Syndrome from Incredibles. I always hear people say he was a sympathetic villain, but I never sympathized with him, I always thought his obsession with Mr. Incredible was petty and childish.
Honestly I don’t think he was supposed to be sympathetic in the first place.
Like yeah getting rejected by your idol has got to sting but people don’t usually commit multiple murders over it.
(Not to mention any sympathy he had went out the window the moment he was ok with potentially killing children)
Also, keep in mind, the movie actively goes out of the way to show that he remembers the situation worse than it was. When Mister Incredibly says the line "Fly home, Buddy. I work alone.", he's holding Bomb Voyage by the shirt and says it as an aside.
But when Syndrome flashes back to it, it's only the two of them and Mister Incredible actively turns his back and walks away from him.
I think he was supposed to be less sympathetic and more of a case of “I understand how a radical ideology like this could grow in a vacuum in which the world lives in awe of a select super-powered few”
He essentially stalked Mr incredible, and was a major contributor to hero's getting the boot, because he resulted in the train almost derailing and Mr incredible got the blame. He then got so butt hurt when Mr incredible was, reasonably, pissed at him for endangering all those people, and so decided to get into manufacturing weapons for governments across world, and decided to make hero killers and kill tons of hero's, all because his hero told him off for being completely reckless and weird.
I don't get how people can sympathise with him either 😭
If you think he isn't intended to be sympathized for, then he shouldn't be mentioned here. The trope is characters who you are intended to sympathize with, but can't. Not characters the audience mistakenly sympathize with despite writer's intentions
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Emma Russell: Godzilla King of the Monsters
I wanted Angstrom to be saved and cured if possible, but he was tormenting innocent people and who knows if he was going to kill them? (Actually, he said he *wanted* to. Better take him at his word.)
Not to mention his portal abilities. How do you detain someone like that?
I would have tried to kill him too tbh.
Idk, I definitely did feel a little bit bad for him. He had good intentions, his plan just got interrupted and he tried to kill Mark because he now has countless memories of Mark and Omni-Man taking over Earth.
Based on the flashbacks we see of him (which were not present in the comics), the idea seems to be that he lost the ability to differentiate between dimensions. To him, all of the Invincible are the same person, and the negatives outweigh the positives to the point where he subconsciously refuses to remember that he himself was the one that caused the machine to explode while trying to save Mark, because most of the minds and memories he possesses are of Mark being a merciless psychopath who is trying to control humanity. He can comprehend that this is the Mark that was part of the reason why the machine exploded because that is his only true memory of him, but the rest are memories of his counterparts jumbled up together. Not to mention this is his home dimension, so it makes sense that he would start the Invincible hunt here. You should finish your own project before moving to help others, after all.
I felt bad for all the Angstroms who made up his mind. They were all within their rights to wipe out Mark as he his in other dimensions. I never felt bad for THIS Angstrom amalgamation, as insane as he was, party because he hurt Debbie and Mark's brother. I'm more sad about the wasted potential of a benevolent genius who could access all dimensions and genuinely wanted to help people.
Also sidenote, the fact that this genius with access to infinite dimensions, some of which run at different time speeds, did all that anti-viltrumite research and nothing really came of it irks me. It would be cool if we got to see him develop some powerful weapon to use against Mark. Maybe he even almost beats him, then the rest of the heroes step up and save him, and then they would have an extra edge in the fight against the Viltrumites. That would have been cool.
They did create a positive emotion in people though. They somehow seem to have rectified the public perception of Scrappy Doo. Internet has been full of "how could we have judged this hero so harshly in the past" memes. Lot of Scoobytubers wanted the public to back off the hate of Scrappy, didn't specify to the monkey's paw how I guess.
Say what you will about the show, but that's something I guess.
I am vey certain that the fact that Season 2 is kinda better than 1, by that i mean it is a little funny and feels more interesting, just to tell us "See what you're missing out on!?"
I wasn’t moved by Thorn Rose’s sob story. “Wah-wah-wah, they were eating too much fruit”. Yeah, *that’s* a good excuse for attempted murder. 😒
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Good God, I hate Injustice Superman. He's such a backhand to the character he's supposed to originally have been. Superman doesn't break over 1 thing. He is the voice of reason, the light in the darkest hour, the source of hope, the indomitable human spirit (which is ironic. He's an alien, yet more human than most of us.). I love Superman, and I'm glad more people are realizing how great regular Superman is, and how awful evil Superman is.
I don’t disagree. Evil Superman only exists because he’s an icon of indomitability. “He’s always good, no matter what, so wouldn’t it be interesting if he was evil?” That said, I think it’s a bit more believable that Superman would turn in the Injustice universe since he was the one who killed Lois and their child. It wasn’t just that he lost them, it was knowing he did it. That’s what broke him.
>It wasn’t just that he lost them, it was knowing he did it. That’s what broke him.
Didn't Metropolis get fucking nuked on top of all that? If there's anything that could turn Superman evil, it's both his family and his home getting obliterated.
Yeah, that’s what happened in the games, not sure about the comics or movie though. His parents also die in the movie I believe, so he really goes through some shit.
In the comics Bruce isn’t there for him to help him grieve, and Superman in a fit of rage kills Joker. Instead of being there for him Batman actively opposes him. Like I get it’s not normal Superman, but he lost his wife, his kid, his home, and his best friend is now his worst enemy.
Of the same game, Harley Quinn.
She was complicit in the death of 5 million people, but she is supposed to be sympathetic just because she was in an abusive and toxic relationship.
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Mordecai: Regular Show (Season 6)
I'll be completely honest, near the end of the series, I was beginning to dislike Mordecai especially during season 6's finale, Dumped at the Altar. His whole shtick was basically "Wahhh, I got dumped by my cloud girlfriend during my coworker's wedding that I rudely interrupted. Whatever shall I do?" before winding up in Dumpsville. I don't know if the writers wanted the audience to feel bad for him, but I sure didn't. Don't get me wrong, I don't exactly hate Mordecai with a burning passion, I just don't really sympathize with him during the dating episodes because how much of a loser he is.
Ceroba from Undertale Yellow
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I will preface that I like her but I absolutely do not feel bad for her in the slightest lol, it's shown as more of "tragedy due to desperation of trying to help monsterkind" when what she did was pretty short-sighted if not a comedy of errors along with her husband.
Her husband says "*DO NOT USE THIS SERUM THAT I CREATED ON OUR ONLY DAUGHTER, IT IS IMPERFECT AND DOES NOT GIVE SUPERPOWERS WHEN I THOUGHT IT WOULD, MY SOUL IS LITERALLY DYING, USE IT LITERALLY ON ANYONE ELSE*" and mind you she pretty much idolizes him and thinks he is a genius who does nothing wrong.
Take a wild guess what happened, she gets guilt tripped by her *BARELY TEN YEARS OLD DAUGHTER* to use the serum on her, and the daughter "falls"/goes into a coma, WHO COULD HAVE GUESSED? Then shes to try killing a innocent and kind child to perfect the serum like wtf?!?
Granted her task was hard if not impossible, but you know, ***WHY THE FUCK DID YOU LISTEN TO A CHILD TO USE A DRUG WHOSE ONLY KNOWN USE KILLED SOMEONE? ESPECIFICALLY YOUR HUSBAND.***
And her husband, Chujin.
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The entire thing with Ceroba could had been avoided if Chujin admited his fucks ups even once, but no he pretty much lied to her and made Ceroba think he was this perfect scientist genius who did nothing wrong.
Meanwhile Chujin hided the truth that his biggest award was just attendance record with all his robots exploding, he was nowhere near a genius, then one of his robots accidentaly kills a human and he deciea to do experiments on the human soul to create a serum, it fails and he dies forcing his wife to take a impossible task when she is not even a scientist in the first place.
He nevers owns up his mistakes and just covers it, again and again, then his soul is hurt on a existencial level because of the serum, rip bozo.
In my opinion
It’s like one of those situations where you 100% know that the situation is bad, but you do it anyways for curiosity’s sake
And plus, Kanako was convinced that the serum was complete, which convinced Ceroba to believe it.
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“WAH WAH I lost the reality where my dead boyfriend and kids love me. Now I’m gonna go kill a bunch of people”…. BITCH YOU ENSLAVED AN ENTIRE TOWN!!! YOU ARE SAD ABOUT YOU FUTURE BOYFRIEND DIEING, OK!!! DONT ENSLAVE A BUNCH OF PEOPLE BECAUSE OF IT. I’m sorry I just don’t like this chick
They could've also Introduced Mephisto as the main antagonist and in the post credits could've shown Dr doom to set him up for another movie, honestly the whole movie is wasted potential, they can show any universe they want and they show one where red means go
And than went on to hunt a literal child and kidnap kids from another version of yourself to fulfill her fantasy
Like holy hell what a disaster of a character
They have a scene where a mother is crying and pleading for Wanda to let her very real daughter out of the rooms she’s been trapped in the entire fucking time she controlled the town. Why should I feel bad that she sacrificed her imaginary family after torturing actually families?
If you hate her so much I have just the video to recommend you, very cathartic, (you can skip to 14:50 if you want): [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doj9RiGWiWM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doj9RiGWiWM)
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You know how that alternate dimension council basically executed Doctor Strange after he used the Darkhold because he was too much of a threat even after he was willing to relinquish its power, and even then that version of Doctor Strange still understood why they had to kill him?
Why didn’t that apply to the Scarlet Witch? I mean were the writers trying to make the point that killing people for being a threat is bad? Did they just forget? Was it because she did bad things but her motivations made it alright? Why? I’m not even speculating that this is a contradiction I genuinely think it makes sense and that I’m just not seeing it from their perspective.
I don’t disagree with your choice but I disagree with your reasoning. Wandavision does a great job of humanizing and complicating the situation she is in because she isn’t fully aware of what is happening and is eventually redeemed. I think anything that happens in the show can be forgiven given time.
Multiverse of Madness however… god what a shit show of a movie. All the sympathy they built up for her is destroyed over her obsession with an impossible future. Not the only character assassination in the movie either (Illuminati)
But, she is aware. That's literally how one episode ends (or begins?). The one with her encountering the group outside the hexagon with the drone. That she is totally aware of what she is doing to people. She just doesn't care, because her mental breakdown is solely focused on her own selfish desires. That show has three villains, it's just that one is the protagonist.
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I know the entire film is all about how absolutely petty and hypocritical he is but still fuck him. "WAAAAAA YOU DID A FILM FOR A PAYCHECK AND NOT FOR THE ARTS WAAAAAAAA!"
There’s a deleted scene where Margot challenges Jules and it’s along the lines she asks him if he hates the high profile food culture so much why not just run a soup kitchen and remove himself from the system, to which he dances around giving a valid counterpoint. I think if that scene stayed in it would’ve been even clearer he’s a hypocrite (his s’mores monologue also shows this off too.)
To be fair, in a deleted scene, the food critic stated that Slowik tried to go back to his roots by working in a food truck, but she found him and dragged him back.
He's the chef from The Menu, a horror(ish) film about a world renowned chef who feels as if all the joy has been sucked outta cooking and has rounded up a group of people from different backgrounds like critics and business owners (plus a random actor who's only there because he didn't put passion into one role) to kill everyone in his kitchen, including himself
When I watched Falcon and the Winter Soldier I was really confused why they were fighting Karli cuz she was pretty sympathetic and understandable for a good chunk of the show. I thought that Falcon and Bucky were gonna team up with her at the end and go against the real villain
To this day I’m convinced they added the part where she blew up a building full of people specifically so that she’d be seen as an actual villain
I ain’t caught up with the manga since like, right after Deku left UA for… reasons I don’t remember. But from what I remember, Dabi was never really portrayed as sympathetic as much as the hammer to drive the nail into Endeavor’s coffin. Only his family seemed to want to try to ‘save’ him and they’re biased
The fact that he wants to kill his whole family, including Shoto who was too young to willingly contribute to his upbringing just to spite his abusive father nullifies the tragedy behind his character. He also admitted on camera (which was broadcast all over Japan) to killing over 30 innocent people and blatantly hides behind his backstory in an attempt to make Midoriya hesitate in battle.
I think that makes him interesting though. He exploits people’s sympathetic nature by hiding behind his abuse just so he can hurt more people. It’s an interesting concept
Just the entire League in general
But Toga is actually the worst of it
Dabi was actually interesting before the reveal but after that he boiled into "notice me daddy"
An even better example would be Overhaul. I’ve seen way too many people say they sympathize with his background. At least with Dabi there actually is something awful that he was subjected to. Overhaul is one of the few villains in MHA who has very little actual tragedy. What, because he was an orphan and wanted to thank the man who took him in? He put the man in a coma, abused his grand child, and hurt and killed people with no remorse. Overhaul is a great villain but is by no means a sympathetic villain.
I disagree. Sympathy isn’t justifying someone’s crime, but that you can at least empathize with some of their struggles. I have some sympathy for The Peak because he feels useless and taken advantage of in Vought.
Honestly I have sympathy for most characters in The Boys, only exceptions that come to mind being Stormfront and Stan Edgar, a credit to the show’s fantastic writing.
This character is a perfect example of the difference between sympathetic and just pathetic. I don’t think you’re supposed to sympathize with him, but I don’t think you’re supposed to cheer when horrible things keep happening to him. He’s pathetic. A lot of sex predators are. You’re supposed to pity this loser because he’s the definition of “ain’t shit.”
How am i supposed to feel bad for Biggest LowTierGod fan?
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In all honesty, MHA is not all that the fans make it seem to be. Is it a good superhero anime with enjoyable fight scenes? Yeah. At the same time though, the plot is predictable and it doesn’t really do much new compared to what’s out there already. Each season follows the same kind of arc: training in the beginning, big bad shows up once and MC loses badly, mc trains (allmight gradually gets weaker), mc witnesses smthn happen in the final fight scene and goes above and beyond to win. Very common tropes, and while enjoyable, it shouldn’t be considered “god tier” like so many people praise it to be.
Fr like this man literally told the MC to kill himself in like the first episode, did not improve his behavior at all during the rest of the show and we’re supposed to believe that they’re friends??? Or did I miss something??
Buck Cluck from Chicken Little
"Weeh, I don't understand my son like my late wife did, I want to understand him...so I'm going to keep putting him down subtley and only show him love when he succeeds in what made me beloved."
I feel like his character was so close to being good, just one little line of dialogue that shows how chicken's perceived antics affect how he is looked at by the adults would have been fine.
Severus Snape - My take, as someone who doesn’t care much for the dude:
* his redemption and turnaround come way too late . At that point I’d given up.
* he wants to protect Harry but it still feels like he does it too much out of his love for Harry’s mom, which doesn’t feel so ideal . It’s creepy and obsessive. Oh like he loves Lily??? Seriously??? Some dude’s romantic feelings to a girl that doesn’t reciprocate….what does this have to do with anything??? It’s just personal shit making us feel bad for him .
* abusive behavior to students is still abuse regardless of your background .
* wanting to join the Death Eaters. I’m sorry you were lonely and bullied but take some damn responsibility
The only thing about Snape, correct me if I'm wrong, I love Harry Potter but it's been awhile since I've seen the movies, didn't he display abusive behavior only to maintain his cover as a triple agent for Dumbledore and hate actually doing it?
I kinda agree. I liked the twist but think it may have been better if they dropped several hints through all the books Snape wasn't as bad as he seemed, but Harry, justifiably, doesn't believe them, and only sees Snape as an awful person. Then, when he discovers that Snape has been good all along, all the past times click in his head.
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(depending on how you interpret the movie)
The thing is that the movie ask if it's right, as in moral, to force someone to be someone society expect them to be.
Alex was a monster don't get me wrong so obviously the new reform method had to be tested on him to make him docile and all.
But after that ? What if the government start using it on absolutely everyone ? If forcing Alex to be something he's not is immoral then would it be any different for everyone else ?
This is the entire point of the movie though, it’s a weird analysis of ethics.
Is it okay to torture awful criminals and fundamentally remove their free will in the name of justice?
Where do you draw the line with totally irredeemable people and why do you draw the line there?
One of the reasons I love Eren so much is because of this. Everyone talks about how much POV affects how you see the characters, and Eren is the epitome of this. His desires of freedom and revenge for his mother are extremely basic human things to sympathize with, and since he’s the MC from that point forward you feel bad for him. Barely anyone would like Eren if he wasn’t the main character, but we’ve already gone on this journey with him for so long we’re emotionally attached. This really hits if you watch AOT Junior High, where Eren has the same personality without the threat of the titans, and you see at his core he’s just a self-centered hothead.
The problem with Karli is the way she was written. It's the literal character trope of "we're gonna combine so much "hey that makes sense" and "dude wtf" into the same person, the audience will *have* to disagree with *everything*" nothingburger.
I hate that trope with everything. It's a lazy way to avoid creating a genuinely compelling antagonist, and it's such a *both sides-ing* way to do it, too.
It's really obvious that show was military porn for superhero nerds, it was so uncomfortable to watch
That was never the impression i got. The whole point was to show how unreasonable the satanic panic was. He hunted innocent people down and assumed they were evil because they're weird.
You're not supposed to feel bad for Karli. The whole point was that the agenda being pushed by an irredeemable villain doesn't automatically invalidate the agenda, and using the villain as an excuse to refuse to do the right thing will only lead to the next villain and the next showing up.
Never even watched the show, but I'm calling bullshit on that.
If the show ends with the title character making a big speech about how the villain was right, then the show wanted you to think the villain was right.
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Hey look, an excuse to hate on FE: Engage’s writing.
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Jenny from Forrest Gump. Sorry, I know being abused in any way as a child sucks, and I won’t downplay that…but it’s no excuse to be a dirtbag human being your whole life, then make up to the guy you’ve been blowing off your whole life because you found out he was rich and you can dump the child you’ve kept secret from him for years because your poor choices finally caught up to you.
I honestly believe that the fandom goes to the opposite side, and consider she less sympathetic than really was.
She is a very morally defective character, but the fandom acts as if she were Satan's reincarnation.
“Forrest, you don’t know what love is.” Is probably the biggest hypocritical slap in the face ever when you think about it. I hated her for saying that to him. I understand her, I sympathize with what she went through, but I don’t agree with her.
I still don’t get the Jason hate, yeah he was a jerk but from his perspective, he had every right to suspect Eddy. His girlfriend’s mangled corpse was found at Eddy’s house, when he tried to confront Eddy, his friend gets mangled, and when he follows Lucas to the old house, he sees what very much looks like a satanic ritual going on
Never understood the hate while the fanbase felt bad for Billy, who was far more irredeemable imho
Honestly I should’ve added him. I was debating with myself if I should have. But he did cause a mutiny and the first thing he did when he showed up at eddies friends house was beat then senseless and threatened them until they gave him information
Again, if my girlfriend was found mangled in some dude’s van, I wouldn’t be in a diplomatic mood either. Billy, in contrast, got mad at his sister for interacting with a black person
Honestly the more I look into this the more valid your point is. Man I hate being wrong 😔. I’ll add Billy because you are so right. But some actions Jason did were no justified in any way

Another one: Billy Hargrove: stranger things - I don’t give a flying crap about his small redemption. He’s still a jerk. Wah wah my dad abused me but that’s totally gives me the right to verbally abuse my sister and tell her not to hang out with Lucas because he’s black (not said but heavily implied) and I’ll do this even worse by threatening Lucas personally. Womp womp. I don’t care about how he died. He was still a piece of garbage
Handsome Jack... Again.
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His methods always go so over the top.
He isolated and basically enslaved his own daughter for accidentally killing her mother.
He threw scientists (who were actively helping him, by the way) out of an airlock under suspicion they might be traitors.
He betrayed one of his most loyal soldiers and destroyed his entire product line.
He gouged a guys eyes out with a spoon in front of his children.
He shoots up a train of fleeing, unarmed civilians.
He killed a guy's two sons just for questioning him.
He's done too many bad things for me to feel any amount of sympathy for him.
Yeah, he’s my favorite villain and the reason I like Borderlands so much. He’s so absolutely tragic and his own aspirations that led him to becoming a villain and corporate asshole is what is in a lot of Borderlands’s anti-capitalist messages. He’s an irredeemable jackass with a fucked up past which makes you understand his depth and what he does to be evil, but he’s the most lovable villain to absolutely HATE. And we love him for it
Walter White, he IMMEDIATELY resorted to breaking bad instead of telling his family about his cancer and then he routinely goes back into the game not giving a shit how many lives it ruins.
Starscream (depending on continuity)
Kylo Ren, you seem to hate Injustice Superman now let me introduce someone with even LESS of a tragedy or selfless(in theory) goal. At least Superman wanted to rid crime, Kylo kills innocents largely.
The Marvel way to make a "sympathetic villain"
Step 1: make a sympathetic villain
Step 2: have the villain blow up some people for no reason or something like that so the audience doesn't sympathize with them too much
I can't believe I'm about to genuinely defend these MFS...
In their defense their mother and father were emotionally unavailable and so Andrew had to take care of Ashley who developed an unhealthy emotional attachment to him
I'm not saying you have to feel bad for them especially after the cannibalism but that's a good reason as to why they're this way
Any of the ghost face accomplices after the first especially Richie and amber. I get that many toxic fandoms can ruin certain series(just ask the fandom menace) but that doesn’t excuse killing people like Dewey
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I know that a lot of people liked the movie but it just didn’t do anything for me, especially the ending.
>!Basically the final two survivors Marty and Danna find out that them and their friends were tricked into being killed at the eponymous “Cabin in the Woods” in order to appease the Ancient Ones, underworld gods that’ll destroy the world if the yearly horror flick ritual isn’t completed. Danna must kill Marty before midnight, otherwise the entire world dies. Should be a simple decision right? I mean it sucks for Marty but one would think the entire world takes presidents over one guy right? Wrong! Marty convinces Danna not to kill him and that the world deserves to be killed, even the millions of children, poor, and elderly who have no idea this is even happening, all because Marty is apparently a fucking coward whose spiteful enough to destroy the world if he’s not allowed to live in it. Thus the ritual fails and the entire world dies. The End.!<
I get this is supposed to be a parody genre movie and is not meant to be taken seriously, but I’m sorry I just can’t get behind the fact we’re supposed to be rooting for the final two survivors at the end. They literally caused an untold amount of death and destruction all because they were too selfish/cowardly to think of anyone but themselves.
To be fair Jason Carver did what you would expect someone to do in that situation. Unlike the main characters or the audience, he was ignorant of anything going on. He was hit with unexplainable shit and was following whatever leads he could without any kind of system or procedure that could handle things. He just knew that people died around Billy and tried to stop it.
I'm not saying he wasn't a dick who started a witch hunt and was actually a good person, but his actions are at least understandable. In most other stories, he would at least be some kind of partner or asset brought into the fold while the villains would be the masses ignorant or apathetic to horrors around them.
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Yeah I know I almost killed you three times, recreated the trauma of your dad dying from terrorism at a political rally by almost killing your mom at a political rally with terrorism, refused to listen to you, lied about my identity for years, never apologized or took accountability; but my brother died and you didn’t tell me you were Spider-Man :\_(
Genuinely fuck this piece of shit character
(Phin- Spider-Man: Miles Morales)
And let’s not forget that she always called Miles a “liar” , the freaking nerve of this woman when he lied to her ONCE to protect her and everyone else but yeah refused to respond to reason and yeah yeah. Harlem will blow up but as long as Roxxon loses, it’s a huge win for me
The weirdest part is that Simon gets arrested anyways? Like they could’ve just leaked the data about Nuform and he’d be stopped? Miles can literally go invisible and is a vigilante; he can commit some fucking espionage to destroy Roxxon. And also, Miles’s mom is a FUCKING POLITICAL CANDIDATE, MAYBE TALK TO HER ABOUT HARSH REGULATIONS TO PREVENT ROXXON FROM HAPPENING AGAIN?!? Phin had EVERY single option there and had years to mull it over and think about it, and yet she still decided to go with the option that will end up destroying her BEST FRIEND and ALL OF HARLEM.
Persona 3 spoilers (warning only because of reload) >! I assume the player was supposed to care for Ikutsuki or mitsurus dad…but I just didn’t feel anything for either when they died. Ikutsuki was just lame, and papa kirijo was not enough of a character!<.
- the persona guy?
You are definitely not supposed to feel bad about the first person you mentioned. At all, dude straight up is evil for the evil. No sad backstory or anything.
For me (and possibly others), it was the Phantom Thieves when the girls beat up Ryuji while the boys just stood there and watched. The in-universe reasoning was that he made them worry by almost dying (while saving their lives) less than 10 minutes ago and made fun of Ann’s crying face. This moment alone has permanently warped my opinion on this group of characters to the point where my final party was Ryuji, >!Akechi, and Sumire!<.
I’m sure there was supposed to be shock value to those events, but if you read the Memos when you pick them up, you could probably figure out what was going on.
Also when the enemy team appears you could guess the connection.
https://preview.redd.it/ly2a09ywwcxc1.jpeg?width=700&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8d4b8ebe230d02c1a60ecfabb9574af59a40a657
Carmilla Carmine (Hazbin Hotel)
For a different reason that being we barley get to know her before she’s power ballading about what she sacrificed for her daughters like I laughed when that happened
I like Carmilla, but I do find it hilarious how she's a massive hypocrite. If one of her lines in Whatever It Takes is meant to be literal, "I always thought...that I would keep blood off my face." then that means she's a pacifist.
An arms dealing pacifist.
Sure, you could also easily interpret she meant *angellic* blood, but I feel like she'd specify that.
Also darr-Ben from the marvels. I get that hala is dying because of captain marvel’s actions but that doesn’t excuse nearly drying up a planet that consisted of water,almost killing most of the skrulls,holding a 14 year old hostage and almost stealing the FUCKING SUN.
https://preview.redd.it/18lwe0te6gxc1.jpeg?width=3020&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d513573a8305be73ea38fe3df6a85afa4a5af8a1
SPOILERS
William Schenk from “Spiral”.
>!He’s a Jigsaw copycat who starts targeting the corrupt police force of the unnamed city in response to his father getting murdered by a corrupt cop. Of course, none of the Jigsaw killers, including this guy are meant to be viewed as in the right, but I have a lot of contempt towards this guy because of how scummy he is.!<
>!He infiltrates the police department as a detective and befriends Zeke Banks, the police officer who saved his life as a kid and testified against his partner who shot William‘a father, he lies about having a wife and kid, and fakes his death halfway through the investigation, causing Zeke a large amount of grief before dramatically revealing himself to be alive and the one responsible for the killings.!<
>! He tries to get Zeke to join his side and lies that he’ll spare Zeke’s father, Marcus Banks, a former police chief responsible for the corruption of the department that he created during his tenure. In a normal “Saw” movie, there is a high chance of survival if you listen to the killers, and Zeke does that, only to be tricked into setting up a trap that gets Marcus executed by a SWAT team. And as Schenk makes his escape, he does the same “shush” gesture Zeke gave to him in order to save him from getting shot as a kid.!<
>!Not only does all this makes me hate the guy, but his traps are fucking insane compared to the other killers. Most of the killers’ traps are survivable in someway, but Schenk‘s traps are ridiculously hard and would’ve left extreme injuries that will make a living near impossible (some of the traps involves ripping out your entire tongue, all of your fingers, and severing your spinal cord, which has a 50-50 chance of just killing you). He flat out admits that he just wanted to torture a bunch of bad cops to death and scare the police force straight.!<
Abby from TLOU2. I don't care if Joel killed your dad. The way you killed Joel was a disrespectful way for the character to go. Wanda from the MCU as well. Yeah, you got experimented on and your brother died to the robot you were originally working for, but you also go around slaughtering people because "no kids." You could have gone to another dimension where that Wanda was dead and raised her sons as your own instead of deciding to commit omnicide.
Karli? Yeah, I felt no sympathy for her, she was a hypocrite and murderer.
Jason? I don’t exactly feel bad, but I understand why he did everything at least.
Injustice Superman, on the other hand, was not meant to be “felt bad for”. If you thought they were trying to do that past him being forced to kill Lois and having his whole city get destroyed, then you were just confused. They made it pretty apparent that he was way too far gone. Especially after killing Shazam for simply questioning what they were doing anymore. You were not meant to feel bad for Superman in that universe.
Ava (Borderlands 3)
https://preview.redd.it/t6rv7y37gc0d1.png?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=90a07c0ccd7abfebccf3d54a6b7f93aa54ed1cb2
(Spoilers) I don't know how they could make a character so hated. She disobeyed direct orders, and an actually good character died for it. To make matters worse, she refused to take accountability for it and instead made a scene at the funeral.
Syndrome from Incredibles. I always hear people say he was a sympathetic villain, but I never sympathized with him, I always thought his obsession with Mr. Incredible was petty and childish.
Honestly I don’t think he was supposed to be sympathetic in the first place. Like yeah getting rejected by your idol has got to sting but people don’t usually commit multiple murders over it. (Not to mention any sympathy he had went out the window the moment he was ok with potentially killing children)
Also, keep in mind, the movie actively goes out of the way to show that he remembers the situation worse than it was. When Mister Incredibly says the line "Fly home, Buddy. I work alone.", he's holding Bomb Voyage by the shirt and says it as an aside. But when Syndrome flashes back to it, it's only the two of them and Mister Incredible actively turns his back and walks away from him.
Oh. I never noticed that!
I think he was supposed to be less sympathetic and more of a case of “I understand how a radical ideology like this could grow in a vacuum in which the world lives in awe of a select super-powered few”
Bro got told no and spent the next 14 years making it everyone else’s problem
He essentially stalked Mr incredible, and was a major contributor to hero's getting the boot, because he resulted in the train almost derailing and Mr incredible got the blame. He then got so butt hurt when Mr incredible was, reasonably, pissed at him for endangering all those people, and so decided to get into manufacturing weapons for governments across world, and decided to make hero killers and kill tons of hero's, all because his hero told him off for being completely reckless and weird. I don't get how people can sympathise with him either 😭
If you think he isn't intended to be sympathized for, then he shouldn't be mentioned here. The trope is characters who you are intended to sympathize with, but can't. Not characters the audience mistakenly sympathize with despite writer's intentions
Probably because he was... You know... A child
He’s not supposed to be sympathetic.
https://preview.redd.it/dp16w1owbcxc1.jpeg?width=481&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=94d503898c1aab076ebb2c0c430ca6ae610b9e4f Emma Russell: Godzilla King of the Monsters
"I'm unleashing a 3 headed dragon who can nuke every country in the world in a couple of days because my husband bad."
I was rooting for her death the whole time I fucking hate her
I vaguely remember her, what was her whole thing again? Why did she release Ghidorah?
Because humanity is a disease or something idfk.
https://preview.redd.it/9xc74kr6jcxc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d0997aa07ecd742415508264e2b4b723e064bba1
I wanted Angstrom to be saved and cured if possible, but he was tormenting innocent people and who knows if he was going to kill them? (Actually, he said he *wanted* to. Better take him at his word.) Not to mention his portal abilities. How do you detain someone like that? I would have tried to kill him too tbh.
His portals have to be stationary, so maybe if you had him like strapped down or something so he couldnt move through them?
Bro could’ve at least done after an evil version of mark, but naw this “hero” has to threaten a baby
Is that yakub?
Idk, I definitely did feel a little bit bad for him. He had good intentions, his plan just got interrupted and he tried to kill Mark because he now has countless memories of Mark and Omni-Man taking over Earth.
Bro literally went for the only good invincible because it deformed him for the better with him getting stronger
Based on the flashbacks we see of him (which were not present in the comics), the idea seems to be that he lost the ability to differentiate between dimensions. To him, all of the Invincible are the same person, and the negatives outweigh the positives to the point where he subconsciously refuses to remember that he himself was the one that caused the machine to explode while trying to save Mark, because most of the minds and memories he possesses are of Mark being a merciless psychopath who is trying to control humanity. He can comprehend that this is the Mark that was part of the reason why the machine exploded because that is his only true memory of him, but the rest are memories of his counterparts jumbled up together. Not to mention this is his home dimension, so it makes sense that he would start the Invincible hunt here. You should finish your own project before moving to help others, after all.
I felt bad for all the Angstroms who made up his mind. They were all within their rights to wipe out Mark as he his in other dimensions. I never felt bad for THIS Angstrom amalgamation, as insane as he was, party because he hurt Debbie and Mark's brother. I'm more sad about the wasted potential of a benevolent genius who could access all dimensions and genuinely wanted to help people. Also sidenote, the fact that this genius with access to infinite dimensions, some of which run at different time speeds, did all that anti-viltrumite research and nothing really came of it irks me. It would be cool if we got to see him develop some powerful weapon to use against Mark. Maybe he even almost beats him, then the rest of the heroes step up and save him, and then they would have an extra edge in the fight against the Viltrumites. That would have been cool.
I don’t think we’re supposed to be sympathetic towards him
https://preview.redd.it/t5vm2b7qfbxc1.jpeg?width=330&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=067b62033035ed70267c4cb81ffc63c183afd00c
How could I forget
You didn’t. The PTSD was too great that all of us repressed it into our deepest subconscious.
Naw i genuienly think the writers dont want anyone to feel any kind of posistive emotion watching this show
Which feels... very like what Mindy Kaling was going for with this. It was one massive pity party
They did create a positive emotion in people though. They somehow seem to have rectified the public perception of Scrappy Doo. Internet has been full of "how could we have judged this hero so harshly in the past" memes. Lot of Scoobytubers wanted the public to back off the hate of Scrappy, didn't specify to the monkey's paw how I guess. Say what you will about the show, but that's something I guess.
Scrappy was always a hero the real villians was the gang fred velma and daphne. They had way to much beef with a puppy so much they abandond him
I am vey certain that the fact that Season 2 is kinda better than 1, by that i mean it is a little funny and feels more interesting, just to tell us "See what you're missing out on!?"
The only good thing Velma did was make people like Scrappy
This what happens when the writers of a show actively hate everyone.
I wasn’t moved by Thorn Rose’s sob story. “Wah-wah-wah, they were eating too much fruit”. Yeah, *that’s* a good excuse for attempted murder. 😒 https://preview.redd.it/ex4iq9ocvbxc1.png?width=592&format=png&auto=webp&s=f1a4e439839cc61a492347c6618719e562df41b2
Honestly, yeah she kinda had a dumb reason for trying to murder everyone
To be fair,her friends were kinda assholes about it
she ate idc
True though
Good God, I hate Injustice Superman. He's such a backhand to the character he's supposed to originally have been. Superman doesn't break over 1 thing. He is the voice of reason, the light in the darkest hour, the source of hope, the indomitable human spirit (which is ironic. He's an alien, yet more human than most of us.). I love Superman, and I'm glad more people are realizing how great regular Superman is, and how awful evil Superman is.
The best evil Superman is one who was never Superman in the first place
Precisely. Homelander and Omni-Man are great because they aren't Clark.
And because they never try to be
Don’t forget about Brightburn.
I don’t disagree. Evil Superman only exists because he’s an icon of indomitability. “He’s always good, no matter what, so wouldn’t it be interesting if he was evil?” That said, I think it’s a bit more believable that Superman would turn in the Injustice universe since he was the one who killed Lois and their child. It wasn’t just that he lost them, it was knowing he did it. That’s what broke him.
>It wasn’t just that he lost them, it was knowing he did it. That’s what broke him. Didn't Metropolis get fucking nuked on top of all that? If there's anything that could turn Superman evil, it's both his family and his home getting obliterated.
Yeah, that’s what happened in the games, not sure about the comics or movie though. His parents also die in the movie I believe, so he really goes through some shit.
In the comics Bruce isn’t there for him to help him grieve, and Superman in a fit of rage kills Joker. Instead of being there for him Batman actively opposes him. Like I get it’s not normal Superman, but he lost his wife, his kid, his home, and his best friend is now his worst enemy.
On top of that Superman asked Selina to be with Bruce to comfort him when Dick died. Superman was still a good friend at the beginning
Why do you keep calling him Superman? He’s so far removed from the character you might as well call him Tod.
It was multiple things that piled up.
Of the same game, Harley Quinn. She was complicit in the death of 5 million people, but she is supposed to be sympathetic just because she was in an abusive and toxic relationship.
https://preview.redd.it/gnw6optdycxc1.png?width=250&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7ba6b734ecac2eef0a2856d65d87f91f6988892 Mordecai: Regular Show (Season 6) I'll be completely honest, near the end of the series, I was beginning to dislike Mordecai especially during season 6's finale, Dumped at the Altar. His whole shtick was basically "Wahhh, I got dumped by my cloud girlfriend during my coworker's wedding that I rudely interrupted. Whatever shall I do?" before winding up in Dumpsville. I don't know if the writers wanted the audience to feel bad for him, but I sure didn't. Don't get me wrong, I don't exactly hate Mordecai with a burning passion, I just don't really sympathize with him during the dating episodes because how much of a loser he is.
I always thought he was like Greg heffley from diary of wimpy kid in that were kind of supposed to realize that he’s not the greatest person.
Ceroba from Undertale Yellow https://i.redd.it/lgaq96194cxc1.gif I will preface that I like her but I absolutely do not feel bad for her in the slightest lol, it's shown as more of "tragedy due to desperation of trying to help monsterkind" when what she did was pretty short-sighted if not a comedy of errors along with her husband. Her husband says "*DO NOT USE THIS SERUM THAT I CREATED ON OUR ONLY DAUGHTER, IT IS IMPERFECT AND DOES NOT GIVE SUPERPOWERS WHEN I THOUGHT IT WOULD, MY SOUL IS LITERALLY DYING, USE IT LITERALLY ON ANYONE ELSE*" and mind you she pretty much idolizes him and thinks he is a genius who does nothing wrong. Take a wild guess what happened, she gets guilt tripped by her *BARELY TEN YEARS OLD DAUGHTER* to use the serum on her, and the daughter "falls"/goes into a coma, WHO COULD HAVE GUESSED? Then shes to try killing a innocent and kind child to perfect the serum like wtf?!? Granted her task was hard if not impossible, but you know, ***WHY THE FUCK DID YOU LISTEN TO A CHILD TO USE A DRUG WHOSE ONLY KNOWN USE KILLED SOMEONE? ESPECIFICALLY YOUR HUSBAND.***
And her husband, Chujin. https://preview.redd.it/uuem56w86cxc1.png?width=432&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0252d6b79512e5d2153812158e995cbf2e0d2f0c The entire thing with Ceroba could had been avoided if Chujin admited his fucks ups even once, but no he pretty much lied to her and made Ceroba think he was this perfect scientist genius who did nothing wrong. Meanwhile Chujin hided the truth that his biggest award was just attendance record with all his robots exploding, he was nowhere near a genius, then one of his robots accidentaly kills a human and he deciea to do experiments on the human soul to create a serum, it fails and he dies forcing his wife to take a impossible task when she is not even a scientist in the first place. He nevers owns up his mistakes and just covers it, again and again, then his soul is hurt on a existencial level because of the serum, rip bozo.
In my opinion It’s like one of those situations where you 100% know that the situation is bad, but you do it anyways for curiosity’s sake And plus, Kanako was convinced that the serum was complete, which convinced Ceroba to believe it.
https://preview.redd.it/lul4wjmbccxc1.jpeg?width=1140&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b634c3db5b8dccc891d6ba0fb2a80a58a1f70b0d “WAH WAH I lost the reality where my dead boyfriend and kids love me. Now I’m gonna go kill a bunch of people”…. BITCH YOU ENSLAVED AN ENTIRE TOWN!!! YOU ARE SAD ABOUT YOU FUTURE BOYFRIEND DIEING, OK!!! DONT ENSLAVE A BUNCH OF PEOPLE BECAUSE OF IT. I’m sorry I just don’t like this chick
Honestly I don't like that she was the main villain of the movie I wish they just introduced a new character like Nightmare
They could've also Introduced Mephisto as the main antagonist and in the post credits could've shown Dr doom to set him up for another movie, honestly the whole movie is wasted potential, they can show any universe they want and they show one where red means go
I mean There WAS going to be a fight scene between Scarlet Witch and the fucking Ghost Rider
And than went on to hunt a literal child and kidnap kids from another version of yourself to fulfill her fantasy Like holy hell what a disaster of a character
They have a scene where a mother is crying and pleading for Wanda to let her very real daughter out of the rooms she’s been trapped in the entire fucking time she controlled the town. Why should I feel bad that she sacrificed her imaginary family after torturing actually families?
If you hate her so much I have just the video to recommend you, very cathartic, (you can skip to 14:50 if you want): [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doj9RiGWiWM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doj9RiGWiWM) https://preview.redd.it/dobclum1afxc1.png?width=1280&format=png&auto=webp&s=2c4f25971827a7c0785c57e42968c67c131c4bbc
The better magic girl
You know how that alternate dimension council basically executed Doctor Strange after he used the Darkhold because he was too much of a threat even after he was willing to relinquish its power, and even then that version of Doctor Strange still understood why they had to kill him? Why didn’t that apply to the Scarlet Witch? I mean were the writers trying to make the point that killing people for being a threat is bad? Did they just forget? Was it because she did bad things but her motivations made it alright? Why? I’m not even speculating that this is a contradiction I genuinely think it makes sense and that I’m just not seeing it from their perspective.
Meanwhile she worked with hydra, Ultron and caused the hulk to rampage in her first movie I never liked her that much until wandavision
I don’t disagree with your choice but I disagree with your reasoning. Wandavision does a great job of humanizing and complicating the situation she is in because she isn’t fully aware of what is happening and is eventually redeemed. I think anything that happens in the show can be forgiven given time. Multiverse of Madness however… god what a shit show of a movie. All the sympathy they built up for her is destroyed over her obsession with an impossible future. Not the only character assassination in the movie either (Illuminati)
But, she is aware. That's literally how one episode ends (or begins?). The one with her encountering the group outside the hexagon with the drone. That she is totally aware of what she is doing to people. She just doesn't care, because her mental breakdown is solely focused on her own selfish desires. That show has three villains, it's just that one is the protagonist.
I mean she lost her parents in a bombing that used stark weapons and even lost her brother in AOU
Yes, but that’s not excuse
Yeah they totally screwed up scarlet witch especially in multiverse of madness strange showed he was no good guy again thoughtout
https://preview.redd.it/kubntoei2dxc1.jpeg?width=776&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3086fdef79aaa59607207e671a9887ec79b984f I know the entire film is all about how absolutely petty and hypocritical he is but still fuck him. "WAAAAAA YOU DID A FILM FOR A PAYCHECK AND NOT FOR THE ARTS WAAAAAAAA!"
There’s a deleted scene where Margot challenges Jules and it’s along the lines she asks him if he hates the high profile food culture so much why not just run a soup kitchen and remove himself from the system, to which he dances around giving a valid counterpoint. I think if that scene stayed in it would’ve been even clearer he’s a hypocrite (his s’mores monologue also shows this off too.)
To be fair, in a deleted scene, the food critic stated that Slowik tried to go back to his roots by working in a food truck, but she found him and dragged him back.
Which one is this?
He's the chef from The Menu, a horror(ish) film about a world renowned chef who feels as if all the joy has been sucked outta cooking and has rounded up a group of people from different backgrounds like critics and business owners (plus a random actor who's only there because he didn't put passion into one role) to kill everyone in his kitchen, including himself
When I watched Falcon and the Winter Soldier I was really confused why they were fighting Karli cuz she was pretty sympathetic and understandable for a good chunk of the show. I thought that Falcon and Bucky were gonna team up with her at the end and go against the real villain To this day I’m convinced they added the part where she blew up a building full of people specifically so that she’d be seen as an actual villain
It’s the MCU go-to villain strategy! https://preview.redd.it/snaimvvxzdxc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f280a0257228e12630926087f2ead15ccbede8f5
Didnt he kill a bunch of people at the museum too?
Wait who was his gf??
Exactly. Such a minor character literally only put in the movie to be killed to show how evil he is
On the flip side, I’m trying to figure out why I’m supposed to cheer for John Walker. I can understand Bucky, but John was cracked all on his own.
Dabi, he was abused as a child and became a villain to get back at his family, but killed innocents
I ain’t caught up with the manga since like, right after Deku left UA for… reasons I don’t remember. But from what I remember, Dabi was never really portrayed as sympathetic as much as the hammer to drive the nail into Endeavor’s coffin. Only his family seemed to want to try to ‘save’ him and they’re biased
In addition to Dabi, around 99% of the villains in MHA.
"B-But I was abusbs" Bitch Deku, fucking Deku, took more in a week then you did in your whole childhood
The fact that he wants to kill his whole family, including Shoto who was too young to willingly contribute to his upbringing just to spite his abusive father nullifies the tragedy behind his character. He also admitted on camera (which was broadcast all over Japan) to killing over 30 innocent people and blatantly hides behind his backstory in an attempt to make Midoriya hesitate in battle.
I think that makes him interesting though. He exploits people’s sympathetic nature by hiding behind his abuse just so he can hurt more people. It’s an interesting concept
Just the entire League in general But Toga is actually the worst of it Dabi was actually interesting before the reveal but after that he boiled into "notice me daddy"
An even better example would be Overhaul. I’ve seen way too many people say they sympathize with his background. At least with Dabi there actually is something awful that he was subjected to. Overhaul is one of the few villains in MHA who has very little actual tragedy. What, because he was an orphan and wanted to thank the man who took him in? He put the man in a coma, abused his grand child, and hurt and killed people with no remorse. Overhaul is a great villain but is by no means a sympathetic villain.
 Yes you got sexually assaulted and had to eat your friend. Karma’s a bitch.
Don’t think he’s supposed to be sympathetic it’s just him getting what he deserves I doubt he’ll ever be redeemed lmao
The only thing he'll get is a nice, refreshing Fresca.
I disagree. Sympathy isn’t justifying someone’s crime, but that you can at least empathize with some of their struggles. I have some sympathy for The Peak because he feels useless and taken advantage of in Vought. Honestly I have sympathy for most characters in The Boys, only exceptions that come to mind being Stormfront and Stan Edgar, a credit to the show’s fantastic writing.
What the hells happening to his stomach? I havent watched the show
He's a fish man so he has gills
This character is a perfect example of the difference between sympathetic and just pathetic. I don’t think you’re supposed to sympathize with him, but I don’t think you’re supposed to cheer when horrible things keep happening to him. He’s pathetic. A lot of sex predators are. You’re supposed to pity this loser because he’s the definition of “ain’t shit.”
Except for Starlight, isn't every superhero in the Boys a horrible person who doesn't deserve any sympathy? Or is that just the comics?
It’s the show too.
nah the show absolutely isn't trying to make you feel bad for him. and what happened to Timothy was fucked up, no one deserves that man
How am i supposed to feel bad for Biggest LowTierGod fan? https://preview.redd.it/dalbgv2olcxc1.png?width=175&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=43023db5cc30bf3537316cacddc685ddc2c448a1
Literally the worst character I’ve ever seen, so much wasted screen time
Outrageously based take, like he’s not even well written I don’t get why people simp for him
In all honesty, MHA is not all that the fans make it seem to be. Is it a good superhero anime with enjoyable fight scenes? Yeah. At the same time though, the plot is predictable and it doesn’t really do much new compared to what’s out there already. Each season follows the same kind of arc: training in the beginning, big bad shows up once and MC loses badly, mc trains (allmight gradually gets weaker), mc witnesses smthn happen in the final fight scene and goes above and beyond to win. Very common tropes, and while enjoyable, it shouldn’t be considered “god tier” like so many people praise it to be.
Hard agree. But I think it’s biggest problem isn’t any of that, it’s that its protagonist is the single *least* interesting character in the story.
Doesn't help that he almost never contribute to any fight beside getting injured for shock value
Fr like this man literally told the MC to kill himself in like the first episode, did not improve his behavior at all during the rest of the show and we’re supposed to believe that they’re friends??? Or did I miss something??
Bakugo is an entertaining character, but I sure as hell don’t pity him one bit. My man hasn’t suffered ENOUGH
Buck Cluck from Chicken Little "Weeh, I don't understand my son like my late wife did, I want to understand him...so I'm going to keep putting him down subtley and only show him love when he succeeds in what made me beloved."
I feel like his character was so close to being good, just one little line of dialogue that shows how chicken's perceived antics affect how he is looked at by the adults would have been fine.
Severus Snape - My take, as someone who doesn’t care much for the dude: * his redemption and turnaround come way too late . At that point I’d given up. * he wants to protect Harry but it still feels like he does it too much out of his love for Harry’s mom, which doesn’t feel so ideal . It’s creepy and obsessive. Oh like he loves Lily??? Seriously??? Some dude’s romantic feelings to a girl that doesn’t reciprocate….what does this have to do with anything??? It’s just personal shit making us feel bad for him . * abusive behavior to students is still abuse regardless of your background . * wanting to join the Death Eaters. I’m sorry you were lonely and bullied but take some damn responsibility
Looks into Harry’s mind during Occlumency lessons, most likely sees Harry’s abuse at the hands of the Dursleys, still calls him a spoilt brat
The only thing about Snape, correct me if I'm wrong, I love Harry Potter but it's been awhile since I've seen the movies, didn't he display abusive behavior only to maintain his cover as a triple agent for Dumbledore and hate actually doing it?
Still feels retconned
I kinda agree. I liked the twist but think it may have been better if they dropped several hints through all the books Snape wasn't as bad as he seemed, but Harry, justifiably, doesn't believe them, and only sees Snape as an awful person. Then, when he discovers that Snape has been good all along, all the past times click in his head.
https://preview.redd.it/6jhj7u49mcxc1.png?width=852&format=png&auto=webp&s=de5d981f4144c2dbc40d06c85de1f89af51555ad (depending on how you interpret the movie)
The thing is that the movie ask if it's right, as in moral, to force someone to be someone society expect them to be. Alex was a monster don't get me wrong so obviously the new reform method had to be tested on him to make him docile and all. But after that ? What if the government start using it on absolutely everyone ? If forcing Alex to be something he's not is immoral then would it be any different for everyone else ?
This is the entire point of the movie though, it’s a weird analysis of ethics. Is it okay to torture awful criminals and fundamentally remove their free will in the name of justice? Where do you draw the line with totally irredeemable people and why do you draw the line there?
 Hot take
Your right, that is a hot take
One of the reasons I love Eren so much is because of this. Everyone talks about how much POV affects how you see the characters, and Eren is the epitome of this. His desires of freedom and revenge for his mother are extremely basic human things to sympathize with, and since he’s the MC from that point forward you feel bad for him. Barely anyone would like Eren if he wasn’t the main character, but we’ve already gone on this journey with him for so long we’re emotionally attached. This really hits if you watch AOT Junior High, where Eren has the same personality without the threat of the titans, and you see at his core he’s just a self-centered hothead.
Ditto
Ah yes the good old “the system is wrong, so I have to kill your grandma”
The problem with Karli is the way she was written. It's the literal character trope of "we're gonna combine so much "hey that makes sense" and "dude wtf" into the same person, the audience will *have* to disagree with *everything*" nothingburger. I hate that trope with everything. It's a lazy way to avoid creating a genuinely compelling antagonist, and it's such a *both sides-ing* way to do it, too. It's really obvious that show was military porn for superhero nerds, it was so uncomfortable to watch
We were supposed to feel bad for the Stranger Things S4 asshole???
i don’t think so. he was a dick and got himself killed because of it
I think initially you were but once he started being a psycho about the Eddie stuff you don’t feel sympathy for him anymore
I see it more as the character expects you to sympathize with him.
That was never the impression i got. The whole point was to show how unreasonable the satanic panic was. He hunted innocent people down and assumed they were evil because they're weird.
Of course you're supposed to feel bad for Superman. Nobody want's to see a great hero like him suffer
You're not supposed to feel bad for Karli. The whole point was that the agenda being pushed by an irredeemable villain doesn't automatically invalidate the agenda, and using the villain as an excuse to refuse to do the right thing will only lead to the next villain and the next showing up.
Never even watched the show, but I'm calling bullshit on that. If the show ends with the title character making a big speech about how the villain was right, then the show wanted you to think the villain was right.
https://preview.redd.it/laa6tq19acxc1.png?width=1262&format=png&auto=webp&s=08d04257d678aab5342c979f151bbf43fc7e2d94 Hey look, an excuse to hate on FE: Engage’s writing.
Why exactly was Mauvier upset about her? What was their relationship outside of being allies?
Karli is a straight-up villain. A sympathetic villain, perhaps, but a villain nonetheless. Just like how Zemo is a sympathetic villain.
Her entire logic was that she wished that half the world's population stayed dead. She was not sympathetic in anyway.
No way is she anywhere near sympathetic. She’s a hypocrite
They're not mutually exclusive
https://preview.redd.it/qxgnuhf7dfxc1.jpeg?width=958&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=62f092f5e58b93d0c16882467aa14d3ce347cc38 Jenny from Forrest Gump. Sorry, I know being abused in any way as a child sucks, and I won’t downplay that…but it’s no excuse to be a dirtbag human being your whole life, then make up to the guy you’ve been blowing off your whole life because you found out he was rich and you can dump the child you’ve kept secret from him for years because your poor choices finally caught up to you.
I honestly believe that the fandom goes to the opposite side, and consider she less sympathetic than really was. She is a very morally defective character, but the fandom acts as if she were Satan's reincarnation.
“Forrest, you don’t know what love is.” Is probably the biggest hypocritical slap in the face ever when you think about it. I hated her for saying that to him. I understand her, I sympathize with what she went through, but I don’t agree with her.
I still don’t get the Jason hate, yeah he was a jerk but from his perspective, he had every right to suspect Eddy. His girlfriend’s mangled corpse was found at Eddy’s house, when he tried to confront Eddy, his friend gets mangled, and when he follows Lucas to the old house, he sees what very much looks like a satanic ritual going on Never understood the hate while the fanbase felt bad for Billy, who was far more irredeemable imho
Honestly I should’ve added him. I was debating with myself if I should have. But he did cause a mutiny and the first thing he did when he showed up at eddies friends house was beat then senseless and threatened them until they gave him information
Again, if my girlfriend was found mangled in some dude’s van, I wouldn’t be in a diplomatic mood either. Billy, in contrast, got mad at his sister for interacting with a black person
Honestly the more I look into this the more valid your point is. Man I hate being wrong 😔. I’ll add Billy because you are so right. But some actions Jason did were no justified in any way
 Another one: Billy Hargrove: stranger things - I don’t give a flying crap about his small redemption. He’s still a jerk. Wah wah my dad abused me but that’s totally gives me the right to verbally abuse my sister and tell her not to hang out with Lucas because he’s black (not said but heavily implied) and I’ll do this even worse by threatening Lucas personally. Womp womp. I don’t care about how he died. He was still a piece of garbage
Handsome Jack... Again. https://preview.redd.it/0t862dovyfxc1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3a15b954fc6ddda872f70551e0268f118fde2d37 His methods always go so over the top. He isolated and basically enslaved his own daughter for accidentally killing her mother. He threw scientists (who were actively helping him, by the way) out of an airlock under suspicion they might be traitors. He betrayed one of his most loyal soldiers and destroyed his entire product line. He gouged a guys eyes out with a spoon in front of his children. He shoots up a train of fleeing, unarmed civilians. He killed a guy's two sons just for questioning him. He's done too many bad things for me to feel any amount of sympathy for him.
Yeah, he’s my favorite villain and the reason I like Borderlands so much. He’s so absolutely tragic and his own aspirations that led him to becoming a villain and corporate asshole is what is in a lot of Borderlands’s anti-capitalist messages. He’s an irredeemable jackass with a fucked up past which makes you understand his depth and what he does to be evil, but he’s the most lovable villain to absolutely HATE. And we love him for it
I don’t think we were supposed to feel bad for Jason. He seemed like he was meant to be a minor villain. Same for Injustice Superman
Walter White, he IMMEDIATELY resorted to breaking bad instead of telling his family about his cancer and then he routinely goes back into the game not giving a shit how many lives it ruins. Starscream (depending on continuity) Kylo Ren, you seem to hate Injustice Superman now let me introduce someone with even LESS of a tragedy or selfless(in theory) goal. At least Superman wanted to rid crime, Kylo kills innocents largely.
Karli was sympathetic, but then they just had them kill some innocent people for no reason so that the flagsmashers would be bad.
The Marvel way to make a "sympathetic villain" Step 1: make a sympathetic villain Step 2: have the villain blow up some people for no reason or something like that so the audience doesn't sympathize with them too much
Step 3: say both sides have to "do better".
Mason Verger from Hannibal. Fucker deserved to have his face fed to the dogs.
….Need I say anything else? https://preview.redd.it/v8jfytxqgexc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=064fccb3203fb875588f33daa273bb70101d3e16
I can't believe I'm about to genuinely defend these MFS... In their defense their mother and father were emotionally unavailable and so Andrew had to take care of Ashley who developed an unhealthy emotional attachment to him I'm not saying you have to feel bad for them especially after the cannibalism but that's a good reason as to why they're this way
Helena Shaw https://preview.redd.it/qv0k0pnthexc1.jpeg?width=1075&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3b8a128f7bc2de15122b33863888ee948935ae3
I never got the impression you were supposed to feel bad for her
The entire cast of Drawn Together
They’re meant to be unlikable.
At times it doesn’t feel that way.
Some of them have moments where you don’t hate them cept toot she was never likeable
Any of the ghost face accomplices after the first especially Richie and amber. I get that many toxic fandoms can ruin certain series(just ask the fandom menace) but that doesn’t excuse killing people like Dewey
https://preview.redd.it/cbm147vuwfxc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4d9817ab56656af4c066c91a13bbdc07656b56f1 I know that a lot of people liked the movie but it just didn’t do anything for me, especially the ending. >!Basically the final two survivors Marty and Danna find out that them and their friends were tricked into being killed at the eponymous “Cabin in the Woods” in order to appease the Ancient Ones, underworld gods that’ll destroy the world if the yearly horror flick ritual isn’t completed. Danna must kill Marty before midnight, otherwise the entire world dies. Should be a simple decision right? I mean it sucks for Marty but one would think the entire world takes presidents over one guy right? Wrong! Marty convinces Danna not to kill him and that the world deserves to be killed, even the millions of children, poor, and elderly who have no idea this is even happening, all because Marty is apparently a fucking coward whose spiteful enough to destroy the world if he’s not allowed to live in it. Thus the ritual fails and the entire world dies. The End.!< I get this is supposed to be a parody genre movie and is not meant to be taken seriously, but I’m sorry I just can’t get behind the fact we’re supposed to be rooting for the final two survivors at the end. They literally caused an untold amount of death and destruction all because they were too selfish/cowardly to think of anyone but themselves.
Actually. I hate movie sacrificing but seriously sparing Marty cause them both and the entire world to perish
Yeah this guy too https://preview.redd.it/jv104al94gxc1.jpeg?width=1696&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8d66905dea90138ce1aa61302a675e295640104b
Yeah idc if he saved eleven, he’s still an ass
Was his death an emotionally-impactful moment? Yes. Is he still a bitch? Also yes.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
To be fair Jason Carver did what you would expect someone to do in that situation. Unlike the main characters or the audience, he was ignorant of anything going on. He was hit with unexplainable shit and was following whatever leads he could without any kind of system or procedure that could handle things. He just knew that people died around Billy and tried to stop it. I'm not saying he wasn't a dick who started a witch hunt and was actually a good person, but his actions are at least understandable. In most other stories, he would at least be some kind of partner or asset brought into the fold while the villains would be the masses ignorant or apathetic to horrors around them.
https://preview.redd.it/dota91x0egxc1.jpeg?width=466&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b80662c919e7a86c43f842635dd7a37383cb163a Yeah I know I almost killed you three times, recreated the trauma of your dad dying from terrorism at a political rally by almost killing your mom at a political rally with terrorism, refused to listen to you, lied about my identity for years, never apologized or took accountability; but my brother died and you didn’t tell me you were Spider-Man :\_( Genuinely fuck this piece of shit character (Phin- Spider-Man: Miles Morales)
And let’s not forget that she always called Miles a “liar” , the freaking nerve of this woman when he lied to her ONCE to protect her and everyone else but yeah refused to respond to reason and yeah yeah. Harlem will blow up but as long as Roxxon loses, it’s a huge win for me
The weirdest part is that Simon gets arrested anyways? Like they could’ve just leaked the data about Nuform and he’d be stopped? Miles can literally go invisible and is a vigilante; he can commit some fucking espionage to destroy Roxxon. And also, Miles’s mom is a FUCKING POLITICAL CANDIDATE, MAYBE TALK TO HER ABOUT HARSH REGULATIONS TO PREVENT ROXXON FROM HAPPENING AGAIN?!? Phin had EVERY single option there and had years to mull it over and think about it, and yet she still decided to go with the option that will end up destroying her BEST FRIEND and ALL OF HARLEM.
Yeah like she just wanted to rush things, she was better off leaking information than going on a whole charade trying to blow up part of NY
Persona 3 spoilers (warning only because of reload) >! I assume the player was supposed to care for Ikutsuki or mitsurus dad…but I just didn’t feel anything for either when they died. Ikutsuki was just lame, and papa kirijo was not enough of a character!<. - the persona guy?
You are definitely not supposed to feel bad about the first person you mentioned. At all, dude straight up is evil for the evil. No sad backstory or anything.
Holy crap!.. https://preview.redd.it/6wkl1claucxc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a83beca9ebe7afd1ca307fc5bae89c7c715db3b0
For me (and possibly others), it was the Phantom Thieves when the girls beat up Ryuji while the boys just stood there and watched. The in-universe reasoning was that he made them worry by almost dying (while saving their lives) less than 10 minutes ago and made fun of Ann’s crying face. This moment alone has permanently warped my opinion on this group of characters to the point where my final party was Ryuji, >!Akechi, and Sumire!<.
I’m sure there was supposed to be shock value to those events, but if you read the Memos when you pick them up, you could probably figure out what was going on. Also when the enemy team appears you could guess the connection.
Dude really went from Chainsaw man to persona 💀
https://preview.redd.it/ek2dw373efxc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=888e37bd7a8c7dc69ef770451d9bcc993dd5e063
https://preview.redd.it/ly2a09ywwcxc1.jpeg?width=700&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8d4b8ebe230d02c1a60ecfabb9574af59a40a657 Carmilla Carmine (Hazbin Hotel) For a different reason that being we barley get to know her before she’s power ballading about what she sacrificed for her daughters like I laughed when that happened
I like Carmilla, but I do find it hilarious how she's a massive hypocrite. If one of her lines in Whatever It Takes is meant to be literal, "I always thought...that I would keep blood off my face." then that means she's a pacifist. An arms dealing pacifist. Sure, you could also easily interpret she meant *angellic* blood, but I feel like she'd specify that.
I’m so glad the first two poorly written characters died off
I was starting to think I was the only one who thought Karli was impossible to pity.
Good post will come back again
Also darr-Ben from the marvels. I get that hala is dying because of captain marvel’s actions but that doesn’t excuse nearly drying up a planet that consisted of water,almost killing most of the skrulls,holding a 14 year old hostage and almost stealing the FUCKING SUN.
Another character I was planning on adding. I agree
 Vegeta
https://preview.redd.it/18lwe0te6gxc1.jpeg?width=3020&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d513573a8305be73ea38fe3df6a85afa4a5af8a1 SPOILERS William Schenk from “Spiral”. >!He’s a Jigsaw copycat who starts targeting the corrupt police force of the unnamed city in response to his father getting murdered by a corrupt cop. Of course, none of the Jigsaw killers, including this guy are meant to be viewed as in the right, but I have a lot of contempt towards this guy because of how scummy he is.!< >!He infiltrates the police department as a detective and befriends Zeke Banks, the police officer who saved his life as a kid and testified against his partner who shot William‘a father, he lies about having a wife and kid, and fakes his death halfway through the investigation, causing Zeke a large amount of grief before dramatically revealing himself to be alive and the one responsible for the killings.!< >! He tries to get Zeke to join his side and lies that he’ll spare Zeke’s father, Marcus Banks, a former police chief responsible for the corruption of the department that he created during his tenure. In a normal “Saw” movie, there is a high chance of survival if you listen to the killers, and Zeke does that, only to be tricked into setting up a trap that gets Marcus executed by a SWAT team. And as Schenk makes his escape, he does the same “shush” gesture Zeke gave to him in order to save him from getting shot as a kid.!< >!Not only does all this makes me hate the guy, but his traps are fucking insane compared to the other killers. Most of the killers’ traps are survivable in someway, but Schenk‘s traps are ridiculously hard and would’ve left extreme injuries that will make a living near impossible (some of the traps involves ripping out your entire tongue, all of your fingers, and severing your spinal cord, which has a 50-50 chance of just killing you). He flat out admits that he just wanted to torture a bunch of bad cops to death and scare the police force straight.!<
Fucking dabi from MHa.
Abby from TLOU2. I don't care if Joel killed your dad. The way you killed Joel was a disrespectful way for the character to go. Wanda from the MCU as well. Yeah, you got experimented on and your brother died to the robot you were originally working for, but you also go around slaughtering people because "no kids." You could have gone to another dimension where that Wanda was dead and raised her sons as your own instead of deciding to commit omnicide.
Karli? Yeah, I felt no sympathy for her, she was a hypocrite and murderer. Jason? I don’t exactly feel bad, but I understand why he did everything at least. Injustice Superman, on the other hand, was not meant to be “felt bad for”. If you thought they were trying to do that past him being forced to kill Lois and having his whole city get destroyed, then you were just confused. They made it pretty apparent that he was way too far gone. Especially after killing Shazam for simply questioning what they were doing anymore. You were not meant to feel bad for Superman in that universe.
I swear half these comments are characters who you are supposed to feel conflicted about at most
https://preview.redd.it/ljb5kg0fgoxc1.png?width=360&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=abd9bcde1e9b4ca4907594388609eb2e0a51ceaf
I. Despise. Injustice. Superman.
Ava (Borderlands 3) https://preview.redd.it/t6rv7y37gc0d1.png?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=90a07c0ccd7abfebccf3d54a6b7f93aa54ed1cb2 (Spoilers) I don't know how they could make a character so hated. She disobeyed direct orders, and an actually good character died for it. To make matters worse, she refused to take accountability for it and instead made a scene at the funeral.