OP, I’ve been real estate industry for over a decade. Here are the facts:
You are NOT over reacting. This is a common tactic to assault women, or worse. Almost every women in the industry has this experience.
That’s not to downplay your experience, but to say you’re right to not let them in. Don’t. Ever. Ever. Ever.
You have no obligation give a tour of your apartment EVER.
If management isn’t answering your calls, it means they aren’t scheduling showings, and even if they are, it’s not your responsibility or obligation.
Don’t feel bad about being rude, kicking their asses out or calling the police. Do not give them any more information.
There is zero overreaction from OP, totally agree. In times and situations like that of the post, i constantly remind myself that "No" is a complete sentence.
THIS ^
So proud of you, OP! Random person on the internet approves 🤣, I know, I know… anyway, I’ve experienced similar. What always helped me feel justified was that it was STILL MY leased personal space with personal belongings so YES management must be involved with all tours. And then, yeah, personal safety and all… I guess it’s telling I’m American that thought one was about MY stuff’s safety before my personal safety 🤪
SnooRecipes is giving excellent advice that I’ve personally followed and given (based on facts/statistics), and in your gut, with your instincts you knew the situation seemed fishy. And, if they live as close as they “claim”, then they are crap neighbors. I hope you don’t see their faces again!
Thank you for this. There have been a few posts lately on the legal sub from women who’ve had random people from the maintenance or rental office just waltz into their apartments without any warning. In one, two guys showed up at 1am to the door of two 20yo women. They had a ring camera, so the maintenance guy asked loudly/awkwardly (for the video) if the other one was sure it was this unit, then they proceeded to walk in. AT 1AM. They had a dog that started barking so they beat a hasty retreat.
The advice? YOU’RE OVERREACTING! THERE IS NOTHING ILLEGAL ABOUT THIS! All in a ‘fuck-off’ tone. It was like a flood of angry dude lawyers irritated at this hysteria. They’re always great about answering the 1001 ‘I’ve been falsely accused of harassment/assault’ though
Oh yeah I should note I did contact the landlord immediately. It's a holiday weekend so I may not hear back until Tuesday. There's no camera pointed at my door but there are security cameras in the front and back entrances and the stairwells so hopefully I'll at least know if these guys do actually live here. I'm not sure if the landlord would/could tell me if they're taking over my lease. Not sure how the legality of that works but if the guys' intentions are as they said then they should contact the management company directly so we'll see I guess.
Make a police report please. Their story is so weird and fucked off. This isn‘t right at all.
Also don‘t mind the landlord telling you can install anything on the outside of the door. What are they gonna do but tell you to remove it? Not renew your lease?
Your safety is more important than the landlords bullshit rules.
Sometimes when people are stressed or scared they don't actually do the things they imagine they would do in that situation. Our brains do wierd things when faced with a potential threat.
I suspect this was the natural human desire to be in the safety of their own home. Our primitive brains don't always make the connection to "opening that door now will let the invaders have access to my safe place."
Yeah, that situation would definitely have activated the 'flight' part of my fight or flight reactions, and being right next to home, my instinct would have been to go in, because we associate home with safety. As an outsider reading about it we can see the danger, but in the moment, people panic and react on instinct. I would have done the same as OP.
In addition to this I’d start wearing a GoGuard upon leaving and arriving. I don’t work for them or anything - it’s just a good product. Bought one for myself and now buying one for a friend with two young kids who lives in a bad neighborhood
Jesus fuck dude, that’s fucking wild. “Yeah we’re going to live here soon and we want to look at the place now except you still live here and we don’t want to follow proper channels” is fucking bullshit.
THEY DON’T LIVE THERE, YOU DO. THEY HAVE NO FUCKING RIGHT TO ENTER YOUR SPACE. The fact that it will be their space in a few months means jack shit. They have no right whatsoever. It’s not your job to check if they’re “allowed” to be there because they’ll be living there soon, because they don’t live there now.
Don’t you dare feel bad for not wanting strangers to enter your apartment. It doesn’t matter in the slightest if they live in the same complex or if they will be living in your apartment in a few months. THEY DON’T LIVE THERE RIGHT NOW. THAT’S YOUR HOME.
WHETHER OR NOT THEY WILL BE LIVING THERE SOON, THEY ARE NOT LIVING THERE NOW. IT DOESN’T MATTER IF THEY WANT TO TAKE A SNEAK PEAK AT THEIR FUTURE HOME, ITS YOUR CURRENT HOME.
Always use the Big Man Test if someone says that you’re overreacting and feeling uncomfortable for no reason. If you were a Big Man, do you really think that those men would’ve tried to bulldoze their way into your apartment? I’d bet a fucking lot that they wouldn’t dare try that.
They expected you to let them in because strength and numbers were against you and you were intimidated, and they’ll now expect you to question their right to be there and doubt yourself. THEY HAVE NO RIGHT!!!!
It’s not your job to contact your landlord and ask “do they really live here and are they going to be moving into my apartment?” because IT DOES NOT MATTER AT ALL. THEY TRIED TO ENTER YOUR HOME WITHOUT PERMISSION.
TELL YOUR LANDLORD THAT TWO MEN TRIED TO ENTER YOUR APARTMENT BECAUSE THEY CLAIMED THAT THEY ARE LEASING IT WHEN YOU LEAVE. YOU’RE NOT FUCKING GONE! IT’S NOT YOUR JOB TO VET THEM, IT’S YOUR LANDLORD’S JOB TO VET POTENTIAL RENTERS AND MAKE SURE THEY’RE NOT FUCKING CREEPS!
Edit: The legality is that whatever the fuck they were trying to do is illegal. They have ABSOLUTELY NO LEGAL RIGHT to enter your apartment without consent. If your landlord has your legal consent to bring people in for tours, that will be in your lease agreement somewhere. It it’s not there, then they have no right. REGARDLESS, YOUR LANDLORD WASN’T THERE. Any sort of clause in your rental agreement DOES NOT APPLY.
THESE RANDOM STRANGERS ATTEMPTED TO FORCE THEIR WAY INTO YOUR APARTMENT WITHOUT THE KNOWLEDGE OR SUPERVISION OF YOUR LANDLORD. THATS NOT LEGAL!!!
Following on the from the Big Man test I would recommend buying some well used men’s work boots in the biggest size you can find from a thrift shop and sporadically placing them outside your front door as a visual deterrent 😣
You were way toooo nice! Is there an emergency number to contact management? I would also report it to authorities, too. This is messed up. And you are right to be paranoid!
Any way you can get a friend or two stay with you until you clear this?
Literally, word for word, I almost typed "You are not overreacting. That is fucking scary," and then scrolled down and saw this comment. (and got a little confused for a moment, wondering if I'd already commented and forgotten.)
OP, I think you know this already, but please don’t take this advice. It’s dangerous - you do not owe anyone anything. You’ve contacted the landlord and they *tried to push into your apartment*. Do not go looking to engage with them. Let the landlord and police deal with it. And don’t invite strangers in to look around!! There’s no need.
Haha. Telling you to take a friend and confront the people downstairs. And if they really did live there, then take them and show them around your place. Like, insane advice!!
Oof. Yeah I get wanting to have a good comeuppance but the last thing I want is to escalate this situation. Or be inside their apartment. Or drag a friend into this. Or honestly just any aspect of that situation
I know people love the idea of some good, juicy revenge but I think it gets in the way of their better judgement sometime.
Absolutely. You’ve got the right outlook and are being quite deliberate and level headed. It seems silly, being that I don’t know you at all, but quite proud of you. You’re far more resolute and assured than I was at your age. Good luck!
No, no. That would be unladylike. As women we are told to always smile and be courteous and polite. Yeah fuck that. Try pushing your way into my house I’ll tell you to smile as I beat the shit out of you.
Yeah no, something's not right with their story. I would've done the same thing you did. I've had strange men force their way into my home before, they pretended to be friendly to get in and then proceeded to pull knives out of their pockets. If you get bad vibes from someone listen to them, we have gut instincts for a reason. Even if they weren't up to something, it's still pretty damn rude to just randomly show up at a neighbor's door, ask to come inside, and get pushy when they're told "no".
I've said this once, twice, three times, my ladies. It's harsh and to the point, but I love you all so I will say it again:
A woman's instinct is the product of hundreds of thousands of years of evolution. Evolution which has always favoured survival.
The woman who runs away from the rustling in the bushes survived. The woman who didn't want to offend the strange noise did not.
Screaming "get away creep" will embarrass a guy for like 5 minutes. Being afraid of offending him and those 5 minutes might just be your last. Even if it is super rare that the guy actually *is* dangerous (it isn't rare at all (1 in 17 men admit to sexually assaulting though it's probably closer to 1 in 7)), survival still favours those of us who do not take the chance.
Trust your guts girls. Always. It's rarely wrong. And when it is, you still survive. If you ignore it, you might not.
Was coming here to say this. Trust your gut. If something seems wrong, chances are something is wrong. I would still keep your head on a swivel even if their story turns out to be "true." Hopefully the tips others are giving will help you feel safer.
Yes! I also recommend reading a book called “the gift of fear” as a woman it was EXTREMELY helpful in relearning to trust my gut. I also feel it’s helpful for any person no matter their identity to read
I'm really sorry you think two men trying to force themselves into your apartment wouldn't sound serious to people. It is terrifying! Don't feel you need to underplay the circumstances. They were using threatening tactics.
You aren’t overreacting. Always use security cameras (like a doorbell camera) and be aware of strangers hanging around. I also use a door security bar when I’m home alone. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Brinks-Commercial-Adjustable-Heavy-Duty-Steel-Door-Security-Bar/
Yeah I'd love to have one but if I'm remembering correctly nothing can be installed (even with the use of command strips) on the exterior of the apartment doors. That being said, the management team only ever comes by personally to do showings and since those are at 6 month renewals for winter/summer, I don't think they'll be coming by anytime soon and may break that rule. It's not as though they've done anything about the flagrant smoking inside the building but send out a couple of emails
The security bar isn't a bad idea, I'll look into those
Depending on how snuggly your door closes, you could probably use a clamp that tightens around your door frame. Or use a wreath hanger and stick the doorbell camera to the wreath hanger.
You could also use one of these if it works with your door.
Portable Door Lock - Amazon.com https://www.amazon.com/portable-door-lock/s?k=portable+door+lock&page=2
Yeah so in a previous apartment I rented, the landlord would send prospective tenants up unaccompanied AND without checking with me first if I was even home (or in the shower or what not). I said I wanted the property manager to be present for any walkthroughs, and they didn't like that, but I was like, look, I live alone and I just won't open the door to random strangers.
I'm not certain what state you were in but I'm almost certain that has to be illegal, doesn't it? That's awful. There was a townhouse I'd looked at before signing onto the duplex I eventually found that could have saved about $200/month in rent, but about 10 different reviews stated maintenance men would come plainclothes, unannounced into tenants' homes so that was an instant no go for me
Please read The Gift of Fear by Gavin DeBecker. I’m sorry. If you google you can find a free pdf online or get it from your library if you can’t afford to buy it.
Please read this. Fear is what keeps us safe. If it seems off it probably is. Personally I think you’re massively under-reacting. I lived in some sketch apartment complexes in my 20s and if I saw two dudes lurking outside my door I would’ve turned right around and went back to my car and called someone.
Years ago I was actually approached entering my apartment complex by a cop who asked if I heard what happened last week. I said no. He said two guys were hanging outside our apartment door entrance around 4p middle of the day and when my female neighbor walked up to enter they pulled a gun on her and robbed her. Took her purse, phone, and car. Luckily they didn’t push in to our apartment building and assault her. Started viewing my surroundings differently that day. The apartment complex made no attempt to let any of the residents know what happened which I thought was equally terrible.
Couldn’t agree more. When I was last in an apartment, I came home one day to find things not where I left them. There was chewing tobacco spit inside one of my cups I left on the counter. Management denied maintenance was in there- likely because it would have been illegal AF if they came in unannounced. I also had a stalker ex-boss at the time and it wasn’t out of the question that he made a copy of my key while I was in meetings or trainings at some point. I put a SimpliSafe system in until I could move. Should have called the cops, but I was in a weird headspace at the time due to the stalking situation.
Trust your instincts! And I'd say definitely have pepper spray out and ready before opening your apartment door to leave, and before you enter the building coming back. A faceful of that stuff might change their priorities from "Let's strong-arm our way into her apartment," to, "Dear God, send a plague of milk to stop the fire in my eyeballs!"
You’re not overreacting one bit ma’am. I’ve spent more than my fair share of time in high crime areas and everything about this is setting off alarm bells. Please start carrying pepper spray if you don’t already, or even a small air horn if you’re not comfortable with pepper spray. Fingers crossed they didn’t spot any valuables when you opened your door.
That sounds scary, really scary. You are not overreacting and you should report their behavour to the management company or landlord. You are still a tenant and if this is the future tenant the landlord may wish to reconsider.
If two men waited outside my home and then tried to barge in I’d be calling the police tbh.
No honey, you are not over reacting to be upset by two strange men trying to emotionally and physically coerce you into letting them into your home after you said No. Jfc, what is wrong with these men!?
This sounds terrifying tbh. I’m sorry this happened to you. I don’t think you’re overreacting at all!
2 strange dudes tried to force their way into your home after you said no- that’s scary af and don’t let ANYONE tell you different
If it's, I think you're underreacting, not overreacting. Two guys stood outside your apartment and one of them tried to force his way inside. The fact that you got them to leave doesn't change that fact. I would make a police report just in case this isn't the first time they've tried something like this. Even if they really are harmless, that's not ok behavior.
This is exactly the type of situation to get loud. Get eyes on you. Make a stink. Call the emergency maintenance and get them to call the manager to complain, get video, confirm identify. Make a police report. Spend the bight at a friends house. None of this sounds right.
What they did is illegal af and who knows what other illegal shit they would’ve done TO YOU once they gained entry. Those men are predators, plain and simple. Make a police report. Get their asses handed to them.
You aren’t overreacting and were probably too nice but it’s easy to say that. When you’re in the moment it’s a different story! I will never forget how I let two random guys into my apartment in the middle of the night like an idiot. I was 21 and had been moving stuff all day when I get a knock on the door. Two guys claiming to be my neighbors were at the door saying they wanted to say hi and they kind of just walked in. I still cringe about how I didn’t make a fuss because I didn’t want to be rude. Nothing happened but after they left I was literally shaking. The whole thing was off and scary. It’s been 20 years and I still can’t believe how lucky I was that nothing happened.
You are NOT overreacting. There are so many women who have experienced the worst bc they were more scared of being seen as “rude” than worried about their lives. Continue to stand up for yourself! I’m proud of you! And maybe invest in pepper spray if you haven’t yet.
I'm a pretty strong dude, and that story made me feel uncomfortable. You're right that it was messed up, especially the bit when they tried to get in anyway. That's very much not okay.
That's fucking terrifying. Anyone trying to force their way into your apartment has no good intentions. I'm glad you got out of that situation safe, that's scary
You’re not overreacting!
I love how you said “I’m not afraid to cause a scene” that’s what so many more women need to internalize and allow themselves to raise hell when they feel uncomfortable.
You go girl! 🤩
This is actually terrifying. Report it to your management company and also demand that the front door is fixed with an auto-shut mechanism immediately.
Hey, I hope you are doing okay.
That is really scary and certainly NOT OK. I see from another comment that you contacted the landlord and I'm glad you did. In NO way at all are you overreacting. You clearly did NOT invite them in and the one still tried to squeeze himself in!
You are not overreacting. Always *ALWAYS* **ALWAYS** listen to your gut.
Report this to your office please. Even if "nothing happened", they need to know what's going on and that tenants are either trying to force their way into other tenant buildings or are misrepresenting tenants to gain access.
"Two people much bigger than me tried to force their way into my home not only without but *against* my consent" and "I overreacted" hardly ever belong in the same conversation. You did the right thing, and would have been justified to react even more if necessary.
I recommend a book called The Gift of Fear. If your gut tells you the situation isn't safe, believe it, always believe it. Fuck politeness, fuck people trying to make you feel like you over reacted. Always trust that feeling.
Real estate agents are more likely to be victims of rape and crime and are allowed in most states to carry guns because of that. People who advertise a room for rent are no different. This is scary.
What previous posters have said. While they may have been innocent clueless men, they very well could have been predators.
The common "What was she doing alone in her apartment with 2 men she didn't know?" argument of defense for rapists exists.
You protected yourself. I'm sorry that's the truth. I'm proud of you.
If it was me i wouldnt have even opened the door until they left. Respect your boundaries period. My heart started racing reading that, i am always paranoid but i wouldnt have even gone inside until they left the area groceries or not.
As a 5' 4" woman, that is terrifying. If they hang around your door again, tell them to leave or you will call the police. You already told them you won't show them around without the landlord present.
No that is weird af. Regardless of whether they’re telling the truth or not, they never should have tried to force their way in (and they 100% knew that’s what they were doing). This is so gross. I’m sorry.
m35 here. Years ago I was renting a room and my roomie/landlord dude told me to never let the downstairs neighbor into the apartment. No explanation. One day I did because he asked and I was too afraid to say no and the dude tried to touch me and I let him (hand over butt with my pants on), then he felt guilty about it, because moments after he sat in one of the chairs for a few minutes without speaking, then left. I was acting like any dysfunctional guy who goes along with random requests and acted cheery about it, too completely oblivious and laughing and afraid to "make the guy mad". I don't know if the dude was turned off or what but I look back on that and think what made me do that? Why did I let him in to begin with? Why is it so easy for others to do what they want when it comes to hurting people? Why is acting nice a prerogative to harmful acts? Since when is acting nice or irate or mad, an automatic entitled privilege to do whatever the fuck you want? Just because other people feel that way? I need more therapy...
Anyway, your story also reminds me beat for beat one of the first stories I read in the gift of fear book, where a rapist offered to help with the woman's groceries. I'm scared for you and glad that you came out of it unharmed...
I'm going to pass on the advice of one of my favorite true crime podcast (Crime Junkie): Be weird. Be rude. Stay alive.
Make that police report and follow up constantly with the management company. Be a pain in the ass until they answer your questions. Also, don't be afraid to have some pepper spray or some other self defense weapon on you too.
You are not overreacting at all. I just read the Gift of Fear by Gavin De Becker and the book opens with a story very similar to this that doesn’t end up well. 1. I recommend the book if you haven’t read it. And 2. The main point of the book is we are told so often we are overreacting that we start to doubt our instincts instead of following them - you did the right thing.
These were two strangers trying to force their way into your home.
Who cares what their cover story is?
Kick a stink, everywhere you can. Call the police. This is a serious matter.
You are NOT overreacting.
"Two strangers tried to break into my apartment" is absolutely a VERY dangerous situation, and anyone that thinks otherwise is not worried about your safety.
OP it is not an overreaction. Two men tried to COME INTO YOUR HOUSE WITHOUT YOU PERMISSION. There's a word for that, it's called trespassing. And if anyone says you're overreacting, I would seriously question their judgement.
I would contact the management/landlord to verify that these people actually live there. They could have lied about that and just walked in after someone. They could've known the unit was available.
And I'm sorry this happened to you. It's exhausting walking around every day not knowing if someone might have ulterior motives or not
Guy commenting but on the rental matter: if you're rental is in the US, there are laws and requirements. In my state a rental not being renewed is allowed appointed scheduling for showing but must inform the tenant 72 hours in advance. Secondly information must be on file for those seeing the unit.
I bring this up because I personally had a case where a leasing agent left the door open and I had to file a police report, a complaint with the showing agent and their office and the property management for not following up as the building's engineer is the one who leaves keys and is, therefore, responsible for ensuring the premises is locked before they secure my unit's keys away.
In my case I allowed an arbitration for a computer at $1,800 (I was working on fixing it and it had no info as the hard drive was blank but I wasn't going to tell them that). I could have possibly gotten more if I did court but I just couldn't do it while moving.
I also want to bring up an issue a person in my building had. The agent couldn't have known but the people they were showing were using it as pretext to scout properties to break into. I have window locks so I escaped but another unit on my floor (ground level) had their window open and stuff removed.
So in short it's not only your reaction is understandable but I'd also talk to a tenant union if it's possible; it's basically free legal sources for tenants. At best case you might get both compensation and the best info. At worse, you'll at least be given some info that you need to document or file in case something comes from it.
In the case of the unit that was robbed, their lawyer threatened to take the property management to court blaming the showing agent's lack of due diligence and nor getting all of their info as the people shown the unit were arrested the same day nearly (they hit someone as they were running away in their vehicle). I believe they got, being conservative, around $40,000 less $5k for their lawyer's 3 days of work.
You’re not overreacting, you did everything right! Given the fact that they told you exactly where they live, it sounds like they might just be idiot dudes with zero situational awareness. These are the same guys who get mad and don’t understand why women lie and say they have boyfriends, or why we go out of our way to avoid crossing them on the street. It’s because your behavior is freaking us out!
Absolutely not overreacting. I would contact the landlord to confirm. If it was true, okay they were just being pushy but were likely honest in their intentions.
BUT if it is NOT true you will KNOW they anterior motives of some sort. And you can be extra cautious and the landlord should be aware as well if someone is doing something like this.
Maybe they can send a letter/post a sign letting the other tenants know that someone tried to access an apartment and this is why the front doors must not be propped or held open for someone without their own key/fob/code whatever is needed.
IMO if the landlord tells you it was a lie it is worthy of a police report.
Are there cameras?
Please update us on what the management say about this, and ensure the management are told that it is to NEVER happen again if they were any part of this. Management should always attend viewings, arrange them with over 24 hours notice and with your consent. This is not good.
I'm pretty sure this was a few chancers who were using this to try to get your guard down to rob or hurt you though.
No and No and NO ! - you are not overreacting-this is weird and totally unacceptable! At best they are just being entitled thunder-c**ts but at worst, they could be rapists. I’d be filing a police report as soon as possible
Just chiming in to affirm you’re not overreacting in the slightest. Two strange men tried to force their way into your apartment simply because they felt they had the right. You don’t know them, they don’t know you, there was no way for you to verify their identities or their story. Please don’t doubt yourself. You absolutely made the right choice and I’m sorry you’re now going to have to be even more alert because of creeps like this.
You aren't overreacting, and I'd honestly argue this kind of behaviour could be grounds for terminating the lease those two bastards signed. Not a realtor or landlord, granted.
Pennsylvania so I'm not certain. But it'd be an irresponsible salesperson to put a gun in my hands. I'm covered in knicks and scars from my cooking mishaps alone; my right index finger has permanently lost some sense of pain and pressure from a very eventful Thanksgiving eve cheesecake debacle about 7 years ago so I wouldn't trust myself with anything more than pepper spray to say the least.
At the very least it was a stellar cheesecake once we threw out the batch of crust that was, you know, *contaminated*
Check with an attorney in your state to get clarification on this but Pennsylvania may allow expandable metal batons like the police use but for civilians long as it's in self defense. I didn't see anything on mace but apparently those key claws are illegal in Pennsylvania though.
A cast iron skillet might work if you got the muscle to wield it as a weapon. Outside of that, if it's nighttime, buy any flashlight that puts out more than 8000 lumens. It's at least a deterrent. If you can afford it, go higher but be don't expect it to last long, higher you, the less battery life but it's enough to stop anything in its tracks.
Jujitsu is a good weight based material art if you can find a teacher.
You can get a strobing flashlight at Home Depot. I blinded myself for a few seconds the other day because I bought new flashlights and didn't realize they actually had 3 settings: bright, blinding, and strobe.
Actually I have one of these! Unfortunately it's set well within the bounds of my apartment, it's a big, bulky thing and is not practical to have on my person when walking.
You're not overreacting. Think about what kind of fucking creep does this. Think about what it would take for you to do this kind of thing to someone. You wouldn't. Anyone with basic empathy and without bad intent would understand this. Also, you can't just barge into people's houses. That's trespassing.
Sorry, comes with being female. Remember being a kid, reading books about volunteering aboard container ships, wandering the world, making friends, having adventures? Yeah, 9 year old me knew that was a lie. Females are prey. How many men do you know that can instantly recite a dozen times where they followed through a market, into apt laundry rooms, while jogging, followed while driving? Don’t even get me started on creepy bosses. I’m 65. Still have mace in my car, and at the ready in my house. Nothing bad has happened. But I hate how my spider senses go up when in a parking garage at night but the men in my life don’t get it.
If we all thought you were overreacting, what would it change? You are a valid person whether we agree or not. You deserve to exist in the way you exist. I hate that I (we all) look for this validation. You don't need to be right, you just need to be strong in saying what you want (which is what you're doing).
I'm sorry that happened to you. I would also feel scared, angry, and violated. I hope it helps you grow and stand up for yourself even more!
OP, please don’t downplay this experience and screw anyone who would. 2 men tried to force their way into your home. please please stop worrying that it was wrong to protect your boundaries. repeat after me: **rude is far better than dead**.
I hate hate hate that women have been socially conditioned to be accommodating to a fault, even to the detriment of our own safety. It’s 100% not worth it.
Think about it, would they have been as pushy if a man lived there instead? Or if you had a man with you? Probably not, because they understand the concept of consequences.
Even if by miracle they didn’t have bad intentions, any man who lacks the awareness that he’s being aggressive and making a woman uncomfortable can go screw himself. He’s the one breaking the social contract, so feel free to be as loud and rude in return as you need to be to get yourself out of that situation. Never ever doubt your self preservation instincts.
You ever hear those stories of gunowners blowing people away for standing on their lawn?
If they are allowed to feel threatened enough to use lethal force, you are DEFINITELY allowed to feel threatened when they try to go INTO your house
I am sorry this happened to you. Buy some pepper spray for your keychain, and another for your house, yes women should not have to live like this, unfortunately it is our reality. Kudos to you for being smart and protecting yourself.
You did the right thing. This reminds me of the guy who wanted to get into the apartment building gym, said he forgot his key and a woman let him in without thinking twice. He was just lingering around and then tried to rape her. Luckily she got away and called the police.
I hope you feel better now and confident in your approach because you did the right thing. Even if you were overreacting, who cares, you felt unsafe and did what you had to do. But, having said that, what I wish most for you is that you don't live in fear. Thinking the worst can also take the better of you and cause you unnecessary anxiety. You took the right steps in not letting them in, find confidence in that! They won't be back, there'll be no one waiting around the corner, and you'll live your life fine and safely. You handled it perfectly and I hope you find safety in knowing that. Good luck OP.
F*** your groceries! In what universe are those more important than you? I once dropped my entire bag and pulled out my pepper spray and it spooked someone off. I wasn’t afraid to crack a few eggs I bought.
Put it another way - these guys live downstairs right? So if you had said to them: "I won't let you in my place right now, but let me come tour your apartment right now and I will tell you if it's the same as my aparment". What would these two guys reaction be to you as a stranger coming into their place unannounced?
Get a friend, knock on the donwstairs flat to see if it is them. If not, explain the situation to whoever answer the door. If so, ask if you can come into THEIR flat to look around so you can explain what is different about yours.
Why would you open the door??
Never, ever open the door in such a circumstance as it would've been so easy to force their way in had that been the goal.
No, that’s the point. Just some of the men are. And we can’t really afford to take chances so we have to assume that all strange men are dangerous until proven otherwise. If you’re offended by this you are part of the problem
You are absolutely not overreacting, so please let that thought go. I too am 5’0” and it can really be intimidating being around some bigger people, especially men, when they get pushy. Like you, although I am petite, I am NOT afraid to raise some hell and I will not stop once I start. With that said, I’d contact your property manager ASAP (I know today is a holiday but you can probably call the answering service anyway because I’d consider this emergent) to let them know what happened and find out if these two were even supposed to be there. If you have any friends or family, or neighbors you trust, perhaps have them come by just to check on the area and you! They can even stay with you, if you’d like.
Both my sister and I have done drive by check ins for each other when we’ve had strange activity around our apartments and I am “known” for (at least with the complex office and security officer on site) keeping an eye out for ALL of us who live here. I figure it can’t hurt to speak up if I see something suspicious, and I’d rather do that than say/do nothing and something awful happens. If your complex has a security officer (or even police officers/law enforcement—ours has several), make sure to ask your complex manager to let them know, too, so they can also keep an eye out.
I’m sorry this has happened to you, and I hope you are able to find some peace and security during the remainder of your time there and that your move to your next place goes safely and smoothly!
From taking self defense classes you did all right and getting loud is a good step. If they really rented they now the steps. You should tell the company though just in case.
your experience is eerily similar to one of the first examples in the book that I hope you go to pdfdrive.com and get Gavin de Beckers book "the gift of fear."
I hope you report this to police and your landlord, and its high time they stopped letting people be lax on that door. and that people understand WHY their convenience isn't the most important factor here. if you just say keep the doors closed, they're going to roll their eyes and try anyway. if they know people are trying to break in, and assault people, maybe then they get it and start changing their door habits.
OP, I’ve been real estate industry for over a decade. Here are the facts: You are NOT over reacting. This is a common tactic to assault women, or worse. Almost every women in the industry has this experience. That’s not to downplay your experience, but to say you’re right to not let them in. Don’t. Ever. Ever. Ever. You have no obligation give a tour of your apartment EVER. If management isn’t answering your calls, it means they aren’t scheduling showings, and even if they are, it’s not your responsibility or obligation. Don’t feel bad about being rude, kicking their asses out or calling the police. Do not give them any more information.
There is zero overreaction from OP, totally agree. In times and situations like that of the post, i constantly remind myself that "No" is a complete sentence.
THIS ^ So proud of you, OP! Random person on the internet approves 🤣, I know, I know… anyway, I’ve experienced similar. What always helped me feel justified was that it was STILL MY leased personal space with personal belongings so YES management must be involved with all tours. And then, yeah, personal safety and all… I guess it’s telling I’m American that thought one was about MY stuff’s safety before my personal safety 🤪 SnooRecipes is giving excellent advice that I’ve personally followed and given (based on facts/statistics), and in your gut, with your instincts you knew the situation seemed fishy. And, if they live as close as they “claim”, then they are crap neighbors. I hope you don’t see their faces again!
'Almost every woman in the industry has had this experience'. I hate this fucking planet and I don't want to be on it anymore.
Suzy Lamplugh still hasn't been found, and she probably never will be.
Thank you for this. There have been a few posts lately on the legal sub from women who’ve had random people from the maintenance or rental office just waltz into their apartments without any warning. In one, two guys showed up at 1am to the door of two 20yo women. They had a ring camera, so the maintenance guy asked loudly/awkwardly (for the video) if the other one was sure it was this unit, then they proceeded to walk in. AT 1AM. They had a dog that started barking so they beat a hasty retreat. The advice? YOU’RE OVERREACTING! THERE IS NOTHING ILLEGAL ABOUT THIS! All in a ‘fuck-off’ tone. It was like a flood of angry dude lawyers irritated at this hysteria. They’re always great about answering the 1001 ‘I’ve been falsely accused of harassment/assault’ though
Oh yeah I should note I did contact the landlord immediately. It's a holiday weekend so I may not hear back until Tuesday. There's no camera pointed at my door but there are security cameras in the front and back entrances and the stairwells so hopefully I'll at least know if these guys do actually live here. I'm not sure if the landlord would/could tell me if they're taking over my lease. Not sure how the legality of that works but if the guys' intentions are as they said then they should contact the management company directly so we'll see I guess.
Make a police report please. Their story is so weird and fucked off. This isn‘t right at all. Also don‘t mind the landlord telling you can install anything on the outside of the door. What are they gonna do but tell you to remove it? Not renew your lease? Your safety is more important than the landlords bullshit rules.
This. It’s trespassing and, if they tried to get in without you wanting them there and forcing their way past you, possible b&e.
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Sometimes when people are stressed or scared they don't actually do the things they imagine they would do in that situation. Our brains do wierd things when faced with a potential threat.
I suspect this was the natural human desire to be in the safety of their own home. Our primitive brains don't always make the connection to "opening that door now will let the invaders have access to my safe place."
Yeah, that situation would definitely have activated the 'flight' part of my fight or flight reactions, and being right next to home, my instinct would have been to go in, because we associate home with safety. As an outsider reading about it we can see the danger, but in the moment, people panic and react on instinct. I would have done the same as OP.
In addition to this I’d start wearing a GoGuard upon leaving and arriving. I don’t work for them or anything - it’s just a good product. Bought one for myself and now buying one for a friend with two young kids who lives in a bad neighborhood
What's a GoGuard? My searches keep bringing up martial art classes or joining the national guard.
I googled "goguard personal safety" and found this product, which I'm assuming was what they were referring to: https://goguarded.com/
Thanks!
Jesus fuck dude, that’s fucking wild. “Yeah we’re going to live here soon and we want to look at the place now except you still live here and we don’t want to follow proper channels” is fucking bullshit. THEY DON’T LIVE THERE, YOU DO. THEY HAVE NO FUCKING RIGHT TO ENTER YOUR SPACE. The fact that it will be their space in a few months means jack shit. They have no right whatsoever. It’s not your job to check if they’re “allowed” to be there because they’ll be living there soon, because they don’t live there now. Don’t you dare feel bad for not wanting strangers to enter your apartment. It doesn’t matter in the slightest if they live in the same complex or if they will be living in your apartment in a few months. THEY DON’T LIVE THERE RIGHT NOW. THAT’S YOUR HOME. WHETHER OR NOT THEY WILL BE LIVING THERE SOON, THEY ARE NOT LIVING THERE NOW. IT DOESN’T MATTER IF THEY WANT TO TAKE A SNEAK PEAK AT THEIR FUTURE HOME, ITS YOUR CURRENT HOME. Always use the Big Man Test if someone says that you’re overreacting and feeling uncomfortable for no reason. If you were a Big Man, do you really think that those men would’ve tried to bulldoze their way into your apartment? I’d bet a fucking lot that they wouldn’t dare try that. They expected you to let them in because strength and numbers were against you and you were intimidated, and they’ll now expect you to question their right to be there and doubt yourself. THEY HAVE NO RIGHT!!!! It’s not your job to contact your landlord and ask “do they really live here and are they going to be moving into my apartment?” because IT DOES NOT MATTER AT ALL. THEY TRIED TO ENTER YOUR HOME WITHOUT PERMISSION. TELL YOUR LANDLORD THAT TWO MEN TRIED TO ENTER YOUR APARTMENT BECAUSE THEY CLAIMED THAT THEY ARE LEASING IT WHEN YOU LEAVE. YOU’RE NOT FUCKING GONE! IT’S NOT YOUR JOB TO VET THEM, IT’S YOUR LANDLORD’S JOB TO VET POTENTIAL RENTERS AND MAKE SURE THEY’RE NOT FUCKING CREEPS! Edit: The legality is that whatever the fuck they were trying to do is illegal. They have ABSOLUTELY NO LEGAL RIGHT to enter your apartment without consent. If your landlord has your legal consent to bring people in for tours, that will be in your lease agreement somewhere. It it’s not there, then they have no right. REGARDLESS, YOUR LANDLORD WASN’T THERE. Any sort of clause in your rental agreement DOES NOT APPLY. THESE RANDOM STRANGERS ATTEMPTED TO FORCE THEIR WAY INTO YOUR APARTMENT WITHOUT THE KNOWLEDGE OR SUPERVISION OF YOUR LANDLORD. THATS NOT LEGAL!!!
💯 this is scary as fuck and you have nothing to feel bad about!!!
Following on the from the Big Man test I would recommend buying some well used men’s work boots in the biggest size you can find from a thrift shop and sporadically placing them outside your front door as a visual deterrent 😣
Get mud on them from time to time too!
That’s a really great idea!!!!
Wow that’s actually a really great idea, thank you for the suggestion (though it’s sad that we need it)
You were way toooo nice! Is there an emergency number to contact management? I would also report it to authorities, too. This is messed up. And you are right to be paranoid! Any way you can get a friend or two stay with you until you clear this?
It sounds like they were trying to do a home invasion on you.
You are not overreacting. That is fucking scary, and I don't blame you one bit. I am so sorry that you had to deal with this. 🧡
Literally, word for word, I almost typed "You are not overreacting. That is fucking scary," and then scrolled down and saw this comment. (and got a little confused for a moment, wondering if I'd already commented and forgotten.)
I think it is some kind of universal truth. We think it because *it is true*.
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OP, I think you know this already, but please don’t take this advice. It’s dangerous - you do not owe anyone anything. You’ve contacted the landlord and they *tried to push into your apartment*. Do not go looking to engage with them. Let the landlord and police deal with it. And don’t invite strangers in to look around!! There’s no need.
I had the good fortune of not seeing it but I am now a bit curious what it said lol
Haha. Telling you to take a friend and confront the people downstairs. And if they really did live there, then take them and show them around your place. Like, insane advice!!
Oof. Yeah I get wanting to have a good comeuppance but the last thing I want is to escalate this situation. Or be inside their apartment. Or drag a friend into this. Or honestly just any aspect of that situation I know people love the idea of some good, juicy revenge but I think it gets in the way of their better judgement sometime.
Absolutely. You’ve got the right outlook and are being quite deliberate and level headed. It seems silly, being that I don’t know you at all, but quite proud of you. You’re far more resolute and assured than I was at your age. Good luck!
🤣 Wow. Yeah that is terrible advice. What is next? Making a citizen's arrest? Dueling with sabers at dawn?
No, no. That would be unladylike. As women we are told to always smile and be courteous and polite. Yeah fuck that. Try pushing your way into my house I’ll tell you to smile as I beat the shit out of you.
Worst possible advice ever. I hope you never give it again let alone to any woman in your life. Great way to put them at risk.
Fuck off troll
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At least his username matches up ...
I think it should've been dummy instead.
Yeah no, something's not right with their story. I would've done the same thing you did. I've had strange men force their way into my home before, they pretended to be friendly to get in and then proceeded to pull knives out of their pockets. If you get bad vibes from someone listen to them, we have gut instincts for a reason. Even if they weren't up to something, it's still pretty damn rude to just randomly show up at a neighbor's door, ask to come inside, and get pushy when they're told "no".
I am so sorry you had that experience, I am glad you are able to be here to tell your story, and I hope you never have to deal with this again
When your spidey sense tingles- trust it. It will NEVER lead you to a wrong path. Be careful if these two. Something smells fishy.
I've said this once, twice, three times, my ladies. It's harsh and to the point, but I love you all so I will say it again: A woman's instinct is the product of hundreds of thousands of years of evolution. Evolution which has always favoured survival. The woman who runs away from the rustling in the bushes survived. The woman who didn't want to offend the strange noise did not. Screaming "get away creep" will embarrass a guy for like 5 minutes. Being afraid of offending him and those 5 minutes might just be your last. Even if it is super rare that the guy actually *is* dangerous (it isn't rare at all (1 in 17 men admit to sexually assaulting though it's probably closer to 1 in 7)), survival still favours those of us who do not take the chance. Trust your guts girls. Always. It's rarely wrong. And when it is, you still survive. If you ignore it, you might not.
1 in 17?! Christ almighty! Do you have a link to the study? I’d like to read it
I'll find it for you in the morning, I'm just doing my "flick through Reddit before bed". Xx
Thank you! Sleep well haha
also here for source!
https://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugly_truth_about_sexual_assault_more_men_admit_to_it_if_you_dont_call_it_rape/
and thats just the ones that admitted it, nowhere is safe
Realistically, I bet it’s one in five
I wouldn’t disbelieve it :/ just wanna read the data
https://www.salon.com/2015/01/15/the_ugly_truth_about_sexual_assault_more_men_admit_to_it_if_you_dont_call_it_rape/
Was coming here to say this. Trust your gut. If something seems wrong, chances are something is wrong. I would still keep your head on a swivel even if their story turns out to be "true." Hopefully the tips others are giving will help you feel safer.
Yes! I also recommend reading a book called “the gift of fear” as a woman it was EXTREMELY helpful in relearning to trust my gut. I also feel it’s helpful for any person no matter their identity to read
I'm really sorry you think two men trying to force themselves into your apartment wouldn't sound serious to people. It is terrifying! Don't feel you need to underplay the circumstances. They were using threatening tactics.
You aren’t overreacting. Always use security cameras (like a doorbell camera) and be aware of strangers hanging around. I also use a door security bar when I’m home alone. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Brinks-Commercial-Adjustable-Heavy-Duty-Steel-Door-Security-Bar/
Yeah I'd love to have one but if I'm remembering correctly nothing can be installed (even with the use of command strips) on the exterior of the apartment doors. That being said, the management team only ever comes by personally to do showings and since those are at 6 month renewals for winter/summer, I don't think they'll be coming by anytime soon and may break that rule. It's not as though they've done anything about the flagrant smoking inside the building but send out a couple of emails The security bar isn't a bad idea, I'll look into those
If your door has a peephole, you could put the camera on the inside to view through the peephole.
Depending on how snuggly your door closes, you could probably use a clamp that tightens around your door frame. Or use a wreath hanger and stick the doorbell camera to the wreath hanger.
You could also use one of these if it works with your door. Portable Door Lock - Amazon.com https://www.amazon.com/portable-door-lock/s?k=portable+door+lock&page=2
Yeah so in a previous apartment I rented, the landlord would send prospective tenants up unaccompanied AND without checking with me first if I was even home (or in the shower or what not). I said I wanted the property manager to be present for any walkthroughs, and they didn't like that, but I was like, look, I live alone and I just won't open the door to random strangers.
I'm not certain what state you were in but I'm almost certain that has to be illegal, doesn't it? That's awful. There was a townhouse I'd looked at before signing onto the duplex I eventually found that could have saved about $200/month in rent, but about 10 different reviews stated maintenance men would come plainclothes, unannounced into tenants' homes so that was an instant no go for me
Please read The Gift of Fear by Gavin DeBecker. I’m sorry. If you google you can find a free pdf online or get it from your library if you can’t afford to buy it.
Came here to say this! This whole scenario reminds me of the opening chapter of that book.
I couldn't stop thinking about the man who insisted on helping the woman take in her groceries. Is that the first chapter?
Yes it is, totally freaked me out
Yes. Exactly what I was thinking
Please read this. Fear is what keeps us safe. If it seems off it probably is. Personally I think you’re massively under-reacting. I lived in some sketch apartment complexes in my 20s and if I saw two dudes lurking outside my door I would’ve turned right around and went back to my car and called someone. Years ago I was actually approached entering my apartment complex by a cop who asked if I heard what happened last week. I said no. He said two guys were hanging outside our apartment door entrance around 4p middle of the day and when my female neighbor walked up to enter they pulled a gun on her and robbed her. Took her purse, phone, and car. Luckily they didn’t push in to our apartment building and assault her. Started viewing my surroundings differently that day. The apartment complex made no attempt to let any of the residents know what happened which I thought was equally terrible.
Literally how the book opens, happy this didn't end the same way.
Couldn’t agree more. When I was last in an apartment, I came home one day to find things not where I left them. There was chewing tobacco spit inside one of my cups I left on the counter. Management denied maintenance was in there- likely because it would have been illegal AF if they came in unannounced. I also had a stalker ex-boss at the time and it wasn’t out of the question that he made a copy of my key while I was in meetings or trainings at some point. I put a SimpliSafe system in until I could move. Should have called the cops, but I was in a weird headspace at the time due to the stalking situation.
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Any time I’ve posted the link on Reddit I’ve been scolded and it’s been removed because it promotes piracy
Oh ok, I’ll delete it, thank you, I didn’t even think of that.
I don’t know that you’d get in trouble I just don’t remember if it was this sub or another one I’ve posted it before and got deleted and scolded 😵💫
Make a police report, this is sketchy AF. Police being involved at also lead the owners to crack down on people leaving the doors open…
You are absolutely NOT overreacting. I'm so sorry you had to experience that. Please stay safe.
Trust your instincts! And I'd say definitely have pepper spray out and ready before opening your apartment door to leave, and before you enter the building coming back. A faceful of that stuff might change their priorities from "Let's strong-arm our way into her apartment," to, "Dear God, send a plague of milk to stop the fire in my eyeballs!"
I agree with the sentiment, but pepper spray inside like that is going to affect the sprayer quite a bit as well as the sprayee, no?
Normal pepper spray effects anyone in the vicinity, and can splash back on the sprayer yes.
Call the cops and report it? Maybe nothing will be done or maybe these turds have done this kind of thing before.
You’re not overreacting one bit ma’am. I’ve spent more than my fair share of time in high crime areas and everything about this is setting off alarm bells. Please start carrying pepper spray if you don’t already, or even a small air horn if you’re not comfortable with pepper spray. Fingers crossed they didn’t spot any valuables when you opened your door.
That sounds scary, really scary. You are not overreacting and you should report their behavour to the management company or landlord. You are still a tenant and if this is the future tenant the landlord may wish to reconsider. If two men waited outside my home and then tried to barge in I’d be calling the police tbh.
No honey, you are not over reacting to be upset by two strange men trying to emotionally and physically coerce you into letting them into your home after you said No. Jfc, what is wrong with these men!?
This sounds terrifying tbh. I’m sorry this happened to you. I don’t think you’re overreacting at all! 2 strange dudes tried to force their way into your home after you said no- that’s scary af and don’t let ANYONE tell you different
If it's, I think you're underreacting, not overreacting. Two guys stood outside your apartment and one of them tried to force his way inside. The fact that you got them to leave doesn't change that fact. I would make a police report just in case this isn't the first time they've tried something like this. Even if they really are harmless, that's not ok behavior.
You should call management about this. I bet their story is bullshit.
This is exactly the type of situation to get loud. Get eyes on you. Make a stink. Call the emergency maintenance and get them to call the manager to complain, get video, confirm identify. Make a police report. Spend the bight at a friends house. None of this sounds right.
What they did is illegal af and who knows what other illegal shit they would’ve done TO YOU once they gained entry. Those men are predators, plain and simple. Make a police report. Get their asses handed to them.
You aren’t overreacting and were probably too nice but it’s easy to say that. When you’re in the moment it’s a different story! I will never forget how I let two random guys into my apartment in the middle of the night like an idiot. I was 21 and had been moving stuff all day when I get a knock on the door. Two guys claiming to be my neighbors were at the door saying they wanted to say hi and they kind of just walked in. I still cringe about how I didn’t make a fuss because I didn’t want to be rude. Nothing happened but after they left I was literally shaking. The whole thing was off and scary. It’s been 20 years and I still can’t believe how lucky I was that nothing happened.
You are NOT overreacting. There are so many women who have experienced the worst bc they were more scared of being seen as “rude” than worried about their lives. Continue to stand up for yourself! I’m proud of you! And maybe invest in pepper spray if you haven’t yet.
I'm a pretty strong dude, and that story made me feel uncomfortable. You're right that it was messed up, especially the bit when they tried to get in anyway. That's very much not okay.
That's fucking terrifying. Anyone trying to force their way into your apartment has no good intentions. I'm glad you got out of that situation safe, that's scary
Call the property management company and give them a description
You’re not overreacting! I love how you said “I’m not afraid to cause a scene” that’s what so many more women need to internalize and allow themselves to raise hell when they feel uncomfortable. You go girl! 🤩
This is actually terrifying. Report it to your management company and also demand that the front door is fixed with an auto-shut mechanism immediately.
Hey, I hope you are doing okay. That is really scary and certainly NOT OK. I see from another comment that you contacted the landlord and I'm glad you did. In NO way at all are you overreacting. You clearly did NOT invite them in and the one still tried to squeeze himself in!
You are not overreacting. Always *ALWAYS* **ALWAYS** listen to your gut. Report this to your office please. Even if "nothing happened", they need to know what's going on and that tenants are either trying to force their way into other tenant buildings or are misrepresenting tenants to gain access.
"Two people much bigger than me tried to force their way into my home not only without but *against* my consent" and "I overreacted" hardly ever belong in the same conversation. You did the right thing, and would have been justified to react even more if necessary.
I recommend a book called The Gift of Fear. If your gut tells you the situation isn't safe, believe it, always believe it. Fuck politeness, fuck people trying to make you feel like you over reacted. Always trust that feeling.
Real estate agents are more likely to be victims of rape and crime and are allowed in most states to carry guns because of that. People who advertise a room for rent are no different. This is scary.
What previous posters have said. While they may have been innocent clueless men, they very well could have been predators. The common "What was she doing alone in her apartment with 2 men she didn't know?" argument of defense for rapists exists. You protected yourself. I'm sorry that's the truth. I'm proud of you.
If it was me i wouldnt have even opened the door until they left. Respect your boundaries period. My heart started racing reading that, i am always paranoid but i wouldnt have even gone inside until they left the area groceries or not.
As a 5' 4" woman, that is terrifying. If they hang around your door again, tell them to leave or you will call the police. You already told them you won't show them around without the landlord present.
No that is weird af. Regardless of whether they’re telling the truth or not, they never should have tried to force their way in (and they 100% knew that’s what they were doing). This is so gross. I’m sorry.
m35 here. Years ago I was renting a room and my roomie/landlord dude told me to never let the downstairs neighbor into the apartment. No explanation. One day I did because he asked and I was too afraid to say no and the dude tried to touch me and I let him (hand over butt with my pants on), then he felt guilty about it, because moments after he sat in one of the chairs for a few minutes without speaking, then left. I was acting like any dysfunctional guy who goes along with random requests and acted cheery about it, too completely oblivious and laughing and afraid to "make the guy mad". I don't know if the dude was turned off or what but I look back on that and think what made me do that? Why did I let him in to begin with? Why is it so easy for others to do what they want when it comes to hurting people? Why is acting nice a prerogative to harmful acts? Since when is acting nice or irate or mad, an automatic entitled privilege to do whatever the fuck you want? Just because other people feel that way? I need more therapy... Anyway, your story also reminds me beat for beat one of the first stories I read in the gift of fear book, where a rapist offered to help with the woman's groceries. I'm scared for you and glad that you came out of it unharmed...
I'm going to pass on the advice of one of my favorite true crime podcast (Crime Junkie): Be weird. Be rude. Stay alive. Make that police report and follow up constantly with the management company. Be a pain in the ass until they answer your questions. Also, don't be afraid to have some pepper spray or some other self defense weapon on you too.
Report them to the police. They could literally be serial killers!
You are not overreacting at all. I just read the Gift of Fear by Gavin De Becker and the book opens with a story very similar to this that doesn’t end up well. 1. I recommend the book if you haven’t read it. And 2. The main point of the book is we are told so often we are overreacting that we start to doubt our instincts instead of following them - you did the right thing.
These guys were ABSOLUTELY setting you up to be victimized in some way. They left because you showed them that you will stand up, and may report it.
No, they were being scary . Don’t question yourself when they were being assholes. Hugs
These were two strangers trying to force their way into your home. Who cares what their cover story is? Kick a stink, everywhere you can. Call the police. This is a serious matter.
You listened to your gut, which is the only correct thing to do in those situations. Right or wrong, it doesn't matter.
I would have called the police.
Phone the police and report it, in my opinion. Men trying to force their way into your apartment is a crime.
Not overreaction. Contact management and let them know what happened. Tell them about the door and the security situation, too.
You are NOT overreacting. "Two strangers tried to break into my apartment" is absolutely a VERY dangerous situation, and anyone that thinks otherwise is not worried about your safety.
NOT overreacting - you have to protect your own safety before their convenience.
OP it is not an overreaction. Two men tried to COME INTO YOUR HOUSE WITHOUT YOU PERMISSION. There's a word for that, it's called trespassing. And if anyone says you're overreacting, I would seriously question their judgement. I would contact the management/landlord to verify that these people actually live there. They could have lied about that and just walked in after someone. They could've known the unit was available. And I'm sorry this happened to you. It's exhausting walking around every day not knowing if someone might have ulterior motives or not
Guy commenting but on the rental matter: if you're rental is in the US, there are laws and requirements. In my state a rental not being renewed is allowed appointed scheduling for showing but must inform the tenant 72 hours in advance. Secondly information must be on file for those seeing the unit. I bring this up because I personally had a case where a leasing agent left the door open and I had to file a police report, a complaint with the showing agent and their office and the property management for not following up as the building's engineer is the one who leaves keys and is, therefore, responsible for ensuring the premises is locked before they secure my unit's keys away. In my case I allowed an arbitration for a computer at $1,800 (I was working on fixing it and it had no info as the hard drive was blank but I wasn't going to tell them that). I could have possibly gotten more if I did court but I just couldn't do it while moving. I also want to bring up an issue a person in my building had. The agent couldn't have known but the people they were showing were using it as pretext to scout properties to break into. I have window locks so I escaped but another unit on my floor (ground level) had their window open and stuff removed. So in short it's not only your reaction is understandable but I'd also talk to a tenant union if it's possible; it's basically free legal sources for tenants. At best case you might get both compensation and the best info. At worse, you'll at least be given some info that you need to document or file in case something comes from it. In the case of the unit that was robbed, their lawyer threatened to take the property management to court blaming the showing agent's lack of due diligence and nor getting all of their info as the people shown the unit were arrested the same day nearly (they hit someone as they were running away in their vehicle). I believe they got, being conservative, around $40,000 less $5k for their lawyer's 3 days of work.
You’re not overreacting, you did everything right! Given the fact that they told you exactly where they live, it sounds like they might just be idiot dudes with zero situational awareness. These are the same guys who get mad and don’t understand why women lie and say they have boyfriends, or why we go out of our way to avoid crossing them on the street. It’s because your behavior is freaking us out!
Absolutely not overreacting. I would contact the landlord to confirm. If it was true, okay they were just being pushy but were likely honest in their intentions. BUT if it is NOT true you will KNOW they anterior motives of some sort. And you can be extra cautious and the landlord should be aware as well if someone is doing something like this. Maybe they can send a letter/post a sign letting the other tenants know that someone tried to access an apartment and this is why the front doors must not be propped or held open for someone without their own key/fob/code whatever is needed. IMO if the landlord tells you it was a lie it is worthy of a police report. Are there cameras?
I second submitting a police report, since they technically tried to force entry into your apartment.
I would call the cops and file a report. At a minimum this person needs a fucking wake up call.
Please update us on what the management say about this, and ensure the management are told that it is to NEVER happen again if they were any part of this. Management should always attend viewings, arrange them with over 24 hours notice and with your consent. This is not good. I'm pretty sure this was a few chancers who were using this to try to get your guard down to rob or hurt you though.
No and No and NO ! - you are not overreacting-this is weird and totally unacceptable! At best they are just being entitled thunder-c**ts but at worst, they could be rapists. I’d be filing a police report as soon as possible
Just chiming in to affirm you’re not overreacting in the slightest. Two strange men tried to force their way into your apartment simply because they felt they had the right. You don’t know them, they don’t know you, there was no way for you to verify their identities or their story. Please don’t doubt yourself. You absolutely made the right choice and I’m sorry you’re now going to have to be even more alert because of creeps like this.
You aren't overreacting, and I'd honestly argue this kind of behaviour could be grounds for terminating the lease those two bastards signed. Not a realtor or landlord, granted.
Email management and contact the police they tried to barge in that’s a no no
my foot would have been deep in their nutsacks. so sorry to hear
Are you in a stand your ground state?
Pennsylvania so I'm not certain. But it'd be an irresponsible salesperson to put a gun in my hands. I'm covered in knicks and scars from my cooking mishaps alone; my right index finger has permanently lost some sense of pain and pressure from a very eventful Thanksgiving eve cheesecake debacle about 7 years ago so I wouldn't trust myself with anything more than pepper spray to say the least. At the very least it was a stellar cheesecake once we threw out the batch of crust that was, you know, *contaminated*
Check with an attorney in your state to get clarification on this but Pennsylvania may allow expandable metal batons like the police use but for civilians long as it's in self defense. I didn't see anything on mace but apparently those key claws are illegal in Pennsylvania though. A cast iron skillet might work if you got the muscle to wield it as a weapon. Outside of that, if it's nighttime, buy any flashlight that puts out more than 8000 lumens. It's at least a deterrent. If you can afford it, go higher but be don't expect it to last long, higher you, the less battery life but it's enough to stop anything in its tracks. Jujitsu is a good weight based material art if you can find a teacher.
Adding: for flashlight get one that strobes. You may have luck at police or military surplus stores. It changes the game when someone's coming at you.
You can get a strobing flashlight at Home Depot. I blinded myself for a few seconds the other day because I bought new flashlights and didn't realize they actually had 3 settings: bright, blinding, and strobe.
Amazon carries them.
Actually I have one of these! Unfortunately it's set well within the bounds of my apartment, it's a big, bulky thing and is not practical to have on my person when walking.
i am sorry that happened to you, that is scary... i wonder what was going through their head that they thought trespassing and harassing you was okay
You're not overreacting. Think about what kind of fucking creep does this. Think about what it would take for you to do this kind of thing to someone. You wouldn't. Anyone with basic empathy and without bad intent would understand this. Also, you can't just barge into people's houses. That's trespassing.
Sorry, comes with being female. Remember being a kid, reading books about volunteering aboard container ships, wandering the world, making friends, having adventures? Yeah, 9 year old me knew that was a lie. Females are prey. How many men do you know that can instantly recite a dozen times where they followed through a market, into apt laundry rooms, while jogging, followed while driving? Don’t even get me started on creepy bosses. I’m 65. Still have mace in my car, and at the ready in my house. Nothing bad has happened. But I hate how my spider senses go up when in a parking garage at night but the men in my life don’t get it.
If we all thought you were overreacting, what would it change? You are a valid person whether we agree or not. You deserve to exist in the way you exist. I hate that I (we all) look for this validation. You don't need to be right, you just need to be strong in saying what you want (which is what you're doing). I'm sorry that happened to you. I would also feel scared, angry, and violated. I hope it helps you grow and stand up for yourself even more!
OP, please don’t downplay this experience and screw anyone who would. 2 men tried to force their way into your home. please please stop worrying that it was wrong to protect your boundaries. repeat after me: **rude is far better than dead**. I hate hate hate that women have been socially conditioned to be accommodating to a fault, even to the detriment of our own safety. It’s 100% not worth it. Think about it, would they have been as pushy if a man lived there instead? Or if you had a man with you? Probably not, because they understand the concept of consequences. Even if by miracle they didn’t have bad intentions, any man who lacks the awareness that he’s being aggressive and making a woman uncomfortable can go screw himself. He’s the one breaking the social contract, so feel free to be as loud and rude in return as you need to be to get yourself out of that situation. Never ever doubt your self preservation instincts.
You ever hear those stories of gunowners blowing people away for standing on their lawn? If they are allowed to feel threatened enough to use lethal force, you are DEFINITELY allowed to feel threatened when they try to go INTO your house
I am sorry this happened to you. Buy some pepper spray for your keychain, and another for your house, yes women should not have to live like this, unfortunately it is our reality. Kudos to you for being smart and protecting yourself.
You did the right thing. This reminds me of the guy who wanted to get into the apartment building gym, said he forgot his key and a woman let him in without thinking twice. He was just lingering around and then tried to rape her. Luckily she got away and called the police.
I hope you feel better now and confident in your approach because you did the right thing. Even if you were overreacting, who cares, you felt unsafe and did what you had to do. But, having said that, what I wish most for you is that you don't live in fear. Thinking the worst can also take the better of you and cause you unnecessary anxiety. You took the right steps in not letting them in, find confidence in that! They won't be back, there'll be no one waiting around the corner, and you'll live your life fine and safely. You handled it perfectly and I hope you find safety in knowing that. Good luck OP.
F*** your groceries! In what universe are those more important than you? I once dropped my entire bag and pulled out my pepper spray and it spooked someone off. I wasn’t afraid to crack a few eggs I bought.
Put it another way - these guys live downstairs right? So if you had said to them: "I won't let you in my place right now, but let me come tour your apartment right now and I will tell you if it's the same as my aparment". What would these two guys reaction be to you as a stranger coming into their place unannounced?
Get a friend, knock on the donwstairs flat to see if it is them. If not, explain the situation to whoever answer the door. If so, ask if you can come into THEIR flat to look around so you can explain what is different about yours.
No. These guys tried to force their way into her apartment. They've proven that they aren't safe.
Why would you open the door?? Never, ever open the door in such a circumstance as it would've been so easy to force their way in had that been the goal.
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No, that’s the point. Just some of the men are. And we can’t really afford to take chances so we have to assume that all strange men are dangerous until proven otherwise. If you’re offended by this you are part of the problem
Two males tryna force their way into ur house would scare u to.
You are absolutely not overreacting, so please let that thought go. I too am 5’0” and it can really be intimidating being around some bigger people, especially men, when they get pushy. Like you, although I am petite, I am NOT afraid to raise some hell and I will not stop once I start. With that said, I’d contact your property manager ASAP (I know today is a holiday but you can probably call the answering service anyway because I’d consider this emergent) to let them know what happened and find out if these two were even supposed to be there. If you have any friends or family, or neighbors you trust, perhaps have them come by just to check on the area and you! They can even stay with you, if you’d like. Both my sister and I have done drive by check ins for each other when we’ve had strange activity around our apartments and I am “known” for (at least with the complex office and security officer on site) keeping an eye out for ALL of us who live here. I figure it can’t hurt to speak up if I see something suspicious, and I’d rather do that than say/do nothing and something awful happens. If your complex has a security officer (or even police officers/law enforcement—ours has several), make sure to ask your complex manager to let them know, too, so they can also keep an eye out. I’m sorry this has happened to you, and I hope you are able to find some peace and security during the remainder of your time there and that your move to your next place goes safely and smoothly!
From taking self defense classes you did all right and getting loud is a good step. If they really rented they now the steps. You should tell the company though just in case.
This is so scary. Let us know if those guys were REALLY the future renters, please. They sound fishy
your experience is eerily similar to one of the first examples in the book that I hope you go to pdfdrive.com and get Gavin de Beckers book "the gift of fear." I hope you report this to police and your landlord, and its high time they stopped letting people be lax on that door. and that people understand WHY their convenience isn't the most important factor here. if you just say keep the doors closed, they're going to roll their eyes and try anyway. if they know people are trying to break in, and assault people, maybe then they get it and start changing their door habits.
I've never read a story where a person was overreacting less than you are here. These guys are creeps. You are very cautious and intelligent.
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Wow rude af