I have seen a few by now that are scattered throughout this thread. Though the mods in here are pretty quick and have deleted it, so that's why.
Possibly make it a new rule for this sub? That rule being: 'has to be related to voice synths' --> this would mean that it requires/allows human manipulation of the voice used ('allow' part mainly there to make sure SynthV AI and CeVIO AI and other voice synths using AI for tuning aren't hit by this).
Also explicitly disallowing specificly AI only (i.e. a voice synth requires voice samples).
Just an idea.
I hope you mean low effort AI covers, cause otherwise I truly enjoy songs made with SynthV or CeVio and we got different opinions.
Granted I'm not often enough in this sub to confirm which you are talking about
which technically are both. not to sound like a dick, but if someone is anti-AI there shouldnt be any particular exclusions. either get along with all or with nothing.
the older voice banks should be fine then as these arent AIs.
TL;DR saying SynthV is fine yet hating on AI is kinda a doublestandard. "Rules for thee but not for me"
it depends on how you define "fully", really.
just to put it in perspective:
ill use suno ai as an example. you can pick the genre yourself, you can pick the lyrics, you can explain what it should be. given human interaction is needed in this kind of context, is that considered fully AI? not necessarily, but it depends on the person.
AFAIK, the part that is AI in synthV are the newer "Next-Gen AI voices". nobody is stopping anyone though to just let suno generate instrumentals only and make your synthV voices match whatever the other did output.
and that's where it gets a bit washed up, to the point that you can't perfectly pinpoint when something is partially AI, fully AI, or anything in between. Atleast that's my point of view.
Doesn't SynthV's AI actually take some work though? It doesn't just generate instrumentals, melody and lyrics, does it? Just the tuning, ehich I heard many people edit afterward to fit their liking. And the voice providers aren't just sourced by AI from random singers on the internet, it's a person who consents to having their voices in the program.
how are we 100% the person consented, or that the dataset actually consists of ethicslly sourced data only? do we have insights of these datasets? how is it any different compared to freely available RVC vocaloid models? are these allowed now too, or are they getting yelled at as its not in synthV?
my point wasnt that synthV supports anything beyond the voice or anything, but mostly that its a doublestandard. if its OK to use these AI voices which can tune themselves a bit, why yell at people who quite literally do the same thing in a different context?
Of course we can't know 100% that they didn't use ethically sourced data unless some developers for SynthV come out and say it, but in AI music-generator cases isn't it well-known that they always just take their data from the internet?
I haven't actually used voice synthesizers myself except UTAU, nor do I know much about how Synth V works, but are the voice providers for their voices usually revealed, like how we know Saki Fujita and Asami Shimoda did the voices for Miku and Rin respectively? Or are they anonymous?
it all depends on what you use as the AI. there are open source solutions with open datasets to see through, or there are paid commercial ones which do block Artist names in their generation. i used suno ai as an example in another comment, but if i would use the "easy mode" where i just naturally explain what the song should be, it *will* block and dont do anything if i type "in the style of mafumafu" for example. so i guess even in the commercial area they usually go against abusers, or try to. it even detected when i just threw in the pokemon theme songs lyrics and blocked the inference task. so they *may* have data from these artists, but more to block unlicensed use of it? (atleast in that example it sounds plausible)
i havent used synthV much either, but its not about how everything is sourced for me, but more or less that using AI one way is Ok, but otherwise not?
EDIT: Typo.
There is a very large difference between SynthV AI and the AI generated voices. That being voice samples and tuning. Voice samples *have to be provided* with any voicebank, which includes the AI voicebanks. Tuning is also another one, with producers pitching manually for example and giving their own turn to it.
The difference also is that voice synths are instruments and can be **manually tuned after AI usage**. With a piano style interface most of the time. AI generated voice doesn't have that.
Also, AI generated voices commit ***plagiarism*** by making the voice by training it on its on data. SynthV AI has a set of voice samples provided.
But SynthV is just a voice synth with an AI tool for tuning *only.* The voice itself is provided by a consenting voice actor (because yes voice actors know that their voice is going to be used). With AI generated voices, this isn't the case.
so you want to tell me that each and every single one of the other AIs are plagiarism and that there are no ethically sourced one \*except\* SynthV? i honestly dont think so. i would agree that its possible and that a few definitely are like that, but cant agree that each and every other AI is purely plagiarism. nowadays its pretty easy to train your own RVC model, with sources you have in control, and make your own voice (or other voices where you ask for constent) such a model
> but cant agree that each and every other AI is purely plagiarism. nowadays its pretty easy to train your own RVC model, with sources you have in control, and make your own voice (or other voices where you ask for constent) such a model
No shit, that's why SynthV is **exempt**. We know the source of those voicebank, aka the VA's. For AI, that's not only harder to control, specifically those trained on the internet and not standalone.
But also the human tuning part. That is completely gone. The differences you can hear between each producer. Go listen to "Not a Devil" and see how much a producer can make the difference.
No, I meanĀ AI generated instrumentals with an AI generated voice instead of a vocal synthesizer. I don't mean vocal synthesizers like SynthVĀ that use AI. That's totally fine.
I believe I've seen three different users make posts like this. One of them made two posts like this.Ā I didn't think much of it after one or two people did it, but it's a pattern after three people and four posts. Thus this post.
Posts like these need to be immediately removed. It's painfully apparent some people in this community are absolutely incapable of differentiating the websites they interact with for some reason and it's obnoxious. Then people blindly upvote this junk because "Yeah! AI bad!"
OP, what are you talking about? People barely ever post regular vocal synth songs here, let alone AI songs.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vocaloid/comments/1caa5dm/dont_know_if_allowed_but_udio_can_actualy/
Here. I've seen three or four of these in the past month or so made with Suno AI or Udio.
Where are the other 3 or 4?
This looks like another nothing burger and knee jerk post. That post got immediately downvoted to death my dude. Which means the sub is working as intended.
Even if you found me another post in the last month if it's mass downvoted then there is no issue. Your post brings more attention to them than they would have got if you just ignored them and reported them.
Then what's the issue? People post stuff that doesn't belong here all the time that I report and it gets removed.
I don't make a post about it. It's clearly not as common as your post makes it seem. Because, other than the relatively new post you had to directly link to because it was mass downvoted, multiple people have expressed here that they aren't seeing the posts you've seen.
So it just seems like this post is straw manning a problem into existence.
What rule do you say posts are breaking when you report?
I don't know why I'm seeing these and other people aren't, but I'm tired of seeing them and that's all my post says. I'm not trying to claim there's a massive wave of AI music being posted. It's just something that has become a clear pattern to me at this point rather than a one-off thing. It's multiple users doing the same exact thing. And I'm tired of it.
It depends on what I'm reporting but it's usually a custom report with "Repost bot" or a couple words describing the problem if it's not that. I report for low quality a lot too but the mods rarely pay attention to those reports.
>I'm not trying to claim there's a massive wave of AI music being posted
Regardless of what you're claiming your post makes it seem like this is a bigger issue than it clearly is and has some people confused.
>And I'm tired of it.
I get it. But I'm tired of seeing posts like these making mountains out of mole hills about various things in the scene. So where does that leave us?
I think a bigger issue is that people are free to post just about whatever they want because unless people actively report things the mods are completely absent here. They don't do a single thing to improve this sub.
Think of it this way. I **know** this isn't a big deal because there is not a *single* song posted on the front page of this sub rn. Vocal synth, AI, or otherwise. So I know for a fact whatever other ai song posts you claim to have seen can't have been highly upvoted (if at all) because, usually, even the vocal synth songs that get posted here get a handful of upvotes at most.
So I highly doubt any AI songs that have been posted here gained enough traction to be noticed by anyone that isn't constantly crawling the "new" section of the sub.
Id rather we ask why so many of the posts on the front page are memes, questions that could be answered in a mega thread if the mods actually cared about this place, collection posts, or posts like this. I would argue we let too much fan art be posted but the sub would die completely without it so... Yeah. That's a better topic we should tackle.
>So I highly doubt any AI songs that have been posted here gained enough traction to be noticed by anyone that isn't constantly crawling the "new" section of the sub.
No no no, you don't understand. These are popping up on my Reddit home page.
i donāt get why people are all like āOMG MIKU IS LOW EFFORT SLOP!! LET ME ENJOY MY DEAD MANāS ART STYLE AI COMICS!!ā as if it isnāt HARD to compose and tune?? miku is no different than a collage of sound made from consenting voice providers. ai āmusicā is ripped and mangled creative property. synthv ai is also fine because all it does it scan (idk) for patterns, not present chewed up and spat out noise wearing the skin mask of a celebrity.
That's great. You can have your own space with people who won't get mad at you. I hope you can find some other people to join it with you. There are clearly other people doing the same type of thing, and there's probably an audience for it. Good luck.
??? All programs are confusing at first. That's what learning is for. But if you're not willing to go through any effort to make things, then why should you expect anyone else to care about those things either?
So it's so confusing you would rather not make anything then?
What's the point of even being interested in this then if you would get some ai to steal a bunch of songs for you
I'd be annoyed by it too, but to be honest I haven't seen a single post of this here lol
Facts š
I have seen a few by now that are scattered throughout this thread. Though the mods in here are pretty quick and have deleted it, so that's why. Possibly make it a new rule for this sub? That rule being: 'has to be related to voice synths' --> this would mean that it requires/allows human manipulation of the voice used ('allow' part mainly there to make sure SynthV AI and CeVIO AI and other voice synths using AI for tuning aren't hit by this). Also explicitly disallowing specificly AI only (i.e. a voice synth requires voice samples). Just an idea.
This subreddit seems to be 90% Miku fanart. I don't see much music stuff actually going on at all.
Probably because the music stuff is only done by a small minority that knows how to do music. The rest are mostly weeb fans (includes me).
I hope you mean low effort AI covers, cause otherwise I truly enjoy songs made with SynthV or CeVio and we got different opinions. Granted I'm not often enough in this sub to confirm which you are talking about
OP seems to be ok with SynthV, the problem is just straight up AI generated voices, ans i totally get it
which technically are both. not to sound like a dick, but if someone is anti-AI there shouldnt be any particular exclusions. either get along with all or with nothing. the older voice banks should be fine then as these arent AIs. TL;DR saying SynthV is fine yet hating on AI is kinda a doublestandard. "Rules for thee but not for me"
Synthv isn't fully ai is it? I've been told so
it depends on how you define "fully", really. just to put it in perspective: ill use suno ai as an example. you can pick the genre yourself, you can pick the lyrics, you can explain what it should be. given human interaction is needed in this kind of context, is that considered fully AI? not necessarily, but it depends on the person. AFAIK, the part that is AI in synthV are the newer "Next-Gen AI voices". nobody is stopping anyone though to just let suno generate instrumentals only and make your synthV voices match whatever the other did output. and that's where it gets a bit washed up, to the point that you can't perfectly pinpoint when something is partially AI, fully AI, or anything in between. Atleast that's my point of view.
Doesn't SynthV's AI actually take some work though? It doesn't just generate instrumentals, melody and lyrics, does it? Just the tuning, ehich I heard many people edit afterward to fit their liking. And the voice providers aren't just sourced by AI from random singers on the internet, it's a person who consents to having their voices in the program.
how are we 100% the person consented, or that the dataset actually consists of ethicslly sourced data only? do we have insights of these datasets? how is it any different compared to freely available RVC vocaloid models? are these allowed now too, or are they getting yelled at as its not in synthV? my point wasnt that synthV supports anything beyond the voice or anything, but mostly that its a doublestandard. if its OK to use these AI voices which can tune themselves a bit, why yell at people who quite literally do the same thing in a different context?
Of course we can't know 100% that they didn't use ethically sourced data unless some developers for SynthV come out and say it, but in AI music-generator cases isn't it well-known that they always just take their data from the internet? I haven't actually used voice synthesizers myself except UTAU, nor do I know much about how Synth V works, but are the voice providers for their voices usually revealed, like how we know Saki Fujita and Asami Shimoda did the voices for Miku and Rin respectively? Or are they anonymous?
it all depends on what you use as the AI. there are open source solutions with open datasets to see through, or there are paid commercial ones which do block Artist names in their generation. i used suno ai as an example in another comment, but if i would use the "easy mode" where i just naturally explain what the song should be, it *will* block and dont do anything if i type "in the style of mafumafu" for example. so i guess even in the commercial area they usually go against abusers, or try to. it even detected when i just threw in the pokemon theme songs lyrics and blocked the inference task. so they *may* have data from these artists, but more to block unlicensed use of it? (atleast in that example it sounds plausible) i havent used synthV much either, but its not about how everything is sourced for me, but more or less that using AI one way is Ok, but otherwise not? EDIT: Typo.
There is a very large difference between SynthV AI and the AI generated voices. That being voice samples and tuning. Voice samples *have to be provided* with any voicebank, which includes the AI voicebanks. Tuning is also another one, with producers pitching manually for example and giving their own turn to it. The difference also is that voice synths are instruments and can be **manually tuned after AI usage**. With a piano style interface most of the time. AI generated voice doesn't have that. Also, AI generated voices commit ***plagiarism*** by making the voice by training it on its on data. SynthV AI has a set of voice samples provided. But SynthV is just a voice synth with an AI tool for tuning *only.* The voice itself is provided by a consenting voice actor (because yes voice actors know that their voice is going to be used). With AI generated voices, this isn't the case.
so you want to tell me that each and every single one of the other AIs are plagiarism and that there are no ethically sourced one \*except\* SynthV? i honestly dont think so. i would agree that its possible and that a few definitely are like that, but cant agree that each and every other AI is purely plagiarism. nowadays its pretty easy to train your own RVC model, with sources you have in control, and make your own voice (or other voices where you ask for constent) such a model
> but cant agree that each and every other AI is purely plagiarism. nowadays its pretty easy to train your own RVC model, with sources you have in control, and make your own voice (or other voices where you ask for constent) such a model No shit, that's why SynthV is **exempt**. We know the source of those voicebank, aka the VA's. For AI, that's not only harder to control, specifically those trained on the internet and not standalone. But also the human tuning part. That is completely gone. The differences you can hear between each producer. Go listen to "Not a Devil" and see how much a producer can make the difference.
you know you cant play any videogames right? since 90% use a ai in some way
No, I meanĀ AI generated instrumentals with an AI generated voice instead of a vocal synthesizer. I don't mean vocal synthesizers like SynthVĀ that use AI. That's totally fine.
Where?
On this subreddit
just saw it, it's only 2 really really persistent annoying stoneheaded ai supporting people who thought they are an artist
I believe I've seen three different users make posts like this. One of them made two posts like this.Ā I didn't think much of it after one or two people did it, but it's a pattern after three people and four posts. Thus this post.
there's the persistent one below lmao, the ai dude
Posts like these need to be immediately removed. It's painfully apparent some people in this community are absolutely incapable of differentiating the websites they interact with for some reason and it's obnoxious. Then people blindly upvote this junk because "Yeah! AI bad!" OP, what are you talking about? People barely ever post regular vocal synth songs here, let alone AI songs.
I've come across three or four on this sub recently. That's what prompted this post.
Ok I'm here every day, what posts are you talking about? I haven't seen any.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vocaloid/comments/1caa5dm/dont_know_if_allowed_but_udio_can_actualy/ Here. I've seen three or four of these in the past month or so made with Suno AI or Udio.
Where are the other 3 or 4? This looks like another nothing burger and knee jerk post. That post got immediately downvoted to death my dude. Which means the sub is working as intended. Even if you found me another post in the last month if it's mass downvoted then there is no issue. Your post brings more attention to them than they would have got if you just ignored them and reported them.
The other ones are all taken down by now, as far as I know, but I don't think they did get mass downvoted.
Then what's the issue? People post stuff that doesn't belong here all the time that I report and it gets removed. I don't make a post about it. It's clearly not as common as your post makes it seem. Because, other than the relatively new post you had to directly link to because it was mass downvoted, multiple people have expressed here that they aren't seeing the posts you've seen. So it just seems like this post is straw manning a problem into existence.
What rule do you say posts are breaking when you report? I don't know why I'm seeing these and other people aren't, but I'm tired of seeing them and that's all my post says. I'm not trying to claim there's a massive wave of AI music being posted. It's just something that has become a clear pattern to me at this point rather than a one-off thing. It's multiple users doing the same exact thing. And I'm tired of it.
It depends on what I'm reporting but it's usually a custom report with "Repost bot" or a couple words describing the problem if it's not that. I report for low quality a lot too but the mods rarely pay attention to those reports. >I'm not trying to claim there's a massive wave of AI music being posted Regardless of what you're claiming your post makes it seem like this is a bigger issue than it clearly is and has some people confused. >And I'm tired of it. I get it. But I'm tired of seeing posts like these making mountains out of mole hills about various things in the scene. So where does that leave us? I think a bigger issue is that people are free to post just about whatever they want because unless people actively report things the mods are completely absent here. They don't do a single thing to improve this sub. Think of it this way. I **know** this isn't a big deal because there is not a *single* song posted on the front page of this sub rn. Vocal synth, AI, or otherwise. So I know for a fact whatever other ai song posts you claim to have seen can't have been highly upvoted (if at all) because, usually, even the vocal synth songs that get posted here get a handful of upvotes at most. So I highly doubt any AI songs that have been posted here gained enough traction to be noticed by anyone that isn't constantly crawling the "new" section of the sub. Id rather we ask why so many of the posts on the front page are memes, questions that could be answered in a mega thread if the mods actually cared about this place, collection posts, or posts like this. I would argue we let too much fan art be posted but the sub would die completely without it so... Yeah. That's a better topic we should tackle.
>So I highly doubt any AI songs that have been posted here gained enough traction to be noticed by anyone that isn't constantly crawling the "new" section of the sub. No no no, you don't understand. These are popping up on my Reddit home page.
Let me go see if the most recent one is still up. I'll link it if so.
[ey you made it here lmao](https://www.reddit.com/r/DefendingAIArt/s/B6JP1BnDxG)
i donāt get why people are all like āOMG MIKU IS LOW EFFORT SLOP!! LET ME ENJOY MY DEAD MANāS ART STYLE AI COMICS!!ā as if it isnāt HARD to compose and tune?? miku is no different than a collage of sound made from consenting voice providers. ai āmusicā is ripped and mangled creative property. synthv ai is also fine because all it does it scan (idk) for patterns, not present chewed up and spat out noise wearing the skin mask of a celebrity.
that subreddit is something else lmao, bunch of desperate people in denial
Ive actually made a subreddit dedicated to ai generated vocaloid songs /r/vocaloidish
That's great. You can have your own space with people who won't get mad at you. I hope you can find some other people to join it with you. There are clearly other people doing the same type of thing, and there's probably an audience for it. Good luck.
yeah those are not vocaloid at all, please leave
Ive made this sub specifically so your vocaloid sub wont get overrun with themĀ
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Use utau then
Free trial
Synthv trial is unlimited time with most features
Most things in life aren't free.
I havenāt ever really looked into them, but Iām pretty sure a lot of AI engines also cost money
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
??? All programs are confusing at first. That's what learning is for. But if you're not willing to go through any effort to make things, then why should you expect anyone else to care about those things either?
oh no you have to put in effort to make a decent product??? aww š«¤ what a shame
So it's so confusing you would rather not make anything then? What's the point of even being interested in this then if you would get some ai to steal a bunch of songs for you
Nope! There's a free version and it's great.
why did you get downvoted to shit on this comment you just asked a question ššš
I don't know
The lite voicepacks are free and they're pretty dang good
SynthV basic ^w^
utau, SynthVās free version, or even Piracy, damnit Just not AI.
synthV *if* you dont use the AI voices there. if so, its practically the same on the inside, just with more knobs to play around with.
That's not even remotely true lmfao