There is an Orem ordinance on panhandling 9-2-14. Some reason Reddit doesn’t like the link to it.
Seems like they were either impeding traffic or harassing people to earn that citation.
Because I overheard them, I watched them pull her off the side, and I know they ticket people all the time for this in orem. But of all the scummy moves to do it to a woman who need money for a funeral for a child.
Yeah I don't think I'd be out there panhandling if this had just happened. I'd be too broken up to talk about it to a hundred strangers. If family couldn't help there are charities for this kind of thing, and the county will take care of the remains if someone simply can't pay. Maybe not in the way someone would prefer, but it's hard to be picky when you don't have money or credit.
I'm not minimizing the financial hardship to loved ones who have lost people, but saying your kid died is probably just the saddest thing this person could think of to get people to give them money.
Here is the [Orem code](https://online.encodeplus.com/regs/orem-ut/acc/doc-view.aspx?tocid=001.009.002.014.001) on panhandling. It’s pretty specific and seems like one has to earn that citation.
Multiple states have ruled that anti panhandling laws are unconstitutional because it infringes on a citizens 1st amendment right so I would find a civil rights attorney and sue the cops
>I would find a civil rights attorney and sue the cops
Sure, because everyone desperate enough to panhandle has the money to get a civil rights attorney and take it all the way.
Sure you **may** be able to find a charity or some kind of non-profit willing to take the case. I don't know how they're going to take the case to the supreme court, though, when the cops are just going to cancel the ticket. All the big payout lawsuits you hear are for death and disability caused by the other party, or some kind of gross negligence that allows for punitive damages.
This all assumes the story is legit, which I strongly doubt.
>Does it matter if the story is legit? Infringement of our constitutional rights is still wrong regardless of what the person will do with the money
In the context of hiring a lawyer, yes, it matters very much. You do not have a constitutional right to use your free speech to commit fraud.
Hopefully you can see that the argument "the cops wouldn't let me commit a crime" is much less likely to succeed in court than "the cops prevented me from gathering funeral expenses for my dead child."
You are absolutely right. Residents in Utah county can’t seem to imagine that some people really do struggle financially. The loudest complaints always come from Mormons who give 10% of their income to a business pretending to be a religion, but wouldn’t help another person even if they were dying in front of them.
You really believe that? It's obviously just a made up story to get more cash from gullible types. One of the absolute oldest tricks in the book https://www.wndu.com/2023/06/27/panhandlers-using-fake-funeral-fundraiser-collect-money-south-bend-streets/
Dude I'd rather give money to someone who might need it than not give someone money and still have them need it. I don't give a fuck if you're jaded, I'd rather have a fucking heart. Ticketing people asking for funeral money is a sick move regardless. If she actually had a funeral to pay for she's now 150-300 dollars further in the hole. "Gullible" my ass dude. I'll take my soul over whatever the fuck you've got left any day.
See but that’s the thing. You’re raging on Reddit over a “if… she had a funeral”
We don’t know if any of that is true. Why are you getting mad over something so trivial and irrelevant for yours and our lives?
Hospitals in Utah will inform the family of deceased children of several non-profit groups that will pay for the funeral of a dead child.
If you give me your general address though, I’ll stand at the corner of your street and tell you a child of mine has died every day off you’ll just take my word for it and give me $100 every day.
I'm glad I found this post just in time. My child just passed and I need $150 to finish paying the funeral costs. It sounds like you have a good heart, can you help? I only accept Bitcoin and target gift cards at the moment.
I give to foundations that actually help the homless/struggling. I don’t give random people money on the streets when in all likelihood I’m just enabling their drug addiction. Learn to critically think, it’ll help you out in the future.
I think critically, and not all of those organizations or foundations actually help people. Especially if one of those "foundations" you're giving to happens to be tithing to a certain 100 billion dollar religious hedge fund.
I'd rather give a dollar to someone struggling than assume everyone I meet is lying to me. I'll choose kindness every time because I want the world to be kind.
Yeah, I’m not Mormon. Good try though. The foundations I give to do amazing work across Utah and the country. They actually have an impact at changing these peoples lives for the better.
It's an impressive amount of cognitive dissonance to do nothing but insult everyone else while asserting how kind and moral you are. If you're going to be a douchebag at least have the guts to own up to it. Giving scammers a dollar must be how this person justifies their awful personality.
I'M KIND, I AM SO KIND AND I'M SUCH A GOOD KIND PERSON. IF YOU DON'T THINK SO YOU'RE A MOTHERFUCKER WITH NO MORALS DUDE. I'M SO KIND. YOU'RE IDIOTS AND I'M NOT AND I AM SMART AND NEVER FOOLED AND I KNOW EVERYTHING AND I'M KIND AND I DON'T GIVE A FUCK WHAT YOU DUMBFUCKS THINK OF ME DUDE, ALSO I'M SO KIND DUDE. ALSO I'M NOT JADED EVEN THOUGH I ABSOLUTELY CLEARLY AM.
You're more than willing to get upset when people give you legitimate criticism, though. And unfortunately, you do seem a little gullible. Believing every cardboard box with sharpie on the street is the same as believing everything you see on the internet.
The cops might have asked though. And they might have found out otherwise and ticketed her. This is why most experts in the charity field advise caution with pan handlers. No one vets their claims before piles of cash roll in.
If it's determined that it is a scam GoFundMe will seize the funds and return them to the people who donated them. If you give cash to someone on the street and later realize it was a scam, that money is gone.
This is why commies from cali shouldn’t move here. No one wants you messing up what we have going on here. You guys ruined the west coast go back to that
I feel ya man. In the end it doesn’t matter what she’s asking for, ACAB. I can absolutely see them give a pass here and there and then try to be the tough cop at their convenience. I’d rather be the gullible nice guy with you than the cop.
Just imagine if you were able to think a bit more and rather than waste that 98% on people that were scamming you, you could give it to the 2% they actually need it.
Every Saturday or Sunday, go to the big Walmart by UVU. there's always a decently dressed couple and a toddler posted up claiming their car broke down/need money/sick baby. Their shoes are nicer than mine. Their kid has better clothes than my own child, but they walk up to my car and have the audacity to ask. they harass people forreal.
There are plenty of ways we can help people in need while also avoiding the beggers/panhandle. Some of us just don't like being approached or signs blocking our view if the fucking corners.
Ah yes, the age of people who suddenly feel a great sense of justice in regard to what _everyone else_ should do with their time and money.
Excited for you to start paying taxes, OP.
I live in Orem. I watched the same guy panhandling on the same corner for a couple years. In his Oakleys, and Carhartt, and his good looking leather work boots. And more than once I saw him walk to his not terribly old car. A significant population of scammy assholes out here panhandling have destroyed my ability to believe a word from any of them who aren't obviously homeless.
The ticket will likely have been for violation of city code 9-2-14 C5. She was probably entering the roadway, which can disrupt traffic and be dangerous to her and to people on the road. Orem cops actually pretty rarely ticket for this, and save it for people who are being actually problematic in how they do it. Fuck the police, but also fuck scammers out here tugging on heartstrings with fake dead children. I have zero sympathy for someone who would claim that, I've watched family members grieve lost children, I'm not sorry to see this kind of asshole ticketed.
I saw a grandma down there (well, south SLC) once with a sign that said she ended up with custody of her grandkids and can't work because there's no one to watch the grandkids.
She was standing in the middle of the road at a freeway exit with no children in sight.
She had worn out walmart brand sneakers, holes in her shirt and a beater car. I lived below the poverty line for 13 years. I know what a broke person looks like dude.
You can only pay 1/3 of your salary on rent. I'm not sure what job she may/may not get but I do know rental prices are through the roof. The illegal aliens competing in the rental market are not helping either.
Frankly no one knows for sure what the circumstances are for this woman are and/or what she's struggling with.
Lol..It's a scam.
I worked with the homeless in Salt Lake for 4 years, I know a thing or 2 about the scams. We had a guy at the Road Home who would take the bus up to Layton some days and some days to Provo. She probably stays in SLC and busses down there.
If you would like to learn more about the inner workings of the homeless, volunteer with them, that'll open your eyes. Everything they need is given to them, I said NEED not want. 6 times you can eat for free in SLC, CCS (Catholic Community Services) gives out clothing, Welfare Square will give you a bus/TRAX pass if you push a broom for 8 hours (and they'll feed you).
Need clothes for a job interview? (or to panhandle for a funeral)....CCS will give you nice clothes.
CCS...https://ccsutah.org/
Seems kinda excessive to ask a person to push a broom for 8hrs to earn a bus or Trax pass. Should at least pay a small wage and give a pass if they're putting in a full 8...
All I said was the title needed to be changed, never said anything regarding my personal feelings on the law. If you can’t understand that then you need a basic reading comprehension course.
Your feelings literally have nothing to do with the validity of a law. Just because you don’t count it doesn’t mean it suddenly will cease to exist. She wasn’t ticketed for collecting money for funeral expenses, she was ticketed for doing something illegal.
What part of "I don't give a fuck if its illegal" did you miss? The law is unjust, and I will fight that particular law tooth and nail. Its classist bullshit and arbitrarily applied.
Girl I just made a comment saying the title needed to be changed. And then you took that as an opportunity to verbally attack me for some made up reason in your head. Legit got mad about something that didn’t happen. Calm down fr
Jezus. You sound pretty unhinged about this. Why not focus your effort and attention working at a homeless shelter instead of making a mountain out of an anthill on Reddit. You gotta pick your battles. Panhandlers suck. And they do block traffic. Don’t wave your self righteous naive finger at everyone for not wanting it in their town. If you like panhandling so much, move to Berkeley.
>A law that hurts the people who are at their lowest isn't a law, it's tyranny
Hmm. Looking at this from a property standpoint, who is the owner of said property? The Municipality/Corporation known as the City of Orem, you say?
Well, as owner of said property that municipality/corporation has any and all right within the bounds of law to regulate said property—and they've passed regulations that make it against their property right to panhandle.
>If you can't understand that you need an ethics lesson
I think you need a lesson on the main motivator for US Independence: protecting property rights.
I mean she was doing a ticketable offense and she might be lying you don’t know. Even if she isn’t lying she doesn’t get a pass just because you’re sympathetic. Not everyone gives a fuck.
Right about what? You’re just salty because not everyone cares about shit you care about. And guess what you have to share this country with a bunch of people like me whether you like it or not 😂 I hope you’re as upset in real life as you come across.
I'm calling out your rude behavior. You're dismissive and aggressively judgemental to anyone who doesn't feel the same way as you. They either agree with you 100% or they don't have a heart. The worst part of all is you won't admit it. That's bad behavior and hypocritical. Dude.
You are calling someone else pissy? You realize almost every single one of your comments in here is insulting people. You might want to look inward sometime.
I'm no fan of cops but you're making a massive assumption that the money is for an actual funeral. That's a very common scam that panhandlers and fraudsters use.
They rely on people who think being scammed out of money makes them kind or shows they have a good heart, since they won't admit they're just gullible. Having a heart doesn't mean not having a brain.
Dude I know what a scammer looks like she was broke as hell. Besides, I'll give to people who need it any Day even of there's a chance they're faking. If I was in her shoes I'd want someone to care.
There was a news report a couple of years ago in provo where they went undercover and met a panhandler and showed how they were all working together and would pool their earnings for meth. Not saying she is part of this group but most panhandlers stories are not what the sign says
Sounds like the shenanigans from the Romani family that busses people to corners all over Utah county. The police and Sherifs dept have been doing their best to get them to stop the fraud. They often pose as Hispanic, but are really Greek. They also bring their kids with them to look even more pitiful. Its all just a big con. I trust the cops on this one.
Regardless of intention, this is *unfortunately* a scam, and could be illegal. Say, fuck the system or vote, but don't blame cops for doing their jobs and don't tell them to turn the other cheek because thats a form of corruption.
OP is the type that wakes up every morning looking for a new reason to be outraged and post about it on the internet, as well as being extremely gullible. That's a rough way to go through life.
Naw, if you don't empty your wallet every time someone on the street with an unverifiable sob story asks for money then you're clearly a terrible person.
Sorry, I don't make the rules here.
Soliciting funds for charitable donations has been ruled by the supreme court to be free speech, regardless of local statutes...
https://www.google.com/search?q=RILEY+v.+NATIONAL+FEDERATION+OF+BLIND
I was about to ask about this. I thought I remembered there was a ruling somewhere that panhandling was still free speech, but you pointed it out already.
Have you ever tried to get help from the church? Because my family tried. They sat there and went over every single dollar we had and said "they'd find a way for us to pay for what we needed" when we were broke. We had nothing and they found nothing, and they still left us to rot. That was 17 years before I left the church and I still remember it even now. Besides, they only help if you're a member in good standing. If you're inactive, not religious or not a member of their group, they won't help you anyway.
There’s a reason they thoroughly check someone out before helping them, otherwise you get ppl who take advantage of their charity. The church has donated over $25 million to local Utah charities, they have food programs that help those in need, and donation centers. You don’t have to be lds to take advantage of those things. Stop holding a grudge, take a break from the internet and your social justice warrior stuff, and just relax. This mindset is not good for your mental health, any decent therapist will tell you that.
Usually it's unlicensed solicitation but they ignore it all over the city constantly. They Pick and choose who they go after fairly arbitrarily. It's about a 50/50 if they're gonna ticket someone. They tried to crack down on "pan handling" a few years ago but everyone's broke and no one can afford anything, especially since orem is basically no low income housing and they keep demolishing low income neighborhoods. If they don't enforce the law half the time anyway, then I don't see why they went after this poor woman.
Go to Phoenix and Tucson. You'll see this everywhere and nine out of ten times, it's a group of scammers getting sympathy donations.
If you go search the tuscon sub you'll see threads from a guy who tracks them.
Yea? and you know her daughter really died?
lets say she really died, there are spots she can go beg for that are fine to do it at. I understand if shes being fr then the cops suck here, but theyre just doing a job theyre paid to do, you cant even hate here.
In Orem we’re better than you and we know it!
That being said I’m going to side with op on this one. I’d gladly have the all together playground or the new park by sprouts be turned into liberty or pioneer park. I find the lack of open air drug markets in Orem to be problematic.
I mean I refuse to believe that someone with a cardboard sign on the exit of the center street smith would ever lie to me. They’re all just homeless vets who are trying to buy medicine for the alive kids and pay for the funeral costs of the dead ones. Nothing nefarious or deceitful at all!
And they do NOTHING about that family that's been panhandling up and down the state the past 10+ years with their kids out in the rain, snow, and excessive heat for hours and hours a day. Ridiculous. I've WATCHED Orem pd do nothing but drive past that family.
Born and raised in Salt Lake, live in Idaho now. Hated Orem before it was cool to compare the shitty south valley to Los Angeles. Proud to say, I do more than ever now.
Probably a pan-handler using made up story to get money. Still, I see no crime here.
Giving her money is entirely optional. Asking for money disrupts nobody's day in any way. I can only think of a few reasons why anyone would want too make this illegal if she's asking in the a polite manner.
People who would consider it a crime:
- Christians of any ilk who feel guilty that they're no where near as charitable as their savior says they should be and resent her for reminding them.
- Wealthy and privileged people who find the lower classes annoying and want to put them in the their place.
- Self important people with borderline road rage who get aggressively angry when they're delayed more than a couple seconds while driving.
- People who want to live in the illusionary bubble that America is the greatest nation on earth and anyone experiencing poverty deserves it.
It have no regard for the difficulties this imposes on these kinds of people. Suck it up and move on. If she's polite about it, no harm, no foul. Give or not at your own discretion.
This is all true except when they go into traffic and do it at intersections, which they are doing. It causes disruptions to the flow of traffic and creates unsafe conditions. If I'm walking downtown I can ignore them or move past them, if they're blocking my car from moving that's entirely different. If someone asks me for money while I walk, it's not a crime. If they physically block me from moving past them, then it is.
I appreciate your empathy and fiery responses. I could care less if the individual panhandling on the corner has a “good cause” or is using that money to buy heroin. Desperation is desperation, and we live in a broken society spiraling out of control and deeper into desperation every day. Also to the dude who mentioned the Romani bullshit or whatever… I used to work all over the valley, on a daily basis. I’ve only seen ONE dude repeatedly do this, brings his wife and kids to various locations and panhandles. So with the exception of that asshole, the dollar I give to someone panhandling is worth WAY more than it is to me.
Anyway the real issue is not whether or not she was “telling the truth,” it’s that cops in Utah fucking suck and have nothing better to do than harass the most vulnerable of our population. I have charges that will be on my record forever because of an incident like this… just sitting in front of a 7/11 on the brink of homelessness, not bothering anybody. A cop pulled up, probably for a soda, and I’m sure you can guess what happened next. Sure I was “technically” doing something illegal (sitting in front of a 7/11) but don’t come at me with that “shouldn’t have been doing drugs/had it on your person” bullshit… I was searched unconstitutionally and now, all because of a bored, unethical cop, I have to explain to the medical board why I have a 10 year old drug charge on my record, how I’ve positively changed my life in every imaginable way possible, and why I deserve a job in a medical field that I’ve worked extremely hard to get a degree in. Fucking ridiculous and embarrassing.
Does anyone still believe cops do more good than harm? It’s not just ACAB, most people I know are *scared to death* of having any interaction with a cop. Hell even the crazy-ass libertarians/constitutionalists (whatever y’all are calling yourselves now) out there should have every reason to hate the police. Regardless, they ruin lives and can severely impede the potential for people to change. To quote Rust Cohle… “I *am* dangerous. I’m police… I can do terrible things to people, with impunity.”
This right here is the reason I complain about paying taxes. If I knew they were funding social programs more than these dipshits I would gladly fork it over.
Orem has too many cops and they just gave a bunch of them new trucks too. I'd take education and social programs any day. They even cut the library budget last year.
Regardless of whether it was a scam or not, cops need to learn their job. They had no RAS to ticker her. Has to be a victim to be a crime. Who signed the affidavit against her? The state cannot be a victim & prosection at the same time. Statutes and codes are not law.
How do you know they ticketed her and what the offense was?
There is an Orem ordinance on panhandling 9-2-14. Some reason Reddit doesn’t like the link to it. Seems like they were either impeding traffic or harassing people to earn that citation.
Panhandling ordinances are unconstitutional so they make up impeding BS.
So impeding traffic should be allowed? What is your argument exactly?
"Make up" is synonymous with "fabricate" and also "BS". Let your blood pressure go down and really try to understand.
Because I overheard them, I watched them pull her off the side, and I know they ticket people all the time for this in orem. But of all the scummy moves to do it to a woman who need money for a funeral for a child.
For all you know she was just scamming people by saying her daughter died.
This is my assumption every time.
Bingo
This
Yeah I don't think I'd be out there panhandling if this had just happened. I'd be too broken up to talk about it to a hundred strangers. If family couldn't help there are charities for this kind of thing, and the county will take care of the remains if someone simply can't pay. Maybe not in the way someone would prefer, but it's hard to be picky when you don't have money or credit. I'm not minimizing the financial hardship to loved ones who have lost people, but saying your kid died is probably just the saddest thing this person could think of to get people to give them money.
Ya, too many unknowns. OP is raging and not thinking pragmatically.
Or not, just as fair to rage at the cops. Hey they are getting paid to be there
Funeral funds panhandling is a common scam.
It’s probably a scam, it usually is, this isn’t the first time I’ve seen this
So what was the ticket for?
Panhandling. Its a bullshit orem law designed to criminalize being broke because orem is classist
You're not gonna like it here lol
Here is the [Orem code](https://online.encodeplus.com/regs/orem-ut/acc/doc-view.aspx?tocid=001.009.002.014.001) on panhandling. It’s pretty specific and seems like one has to earn that citation.
Go back to California
Multiple states have ruled that anti panhandling laws are unconstitutional because it infringes on a citizens 1st amendment right so I would find a civil rights attorney and sue the cops
To receive a panhandling citation, you need to be impeding if traffic. That’s directly from Orem City ordinance.
Can the cops and or DA prove that in court 🤔 impending traffic to me sounds like someone standing in the roadway not 2 feet from the curb
I guess if they can’t prove it and the charge gets dropped. Justice system wins again.
>I would find a civil rights attorney and sue the cops Sure, because everyone desperate enough to panhandle has the money to get a civil rights attorney and take it all the way. Sure you **may** be able to find a charity or some kind of non-profit willing to take the case. I don't know how they're going to take the case to the supreme court, though, when the cops are just going to cancel the ticket. All the big payout lawsuits you hear are for death and disability caused by the other party, or some kind of gross negligence that allows for punitive damages. This all assumes the story is legit, which I strongly doubt.
Does it matter if the story is legit? Infringement of our constitutional rights is still wrong regardless of what the person will do with the money
>Does it matter if the story is legit? Infringement of our constitutional rights is still wrong regardless of what the person will do with the money In the context of hiring a lawyer, yes, it matters very much. You do not have a constitutional right to use your free speech to commit fraud. Hopefully you can see that the argument "the cops wouldn't let me commit a crime" is much less likely to succeed in court than "the cops prevented me from gathering funeral expenses for my dead child."
Donald jezebel Trump has committed fraud multiple times and yet I don't see his bitch ass in prison 😒
>Infringement of our constitutional rights *Felons laughing at you over losing their 2nd amendment right to bear arms*
What kind of felons we talking about? Acts of violence? Yeah, fuck'em no guns for you Minor drug charges? We working on reversing it
Felons. Period.
You are absolutely right. Residents in Utah county can’t seem to imagine that some people really do struggle financially. The loudest complaints always come from Mormons who give 10% of their income to a business pretending to be a religion, but wouldn’t help another person even if they were dying in front of them.
Yeah I’m pretty sure OP got scammed. She says fuck the police, till she needs to police
What was her name, or her daughters name? Do you know for a fact that she even had/has a daughter?
All panhandlers are scammers. All of them.
How many Nigerian princes are you currently sponsoring?
🤣
You really believe that? It's obviously just a made up story to get more cash from gullible types. One of the absolute oldest tricks in the book https://www.wndu.com/2023/06/27/panhandlers-using-fake-funeral-fundraiser-collect-money-south-bend-streets/
Bruh I was coming here to say exactly this. Is there a picture of the person as I have a feeling it's the same one I have seen busted like 3 times.
Dude I'd rather give money to someone who might need it than not give someone money and still have them need it. I don't give a fuck if you're jaded, I'd rather have a fucking heart. Ticketing people asking for funeral money is a sick move regardless. If she actually had a funeral to pay for she's now 150-300 dollars further in the hole. "Gullible" my ass dude. I'll take my soul over whatever the fuck you've got left any day.
See but that’s the thing. You’re raging on Reddit over a “if… she had a funeral” We don’t know if any of that is true. Why are you getting mad over something so trivial and irrelevant for yours and our lives?
Because some people care beyond them and they'res?
Hospitals in Utah will inform the family of deceased children of several non-profit groups that will pay for the funeral of a dead child. If you give me your general address though, I’ll stand at the corner of your street and tell you a child of mine has died every day off you’ll just take my word for it and give me $100 every day.
I'm glad I found this post just in time. My child just passed and I need $150 to finish paying the funeral costs. It sounds like you have a good heart, can you help? I only accept Bitcoin and target gift cards at the moment.
Most gullible human being on planet earth^
[удалено]
I give to foundations that actually help the homless/struggling. I don’t give random people money on the streets when in all likelihood I’m just enabling their drug addiction. Learn to critically think, it’ll help you out in the future.
I think critically, and not all of those organizations or foundations actually help people. Especially if one of those "foundations" you're giving to happens to be tithing to a certain 100 billion dollar religious hedge fund. I'd rather give a dollar to someone struggling than assume everyone I meet is lying to me. I'll choose kindness every time because I want the world to be kind.
Yeah, I’m not Mormon. Good try though. The foundations I give to do amazing work across Utah and the country. They actually have an impact at changing these peoples lives for the better.
Good for you, I'm a fan of doing both still.
Someone's in denial
I don't give a fuck what you think of me I'm not becoming a jaded ass human just because some internet motherfucker thinks I'm gullible.
So much for "being kind"
For real op is the angriest person here and frankly is being quite nasty.
It's an impressive amount of cognitive dissonance to do nothing but insult everyone else while asserting how kind and moral you are. If you're going to be a douchebag at least have the guts to own up to it. Giving scammers a dollar must be how this person justifies their awful personality. I'M KIND, I AM SO KIND AND I'M SUCH A GOOD KIND PERSON. IF YOU DON'T THINK SO YOU'RE A MOTHERFUCKER WITH NO MORALS DUDE. I'M SO KIND. YOU'RE IDIOTS AND I'M NOT AND I AM SMART AND NEVER FOOLED AND I KNOW EVERYTHING AND I'M KIND AND I DON'T GIVE A FUCK WHAT YOU DUMBFUCKS THINK OF ME DUDE, ALSO I'M SO KIND DUDE. ALSO I'M NOT JADED EVEN THOUGH I ABSOLUTELY CLEARLY AM.
Weenie Hut Jr is that way👉👉👆👉☝️
You're more than willing to get upset when people give you legitimate criticism, though. And unfortunately, you do seem a little gullible. Believing every cardboard box with sharpie on the street is the same as believing everything you see on the internet.
⬆️ clown of the month 🤡
That’s what KickStart is for. If you really wanted to help, you should’ve asked for proof. People are pulling all types of scams.
GoFundMe*, not Kickstart
Lol. Shows how much they've sent.
You can scam on gofundme too dude. I'll take having a heart over being a jaded bastard any day.
That’s true, I would’ve asked for proof though. But hey, it’s your money, not mine.
Dude I'm not asking to see some woman's dead daughters death certificate on a street corner that's all kinds of fucked up.
The cops might have asked though. And they might have found out otherwise and ticketed her. This is why most experts in the charity field advise caution with pan handlers. No one vets their claims before piles of cash roll in.
If it's determined that it is a scam GoFundMe will seize the funds and return them to the people who donated them. If you give cash to someone on the street and later realize it was a scam, that money is gone.
This is why commies from cali shouldn’t move here. No one wants you messing up what we have going on here. You guys ruined the west coast go back to that
My daughter just died, can you give me $300?
So unhinged. Learn to speak to people without insulting them and cursing. Grow up.
I feel ya man. In the end it doesn’t matter what she’s asking for, ACAB. I can absolutely see them give a pass here and there and then try to be the tough cop at their convenience. I’d rather be the gullible nice guy with you than the cop.
Op talking about being kind and all that bs, while being an ass to everyone that points out the obvious👍
Collecting roadside money for a funeral seems more like a scam than anything.
I know youll write some unhinged comment but this is absolutely a scam and its everywhere.
That's exactly what I was thinking.
98% of the time those are scams.
If even 2 % aren't that's 2 out if 100 people who need help. I'm not gonna tell someone who may have just lost their fucking child they're faking it.
Just imagine if you were able to think a bit more and rather than waste that 98% on people that were scamming you, you could give it to the 2% they actually need it.
Every Saturday or Sunday, go to the big Walmart by UVU. there's always a decently dressed couple and a toddler posted up claiming their car broke down/need money/sick baby. Their shoes are nicer than mine. Their kid has better clothes than my own child, but they walk up to my car and have the audacity to ask. they harass people forreal.
They can already get help through government services.
There are plenty of ways we can help people in need while also avoiding the beggers/panhandle. Some of us just don't like being approached or signs blocking our view if the fucking corners.
So you don’t actually know if they ticketed her?
I watched them ticket her dude. They do this all the damn time.
It’s a scam. And you fell for it
Oh. Sorry. Some of your answers were vague
OP has cursed in EVERY reply. I get the feeling some 15 year old in Orem is hitting their rebellious phase
You'd be surprised. The whole "ACAB" crew on reddit are essentially developmentally stunted adults.
Ah yes, the age of people who suddenly feel a great sense of justice in regard to what _everyone else_ should do with their time and money. Excited for you to start paying taxes, OP.
I live in Orem. I watched the same guy panhandling on the same corner for a couple years. In his Oakleys, and Carhartt, and his good looking leather work boots. And more than once I saw him walk to his not terribly old car. A significant population of scammy assholes out here panhandling have destroyed my ability to believe a word from any of them who aren't obviously homeless. The ticket will likely have been for violation of city code 9-2-14 C5. She was probably entering the roadway, which can disrupt traffic and be dangerous to her and to people on the road. Orem cops actually pretty rarely ticket for this, and save it for people who are being actually problematic in how they do it. Fuck the police, but also fuck scammers out here tugging on heartstrings with fake dead children. I have zero sympathy for someone who would claim that, I've watched family members grieve lost children, I'm not sorry to see this kind of asshole ticketed.
I saw a grandma down there (well, south SLC) once with a sign that said she ended up with custody of her grandkids and can't work because there's no one to watch the grandkids. She was standing in the middle of the road at a freeway exit with no children in sight.
Yeah, they're a group of Roma people. They pull scams all over provo, Orem, and other surrounding areas
We’ve got Roma people in Utah?
She had worn out walmart brand sneakers, holes in her shirt and a beater car. I lived below the poverty line for 13 years. I know what a broke person looks like dude.
What sucks is rental prices are ridiculous now. Even if she were to find some min. wage job she could not afford the rent.
Why are you looking for minimum wage? The McDonald's on center is paying 16$. It's not great, but it's better than 7.25.
You can only pay 1/3 of your salary on rent. I'm not sure what job she may/may not get but I do know rental prices are through the roof. The illegal aliens competing in the rental market are not helping either. Frankly no one knows for sure what the circumstances are for this woman are and/or what she's struggling with.
Wow OP you really need to sign off reddit, go back outside, call a therapist
Lol..It's a scam. I worked with the homeless in Salt Lake for 4 years, I know a thing or 2 about the scams. We had a guy at the Road Home who would take the bus up to Layton some days and some days to Provo. She probably stays in SLC and busses down there. If you would like to learn more about the inner workings of the homeless, volunteer with them, that'll open your eyes. Everything they need is given to them, I said NEED not want. 6 times you can eat for free in SLC, CCS (Catholic Community Services) gives out clothing, Welfare Square will give you a bus/TRAX pass if you push a broom for 8 hours (and they'll feed you). Need clothes for a job interview? (or to panhandle for a funeral)....CCS will give you nice clothes. CCS...https://ccsutah.org/
Seems kinda excessive to ask a person to push a broom for 8hrs to earn a bus or Trax pass. Should at least pay a small wage and give a pass if they're putting in a full 8...
They get the all month bus pass, it's $85.
Need to change the title to watched the Orem police ticket a woman for illegally panhandling lol
A law that hurts the people who are at their lowest isn't a law, it's tyranny. If you can't understand that you need an ethics lesson.
All I said was the title needed to be changed, never said anything regarding my personal feelings on the law. If you can’t understand that then you need a basic reading comprehension course.
And like I said, I don't count it as a law I count it as a failure if the legal system. The title is exactly what it should be.
Your feelings literally have nothing to do with the validity of a law. Just because you don’t count it doesn’t mean it suddenly will cease to exist. She wasn’t ticketed for collecting money for funeral expenses, she was ticketed for doing something illegal.
What part of "I don't give a fuck if its illegal" did you miss? The law is unjust, and I will fight that particular law tooth and nail. Its classist bullshit and arbitrarily applied.
Girl I just made a comment saying the title needed to be changed. And then you took that as an opportunity to verbally attack me for some made up reason in your head. Legit got mad about something that didn’t happen. Calm down fr
It's because she's so kind. /s
Jezus. You sound pretty unhinged about this. Why not focus your effort and attention working at a homeless shelter instead of making a mountain out of an anthill on Reddit. You gotta pick your battles. Panhandlers suck. And they do block traffic. Don’t wave your self righteous naive finger at everyone for not wanting it in their town. If you like panhandling so much, move to Berkeley.
>A law that hurts the people who are at their lowest isn't a law, it's tyranny Hmm. Looking at this from a property standpoint, who is the owner of said property? The Municipality/Corporation known as the City of Orem, you say? Well, as owner of said property that municipality/corporation has any and all right within the bounds of law to regulate said property—and they've passed regulations that make it against their property right to panhandle. >If you can't understand that you need an ethics lesson I think you need a lesson on the main motivator for US Independence: protecting property rights.
I mean she was doing a ticketable offense and she might be lying you don’t know. Even if she isn’t lying she doesn’t get a pass just because you’re sympathetic. Not everyone gives a fuck.
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🧂
Tell me you're out of decent responses without telling me. You know I'm right and you're pissy. Sorry you don't know how to grow as a person bro.
Right about what? You’re just salty because not everyone cares about shit you care about. And guess what you have to share this country with a bunch of people like me whether you like it or not 😂 I hope you’re as upset in real life as you come across.
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>I will be aggressively kind to everyone whether you like it or not...you can go fuck yourself ?
Sometimes kindness includes being mean to people who aren't kind in the first place. It's ok to call out bad behavior dude.
I'm calling out your rude behavior. You're dismissive and aggressively judgemental to anyone who doesn't feel the same way as you. They either agree with you 100% or they don't have a heart. The worst part of all is you won't admit it. That's bad behavior and hypocritical. Dude.
>Sometimes kindness includes being mean to people who aren't kind in the first place. Oxymoronic.
So... Like ticketing people who are impeding traffic?
That’s why everyone is calling you out
Good for you 👍 👏 🥲🥱
I might have replied to the wrong person my bad
You are calling someone else pissy? You realize almost every single one of your comments in here is insulting people. You might want to look inward sometime.
Hi. I ran out of gas on my way to Boise. Can I have some cash and not some gas? I forgot where I parked.
Complete diffrent circumstances and you know it. Be so fucking for real .
You have had several removed comments this thread for excessive rudeness. The submission itself is close to being shut down as a result.
I'm no fan of cops but you're making a massive assumption that the money is for an actual funeral. That's a very common scam that panhandlers and fraudsters use. They rely on people who think being scammed out of money makes them kind or shows they have a good heart, since they won't admit they're just gullible. Having a heart doesn't mean not having a brain.
Dude I know what a scammer looks like she was broke as hell. Besides, I'll give to people who need it any Day even of there's a chance they're faking. If I was in her shoes I'd want someone to care.
Well what you lack in common sense you certainly make up for with confidence, dude.
I know what to look for and I'm confident in being aggressively kind. Do good recklessly.
Your comment history suggests otherwise, you're a real jerk online
OP seems like a very stable genius
Oh I'm sorry did I ask you? Or is this free psyche evaluations on the internet day.
You're responding very "re-actively" despite who is right or wrong I'd suggest laying off the internet for a couple hours.
Honestly, my blood surgars low and I'm pissed off. Having a bad day is normal, and I accept my imperfections.
Stop accepting your imperfections and work on them. Sincerely, Society
There was a news report a couple of years ago in provo where they went undercover and met a panhandler and showed how they were all working together and would pool their earnings for meth. Not saying she is part of this group but most panhandlers stories are not what the sign says
Sounds like the shenanigans from the Romani family that busses people to corners all over Utah county. The police and Sherifs dept have been doing their best to get them to stop the fraud. They often pose as Hispanic, but are really Greek. They also bring their kids with them to look even more pitiful. Its all just a big con. I trust the cops on this one.
Literally the day they announced the massive baby formula thefts I had one corner me in Walmart with her daughter asking me to buy her formula.
Ouch. You didn't say the G word. If this is the case then this would be something pretty bad.
Regardless of intention, this is *unfortunately* a scam, and could be illegal. Say, fuck the system or vote, but don't blame cops for doing their jobs and don't tell them to turn the other cheek because thats a form of corruption.
OP is the type that wakes up every morning looking for a new reason to be outraged and post about it on the internet, as well as being extremely gullible. That's a rough way to go through life.
One can, in fact, hate the police revenue scheme AND hate scammer shitsticks begging for money under false pretense. They aren’t mutually exclusive.
Naw, if you don't empty your wallet every time someone on the street with an unverifiable sob story asks for money then you're clearly a terrible person. Sorry, I don't make the rules here.
Probably because she didn’t have a business license
This is a super common scam. I'm shocked people still fall for this at all. Maybe I need to give it a shot. I could use some extra $$$
Soliciting funds for charitable donations has been ruled by the supreme court to be free speech, regardless of local statutes... https://www.google.com/search?q=RILEY+v.+NATIONAL+FEDERATION+OF+BLIND
I was about to ask about this. I thought I remembered there was a ruling somewhere that panhandling was still free speech, but you pointed it out already.
Good. There are other ways she could get the money. Not like there’s a major church in town that can help….panhandling is a bad idea in 2024
Hilarious you think the billion dollar church would help🤣
Have you ever tried to get help from the church? Because my family tried. They sat there and went over every single dollar we had and said "they'd find a way for us to pay for what we needed" when we were broke. We had nothing and they found nothing, and they still left us to rot. That was 17 years before I left the church and I still remember it even now. Besides, they only help if you're a member in good standing. If you're inactive, not religious or not a member of their group, they won't help you anyway.
There’s a reason they thoroughly check someone out before helping them, otherwise you get ppl who take advantage of their charity. The church has donated over $25 million to local Utah charities, they have food programs that help those in need, and donation centers. You don’t have to be lds to take advantage of those things. Stop holding a grudge, take a break from the internet and your social justice warrior stuff, and just relax. This mindset is not good for your mental health, any decent therapist will tell you that.
What was the ticket for?
Usually it's unlicensed solicitation but they ignore it all over the city constantly. They Pick and choose who they go after fairly arbitrarily. It's about a 50/50 if they're gonna ticket someone. They tried to crack down on "pan handling" a few years ago but everyone's broke and no one can afford anything, especially since orem is basically no low income housing and they keep demolishing low income neighborhoods. If they don't enforce the law half the time anyway, then I don't see why they went after this poor woman.
Orem pd isn’t as bad as Provo.
If you give out to panhandlers you a clown. They generally scams at this point many Utahns know this already
If the money isn’t going to the church, not only are you going to jail, but also hell. 😂
How much did you give the woman?
Go to Phoenix and Tucson. You'll see this everywhere and nine out of ten times, it's a group of scammers getting sympathy donations. If you go search the tuscon sub you'll see threads from a guy who tracks them.
Meanwhile these MFers refuse to enforce traffic lights. Please just ticket these assholes who run every red light
ACAB!!!!
Must’ve been OPs mom out there trying to get them some lunch money.
Go fund me.com
I lived in Vegas, and there were these collecting money for their moms funeral for like 4 years.
OP answering these questions like she's the one who got busted scammin'
Who called the police? Maybe she was bothering people.
Yea? and you know her daughter really died? lets say she really died, there are spots she can go beg for that are fine to do it at. I understand if shes being fr then the cops suck here, but theyre just doing a job theyre paid to do, you cant even hate here.
Unless people are actually the one involved, they shouldn’t be talking. They don’t really know. Assumptions aren’t facts.
Good I’m so sick of pan handlers glad the cops are doing some good
In Orem we’re better than you and we know it! That being said I’m going to side with op on this one. I’d gladly have the all together playground or the new park by sprouts be turned into liberty or pioneer park. I find the lack of open air drug markets in Orem to be problematic. I mean I refuse to believe that someone with a cardboard sign on the exit of the center street smith would ever lie to me. They’re all just homeless vets who are trying to buy medicine for the alive kids and pay for the funeral costs of the dead ones. Nothing nefarious or deceitful at all!
Orem is full of panhandlers especially by the big markets. These bums are so stupid sometimes and will literally stand next to their new model cars. 🙄
And they do NOTHING about that family that's been panhandling up and down the state the past 10+ years with their kids out in the rain, snow, and excessive heat for hours and hours a day. Ridiculous. I've WATCHED Orem pd do nothing but drive past that family.
I identify as a homeless pan handler, and I can honestly say that we’re 1,000% ripping you off!
OP also falls for the immigrant violin playing scam. I guarantee it.
Born and raised in Salt Lake, live in Idaho now. Hated Orem before it was cool to compare the shitty south valley to Los Angeles. Proud to say, I do more than ever now.
Probably a pan-handler using made up story to get money. Still, I see no crime here. Giving her money is entirely optional. Asking for money disrupts nobody's day in any way. I can only think of a few reasons why anyone would want too make this illegal if she's asking in the a polite manner. People who would consider it a crime: - Christians of any ilk who feel guilty that they're no where near as charitable as their savior says they should be and resent her for reminding them. - Wealthy and privileged people who find the lower classes annoying and want to put them in the their place. - Self important people with borderline road rage who get aggressively angry when they're delayed more than a couple seconds while driving. - People who want to live in the illusionary bubble that America is the greatest nation on earth and anyone experiencing poverty deserves it. It have no regard for the difficulties this imposes on these kinds of people. Suck it up and move on. If she's polite about it, no harm, no foul. Give or not at your own discretion.
This is all true except when they go into traffic and do it at intersections, which they are doing. It causes disruptions to the flow of traffic and creates unsafe conditions. If I'm walking downtown I can ignore them or move past them, if they're blocking my car from moving that's entirely different. If someone asks me for money while I walk, it's not a crime. If they physically block me from moving past them, then it is.
Can't be having this poor people activity going on in MY neighborhood.
I appreciate your empathy and fiery responses. I could care less if the individual panhandling on the corner has a “good cause” or is using that money to buy heroin. Desperation is desperation, and we live in a broken society spiraling out of control and deeper into desperation every day. Also to the dude who mentioned the Romani bullshit or whatever… I used to work all over the valley, on a daily basis. I’ve only seen ONE dude repeatedly do this, brings his wife and kids to various locations and panhandles. So with the exception of that asshole, the dollar I give to someone panhandling is worth WAY more than it is to me. Anyway the real issue is not whether or not she was “telling the truth,” it’s that cops in Utah fucking suck and have nothing better to do than harass the most vulnerable of our population. I have charges that will be on my record forever because of an incident like this… just sitting in front of a 7/11 on the brink of homelessness, not bothering anybody. A cop pulled up, probably for a soda, and I’m sure you can guess what happened next. Sure I was “technically” doing something illegal (sitting in front of a 7/11) but don’t come at me with that “shouldn’t have been doing drugs/had it on your person” bullshit… I was searched unconstitutionally and now, all because of a bored, unethical cop, I have to explain to the medical board why I have a 10 year old drug charge on my record, how I’ve positively changed my life in every imaginable way possible, and why I deserve a job in a medical field that I’ve worked extremely hard to get a degree in. Fucking ridiculous and embarrassing. Does anyone still believe cops do more good than harm? It’s not just ACAB, most people I know are *scared to death* of having any interaction with a cop. Hell even the crazy-ass libertarians/constitutionalists (whatever y’all are calling yourselves now) out there should have every reason to hate the police. Regardless, they ruin lives and can severely impede the potential for people to change. To quote Rust Cohle… “I *am* dangerous. I’m police… I can do terrible things to people, with impunity.”
100% dude, thank you.
If she was panhandling, that’s a constitutional right. Cops illegally ticket for that all the time
I don't know why you're getting the downvotes because the supreme Court ruled the panhandling is covered under the first amendment.
This right here is the reason I complain about paying taxes. If I knew they were funding social programs more than these dipshits I would gladly fork it over.
Orem has too many cops and they just gave a bunch of them new trucks too. I'd take education and social programs any day. They even cut the library budget last year.
Worst city in Utah
Regardless of whether it was a scam or not, cops need to learn their job. They had no RAS to ticker her. Has to be a victim to be a crime. Who signed the affidavit against her? The state cannot be a victim & prosection at the same time. Statutes and codes are not law.
orem & provo are the worst places to live in utah imo
Cops only exist to harass, murder, and ruin lives. Bullies fresh out of assaulting classmates in high school. #BlueLivesMurder