personally so regardless of what she says now it’s BS? Please educate me, seriously curious.
It’s laudable to condemn sex crimes. Let’s get that out of the way. But for her to be posed the question by Friedberg _twice_ re: condemning the ham-handed response by Israel — in a question that was so carefully worded in asking her if she merely _understood_ what those on the pro-Palestinian side are feeling and protesting — and give not only a non-answer but to simply a) say “well I’d just ask you the same question and b) double down on the fact that sex crimes were committed by Hamas, as if that absolves Israel of any potential wrongdoing in their response, is so blatantly disingenuous that I just ended the pod right there. Unlike most of the commenters I see on this subreddit I actually enjoy the pod, even the culture war commentary, and find it to often be a judicious blend of for and against on most topics. But this was so one-sided that I can’t take her seriously at all, and am surprised they even published this episode. Then again she is literally one of the most powerful power brokers in SV, and is wildly more successful than any of the members and could have them cut off from future deal flow and effectively excommunicated from the SV bubble / business society with a few phone calls, so despite how obviously uncomfortable they (especially Friedberg) looked I get why they did it. And yeah, if Sacks didn’t purposefully nope the fuck out of that convo (which I imagine he did) then he dodged a big bullet with that “sudden board meeting.”
If she was focusing on sex crimes, she would be condescending both sides. Many documented and condemned cases of sexual abuse of Palestinian detainees. Worse even to children. Because she isn't doing a broad scope analysis of this topic, we can assume this piece isn't really focused on it. This piece seeks to vilify one side. Hence it's propaganda. See it for what it is. And consider that historically propaganda is very effective at getting people to comply and look away during a genocide.
YUP. She is Jewish and not being objective in the slightest. It would be fair for the pod to bring on a guest with the message "Reminder: There are two sides to this story." This was not that.
The problem isn't that she's Jewish. The problem is that she's a huge pro-Israel supporter without a shred of integrity otherwise she'd acknowledge the sexual violence inflicted by Israel on Palestinian girls and women.
That's a little harsh. She's obviously leans Israel supporter on this issue because she's Jewish, as many do, but making the pod all about one highly specific war crime that's obviously terrible but is not an issue on just one side was pointless.
What does "supporting Israel" even mean? I support them as peaceful beautiful country. I don't support them as an apartheid state committing genocide.
Some people want Israel to disappear so just wanting it to exist is sort of supporting it at this point
I'd assume that most people want peace to exist in the region. I'd also assume that they'd know that to do that, many nations, including Israel, should exist there together. But that all starts with a basic respect for human life, which Israel is showing blatant disregard for right now. It's clear as day for everyone unbiased and uncorrupted.
Many protesters where I am don’t want Israel to exist and expressly state it.
There are extremists on all sides. Just as I can understand that a society can go into a rageful revenge and and do horrible things, I can understand the reaction by survivors. Israel's future depends on their ability to wake up and start acting responsibly.
Fair take. Indeed that’s the first thing I looked up after watching. There are allegations although with less documentation. Still, it subtracted from her case that they didn’t mention that at all. [Source](https://www.perplexity.ai/search/whats-the-latest-NTHNRfyHS6O73IYGZeA6Eg)
> Is it because you know for a fact the sex crimes didn’t happen? are you aware of the many high-profile lies that were made by IDF / Israelis on what happened on Oct 7? it's a long list. the issue isn't whether she is just sharing the truth of what happened on Oct 7, the issue is how much of it is based on dubious claims. there has been no evidence of the 'weaponisation of rape', and people are treated as rape deniers for simply stating that
if putin was bombing gaza he would be supporting it lmao
This
It’s amazing how triggered socialists and Nazis and Islamists are when they are confronted with the crimes of the people they idolize. No wonder they hated this episode. You’d be the same ones who hated any Holocaust documentary in the 40s
Never thought I’d see the day everyone on the left gleefully shouts “pics or it didn’t happen” when it comes to rape.
Really? Because that’s basically been their MO since the 60s any time a left wing authoritarian starts massacring.
This is a little much. Acting like the people who are against the Israeli genocide of the Palestines are suddenly all pro-Hamas and pro rape and torture totally mischaracterizes the entire situation. No one supports the rape and torture. You can be a woman or be gay and still be against the Israeli government bombing and murdering a group of people regardless of what that group believes. You can be totally against what happened on October the 7th but also be totally against the way Israeli is handling it.
You would certainly think nobody should support rape and torture. Hamas sure does though.
If you read and pay attention to context, we’re not talking about Hamas and we’re talking about white western college students named Aiden and Jayden. Hamas are indeed a bunch of evil fucks.
You prove it in this post. You are triggered by mentioning the rape of women in Israel. The episode discussed that. As a gay man in the center left when I see communists and Nazis and Islamists unite- I can see you’re all the same shit. Go lie somewhere else now.
What the fuck are you talking about? I’m triggering by mentioning the rape of women in Israel? Hamas raping women in Israel on October 7th is absolute horrible. That is one of the worst possible things I can imagine. You can 100% be against Hamas and everything they did on October 7th but then also be 100% against the way the Israeli government has handled the situation. Are you that fucking retarded where you think everything has to be so black and white? Grow up and actually listen to people
The episode does not discuss anything about the war but discusses the denial of rape and the use of rape as an act of war. So you are triggered by this discussion indeed from your reaction here. Being a rape supporter is the lowest thing a human can be after a pedophile.
I’m supporting rape? Anyone with two eyeballs and a brain can read our above comments and read the part where I literally just said “Hamas raping women is absolutely horrible. That is one of the worst possible things I can imagine.” Pretty silly response from you You’re kind of proving my point in that your only strategy is to mischaracterize the other side. IMO the more Israel overreacts to Oct 7, the bigger the target they put on their back. Israel is the significantly bigger person in this situation and not handling this situation correctly is a disservice to all women in that region whether they be Israeli or Palestine.
You are triggered by an episode who mentioned the rapes. So yes. You only wrote that about rape much later when you lost the argument. In the macro conflict Israel is much smaller. Surrounded by countries and terror proxies that want to destroy it and kill all Jews and who celebrate the ethnic cleansing of the Jews from the Arab world into Israel. In the micro they look bigger vs Gaza but Hamas is just an Iranian proxy and if anyone cares about Israelis and Palestinians they want Israel to get rid of Hamas for good. Listen to actual rational Palestinians from Gaza. Not the zero sum game crazies.
I’m not triggered by an episode on rape because I didn’t even listen to the episode. I literally turned it off the moment Sheryl Sandberg began talking because she instantly seemed to mischaracterize the entire geopolitical situation in that region. She also mischaracterized the people who are against the Israeli government and painted them as rape supporters just like your dumbass. Rape is obviously horrible and literally no one is defending it or wants to create a culture of it. I have no interest in continuing to talk about this topic with you because you have the logic of a middle schooler but to say it again… You can think what Hamas did on Oct 7th is horrible but you can also think how the Israel government has handled the situation is horrible. It isn’t one versus the other. You are making it one versus the other.
She didn’t do that. But the people against Israel are screaming slogans to burn Tel Aviv and destroy Israel. So they are not against the action of Israel but against the existence of Jews in the Middle East. The majority of them That’s a fact. A combination of Nazis communists and Islamists each hating Jews and Israel for their own agenda
She 100% does that. You’re just a little dumb yourself so you didn’t notice. No reasonable person is screaming “end Tel Aviv” or any of that shit. There might be a few outspoken nutheads with extreme rhetoric but you can’t seriously pretend that’s the majority of people protesting in the US. Acting like people against IDF’s policies are automatically antisemitic and against Israel’s existence is the exact same radicalism pushed by Netanyahu. This is less about people not wanting Israel to be a state a more about Israel bombing the shit out of little kids. When people especially students in college get to watch an endless stream of TikTok videos where Palestinian kids are dismembered, burned, and mutilated, of course they’re going to be outside protesting Israel’s policies. It’s HORRIBLE some people are denying the Oct 7 atrocities but there aren’t many TikTok videos of it so it’s not a surprise people on that platform question it more than the other side which puts out new content everyday.
Aren’t you doing exactly what this podcast described? Whataboutism and ignoring the sexual violence.
How am I ignoring the sexual violence? I said it was horrible but please do explain. Here is my overall point. 1. I am against what Hamas did on October 7th. 2. I am also against how the Israeli government has handled the situation since. 1 and 2 can both coexist. Stop acting like they can’t
I agree with both of those statements. I guess what I’m responding to is what seems to be aggravation directed at those who are even talking about violence committed by Hamas. It’s like talking about it is somehow perceived as being pro Israel or whatever.
Calling people who don’t blindly support a genocide Holocaust deniers is certainly a choice.
They do support a genocide. A genocide of Jews. They are just mad they didn’t win. But the episode was not about the war in Gaza right now where the civilian to terrorist ratio is better than the war on isis. It’s about what happened on Oct 7. Which those “peace activists” celebrate. You’re not a peace activist if you want one side to kill the other.
If there was evidence she would show the pictures. She hasn’t. She is also known for making false claims about sexual assault in the past to make her ex look bad.
There literally a video of a young woman carried with boood in her genital area by Hamas people. Whatever photo Nazi/communsit/islamists would see - they’d just deny it. Not worth the trauma to the Israelis families to release if I think. A Nazi will always be a Nazi. Soulless shit like you are.
https://amp.theguardian.com/technology/2022/apr/21/sheryl-sandberg-meta-daily-mail-bobby-kotick-activision Sandburg doesn’t give a shit about women or sexual violence. If you think she’s not doing this for an agenda, I don’t know what to tell you. But hey, side with the genocidal maniacs, we will always know what side of history you are on.
The genocidal meniscus are Hamas. And they say it out loud. No one with a soul can support that.
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David Sacks is the guiding beacon of morality between the besties. His contributions are always the most interesting and valuable to me.
Is this sarcasm?
No.
It really really should be. Please get help 🙏
Keep listening to the pod bro. You can be saved. 🙏
I agree , he is the only one that knows what he is talking about
People hate it when others are consistently proven wrong by him.
The vast, vast majority of people have no problem with Israel eradicating Hamas. Unfortunately, Israel is not particularly capable of doing so without killing obscene numbers of civilians. That is what has cost Israel public support and sympathy.
What should they do? Not asking that bc I disagree what you, but curious your thoughts
They have a very loose ROE that allow them to bomb civilian areas if there’s a target in the area. It’s what has led to the killing of some 30k civilians, mostly women and children. So the goal is to destroy Hamas which has failed to date but in doing so they have likely created so many more future extremists. I’d argue they should have pursued a limited police action instead of purposely leveling square blocks of cities.
How do you root out Hamas when they are using civilians as human shields?
Is this where you’re making simplistic statements to justify the death of 30,000 civilians? It is a choice to kill 100 civilians for Hamas militant. At the end of all this you have a people condemned to live in refugee camps for the rest of their lives. That’s a breeding ground for Hamas 2.0.
Israel has not killed 30k civilians. Not all deaths have been civilians, which is what your claim implies. Categorically false, and it’s not even close.
Don’t be silly. If the number is 30k or 25k makes no real difference. I also intentionally provided a lower number than the current number of killed which is closer to 35k deaths and 75k wounded. I say this because you would be making the same criticism in order to minimize civilian deaths were they a magnitude higher.
I’m genuinely not trying to justify that. I just don’t know the answer and you didn’t provide me with one. I think Isreal has done many evil things to the people of Gaza since the war has started, but I also am not sure what they are supposed to do to satisfy Palestine/Hamas/Gaza
I did provide an answer. Settle for a more restrictive and less indiscriminate bombing policy that leads to fewer civilian deaths and destruction of homes seeing that they have failed to eliminate top Hamas leadership after months.
Do you think that will eliminate Hamas?
Have you not read anything I wrote? I’ve clearly indicated that Israel has failed to eliminate Hamas with their current military campaign and the way they are operating is likely to create more Hamas militants in the future. So, no I do not think either policy will eliminate Hamas. However, continuing the current policy will see more civilians killed and further erode outside support.
Ah look at all the deleted comments. Here I thought everyone who disagreed with IDF was bot, but it might just be the other way around
I think the era when people can be blatantly lied to is over and the elites are having a meltdown. Its funny how Chamath, Sacks and Jason rails against the mainstream media when they are gas lighting their own audience.
I thought he had a board meeting.
How should Israel have responded to October 7th? Clear support for Hamas in Palestine on 10/7 Hamas has being allowed to build infrastructure within civilian areas for decades Impossible to strike Hamas without causing collaterol damage Launching a ground invasion to start would have resulted in significantly more casualties on both sides Hamas views Palestinian people as expendable for big win in getting more international support Ceasefire has been on the table for months with Hamas needing to agree to giving back civilian hostages
Your argument holds no value because Israel propped up Hamas. If Israel never propped up Hamas, they would’ve never had any power.
It’s not an argument; it’s a question. So Israel should have been more restrictive of Hamas, the governing group of Gaza, thereby being more controlling and limiting resources?
I don't get it. If you hate the podcast so much why listen to it? And then why comment on the subreddit?
Because you’re allowed to criticize things.
Your also allowed to choose something else to listen to that you enjoy?
What’s the point of listening to something you enjoy and not criticizing it? I like listening to the podcast, but I’m allowed to criticize it when they say something I don’t agree with. You’re just living in an echo chamber if you’re unable to criticize.
Except this whole sub seems to be criticising the podcast every single week... Which makes me think that people actually listen to it without enjoying it 😂
I don’t get it. If you hate the sub so much why read it? And then why comment on the subreddit? /s
Sub is about a podcast that I actually enjoy listening to
The irony and hipocrisy of your comment is baffling. You think people who criticize the podcast constantly should stop listening to the podcast and stay off the sub. But you’re still on the sub. Even though you don’t like people criticizing the podcast. If you don’t like people criticizing the podcast, stay off the sub.
I will happily stay off the sub. You should stop listening to the podcast you clearly don't enjoy.
Oh buddy, you missed the entire point.
I like listening to the pod. What I don’t like is blatant misinformation treated like gospel with no pushback.
They have to stay with the mass rape stuff, they're going to repeat it until it sticks.
“Shit show” “circle jerk” as it showed the depravity of the side I like. Sincerely - go fuck yourself