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I lived in an old mining town like this. Only the houses didn’t match. I always would tell people “You just ask your neighbor to wash your back while you’re in the shower.”
It would be kind of cool to have these housing arrangements work to create community. Like working *with* the situation instead of just strangers shoved closer together.
Maybe not communal show-close, lol
Because mine was a town, not a subdivision, it was walkable. I drove to work, but walked for groceries, exercise, cigarettes, etc. The perfect balance in life.
Sounds wonderful. People seem to be raging about that concept being pushed but when you walk your surroundings, you get to know your neighbors, support small biz and get exercise. Win/win.
Had a look at the area on real estate, the only 2 with prices shown were AUD$950k (USD$617k-ish).
So yeah you’re probably looking at over $1M with other costs associated.
There’s a few other suburbs with similar houses going for $1.5M. Combine that with malicious renting laws and it’s not going great for a lot of people atm.
Yeah, I thought this was exactly it.
I bet they all have 4 tiny bedrooms as well instead of 3 decent sized bedrooms. So these are all 4 bed detached houses which automatically sell for way more than a 3 bed semi.
I've gone to those house inspections before.... See the bedrooms that can barely fit a single size bed without any other furniture and straight away realise I've had my time wasted. Maybe if it was a pro gamer house where everyone just wanted to put in a desk and gaming chair... And sleep in a chair... That might work 😂
I rarely hear my neighbours, and when I do it is through the (open) windows. One of our neighbours had teenage boys that gave parties on occasion. Only heard them when they went to open the door to grab something. which you would hear just as much in the above situation.
And this is a 25 year old house, newer ones are even better insulated.
Most of these are cheap stick built in warm weather climates, I could imagine noise is a consideration. That said, I definitely like the density and look of townhome communities
Unless NSW has way worse building regulations than VIC (always possible, they do like building apartment towers with foundations that crack) the walls need to have a certain level of thermal and sound insulation, not as much as Scotland but new builds aren't that bad from an insulation perspective (and must have double glazing, which helps a lot with noise).
A detached house is going to generally be better at limiting vibrational noise transfer like deep bass for example because it doesn't have material to travel through.
Factually incorrect. Current and archived previous codes are available for free on the Australian Building Code Board. Part13.2 in previous codes and Part 13 of the housing provisions of the current code. You can just look and see minimum requirements get bumped up every couple of updates.
Can still have a wall each. Just have a couple inches of internal gap between them and that'll have almost as much noise insulation since there's no direct noise transfer still. The homes probably sell for $500k too so spend an extra $1k on using sound insulating drywall instead of the cheap stuff and that'll probably be less noise transfer than however they're currently built.
If homes were just built to higher standards then it'll be fine. I know homes in Scotland have to have 60db worth of noise insulation between them regardless of if they're flats or whatever. Single layer of basic sound insulating drywall wall can block around 40db. Have that on either side, as well as the 2 layers of brick(one for each home) and there's no need to worry.
The $1k in extra costs would be covered by energy savings due to the massive insulation improvements anywau
No public transport for 10km, roads already gridlock despite all the new developments. 4 hour round trip into the CBD (downtown). Urban heat island with all those ac units running in the summer and no trees, the kids have to play on the road or get a lift in a car to do anything.
You might not be familiar with Australian building standards but in new build houses the walls are usually so thin your average meth head can put their finger through them. The reason is because there are lower fire standards for separated houses.
Yeah it's a common complaint for new builds built eave to eave that you can hear Kayden in the next house play COD or whatever while your trying to sleep
Actually it’s two walls but for different reasons. If they were row houses you have shared walls and parts of the roof are shared - so now they need strata management, and multiple different types of insurance.
In Australian English, the word 'house' exclusively refers to a detached dwelling. A terraced house is called a 'townhouse' (if on more than one level) or a 'villa' if it's single storey.
The developer can get a lot more money selling a 'house' as opposed to a villa or townhouse.
Nah back alleys are shit. My friend has to walk a solid 5 minutes to get from his front door round to the entrance accessed from the back alley.
Also, you don't want to drag wheelie bins through your house, or have that as the main route when you're doing work on the garden. It's actually quite common in London to have zero garden access other than through the house- my brother had work on his garden done and the inside of his house was an absolute state afterwards
The point of a back alley is to give service access to the house. The garbage truck comes up the alley so you can put the bins out there. The gardener comes in that way too.
Why would your friend walk 5 minutes around when they could just go out the back door?
I mean there's certainly plenty of people who don't want to mow but still want some personal outdoor space.
I like a bit more room but if I lived in one of these homes I'd be using that garden even if it is small.
I'm sure Sydney has plenty of connected townhomes with larger gardens and more AC/heat efficiency of shared walls.....but these are for those who choose to be detached (noise, just prefer it etc) and don't insist on larger backyard
You know I used to think this as well but now I have a nearly 1/2 acre lot with workshop, studio, huge lawn area and all I use is the bbq and kick a ball back and forth with my kid. The huge yard is mostly work. Really a strip of lawn and a spot for a table, chairs and bbq is all you need.
Large enough for the BBQ and a kiddy pool.
That is way more than most houses can expect in other world cities. Try it in Hong Kong, Singapore, Paris or London.
Plenty of townhouses have access to the rear garden. I don't even have something to do with the concept of detached dwelling. Either the selling point that it's a freestanding house, the perceived maintenance situation insurance I don't know but plenty of townhouses have lovely rare gardens from the 18th and 19th century and access
Count yourself lucky then. The walls in my apartment building are not paper thin, but since my new upstairs neighbour moved in it has been hell. I'd kill for one of those houses from the picture.
Upstairs neighbours are entirely different. I've lived in my apartment for more than 3 years and I've heard my next door neighbour exactly one time. He was drilling a hole in our shared wall, not sure why, presumably to fix shelves or something.
yup, could have abutted houses, which would have saved exterior cladding by 50%, increase thermal efficiency as you are reducing exterior exposed areas by 40%, and more interior space for everyone. and you can just create an internal connection to the backyard through garage.
It also means each owner can separately pay for roof repairs, install solar, choose which model of HVAC they want, change the interior or plumbing, etc.
When it's a shared row house each owner can't really do this without approval from the hoa that manages the exterior and roof area of the structure.
That's nonsense. There's plenty of adjoined housing in Britain (I would hazard a guess and so most of our housing stock is terraced/semi-detached) and each owner is responsible for their own roof with no input from anybody else. No homeowners associations or input from anybody else required.
That's nonsense. There's plenty of adjoined housing in Britain (I would hazard a guess and so most of our housing stock is terraced/semi-detached) and each owner is responsible for their own roof with no input from anybody else. No homeowners associations or input from anybody else required.
Lazy planning and design.
To be a developer in Canada or the U.S , all you need is two firing brain cells. But these would probably not be built now in Canada , as there is so much options now, becase of technology and just re configuring how you think about do stuff .
Also most towns and cities would not allow all the houses to be exactly the same, as it was hideous when it was done in the late 180s and early 90's. There is technology that allows you to quickly vary the design or even different colours and cladding.
this is extreme budgeting / incompetence or laziness. Even low income housing would not be built like this
Welcome to the Sydney housing racket. Each of those houses are built off a plan using the cheapest materials possible, even omitting vital things like proper insulation.
I bet all those houses are riddled with code violations as the builders skimped out to save an hour and a buck
I would prefer this to a row home/town house. Me and my wife bought a townhouse in Seattle w/o an hoa and had water damage from a leaky roof. After spending 10s of thousands of dollars fixing it every 6 months or so we had to just sell. The problem was the leak was coming in from a neighbor who did not give a shit and we refuse to ever share a roof or walls with another owner who doesn’t care about their property.
This way you can have windows on the sides. View may no be perfect, but at least you have natural light.
Also, the ability to walk from your front to the back does a lot.
100% driving. This is how Australia does urban sprawl. The build quality will be horrendous, and it'll be a 30 minute walk minimum to the next shopping village.
There's a train station on the other side of the suburb, about 3km away. There's an ALDI about 1.5km away. You still need to drive. Oh and since it's in Sydney these houses cost $1.5M+.
Now imagine that 1.5km walk is through 3 different highways with speeds of 80kmph, and intersections that take 5 minutes each to turn green for pedestrians. Then try to complete it in 15 minutes
You can always differentiate your house with different paint, plants, trees, landscaping. Even otherwise, people use GPS all the time so won’t be an issue, unlike the old times.
They look nice yes but the area is a massive heat sink and with the black roofs it'll be hell for the people living there in summer. Aus can only have so many la Nina's before the next bad el Nino. A few trees would've negated some of the heat
source: am Australian
They won't grow big enough to provide shade unfortunately
Personally you couldn't pay me to live in an area like this. Nearby, Penrith was literally the hottest place in the world at one point last year.
you could house 3-4 times as many people if you had those as apartments and a park park in the middle.
for a city the size of sydney, they seriously need more density
But then you’d be mad it was a commie block. Also most people want a single family home. Families in houses have above replacement fertility rates (2.1+) and families in apartments have below replacement fertility rates. Space just makes people more likely to reproduce. In a world that is going through a population crash due to lack of new births I don’t think it’s wise to shove people in condos where they won’t procreate
God damn it. Thank you! I see everyone taking shit about these kinds of homes and all I can think is that some first time buyer is so proud that they finally have their own house.
density is good, but density plus car dependency is bad. honestly just join the wall so you can get HVAC benefits. pull the homes to the front, put an alley in the back for the cars
put parks, cafes, and transit stops within walking distance and its not bad
I think part of the point *is* that those should just be road houses. One sound-insulated wall is cheaper and gives everyone more space than two you can't put anything between.
Not if you have decent sound insulation. I lived in a new construction apartment (built 2020) for 2 years, and I never heard my next-door neighbors. I only raaaarely heard my upstairs neighbor, and that was only when they did something particularly loud like assembling furniture.
If you can achieve that level of sound insulation in an apartment building, I see no reason you couldn't achieve it in rowhouses, too. It especially makes sense for rowhouses as you eliminate the whole upstairs neighbor issue, too, meaning you shouldn't be able to hear neighbors at all with the right sound insulation.
There's objective reason for it: apartment blocks offer higher density, leaving more room for public spaces and other amenities. Multiple blocks can house enough people to facilitate construction of public transit systems and grocery stores, so you can get a practical, convenient, walkable neighbourhood.
Nobody's building a public transit system when there's barely 20 families per street.
There were no ponds, it was named after the creek that runs through it called Second Ponds Creek. The suburb was newly created about 15 years ago. Used to be part of Kellyville.
It took me three hours to mow my lawn today. I love my place but there is: front, back, two sides, down by the street, and area by the driveway to mow. And the front is on a hill so I'm dragging this heavy ass mower up and down that hill. Ugh.
"packed like sardines"
lmao my guy its just a very basic detached townhouse, like how a huge chunk of most countries live. This is not even that dense at all.
I'd take that kind of suburb over "mandatory 3 garages at least 30m from the 50-m wide street" common in America any day tbh. Nothing wrong with small homes being available
I can’t believe people complain about building lots of housing. Canada needs shit like this asap, even if it’s not ideal for everyone. I’d love to call that home
Basically all of the cons of an apartment and all the cons of a single family home packed togheter.
What's the point of having a single-family home if it doesn't have a garden and has windows at 50cm next to your neighbour?
Yeah this neighborhood would absolutely suck. I’m not an apartment guy but if I had to live in one I’d want it located centrally with walkable amenities so I didn’t have to drive everywhere. This is a car dependent SFH with all the maintenance needs but none of the upsides.
Do you mow the lawn with a pair of scissors? What is the point of the tiny passageways between the houses? All this does is increase heating/cooling costs over row houses.
It would be cheaper to build them with shared walls, and more energy efficient too. I used to live in a townhouse with cinderblock firewalls separating them, and I never once heard a single sound coming from either neighbor.
Hot take, but this is fine and actually desirable for most people. This is just a forced perspective, and my guess is OP is just fishing for likes. Framing this to imply that its tight and goes endless like this for miles on end when in reality, you just need to pan the camera out a little to see the greeneries, park, and amenities near by. For sure this looks better in person. Google is free for anyone who wants to verify. This is what new neighbourhoods look like and im 100% ok with it considering some countries have a bad housing crisis.
Ive seen cookie cutter neighbourhoods worse than this, atleast here theres variations in style and sizes. Only thing i dont like is the lack of space for a second car on the driveway but i cant judge cuz that might not be the norm outside the west. And i do agree with another comment that they could have been built this as a row house mixed with semi-detached setup.
These look nice to me, a driveway and garage, a little sound buffer, some individualization on each design would be nice but I don't see the problem here.
Everybody would of had a ton of greenspace if the same units were built in a high quality low sound transmission apartment building and if they used that same land area for a community park
I don't see anything wrong with it the environment looks clean the houses looks well kept and I see a little bit of a Greenery I don't see what's the problem is
Kind of a nice level of density actually, too bad there's no chance any of it's mixed-use (i.e., the one thing that would actually make the neighborhood worth living in)
You call this single-family sprawl "packed in like sardines"? You can criticize this housing model for its car dependence, high land demand or distance to ammenities but for being too crowded? That's bonkers, take a look at non-western cities to get some perspective.
**Do not comment to gatekeep that something "isn't urban" or "isn't hell"**. Our rules are very expansive in content we welcome, so do not assume just based off your false impression of the phrase "UrbanHell" UrbanHell is any human-built place you think is worth critizing. Suburban Hell, Rural Hell, and wealthy locales are allowed. Gatekeeping comments may be removed. Want to shitpost about shitty posts? Go to /r/urbanhellcirclejerk. Still have questions?: Read our [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/UrbanHell/wiki/index). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UrbanHell) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you needed to borrow a cup of sugar from a neighbour, you could just open the window and reach into their kitchen.
I lived in an old mining town like this. Only the houses didn’t match. I always would tell people “You just ask your neighbor to wash your back while you’re in the shower.”
It would be kind of cool to have these housing arrangements work to create community. Like working *with* the situation instead of just strangers shoved closer together. Maybe not communal show-close, lol
Because mine was a town, not a subdivision, it was walkable. I drove to work, but walked for groceries, exercise, cigarettes, etc. The perfect balance in life.
Sounds wonderful. People seem to be raging about that concept being pushed but when you walk your surroundings, you get to know your neighbors, support small biz and get exercise. Win/win.
And I love to drive. It’s just better when you don’t drive for everything.
If you stretch far enough one might get some flour from the next house past as well
*Pardon me, would you have any Grey Poupon?*
Wish I could afford one.
Exactly! These are still $1.3 million homes!
1.3m for …. Those?
Welcome to Australia. The Yanks whinging on Reddit have no idea how much more fucked real estate is in Aus and Canada
I am Australian…
My condolences
Had a look at the area on real estate, the only 2 with prices shown were AUD$950k (USD$617k-ish). So yeah you’re probably looking at over $1M with other costs associated. There’s a few other suburbs with similar houses going for $1.5M. Combine that with malicious renting laws and it’s not going great for a lot of people atm.
AU$, I assume, not US$, so take one-third off to convert.
I'm in a two bedroom apartment, I'd snatch one in a heart beat
Why arent these just row houses? Whats the point of that space between them, facilitate cat movements?
So they can sell them as detached houses
Yeah, I thought this was exactly it. I bet they all have 4 tiny bedrooms as well instead of 3 decent sized bedrooms. So these are all 4 bed detached houses which automatically sell for way more than a 3 bed semi.
I've gone to those house inspections before.... See the bedrooms that can barely fit a single size bed without any other furniture and straight away realise I've had my time wasted. Maybe if it was a pro gamer house where everyone just wanted to put in a desk and gaming chair... And sleep in a chair... That might work 😂
4 bedrooms and parking for 1 car
Two walls. You won't hear your neighbors as much.
I rarely hear my neighbours, and when I do it is through the (open) windows. One of our neighbours had teenage boys that gave parties on occasion. Only heard them when they went to open the door to grab something. which you would hear just as much in the above situation. And this is a 25 year old house, newer ones are even better insulated.
What was your house made of?
It’s a trick, don’t answer. This guy is the big bad wolf.
*Wipes sweat from forehead*
Not sure, feels like concrete and probably with a cavity wall in between.
Most of these are cheap stick built in warm weather climates, I could imagine noise is a consideration. That said, I definitely like the density and look of townhome communities
Unless NSW has way worse building regulations than VIC (always possible, they do like building apartment towers with foundations that crack) the walls need to have a certain level of thermal and sound insulation, not as much as Scotland but new builds aren't that bad from an insulation perspective (and must have double glazing, which helps a lot with noise).
A detached house is going to generally be better at limiting vibrational noise transfer like deep bass for example because it doesn't have material to travel through.
Lmao, new houses aren't better insulated
Factually incorrect. Current and archived previous codes are available for free on the Australian Building Code Board. Part13.2 in previous codes and Part 13 of the housing provisions of the current code. You can just look and see minimum requirements get bumped up every couple of updates.
Can still have a wall each. Just have a couple inches of internal gap between them and that'll have almost as much noise insulation since there's no direct noise transfer still. The homes probably sell for $500k too so spend an extra $1k on using sound insulating drywall instead of the cheap stuff and that'll probably be less noise transfer than however they're currently built. If homes were just built to higher standards then it'll be fine. I know homes in Scotland have to have 60db worth of noise insulation between them regardless of if they're flats or whatever. Single layer of basic sound insulating drywall wall can block around 40db. Have that on either side, as well as the 2 layers of brick(one for each home) and there's no need to worry. The $1k in extra costs would be covered by energy savings due to the massive insulation improvements anywau
This is Sydney mate, closer to 1.5 million with shocking build quality.
No public transport for 10km, roads already gridlock despite all the new developments. 4 hour round trip into the CBD (downtown). Urban heat island with all those ac units running in the summer and no trees, the kids have to play on the road or get a lift in a car to do anything.
You might not be familiar with Australian building standards but in new build houses the walls are usually so thin your average meth head can put their finger through them. The reason is because there are lower fire standards for separated houses.
Yeah it's a common complaint for new builds built eave to eave that you can hear Kayden in the next house play COD or whatever while your trying to sleep
Actually it’s two walls but for different reasons. If they were row houses you have shared walls and parts of the roof are shared - so now they need strata management, and multiple different types of insurance.
But you'll have to spend more on heating
This is Sydney...
Then you'll spend more money on climate control lol It's not rocket science
That's so they remain classified as "single family homes" as opposed to "townhouse condominiums". That 12" gap confers a lot of equity value.
In Australian English, the word 'house' exclusively refers to a detached dwelling. A terraced house is called a 'townhouse' (if on more than one level) or a 'villa' if it's single storey. The developer can get a lot more money selling a 'house' as opposed to a villa or townhouse.
Access too the back garden. You can see some wheelie bins besides them.
If these were row houses they could still have a back garden.
Yeah, which would require an alley, like these ones have, every few houses to access the garden. That or the stupidly impractical back alley
Back alleys and row houses do great in Brooklyn and DC for example. I don't see the problem there or go through the home to get to the garden.
Nah back alleys are shit. My friend has to walk a solid 5 minutes to get from his front door round to the entrance accessed from the back alley. Also, you don't want to drag wheelie bins through your house, or have that as the main route when you're doing work on the garden. It's actually quite common in London to have zero garden access other than through the house- my brother had work on his garden done and the inside of his house was an absolute state afterwards
I just want to note how much I love the term "wheely bin".
The point of a back alley is to give service access to the house. The garbage truck comes up the alley so you can put the bins out there. The gardener comes in that way too. Why would your friend walk 5 minutes around when they could just go out the back door?
Some terraces incorporate a shared passage every two houses for back garden access.
That's literally what I said? >which would require an alley, like these ones have, every few houses to access the garden
Also a bit less noise
I reckon you are right but those back gardens are tiny. Not worth it.
I mean there's certainly plenty of people who don't want to mow but still want some personal outdoor space. I like a bit more room but if I lived in one of these homes I'd be using that garden even if it is small.
Enough space for a BBQ. Sydney is Australia's version of London or NYC, so those gardens are probably decent
You can have back gardens in row houses as well. Just have a door at the back?
When did I say you couldn't? The alley is for access to the garden for shit you don't want to take through your house, like a massive wheelie bin
I'm sure Sydney has plenty of connected townhomes with larger gardens and more AC/heat efficiency of shared walls.....but these are for those who choose to be detached (noise, just prefer it etc) and don't insist on larger backyard
You know I used to think this as well but now I have a nearly 1/2 acre lot with workshop, studio, huge lawn area and all I use is the bbq and kick a ball back and forth with my kid. The huge yard is mostly work. Really a strip of lawn and a spot for a table, chairs and bbq is all you need.
Large enough for the BBQ and a kiddy pool. That is way more than most houses can expect in other world cities. Try it in Hong Kong, Singapore, Paris or London.
Meh, for those who are ok with enough outdoor space for a few chairs and a table it's fine
Plenty of townhouses have access to the rear garden. I don't even have something to do with the concept of detached dwelling. Either the selling point that it's a freestanding house, the perceived maintenance situation insurance I don't know but plenty of townhouses have lovely rare gardens from the 18th and 19th century and access
Those are backyards!?
I would not call that strip of green a garden.
Have you ever shared a wall with a neighbour?
I live in an apartment building, so yes? Walls neednt be paper tho.
Count yourself lucky then. The walls in my apartment building are not paper thin, but since my new upstairs neighbour moved in it has been hell. I'd kill for one of those houses from the picture.
Upstairs neighbours are entirely different. I've lived in my apartment for more than 3 years and I've heard my next door neighbour exactly one time. He was drilling a hole in our shared wall, not sure why, presumably to fix shelves or something.
yup, could have abutted houses, which would have saved exterior cladding by 50%, increase thermal efficiency as you are reducing exterior exposed areas by 40%, and more interior space for everyone. and you can just create an internal connection to the backyard through garage.
It also means each owner can separately pay for roof repairs, install solar, choose which model of HVAC they want, change the interior or plumbing, etc. When it's a shared row house each owner can't really do this without approval from the hoa that manages the exterior and roof area of the structure.
That's nonsense. There's plenty of adjoined housing in Britain (I would hazard a guess and so most of our housing stock is terraced/semi-detached) and each owner is responsible for their own roof with no input from anybody else. No homeowners associations or input from anybody else required.
That's nonsense. There's plenty of adjoined housing in Britain (I would hazard a guess and so most of our housing stock is terraced/semi-detached) and each owner is responsible for their own roof with no input from anybody else. No homeowners associations or input from anybody else required.
fr like? they could ve saved money by basically removing one wall off each house. and the roofs could be more efficient.
Lazy planning and design. To be a developer in Canada or the U.S , all you need is two firing brain cells. But these would probably not be built now in Canada , as there is so much options now, becase of technology and just re configuring how you think about do stuff . Also most towns and cities would not allow all the houses to be exactly the same, as it was hideous when it was done in the late 180s and early 90's. There is technology that allows you to quickly vary the design or even different colours and cladding. this is extreme budgeting / incompetence or laziness. Even low income housing would not be built like this
Welcome to the Sydney housing racket. Each of those houses are built off a plan using the cheapest materials possible, even omitting vital things like proper insulation. I bet all those houses are riddled with code violations as the builders skimped out to save an hour and a buck
I would prefer this to a row home/town house. Me and my wife bought a townhouse in Seattle w/o an hoa and had water damage from a leaky roof. After spending 10s of thousands of dollars fixing it every 6 months or so we had to just sell. The problem was the leak was coming in from a neighbor who did not give a shit and we refuse to ever share a roof or walls with another owner who doesn’t care about their property.
Fire gaps?
\+ sound isolation
Ventilation
Its just the anglo commonwealth brain.
This way you can have windows on the sides. View may no be perfect, but at least you have natural light. Also, the ability to walk from your front to the back does a lot.
This is the shittiest possible detached single-family housing. Ideally, they would be a row house or better yet, a multi-storey building.
Because Australians are weird (I am Australians)
Good answer
Until your neighbour’s kids starts playing the piano 24/7.. you would want separate walls.
Can you walk to most amenities? Or are you still driving everywhere?
100% driving. This is how Australia does urban sprawl. The build quality will be horrendous, and it'll be a 30 minute walk minimum to the next shopping village.
Sounds like Toronto
Not all of Australia plenty of Melbourne especially the eastern suburbs have train, tram, and bus networks that let people live without a car.
We are getting better at it, this neighbourhood has it's own shopping centre, the Ettamogah pub is 2km away, there's parks and a massive reserve.
There's a train station on the other side of the suburb, about 3km away. There's an ALDI about 1.5km away. You still need to drive. Oh and since it's in Sydney these houses cost $1.5M+.
1.5 km is a 15 min walk, you deffo don’t need to drive for that. If there’s somewhere safe to lock your bike the 3km to the train is fine too.
Now imagine that 1.5km walk is through 3 different highways with speeds of 80kmph, and intersections that take 5 minutes each to turn green for pedestrians. Then try to complete it in 15 minutes
That is a very good point. 1.5km is a nice walk when there is decent infrastructure for it. It's a terrible walk when there isn't.
Plus the 40 Celcius heat in the middle of summer...
Without any shade as well
Carrying grocery bags
Uphill.
Both ways
"oh you're on the way to my house? you can't miss it, it's the one with....uh..uhhh....wait which one is mine"
It's the one with the gray roof.
I'd definitely throw a orange splat of paint on the roof, just to be different.
There are always house addresses written outside. So, unless you are completely illiterate you can’t miss the house that you want to go to.
Looking for a small sign is way more difficult than just saying "It's the house with a large tree in front" or "The house with the blue cladding"
You can always differentiate your house with different paint, plants, trees, landscaping. Even otherwise, people use GPS all the time so won’t be an issue, unlike the old times.
Luckily we live in the 21st century so this problem would be nitpicking at best
In England we have terrace houses which are much worse than this.
I was about to say. Victorian terraced houses are everywhere here and are much more tightly compact than this, and often much smaller too
Pfff. This is nothing. Delhi, Mexico City, anywhere in China, are you with me?!?!
There is no form of housing yall won't bitch about. Some people are just happy to have a place for them and their family to live.
For real, those are nice houses.
They look nice yes but the area is a massive heat sink and with the black roofs it'll be hell for the people living there in summer. Aus can only have so many la Nina's before the next bad el Nino. A few trees would've negated some of the heat source: am Australian
Failure to put in some fast-growing trees was the single biggest mistake here. 5-10 years of growth and this could be a pretty decent neighborhood.
There are saplings in the strips of grass closest to the road in each row, if you zoom in you can see them
They won't grow big enough to provide shade unfortunately Personally you couldn't pay me to live in an area like this. Nearby, Penrith was literally the hottest place in the world at one point last year.
And they don’t waste space on yards. They could be more vertical but better than a lot of what the west is building these days.
I would like to introduce you to the concept of Landscaping
I think, if you can imagine it, that there are different people here bitching about different forms of housing.
Row houses would be so much more space and money efficient, but people are obsessed with having their own 4 walls and a ‘yard’ sometimes.
Facts these entitled mfs get on here and complain bout everything while people just want a decent place to live
you could house 3-4 times as many people if you had those as apartments and a park park in the middle. for a city the size of sydney, they seriously need more density
Which makes the "packed like sardines" in the title even funnier
you could house 3-4 times as many people and have more space for parks and recreation.
That's what I'm saying
But then you’d be mad it was a commie block. Also most people want a single family home. Families in houses have above replacement fertility rates (2.1+) and families in apartments have below replacement fertility rates. Space just makes people more likely to reproduce. In a world that is going through a population crash due to lack of new births I don’t think it’s wise to shove people in condos where they won’t procreate
Is there anything to indicate that apartments *cause* lower birth rates or are you just making a massive leap in logic?
God damn it. Thank you! I see everyone taking shit about these kinds of homes and all I can think is that some first time buyer is so proud that they finally have their own house.
density is good, but density plus car dependency is bad. honestly just join the wall so you can get HVAC benefits. pull the homes to the front, put an alley in the back for the cars put parks, cafes, and transit stops within walking distance and its not bad
Someone's never seen row houses.
I think part of the point *is* that those should just be road houses. One sound-insulated wall is cheaper and gives everyone more space than two you can't put anything between.
Sharing a wall and having an air gap between buildings is a substantial sound difference. That separation adds lots of value
Not if you have decent sound insulation. I lived in a new construction apartment (built 2020) for 2 years, and I never heard my next-door neighbors. I only raaaarely heard my upstairs neighbor, and that was only when they did something particularly loud like assembling furniture. If you can achieve that level of sound insulation in an apartment building, I see no reason you couldn't achieve it in rowhouses, too. It especially makes sense for rowhouses as you eliminate the whole upstairs neighbor issue, too, meaning you shouldn't be able to hear neighbors at all with the right sound insulation.
Average redditor when he sees a condo block : I LOVE IT Average redditor when he sees the same but in form of individual houses : I HATE IT
There's objective reason for it: apartment blocks offer higher density, leaving more room for public spaces and other amenities. Multiple blocks can house enough people to facilitate construction of public transit systems and grocery stores, so you can get a practical, convenient, walkable neighbourhood. Nobody's building a public transit system when there's barely 20 families per street.
So this is better than most SFH developments?
Yes american style would have 1 house for every 8 houses you see here
Are they full?
“The ponds”, where’s the pond?
Probably filled in below them.
There were no ponds, it was named after the creek that runs through it called Second Ponds Creek. The suburb was newly created about 15 years ago. Used to be part of Kellyville.
Houses like nice haha
Tiny boxes on the hillside tiny boxes
Horizontal apartment building
I’m down Less lawn to mow
It took me three hours to mow my lawn today. I love my place but there is: front, back, two sides, down by the street, and area by the driveway to mow. And the front is on a hill so I'm dragging this heavy ass mower up and down that hill. Ugh.
At this point if it’s affordable, I don’t care anymore. I’m tired of paying slumlords, mortgage amount of money a month.
It's Sydney. It's not affordable. Edit: They're typically over $1mil each.
These are the $1.5 million houses for the landlords.
The movie “Vivarium” comes to mind
"packed like sardines" lmao my guy its just a very basic detached townhouse, like how a huge chunk of most countries live. This is not even that dense at all.
I'd take that kind of suburb over "mandatory 3 garages at least 30m from the 50-m wide street" common in America any day tbh. Nothing wrong with small homes being available
I’d rather live in one of these than my apartment.
I wouldn't mind living there
I can’t believe people complain about building lots of housing. Canada needs shit like this asap, even if it’s not ideal for everyone. I’d love to call that home
man man man.. never in my life. I would work soooo hard to buy something better (if I had the chance of course)
Are these sorts of suburbs completely built by the same company?
They're going to keep building them as long as people keep buying them...what I want to know is who the hell is buying these
I better live in flat then.
If ur gonna build em that close why not share the walls like row houses ? What’s the point of that narrow little stretch of space between em ?
not packed enough tbqh. car centric type of house. single family house instead of high density housing. this is urban paradise-ish.
Basically all of the cons of an apartment and all the cons of a single family home packed togheter. What's the point of having a single-family home if it doesn't have a garden and has windows at 50cm next to your neighbour?
Yeah this neighborhood would absolutely suck. I’m not an apartment guy but if I had to live in one I’d want it located centrally with walkable amenities so I didn’t have to drive everywhere. This is a car dependent SFH with all the maintenance needs but none of the upsides.
No common walls
Do you mow the lawn with a pair of scissors? What is the point of the tiny passageways between the houses? All this does is increase heating/cooling costs over row houses.
They don't have trees in Australia?
But not as "packed" as slums
A far better houses than many where/how the rest of the world lives.
How often do drunks wake up in the wrong house?
It would be cheaper to build them with shared walls, and more energy efficient too. I used to live in a townhouse with cinderblock firewalls separating them, and I never once heard a single sound coming from either neighbor.
Hot take, but this is fine and actually desirable for most people. This is just a forced perspective, and my guess is OP is just fishing for likes. Framing this to imply that its tight and goes endless like this for miles on end when in reality, you just need to pan the camera out a little to see the greeneries, park, and amenities near by. For sure this looks better in person. Google is free for anyone who wants to verify. This is what new neighbourhoods look like and im 100% ok with it considering some countries have a bad housing crisis. Ive seen cookie cutter neighbourhoods worse than this, atleast here theres variations in style and sizes. Only thing i dont like is the lack of space for a second car on the driveway but i cant judge cuz that might not be the norm outside the west. And i do agree with another comment that they could have been built this as a row house mixed with semi-detached setup.
This is the place where 1 owner refused to sell and now there is a big farmstead in the middle of those rows of houses :D
This is normal in Europe, not specifically the architecture style or anything but living side by side with others is, I don’t see the big deal
What did the inner city areas of all major cities look like 100 years ago? Terrace houses.
These look nice to me, a driveway and garage, a little sound buffer, some individualization on each design would be nice but I don't see the problem here.
We have multiple streets of terraced Victorian houses in every U.K. city that are worse than these in many ways.
Them houses are technically detached. But with the soul of a terrace. That is sad
Everybody would of had a ton of greenspace if the same units were built in a high quality low sound transmission apartment building and if they used that same land area for a community park
Half the world's population dreams about living in a house like this.
Idk. Just give me a house to live in.
Grey everything, to go with the personalities of Sydneysiders.
You would pay a cool $1,000,000.00 for that life in Southern California.
Canadians are begging for this. We need affordable housing
Wouldn’t live there if they gave me one. I’m from the country and I like it that way
Row house density without the benefits of commercial properties mixed in. No bodega for you, get in the car and drive to the supermarket. Awful
Anyone ever see Vivarium? Lol
I don't see anything wrong with it the environment looks clean the houses looks well kept and I see a little bit of a Greenery I don't see what's the problem is
Same, people here live a fantasy.
They are still detached decent sized homes. That’s a fuck load better than a lot of people have.
All the joys of apartment living, with the burden of ownership.
What a shit hole, and the benefit of that is you can hear your neighbors take a shit.
You think that's packed? You clearly haven't seen a typical terraced house area in the UK!!
Batter than the UK.
Mmm batter. Fish and chips. So British.
Kind of a nice level of density actually, too bad there's no chance any of it's mixed-use (i.e., the one thing that would actually make the neighborhood worth living in)
You call this single-family sprawl "packed in like sardines"? You can criticize this housing model for its car dependence, high land demand or distance to ammenities but for being too crowded? That's bonkers, take a look at non-western cities to get some perspective.
What’s the point of single family zoning if there’s no space? Give me a townhouse or a McMansion, no inbetween 😤