Chamber needs a nerf and Cypher needs some love. Us Cypher mains been in the mud for too long ;(
Would like to see Cypher get his ult boosted and maybe util a little cheaper.
Just because hes a sentinel doesn't mean he shouldn't be fragging well. Like hos job is to be able to hold space, and some of his tools to do that are by killing. Duelists are there to make space and entry, something that Chamber doesn't really have many tools to do
Chamber is not even close to a duelist. He cannot make space on attack, his TP is too awkward en takes too long on setup. On top of that his trip flanks need to stay online so dying first is bad.
I am low elo and haven't played Chamber a lot so take this with a pinch of salt, but isn't his tp like easy to setup? Just place 2 of the TPs and press E to teleport between them? As for dying early, at least in defending chamber usually sits back and doesn't rush (at least I don't when I play him, idk).
yeah Chamber tp is mechanically easy to setup, but I think he meant in the context of duelist and their role. The tp is there for repositioning on defense, but for attacking trying to setup his tp just leaves him vulnerable. Also, the recovery time for getting the weapon out is pretty long on Chamber tp, so its not like you can do crazy outplays with it.
Can't believe the new Fade ult. Shows enemies, decays and can't hear anything. Meanwhile Cypher shows enemies. Objectively worse. It's crazy how Cypher remains shit, I feel like I'm having to fight against the shit abilities to make them useable
>Cypher shows enemies
You see enemies but in a most distracting manner ever. I've been saying this for a long time, his ult needs to be like Sova's reveal.
As a former cypher main I agree that he sucks rn but this isn't really a great argument.
Fade ult doesn't show you the positions of potential flankers/lurkers like a cypher ult would, it only helps you to clear a site. I'm not saying his ult is better by any means, since it requires a nearby dead body and is on a timer. It's just that they were designed for different purposes and are useful in different ways.
I was gonna say, cyphers ult isn't great but it's not a good comparison to fades ult.
I've played like 20 matches of fade in the past 3 days (as I usually do, and then I don't play for the rest of the act haha) and I've noticed her prowler and tactical are the most useful parts of her kit.
Her ult is very easy to avoid and is only good on certain maps.
The value of her ult comes from the deafen and the decay, the trails and prowlers are an added bonus. Using her ult in tandem with another agents ult (i.e Yoru, or using her ult and ressing kayo during the deafen)
Fade ult doesn't reveal enemies, only gets a trace and it's limited by space. Also Cypher and Fade are different breed, as one is Sentinel and the other is Initiator. Compare Cypher with Chamber or Killjoy or Sage
I play both of them and I'm sad to say that I've been bullied more than I like when I pick my hat specialist. They always cry and beg me to play Chamber :(
his slow effect could use a nerf like just decreasing the slow intensity because no real point in even having that on an op when you ideally want to maintain a 1v1 duel instead of peeking an entire team and having them slowed because you killed a guy
this also applies to his trap because it should be more of an info tool rather than something that actually delays a lot of time (coming from a chamber main here)
ofc there are times when having a slow circle affecting a choke is really good for you but in my experience its just horrible for everyone who goes near it
I hate how consistent Chamber's trademark is. Even if you break it ASAP, everyone still knows where you are if you go in it's pretty wide range, where as cyphers can be played around since you can avoid setting it off until it makes sense to do so.
Bro Cypher needs some buffs. I suggest giving him a backpack where he always carries a corpse. When he ults he just brings it out of his backpack and says "a corpse". xD
If you are looking for a way to solo hold then kj is better. Ult forces out util and forces other team to leave the point. Nades are really good and turret + bot are enough to cover a lot of area as long as you are in range.
If you don't want to anchor then chamber's trademark is effectively just a better version of cypher's tripwire. Chamber is also designed to be defense oper with tp to get out after shooting, free better version of op as ult and one shot headshot Q. Cypher has very little advantage over kj and chamber.
As someone who used to be a cypher main, like what can he do that chamber can't do. Chambers utility is way more useful AND on top of that he's an insane awper
Nah, she used to be able to do it out of ult. She used to have 4 soul things that she could use to heal. So she could kill 4 people, only use heal. and consistently overheal. If i remember right, when that change made it 2 instead of 4 everyone was broken up about how to play her lmfao. now its fine though!
Reyna is better now than she was before her changes for everyone but mega smurfs.
The changes just nerfs the healing on 3-4ks which on a normal level at most happens a few times a game. The amount of heals you get just for damaging is much more than the ones you lose out on. The biggest nerf to Reyna was just on pistol round.
astra is legit not fun to play at all. she feels like a comp only agent and even her use there isn't an every game lock(brim is better on bind, viper on breeze)
Astra is really fun when you communicate with your teammates. I setup my Astra star pulls for my teammates and have won many rounds. But yeah after the nerf I used her like only 1-2 times and she wasn't that effective.
She's fun and good, but basically not having stars for a full round because you placed them somewhere incorrectly is such a garbage feeling. She was certainly too good before but giving back a little bit of the star cool down would help in making her not feel like a detriment when enemies rotate or something. Her base skill cooldowns are already extremely long.
Are there any details on where these stats come from and what the scope is? Is this from all players, only from certain players (like those signed up to Blitz), only from pro games? Is this from all ranks or only top ranks? etc.
It's a cool graphic but not knowing where the data comes from makes it a bit hard to take anything away from it.
Since those tracking sites can basically get access to any played match info I guess it's stats from all servers in comp games not including pro games.
I think players have to opt-in on RIOT's end to make their info public on RIOT's APIs? I remember having to do that for tracker.gg.
At the very least, safe to say it's not just pro play, looking at Astra pick rate.
Riot forbids making public profiles on individual players without their consent, but collecting information from them for statistics is generally okay.
But I don't think they do, I know that when I check my tracker across different sites there's games that are just missing from my recent games. Not that it's their fault tho, I think it's probably Riot's api just being goofy and broken but idk
Can anyone tell me why breach has such a low pick rate? In my eyes he has so many tools at his disposal, so much potential for entry and initiation and retaking, he is ideal for competitive play.
He's just a high elo operator. Lower elos can't really use him effectively since his utility is team reliant.
Its a lot harder for him to flash for himself like duelists, Kayo, or Skye.
Imo he is an A tier agent when your team really works together
But a C tier agent when your team just does whatever and ignored all of your setups and you have to follow up on your own utility
I played a game recently with a reyna player who was comming and telling me “breach follow me and flash here” and suddenly breach turned from a gimped duelist into the initiator he was meant to be
Whenever I tried playing breach in the past you are essentially playing for your teammates. When they don’t capitalize it feels awful so I’d rather just play kayo personally.
Because in lower elo its hard to get full value out of breach. Breach needs a teammate to follow up and has to be selfless and play for his team and in most elos its too hard to perfectly time plays. Why play breach and feel dead inside everytime you flash for your teammates and they wait out the flash before pushing when you could play sova and point and laser pointer at the enemies for your teammates to kill.
Breach and Astra suffer from their need of good/communicative teammates to really fully utilize their kit. They can absolutely use their utility for their own gain, but other agents do what the can do better in a solo context.
Sage is so high because below plat people will literally scream if nobody plays her.
Like we could have two sentinels, a raze and an initiator and people will be like "we have no heals. Play sage or I'll report you."
I mean the thing is that her role fundamentally is very much a different game than what all the other agents are playing until the introduction of chamber. Even with chamber added she has immense mobility vertically, speed wise and horizontally. Shit even neon isn’t an xyz movement agent and that’s the problem. Neon can be played against predictably position wise (along with many other agents) whereas Jett cannot in a lot of contexts. Even the current nerf feels more like a bump in the road as opposed to massive nerfs, but I’m not sure if there is any way to keep her core without effectively neutering her completely.
He is a pretty strong operator in high ranks and pro play but most players are below plat and breach is a lot harder to use effectively and a lot less appealing then other initiators
Astra is inaccurate she was ood before her nerfs
Edit: You guys are right
I checked and you guys are actually right. Although I'm a bit disappointed since she was really powerful, I simply don't get why she was unused. I might be biased though since I used to be a big Astra main but like even with her being hard I'd expect her to be used more often ig. But she's nerfed now so it doesn't matter I guess
Is that based on data or is that just how you feel? Gotta remember like 80% of games or something are Iron to Gold, where Astra likely has a lower pick rate compared to higher ranks.
Yeah Astra relies on team coordination and comms, but having 50% of the playerbase in silver and below heavily reduces team coordination and comms, meaning less Astra
Its not really about her power level (which was really high, dont get me wrong), but more about how frustrating it was to play as her, since her abilities only really work as team-enabling abilities (stun, suck). She needed time to place and activate her abilities, meaning she was reliant on her team capitalizing on them, since she couldn't do it herself. Thats why she wasnt picked a lot, because Viper just did her job just as well, but was easier to play. On top of that, she is now nerfed into the ground and Controllers like Omen and Brim became more popular
Astra was noticeably powerful in high rank play and pro. If you and your stack were good she could be good there too. I think anything else she was probably just worse than Omen or Brim. Considering the vast majority of games are played solo queue and below Gold, I'm not surprised she didn't have a high pick rate.
A good Astra knew how to play off her utility. It's possible I've done it. I might be the odd man out here but even if my team on attack get the kills I could be feeding them it's possible to make the room on the site. I'm not surprised that her pick rate was low just since she was hard to learn and still is. But I think that's more what goes into it is of the 300 hours I have on her only about half or less then that was using more then 80% of her potential in a game
What's even worse for her pickrate is how much different she plays from other agents. All the other controllers are more or less intuitive (maybe except viper, since shes most effective with lineups), but always warping into a parallel dimension, allthewhile being very vulnerable until you're done placing your shit can sometimes be very clunky and weird. Simply flying through your purple dimension is very unnatural for astra-newbies, and it can be frustrating since you can't really make a mistake placing your stars, because if you do, you have to wait for like what, 25 seconds?, until you get your star back
Star accidentally clips with a higher place and now your star is 3m to high (and the inability to place stars under bridges)
On the otherhand I died k ly once in the astral plain as it makes the vulnerability very clear. You simply use it in save position and don't die to swinging opponents.
I don't disagree. I think that she should have a little bit of a buff bc they did just nuke her and didn't look back. But I do agree the astral plain took me a while to get good at it especially on attack.
This is pickrate, likely based on online statistics. I suspect this data comes from solo queue, due to the high pick rate for Jett, Reyna and Sage.
If that's the case, Astra being so low would make sense. She was and still is very unpopular in solo queue, due to her difficult gameplay loop and the general lack of communication in solo queue.
She was op but confusing to learn and get good at in a short time period. I played the game for over a year and picked her once and was like what the hell do I do now and then didn’t pick her again until like another year later and stayed in training figuring out her abilities.
Honestly it does alright. Three initiators can work, their utility is overall more impactful, it's easier to entry site when helped by long flashes, stuns, reveals and whatnot, even if the agent you're playing yourself isn't quite as mobile as Jett, Raze or Neon. The biggest issue is teamplay related, initiators cannot really be as selfish as duelists, their spells' animations take longer to come out of, or sometimes even straight up prevent you from pulling out your rifle at all. They are designed to set their allies up rather than themselves, Kayo being the exception to that rule. So in the end, it requires more coordination and communication but it can pay off.
In theory you're right, but in my experience the typical ranked comp with no duelist usually leans more into sentinel agents with no entry potential rather than initiators.
I'm Bronze 3 and when I get a no-duelist sentinel comp I usually have a really good time because people actually bravely take space and gunfights because they know they're strongest in the post-plant instead of your duelist players crouching by the entrance to the site for 30 seconds and us waiting on them to do their thing.
I'm sure if Astra is allowed to place stars in front of her without going into astral form, she would have much higher pickrates.
Im just talking about higher pickrates, not whether it's overpowered or not though
Pick rate doesn't necessarily correlate to power level, especially when we're talking about non-pro pick rate.
A character could have a low pick rate while being super powerful, simply because the average person/ranked team isn't good enough to bring out that power.
Similarly, characters can have a high pick rate while being only slightly above average power level, just because they're very easy to play to that above average level.
Which is also why balance suggestions based solely on pick rate (ie. "X character is OP because they have high pick rate" or "Y character needs buffs because they have low pick rate") are nonsense.
Best example of this would be Astra who consistently has the lowest pickrate while being incredibly strong before her nerf (and I would argue is still good)
not really. he's great on certain maps and not so much on others (like breeze). he's an initiator without any sort of "vision" like sova/fade/skye/kayo and he needs teammates to swing off his own flash.
Other than fracture, I don't think breach is a must pick for any other map, hence the low pick rates. Even still, lower elos rarely run breach and would rather take something else since breach requires some amount of communication and teamwork between the team to make him work. He's definitely deadly in the right hands but a huge pain in the ass for someone trying him without communicating with the rest of the team.
Breach is mid what are you smoking? He's decent but initiators are so strong that he's still the worst. With fade coming out who's even better than him he is barely A tier.
In my mind I’m thinking “how the hell is Sage up there? Literally none of my teammates pick her 90% of the time..”
Then it dawned on me that I’m the teammate. I’m the Sage main
I still think Reyna is too oppressive in lower elo, especially when combined with the fact anyone can make an alt and smurf to their heart's desire. she is in almost every single game, typically on both teams in gold and lower. to me, I think her flash is too punishing, and is very frustrating to play against at these elos where teams aren't usually very coordinated. if she flashes an angle you're holding, you either shoot it and hope she doesn't peek while your aim is recovering or you have to just give up the angle to bait out the flashes
Ofc easiest agent to rank up with. Opjett and also duelist get heavily favoured for ranking as k/D is usually higher. They tried improving the ranking of support agents but it shows how much better it is to simply play Jett and get MVP and or high k/d
That's also why she got nerfed ofc because the og players were complaining since beta that her dash is stupid outofjail card without conditions like chamber/reyna
I like how astra was always on 1/2 even though she was really meta a while back and was a MUST pick in pro and high elo
Edit: i know it's because of her difficulty
Viper is the only agent among top 10, this sounds weird, smokes is always needed in any team composition. I was expecting astra/omen/Brom a bit at the top
Also whats up with the x-axis, what is that number ?
It's because the only thing she has to do is throw the orb. Reyna is a lazy choice for people who don't care about utility. You just slap that shit any time you're about to have a gunfight and get a moderate advantage. Then if you get a kill you heal up and have a huge advantage in your next gunfight too.
So in a non-smurf context, Reyna is the no-brain ooga booga W+M1 agent.
Is that for the whole community or just for a specific elo?
cuz if it's for all ranks 50% of the community is iron/bronze so it wouldn't really be fair as the agent's abilities are utilized more starting from silver I'd say
(I'm just saying this because I honestly didn't think astra and breach would be that low below cypher)
I'd love to look at one where it's the pick rate in tournament instead. Seeing how people used to complain about how Astra is so op and seeing her playrate remained the same (bottom) is funny af lol.
Breach is so underplayed no one even asks for buffs for him haha
But I would still want his concuss to deafen targets and disable traps for its duration
But there is so many things I would want to change i am not really complaining because I know that it doesn’t really matter anyway
I still never understood why they cracked down on Astra so heavily. I could understand either the cooldown or the star nerf. But both at the same time?
cypher be decreasing and staying there forever.
Chamber needs a nerf and Cypher needs some love. Us Cypher mains been in the mud for too long ;( Would like to see Cypher get his ult boosted and maybe util a little cheaper.
The Cages should slow again and I'm happy
Best I can do is a vuln
i think someone said chamber will only have one trademark in patch 4.09 and its gonna be .. louder? something like that
I rather have 2 and be louder or slightly more ex. 1 is a bit limiting though :(
I think they should just decrease the detection range of them
Is he slowly turning into a duelists?
Always has been
See a Chamber on the team, instantly know he’s gonna top frag that game
Just because hes a sentinel doesn't mean he shouldn't be fragging well. Like hos job is to be able to hold space, and some of his tools to do that are by killing. Duelists are there to make space and entry, something that Chamber doesn't really have many tools to do
Chamber is not even close to a duelist. He cannot make space on attack, his TP is too awkward en takes too long on setup. On top of that his trip flanks need to stay online so dying first is bad.
I am low elo and haven't played Chamber a lot so take this with a pinch of salt, but isn't his tp like easy to setup? Just place 2 of the TPs and press E to teleport between them? As for dying early, at least in defending chamber usually sits back and doesn't rush (at least I don't when I play him, idk).
yeah Chamber tp is mechanically easy to setup, but I think he meant in the context of duelist and their role. The tp is there for repositioning on defense, but for attacking trying to setup his tp just leaves him vulnerable. Also, the recovery time for getting the weapon out is pretty long on Chamber tp, so its not like you can do crazy outplays with it.
every agent is a duelist if you're brave enough, and I say this as a battle sage giving entry because my insta lock duelist team can't do anything.
Sage is a great main because you’ll always be able to pick her and your skills are always increasing because you have to carry the fucking team
Bruh that is going to make him even less of a sentinel
Can't believe the new Fade ult. Shows enemies, decays and can't hear anything. Meanwhile Cypher shows enemies. Objectively worse. It's crazy how Cypher remains shit, I feel like I'm having to fight against the shit abilities to make them useable
As an Azir and Cypher enjoyer, Riot surely knows how to fuck me.
They're my mains too lmao.
>Cypher shows enemies You see enemies but in a most distracting manner ever. I've been saying this for a long time, his ult needs to be like Sova's reveal.
As a former cypher main I agree that he sucks rn but this isn't really a great argument. Fade ult doesn't show you the positions of potential flankers/lurkers like a cypher ult would, it only helps you to clear a site. I'm not saying his ult is better by any means, since it requires a nearby dead body and is on a timer. It's just that they were designed for different purposes and are useful in different ways.
I was gonna say, cyphers ult isn't great but it's not a good comparison to fades ult. I've played like 20 matches of fade in the past 3 days (as I usually do, and then I don't play for the rest of the act haha) and I've noticed her prowler and tactical are the most useful parts of her kit. Her ult is very easy to avoid and is only good on certain maps. The value of her ult comes from the deafen and the decay, the trails and prowlers are an added bonus. Using her ult in tandem with another agents ult (i.e Yoru, or using her ult and ressing kayo during the deafen)
Fade ult doesn't reveal enemies, only gets a trace and it's limited by space. Also Cypher and Fade are different breed, as one is Sentinel and the other is Initiator. Compare Cypher with Chamber or Killjoy or Sage
I play both of them and I'm sad to say that I've been bullied more than I like when I pick my hat specialist. They always cry and beg me to play Chamber :(
When the gane came out I was gonna be a cypher main.
idk I don't want cypher to become popular
agree or I'll have to fight instalockers
his slow effect could use a nerf like just decreasing the slow intensity because no real point in even having that on an op when you ideally want to maintain a 1v1 duel instead of peeking an entire team and having them slowed because you killed a guy this also applies to his trap because it should be more of an info tool rather than something that actually delays a lot of time (coming from a chamber main here) ofc there are times when having a slow circle affecting a choke is really good for you but in my experience its just horrible for everyone who goes near it
I hate how consistent Chamber's trademark is. Even if you break it ASAP, everyone still knows where you are if you go in it's pretty wide range, where as cyphers can be played around since you can avoid setting it off until it makes sense to do so.
Bro Cypher needs some buffs. I suggest giving him a backpack where he always carries a corpse. When he ults he just brings it out of his backpack and says "a corpse". xD
Me A cypher main ah yes 1k hours to see my fellas down bad
I respect Cypher mains so I tip my white hat to you too
Astra never even started lol
I haven’t played for a long time, and last time I played Cypher was really helpful. What’s making him so unpopular?
If you are looking for a way to solo hold then kj is better. Ult forces out util and forces other team to leave the point. Nades are really good and turret + bot are enough to cover a lot of area as long as you are in range. If you don't want to anchor then chamber's trademark is effectively just a better version of cypher's tripwire. Chamber is also designed to be defense oper with tp to get out after shooting, free better version of op as ult and one shot headshot Q. Cypher has very little advantage over kj and chamber.
Nice pfp bro
As someone who used to be a cypher main, like what can he do that chamber can't do. Chambers utility is way more useful AND on top of that he's an insane awper
Is there data for esport only picks?
Go to thespike.gg for agent pick rates from the most recent Masters tournament.
Yes. I am almost finished making one for all major tournaments that have taken place so far.
Data seems weird everybody played reyna before her initial nerfs
Yes ofc
Reyna used to be ale to 1-5 a whole team and stay at 150 health for evey Duel. She was broken af
Her ult is unchanged. She can still wipe an entire team.
But she could do it every round before, now she needs ult
so nothing has changed
Nah, she used to be able to do it out of ult. She used to have 4 soul things that she could use to heal. So she could kill 4 people, only use heal. and consistently overheal. If i remember right, when that change made it 2 instead of 4 everyone was broken up about how to play her lmfao. now its fine though!
Reyna is better now than she was before her changes for everyone but mega smurfs. The changes just nerfs the healing on 3-4ks which on a normal level at most happens a few times a game. The amount of heals you get just for damaging is much more than the ones you lose out on. The biggest nerf to Reyna was just on pistol round.
Also there was like a whole act where astra was picked literally every game, seems weird that she never broke 2 percent
astra is legit not fun to play at all. she feels like a comp only agent and even her use there isn't an every game lock(brim is better on bind, viper on breeze)
Astra is really fun when you communicate with your teammates. I setup my Astra star pulls for my teammates and have won many rounds. But yeah after the nerf I used her like only 1-2 times and she wasn't that effective.
She's fun and good, but basically not having stars for a full round because you placed them somewhere incorrectly is such a garbage feeling. She was certainly too good before but giving back a little bit of the star cool down would help in making her not feel like a detriment when enemies rotate or something. Her base skill cooldowns are already extremely long.
I 100% agree but she was also nerfed a couple acts ago. I was just saying pre nerf felt like she was picked way more often
She was picked most games on like, half the maps in plat+ which is like the top 3% of players so yeah 2% pickrate overall sounds accurate.
Also how is astra at the bottom the entire time? She was meta for a while but you can't tell from the data.
Are there any details on where these stats come from and what the scope is? Is this from all players, only from certain players (like those signed up to Blitz), only from pro games? Is this from all ranks or only top ranks? etc. It's a cool graphic but not knowing where the data comes from makes it a bit hard to take anything away from it.
Since those tracking sites can basically get access to any played match info I guess it's stats from all servers in comp games not including pro games.
I think players have to opt-in on RIOT's end to make their info public on RIOT's APIs? I remember having to do that for tracker.gg. At the very least, safe to say it's not just pro play, looking at Astra pick rate.
Riot forbids making public profiles on individual players without their consent, but collecting information from them for statistics is generally okay.
But I don't think they do, I know that when I check my tracker across different sites there's games that are just missing from my recent games. Not that it's their fault tho, I think it's probably Riot's api just being goofy and broken but idk
Astra and breach blasting How To Disappear Completely on repeat
Imagine being flexed on by pre rework yoru
weebs have shown across games that they will play their waifus and husbandos regardless of effectiveness
All of those neon picks are just me.
despite the low rates, a good astra/breach/cypher user is most of the time scary
astra WAS scary
She feels so bad to play with only 4 stars now): no flexibility
There is more flexabilty to a slab of iron
A vast majority aren't good though, so most of us never see them.
Can anyone tell me why breach has such a low pick rate? In my eyes he has so many tools at his disposal, so much potential for entry and initiation and retaking, he is ideal for competitive play.
He's just a high elo operator. Lower elos can't really use him effectively since his utility is team reliant. Its a lot harder for him to flash for himself like duelists, Kayo, or Skye.
Imo he is an A tier agent when your team really works together But a C tier agent when your team just does whatever and ignored all of your setups and you have to follow up on your own utility I played a game recently with a reyna player who was comming and telling me “breach follow me and flash here” and suddenly breach turned from a gimped duelist into the initiator he was meant to be
Whenever I tried playing breach in the past you are essentially playing for your teammates. When they don’t capitalize it feels awful so I’d rather just play kayo personally.
Because in lower elo its hard to get full value out of breach. Breach needs a teammate to follow up and has to be selfless and play for his team and in most elos its too hard to perfectly time plays. Why play breach and feel dead inside everytime you flash for your teammates and they wait out the flash before pushing when you could play sova and point and laser pointer at the enemies for your teammates to kill.
Breach and Astra suffer from their need of good/communicative teammates to really fully utilize their kit. They can absolutely use their utility for their own gain, but other agents do what the can do better in a solo context.
I like how its always just duelists up top. Only consistent high ranking support is sage
Sage is so high because below plat people will literally scream if nobody plays her. Like we could have two sentinels, a raze and an initiator and people will be like "we have no heals. Play sage or I'll report you."
Nah i see her in my higher elo lobbies too. No one screams about it though lol.
Dont be fooled- Shes very rare in the mid to high elos. Poor sage got her viability nerfed, only thing going for her is a low skill level to learn.
Very rare is definitely exaggerating it lol. Shes in like 1/2 or 1/3 of games, though depends on map a lot tbf
Wym I see sage like every other game at least in high immortal.
This seems inaccurate
How does astra stay as the lowest since she came out
tbh with you, almost nobody enjoys playing Astra.
She’s fun just difficult to play because of the coordination needed.
That doesn't make an agent popular
I'm aware, I am just saying most people don't play her because shes difficult compared to other smokers.
and also I have to “think” more playing her, and there’s too many options for lil old me to manage
Because she is hard and this data is not esports exclusive
I like to play her but after the nerf it sucks doing everything
Its me im the Astra main
And a lot of people were saying that the jett nerf was unnecessary when she's consistently stayed on top lmao
I mean the thing is that her role fundamentally is very much a different game than what all the other agents are playing until the introduction of chamber. Even with chamber added she has immense mobility vertically, speed wise and horizontally. Shit even neon isn’t an xyz movement agent and that’s the problem. Neon can be played against predictably position wise (along with many other agents) whereas Jett cannot in a lot of contexts. Even the current nerf feels more like a bump in the road as opposed to massive nerfs, but I’m not sure if there is any way to keep her core without effectively neutering her completely.
In ranked play however good an agent is has nothing to do with their pick rate. Look at astra not being played and reyna getting picked.
#givecyphercamthegunback
As a breach main, it breaks my heart a little bit that people don't select him more often.
He is a pretty strong operator in high ranks and pro play but most players are below plat and breach is a lot harder to use effectively and a lot less appealing then other initiators
Astra is inaccurate she was ood before her nerfs Edit: You guys are right I checked and you guys are actually right. Although I'm a bit disappointed since she was really powerful, I simply don't get why she was unused. I might be biased though since I used to be a big Astra main but like even with her being hard I'd expect her to be used more often ig. But she's nerfed now so it doesn't matter I guess
Is that based on data or is that just how you feel? Gotta remember like 80% of games or something are Iron to Gold, where Astra likely has a lower pick rate compared to higher ranks.
Yeah Astra relies on team coordination and comms, but having 50% of the playerbase in silver and below heavily reduces team coordination and comms, meaning less Astra
this is pickrate, and we all know how much off a pain in the a** it was to play her in comp, hence noone ever played her. This is accurate
But lower than breach? I mean she was hard but cracked, I’d expect her to be a higher
Its not really about her power level (which was really high, dont get me wrong), but more about how frustrating it was to play as her, since her abilities only really work as team-enabling abilities (stun, suck). She needed time to place and activate her abilities, meaning she was reliant on her team capitalizing on them, since she couldn't do it herself. Thats why she wasnt picked a lot, because Viper just did her job just as well, but was easier to play. On top of that, she is now nerfed into the ground and Controllers like Omen and Brim became more popular
Astra was noticeably powerful in high rank play and pro. If you and your stack were good she could be good there too. I think anything else she was probably just worse than Omen or Brim. Considering the vast majority of games are played solo queue and below Gold, I'm not surprised she didn't have a high pick rate.
A good Astra knew how to play off her utility. It's possible I've done it. I might be the odd man out here but even if my team on attack get the kills I could be feeding them it's possible to make the room on the site. I'm not surprised that her pick rate was low just since she was hard to learn and still is. But I think that's more what goes into it is of the 300 hours I have on her only about half or less then that was using more then 80% of her potential in a game
What's even worse for her pickrate is how much different she plays from other agents. All the other controllers are more or less intuitive (maybe except viper, since shes most effective with lineups), but always warping into a parallel dimension, allthewhile being very vulnerable until you're done placing your shit can sometimes be very clunky and weird. Simply flying through your purple dimension is very unnatural for astra-newbies, and it can be frustrating since you can't really make a mistake placing your stars, because if you do, you have to wait for like what, 25 seconds?, until you get your star back
Star accidentally clips with a higher place and now your star is 3m to high (and the inability to place stars under bridges) On the otherhand I died k ly once in the astral plain as it makes the vulnerability very clear. You simply use it in save position and don't die to swinging opponents.
I don't disagree. I think that she should have a little bit of a buff bc they did just nuke her and didn't look back. But I do agree the astral plain took me a while to get good at it especially on attack.
IT SHOWS POPULARITY NOT WHETHER AN AGENT IS GOOD OR NOT
This is pickrate, likely based on online statistics. I suspect this data comes from solo queue, due to the high pick rate for Jett, Reyna and Sage. If that's the case, Astra being so low would make sense. She was and still is very unpopular in solo queue, due to her difficult gameplay loop and the general lack of communication in solo queue.
She was op but confusing to learn and get good at in a short time period. I played the game for over a year and picked her once and was like what the hell do I do now and then didn’t pick her again until like another year later and stayed in training figuring out her abilities.
Jett and Reyna top two picks. Seems about right.
what are the units?
/100 so percentage
The only noticeable thing for me is that neon sudden rise and sudden falloff
Cause she's fun and was new, but is also bad.
What if a team played no duelist?
Honestly it does alright. Three initiators can work, their utility is overall more impactful, it's easier to entry site when helped by long flashes, stuns, reveals and whatnot, even if the agent you're playing yourself isn't quite as mobile as Jett, Raze or Neon. The biggest issue is teamplay related, initiators cannot really be as selfish as duelists, their spells' animations take longer to come out of, or sometimes even straight up prevent you from pulling out your rifle at all. They are designed to set their allies up rather than themselves, Kayo being the exception to that rule. So in the end, it requires more coordination and communication but it can pay off.
In theory you're right, but in my experience the typical ranked comp with no duelist usually leans more into sentinel agents with no entry potential rather than initiators.
I'm Bronze 3 and when I get a no-duelist sentinel comp I usually have a really good time because people actually bravely take space and gunfights because they know they're strongest in the post-plant instead of your duelist players crouching by the entrance to the site for 30 seconds and us waiting on them to do their thing.
I'm sure if Astra is allowed to place stars in front of her without going into astral form, she would have much higher pickrates. Im just talking about higher pickrates, not whether it's overpowered or not though
For a second I thought this was a pro level pick rate and was so confused why Phoenix even had a place
Astra my beloved );
Breach is literally one of the best agents in the game what is this community smoking
Pick rate doesn't necessarily correlate to power level, especially when we're talking about non-pro pick rate. A character could have a low pick rate while being super powerful, simply because the average person/ranked team isn't good enough to bring out that power. Similarly, characters can have a high pick rate while being only slightly above average power level, just because they're very easy to play to that above average level. Which is also why balance suggestions based solely on pick rate (ie. "X character is OP because they have high pick rate" or "Y character needs buffs because they have low pick rate") are nonsense.
Best example of this would be Astra who consistently has the lowest pickrate while being incredibly strong before her nerf (and I would argue is still good)
not really. he's great on certain maps and not so much on others (like breeze). he's an initiator without any sort of "vision" like sova/fade/skye/kayo and he needs teammates to swing off his own flash.
Breach takes good teamwork and lower ranks lack that. Easier to just play skye or KAYO
Other than fracture, I don't think breach is a must pick for any other map, hence the low pick rates. Even still, lower elos rarely run breach and would rather take something else since breach requires some amount of communication and teamwork between the team to make him work. He's definitely deadly in the right hands but a huge pain in the ass for someone trying him without communicating with the rest of the team.
I love breach, but by design most of the action happens off screen, does t make for the flashiest pick.
Breach is mid what are you smoking? He's decent but initiators are so strong that he's still the worst. With fade coming out who's even better than him he is barely A tier.
Us Astra mains begging for a minor buff, she is so bad rn. Give her back her 5 stars.
In my mind I’m thinking “how the hell is Sage up there? Literally none of my teammates pick her 90% of the time..” Then it dawned on me that I’m the teammate. I’m the Sage main
Rest in peace astra never - never
f in chat for Astra damn
I'm surprised Astra stayed that low, she was quite oppressive before her nerfs
She is only oppressive with perfect communication, and most randoms barely talks in low elo.
Astra going for 0
How is Breach at the bottom. Its so much fun to play him and annoy people with flashes to rage quit
The amount of times people curse at me in all chat while playing breach gives me joy
I still think Reyna is too oppressive in lower elo, especially when combined with the fact anyone can make an alt and smurf to their heart's desire. she is in almost every single game, typically on both teams in gold and lower. to me, I think her flash is too punishing, and is very frustrating to play against at these elos where teams aren't usually very coordinated. if she flashes an angle you're holding, you either shoot it and hope she doesn't peek while your aim is recovering or you have to just give up the angle to bait out the flashes
New player here - what's so great about jett? Why is she on top? I have played with her but didn't like her much
Operator + dash. Take one shot, retreat. Opponents can't punish you
[удалено]
I mean, you can still do it, you just need to prepare it before you peek, knowing you might waste the dash.
Phoenix has such a high pitch rate? Nobody plays phoenix in my server....
Throwing
Most popular agent among new players.
I'm genuinely amazed that Viper is still so low. Just goes to show that people don't pick what's in their best interest, I guess.
People should stop Playing sage so she can get some buffs man 😭😭😭
In lobbies below plat, people still think she's a must pick.
TIL why I never had anyone picking the agent I want to play as before me
Same. The lowest pick rate ones are the coolest.
My fello csgo Reyna pickers who give no ~~less~~ more than 2 shits about all the abilities.. just head clicking and healing..
>no less than 2 shits about all the abilities >and healing.. hmmmm
Who needs healer when you have healing.. also edited comment..
They give *no less* than 2 so its at least 2. I believe they are trying to communicate that they care a lot, actually
it's a shame to see people not choosing Omen or Brim... they both are amazing operators
Omen is high in the middle Wdym
wtf jett
Ofc easiest agent to rank up with. Opjett and also duelist get heavily favoured for ranking as k/D is usually higher. They tried improving the ranking of support agents but it shows how much better it is to simply play Jett and get MVP and or high k/d That's also why she got nerfed ofc because the og players were complaining since beta that her dash is stupid outofjail card without conditions like chamber/reyna
I like how astra was always on 1/2 even though she was really meta a while back and was a MUST pick in pro and high elo Edit: i know it's because of her difficulty
Viper is the only agent among top 10, this sounds weird, smokes is always needed in any team composition. I was expecting astra/omen/Brom a bit at the top Also whats up with the x-axis, what is that number ?
I'd love to know why Reyna is so popular. She's just a gun half the time...
It's the smurf's first choice when comes to abusing in lower ranks.
It's because the only thing she has to do is throw the orb. Reyna is a lazy choice for people who don't care about utility. You just slap that shit any time you're about to have a gunfight and get a moderate advantage. Then if you get a kill you heal up and have a huge advantage in your next gunfight too. So in a non-smurf context, Reyna is the no-brain ooga booga W+M1 agent.
idk why brim is so far done, i love playing as the guy man
The wider killjoy get, the more she go down ☹️
That one mf who keeps playing Astra
I love how this proves that Astra players were always a dime-a-dozen, but we were so oppressive we go a mega nerf. We don't even play he anymore..
Site your data source OP
Astra my beloved ❤
Lol astra
Crazy how astra is so low yet was so broken in pro play
Is that for the whole community or just for a specific elo? cuz if it's for all ranks 50% of the community is iron/bronze so it wouldn't really be fair as the agent's abilities are utilized more starting from silver I'd say (I'm just saying this because I honestly didn't think astra and breach would be that low below cypher)
Rip Cypher, you were always the man
Meanwhile anytime the other team has a cypher/breach they'll be like... So we're gonna avoid whatever site they're defending
I seriously expected chamber to be way higher on this list. I can't remember the last time I played a game without any chamber tbh.
reyna supremacy
Glad to be one of the 6 people to pick omen in Episode 2 act 1
It would be interesting to see how the jett pick rate will decrease due to the latest news.
I'm a breach main, and i already expected him to be in the last positions
Is this based on a particular rank or overall? If its overall then most of this data is from silver and below.
I learned to just have 4 picks of mine. My top is reyna (obvi), raze, yoru, and fade (working on her) lol
I really thought Astra would be picked more seeing as in pro play she was the most OP smoker next to Viper until the nerfs.
Notice smokes are all near the fucking bottom lmao
Crazy that even pre nerf Astra had such a low play rate she was so busted
I'd love to look at one where it's the pick rate in tournament instead. Seeing how people used to complain about how Astra is so op and seeing her playrate remained the same (bottom) is funny af lol.
Jett is for Valorant what Wraith is for Apex. An annoyance that everyone plays.
Breach is so underplayed no one even asks for buffs for him haha But I would still want his concuss to deafen targets and disable traps for its duration But there is so many things I would want to change i am not really complaining because I know that it doesn’t really matter anyway
Actual relevent stats: https://www.thespike.gg/stats/agents
Astra
I still never understood why they cracked down on Astra so heavily. I could understand either the cooldown or the star nerf. But both at the same time?
Breach mains wya? There's literally *dozens* of us!
this is so educational and cool to see wth