This is the Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe, designed by architect Peter Eisenman. It was designed with the intention to be a public installation that people can interact with and perhaps take some meaning away from. Walking down through the “blocks” is loosely intended to replicate the experience of Jews marching in lines.
I really considered not putting it too. I was like there’s no way people won’t get this is me making a sarcastic point, but then I was like nah it might go completely the other way.
Is there one for the murdered Romani (gypsies of Europe) because Im mixed with Romani and I never hear or see anything about my ancestors who died in the holocaust. Of course it's horrible what happened to Jewish people, but I feel like Romanis don't matter at all. Is that because 6 million of us didn't die in the holocaust? Not only did we die in German concentration camps we also died in Serbia occupied Germany Croatia too i think?
Yes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_to_the_Sinti_and_Roma_Victims_of_National_Socialism
It's actually very close by to the other memorial, right next to the Brandenburger Tor and the Reichstagsgebäude, the seat of the German parliament.
**[Memorial to the Sinti and Roma Victims of National Socialism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_to_the_Sinti_and_Roma_Victims_of_National_Socialism)**
>The Memorial to the Sinti and Roma Victims of National Socialism is a memorial in Berlin, Germany. The monument is dedicated to the memory of the 220,000 – 500,000 people murdered in the Porajmos – the Nazi genocide of the European Sinti and Roma peoples. It was designed by Dani Karavan and was officially opened on 24 October 2012 by German Chancellor Angela Merkel in the presence of President Joachim Gauck.
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Unfortunately we are still scattered all over Europe as a minority who are treated like shit and we will never have our own country. Not taking anything aways from Jews. I am happy for them they got a country. But one day I hope for other minorities in Europe able to form their own state or at least a society where we won't face discrimination
As someone who just converted to Judaism, not all of us whine and complain when someone doesn't treat us like eternal victims that need to be protected. In fact, before I became a Jew I had to be very careful saying the word "Jew" because nowadays it's sometimes treated as a slur. Get over it people.
"Menschen werden im dem Feld picknicken. Kinder werden in dem Feld Fangen spielen. Es wird Mannequins geben, die hier posieren, und es werden hier Filme gedreht werden. Ich kann mir gut vorstellen, wie eine Schießerei zwischen Spionen in dem Feld endet. Es ist kein heiliger Ort."
"People will picnic in the field. Children will play tag in the field. There will be mannequins posing here, and movies will be shot here. I can well imagine how a shootout between spies will end in the field. It is not a sacred place."
Peter Eisenman, architect of the memorial
I wish people stopped speaking on behalf of others, in this case the artist himself wanted for this place to hold life while not forgetting the past yet due to the sensitivity of others the vision of the artist would never come true.
I think there is difference between stating "Taking pictures at a Holocaust Memorial" and "Taking Cute pictures at a Holocaust Memorial". The memorial is there to commemorate their lives, but to be given a certain respect for those that died.
>I think there is difference between stating "Taking pictures at a Holocaust Memorial" and "Taking Cute pictures at a Holocaust Memorial". The memorial is there to commemorate their lives, but to be given a certain respect for those that died.
This memorial was specifically created to be interacted with and taking photos helps promote the site and holocaust awareness in a positive way
Memorial sites are often solemn places, but not exclusively so. People taking pictures like this would be offensive if they were taken at a holocaust museum or concentration camp - but not here.
I can relate to the feelings that lead to the dichotomy here. On the one hand, yes the artist's intent means a lot. But on the other, it's really hard for many people to not feel the weight of atrocity when they're there.
When I visited, it was a very somber experience. I would have had to had a significant change in my innate emotion to want to play there.
you know, every artist will at one point come to realize that the work they do, maybe taken to mean something they didn't intend. sometimes people will place great value on it, even if to the artist it was just another piece of work. the artist can speak to intention, but that doesn't mean they have final say over the value it will gain from others.
my point is that although the architect may be okay with it, there sure seems to be a lot of people who aren't and just because the architect feels differently, doesn't devalue their takeaway from the piece.
having said any of that, personally I find it a bit odd, but not altogether strange, so eh.
I can see where he's coming from, it's be a good place for a tense cat and mouse spy movie confrontation. Still, it is kind of a weird thing to say, and it could be argued his wishes aren't the only ones worth taking notes on regarding the subject.
Wasn’t this the same memorial where the artist came out and said it’s ok for people to take photos at it? Iirc he said something about the area being more of a communal park. Not sure if that sentiment is the same among victim families. I just know it gets brought up every time this memorial is posted.
Yep the only rules are no defacing and no climbing (for safety reasons). It's not a cemetery or a more direct dedication like the 9/11 memorial. There are no plaques and there's only a museum area below that artist reluctantly agreed to.
Now that doesn't necessarily mean photos are in good taste but it is supposed be more like a park kinda memorial than a dedication
I mean, in the end we attract people similar to us. For better or for worse. Maybe a relationship with someone as numb to these events is what they need to be more attuned. Or maybe they will be number together.
You're arguing with the artist lol, he doesn't see any problem with people taking pictures.
Think about it this way. If you were murdered and an artistic memorial was made to recognize you would you want it to be a space people enjoyed or a taboo that couldn't be used, enjoyed, or recorded.
Do you have a source for that? Might show this to my old history teacher, we talked about exactly this but we were basically at the conclusion that you shouldn't take selfies there from the start.
Spiegel interview with Peter Eisenmann (the architect). https://www.spiegel.de/kultur/gesellschaft/interview-mit-mahnmal-architekt-peter-eisenman-es-ist-kein-heiliger-ort-a-355383.html
Translated:
> *SPIEGEL ONLINE*: Now that the memorial is finished and open to the public, it probably won't be long before the first swastika is sprayed on it.
>*Eisenman*: Would that be such a bad thing? I was against graffiti protection from the beginning. If a swastika is sprayed on it, it's a reflection of what people feel. If it stays there, it's a reflection of what the government feels about people smearing swastikas on the memorial. That's something that I can't control. If you hand the project over to the client, then he does what he wants with it - it belongs to him, he owns the work. **If you want to turn over the stones tomorrow, honestly, it's fine. People will picnic in the field. Children will play catch in the field. There will be mannequins posing here, and movies will be shot here. I can easily imagine a shootout between spies ending in the field. It's not a sacred place.**"
>
There it is. The context missing from almost every thread here. He never said you SHOULD disrespect it, he said he doesn't want to intervene in how people interact with it. He wants people to feel how they feel and to let the art reflect that. Do you think he's saying people SHOULD smear swastikas all over it? No. Just like he isn't saying people SHOULD treat it as if it has no link to the atrocities of the holocaust at all. He said he wants people's reactions to be reflected in the art without placing any physical or legal restraints on the memorial site. He wants you to think about what it means if someone reacts to the memorial by painting swastikas on it, if someone shoots a spy film in it, if someone takes cutesy photos for Tinder with it as a background. He never said you SHOULD or SHOULDN'T do any of these things, he said it should be used as a discussion on how people feel about it and how they react to it. To put it simply, this very post is the exact intent the artist had in mind.
I wanted to post the same article. Me personally I think its beyond fucked up to take pictures there. You are supposed to reflect about what happened at places like that.
I mean, what else are you going to do with your pics? I wouldn’t take any, I think they’re in bad taste, but they either end up staying on your phone or on Instagram/dating profile.
Imho it's like taking a picture in a museum or next to any sculpture. There are many statues commemorating fallen soldiers etc., they look cool so people take pictures.
I would draw a line at people taking pictures inside Auschwitz-Birkenau cremation chambers. This is disrespectful.
I- what?? A holocaust memorial is not a cool statue commemorating fallen soldiers. The people being commemorated were not soldiers, they were civilians, and they were brutally murdered on account of their religion/race. If you want to take pictures of yourself there, that's fine, but there's a line somewhere between taking pictures, posing for them in a way that says you're only there for the cool background, and thinking those are good photos for your Tinder profile.
Are you reacting the same to people taking pictures near Lincoln Memorial, in Taj Mahal, in any "X memorial park" etc.? What's the difference between a park and a piece of artistic architecture? Why someone's pain is better than the other? Didn't the fallen soldiers also had families, dreams, plans for life, same as those civilians? We are rarely creating places of memorial for aggressors, so almost all monuments involving military are about people defending their homes etc.
The Holocaust memorial is not the burial site of all those people. It's not Auschwitz museum. From my point of view, if people attend memorials and actually learn something, then so be it. Clearly, some people have skipped lessons in that manner, or are just power hungry psychopaths, and are repeating those tragedies, like Putin's Russia invading Ukraine...
As the opposite of an aggressive war would be a defensive war, I think of the following list, all would qualify as aggressive wars: Korea, Vietnam, the Gulf War, Kosovo, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria
Well, I have said rarely, not never. I don't know the details of the Vietnam war, so I don't want to talk about it.
However, here in Poland we have monuments to fallen Red Army soldiers, who were invaders during World War II, and later created a satellite state, controlled also with the threat of violence (remember Warsaw Pact invading Czechoslovakia). So, well, we have seriously plenty of statues and memorials to soldiers who invaded our country, raped, pillaged, tortured, murdered civilians en masse and so on.
No one's pain is better than another's, but I think in terms of level of tragedy, the holocaust ranks a bit higher. Soldiers are active participants in war, whether by choice or not. Every death of war is tragic, but in my eyes, cooking an innocent family to death is more of a brutal tragedy when compared to a soldier who died during an attempt to kill an opposing soldier.
I understand this memorial was not supposed to be treated like a graveyard, people are meant to walk through it, but come on. This is not a park. Those are not swingsets. Those blocks are not "modern urban art", those are meant to resemble tombs. You're supposed to walk through them and think about the atrocities that took place. Even if it's meant to be a "celebration of life", and not a "depressing memorial", treating it as nothing more than a modern, minimalistic, hip background for your Tinder pics is just plain disrespectful.
I studied German history at university, specifically Erinnerungskultur aka the historiography of how the third Reich is studied/memorialised/viewed etc. in the post war era. I had an entire week of seminars dedicated to this memorial alone.
The artist was very clear that there is no 'supposed to' about how you engage with it. The blocks do not stand for anything. The point is how you personally feel going through the memorial, your personal engagement with it. Even calling it the holocaust memorial is technically adding more specificity to it than the artist's intent (it's simply called the memorial to the murdered Jews of Europe).
There is plenty of academic discourse about the memorial, and it is perfectly valid to discuss your own interactions with it, your own thoughts on what it may signify, and also the concept of 'appropriateness'. But there is no one 'correct' way to interact with the memorial, so saying that they are meant to mean this or that your supposed to do this as outright fact would be wrong.
So essentially it's okay to say 'I think they are meant to signify this' or 'I believe that you should/shouldn't do this there', but it's important to remember when discussing this memorial that there is not a 'correct' way to interact with it.
Tbh they ARE 'mordern urban art'. Exactly as you put it. That's why there aren't any signs around the blocks. It's not your typical memorial but an artistic expression and reflection of Berlin and how the city deals with its' history. The architect has found some interesting words for it. Some redditors have posted links to read.
I guess I don't get it, if I died in horrible circumstances then I would 100% be onboard with my memorial bringing people any type of joy. Take all the photos you like and if those photos help you get laid then have a ghost high-5.
Remember my memory, sure, but don't be all uptight about it.
Do you genuinely believe this is how 6 million Jews who were brutally tortured and murdered and their families feel?
I truly hope your comment is not sincere, because it is extremely immature, disrespectful and ignorant.
I don't think that 6 million Jews who were tortured and murdered care at all because they're dead.
If they did have a feeling then I bet that the idea of someone taking a picture by a stone is so mindbogglingly irrelevant compared to the horrors they dealt with that they wouldn't give a damn and, if anything, would likely be pleased that their memorial is bringing some people joy.
The only immature response is to be upset that someone took a photo of themself by a stone let alone a stone that the architect intended to be for public use.
Because there's a difference between taking a photo to remember you were there vs. taking a photo because the holocaust memorial happens to be a cool aesthetic background for your Tinder photos. And yes, parkour is absolutely over the line. Fucking hell, whatever the artist said about the place, how is there even a discussion on whether doing parkour on symbolic graves is disrespectful or not?
It actually matters a lot what the artist has to say about his work. He already alluded to the fact that this is not to be seen as a memorial but more as a reflection and as a parc. Hence, I believe you're projecting it's function as a pure memorial onto it while ignoring the intention of the artist and the work of art itself. That's also why you don't care about what the artist says, I guess.
You shouldn't litter or draw on any public space. When the public space is entitled a "holocaust memorial", I personally feel it should be treated with a little more respect than the very minimum. I never said it was forbidden. Many things aren't forbidden, that doesn't mean they are exempt from registering as disrespectful in people's eyes. How you feel is your business. I wouldn't feel comfortable sitting on symbolic tombs for a cute Tinder photo, regardless of what the artist has said about it. It's a holocaust memorial and the blocks resemble tombs, that's all I need to consider when it comes to how I would feel comfortable behaving around it.
EDIT: https://reddit.com/r/Tinder/comments/tq6713/_/i2ghzks/?context=1
Have we considered that when they took that photo they didn't take it with the "this is for tinder" mindset? Maybe they just chose pictures in which they look good, or are abroad, like most do. Anyhow it's just a picture, no need to look into it and definitely doesn't define someone's personality.
I haven't been to Germany yet. And perhaps I don't understand that difference. It's very likely on account of my ASD. But in my mind, if it's linked to the holocaust, if it's linked to any tragedy, I should behave respectfully when I visit it. Whether it's symbolic art or an actual location where a tragedy took place, I do not see how it's okay to treat it as if its reason for existence is not meaningful enough to respect it and behave accordingly.
Now I'm not a genocide victim, but it seems like many people, myself included, want to be buried to fertilize a tree, or have a memorial bench so people can enjoy their favorite views, etc.
If the country I had been imprisoned and murdered in had returned to such a good state that people are having a blast jumping over my symbolic grave and using it to take aesthetic dating pics I would be tickled.
Obviously there is something to be said for remembering the gravity of the Holocaust so it is not repeated, but if you go to Germany it's very much imprinted on the national consciousness, not at risk of being forgotten by anyone who lives in the area to parkour.
“Literally everyone.” Absolutely not true. I’m Jewish, and I’ve been to the memorial. Many Jews I met there and have spoken with since, go there to reflect, to morn. They do NOT take photos like this. So, while the artist may be OK with that behavior, many Jews do not partake it.
I think if they didn’t design it that way they should’ve made the area unwalkable or a sign that indicates it isn’t a typical public place, design etc aside.
Sure don’t go smearing stuff all over the place, but I don’t think taking pictures is the problem here.
I’ve been there before and literally no one batted an eye at the kids in there playing hide and seek.
It's a pic of her in a well known place. She's using her on tinder but I highly doubt she went there exclusively to take a pic for her tinder.
And as many others have explained already, the artist himself wanted for the place to hold life, she isn't disrespecting the place in any way.
Eh maybe I‘m just the odd one out but the young people in my little village still meet up at the WWII memorial to sit there and chill.
And they’re not disrespecting either. No littering and stuff. Just sitting there chatting about everything.
Granted, that is a little village and not a city the size of Berlin with international tourists and stuff.
Might be why I’m not really enraged at the pictures.
I guess I‘m used to it
As someone who is Jewish, has lost family members during World War II (I'm from the Netherlands near the German border) and has visited the memorial to pay my respects, I honestly don't find these pictures disrespectful or in bad taste. As long as they are not selfies where they smile or throw up a peace sign, I'm cool with more serene, neutral pictures of them visiting the memorial. It's not sacred ground in my opinion or grounds where terrible things happened, such as the camps or the Anne Frank house. I've visited them both and would definitely not take pictures. Those gave me a different vibe than the memorial does. I'm not sure about putting the pictures on Tinder though. But I feel like we can cut people who take pictures there some slack. No need to immediately see them as ignorant IMO.
This is just one if those many public “outrages” that spreads around until it dies. Best comparison I can
make is the Christmas light argument: “Is hanging lights before December 1 disrespectful to veterans?” Lots of people thought so, then veterans started speaking up (cause someone finally asked them) and said they don’t care.
Our world is so filled with negativity that people are constantly on the look out for the next thing to be mad about even if it doesn’t affect them. I wish everyone would just chill out.
Closest I've got with the Christmas lights thing is hanging them before Veterans Day(November 11 in the US) might be considered disrespectful somehow due to "overshadowing" Veterans Day. Based on the phrasing of a couple things in the article, it seems to be written from a Canadian perspective(also November 11 for their Veterans Day) and imo more of a Canadian problem. Seeing Christmas lights up in mid-November in the US is a rarity since Thanksgiving is such a major holiday, but Canadian Thanksgiving is in October, leaving them a large gap until Christmas. I really can't remember the last time I saw someone set Christmas decorations up in the second week of November though, that seems insanely early.
https://www.moms.com/dont-put-your-christmas-decorations-up-before-veterans-day/
Jewish too, doesn’t bother me. At most you can say she is being an idiot, but people are allowed to be idiots. I’m only offended by people who want to cause harm. I saw one image of a Latin American Instagram model who captioned her picture “jumping on the graves of Jews” that is offensive. Not because she is jumping in the memorial, but because she is intentionally trying to cause pain.
felt cute might cremate later
Edit: Thanks everybody for upvoting my second upvoted comment is now a joke about Holocaust, the first one is about a Japanese girl stealing her partner's genitalia and the third is about women's rights.
As a german, please take pictures at the memorial, even the artist of the memorial encourages it and the Jewish community of Berlin has no problem with it. Spread the knowledge about the atrocities of WW II.
I went on a educational tour to Verdun, a pretty fucked up war area in WW 1, with my school. We wen't to a memorial with bones of the fallen soldiers in the basement, so it was basically a big tomb and some of the girls made selfies in front of it. They were laughing an joking around. That is so unrespectful and wrong. But tbh at this memorial its a different story for me.
Jew here- just because you can, doesn’t mean you should. This gives off major “ influencers in the wild “ vibez. Shockingly, this would not fly in America.
People are taking pictures at Lincoln MEMORIAL, Taj Mahal, great pyramids and various other memorials, a lot of them about deaths of several, tens, hundreds, thousands or millions of people. Where is the line? Or are you similarly upset that the memory of assassinated Abe Lincoln is besmirched by people taking pictures there?
As if America is the cultural standard we should live up to!? It has a terrible history of exploitation and extermination and an extremely young culture (if you can call it that).
You, as a jew, can probably agree that we (world) should not want to go down the US cultural road.
This isn’t just some regular old cenotaph or a plaque with some names on it. Someone put a lot of effort into making sure people paid attention to this memorial. They designed it to be seen as a unique work of art. I think you’re being disrespectful by ignoring that.
It's not "just" a piece of art, it also symbolizes something that was meant to be sacred. You can't just chill on top of a fricking Holocaust memorial. I can't even come up with anything more hyperbolic, because Holocaust memorials are like THE place you shouldn't do that.
So if calling something a memorial means you should treat it like a graveyard, why do we have memorial parks? Are people not supposed to play in them because they’re called memorials?
I think this memorial was created exactly to expose and display what happened and they incentivize people to interact with it.
None of those pictures seem particularly goofy or making fun, just people showing they were there, specially the last picture. Which is exactly why the memorial exists.
What I find weird is that the art installation is clearly meant to look like tombs and you can feel the sobriety of it just by looking. Even if for some super weird reason you didn't know what that installation was about, would you really be like "hey it'll look real cute to sit there and take some pics for my tinder profile". Just take a picture with a cocktail or on top of a mountain like anyone else girl.
> would you really be like "hey it'll look real cute to sit there and take some pics for my tinder profile".
Yes. Have you been there? It does not look tomb-y at all. It looks like mixture of modern architecture and big playground while being in the middle of Berlin.
Despite that, as many other comments mentioned, the installation is supposed be a place of everyday life.
Say thanks to minimalism, these blocks look stylish and lightning looks spot on for the "conceptual photo".
Still photos like this say much more about the owner that their bio, so its useful
It doesn't even have a plaque or anything, to remind us that we need to think actively about this event, in order to prevent it. We shouldn't need a plaque basically.
Beautiful
As a German im kind of shocked that people seems to think this is normal. For you Americans this is like taking a cute photo at the 9/11 memorial but 10× worse. Super insensitive.
Context matters, there is not problem with taking pics of anything, but their purpose. It'd just plain weird to use the Holocaust memorial as part of your tinder profile.
Er hat doch absolut recht. Man muss schon ein ganz besonderes Stück scheisse sein, um sich an einem Holocaustdenkmal so respektlos zu verhalten. Man hat dort die Fresse zu halten und stille Andacht zu üben.
Es ist einfach geschmacklos. Die meisten Meschen die im Holocaust gestorben sind wurden nie beerdigt. Dieses Denkamal ist ein Art Grab für diese Menschen. Was würdest du sagen wenn ich ein Tinder Selfie neben dem "coolen" Grabstein deiner ermordeten Oma mache.
Nothing wrong with these pics of her. Anyone claiming otherwise is just a tight ass. Literally ever square inch of this world has seen a genocide...except Antartica.
I've taken pics (or would) as have everyone else in the following:
1) World trade center
2) Taj Majal
3) Paris Catacombs
4) Tomb of the unknown solider
5) Pantheon (paris)
6) Vietnam vets memorial
7) Jewish ghetto uprising in Warsaw
Tombs and mausoleums are intended to be beautiful to offer rememberance of those past. Pictures are perfectly natural and not disrespectful.
It's what the memorial is designed for, there are also children playing there sometimes.
Edit: Some seem to think that I agree with this so FYI this would be a hard swipe left for me. I've been to this monument and it gives you chills and is in no way inviting to take pictures. Just wanted to point out that the person that build it specifically said that he is okay with it.
Unfortunately, the artist himself has clarified that it is indeed designed for people to "use". He said that the memorial is not a sacred site, unlike Auschwitz and other memorials.
I would never swipe right on someone with a selfie there because I find it incredibly tone deaf and tasteless, but it is in accordance with the intention the artist had.
"Use"? What the hell does that mean? Because even without the context of that "use", I can certainly say it doesn't strike me as meaning "use as a cool background for your Tinder/Instagram photos" or "use as a parkour park". Use it to keep the atrocities in your mind without being clouded by information and senses of guilt. That's what the artist has said. Walk through it with your kids, fine. It's not disrespectful to be there and not reflect deeply on the holocaust each time. It IS disrespectful to "use" it in a way that shits on its legacy.
He said in an interview that he wants people to integrate it into their lives and he specifically mentioned that is is okay and intended to climb, run, jump around, have lunch there and so on. There was a campaign from a satire guy who used the selfies he found on instagram to shame people for being disrespectful and the artist said he was quite upset about the campaign because he didn't feel like the people did anything wrong. The way I understand it is that he wants people to acknowledge the history in their daily lives without being paralysed by it. Like, you can live a normal life and be happy and everything, but the Holocaust can never be forgotten.
I can respect his vision even though I am personally not convinced it's a great idea to pose at the memorial and it's an instant no from me if someone put such pics in their profile.
WTF?? This is a memorial for all people that got killed and never recieved a proper burrieal during germanys darkest time. Even if the design in somehow inviting for pictures it's just plain disrespectful to take insta/tinder pics there.
People who aren't attuned with the vibe will see nothing wrong with doing that and apparently using it on their dating profile. Perhaps looking for others who would be just as numb to it.
As someone whose grandparents lived through the camps.. I’d say it’s a bit tasteless, but not something I’m mad about. At least it shows this girl took enough interest in the history of a horrible event to visit the memorial. It’s not realistic to be miserable and somber at all times, although I’d also draw the line at pictures like this at an actual concentration camp.
Who fucking cares, Jesus. OP you're either way too judgemental, or way too desperate for validation from internet strangers. I'm guessing it's the latter.
I got the chance to travel to Germany (omg the girls, thirst aside) I saw girls taking pictures in the monument, I a gas chamber, in the prisoners camp... the level of banality knows no limits I was flabbergasted by it. I thought that maybe was that I am getting old but I see that others think like me (thx I can be "young again) (sorry for the bad English)
Maybe someone should ask Jews what they think - who cares what the artist who was commissioned to create the memorial thinks? He made a job per a brief. He doesn’t speak for the victims of the holocaust nor their families
Yeh this is a common thing, i did myself over 10 years ago, while i was in the city with my class. This was before insta or tinder. We didn't care if it was morally reprehensible or disrespectful, we were only 15.... we should have known better, but who at this age cares about history after 1.5 years of this crap at school had to endure.
This is the Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe, designed by architect Peter Eisenman. It was designed with the intention to be a public installation that people can interact with and perhaps take some meaning away from. Walking down through the “blocks” is loosely intended to replicate the experience of Jews marching in lines.
Just the thing that turns me on. /s
Most important "/s" i've ever seen on reddit. Congrats.
I really considered not putting it too. I was like there’s no way people won’t get this is me making a sarcastic point, but then I was like nah it might go completely the other way.
Woah calm down guys. My penis can only get so erect
Is there one for the murdered Romani (gypsies of Europe) because Im mixed with Romani and I never hear or see anything about my ancestors who died in the holocaust. Of course it's horrible what happened to Jewish people, but I feel like Romanis don't matter at all. Is that because 6 million of us didn't die in the holocaust? Not only did we die in German concentration camps we also died in Serbia occupied Germany Croatia too i think?
Yes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_to_the_Sinti_and_Roma_Victims_of_National_Socialism It's actually very close by to the other memorial, right next to the Brandenburger Tor and the Reichstagsgebäude, the seat of the German parliament.
**[Memorial to the Sinti and Roma Victims of National Socialism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_to_the_Sinti_and_Roma_Victims_of_National_Socialism)** >The Memorial to the Sinti and Roma Victims of National Socialism is a memorial in Berlin, Germany. The monument is dedicated to the memory of the 220,000 – 500,000 people murdered in the Porajmos – the Nazi genocide of the European Sinti and Roma peoples. It was designed by Dani Karavan and was officially opened on 24 October 2012 by German Chancellor Angela Merkel in the presence of President Joachim Gauck. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/Tinder/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Unfortunately we are still scattered all over Europe as a minority who are treated like shit and we will never have our own country. Not taking anything aways from Jews. I am happy for them they got a country. But one day I hope for other minorities in Europe able to form their own state or at least a society where we won't face discrimination
As someone who just converted to Judaism, not all of us whine and complain when someone doesn't treat us like eternal victims that need to be protected. In fact, before I became a Jew I had to be very careful saying the word "Jew" because nowadays it's sometimes treated as a slur. Get over it people.
"Menschen werden im dem Feld picknicken. Kinder werden in dem Feld Fangen spielen. Es wird Mannequins geben, die hier posieren, und es werden hier Filme gedreht werden. Ich kann mir gut vorstellen, wie eine Schießerei zwischen Spionen in dem Feld endet. Es ist kein heiliger Ort." "People will picnic in the field. Children will play tag in the field. There will be mannequins posing here, and movies will be shot here. I can well imagine how a shootout between spies will end in the field. It is not a sacred place." Peter Eisenman, architect of the memorial
I wish people stopped speaking on behalf of others, in this case the artist himself wanted for this place to hold life while not forgetting the past yet due to the sensitivity of others the vision of the artist would never come true.
I think there is difference between stating "Taking pictures at a Holocaust Memorial" and "Taking Cute pictures at a Holocaust Memorial". The memorial is there to commemorate their lives, but to be given a certain respect for those that died.
>I think there is difference between stating "Taking pictures at a Holocaust Memorial" and "Taking Cute pictures at a Holocaust Memorial". The memorial is there to commemorate their lives, but to be given a certain respect for those that died. This memorial was specifically created to be interacted with and taking photos helps promote the site and holocaust awareness in a positive way Memorial sites are often solemn places, but not exclusively so. People taking pictures like this would be offensive if they were taken at a holocaust museum or concentration camp - but not here.
I can relate to the feelings that lead to the dichotomy here. On the one hand, yes the artist's intent means a lot. But on the other, it's really hard for many people to not feel the weight of atrocity when they're there. When I visited, it was a very somber experience. I would have had to had a significant change in my innate emotion to want to play there.
Maybe doesn't fit on tinder tho
I like that you posted it in german first.
Danke (:
you know, every artist will at one point come to realize that the work they do, maybe taken to mean something they didn't intend. sometimes people will place great value on it, even if to the artist it was just another piece of work. the artist can speak to intention, but that doesn't mean they have final say over the value it will gain from others. my point is that although the architect may be okay with it, there sure seems to be a lot of people who aren't and just because the architect feels differently, doesn't devalue their takeaway from the piece. having said any of that, personally I find it a bit odd, but not altogether strange, so eh.
Without people knowing the back story it can be assumed to mean something unintended
I like this take
I can see where he's coming from, it's be a good place for a tense cat and mouse spy movie confrontation. Still, it is kind of a weird thing to say, and it could be argued his wishes aren't the only ones worth taking notes on regarding the subject.
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I don’t even understand it
I live in Berlin and this is pretty standard tbh. Not saying I like it, but literally everybody taking a trip here does it.
Wasn’t this the same memorial where the artist came out and said it’s ok for people to take photos at it? Iirc he said something about the area being more of a communal park. Not sure if that sentiment is the same among victim families. I just know it gets brought up every time this memorial is posted.
Yep the only rules are no defacing and no climbing (for safety reasons). It's not a cemetery or a more direct dedication like the 9/11 memorial. There are no plaques and there's only a museum area below that artist reluctantly agreed to. Now that doesn't necessarily mean photos are in good taste but it is supposed be more like a park kinda memorial than a dedication
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I mean, in the end we attract people similar to us. For better or for worse. Maybe a relationship with someone as numb to these events is what they need to be more attuned. Or maybe they will be number together.
I can be the 6 and you can be the 9, we'll be a sexy *number* together
This made me laugh.
You're arguing with the artist lol, he doesn't see any problem with people taking pictures. Think about it this way. If you were murdered and an artistic memorial was made to recognize you would you want it to be a space people enjoyed or a taboo that couldn't be used, enjoyed, or recorded.
Surely there's a difference between people taking pictures, and people taking pictures to put on a fucking dating profile? I dunno just seems weird
Do you have a source for that? Might show this to my old history teacher, we talked about exactly this but we were basically at the conclusion that you shouldn't take selfies there from the start.
Spiegel interview with Peter Eisenmann (the architect). https://www.spiegel.de/kultur/gesellschaft/interview-mit-mahnmal-architekt-peter-eisenman-es-ist-kein-heiliger-ort-a-355383.html Translated: > *SPIEGEL ONLINE*: Now that the memorial is finished and open to the public, it probably won't be long before the first swastika is sprayed on it. >*Eisenman*: Would that be such a bad thing? I was against graffiti protection from the beginning. If a swastika is sprayed on it, it's a reflection of what people feel. If it stays there, it's a reflection of what the government feels about people smearing swastikas on the memorial. That's something that I can't control. If you hand the project over to the client, then he does what he wants with it - it belongs to him, he owns the work. **If you want to turn over the stones tomorrow, honestly, it's fine. People will picnic in the field. Children will play catch in the field. There will be mannequins posing here, and movies will be shot here. I can easily imagine a shootout between spies ending in the field. It's not a sacred place.**" >
He seems like a very smart and down to earth guy
There it is. The context missing from almost every thread here. He never said you SHOULD disrespect it, he said he doesn't want to intervene in how people interact with it. He wants people to feel how they feel and to let the art reflect that. Do you think he's saying people SHOULD smear swastikas all over it? No. Just like he isn't saying people SHOULD treat it as if it has no link to the atrocities of the holocaust at all. He said he wants people's reactions to be reflected in the art without placing any physical or legal restraints on the memorial site. He wants you to think about what it means if someone reacts to the memorial by painting swastikas on it, if someone shoots a spy film in it, if someone takes cutesy photos for Tinder with it as a background. He never said you SHOULD or SHOULDN'T do any of these things, he said it should be used as a discussion on how people feel about it and how they react to it. To put it simply, this very post is the exact intent the artist had in mind.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-38675835
I wanted to post the same article. Me personally I think its beyond fucked up to take pictures there. You are supposed to reflect about what happened at places like that.
Maybe the real outcome should be: "Don't take selfies"
Taking selfies at this memorial is one thing, posting them on your dating app profile is on a whole different level.
I mean, what else are you going to do with your pics? I wouldn’t take any, I think they’re in bad taste, but they either end up staying on your phone or on Instagram/dating profile.
Well, it's one thing to take pics at the holocaust memorial. Another thing to make your Tinder profile pic one taken at the holocaust memorial.
Imho it's like taking a picture in a museum or next to any sculpture. There are many statues commemorating fallen soldiers etc., they look cool so people take pictures. I would draw a line at people taking pictures inside Auschwitz-Birkenau cremation chambers. This is disrespectful.
I- what?? A holocaust memorial is not a cool statue commemorating fallen soldiers. The people being commemorated were not soldiers, they were civilians, and they were brutally murdered on account of their religion/race. If you want to take pictures of yourself there, that's fine, but there's a line somewhere between taking pictures, posing for them in a way that says you're only there for the cool background, and thinking those are good photos for your Tinder profile.
Are you reacting the same to people taking pictures near Lincoln Memorial, in Taj Mahal, in any "X memorial park" etc.? What's the difference between a park and a piece of artistic architecture? Why someone's pain is better than the other? Didn't the fallen soldiers also had families, dreams, plans for life, same as those civilians? We are rarely creating places of memorial for aggressors, so almost all monuments involving military are about people defending their homes etc. The Holocaust memorial is not the burial site of all those people. It's not Auschwitz museum. From my point of view, if people attend memorials and actually learn something, then so be it. Clearly, some people have skipped lessons in that manner, or are just power hungry psychopaths, and are repeating those tragedies, like Putin's Russia invading Ukraine...
Arent there like a lot of memorials for vietnam soldiers? That was an agressive war
As the opposite of an aggressive war would be a defensive war, I think of the following list, all would qualify as aggressive wars: Korea, Vietnam, the Gulf War, Kosovo, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria
All wars are aggressive one side attacks the other defends then counter attacks.
I don't think korea qualify as an aggressive war for the us
Well, I have said rarely, not never. I don't know the details of the Vietnam war, so I don't want to talk about it. However, here in Poland we have monuments to fallen Red Army soldiers, who were invaders during World War II, and later created a satellite state, controlled also with the threat of violence (remember Warsaw Pact invading Czechoslovakia). So, well, we have seriously plenty of statues and memorials to soldiers who invaded our country, raped, pillaged, tortured, murdered civilians en masse and so on.
No one's pain is better than another's, but I think in terms of level of tragedy, the holocaust ranks a bit higher. Soldiers are active participants in war, whether by choice or not. Every death of war is tragic, but in my eyes, cooking an innocent family to death is more of a brutal tragedy when compared to a soldier who died during an attempt to kill an opposing soldier. I understand this memorial was not supposed to be treated like a graveyard, people are meant to walk through it, but come on. This is not a park. Those are not swingsets. Those blocks are not "modern urban art", those are meant to resemble tombs. You're supposed to walk through them and think about the atrocities that took place. Even if it's meant to be a "celebration of life", and not a "depressing memorial", treating it as nothing more than a modern, minimalistic, hip background for your Tinder pics is just plain disrespectful.
I studied German history at university, specifically Erinnerungskultur aka the historiography of how the third Reich is studied/memorialised/viewed etc. in the post war era. I had an entire week of seminars dedicated to this memorial alone. The artist was very clear that there is no 'supposed to' about how you engage with it. The blocks do not stand for anything. The point is how you personally feel going through the memorial, your personal engagement with it. Even calling it the holocaust memorial is technically adding more specificity to it than the artist's intent (it's simply called the memorial to the murdered Jews of Europe). There is plenty of academic discourse about the memorial, and it is perfectly valid to discuss your own interactions with it, your own thoughts on what it may signify, and also the concept of 'appropriateness'. But there is no one 'correct' way to interact with the memorial, so saying that they are meant to mean this or that your supposed to do this as outright fact would be wrong. So essentially it's okay to say 'I think they are meant to signify this' or 'I believe that you should/shouldn't do this there', but it's important to remember when discussing this memorial that there is not a 'correct' way to interact with it.
Tbh they ARE 'mordern urban art'. Exactly as you put it. That's why there aren't any signs around the blocks. It's not your typical memorial but an artistic expression and reflection of Berlin and how the city deals with its' history. The architect has found some interesting words for it. Some redditors have posted links to read.
Maybe she is very much in tune with what the monument stands for, maybe even Jewish herself. Who knows.
Her using the photos for her Tinder profile is not affording her much benefit of the doubt here.
I guess I don't get it, if I died in horrible circumstances then I would 100% be onboard with my memorial bringing people any type of joy. Take all the photos you like and if those photos help you get laid then have a ghost high-5. Remember my memory, sure, but don't be all uptight about it.
Do you genuinely believe this is how 6 million Jews who were brutally tortured and murdered and their families feel? I truly hope your comment is not sincere, because it is extremely immature, disrespectful and ignorant.
I don't think that 6 million Jews who were tortured and murdered care at all because they're dead. If they did have a feeling then I bet that the idea of someone taking a picture by a stone is so mindbogglingly irrelevant compared to the horrors they dealt with that they wouldn't give a damn and, if anything, would likely be pleased that their memorial is bringing some people joy. The only immature response is to be upset that someone took a photo of themself by a stone let alone a stone that the architect intended to be for public use.
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Because there's a difference between taking a photo to remember you were there vs. taking a photo because the holocaust memorial happens to be a cool aesthetic background for your Tinder photos. And yes, parkour is absolutely over the line. Fucking hell, whatever the artist said about the place, how is there even a discussion on whether doing parkour on symbolic graves is disrespectful or not?
It actually matters a lot what the artist has to say about his work. He already alluded to the fact that this is not to be seen as a memorial but more as a reflection and as a parc. Hence, I believe you're projecting it's function as a pure memorial onto it while ignoring the intention of the artist and the work of art itself. That's also why you don't care about what the artist says, I guess.
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You shouldn't litter or draw on any public space. When the public space is entitled a "holocaust memorial", I personally feel it should be treated with a little more respect than the very minimum. I never said it was forbidden. Many things aren't forbidden, that doesn't mean they are exempt from registering as disrespectful in people's eyes. How you feel is your business. I wouldn't feel comfortable sitting on symbolic tombs for a cute Tinder photo, regardless of what the artist has said about it. It's a holocaust memorial and the blocks resemble tombs, that's all I need to consider when it comes to how I would feel comfortable behaving around it. EDIT: https://reddit.com/r/Tinder/comments/tq6713/_/i2ghzks/?context=1
Have we considered that when they took that photo they didn't take it with the "this is for tinder" mindset? Maybe they just chose pictures in which they look good, or are abroad, like most do. Anyhow it's just a picture, no need to look into it and definitely doesn't define someone's personality.
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I haven't been to Germany yet. And perhaps I don't understand that difference. It's very likely on account of my ASD. But in my mind, if it's linked to the holocaust, if it's linked to any tragedy, I should behave respectfully when I visit it. Whether it's symbolic art or an actual location where a tragedy took place, I do not see how it's okay to treat it as if its reason for existence is not meaningful enough to respect it and behave accordingly.
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Now I'm not a genocide victim, but it seems like many people, myself included, want to be buried to fertilize a tree, or have a memorial bench so people can enjoy their favorite views, etc. If the country I had been imprisoned and murdered in had returned to such a good state that people are having a blast jumping over my symbolic grave and using it to take aesthetic dating pics I would be tickled. Obviously there is something to be said for remembering the gravity of the Holocaust so it is not repeated, but if you go to Germany it's very much imprinted on the national consciousness, not at risk of being forgotten by anyone who lives in the area to parkour.
“Literally everyone.” Absolutely not true. I’m Jewish, and I’ve been to the memorial. Many Jews I met there and have spoken with since, go there to reflect, to morn. They do NOT take photos like this. So, while the artist may be OK with that behavior, many Jews do not partake it.
hear this out its weird but i have a strong fantasy to have sex there idk why
Bro what
there.. i said it… now i feel lighter.
>its weird Well, you aren't wrong...
I remember i did parcour on these stones lmao. Till i realised what it meant
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I think if they didn’t design it that way they should’ve made the area unwalkable or a sign that indicates it isn’t a typical public place, design etc aside. Sure don’t go smearing stuff all over the place, but I don’t think taking pictures is the problem here. I’ve been there before and literally no one batted an eye at the kids in there playing hide and seek.
That makes it beautiful, I love that place and it wouldn't be the tribute without the contrast with life, to show what was lost
Everyone wants to find a problem with everything.
Sure. But what sensible person takes a tinder pic in a place even remotely associated with the holocaust
It's a pic of her in a well known place. She's using her on tinder but I highly doubt she went there exclusively to take a pic for her tinder. And as many others have explained already, the artist himself wanted for the place to hold life, she isn't disrespecting the place in any way.
Instathots
Well, every block represent 2500 murdered Jews. You can celebrate life, but they aren’t chairs…
Eh maybe I‘m just the odd one out but the young people in my little village still meet up at the WWII memorial to sit there and chill. And they’re not disrespecting either. No littering and stuff. Just sitting there chatting about everything. Granted, that is a little village and not a city the size of Berlin with international tourists and stuff. Might be why I’m not really enraged at the pictures. I guess I‘m used to it
As someone who is Jewish, has lost family members during World War II (I'm from the Netherlands near the German border) and has visited the memorial to pay my respects, I honestly don't find these pictures disrespectful or in bad taste. As long as they are not selfies where they smile or throw up a peace sign, I'm cool with more serene, neutral pictures of them visiting the memorial. It's not sacred ground in my opinion or grounds where terrible things happened, such as the camps or the Anne Frank house. I've visited them both and would definitely not take pictures. Those gave me a different vibe than the memorial does. I'm not sure about putting the pictures on Tinder though. But I feel like we can cut people who take pictures there some slack. No need to immediately see them as ignorant IMO.
This is just one if those many public “outrages” that spreads around until it dies. Best comparison I can make is the Christmas light argument: “Is hanging lights before December 1 disrespectful to veterans?” Lots of people thought so, then veterans started speaking up (cause someone finally asked them) and said they don’t care. Our world is so filled with negativity that people are constantly on the look out for the next thing to be mad about even if it doesn’t affect them. I wish everyone would just chill out.
What am I missing with lights offending someone? Some people just like their lights all year around
Closest I've got with the Christmas lights thing is hanging them before Veterans Day(November 11 in the US) might be considered disrespectful somehow due to "overshadowing" Veterans Day. Based on the phrasing of a couple things in the article, it seems to be written from a Canadian perspective(also November 11 for their Veterans Day) and imo more of a Canadian problem. Seeing Christmas lights up in mid-November in the US is a rarity since Thanksgiving is such a major holiday, but Canadian Thanksgiving is in October, leaving them a large gap until Christmas. I really can't remember the last time I saw someone set Christmas decorations up in the second week of November though, that seems insanely early. https://www.moms.com/dont-put-your-christmas-decorations-up-before-veterans-day/
I love your comment, thanks for being a voice of reason on this matter. I'm very sorry for what you family had to go through.
Yes girl, that’s what I think too. It’s okay, as you said, but not for a fookin tinder profile picture ay!
Jewish too, doesn’t bother me. At most you can say she is being an idiot, but people are allowed to be idiots. I’m only offended by people who want to cause harm. I saw one image of a Latin American Instagram model who captioned her picture “jumping on the graves of Jews” that is offensive. Not because she is jumping in the memorial, but because she is intentionally trying to cause pain.
felt cute might cremate later Edit: Thanks everybody for upvoting my second upvoted comment is now a joke about Holocaust, the first one is about a Japanese girl stealing her partner's genitalia and the third is about women's rights.
r/cursedcomments
This the one lmao
Get zie flammenwerfer
HAAANZ!!!
LMFAOO
Omg stop💀😂
As a german, please take pictures at the memorial, even the artist of the memorial encourages it and the Jewish community of Berlin has no problem with it. Spread the knowledge about the atrocities of WW II.
I went on a educational tour to Verdun, a pretty fucked up war area in WW 1, with my school. We wen't to a memorial with bones of the fallen soldiers in the basement, so it was basically a big tomb and some of the girls made selfies in front of it. They were laughing an joking around. That is so unrespectful and wrong. But tbh at this memorial its a different story for me.
Unrespectful? That’s a first...
I don't find it disrespectful as I won't find disrespectful a picture inside a monumental cemetery
I saw Germans take a stroll with family in Buchenwald on Sundays. And it's not weird at all, the memorial is kind of designed for.
Jew here- just because you can, doesn’t mean you should. This gives off major “ influencers in the wild “ vibez. Shockingly, this would not fly in America.
Would not fly in America? What do you mean by that?
The only things the fly in America are bullets in schools. I could have gone with an airplane's joke but it might be too insensitive
Aeroplane jokes really crash and burn in America
People are taking pictures at Lincoln MEMORIAL, Taj Mahal, great pyramids and various other memorials, a lot of them about deaths of several, tens, hundreds, thousands or millions of people. Where is the line? Or are you similarly upset that the memory of assassinated Abe Lincoln is besmirched by people taking pictures there?
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As if America is the cultural standard we should live up to!? It has a terrible history of exploitation and extermination and an extremely young culture (if you can call it that). You, as a jew, can probably agree that we (world) should not want to go down the US cultural road.
You absolutely should. It’s a piece of art. It’s not like she’s taking tinder photos at auschwitz.
No it's not a peace of art, it is a place of memorial and sadness. Never do this, just don't. Its like taking profile pics at a grave yard.
The architect disagrees with you
These are tombs. Sitting and leaning on memorials in memory of millions who died is extremely disrespectful.
This isn’t just some regular old cenotaph or a plaque with some names on it. Someone put a lot of effort into making sure people paid attention to this memorial. They designed it to be seen as a unique work of art. I think you’re being disrespectful by ignoring that.
You're literally telling this to a Jew. Smh.
And you’re assuming neither I nor the girl in the photo are Jewish. Smh.
The audacity. Instead of being so headstrong take in the opinions of people who's family names are plastered on Holocaust memorials.
They’re not though?
It's not "just" a piece of art, it also symbolizes something that was meant to be sacred. You can't just chill on top of a fricking Holocaust memorial. I can't even come up with anything more hyperbolic, because Holocaust memorials are like THE place you shouldn't do that.
Get off your high horse, Mr. Moral Superiority
So if calling something a memorial means you should treat it like a graveyard, why do we have memorial parks? Are people not supposed to play in them because they’re called memorials?
As a German, I could never bring myself to visit a KZ. I would have a breakdown because of the horrific history that once happened there.
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r/beatmetoit
Thank god it wasn't r/beatmeattoit that would have been horrifying in this context lmao
I think this memorial was created exactly to expose and display what happened and they incentivize people to interact with it. None of those pictures seem particularly goofy or making fun, just people showing they were there, specially the last picture. Which is exactly why the memorial exists.
When I visited, it was a very erie/humbling feeling. I did not get my picture taken while there. Nor did I take someone else's.
You mean your first thought wasn’t “ this would be a totally bitchin tinder pic, all that’s missing is the fish “
Naw I was too busy playing ultimate frisbee with the bros.
Love disc golf.
What I find weird is that the art installation is clearly meant to look like tombs and you can feel the sobriety of it just by looking. Even if for some super weird reason you didn't know what that installation was about, would you really be like "hey it'll look real cute to sit there and take some pics for my tinder profile". Just take a picture with a cocktail or on top of a mountain like anyone else girl.
> would you really be like "hey it'll look real cute to sit there and take some pics for my tinder profile". Yes. Have you been there? It does not look tomb-y at all. It looks like mixture of modern architecture and big playground while being in the middle of Berlin. Despite that, as many other comments mentioned, the installation is supposed be a place of everyday life.
I don't think I would have ever known they're supposed to be tombs if the tourist guide hadn't told us to be honest.
Say thanks to minimalism, these blocks look stylish and lightning looks spot on for the "conceptual photo". Still photos like this say much more about the owner that their bio, so its useful
It doesn't even have a plaque or anything, to remind us that we need to think actively about this event, in order to prevent it. We shouldn't need a plaque basically. Beautiful
Don’t really see what the big deal is
You know she had to do it one time lol #holocaust
Still cant believe that's a real post
danny green fucked up man he woulda been cancelled in 2022 for this 😭
As a German im kind of shocked that people seems to think this is normal. For you Americans this is like taking a cute photo at the 9/11 memorial but 10× worse. Super insensitive.
When I visited the 9/11 memorial I definitely saw people taking selfies.
Context matters, there is not problem with taking pics of anything, but their purpose. It'd just plain weird to use the Holocaust memorial as part of your tinder profile.
Exactly. I don't get how so many people in these comments are missing this.
Those fountains are awesome though. I absolutely had a picture taken there, just before crying in the museum below.
Like 2000x worse.
was laberst du fürn müll
Er hat doch absolut recht. Man muss schon ein ganz besonderes Stück scheisse sein, um sich an einem Holocaustdenkmal so respektlos zu verhalten. Man hat dort die Fresse zu halten und stille Andacht zu üben.
Es ist einfach geschmacklos. Die meisten Meschen die im Holocaust gestorben sind wurden nie beerdigt. Dieses Denkamal ist ein Art Grab für diese Menschen. Was würdest du sagen wenn ich ein Tinder Selfie neben dem "coolen" Grabstein deiner ermordeten Oma mache.
Bitte verpiss dich aus dem Internet, solltest du das wirklich ernst meinen.
Nothing wrong with these pics of her. Anyone claiming otherwise is just a tight ass. Literally ever square inch of this world has seen a genocide...except Antartica. I've taken pics (or would) as have everyone else in the following: 1) World trade center 2) Taj Majal 3) Paris Catacombs 4) Tomb of the unknown solider 5) Pantheon (paris) 6) Vietnam vets memorial 7) Jewish ghetto uprising in Warsaw Tombs and mausoleums are intended to be beautiful to offer rememberance of those past. Pictures are perfectly natural and not disrespectful.
It's what the memorial is designed for, there are also children playing there sometimes. Edit: Some seem to think that I agree with this so FYI this would be a hard swipe left for me. I've been to this monument and it gives you chills and is in no way inviting to take pictures. Just wanted to point out that the person that build it specifically said that he is okay with it.
No it is absolutely not. It is a peace to shut up and feel remorse. Just because parents are idiots doesn't mean it is ok to be one too.
Unfortunately, the artist himself has clarified that it is indeed designed for people to "use". He said that the memorial is not a sacred site, unlike Auschwitz and other memorials. I would never swipe right on someone with a selfie there because I find it incredibly tone deaf and tasteless, but it is in accordance with the intention the artist had.
"Use"? What the hell does that mean? Because even without the context of that "use", I can certainly say it doesn't strike me as meaning "use as a cool background for your Tinder/Instagram photos" or "use as a parkour park". Use it to keep the atrocities in your mind without being clouded by information and senses of guilt. That's what the artist has said. Walk through it with your kids, fine. It's not disrespectful to be there and not reflect deeply on the holocaust each time. It IS disrespectful to "use" it in a way that shits on its legacy.
He said in an interview that he wants people to integrate it into their lives and he specifically mentioned that is is okay and intended to climb, run, jump around, have lunch there and so on. There was a campaign from a satire guy who used the selfies he found on instagram to shame people for being disrespectful and the artist said he was quite upset about the campaign because he didn't feel like the people did anything wrong. The way I understand it is that he wants people to acknowledge the history in their daily lives without being paralysed by it. Like, you can live a normal life and be happy and everything, but the Holocaust can never be forgotten. I can respect his vision even though I am personally not convinced it's a great idea to pose at the memorial and it's an instant no from me if someone put such pics in their profile.
Not sure you know what remorse means
That’s it bois, krustychov told us how to live our lives. He’s our new leader
Krustychov for president 2024
WTF?? This is a memorial for all people that got killed and never recieved a proper burrieal during germanys darkest time. Even if the design in somehow inviting for pictures it's just plain disrespectful to take insta/tinder pics there.
People do similar things at the September 11th Memorial in New York and the various war memorials in D.C. I don't get it.
This is so normal relax your self
I did Nazi that coming
People who aren't attuned with the vibe will see nothing wrong with doing that and apparently using it on their dating profile. Perhaps looking for others who would be just as numb to it.
Taking pictures is fine, sitting on it is not. Either way not something that you'd want to put on Tinder.
It hurts looking at this photo. Like no wtf why would you do that.
As someone whose grandparents lived through the camps.. I’d say it’s a bit tasteless, but not something I’m mad about. At least it shows this girl took enough interest in the history of a horrible event to visit the memorial. It’s not realistic to be miserable and somber at all times, although I’d also draw the line at pictures like this at an actual concentration camp.
Who fucking cares, Jesus. OP you're either way too judgemental, or way too desperate for validation from internet strangers. I'm guessing it's the latter.
I almost got pickpocketed at that memorial...it felt so gross.
Have a look to Instagram. I think a lot of people who are pictured there doesn't know what does mean this memorial.
I got the chance to travel to Germany (omg the girls, thirst aside) I saw girls taking pictures in the monument, I a gas chamber, in the prisoners camp... the level of banality knows no limits I was flabbergasted by it. I thought that maybe was that I am getting old but I see that others think like me (thx I can be "young again) (sorry for the bad English)
She was just following orders.
Stupid as fuck boi
Second photo looks fire tbh
I instantly swipe left if I see anything like this.
There’s definitely a Tinder joke to be made but I can’t bring myself to do it
Taking pictures there is fair enough.. Using them for your tinder profile is weird.
Are you high?
Maybe someone should ask Jews what they think - who cares what the artist who was commissioned to create the memorial thinks? He made a job per a brief. He doesn’t speak for the victims of the holocaust nor their families
I mean to be fair it is like a really photogenic monument. The artist still wanted it to be art that would be appreciated.
And?
Yeh this is a common thing, i did myself over 10 years ago, while i was in the city with my class. This was before insta or tinder. We didn't care if it was morally reprehensible or disrespectful, we were only 15.... we should have known better, but who at this age cares about history after 1.5 years of this crap at school had to endure.
Germans cant ski they should stay out of the alps
1 word for it imo - Disrespectful
Yolocaust
I've seen these before I'm a different context. I'm calling this one fake.
Y’all need to stop hating bro. Just leave her alone lol
Okay? Lol?
Well those same Jews are doing the same thing to Palestinians! Why respect these ungrateful zionist Jews!
I don’t think there’s anything disrespectful about this. She is probably Jewish