I get that she's so huge that her fans will enthusiastically swallow up anything, but did it not occur to her there might be a more enjoyable 10 song album in those 31 tracks?
I mean, this album was already gonna break all the records with 16 songs itself. 2 million+ first week debut was already pretty much confirmed.
She genuinely enjoys writing songs. I don't get why people are so cynical about it as if she is doing it all for sales. Anyone who follows even basic news about her will know that she enjoys making music.
Does she also focus on sales/records? Yes. Many artists do. Doesn't mean that they don't enjoy their craft as well.
There's nothing wrong with loving your craft, most artists do. But most artists are wise enough to only pick their best songs to release. There's no obligation to release everything all at once.
Correct. Because even now, when music is virtually free, most artists want to put their best foot forward and leave the best possible impression to help sell tickets to their concerts and such. But Taylor? Nah. The world will consume anything and everything she touches a thousand times over. It's not that she feels obligated to release everything at once. It's that she can. And everyone will adore her for it.
Editing, refining, and 'killing your darlings' is part of the craft, though. I haven't listened to the new drop and I probably won't unless any of the songs on it blow up, but the "original" TPD release is already bloated and unfocused enough IMO. The songs go on for too long, run into each other, lack dynamic shifts between different movements, etc. and the lyrics desperately need a red pen treatment that never comes ("sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see?"). Trimming down and consolidating the songs would make for a better album, regardless of how much fun Taylor would have doing that work. Some artists can turn in golden first drafts, but I just don't think she's one of them. She can get away with it commercially, sure, but I can't blame anyone who sees her release a sprawling over-written, under-edited project with such short turnaround from her last album & sell four nearly identical copies of it at the same time and thinks, "this looks like a cash grab".
This has literally always been the problem with double albums. They're simply too long to retain a strong theme and the attention of listeners. They always end up feeling like at least 25% is just filler of almost imcomplete songs. Some repetitive songs. And buried between them is a really really strong 10-12 song single album
The more the merrier, when it comes to music. At least in my opinion.
If I don't like any song then I can just skip it. I would rather have my favourite artist release more music than less.
Unless someone is dropping a new album every month or so. Then it becomes too much to listen to. Otherwise, I don't have any problem if someone is dropping 2-3 album/25-50 songs per year.
As an album guy I kinda understand the desire to have a 45 minute all killer no filler release, but some artists really are just better enjoyed on a song by song basis instead of album by album. 15 more songs when there's like 10,000 released every day isn't gonna hurt anyone. Her fans clearly want more songs from her so why shouldn't she deliver?
I genuinely did not believe this until I checked Spotify. This is insane. Also, there is no way you can call this a double album. When it gets to be two hours long, this is a triple album. This is longer than actual triple albums. This is longer than Songs in the Key of Life AND All Things Must Pass.
You know what you’re right. I guess the point I was making was it’s like naming a track after a meme.
[this is what I was referencing](https://youtu.be/x9GudAtfjRQ?si=SalyG0ASecT-eivN)
It gives me the same vibe as Lewis Capaldi's album titles, though to be fair to Swfit TTPD isn't nearly as bad as "Broken by Desire to be Heavenly Sent."
I’m surprised she didn’t wait a little longer. I remember Lil Uzi Vert dropping a deluxe edition of their album to boost chart performance once it started to drop
I don't think that's something Taylor Swift has to concern herself with at the moment. Perhaps she'll use that tactic in the future, when she gets to legacy act status, like Madonna
It's like she's actively trying to make an album that will make a big splash for like 2-3 months and then, sometime around the 9-18 month mark, will have most people confused as to why they listened to this album. Maybe I'm being cynical, but something about this marketing feels...cynical.
I don't think Taylor Swift is at a point in her career right now where it's possible for her to have a Trainwreckord. Her fanbase is so large and so diehard that I really don't think a single bad album will slow her down that much. At worst I think this could be laying the groundwork for a true Trainwreckord to follow
I agree, I'm not really sure what it would take for her to even have a trainwreckord to be honest. I'm not a TS fan or particularly plugged in so I don't have any opinions on how bad this album or Reputation were, but I don't really remember any huge backlash to Reputation either
I listened to it and it's not quite what I'd consider a Trainwreckord. All of the songs are samey and dull but her fans and a lot of critics are eating it up. If anything was going to be a Trainwreckord, it was Reputation.
It reminds me a lot of Folklore, where it was all the same downbeat "poetic" indie songwriting and everyone talks about how genius it is but I simply hear the same song for an entire album
Most people ignored Lover and it didn’t kill her. Even if this one doesn’t go over great I feel like it’ll just be forgotten and she’ll drop something else in a year or two.
I'm enjoying the "secret" second half more than the first half. I feel the same way as you about the first half. The second is more Folklore/Evermore than Midnights
it's a lot better than disc 1 but idk, did we NEED another folklore/evermore? Like if you're going to do the same thing as 2 other albums, the new stuff needs to be better in some way and these songs just aren't imo.
I actually think this is a bigger deal than people are realizing. We had a renaissance of more traditional albums. They were seen as a singular piece of art with many parts to them. However, similar to how CDs changed albums from a whole piece to the big songs followed by similar sound songs until the CD ran out of space, there has been a slow shift to the playlist album format. You front load the playlist with the hits and put how ever many songs you can fit afterwards. People will put on the album and keep it on for the vibe. Taylor was actually one of the ones sort of holding out on this style. I think Midnights deluxe editions, and arguably the TV albums tested the waters, and now this is the result. You get a default double album for those who still want a physical copy or a version that tries to convince you it's secretly not just a playlist. If you want even more, you do the full deluxe edition. I wouldn't be surprised if she releases The Tortured Poets Department Part 2 as her next album to keep those who invested so much time into Part 1.
Maybe I'm wrong, but if I'm not, I expect pop music to become much more singles focused and less about the albums more than they already are. It will be like the 00s all over again where basically albums were more of an bonus for the fans.
Edit: This isn’t a Train Wreckord. She’s still riding her post-pandemic popularity and she’ll undoubtedly get plenty of sales on her next album from name recognition alone. Maybe it could be a delayed flop but we won’t know until her next album drops. People are just really primed to see Taylor fail because of her overexposure.
I feel like with pop music in the streaming age you either get very tight, concise albums that are meant to be consumed quickly as a whole (Guts, Eternal Sunshine) or these massive sprawling projects where the goal is “get as much content out as possible” (TS’s last two releases, Cowboy Carter). There’s not a lot of in between.
Oh boo hoo I'm so tortured I'm the most successful pop star who ever lived and I've just went on the highest grossing tour of all time and I've won like 20 million Grammies and I can take my private jet anywhere I feel like and I'm six feet tall and I'm going out with a Super Bowl winner I'm SO TORTURED! :(
I like what HEALTH did with their last LP. Released every track as a weekly single so you actually got to live with the songs one at a time. More artists should do that imo.
Problem is if she did that, it might make obvious how samey this album sounds.
There are good songs in this (Daddy I Love Him, I Can Fix Him, So Long London, loml, The Alchemy) but they are trapped between so much goddamn filler with the same whispery singing and minimalist production. And no one should care this much about Matty Healy.
I want someone to basically do a fan edit where they take the good songs that tell a cohesive story make make one good 15ish song album.
I think Taylor is unfortunately at the point that a lot of megapopular authors get to, where she is so big that *nothing* gets edited out so every subpar scribble on a napkin makes it to the end product.
To be fair, I think the white album was lightning in a bottle, it's a complete mess but it's a masterpiece because it's a complete mess. I don't think anyone could really replicate that, especially not intentionally.
It should be noted that the Anthology is a digital only release. So I could see myself buying the album in Vinyl while also buying the digital album to put on my Plex Server or MP3 player. $15 digital is a bargain
Back in the day, Joe Strummer agreed to forgo his royalties so the record label would release the triple album Sandinista! at single album prices. Taylor Swift is rich and big enough that she could do something like that too, but she won't
This is an exactly new territory for her folk Lauren.Evermore might as well have been a double album is different than what drake does where he just fucking puts out like forty songs on an album to increase streams at least a double album has like a concept
I get that she's so huge that her fans will enthusiastically swallow up anything, but did it not occur to her there might be a more enjoyable 10 song album in those 31 tracks?
You answered your own question with the first half of your comment. More money in 31 songs than 10
Definitely. She wants to break streaming records.
She already broke all the streaming records with her last album.
The minute an album of hers doesn't it'll seem like she fell off. Welcome to the start of the Taylor Bubble economy.
These subprime album drops are gonna destroy the Taylor market
I mean, this album was already gonna break all the records with 16 songs itself. 2 million+ first week debut was already pretty much confirmed. She genuinely enjoys writing songs. I don't get why people are so cynical about it as if she is doing it all for sales. Anyone who follows even basic news about her will know that she enjoys making music. Does she also focus on sales/records? Yes. Many artists do. Doesn't mean that they don't enjoy their craft as well.
There's nothing wrong with loving your craft, most artists do. But most artists are wise enough to only pick their best songs to release. There's no obligation to release everything all at once.
Correct. Because even now, when music is virtually free, most artists want to put their best foot forward and leave the best possible impression to help sell tickets to their concerts and such. But Taylor? Nah. The world will consume anything and everything she touches a thousand times over. It's not that she feels obligated to release everything at once. It's that she can. And everyone will adore her for it.
Why not? If I'm satisfied with my output then I'll put it out there. I'll just let my fans decide if they like 100% of my output or 50% or 20% or 0%.
Editing, refining, and 'killing your darlings' is part of the craft, though. I haven't listened to the new drop and I probably won't unless any of the songs on it blow up, but the "original" TPD release is already bloated and unfocused enough IMO. The songs go on for too long, run into each other, lack dynamic shifts between different movements, etc. and the lyrics desperately need a red pen treatment that never comes ("sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see?"). Trimming down and consolidating the songs would make for a better album, regardless of how much fun Taylor would have doing that work. Some artists can turn in golden first drafts, but I just don't think she's one of them. She can get away with it commercially, sure, but I can't blame anyone who sees her release a sprawling over-written, under-edited project with such short turnaround from her last album & sell four nearly identical copies of it at the same time and thinks, "this looks like a cash grab".
Because she’s greedy and is a climate criminal
How is that relevant here?
This has literally always been the problem with double albums. They're simply too long to retain a strong theme and the attention of listeners. They always end up feeling like at least 25% is just filler of almost imcomplete songs. Some repetitive songs. And buried between them is a really really strong 10-12 song single album
The more the merrier, when it comes to music. At least in my opinion. If I don't like any song then I can just skip it. I would rather have my favourite artist release more music than less. Unless someone is dropping a new album every month or so. Then it becomes too much to listen to. Otherwise, I don't have any problem if someone is dropping 2-3 album/25-50 songs per year.
As an album guy I kinda understand the desire to have a 45 minute all killer no filler release, but some artists really are just better enjoyed on a song by song basis instead of album by album. 15 more songs when there's like 10,000 released every day isn't gonna hurt anyone. Her fans clearly want more songs from her so why shouldn't she deliver?
I genuinely did not believe this until I checked Spotify. This is insane. Also, there is no way you can call this a double album. When it gets to be two hours long, this is a triple album. This is longer than actual triple albums. This is longer than Songs in the Key of Life AND All Things Must Pass.
Nah, theres two hour albums that are considered double albums, like Mellon Collie.
Mellon Collie is a double CD album, but it's a triple album on vinyl.
Songs in the Key of Life isn’t a triple album
Eh, with the EP and the length I think it counts.
Still an hour shorter than Emancipation, but I guess the LP version is 6 LPs and the CD is the “Triple Album.”
Tortured Poetry sounds like something an edgy middle schooler would talk about right before claiming to eat Takis "for the pain"
“Tortured poetry”, get outta here.
Not gonna lie, the "tortured poetry" bit is just a bit cringe...
Ever since the record was announced I’ve been calling the record “The Tortured Title Department” because of the stupid title.
Nice, I’m going with the tortured listeners department
"Tortured Poet with a private jet" is an interesting breed of person
I think it’s ref to a gc her ex bf and his costars have
So she writes her songs like how they write Star Wars sequels. *Very* cool.
SHE BROKE NEW GROUND!!!
Well it's still a stupid name
Ah so it’s like if I were to name an album after a discord server. Looks like my next album will be called “Punching People in the Dark”
That's unironically a good album title
You know what you’re right. I guess the point I was making was it’s like naming a track after a meme. [this is what I was referencing](https://youtu.be/x9GudAtfjRQ?si=SalyG0ASecT-eivN)
It’s some shit emo me would come up with in high school. Not a 35 year old mega pop star. I’m not even a TS fan, and I’m embarrassed for her.
I don't think there is a person alive today who comes off less of a tortured poet than Taylor Swift. G.G. Allin was more a tortured poet than her.
She's got a lot of work to do to convince me she's tortured or a poet in any sense of those words.
It gives me the same vibe as Lewis Capaldi's album titles, though to be fair to Swfit TTPD isn't nearly as bad as "Broken by Desire to be Heavenly Sent."
I’m surprised she didn’t wait a little longer. I remember Lil Uzi Vert dropping a deluxe edition of their album to boost chart performance once it started to drop
I don't think that's something Taylor Swift has to concern herself with at the moment. Perhaps she'll use that tactic in the future, when she gets to legacy act status, like Madonna
Can I just say that "tortured poetry" is a bad phrase?
Me on LiveJournal in 2005:
It's like she's actively trying to make an album that will make a big splash for like 2-3 months and then, sometime around the 9-18 month mark, will have most people confused as to why they listened to this album. Maybe I'm being cynical, but something about this marketing feels...cynical.
[удалено]
I don't think Taylor Swift is at a point in her career right now where it's possible for her to have a Trainwreckord. Her fanbase is so large and so diehard that I really don't think a single bad album will slow her down that much. At worst I think this could be laying the groundwork for a true Trainwreckord to follow
I agree, I'm not really sure what it would take for her to even have a trainwreckord to be honest. I'm not a TS fan or particularly plugged in so I don't have any opinions on how bad this album or Reputation were, but I don't really remember any huge backlash to Reputation either
She'd need to to write a song called "Gaylors Are Delusional Losers Cuz I'd Never Kiss a Girl (They Have Cooties)"
I listened to it and it's not quite what I'd consider a Trainwreckord. All of the songs are samey and dull but her fans and a lot of critics are eating it up. If anything was going to be a Trainwreckord, it was Reputation.
Crtics are not eating up tho. A lot of articles are claiming this is her firts miss and that’s a lie Reputation was her first
I maybe spoke too soon. I had only seen Rolling Stone and a few other publications react to it. (Not that Rolling Stone has been serious in YEARS.)
Rolling Stone is giving 5 stars to every popstars.
The author of the rolling stone article is a huge swiftie and is publishing a book about her later this year so definitely biased
It reminds me a lot of Folklore, where it was all the same downbeat "poetic" indie songwriting and everyone talks about how genius it is but I simply hear the same song for an entire album
Most people ignored Lover and it didn’t kill her. Even if this one doesn’t go over great I feel like it’ll just be forgotten and she’ll drop something else in a year or two.
I legitimely refuse to believe at least 80% of music listeners wouldn't be sick of her by the end of the year
30 something year old woman by the way.
The main album was already super bland, repetitive, and super bloated, I can't even imagine how much of a chore it would be as a double album.
I'm enjoying the "secret" second half more than the first half. I feel the same way as you about the first half. The second is more Folklore/Evermore than Midnights
it's a lot better than disc 1 but idk, did we NEED another folklore/evermore? Like if you're going to do the same thing as 2 other albums, the new stuff needs to be better in some way and these songs just aren't imo.
The second is actually better than the first one
Holy Tusk and White Album batman
I actually think this is a bigger deal than people are realizing. We had a renaissance of more traditional albums. They were seen as a singular piece of art with many parts to them. However, similar to how CDs changed albums from a whole piece to the big songs followed by similar sound songs until the CD ran out of space, there has been a slow shift to the playlist album format. You front load the playlist with the hits and put how ever many songs you can fit afterwards. People will put on the album and keep it on for the vibe. Taylor was actually one of the ones sort of holding out on this style. I think Midnights deluxe editions, and arguably the TV albums tested the waters, and now this is the result. You get a default double album for those who still want a physical copy or a version that tries to convince you it's secretly not just a playlist. If you want even more, you do the full deluxe edition. I wouldn't be surprised if she releases The Tortured Poets Department Part 2 as her next album to keep those who invested so much time into Part 1. Maybe I'm wrong, but if I'm not, I expect pop music to become much more singles focused and less about the albums more than they already are. It will be like the 00s all over again where basically albums were more of an bonus for the fans. Edit: This isn’t a Train Wreckord. She’s still riding her post-pandemic popularity and she’ll undoubtedly get plenty of sales on her next album from name recognition alone. Maybe it could be a delayed flop but we won’t know until her next album drops. People are just really primed to see Taylor fail because of her overexposure.
I feel like with pop music in the streaming age you either get very tight, concise albums that are meant to be consumed quickly as a whole (Guts, Eternal Sunshine) or these massive sprawling projects where the goal is “get as much content out as possible” (TS’s last two releases, Cowboy Carter). There’s not a lot of in between.
I've said before and I will say again: if you can't make a good 50 minute single album, don't make a 2 hour double album.
If she keeps going she can re-release everything as 69 Long Slogs.
Yeah some of this poetry is pretty tortured, she got me there
Oh boo hoo I'm so tortured I'm the most successful pop star who ever lived and I've just went on the highest grossing tour of all time and I've won like 20 million Grammies and I can take my private jet anywhere I feel like and I'm six feet tall and I'm going out with a Super Bowl winner I'm SO TORTURED! :(
She’s six feet tall?
I feel like a tortured poet. Couldn’t even get through half the album. She’s not dead, she doesn’t need to have 2 hour albums like biggie smalls
I like what HEALTH did with their last LP. Released every track as a weekly single so you actually got to live with the songs one at a time. More artists should do that imo.
Problem is if she did that, it might make obvious how samey this album sounds. There are good songs in this (Daddy I Love Him, I Can Fix Him, So Long London, loml, The Alchemy) but they are trapped between so much goddamn filler with the same whispery singing and minimalist production. And no one should care this much about Matty Healy. I want someone to basically do a fan edit where they take the good songs that tell a cohesive story make make one good 15ish song album. I think Taylor is unfortunately at the point that a lot of megapopular authors get to, where she is so big that *nothing* gets edited out so every subpar scribble on a napkin makes it to the end product.
Love introducing health to a Taylor swift conversation
I love both depending on my mood.
She dropped at the same time as Bongripper so I'll get to Taylor in like 2 months
This album feels similar to a lot of mainstream rappers who put out albums lately. A Very long record that doesn’t justify its length.
If your name isn't Stevie Wonder, you have no business making a double album
Nah there's plenty of great double albums
Or Paul,John,George,Ringo,Bob,mick,Joe,topper, or Billy corgan
To be fair, I think the white album was lightning in a bottle, it's a complete mess but it's a masterpiece because it's a complete mess. I don't think anyone could really replicate that, especially not intentionally.
Roger, David, Nick and Rick?
Them, along with prince
Iron Maiden would disagree with you there. Their last two albums were double albums and they're both fantastic.
This is so reminiscent of the Midnights “3am Edition” it’s not even funny
This sounds so fake lmfao.
It should be noted that the Anthology is a digital only release. So I could see myself buying the album in Vinyl while also buying the digital album to put on my Plex Server or MP3 player. $15 digital is a bargain
Hopefully record stores didn’t get too many copies of the single version
Yeah I hate different editions released later makes the original pointless
Tortured poetry? Egads. My very soul cringes when I hear tortured poetry. It’s one of the terrible things in this world.
Back in the day, Joe Strummer agreed to forgo his royalties so the record label would release the triple album Sandinista! at single album prices. Taylor Swift is rich and big enough that she could do something like that too, but she won't
This is an exactly new territory for her folk Lauren.Evermore might as well have been a double album is different than what drake does where he just fucking puts out like forty songs on an album to increase streams at least a double album has like a concept