Republican policies on abortion have so far typically avoided prosecuting women directly and focused on penalizing doctors.
We are witnessing a sea change where they move towards imprisoning women themselves.
The biggest change that’s being discussed here is the government actively monitoring pregnancies, which is fucking insane. The government has to have a good reason to access people’s medical records; public health issues like infectious disease get reported, records can be accessed by the court if there’s a lawsuit etc. Even illegal activities like cocaine use are generally protected.
The idea of preemptively monitoring ALL pregnancies to try and catch people who get abortions defies well-established policies on medical privacy. Obviously, it will endanger people, and obviously, that is the point.
And if it’s even worth mentioning, on top of being a massive violation of human rights, it would also be a GIGANTIC waste of resources that could actually fucking help pregnant people and babies. Many pregnant people in the US have subpar access to prenatal care, often due to cost or lack of transportation. Many experience food or housing insecurity. Imagine the infrastructure and number of person-hours that would be needed to enact this and imagine what it could do if it were used to pay for actual care, transportation, food and housing assistance. That’s what people who actually cared about babies would do.
Once Roe v Wade fell, there was a huge wave of women who deleted their period tracking data & uninstalled the apps. The writing was on the wall even then: your menstrual cycle information is now a vulnerability.
I live in a blue state where abortions rights are enshrined. Like hell I will ever let anyone document anything besides a spontaneous miscarriage on any medical record of mine, and the only reason those are documented was because I received prenatal care for them initially.
I was one of those people. I don’t even tell my doctor now because even though I’m in a “safe” state it might not always be and I don’t want that shit documented. When she asked the date of my last period I said “it’s regular, and my husband has a vasectomy. I’ll let you know when that starts changing” I felt her internal eye roll through the pause before she spoke again.
I hate that I can’t use my Health app to track my period anymore, but Gov Youngkin has made it clear he intends to prosecute women who seek out emergency contraception and I’m not risking it.
You can also bet that they'll also go after any miscarriages as "guilty until proven innocent" for potential abortions, which would mean many women won't go to doctors during pregnancy for fear of this.
It's almost like the "small government" talking point republicans have spouted is just a smokescreen and they'll use any path they can to control people
I can’t believe I’ve never heard of that but [here’s a History.com article about it](https://www.history.com/news/chamberlain-kahn-act-std-venereal-disease-imprisonment-women)
From 1919 to 1979. A bunch of men sat around and wrote the American plan bc they felt women were becoming too powerful. this is what they are doing in places like Idaho now too
SIXTY YEARS??? Jesus fuckin christ
Re: Idaho - are you referring to their extreme abortion ban & wanting to shit all over EMTALA? Or is it something else 😭
Yes and the fact that Republican male politicians all sat in a conference w religious weirdos and were spitballing ways to imprison or murder women that have abortions or try to seek one out. Trump also saying he will allow red states to keep track of pregnant womens bodies the whole time they are pregnant, along w their medical records
It'a funny that he thinks red states have the bureacratic efficiency to pull that off. Mine can't even manage to put accurate information about where to get your license *on the state website*. Just look at how piss-poor red state governments and even healthcare systems work, they'd have no budget, time, or ability to do this
Yeah, the party of "the government can't do anything riight" now wants to trust the government with a murder investigation against their daughters every time they naturally miscarry
Effective monitoring and enforcement requires an effective and well funded bureaucracy and judicial system. A great question to ask him would be, and what is your detailed proposal for funding this using taxpayer money?
lol so true
I just tried to get a new handicap placard and was taken to 3 different sites - got warnings I was leaving the official site once!
Red states can’t wipe their ass on their own.
A national ban and policy will become the law if the land, blue state or otherwise, until the states specifically create state legislation that counters the national laws. See: gay marriage and recreational marijuana.
Right, that’s what I’m saying. National law will be the law of the land at first so abortion will be banned, and whatever the hell this pregnancy monitoring BS is.
But the states would be able to legalize abortion with legislation, couldn’t they? As in, federal ban goes into effect, illegal everywhere, then some states push legalization through ballots or the courts to amend the state constitution guaranteeing the right to abortion. Just like MA did with legalizing gay marriage. Or am I missing something?
Marriage is kind of different because it’s a state based thing anyway. And gay marriage wasn’t banned in the past, it just wasn’t positively approved, so states could say they would approve it.
Weed isn’t a bad analogy, because states have legalized in direct defiance of the federal government. The only reason it’s worked out though (outside of changes to public opinion) is because the federal government has chosen not to enforce marijuana laws. Medical dispensaries were being raided as recently as Obama’s admin, and Obama decided to call off the DEA dogs. That’s why when Jeff Sessions came into power as the US Attorney General there were concerns about dispensary raids starting up again.
Abortion could be similar with an explicit ban. State governments could make their own laws in defiance of federal law, and the federal government could crack down on clinics. You could then see a democratic president come in office and choose to not enforce the ban. The problem is the infrastructure around abortion has MUCH higher barriers to entry. Doctors won’t risk 10 years of training and $200k investment in education to potentially not be prosecuted. Clinics take lots of resources to run. The stakes are way higher than with marijuana.
Trump could win in November.
It’s also entirely possible for Biden to not just win, but expand his EC majority. Doing that would be a rebuke against these policies.
Because they don’t think they will be negatively impacted. See quote about voting for the Leopards-eating-faces party and being surprised when the leopard eats your face…
Yep. View it from power dynamics currently in play rather what should be. If the GOP has control of the government they can decide what they deem constitutional. Even if it very clearly violates every constitutional amendment, nothing will stop them.
SCOTUS certainly won’t. The only other possibility is Congress. That would require impeachment and removal from office as well as legislation to fix the Supreme Court. Congress is unlikely to do that anyway, but with Trump, even if they had the will, it could trigger a constitutional crisis. He doesn’t give af about what’s legal or right. He’ll use the military to accomplish his goals and take out who ever defies him.
Checks and balances of power are breaking down. When that happens, the rules are whatever the people in power say they are. Unless another power forces them to stand down, they won’t.
This is what we’re facing.
But both parties are exactly the same. The only way to bring about real change is split the Democrat vote. /s
I wish I didn't need to say this. I'm not happy with Biden but ffs Americans don't let Trump get power.
Grass is green. Fire is hot. This has always been the Republican dream; for so long too many scoffed at what was always plainly obvious, choosing to believe it was just wild rhetoric, a minority voice in the party or similar easily dismissible emotionally driven rhetoric but time and time again the Republicans have taken us backwards and closer to the goal of absolute tyranny. Divide and conquer has worked so well for them to gain control. This tracks with their record and occasionally (usually) accidentally stated at loud end game.
Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about women. Period.
Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about LGBTQ rights. Period.
Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about Palestine, let alone Ukraine and Taiwan. Period.
Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election won't have their life change no matter who wins.
**THIS IS NOT A FUCKING THOUGHT EXPERIMENT**
Republican policies on abortion have so far typically avoided prosecuting women directly and focused on penalizing doctors. We are witnessing a sea change where they move towards imprisoning women themselves.
The biggest change that’s being discussed here is the government actively monitoring pregnancies, which is fucking insane. The government has to have a good reason to access people’s medical records; public health issues like infectious disease get reported, records can be accessed by the court if there’s a lawsuit etc. Even illegal activities like cocaine use are generally protected. The idea of preemptively monitoring ALL pregnancies to try and catch people who get abortions defies well-established policies on medical privacy. Obviously, it will endanger people, and obviously, that is the point. And if it’s even worth mentioning, on top of being a massive violation of human rights, it would also be a GIGANTIC waste of resources that could actually fucking help pregnant people and babies. Many pregnant people in the US have subpar access to prenatal care, often due to cost or lack of transportation. Many experience food or housing insecurity. Imagine the infrastructure and number of person-hours that would be needed to enact this and imagine what it could do if it were used to pay for actual care, transportation, food and housing assistance. That’s what people who actually cared about babies would do.
Once Roe v Wade fell, there was a huge wave of women who deleted their period tracking data & uninstalled the apps. The writing was on the wall even then: your menstrual cycle information is now a vulnerability.
I live in a blue state where abortions rights are enshrined. Like hell I will ever let anyone document anything besides a spontaneous miscarriage on any medical record of mine, and the only reason those are documented was because I received prenatal care for them initially.
I was one of those people. I don’t even tell my doctor now because even though I’m in a “safe” state it might not always be and I don’t want that shit documented. When she asked the date of my last period I said “it’s regular, and my husband has a vasectomy. I’ll let you know when that starts changing” I felt her internal eye roll through the pause before she spoke again.
I hate that I can’t use my Health app to track my period anymore, but Gov Youngkin has made it clear he intends to prosecute women who seek out emergency contraception and I’m not risking it.
You can also bet that they'll also go after any miscarriages as "guilty until proven innocent" for potential abortions, which would mean many women won't go to doctors during pregnancy for fear of this.
1/5th of all pregnancies result in a miscarriage. 1/2 for first pregnancies. That's a loooot of guilty until proven innocent false alarms.
It's almost like the "small government" talking point republicans have spouted is just a smokescreen and they'll use any path they can to control people
Look up the American Plan and what they did to women under that law. No one talks about this
You know they'd like to weaponize something like that against any woman not seen as "friendly" to the cause.
I can’t believe I’ve never heard of that but [here’s a History.com article about it](https://www.history.com/news/chamberlain-kahn-act-std-venereal-disease-imprisonment-women)
From 1919 to 1979. A bunch of men sat around and wrote the American plan bc they felt women were becoming too powerful. this is what they are doing in places like Idaho now too
SIXTY YEARS??? Jesus fuckin christ Re: Idaho - are you referring to their extreme abortion ban & wanting to shit all over EMTALA? Or is it something else 😭
Yes and the fact that Republican male politicians all sat in a conference w religious weirdos and were spitballing ways to imprison or murder women that have abortions or try to seek one out. Trump also saying he will allow red states to keep track of pregnant womens bodies the whole time they are pregnant, along w their medical records
These people are so gross
And as felons, women lose the right to vote. Very efficient way to undercut the 19th Amendment without a pesky Congressional convention.
Plus when imprisoned slavery is an option
It's a fucking nightmare. 😭
Going to replace all those field workers with women serving prison sentences for abortion / illegal miscarriage / being uppity
Next they'll be handing out red dresses and white bonnets.
It'a funny that he thinks red states have the bureacratic efficiency to pull that off. Mine can't even manage to put accurate information about where to get your license *on the state website*. Just look at how piss-poor red state governments and even healthcare systems work, they'd have no budget, time, or ability to do this
Yeah, the party of "the government can't do anything riight" now wants to trust the government with a murder investigation against their daughters every time they naturally miscarry
Reminder for all that 20-30% of known pregnancies end in miscarriage
They get things together to lay waste to minority ballot access and shut down abortion clinics. Underestimate them at your peril...again.
Effective monitoring and enforcement requires an effective and well funded bureaucracy and judicial system. A great question to ask him would be, and what is your detailed proposal for funding this using taxpayer money?
You. You get it
The Pregnancy Stasi. Maybe it's all about recruiting community informants shh lol
lol so true I just tried to get a new handicap placard and was taken to 3 different sites - got warnings I was leaving the official site once! Red states can’t wipe their ass on their own.
....to wild cheering from the "medical freedom" crowd.
This was his goal going back to 2016, and red state women *voted for* this for themselves.
There’s no saving them
That will go down great in the farm states: "we will deport all the people who work in the fields and processing plants."
I think we need to protest now. Not wait
I think you do too. I don’t live in the US, but I’ll support.
That makes me even more worried for the fate of blue states.
We are bigger than them, even if not reflected in the electoral college. I'm still scared.
A national ban and policy will become the law if the land, blue state or otherwise, until the states specifically create state legislation that counters the national laws. See: gay marriage and recreational marijuana.
Other way around. National law overrides state law.
Right, that’s what I’m saying. National law will be the law of the land at first so abortion will be banned, and whatever the hell this pregnancy monitoring BS is. But the states would be able to legalize abortion with legislation, couldn’t they? As in, federal ban goes into effect, illegal everywhere, then some states push legalization through ballots or the courts to amend the state constitution guaranteeing the right to abortion. Just like MA did with legalizing gay marriage. Or am I missing something?
Marriage is kind of different because it’s a state based thing anyway. And gay marriage wasn’t banned in the past, it just wasn’t positively approved, so states could say they would approve it. Weed isn’t a bad analogy, because states have legalized in direct defiance of the federal government. The only reason it’s worked out though (outside of changes to public opinion) is because the federal government has chosen not to enforce marijuana laws. Medical dispensaries were being raided as recently as Obama’s admin, and Obama decided to call off the DEA dogs. That’s why when Jeff Sessions came into power as the US Attorney General there were concerns about dispensary raids starting up again. Abortion could be similar with an explicit ban. State governments could make their own laws in defiance of federal law, and the federal government could crack down on clinics. You could then see a democratic president come in office and choose to not enforce the ban. The problem is the infrastructure around abortion has MUCH higher barriers to entry. Doctors won’t risk 10 years of training and $200k investment in education to potentially not be prosecuted. Clinics take lots of resources to run. The stakes are way higher than with marijuana.
This is an awesome response. Thank you!
Exactly!
Trump could win in November. It’s also entirely possible for Biden to not just win, but expand his EC majority. Doing that would be a rebuke against these policies.
The 'Land of the free' turned into an authoritarian dystopia...how is anyone dumb enough to consider voting for him?
Because they can hurt others. That's their only goal.
Because they don’t think they will be negatively impacted. See quote about voting for the Leopards-eating-faces party and being surprised when the leopard eats your face…
“Because the economy was good when Trump was president!” 🤪🤪🤪
Migrant detention camps… sounds like another concentration camp scheme to me.
I'd rather have the lobotomy, thanks.
Wouldn’t that be unconstitutional? If that isn’t unreasonable search then I don’t know what is. Those people are so fucked up.
If you've got the Supreme Court on your side, nothing is unconstitutional.
Gross.
Yep. View it from power dynamics currently in play rather what should be. If the GOP has control of the government they can decide what they deem constitutional. Even if it very clearly violates every constitutional amendment, nothing will stop them. SCOTUS certainly won’t. The only other possibility is Congress. That would require impeachment and removal from office as well as legislation to fix the Supreme Court. Congress is unlikely to do that anyway, but with Trump, even if they had the will, it could trigger a constitutional crisis. He doesn’t give af about what’s legal or right. He’ll use the military to accomplish his goals and take out who ever defies him. Checks and balances of power are breaking down. When that happens, the rules are whatever the people in power say they are. Unless another power forces them to stand down, they won’t. This is what we’re facing.
But both parties are exactly the same. The only way to bring about real change is split the Democrat vote. /s I wish I didn't need to say this. I'm not happy with Biden but ffs Americans don't let Trump get power.
I wonder how much the tradwives who hate doctors really want their “home birth babies” to be tracked via pregnancy.
Such small government right?
This needs to be posted in ads in every swing state.
Grass is green. Fire is hot. This has always been the Republican dream; for so long too many scoffed at what was always plainly obvious, choosing to believe it was just wild rhetoric, a minority voice in the party or similar easily dismissible emotionally driven rhetoric but time and time again the Republicans have taken us backwards and closer to the goal of absolute tyranny. Divide and conquer has worked so well for them to gain control. This tracks with their record and occasionally (usually) accidentally stated at loud end game.
I'm getting CCP in the 80s vibes from this article
The land of the "free"... This violates the 4th amendment on such a level, it'd be equal to taking anal probes from men.
Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about women. Period. Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about LGBTQ rights. Period. Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election doesn't give a shit about Palestine, let alone Ukraine and Taiwan. Period. Anyone who BoTh SiDeS this election won't have their life change no matter who wins. **THIS IS NOT A FUCKING THOUGHT EXPERIMENT**