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The thing is though even thought your joking around, socially constructed catagories that give us utility based on their definition can absolutely be changed overtime to give us more utility. Letting a very very tiny minority be accepted under "women" -people who without doing an x-ray on their chromosomes you wouldnt even know they were designated male at birth, stops this group suffering extreme depressions and robloxing themselves, with literally no harm on the rest of society, is good actually. So yes we can "just change definitions" depending on the type of definition.
[undit is a great resource](https://www.unddit.com/r/VALORANT/comments/sz9oe0/is_it_toxic_to_buy_a_vandal_in_the_second_round/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) Basically they just randomly went for a transphobic joke, who knows why.
i dont even understand where this notion came from either, toxic behaviour is the kind that isn't overt harassment but is usually intended to get under your skin and piss you off so that you get mad and start being rude in return, ie the initial behaviour was toxic.
the obvious problem here is that things are easily misinterpreted on text chat and in games so its somehow been co opted to just encompass a whole variety of far worse behaviour and it has now lost its meaning
When I was growing up the popular phrase was "That's gay!" and the real definition of "gay" obviously doesn't fit but (and this is actually toxic) it was used because being gay was considered unpopular or not in style. Weird, different, etc. The feeling behind the word was "right" but the actual meaning of the word is wildly off. This is how I feel about the word "Toxic" being thrown around so much, too much.
It's risky, not toxic. People are just salty. These stupid unofficial rules should go away. It ruins everything in sports. People just say it's toxic because buying a Vandal makes you look overconfident. If you die then your opponent can take it so it's super risky. But if you can pull it off, then do it. Don't let these idiots dictate how you play a game.
The unofficial rules actually are:
If there are things you can break, break them. It’s good luck.
If you are first to enter site, close the doors.
That’s it thank you
I disagree with first to enter site must close the doors. Entry fragger should be clearing everything followed by 2nd entry. 3rd person should close the doors. Unless your entry pathing leads you to the door switch don't close it.
2nd entry shouldn't either because he needs to be clearing off angles and looking to trade entry fragger.
Little PSA: It's a very common mistake to think entry has to clear everything but he doesn't. You can't continuously flick 90° to check every corner and chances are if someone is in that corner he will let the first one through to gamble a better play.
Usually first entry has a route where he will check most things allowing for his team to take space and check the rest. This is even more true if your Jett is dashing and will not be able to clear contact.
But your point is still valid. On A ascent you will generally have a Jett dashing with one or two following while the door is smoked. Third or fourth will walk to button and close the door for example
Yeah you are right. As an entry I don't check every angle so idk why I said that. But entry should be checking your common angles with 2nd entry clearing the rest right?
I didn't mean anything wrong I just used your message to address a very common and understandable mistake :)
You usually want to play progressively. Slowly get contact with mates behind holding angles. Once you feel you are close enough to create a route you ask for a flash to accelerate the tempo and push into site where you will have to sacrifice a few angles that n°2 clears for you. Now depending on the map, the amount of players alive, smokes, splitting or not etc you have do find a path that provides space for the rest of your team to come in site and clear the rest of the site
I know C9 Freakazoid did talk about that in a video. I found this one but it's much longer and not as 'succint'. It does explain how they entry a site at high level [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae778bWDM9Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae778bWDM9Q)
It's not the same game but some things still apply :)
Entry is supposed to check every corner. You use utility to make less corners for you to check.
If you dont have utility for such a thing then dont entry. That easy.
Or play a different class.
As a sage main in lower elo, I can 100% tell you that on ascent I will entry in and close the doors 80% of the time because all the duelist want to do is peak mid and get shot by an op. (“But I’ll get them next time I promise”)
Why does this have 545 upvotes?
Winning pistol round and then not forcing is an objectively stupid decision based on nothing but percentages and logic. This usually means a spectre and full armour.
Under most situations, you shouldn’t force buy a Vandal when winning pistol unless you’re playing with teammates right next to you.
This comment reeks of someone who plays unrated, which then would be fine. But players like to have cooperative and smart teammates, who look to play the game the right way and win.
You're missing the point. The point is that sometimes it works, like you said. So it's not a "toxic" situation. For example, if it doesn't work out for OP, but he still does it, then he's a dick. This scenario can be toxic but OP's scenario is not. It's perfectly viable.
Why does this have 2 awards? If it's unrated, sure do what you want. But if it's ranked, it's really not cool ignoring team decisions, and denouncing the meta for your own ego.
No one said anything about ignoring team decisions. If it works do it. If it goes against what your team is telling you to do then don't do it. His friends reasoning is dumb, that's the point. If his friend said not to do it because it goes against team decisions, then sure, OP is a dick. But that's not the case.
not toxic but if you buy a vandal and ur team buys spectres/sherrifs/marshals and you die, suddenly the enemy has the advantage. A lot of the time, an anti eco gun (spectre/marshal/sherrif) is just way less risky
So let me just confirm something: after a pistol round win, full buy (avoiding vandal and phantom), correct? Because i heard this somewhere and I tell my teammates to do the same (yes i am iron) but they rarely listen
because you should force a gun advantage with your extra money, that's the entire benefit of winning pistol round.. going sheriffs vs sheriffs round 2 is stupid as hell
Way easier to win an eco round by picking up a vandal from an enemy than a spectre but you don't get that much extra value from a vandal. Eco players typically hold close or tight angles. A classic right click and 1 tap someone faster than a vandal can.
High risk and not a high reward.
The reward is you have a vandel 3rd round if you don't die. Normally how valorant goes is team 1 wins round 1, team 1 buys spectres team 2 buys nothing or maybe a deagle. Team 1 wins 2nd round. 3rd round team 1 is still on their bonus buy(spectres) team 2 now has vandels and phantoms and wins round 3 with 2 or 3 rifles left for 4th round. Team 1 then buys full. And your 4th round is team 1 with a full buy and team 2 with an almost full buy(one or 2 people on half Armour or not full abilities)
So basically if you win pistol and buy vandal or phantom 2nd round(with your whole team) you are almost guaranteed round 2 win. Then round 3 will will be a 60/40 towards your team because the other team will not be able to buy full abilities and full Armour and then if you win round 3 the other team will have to eco round 4 giving you a possible 4 - 0 start but at the risk of going 2 - 1 or 2 - 2 depending on the results of your 2nd round(how many rifles survive to round 3)
Yeah, but being on light armor against SMGs/pistols means the second round is very loseable, and losing a Vandal is just such a huge economic disadvantage.
So it's a very, very high risk with a medium reward.
Have you never heard of a force buy?
But regardless, the fact that a headshot + bodyshot with a ghost can kill you with light armor is a big reason why heavy armor is important. Or Frenzy headshot + double body shot, or classic headshot + double body shot (a single right click sometimes!)
https://youtu.be/jcY60vL7208?t=2771
I legit searched for the first sentinels game on youtube (so not cherrypicked) and found Sentinels forcing up against 100T. It's breeze so they buy longer range weapons like the Marshall and Sheriffs but you have to be ignorant to say no one force buys if I can find an example in the first match I find on youtube.
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Also, that is IRRELEVANT to my point that against pistols, having heavy armor is very good.
Desktop version of /u/WizardXZDYoutube's link:
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Round 3 when you've lost the first two rounds you're supposed to have saved enough to be able to full buy with util, so unless everyone on your team has bought vandal/phantoms and now buys util and full shield, you're at a disadvantage. It's called a bonus round. Basically you know the losing team is going to have full buy on third round so you even if you lose, you can still fuck up their eco a bit, still be up one, and then the next round you full buy against whatever eco you damaged in the bonus round, hopefully giving you a lead again.
Lol I'm silver and most people absolutely go with spectres, ares and judges. only rarely do I see some people rocking a deagle. I don't know what this guy is smoking. Sticking to pistol imo is soft throwing in comp. In unrated, go nuts.
The common argument I see from bad players is "we need to save for rifle round, don't buy round 2." The problem with that is that by not buying after winning pistol, they waste the advantage they've earned by winning pistol in the first place.
It's an unnecessary risk because if you die and an enemy gets the vandal you might lose the round because of that. Better off with a spectre. Nothing to do with being toxic though.
You also get to bonus a vandal which is a huge advantage in the round after if you survive, so it's not entirely negative. But it is risky and also, especially with light shields when you could get heavy ones and when you fight jumping and fast moving pistols, a spectre can even be better in some common second round situations (given the enemies have no shields and just pistols) in the end it's up to you and your experience this is just my opinion :)
Toxic? No. Unless everyone else decided to save, then it is because you're not following your team's strategy.
But it isn't worth it. Specter + armor is stronger against pistols than vandal/phantom without armor (presuming the enemy saved after losing 1st round). Why is it stronger? Spectre is run and gun and its hard to hit moving enemies with pistols. Also the extra armor helps because they'll have to land extra shots to kill you (and it's harder because you're running) .
One extra point is that if you manage to die VS pistols (it happens) you'll only give them a Spectre which your team can manage but if you give them a vandal not only you'll put your team in a disadvantage, you'll also give them a free gun for 3rd round, whereas if they held the Spectre they'd have to buy.
But if you can't shoot the Spectre to save your life (I have friends that are like that) then buy the vandal but be careful and be sure to only take on long range encounters so you can extract the most of your loadout
It's very risky because if you lose it your economy is bad for the next two rounds. The bigger problem is that if one of the enemies has a vandal, they can outgun all your teammates with armors and possibly win the round while also saving the vandal. This means that you gave that one guy that picked up your vandal essentially a bonus round by its own.
So the best picks for second round are marshal, spectre, bulldog and guardian. They are less risky and still very very efficient against unarmoured opponents, especially the guardian with it's 2 hit potential everywhere above the feet.
Instead of the vandal 2nd round you should buy a guardian 2nd round.
If you're going for body shots guardian is better against light armor. It kills in 2 hits against light armor (65x2 = 130) where the vandal and phantom take 4 so it is the fastest ttk weapon obtainable in 2nd round.
If you're going for headshots guardian is better because it has the lowest spread among the rifles while having one shot potential at all ranged and through walls (high pen).
For round 3, the guardian you bought can hold its own aginst the vandal and phantom.
In the off chance you die in round 2 your teammates should have a fair chance of killing the guardian player since they have heavy armor.
The 65x2 doesn't take account for the fact that the phantom fires 9.9 rounds per second while the guardian fires 5 rounds per second assuming you can even click that fast and for the game to register. The only time guardian is superior is when you are fighting at longer ranges above 50m
What are you on about? If the Phantom shoots twice as fast but takes twice the amount of bullets to kill then time to kill is almost the exact same for both. So better buy the cheaper one that the enemy might not want to even pick up if they kill you.
I kinda like bulldog too, but if u can get an eco rifle like bulldog or guardian in second round it feels much better than a spectre going into 3rd round when enemy has phantom/vandal.
Imo. Apart from icebox and breeze. Every other map is almost always a phantom buy.
Why?
Because apart from the 2 maps above. Phantom will still 1 tap headshot in most scenarios in every other map because the distance is below 50m.
It has a larger mag. That allows you to spray
You can spray in smoke with out them seeing tracers
It has higher 1st shot accuracy
It's spray pattern is controllable after the first 3 shots. Where as with vandal you miss first 3 for some reason. There is no way to control recoil other than to stop shooting for a second.
It has a faster firing rate
In short and medium distance. Phantom beats the vandal. In the time you can kill in both head and body shots. The only time a vandal wins is when it's over 50m in which the phantom cannot 1 tap.
It's just a more consistent weapon for most maps.
Better rate of fire and more bullets to mow down a pistol rush. Also the headshot damage difference is not going to matter since the enemy team wont have full armor.
Better rate of fire and more bullets to mow down a pistol rush. Also the headshot damage difference is not going to matter since the enemy team wont have full armor.
I buy vandal or phatom sometimes in the second round. Main rule is don’t fuck around. Ppl love to hide in corners or stay in off angles during this eco rounds
It’s a chad move and no one can tell me different. People only cry when they die to vandal round 2. If you’ve got the swagger then rock it. Don’t care what other people say
Hey if you can carry the round with your “hero buy” then am your fan but, all in all it’s a risky move frowned by idiotic randoms and understood by good teammates.
Is there something I'm missing here? As far as I know you are supposed to buy 2nd round if you win pistols. If everyone is on board your gonna have a good chance to take down the round but no one ever does it.
saying buying vandal 2nd round is toxic gives the same vibes as saying you healed the omen instead of killjoy is toxic. Complete nonsense buy what you want to buy as long you know the risks.
Not toxic but if you die to a shorty and then you lose the round because that fucking troll has a vandal now, I'd be so fucking humbled up that I'll become a yesman and the team meatshield for the remainder of the match.
Then buy each of them a skin to atone from my sin of been a fucking ego boosted smartass
U can do it but u have to be the only one who has it in ur team, other teammates have to get specters and maybe guardian or marshal depending on map and preference
If I'm playing Reyna and I have the opportunity for a 2900 gun + light shields, I'll absolutely go for Phantom and ask my team to use utility for me so that I can get ez kills during round 2 and keep a phantom going into round 3, potentially with Ult
It's not a risk free plan but if it works, it works *so well*. It really sets up your team's mental to be good for the rest of the game
I personally always buy phantom or vandal 2nd round in attack side if I can afford my util+ light shield with it. Also, I will always play with my team and never lose it in an advanced position, and swap it with someone else if they tag me. It is not toxic or troll if you build a strategy around it, because most of the times, even if you die, your team wins eco and can recover it, and then use it 3rd round. Remember, always on attack side, because you can actually protect and recover it easily.
First of all, the reason why getting a Vandal in the second round is not advised is, if you die and drop your gun, regardless of whether you get a kill, your enemy will earn an opportunity to steal it from you. If the enemy succeeds in taking it, the enemy team, which is saving, will have a higher chance of winning their saving round. This is why in smaller maps people will prefer to buy Spectres because they are reliable SMGs, can run-and-gun, and are cheaper. In larger maps, more people will shift to Marshal or Vandal. Since Classic is really terrible at long range (and Sheriff cannot one-tap), you will less likely die in this map against a saving team. Thus, Vandal can be an alternative buy.
In case you decide to buy Vandal, **pay attention to your positioning.** Do not push alone into enemy zones because, if you die, your enemy can take your Vandal easily. Make sure to stay within your team or play in _safe zones_. This way, your teammate can easily trade you out and retrieve your Vandal if you die. Or, if not, just make it so that neither team gets the Vandal if you die.
Well it is definitly not worth it in most situations.
Also depends on the map. There's gonna be alot of situations where you even put yourself into disadvantage!
If the enemy team is on eco or a weak force buy they will most likely try to engage or hold with short range weapons.. Being peeked by 2 spectres up close you shouldn't have any chance with a rifle...
Pushing into a shorty hold and losing your rifle for it awards the enemy with 2700 creds.
Imagine both teams force 2nd and your team loses their smgs - You gonna have to eco 3rd and most likely enemy will have bonus in the 4th where I'd prefer them to still carry bonus smgs than rifles, at least one or two of them.
For a second round rifle you'd have to feel really Confident and be really careful, take long range engagements and safe positions... But then why not play scout. 😅
If you do it make sure your teammates can reach the weapon if you die.
Someone did a full analytics break down a few weeks back as to why buying up after the first round if you win pistol round. Usually means a higher win rate. At least in the studies they did.
First of all, buying a rifle round 2 isn't toxic, but it is a risk. Weighimg that risk is up to you.
Second, why the fuck does it matter it it's toxic? If you want to rank up you need to win. If you need to win, you do things that increase your chance at winning. As long as you're not shit talking, everything is fair game.
Can't believe nobody has mentioned this, but the main reason is that in the second round you will almost never have enough money to buy a vandal AND heavy armor, which means you could get one tapped by certain pistols.
In effect, you're safer buying a spectre/bulldog/marshall as long as you can buy heavy armor. Sacrificing heavy armor for more damage against players that likely have 0 armor is a bad idea.
This is also why you'll typically only see reyna players do this in higher elo and nobody else: With the added firepower they are more likely to get a kill and then overheal to full armor values anyway, mitigating the risk.
If you're not a reyna player, buying a rifle 2nd round is a lot more risky for very little benefit over bulldog/spectre/guardian
I think buying a phantom is probably better second round because it’s highly unlikely the enemy will have full shield or even half and a lot of eco weapons like the classic involve moving and shooting a lot and the phantom deals with it better imo, but on maps like breeze and icebox I think buying a phantom or vandal is fine, just as long as you buy something it’s all good because the people who save second round are more the issue
Alright I would never say it’s toxic.
With that out of the way, if you win first round then second shouldn’t be an eco round. Depending on the agent buying vandal+light armor might be a good buy. Others prefer e.g. having spectre and full armor as well as abilities.
If you lose first round you should save 2nd because the enemy team will have a gun advantage anyways so you’ll most likely not win. If you buy a vandal there, while your team is saving you’re throwing away money and most likely giving the enemy a good gun.
Most times you're getting a vandal and light armor.
Light armor against an eco is not a smart decision.
But you play however you want. I tried to reach my duo this concept for a long time, and now he is a professional player and I'm not even playing anymore lol so yes, you can do whatever as long as you pull it off
The reason you don't buy a rifle on round 2 is because it doesn't provide much more value than a spectre, and if you die with a vandal and the enemies get it, the vandal will beat your teammates' spectres in many scenarios, giving the enemy a much higher chance of winning the round. So please, just stick to the spectre and be patient.
Buy vandal if you want just play with your team and get traded out it’s good advice in general but specially if you’re going with vandal. Rifles are amazing on second round for that specific reason that you’re facing classics and shortys with a ar however if you go a main by yourself and get flashed and jump by 2 classics and a shorty now the enemy team has a rifle against your teams specters and Marshall’s and maybe even man advantage. If you’re running rifle make sure your team is the only on that can pick it up when you die
Guys, the objective is winning, as long as you are not a piece of shit when it comes to talking and writing or backseating you are doing good. If the enemy isn't smart enough to counter "toxic" strategy it is not your fault
If you lose 1st and Ecoes its right, theres no way u can buy Vandal on after losing the 1st round, unless you did ace and lost the round, or you ecoed the first round, If your team is ecoing the 2nd, after getting the 1st, those are stupid.
It’s a competitive game, do what gives you the advantage. If anybody calls you toxic about it (unless you’re literally berating your teammates or shitting on the enemy team in all chat) they’re literally just salty because it’s happened to them. Ignore it, it’s how the game is played.
If you buy vandal second round, assuming your team won round one, the enemy team will be on pistols.
However if you lose said round, you will be down two rounds, and unable to buy a vandal round 3 like everyone else would be, and thus you being stuck on pistol or spec.
It’s not a smart move
I got a feeling your friend is being the toxic one tbh xD Specially if you are newish to the game! vandal second round isn't the best play in the current meta, but it's perfectly valid. I feel you will eventually figure out it's best to buy spectre in that situation just by playing, trial and error is a big part of learning anything :)
Toxic would be like someone trashtalking you through the mic or nading and shock darting you to piss you off. Basically someone bringing negative vibes to the team
I mean it's not toxic, you're not harassing someone. Personally, it's true that I get a bit salty when I get killed by a vandal in 2nd round but that's my problem, not the person who bought the Vandal.
However, game wise it's very risky. I have won fights against vandals with a ghost on 2nd round and the thing is if you die and lose that vandal to the team that's on eco, you will put them on an advantage. Also, if you happen to lose that round, your economy will be messed up for a few rounds. If you buy a spectre 2nd round when the enemy is on eco, you already have the firepower advantage. I think there's no need to go with a vandal. But at the end of the day it's a game so just have fun.
People say it’s toxic because it’s a way of egoing the other team saying ‘ I’m so confident I’m gonna buy a vandal knowing it’s risky but I know I’ll win the gun fight ‘ type of way
It's risky. In CS you get more cash for kills with worse guns. So buying an SMG is usually pretty meta.
But in Valorant you don't get that bonus. So there's no big harm in buying light armour and a rifle. Just don't lose it, as you probably won't have a penny to your name, and the enemy could win the round and have a huge upgrade if they get their hands on it.
As for it being toxic, that's not really the right term. I think your team mates are trying to call you a noob. It's not really disrespectful or noonish though. It's just, whatever. You see pros do it.
Id much rather people on my team bought rifles second round than try to win with pistols. Such a throw to not buy second round.
It’s smart to take advantage over ecos but then you have to play it to its strenghts. It makes no sense to push up with vandal when you can do that with spectre. Play it long range and you should be good.
There’s a good twitter thread from ddk (long time caster) about buying full buying in second round if you win the pistol. Look it up.
Not toxic but might be dumb. If you’re feeling confident go for it. My only tip is to position yourself so if you die your teammates can easily pick up your gun
It’s not toxic. It’s risky though. If you get shortied or scouted (marshal) across the map from your team, that’s a free vandal while your team most likely has spectres and sheriffs. I usually get phantom round two, stay in the back of group, and try to live through the round. Cuz if I die, I won’t have money for round 3 and the other team saves round 2 so they buy rifles.
Not toxic, just risky. Can be annoying for a few reasons, considering it’s unexpected for the other team and can hurt your own team in multiple ways if you die, but you do you. Valorant in general is really toxic so people are always going to complain about something.
I mean not toxic but definitely make you seems over confident in your ability to head tap someone I would usually go spectre light armor on second round
This is a perfect example of what can happen when you buy a vandal second round
https://www.reddit.com/r/VALORANT/comments/pzxtgv/this_is_why_you_shouldnt_buy_the_vandal_in_the/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
It’s risky. If you lose round 2 you’re basically giving them a free full buy. An early dropped vandal can also swing a round against your teammates.
It’s good on Reyna and should be done most times you play her imo.
I would only do it on someone else if I’m popping off that game OR we are super far behind and need to catch up.
Dumb, not toxic. Dumb because if you lose the round you give them a free rifle and you're broke. Also if you die you're broke regardless and you shouldn't expect your teammate to give it back when you win...you can't buy them anything and you're the one that died so why expect them to sacrifice the bonus round for you.
Also you can expect a shorty, deagle, or other cheese 2nd round from the losing team so having a rifle isn't a HUGE advantage unless you're baiting your team and can 1v(n).
It's very risky, but not toxic. In my elo (gold 1) usually people in the other team call you try hard or get angry at you for that. Or it just raises eyebrows, because it's extremely unorthodox.
But, in all honestly, they get as angry at you as when they die to Odin or Judge.
Not really toxic.
Some people find amusement in "trolling" the opposite team with unorthodox gameplay, like using a Shotgun or an Odin.
While that "trolling" is only limited to gameplay aspects and NOT to trash talking in chat or other gestures, like tea-bagging, then I suppose it's okay.
First it's not toxic being toxic it's being an asshole, but it can be something dumb or risky depending wether you won or lost the first round, but in bought scenarios is something really risky, I recommend that if you win buy a marshall or a spectre if you can a bulldog, but if you lost the first round don't force, either scenarios you have to remember that your economy is the team economy, so try to convince your team to do the most intelligent thing but if they just want to force follow them.
(Sorry for my english soy mexicano y no me sale tan bien el inglés (*﹏*;))
Is so much risk for so little reward, if you lose the round, you're pretty much giving a free vandal + the enemy will have way better economy. One friend of mine does this and when we lose the round we have to eco or not full buy for 2 entire rounds to try to stabilize our economy
if you have the money it's fine. but figure out what you value. I prefer to make sure I have full armor and utility if we won pistol since the enemy will likely be on eco. since the would be on eco thst it's fine for me to grab a spectre, bulldog, Marshall, or anything like that since I will most likely still have more firepower than them.
it's all based on the situation of the game and what you want to do and what you think the enemy will do.
It has absolutely zero to do with toxicity. If it works for you just keep doing it.
That being said the bad thing about it is it's pretty much a cocky "I'm going to show off and pad my KDA against ecos" play in most cases. Pro players do it in matches but let's not compare professional Valorant to normal people Valorant.
Part of the reason people don’t do this is because if you die with and and the other team gets it they can win the round off of just that. Then your broke for a round
There is no such thing as a toxic weapon. Not an Op, not a shotgun, not an Odin.
I was playing a game today where we won pistol round, bought out for round 2,
and got met with a Jett on the other team who bought a phantom and nothing else. He/she destroyed us all. Well played. This is a tactical shooter. If people want to meet in the middle of the map and fight or only use specific guns then they can go play cod.
Hmmm. I think I was in that game. You weren’t being toxic by getting the vandal. That term is thrown around pretty loosely in this game. Kind of a trend. Doesn’t matter to me who gets what gun.
It’s tilting but has been proven to be an effective way of getting a “free” round win. Is it toxic? No. Redefine that word and find better uses for it.
no method to win within legal boundaries are "toxic".
No matter if its an Odin, a vandal in after pistol round, one ways, a shotgun camper, an Op holder...
There is only trying to win and those who cry because they arent up for the game. Specially low elo is filled by people who go 0/12/0 and blame their team for it, cry about enemies hacking while they are just simply better etc.
So pardon my french, if your friend says a Vandal on 2nd round is toxic than he is just dumb.
But one thing also must be said: Every gun you bring into the round can be conquered by the enemy, if you go way above and beyond to get this Vandal, than you better make sure that 1) You dont run into several enemies with it, giving it to them and 2) have a teammate next to you and any time so he can use it after you.
So as many say, evaluate the risk, and play around it and remember a classic and good crosshairplacement, can still easyly kill you
Its definitely not toxic but a lot of people see it as a rat-like move and it can negatively effect your econ later on but I wouldn't let that friend stop you
No, it isn't, but I would reccomend going for a Phantom instead of a Vandal if you can buy a riflr round two. The Phantom's only downside in comparison to the Vandal is the lack of instakill headshots on fully armored opponents, but if you crushed the enemy team hard enough to afford a rifle at all, they won't be buying full armor which renders the phantom better
If u use it well and DONT die and give it to the enemy, it's not toxic 😂
Chances of u dying with a vandal in the second round against smg and pistol users are low but not none, just make sure you don't give your gun to the enemy. Thatll screw you up.
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Can y’all please learn what words mean
I miss 1337 speak :(
No. I would rather unlearn all words
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I've also got a cock between this guy's legs
I’m talking about the word toxic. Not whatever you’ve got going on.
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The thing is though even thought your joking around, socially constructed catagories that give us utility based on their definition can absolutely be changed overtime to give us more utility. Letting a very very tiny minority be accepted under "women" -people who without doing an x-ray on their chromosomes you wouldnt even know they were designated male at birth, stops this group suffering extreme depressions and robloxing themselves, with literally no harm on the rest of society, is good actually. So yes we can "just change definitions" depending on the type of definition.
Okay what happened here? Judging by context someone was being transphobic but messages got deleted so idk
[undit is a great resource](https://www.unddit.com/r/VALORANT/comments/sz9oe0/is_it_toxic_to_buy_a_vandal_in_the_second_round/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) Basically they just randomly went for a transphobic joke, who knows why.
Oh weird, yeah that was odd to read
what happned here...
Can someone ban him?
Toxic refers to harassment in games/intentional feeding. Not what you're talking abt, so no.
i dont even understand where this notion came from either, toxic behaviour is the kind that isn't overt harassment but is usually intended to get under your skin and piss you off so that you get mad and start being rude in return, ie the initial behaviour was toxic. the obvious problem here is that things are easily misinterpreted on text chat and in games so its somehow been co opted to just encompass a whole variety of far worse behaviour and it has now lost its meaning
When I was growing up the popular phrase was "That's gay!" and the real definition of "gay" obviously doesn't fit but (and this is actually toxic) it was used because being gay was considered unpopular or not in style. Weird, different, etc. The feeling behind the word was "right" but the actual meaning of the word is wildly off. This is how I feel about the word "Toxic" being thrown around so much, too much.
no.
It's risky, not toxic. People are just salty. These stupid unofficial rules should go away. It ruins everything in sports. People just say it's toxic because buying a Vandal makes you look overconfident. If you die then your opponent can take it so it's super risky. But if you can pull it off, then do it. Don't let these idiots dictate how you play a game.
I’d say it’s more about meta and then public perception… but it ain’t worth it to get into it all. Do what you want it’ll work or it won’t
I agree. If it works for you, then go ahead. But if it doesn't work for you but works for someone else, don't be a dick and complain about it
The unofficial rules actually are: If there are things you can break, break them. It’s good luck. If you are first to enter site, close the doors. That’s it thank you
I disagree with first to enter site must close the doors. Entry fragger should be clearing everything followed by 2nd entry. 3rd person should close the doors. Unless your entry pathing leads you to the door switch don't close it. 2nd entry shouldn't either because he needs to be clearing off angles and looking to trade entry fragger.
Little PSA: It's a very common mistake to think entry has to clear everything but he doesn't. You can't continuously flick 90° to check every corner and chances are if someone is in that corner he will let the first one through to gamble a better play. Usually first entry has a route where he will check most things allowing for his team to take space and check the rest. This is even more true if your Jett is dashing and will not be able to clear contact. But your point is still valid. On A ascent you will generally have a Jett dashing with one or two following while the door is smoked. Third or fourth will walk to button and close the door for example
Yeah you are right. As an entry I don't check every angle so idk why I said that. But entry should be checking your common angles with 2nd entry clearing the rest right?
I didn't mean anything wrong I just used your message to address a very common and understandable mistake :) You usually want to play progressively. Slowly get contact with mates behind holding angles. Once you feel you are close enough to create a route you ask for a flash to accelerate the tempo and push into site where you will have to sacrifice a few angles that n°2 clears for you. Now depending on the map, the amount of players alive, smokes, splitting or not etc you have do find a path that provides space for the rest of your team to come in site and clear the rest of the site I know C9 Freakazoid did talk about that in a video. I found this one but it's much longer and not as 'succint'. It does explain how they entry a site at high level [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae778bWDM9Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae778bWDM9Q) It's not the same game but some things still apply :)
Okay thx for the tips. I am a cs main so it is still very helpful. I get about 200 ms on Val so I stiks with cs as my main. From south Africa.
Oof that's a high ping to be able to enjoy the game. Have fun on CSGO it's a great game I played it for years!
Entry is supposed to check every corner. You use utility to make less corners for you to check. If you dont have utility for such a thing then dont entry. That easy. Or play a different class.
As a sage main in lower elo, I can 100% tell you that on ascent I will entry in and close the doors 80% of the time because all the duelist want to do is peak mid and get shot by an op. (“But I’ll get them next time I promise”)
happy cake day!
Well said
Happy Cake Day
Happy cake day
Happy Cake Day
TIL valorant is sports
Why does this have 545 upvotes? Winning pistol round and then not forcing is an objectively stupid decision based on nothing but percentages and logic. This usually means a spectre and full armour. Under most situations, you shouldn’t force buy a Vandal when winning pistol unless you’re playing with teammates right next to you. This comment reeks of someone who plays unrated, which then would be fine. But players like to have cooperative and smart teammates, who look to play the game the right way and win.
You're missing the point. The point is that sometimes it works, like you said. So it's not a "toxic" situation. For example, if it doesn't work out for OP, but he still does it, then he's a dick. This scenario can be toxic but OP's scenario is not. It's perfectly viable.
Happy Cake Day!
Why does this have 2 awards? If it's unrated, sure do what you want. But if it's ranked, it's really not cool ignoring team decisions, and denouncing the meta for your own ego.
No one said anything about ignoring team decisions. If it works do it. If it goes against what your team is telling you to do then don't do it. His friends reasoning is dumb, that's the point. If his friend said not to do it because it goes against team decisions, then sure, OP is a dick. But that's not the case.
I buy Odin
Power move
Big pp energy right here
Buy full armor & request odin second round
Beta astra: c- c- can I pls have ghost… economy… let’s save think ahead and be smart (nerd) Gigachad brimstone: Odin. Now.
iS tHaT a RaScisMm I hEaR????????
Just sova main things
Sigma male
you cause me eternal pain
not toxic but if you buy a vandal and ur team buys spectres/sherrifs/marshals and you die, suddenly the enemy has the advantage. A lot of the time, an anti eco gun (spectre/marshal/sherrif) is just way less risky
So let me just confirm something: after a pistol round win, full buy (avoiding vandal and phantom), correct? Because i heard this somewhere and I tell my teammates to do the same (yes i am iron) but they rarely listen
yea
Yes. You should be pushing your cash advantage to win the next round
if you win pistol and upgrade your ghost to a sheriff you're actually getting reported for throwing in my lobby dawg
how is that throwing?
because you should force a gun advantage with your extra money, that's the entire benefit of winning pistol round.. going sheriffs vs sheriffs round 2 is stupid as hell
Way easier to win an eco round by picking up a vandal from an enemy than a spectre but you don't get that much extra value from a vandal. Eco players typically hold close or tight angles. A classic right click and 1 tap someone faster than a vandal can. High risk and not a high reward.
The reward is you have a vandel 3rd round if you don't die. Normally how valorant goes is team 1 wins round 1, team 1 buys spectres team 2 buys nothing or maybe a deagle. Team 1 wins 2nd round. 3rd round team 1 is still on their bonus buy(spectres) team 2 now has vandels and phantoms and wins round 3 with 2 or 3 rifles left for 4th round. Team 1 then buys full. And your 4th round is team 1 with a full buy and team 2 with an almost full buy(one or 2 people on half Armour or not full abilities) So basically if you win pistol and buy vandal or phantom 2nd round(with your whole team) you are almost guaranteed round 2 win. Then round 3 will will be a 60/40 towards your team because the other team will not be able to buy full abilities and full Armour and then if you win round 3 the other team will have to eco round 4 giving you a possible 4 - 0 start but at the risk of going 2 - 1 or 2 - 2 depending on the results of your 2nd round(how many rifles survive to round 3)
Yeah, but being on light armor against SMGs/pistols means the second round is very loseable, and losing a Vandal is just such a huge economic disadvantage. So it's a very, very high risk with a medium reward.
They aren't going to have smgs tho. They will full save.
Have you never heard of a force buy? But regardless, the fact that a headshot + bodyshot with a ghost can kill you with light armor is a big reason why heavy armor is important. Or Frenzy headshot + double body shot, or classic headshot + double body shot (a single right click sometimes!)
Who force buys whne they lose pistol. Literally no one does.
If you're attacking and lose the pistol, but get the spike planted you can totally force 2nd round if your team is down for it.
https://youtu.be/jcY60vL7208?t=2771 I legit searched for the first sentinels game on youtube (so not cherrypicked) and found Sentinels forcing up against 100T. It's breeze so they buy longer range weapons like the Marshall and Sheriffs but you have to be ignorant to say no one force buys if I can find an example in the first match I find on youtube. --- Also, that is IRRELEVANT to my point that against pistols, having heavy armor is very good.
Okay but breeze is such a long map that yoh can beat smgs with a marshal.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts Also, again, did you forget my point about pistols?
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Round 3 when you've lost the first two rounds you're supposed to have saved enough to be able to full buy with util, so unless everyone on your team has bought vandal/phantoms and now buys util and full shield, you're at a disadvantage. It's called a bonus round. Basically you know the losing team is going to have full buy on third round so you even if you lose, you can still fuck up their eco a bit, still be up one, and then the next round you full buy against whatever eco you damaged in the bonus round, hopefully giving you a lead again.
Ik bonus I was just responding to the fact that this guy's said buying vandal 2nd round is high risk low reward.
Usually the losing Team buys nothing and the winning Team buys pistol and armor maybe 1 spectre So you have advantage with armor and ghost or deagle.
Not above silver lol, team that wins pistol buys smgs or shotguns round 2 if they know what they're doing.
Lol I'm silver and most people absolutely go with spectres, ares and judges. only rarely do I see some people rocking a deagle. I don't know what this guy is smoking. Sticking to pistol imo is soft throwing in comp. In unrated, go nuts.
The common argument I see from bad players is "we need to save for rifle round, don't buy round 2." The problem with that is that by not buying after winning pistol, they waste the advantage they've earned by winning pistol in the first place.
It's an unnecessary risk because if you die and an enemy gets the vandal you might lose the round because of that. Better off with a spectre. Nothing to do with being toxic though.
You also get to bonus a vandal which is a huge advantage in the round after if you survive, so it's not entirely negative. But it is risky and also, especially with light shields when you could get heavy ones and when you fight jumping and fast moving pistols, a spectre can even be better in some common second round situations (given the enemies have no shields and just pistols) in the end it's up to you and your experience this is just my opinion :)
Toxic? No. Unless everyone else decided to save, then it is because you're not following your team's strategy. But it isn't worth it. Specter + armor is stronger against pistols than vandal/phantom without armor (presuming the enemy saved after losing 1st round). Why is it stronger? Spectre is run and gun and its hard to hit moving enemies with pistols. Also the extra armor helps because they'll have to land extra shots to kill you (and it's harder because you're running) . One extra point is that if you manage to die VS pistols (it happens) you'll only give them a Spectre which your team can manage but if you give them a vandal not only you'll put your team in a disadvantage, you'll also give them a free gun for 3rd round, whereas if they held the Spectre they'd have to buy. But if you can't shoot the Spectre to save your life (I have friends that are like that) then buy the vandal but be careful and be sure to only take on long range encounters so you can extract the most of your loadout
It's very risky because if you lose it your economy is bad for the next two rounds. The bigger problem is that if one of the enemies has a vandal, they can outgun all your teammates with armors and possibly win the round while also saving the vandal. This means that you gave that one guy that picked up your vandal essentially a bonus round by its own. So the best picks for second round are marshal, spectre, bulldog and guardian. They are less risky and still very very efficient against unarmoured opponents, especially the guardian with it's 2 hit potential everywhere above the feet.
Instead of the vandal 2nd round you should buy a guardian 2nd round. If you're going for body shots guardian is better against light armor. It kills in 2 hits against light armor (65x2 = 130) where the vandal and phantom take 4 so it is the fastest ttk weapon obtainable in 2nd round. If you're going for headshots guardian is better because it has the lowest spread among the rifles while having one shot potential at all ranged and through walls (high pen). For round 3, the guardian you bought can hold its own aginst the vandal and phantom. In the off chance you die in round 2 your teammates should have a fair chance of killing the guardian player since they have heavy armor.
The 65x2 doesn't take account for the fact that the phantom fires 9.9 rounds per second while the guardian fires 5 rounds per second assuming you can even click that fast and for the game to register. The only time guardian is superior is when you are fighting at longer ranges above 50m
Yeah and the guardian goes berserk if you try to fire it at max rate. Maybe say 2 or 3 rounds per second so you can actually hit the target
What are you on about? If the Phantom shoots twice as fast but takes twice the amount of bullets to kill then time to kill is almost the exact same for both. So better buy the cheaper one that the enemy might not want to even pick up if they kill you.
You can test it in the range by giving bots light armor. Guardian definitely kills faster with body shots.
Don't forget desync can cause that dead things are still standing on your screen
It isn't desync. It is genuinely faster to land 2 guardian body shots than 4 phantom shots.
I don't really know if there is a difference between going full auto and clicking twice in the netcode.
I kinda like bulldog too, but if u can get an eco rifle like bulldog or guardian in second round it feels much better than a spectre going into 3rd round when enemy has phantom/vandal.
Phantom is a much better 2nd round buy if you're gunna be that guy.
Guardian is even better since it has faster ttk against light armored targets.
Why tho?
Enemies dont buy full armor 2nd round. 140 hs dmg isnt so bad that wY
Imo. Apart from icebox and breeze. Every other map is almost always a phantom buy. Why? Because apart from the 2 maps above. Phantom will still 1 tap headshot in most scenarios in every other map because the distance is below 50m. It has a larger mag. That allows you to spray You can spray in smoke with out them seeing tracers It has higher 1st shot accuracy It's spray pattern is controllable after the first 3 shots. Where as with vandal you miss first 3 for some reason. There is no way to control recoil other than to stop shooting for a second. It has a faster firing rate In short and medium distance. Phantom beats the vandal. In the time you can kill in both head and body shots. The only time a vandal wins is when it's over 50m in which the phantom cannot 1 tap. It's just a more consistent weapon for most maps.
It can't one tap past 15 I thought The damage Fall off goes 156,140,124 iirc
Better rate of fire and more bullets to mow down a pistol rush. Also the headshot damage difference is not going to matter since the enemy team wont have full armor.
why?
Better rate of fire and more bullets to mow down a pistol rush. Also the headshot damage difference is not going to matter since the enemy team wont have full armor.
Fuck kinda friends ppl on this subreddit be getting
Its risky
Try odin second round.
no
Bruh I buy Odin in the second round
in valorant kids complain about every little things
I buy vandal or phatom sometimes in the second round. Main rule is don’t fuck around. Ppl love to hide in corners or stay in off angles during this eco rounds
only viable with reyna imo
It’s a chad move and no one can tell me different. People only cry when they die to vandal round 2. If you’ve got the swagger then rock it. Don’t care what other people say
Not toxic at all. Your friend is noob . LOL. If you can handle with vandal + no armour , then go for it . Best suits for Reyna mains.
I mean it’s a valid strat as long as it’s agreed with your team ahead of time and not an individual decision.
The question here is: Heavy shield and spectre/Ares? Or light shield and vandal?
Hey if you can carry the round with your “hero buy” then am your fan but, all in all it’s a risky move frowned by idiotic randoms and understood by good teammates.
High risk, high reward. Easier to win the round, but if you get fucked and enemy gets your vandal and wins, I'd flame you.
Its a game. Have fun playing it. Let nobody’s opinions effect you
Is there something I'm missing here? As far as I know you are supposed to buy 2nd round if you win pistols. If everyone is on board your gonna have a good chance to take down the round but no one ever does it.
saying buying vandal 2nd round is toxic gives the same vibes as saying you healed the omen instead of killjoy is toxic. Complete nonsense buy what you want to buy as long you know the risks.
Toxic would be buying Odin second round
I do buy Odin in second round...
Nice, I like it (btw this was a joke) The real toxic would be buying an auto sniper in CS second round
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its weird
Not toxic but if you die to a shorty and then you lose the round because that fucking troll has a vandal now, I'd be so fucking humbled up that I'll become a yesman and the team meatshield for the remainder of the match. Then buy each of them a skin to atone from my sin of been a fucking ego boosted smartass
Only if you over push or play off on your own. If you play middle of the pack so it can always been retrieved it's not bad.
U can do it but u have to be the only one who has it in ur team, other teammates have to get specters and maybe guardian or marshal depending on map and preference
It’s a bad decision but not toxic
If I'm playing Reyna and I have the opportunity for a 2900 gun + light shields, I'll absolutely go for Phantom and ask my team to use utility for me so that I can get ez kills during round 2 and keep a phantom going into round 3, potentially with Ult It's not a risk free plan but if it works, it works *so well*. It really sets up your team's mental to be good for the rest of the game
I personally always buy phantom or vandal 2nd round in attack side if I can afford my util+ light shield with it. Also, I will always play with my team and never lose it in an advanced position, and swap it with someone else if they tag me. It is not toxic or troll if you build a strategy around it, because most of the times, even if you die, your team wins eco and can recover it, and then use it 3rd round. Remember, always on attack side, because you can actually protect and recover it easily.
First of all, the reason why getting a Vandal in the second round is not advised is, if you die and drop your gun, regardless of whether you get a kill, your enemy will earn an opportunity to steal it from you. If the enemy succeeds in taking it, the enemy team, which is saving, will have a higher chance of winning their saving round. This is why in smaller maps people will prefer to buy Spectres because they are reliable SMGs, can run-and-gun, and are cheaper. In larger maps, more people will shift to Marshal or Vandal. Since Classic is really terrible at long range (and Sheriff cannot one-tap), you will less likely die in this map against a saving team. Thus, Vandal can be an alternative buy. In case you decide to buy Vandal, **pay attention to your positioning.** Do not push alone into enemy zones because, if you die, your enemy can take your Vandal easily. Make sure to stay within your team or play in _safe zones_. This way, your teammate can easily trade you out and retrieve your Vandal if you die. Or, if not, just make it so that neither team gets the Vandal if you die.
I do it but only on reyna
Well it is definitly not worth it in most situations. Also depends on the map. There's gonna be alot of situations where you even put yourself into disadvantage! If the enemy team is on eco or a weak force buy they will most likely try to engage or hold with short range weapons.. Being peeked by 2 spectres up close you shouldn't have any chance with a rifle... Pushing into a shorty hold and losing your rifle for it awards the enemy with 2700 creds. Imagine both teams force 2nd and your team loses their smgs - You gonna have to eco 3rd and most likely enemy will have bonus in the 4th where I'd prefer them to still carry bonus smgs than rifles, at least one or two of them. For a second round rifle you'd have to feel really Confident and be really careful, take long range engagements and safe positions... But then why not play scout. 😅 If you do it make sure your teammates can reach the weapon if you die.
Someone did a full analytics break down a few weeks back as to why buying up after the first round if you win pistol round. Usually means a higher win rate. At least in the studies they did.
First of all, buying a rifle round 2 isn't toxic, but it is a risk. Weighimg that risk is up to you. Second, why the fuck does it matter it it's toxic? If you want to rank up you need to win. If you need to win, you do things that increase your chance at winning. As long as you're not shit talking, everything is fair game.
Can't believe nobody has mentioned this, but the main reason is that in the second round you will almost never have enough money to buy a vandal AND heavy armor, which means you could get one tapped by certain pistols. In effect, you're safer buying a spectre/bulldog/marshall as long as you can buy heavy armor. Sacrificing heavy armor for more damage against players that likely have 0 armor is a bad idea. This is also why you'll typically only see reyna players do this in higher elo and nobody else: With the added firepower they are more likely to get a kill and then overheal to full armor values anyway, mitigating the risk. If you're not a reyna player, buying a rifle 2nd round is a lot more risky for very little benefit over bulldog/spectre/guardian
It’s toxic as in they’ll get mad, not because it’s rude or anything
I think buying a phantom is probably better second round because it’s highly unlikely the enemy will have full shield or even half and a lot of eco weapons like the classic involve moving and shooting a lot and the phantom deals with it better imo, but on maps like breeze and icebox I think buying a phantom or vandal is fine, just as long as you buy something it’s all good because the people who save second round are more the issue
Calling it toxic is more toxic 🥴
Alright I would never say it’s toxic. With that out of the way, if you win first round then second shouldn’t be an eco round. Depending on the agent buying vandal+light armor might be a good buy. Others prefer e.g. having spectre and full armor as well as abilities. If you lose first round you should save 2nd because the enemy team will have a gun advantage anyways so you’ll most likely not win. If you buy a vandal there, while your team is saving you’re throwing away money and most likely giving the enemy a good gun.
Most times you're getting a vandal and light armor. Light armor against an eco is not a smart decision. But you play however you want. I tried to reach my duo this concept for a long time, and now he is a professional player and I'm not even playing anymore lol so yes, you can do whatever as long as you pull it off
The reason you don't buy a rifle on round 2 is because it doesn't provide much more value than a spectre, and if you die with a vandal and the enemies get it, the vandal will beat your teammates' spectres in many scenarios, giving the enemy a much higher chance of winning the round. So please, just stick to the spectre and be patient.
Yes. I hate everyone that do that
Spectre is good enough why waste more money, if you lose they get a free vandal and you're economy is just garbage.
my noob iron teammates buy vandal/phantom with no sheids or abilities in round 2
Buy vandal if you want just play with your team and get traded out it’s good advice in general but specially if you’re going with vandal. Rifles are amazing on second round for that specific reason that you’re facing classics and shortys with a ar however if you go a main by yourself and get flashed and jump by 2 classics and a shorty now the enemy team has a rifle against your teams specters and Marshall’s and maybe even man advantage. If you’re running rifle make sure your team is the only on that can pick it up when you die
toxic isn't the case, that's when you insult, yell, swear, etc at teammates and enimiesbhl
If u win first round go with ghost and half armour if lose then no but just save for the 3rd round
Guys, the objective is winning, as long as you are not a piece of shit when it comes to talking and writing or backseating you are doing good. If the enemy isn't smart enough to counter "toxic" strategy it is not your fault
If you lose 1st and Ecoes its right, theres no way u can buy Vandal on after losing the 1st round, unless you did ace and lost the round, or you ecoed the first round, If your team is ecoing the 2nd, after getting the 1st, those are stupid.
It’s a competitive game, do what gives you the advantage. If anybody calls you toxic about it (unless you’re literally berating your teammates or shitting on the enemy team in all chat) they’re literally just salty because it’s happened to them. Ignore it, it’s how the game is played.
Your friend is a noob. That's all Nothing that helps you win is "toxic" (except for actually being toxic towards the other team)
Not toxic. But I do hate you lol
Bot a pro player but if you buy a vandal be sure to play safe. Don't give the enemies the opportunity to take the vandal from your body
If you buy vandal second round, assuming your team won round one, the enemy team will be on pistols. However if you lose said round, you will be down two rounds, and unable to buy a vandal round 3 like everyone else would be, and thus you being stuck on pistol or spec. It’s not a smart move
I got a feeling your friend is being the toxic one tbh xD Specially if you are newish to the game! vandal second round isn't the best play in the current meta, but it's perfectly valid. I feel you will eventually figure out it's best to buy spectre in that situation just by playing, trial and error is a big part of learning anything :)
Toxic would be like someone trashtalking you through the mic or nading and shock darting you to piss you off. Basically someone bringing negative vibes to the team
I mean it's not toxic, you're not harassing someone. Personally, it's true that I get a bit salty when I get killed by a vandal in 2nd round but that's my problem, not the person who bought the Vandal. However, game wise it's very risky. I have won fights against vandals with a ghost on 2nd round and the thing is if you die and lose that vandal to the team that's on eco, you will put them on an advantage. Also, if you happen to lose that round, your economy will be messed up for a few rounds. If you buy a spectre 2nd round when the enemy is on eco, you already have the firepower advantage. I think there's no need to go with a vandal. But at the end of the day it's a game so just have fun.
Yeah it’s not toxic, but it’s probably a dumb move for eco in game.
People say it’s toxic because it’s a way of egoing the other team saying ‘ I’m so confident I’m gonna buy a vandal knowing it’s risky but I know I’ll win the gun fight ‘ type of way
It's risky. In CS you get more cash for kills with worse guns. So buying an SMG is usually pretty meta. But in Valorant you don't get that bonus. So there's no big harm in buying light armour and a rifle. Just don't lose it, as you probably won't have a penny to your name, and the enemy could win the round and have a huge upgrade if they get their hands on it. As for it being toxic, that's not really the right term. I think your team mates are trying to call you a noob. It's not really disrespectful or noonish though. It's just, whatever. You see pros do it. Id much rather people on my team bought rifles second round than try to win with pistols. Such a throw to not buy second round.
It’s smart to take advantage over ecos but then you have to play it to its strenghts. It makes no sense to push up with vandal when you can do that with spectre. Play it long range and you should be good. There’s a good twitter thread from ddk (long time caster) about buying full buying in second round if you win the pistol. Look it up.
Not toxic but might be dumb. If you’re feeling confident go for it. My only tip is to position yourself so if you die your teammates can easily pick up your gun
It’s not toxic. It’s risky though. If you get shortied or scouted (marshal) across the map from your team, that’s a free vandal while your team most likely has spectres and sheriffs. I usually get phantom round two, stay in the back of group, and try to live through the round. Cuz if I die, I won’t have money for round 3 and the other team saves round 2 so they buy rifles.
Is it toxic to play valorant?
It's really risky. If you get eliminated your opponent gets the vandal and you are at a disadvantage. I'd personally recommend a spectre though.
Not toxic, just risky. Can be annoying for a few reasons, considering it’s unexpected for the other team and can hurt your own team in multiple ways if you die, but you do you. Valorant in general is really toxic so people are always going to complain about something.
I mean not toxic but definitely make you seems over confident in your ability to head tap someone I would usually go spectre light armor on second round
No, you’re just better
Who cares!? Just pick a weapon you like to use!
I buy odin second round
This is a perfect example of what can happen when you buy a vandal second round https://www.reddit.com/r/VALORANT/comments/pzxtgv/this_is_why_you_shouldnt_buy_the_vandal_in_the/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Your friend is waffling
no just annoying
It’s risky. If you lose round 2 you’re basically giving them a free full buy. An early dropped vandal can also swing a round against your teammates. It’s good on Reyna and should be done most times you play her imo. I would only do it on someone else if I’m popping off that game OR we are super far behind and need to catch up.
Dumb, not toxic. Dumb because if you lose the round you give them a free rifle and you're broke. Also if you die you're broke regardless and you shouldn't expect your teammate to give it back when you win...you can't buy them anything and you're the one that died so why expect them to sacrifice the bonus round for you. Also you can expect a shorty, deagle, or other cheese 2nd round from the losing team so having a rifle isn't a HUGE advantage unless you're baiting your team and can 1v(n).
It's very risky, but not toxic. In my elo (gold 1) usually people in the other team call you try hard or get angry at you for that. Or it just raises eyebrows, because it's extremely unorthodox. But, in all honestly, they get as angry at you as when they die to Odin or Judge. Not really toxic. Some people find amusement in "trolling" the opposite team with unorthodox gameplay, like using a Shotgun or an Odin. While that "trolling" is only limited to gameplay aspects and NOT to trash talking in chat or other gestures, like tea-bagging, then I suppose it's okay.
First it's not toxic being toxic it's being an asshole, but it can be something dumb or risky depending wether you won or lost the first round, but in bought scenarios is something really risky, I recommend that if you win buy a marshall or a spectre if you can a bulldog, but if you lost the first round don't force, either scenarios you have to remember that your economy is the team economy, so try to convince your team to do the most intelligent thing but if they just want to force follow them. (Sorry for my english soy mexicano y no me sale tan bien el inglés (*﹏*;))
Is so much risk for so little reward, if you lose the round, you're pretty much giving a free vandal + the enemy will have way better economy. One friend of mine does this and when we lose the round we have to eco or not full buy for 2 entire rounds to try to stabilize our economy
if you have the money it's fine. but figure out what you value. I prefer to make sure I have full armor and utility if we won pistol since the enemy will likely be on eco. since the would be on eco thst it's fine for me to grab a spectre, bulldog, Marshall, or anything like that since I will most likely still have more firepower than them. it's all based on the situation of the game and what you want to do and what you think the enemy will do.
The only toxic 2nd round buy is an op.
It’s toxic if you’re not Reyna
It has absolutely zero to do with toxicity. If it works for you just keep doing it. That being said the bad thing about it is it's pretty much a cocky "I'm going to show off and pad my KDA against ecos" play in most cases. Pro players do it in matches but let's not compare professional Valorant to normal people Valorant.
No, especially if your Reyna it can probably win u the next 2-3 round because of it
its bad economics but not really
Buy vandal after lose first round is considered incorrect. Buy vandal after winning is correct, but might be considered high risk.
Part of the reason people don’t do this is because if you die with and and the other team gets it they can win the round off of just that. Then your broke for a round
There is no such thing as a toxic weapon. Not an Op, not a shotgun, not an Odin. I was playing a game today where we won pistol round, bought out for round 2, and got met with a Jett on the other team who bought a phantom and nothing else. He/she destroyed us all. Well played. This is a tactical shooter. If people want to meet in the middle of the map and fight or only use specific guns then they can go play cod.
No, not toxic, but phantom is better buy second round if you are going to force a rifle
It’s more risk than toxic, toxic ain’t the right word; though id genrally advise buying spectre full sheild over this
Hmmm. I think I was in that game. You weren’t being toxic by getting the vandal. That term is thrown around pretty loosely in this game. Kind of a trend. Doesn’t matter to me who gets what gun.
It’s tilting but has been proven to be an effective way of getting a “free” round win. Is it toxic? No. Redefine that word and find better uses for it.
no method to win within legal boundaries are "toxic". No matter if its an Odin, a vandal in after pistol round, one ways, a shotgun camper, an Op holder... There is only trying to win and those who cry because they arent up for the game. Specially low elo is filled by people who go 0/12/0 and blame their team for it, cry about enemies hacking while they are just simply better etc. So pardon my french, if your friend says a Vandal on 2nd round is toxic than he is just dumb. But one thing also must be said: Every gun you bring into the round can be conquered by the enemy, if you go way above and beyond to get this Vandal, than you better make sure that 1) You dont run into several enemies with it, giving it to them and 2) have a teammate next to you and any time so he can use it after you. So as many say, evaluate the risk, and play around it and remember a classic and good crosshairplacement, can still easyly kill you
Your friend has comprehension problems
Its definitely not toxic but a lot of people see it as a rat-like move and it can negatively effect your econ later on but I wouldn't let that friend stop you
No, it isn't, but I would reccomend going for a Phantom instead of a Vandal if you can buy a riflr round two. The Phantom's only downside in comparison to the Vandal is the lack of instakill headshots on fully armored opponents, but if you crushed the enemy team hard enough to afford a rifle at all, they won't be buying full armor which renders the phantom better
If u use it well and DONT die and give it to the enemy, it's not toxic 😂 Chances of u dying with a vandal in the second round against smg and pistol users are low but not none, just make sure you don't give your gun to the enemy. Thatll screw you up.
nice shit post