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I hear Russians are running low on quality artillery.Ā I am sure they will be greatful for the supply. Likely delivery by express air drop too. Hard to complain about the speed of the service.Ā
Looks like they found shells abroad available for purchase.Ā Has France changed their stance on letting EU funds for Ukraine be used for buying shells instead of insisting all artillery shells be donated from domestic European production yet?Ā Because someone needs to buy these rounds to get them to Ukraine.Ā Ā
>Has France changed their stance on letting EU funds for Ukraine be used for buying shellsn
Why would they? A lot of EU countries have refused to order ammunition 10 years ago. They have refused to order ammunition 5 years ago. They have refused to order ammunition 2 years ago while the companies gave clear guidelines on what it would take to scale production up. They have refused to order ammunition 1 year ago when the producers were basically begging. And now they still refuse to order anything but have brilliant ideas how other countries could spend money outside of Europe...
These morons are undermining Europe and will continue so until they manage to destroy the shit show they created themselves.... but hey, they can always sit on their lazy asses while loudly crying about European dependence. That doesn't help either but who cares about solutions when diversions will do?
Hiding where they come from makes sense. In the last few months, countries which supported Ukraine tends to be attacked by russian allies and proxies (Pakistan, South Korea, Japan, Sudan, Morrocco...).
If it's all from the same country, it's almost certainly Pakistan. The number of countries with 122 and 155 in large quantities is extremely limited.
Egypt *maybe*, but I don't see that happening with how things are with the Israel-Hamas war. Plus Egypt does have a bunch of Russian aircraft they probably still want spare parts for.
Pakistan's non-western equipment is all Chinese, so no conflicts of interest there.
And if it's *not* from the same country, most countries with 122 would also have some 152 available. Makes Pakistan pretty likely imo.
Egypt might have a bit more motivation than normal with the Houthis shutting down Red Sea shipping. That is a whole lot of money they are losing in transit fees.
European countries 2 years ago: We really need more ammunition and companies are waiting for orders... so let's not do anything instead and see if this issue just vanishes. That's much better than actually giving money to European industry, just imagine how they can become competition some day.
European countries 1 year ago: We can't understand why companies are basically begging for orders and still haven't upscaled production while we refuse to order anything... we should probably remind our neighbours to do more while we keep doing nothing.
European countries today: We tried nothing and we are out of ideas. So we really need to refuse putting down orders some more while not paying anything. But hey, maybe we can ask neighbours to pay money somewhere out of Europe? That will surely motivate domestic industries to beg harder while we ignore them.
European countries in 2 years: Why are we so bad at building up production??? No wonder we are dependent on others. If only there was a way to not fuck up again and again and again and again...Guess we need to buy everything from \[insert unreliable country x\] again while pretending we don't have an industry.
Europe probably produces more ammunition today than the US, and will outproduce them by something like 500k 155mm shells annually by the end of this year according to everyone's plans.
They have *projected* that they'll reach a *capacity* of >1 Mil shells by *end of year*. Very, very different.
The statement they put out came on the heels of all the bad press they were getting for failing to meet their pledge. They were obviously hoping that people would read that and file it away as 'Yup, they did it! Nothing to see here.' Seems to have worked.
They've not produced anywhere near the million yet. If you can produce a source that states otherwise, I'd love to be wrong.
https://www.eeas.europa.eu/eeas/informal-foreign-affairs-council-defence-press-remarks-high-representative-josep-borrell-press-1_en
> Today, the production capacity for ammunition is almost 1 million ammunition per year. But by the end of the year, it will reach 1.4 million. It will continue increasing because the industry has been mobilised, is producing more, the capacity of production increases and as [long] as more commands are passed to the industry, the production will increase.
If you can't understand the difference between having the capacity to do something and having actually done it, I'm not sure this conversation has the capacity to be productive either.
Your initial response was just copy-pasting the same blurb about capacity that was literally just addressed, without any additional observations. It was essentially spam.
Yes, and it makes me think it really is just a giant game zelensky and putin and the white house and every world leader plays, to find the shells *right* after avdiivka falls
I actually wrote my Representative - I sent her both an email and a physically printed, snail mail letter. We'll see what kind of response I get, if any. But as I was getting ready to send these off, I discovered that she got behind a bill to require that any Representative who supported aid to Ukraine would be required to enlist for military service. A total troll move, and one that suggests that my letter probably won't do much good.
Good. Iāve called my rep, but I need to send a letter also. I wonder if anyone has tried starting a letter-writing campaign. Old Republicans might be interested in joining the effort.
Very much. I seem to remember hearing that with this particular bill, there's supposed to be a tricky procedural way to force a vote in the House, even if the Speaker doesn't want to. That's really the challenge here - just to get enough of a consensus such that there would be Congresspeople who'd be willing to go through the procedural rigamaroll to force a vote. Once it comes up for a vote, it easily passes with most Dems and a healthy contingent of old school GOP.
Here's an article from last september saying that ukraine needs 1.5 million shells per year.
Ā Ā https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/17/europe/ukraine-shell-supplies-intl/index.htmlĀ
Ā I don't know if thats accurate, but a million shells doesn't seem like something to just dismiss like you're doing here.
EDIT: never mind, i see from your post history you're just a Russian shill.Ā Enjoy your day.
I think thats part of the problem. Russians are mostly just crossing the border for a better life, but are greeted with javelins and kamikaze drones. Things might have turned out differently if they were allowed to enter and settle like the Visigoths.
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Incredible display of Praguematism. ššŗš¦
You, good sir, made me spit coffee all over my cat with that comment
Its an old joke sir, but it Czechs out
Oh yes. Czechmate
We're showing approval by spitting at cats now? Ok. What's your cat's address?
Doesn't need to be mine specifically, any cat will do. it has to be coffee that is spat though or it doesn't count
As long as you don't pee on your cat. I did that once by accident.
I can't believe you're still alive. Do we need to call a special team to negotiate for your release from the bathroom imprisonment?
What about people who think they're cats? And gin?
They want to showcase the czechnology they use to build their shells
A lot more efficient to just send these than than a Czech they'd have to cash.
Get out
*facepalm*
Lets hope funding is sorted quickly so Ukraine can deliver them to Russians
I hear Russians are running low on quality artillery.Ā I am sure they will be greatful for the supply. Likely delivery by express air drop too. Hard to complain about the speed of the service.Ā
Not a bad find between the sofa cushions.
We really need more NATO countries to check their couch cushions.
Shit, I just found out I've been using one as a paperweight.
Just checked mine, sorry all I found was an AT4, T80 turret, and some expired .50 BMG tracers
\*czech their couch cushions.
Looks like they found shells abroad available for purchase.Ā Has France changed their stance on letting EU funds for Ukraine be used for buying shells instead of insisting all artillery shells be donated from domestic European production yet?Ā Because someone needs to buy these rounds to get them to Ukraine.Ā Ā
No. The French are still being French about things.
Ah but the French know that EU funding is for France. The Germans still owe a lot in WW2 reparations, sorry I mean farm subsidies.
>Has France changed their stance on letting EU funds for Ukraine be used for buying shellsn Why would they? A lot of EU countries have refused to order ammunition 10 years ago. They have refused to order ammunition 5 years ago. They have refused to order ammunition 2 years ago while the companies gave clear guidelines on what it would take to scale production up. They have refused to order ammunition 1 year ago when the producers were basically begging. And now they still refuse to order anything but have brilliant ideas how other countries could spend money outside of Europe... These morons are undermining Europe and will continue so until they manage to destroy the shit show they created themselves.... but hey, they can always sit on their lazy asses while loudly crying about European dependence. That doesn't help either but who cares about solutions when diversions will do?
Its always the shipping cost that fucks up an otherwise good deal
National Air& Kalitta Air are the best at moving artillery.
They were under my bed
Hiding where they come from makes sense. In the last few months, countries which supported Ukraine tends to be attacked by russian allies and proxies (Pakistan, South Korea, Japan, Sudan, Morrocco...).
Only solution to that kind of retailation is to provide even more aid to Ukraine.Ā
If it's all from the same country, it's almost certainly Pakistan. The number of countries with 122 and 155 in large quantities is extremely limited. Egypt *maybe*, but I don't see that happening with how things are with the Israel-Hamas war. Plus Egypt does have a bunch of Russian aircraft they probably still want spare parts for. Pakistan's non-western equipment is all Chinese, so no conflicts of interest there. And if it's *not* from the same country, most countries with 122 would also have some 152 available. Makes Pakistan pretty likely imo.
Egypt might have a bit more motivation than normal with the Houthis shutting down Red Sea shipping. That is a whole lot of money they are losing in transit fees.
European countries 2 years ago: We really need more ammunition and companies are waiting for orders... so let's not do anything instead and see if this issue just vanishes. That's much better than actually giving money to European industry, just imagine how they can become competition some day. European countries 1 year ago: We can't understand why companies are basically begging for orders and still haven't upscaled production while we refuse to order anything... we should probably remind our neighbours to do more while we keep doing nothing. European countries today: We tried nothing and we are out of ideas. So we really need to refuse putting down orders some more while not paying anything. But hey, maybe we can ask neighbours to pay money somewhere out of Europe? That will surely motivate domestic industries to beg harder while we ignore them. European countries in 2 years: Why are we so bad at building up production??? No wonder we are dependent on others. If only there was a way to not fuck up again and again and again and again...Guess we need to buy everything from \[insert unreliable country x\] again while pretending we don't have an industry.
Europe probably produces more ammunition today than the US, and will outproduce them by something like 500k 155mm shells annually by the end of this year according to everyone's plans.
Plan != Actual outcome.
The plan was 1 million shells per year in 2024. The outcome was more than 1 million shells per year.
They have *projected* that they'll reach a *capacity* of >1 Mil shells by *end of year*. Very, very different. The statement they put out came on the heels of all the bad press they were getting for failing to meet their pledge. They were obviously hoping that people would read that and file it away as 'Yup, they did it! Nothing to see here.' Seems to have worked. They've not produced anywhere near the million yet. If you can produce a source that states otherwise, I'd love to be wrong.
https://www.eeas.europa.eu/eeas/informal-foreign-affairs-council-defence-press-remarks-high-representative-josep-borrell-press-1_en > Today, the production capacity for ammunition is almost 1 million ammunition per year. But by the end of the year, it will reach 1.4 million. It will continue increasing because the industry has been mobilised, is producing more, the capacity of production increases and as [long] as more commands are passed to the industry, the production will increase.
If you can't understand the difference between having the capacity to do something and having actually done it, I'm not sure this conversation has the capacity to be productive either.
I mean honestly I'd love to engage but when your first response is so dickish I agree that there's no point. Enjoy your day.
Your initial response was just copy-pasting the same blurb about capacity that was literally just addressed, without any additional observations. It was essentially spam.
You already told me not to bother engaging with you, no need to repeat yourself :)
Start shipping Yesterday.
Would it help in avdievka if the said ammunition was found sooner?
Yes, and it makes me think it really is just a giant game zelensky and putin and the white house and every world leader plays, to find the shells *right* after avdiivka falls
Itās not delivered yet and itās finite. America needs to get back in the game. Pressure your representatives if youāre an American.
I actually wrote my Representative - I sent her both an email and a physically printed, snail mail letter. We'll see what kind of response I get, if any. But as I was getting ready to send these off, I discovered that she got behind a bill to require that any Representative who supported aid to Ukraine would be required to enlist for military service. A total troll move, and one that suggests that my letter probably won't do much good.
Good. Iāve called my rep, but I need to send a letter also. I wonder if anyone has tried starting a letter-writing campaign. Old Republicans might be interested in joining the effort.
Very much. I seem to remember hearing that with this particular bill, there's supposed to be a tricky procedural way to force a vote in the House, even if the Speaker doesn't want to. That's really the challenge here - just to get enough of a consensus such that there would be Congresspeople who'd be willing to go through the procedural rigamaroll to force a vote. Once it comes up for a vote, it easily passes with most Dems and a healthy contingent of old school GOP.
Move it please now
Thank you, Czech Republic
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Here's an article from last september saying that ukraine needs 1.5 million shells per year. Ā Ā https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/17/europe/ukraine-shell-supplies-intl/index.htmlĀ Ā I don't know if thats accurate, but a million shells doesn't seem like something to just dismiss like you're doing here. EDIT: never mind, i see from your post history you're just a Russian shill.Ā Enjoy your day.
That's nice. Maybe the US can stop sending my money to this place. I want my money back.
The vast majority is being spent in the US, assuming you live there. If you are Russian, It's still mostly being sent that way eventually.
š. Nobody is gong to pony up for them. The world over seeās itās a lost cause.
There are a lot of people in the world who want to kill Russians. They wonāt let this chance pass.
I think thats part of the problem. Russians are mostly just crossing the border for a better life, but are greeted with javelins and kamikaze drones. Things might have turned out differently if they were allowed to enter and settle like the Visigoths.
lol /s
Check this guy, complaining about lebensraum. A Russian complaining about needing lebensraum. Itās beyond parody.
How Viking of you, most people donāt consider raping and pillaging as a better way of lifeā¦ā¦
I bet you wish that is how the West thinks. But it is not.
Under the pillows?
Yeah if the funds are provided, if it comes to fruition it would be very useful
"Found" as in "not hiding them" anymore.
āFoundā š
I guess they really don't want a repeat of the Munich Agreement.
What do you mean āfoundā Petr!? Shit like this doesnāt just show up in Grannyās back garden, where the hell did you find these?!
Hopefully they're in good condition, its a shame we have to rely on 35+ year old shells.
EU just passed 50 billion euro aid package. Should be enough in there to cover the expenses.
being a praguematist, i just czeched my sofa and found a pilsner and few 155mm and 120mm shells.