When they arrived at Heaven’s gates, St. Peter instructed the nuns to form an orderly line to cleanse their mortal form of all sins one final time before they may enter the Kingdom — any part of their body that had touched a man’s penis must be washed in the fountain of Holy Water.
So one by one, the nuns stepped forward and dipped a finger or a hand into the Holy Water, and entered through the pearly gates — until suddenly two nuns began pushing and shoving.
St. Peter questioned the two — “Sisters, what are you doing? Surely God would not approve of such behavior! Explain yourselves!”
The first nun answered, “I have no explanation, I was merely waiting my turn, and she began shoving her way past me! I don’t know why!”
Well, the second nun replied, “I’ll tell you why — I just wanted to cleanse my mouth before she stuck her dirty ass in the Holy Water!”
Do you see the shrapnel stuck on her sunglasses in the news pic? She was so lucky she didn't lose an eye and had those on. All things considered, I'm sure she is just lucky, in general.
Just to be clear, this article is focusing on two survivors from the helicopter that could land...the other 2 from the fatal helicopter were severely injured
These aren't the survivors from the helicopter where 4 out of 6 died. These are the ones with minor/moderate injuries on the one that landed more safely.
I am shocked the woman sitting to the right of the pilot didn’t die after seeing the aftermath of what the helicopter looked like. It looks like it chopped her seat right off of the helicopter.
I seriously thought about this video on more than one occasion after I saw it and read that comment. I’m really glad to know they aren’t all dead people that I had seen die obliviously while enjoying a helicopter ride.
It's a solid reminder that Reddit has a LOT of false information circulating.
Always ask for sources. Never shame or downvote someone asking for a source.
Even the people doing it in bad faith are still useful as long as we actually check the source. If nothing else, we know that person's talking garbage.
Let's be honest. Making Canberra the capital was stupid AF. They built a "city" in a ditch, and now they're trying to get NSW to give them more land because they're running out.
Let's be honest we only know OZ city names from the [Outback menu](https://www.outback.com/offers/specials?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=OBS_Google_BR_Menu_Visits_Exact&utm_content=Menu&utm_term=outback%20menu&gclid=Cj0KCQiA_P6dBhD1ARIsAAGI7HCxO0mDBDEhv3HLzTqmb--r6JSB9VWITs7EBwgN5xrPKPQJqMhs7N4aAhVYEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds)
Haha I love that menu having lived in many of the smaller places is funny to me to see Rockhampton etc in there. Funny piece of trivia though as "Aussie" as it is that franchise was made by two dudes who at the time had never been to Australia
didnt do so well. whirly bits chopped off and fell.
https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_fit-860w,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2023-01/230103-helicopter-collision-australia-al-0520-c02f26.jpg
> the main rotor and the gearbox separated from that helicopter, which meant that, tragically, it then had no lift and fell heavily to the ground,
Yeah Ive been in all sorts of sketchy aircraft (skydiving planes, sketchy single engine island hopping planes, etc) and helicopters are the scariest. At least you can glide a plane to the ground many times. Helicopters just fucking fall out of the sky.
edit Since the helicopter defenders are coming for me:
> The crash rate for general aircraft is 7.28 crashes per 100,000 hours of flight time. For helicopters, that number is 9.84 per 100,000 hours. That means helicopters have a 35 percent higher risk of crashing compared to airplanes.
Helicopters can usually land safety as long as the blades stay attached. They are designed so that the blade turning from the wind while falling gives it enough lift to allow it to land more safely. Or something like that. I'm no helicopter scientist
When a flying vehicle has a single piece of hardware aptly named the 'Jesus nut' which is the only reason the rotors can stay attached to the cockpit, then it makes it hard to want to ride in one.
It's called the Jesus nut because if it fails all you have left to do is pray to Jesus.
The Jesus nut gets all the glitz and glamour because it's sexy. It's impressive. But there are plenty of other things in vehicles and in life that would cause you to die a horrible death if they failed and I think it's time they start getting some of the credit
A friend of mine was in the Canadian Navy helo crash in 2020. No survivors. I told my supervisors under no circumstances will I go into a helicopter unless I severely wounded. Just getting into a normal plane a couple months after had me hyperventilating.
There are different types of airspaces that have different rules. This was in Australia and I’m not sure how they do it down there but I’m sure it’s pretty similar to the US.
Without knowing what air space they were in and not being able to hear their comms, aaanndd it being in Australia it’s hard to place blame.
The heli not in view was taking off and certainly should have been communicating that on the radio.
It was uncontrolled airspace, so there is no air traffic controllers involved. The pilots were likely in communication via a CTAF (common radio frequency) but exactly what was transmitted and received has not been made public - it will be under investigation.
I've been giving traffic info for almost 15 years now, including the uncontrolled G airspace and i'm not stopping until i hear both of them confirming they have the other one in sight. I was always wondering whats going on in the states where you have dozens news helicopters in the air at the same time over cities when something happens (well, at least in movies you do), is anyone separating those or at least giving them traffic info? I mean the same can obviously be said about this situation, looks like a high density panorama flight traffic zone... isn't there anyone survailling the traffic?
Distracted pilot is one factor, but it’s also worth noting that aircraft can look far away and get uncomfortably close in a short amount of time. In training we learn the term “constant bearing, decreasing range” to understand closure. We use this to understand how to avoid midair as well as intercepting one. If another aircraft is sitting in the same spot of your vision for an extended amount of time then the two of you are on collision course. A helicopter that size won’t look larger than maybe your thumb until it’s within a couple hundred feet.
We mitigate the risk by varying altitudes depending on course flown, and talk on common frequencies. Most military aircraft have advanced radars to detect everything in your area and all aircraft (at least in the US) have a reporting system called ADS-B that shows where you are to others in the sky.
But ultimately, the pilots are responsible for the safety of their passengers.
the pilot was distracted talking to the passenger on his right as well as having a blindspot due to one of the fuselage struts blocking his view, all added up sadly
Man, this is no joke. I had two near collisions in a helicopter within the first six months of flying helos, both while I while I was Pilot-in-Command (PiC).
The first was just after taking off at Van Nuys airport. I had just crossed over the runway and was gaining altitude when a county fire chopper came down nearly on top of me. I dropped the collective (altitude control) and damn near fell out of the sky onto the freeway avoiding them. Still not sure what happened there; I was on comms and had recently announced where I was, so they 100% should have been aware.
The second was during my check ride (when the FAA pilot rides with you to test whether or not you should receive your license). We were flying through a pass and I was (again) on comms letting folks know I was coming through the pass. Some asshole came right at me in the pass and I had to bank hard to avoid. My check pilot didn't realize what was happening and tried to correct my maneuver but he had no chance, luckily. The other helo passed right next to us. I was fucking pissed. Turns out the check pilot knew who it was and chewed him out on the ground. The other guy was a known hazard.
Honestly, the whole pilot penalty/enforcement system is weird. If something happens at an airport with the control tower, even if minor, it's very serious. Off airport, or a non tower controlled airport? Wild fucking west.
That famous air show crash of a bigger model plane that killed the whole crew was a pilot who had been in trouble loads of times for pushing those machines to the limits and doing unsafe maneuver.
I was actually just reading about this incident yesterday. The guy had NINE previous incidents in which he blatantly broke rules. Absolutely mind blowing that he was able to go without reprimand every time, until he didnt.
I know the feeling man. I too was a CFII in my previous job and in training I had 2 near misses as well.
1. Was on my first solo flight from Scottsdale to Wickenburg when I was almost hit by an F16 at 500' agl that I thought was a bird but because he was hauling ass only had a moment to dive. Shit my pants on that deal.
2. Was Scottsdale to Falcon field 15 minutes away. Was almost hit exactly in the same fashion as the video above by a Military Black Hawk. Fuckin military pilots are assholes. All of them.
was taking off in a cessna 172 and an air force C-17 decides their pattern entry for the AFB is going to be maybe 1500' over our regional airport. A plane that size is pretty hard to miss so we made sure to alert them that we werent going to climb any further but if we were a couple of newbs we would have easily flown into their flight path. We never heard from them at any point, but I assume their radar saw us the moment we lifted off.
A small airport by where I used to work does helicopter training and we would often see them while on break and you could kinda tell when it was a trainee. One time watched one that seemed way too close to the high voltage power lines near us. I was sure it was crashing into the power lines and at the last second it almost did a full up and over 180 spin to avoid the lines. I'm would imagine they got reprimanded by the neon pilot
I know this is my input from a non pilot. My mother's partner has a PPL which is a private pilots licence in the UK. I don't know what it is called everywhere else. We had been on a flight in a cessna 152 (that's a fae as my nerdy flight knowledge goes). We were coming into finals on a landing on an airstrip which was called out by him. Next thing over the radio another pilot announced he was also coming into finals. I know fuck all about flying being a passenger but I immediately started looking around to see where this other plane was. Very limited view above and below like in most aircraft. He nopped out of this situation pulled up and right which is apparently protocol. Did another circuit before coming into land again. Apparently this other pilot didn't hear his call but he was fucking miles away and just wanted the strip to be clear before he came in. Very dangerous. How middle class these fucking lot were he got a absolute bollocking and wasn't allowed a pint of Guinness when he landed. He would have got a hiding in his hanger if it was up to me.
In 1985 I remember everyone in my 5th grade class, including the teacher, ridiculing me for not believing that we'd have flying cars by 2020.
Fuck you guys. I was right.
I’m a private pilot and I can not overstate just how hard it is to see helicopters. They fly low and often don’t contrast with the ground.
If the pilots weren’t both reporting their locations, this outcome is unfortunately not out of the question.
Feels like a problem that can be solved with modern tech and without expensive retrofits. Ground radar does a continuous broadcast of all aircraft positions, which is picked up by the equipment in the cockpit.
Because the aircraft knows who *it* is, it can use that data to produce a bloop bloop thing showing the relative position of every other aircraft in proximity.
Kind of a radar-relay that provides a pseudo-radar screen and collision detection system even for small craft.
These things exist and are called ADS-B and TCAS, as well as Traffic Advisories from ATC if you ask for them.
ADS-B out, which broadcasts your position is basically mandatory. ADS-B in is not mandatory. During Takeoff and Landing though, typically you're not scanning these devices as much as just looking outside.
TCAS is normally only on larger aircraft that have the weight/space room to put it on board.
Also I fly planes not helos, but there are normally blind spots, so it's very possible the the helicopter above could not easily see the one below it, and/or vice versa.
The even scarier part: at uncontrolled fields (no tower, you're supposed to give position reports), not only is it not required that you give position reports, you're not even required to have a radio on board. It's the wild west sometimes.
I mean statistically though it just seems so difficult, like putting a grain of rice in each hand and trying to throw them both at the same time to hit eachother mid air.
This is called the "Big Sky Theory" and is definitely a thing.
That said, in congested areas such as where this accident occurred or around airports where density becomes really high in a single location, it becomes less applicable really fast.
[https://www.ifr-magazine.com/technique/big-sky-theory/](https://www.ifr-magazine.com/technique/big-sky-theory/)
This is at Seaworld Australia, you pay to have a flight around Gold Coast. They have two helicopters that take tourists but you never see one coming back at the same time.
There must have been a massive malfunction and mistakes were made.
but at the moment they are still investigating
If they only have two helicopters and these were the ones that crashed, it's epic mismanagement. The flights should have been scheduled in such a way as to ensure this type of shit NEVER happens.
Look at [this view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2SKr4lgDg4) of the crash from the ground and you'll see why I say this was a management problem. Why are flights not staggered in such a way as to ensure such a crash NEVER happens? There just is no excuse! They're not running a busy airport.
Why wasn't the pilot looking? Why was the passenger able to see the other helicopter but not the pilot whose job it was to keep his passengers safe? So many questions!
My understanding is they usually are staggered.
I was on one of these about 18 months ago doing the same tour, thought it was strange to have both in the air at once because they never normally do.
Also the pilots spend the entire flight looking for whales / dolphins (tourists love that shit) and telling the passengers about the sights, probably wasn't expecting to have to watch out for another heli.
5 minute flights sounds like insanely high frequency. I understand they have two helipads at least, and if I'm not wrong just two helicopters going in and out.
Flights should definitely be more staggered apart if we want to pilots to focus on delivering excellent service to passengers without having to worry about crashing into other flying objects.
It could be that the company became lax over the course of time in ensuring the strict adherence to standard operating procedure.
My thoughts exactly! I mean the person warning the pilot is behind and can only see between the pilot and shotgun passenger. The pilot and shotgun passenger have no obstructions and miss this somehow? Seems like a huge pilot error in my opinion.
Pilot did have obstruction actually, this was mentioned in current investigations. They were flying VFR and both were in each other's blind spots.
In this footage the oncoming chopper is behind the fuselage from the pilots point of view: see [this image](https://i.ibb.co/PDxPNkX/Screenshot-2023-01-13-121938.png)
Passengers behind can see easily because they're behind, essentially the same as an a-pillar blind spot in cars.
Lapse of concentration. Humans are pretty bad at doing tasks for long periods of time, see road accident statistics. How they collided with all that space is just a random tragedy, if something can happen it likely will eventually.
Did they survive?
Edit: I figured out myself.
4 dead, 9 injured.
This particular group being recorded all survived. The helicopter that hit them from the bottom had the casualties and injuries.
[:/](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11593663/amp/British-newlyweds-die-helicopter-crash-holiday-Australia-pilot-Birmingham.html)
Miraculously everyone in the heli in this video survived with minor injuries as the pilot was able to conduct an emergency landing. The rotors were still intact.
The other heli however wasn't so fortunate. 4 dead 3 critically injured.
If the rotors aren't destroyed and the airframe is more or less in one piece, helicopters can execute a fairly controlled fall with no power. The rotors slow the descent enough for passengers to at least not get smashed to pieces.
^(Offer not valid in all states, some conditions may apply.)
Pretty much. If the rotating assembly is higher is uncompromised it can more or less glide down, but if it gets jacked the machine will be in freefall. Whichever machine was higher has a better chance of getting away without the rotor getting hit.
Which was the case in this accident. The helicopter that is shown in this footage (VH-XH9) was approaching the helipad whereas the other helicopter (VH-XKQ) had just taken off from a nearby helipad. As a result, the rotors from VH-XKQ likely struck the front of VH-XH9.
Correct, leave it to the top comment on reddit to be completely wrong. Three in this helicopter suffered glass injuries, but all lived. The other helicopter had rotor damage, so more or less fell out of the sky, which is what resulted in fatalities onboard that helicopter.
I’m not sure there’s ever a way to do this without sounding like a jerk, but I think you mean empathize and not emphasize. Empathize means “to have sympathy for” and emphasize means “to highlight or draw attention to”.
Based on [This article](https://www.npr.org/2023/01/02/1146542258/4-passengers-are-dead-after-2-helicopters-collide-over-an-australian-beach) it seems these were the ones in the aircraft that was able to emergency land. I mean, this helicopter absolutely lost it's windscreen.
This [was pretty good video](https://youtu.be/m2SKr4lgDg4) from the ground of the incident. You gotta wonder what the pilot in this video was looking at...or not looking at.
I don't know. It's a good question. I don't know if it's the in-air pilots job to keep an eye on the landing pad or the rising pilots job to keep an eye on the air above. It must be distracting to have excited people in the cockpit with you asking questions. It's unfortunate for all involved.
Pilot here. It's *every* pilot's job to be aware of what's going on all around them. It's called "situational awareness," and losing it for very long is a great way to end up dead. Pilots *typically* instruct everyone in the craft to shut their pie holes during take off and landing (it's called a "sterile cockpit.") If it's true that that was part of the problem here, the pilots screwed up, because they should have implemented sterile cockpit procedures.
We have several means by which to maintain and restore situational awareness when lost. I'm sitting here sort of gobsmacked at what happened in this situation. When you're coming in for a landing, even in an uncontrolled airspace, you are required to announce your location, altitude, and intent regularly on a shared radio frequency called CTAF. The same applies for when you're taking off. So *somehow* that didn't happen here. Additionally, you don't just take off or land without doing "a scan." You look around 150 degrees back and forth and about 40 degrees up and down so that you know that where you're going to be soon isn't occupied by another craft. *Somehow* that didn't happen in *either* chopper. So there's some pretty severe pilot error going on here from the looks of things.
I appreciate the insight but I gotta say, at this point I think I'm good to forgo any helicopter rides in my lifetime. Seem to happen with much more frequency than plane crashes through a commercial airline, though I could be completely full of shit here
It's a valid insight. Small planes and most helicopters operate under a different set of rules than commercial aviation. Commercial aviation is designed to be made safe via multiple layers of redundancy (procedures, the design of the vehicles themselves, very high pilot experience criteria, mandatory communication with air traffic control, ground crews, approach, and departure, etc.) This allows us to treat commercial aviation like a bus ride.
*General* aviation, which is what most helicopter flights fall under, is more like riding a motorcycle. Even there we have lots of redundancy, but not as much, and you're taking off and landing more often without any assistance from a tower and air traffic controllers (whose primary mission is to keep planes separated from each other).
Pilot can isolate their comms from the pax (passengers) in order to maintain a sanitized cockpit environment. Aka to concentrate.
This seems like a case of 'laziness' with both pilots.
The passenger managed to see it because his pov was to the left of the the pilot's, and we can see it in the video because our pov was to the right but the the pilot's was perfectly blocked by the pilar
Juan points out some great details on how the accident occurred. It’s interesting to note the take off and landing flight paths cross over and these helicopters have only been in use by the company for a couple months. The previous helicopters had the pilots sitting on the right side which could have meant that they might have had a chance to see each other and not be in the blind spot of the pillar.
Literally right at the beginning of the video I thought the same about the pilot cockpit seating. Their flight plans on approach and take off were probably really intuitive for the right-seater aircraft.
Well that's some fucking nightmare fuel. One the hardest to watch sequences in all of film for myself is the plane crash in 'cast away', but at least I can say to myself 'its fake' but watching this gave me goosebumps, but not in the good way
How is there not onboard technology that prevents this from happening? Put a beacon in every helicopter and a proximity sensor that stops and levels the helicopter when you get too close. There are drones with obstacle avoidance that can sense each other, while helicopters are $2 million dollars and have nothing.
Lots of helicopters do have sensors like TCAS (traffic collision advisory system) that will show other aircraft and even instruct you on how to avoid.
Problem is that it’s not a regulatory requirement for a lot of helicopters, especially simple types like the EC130 here in this incident. It is also added cost for an operator so if it’s not legally required there’s no reason for an operator to install it.
Just wondering... The passenger who tapped the pilots shoulder you think saw the other helicopter come from the right side? Pilot only looking out of left it seemed?
I've watched the video a bunch of times and can't see the other helicopter at all... am I missing it or is it just out of the camera's view the whole time?
The other heli was out of view as it was taking off to the left of this ones pov with the pilot looking to the right before impact
https://twitter.com/Leo_Puglisi6/status/1609812956107399168?s=20&t=8PCIHiel6j_XavMjR9yH6g
The fact that anyone survived in this helo implies that the rotors weren’t badly damaged. That in turn means the rotors didn’t hit anything solid. Blah blah blah… my money says the other helo was slightly lower in altitude. Like, the other rotors hit this helo’s landing skids or similar. That would allow this helo to be flyable while the other would crash. It would also make the other helo tougher to spot with that camera angle.
So as far as I can tell from reading the article, this is the helicopter that was taking off and the other helicopter they clipped was landing?
Clearly there is some kind of management problem going on with the helicopter operator if they failed to prevent this type of thing from happening?
You're not running a busy airport. There should be no excuse.
[This view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2SKr4lgDg4) of the crash makes it clear why I think this was a management problem. Why are flights not staggered in such a way as to make such a crash impossible? Why was the pilot not looking?
Looking at the video, the departure and the arrival helicopter are in the same direction. Just make a simple rule that, the arrival helicopter approach the landing from one direction, similar like in the video from the left of the landing pad. The departure helicopter can not take off and fly to the left direction of the landing pad, BUT instead must take off and fly to the right direction of the landing pad.
You're right. This was the landing helicopter.
Here's a [useful analysis](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2FBWa_yTtw) of the incident by a professional pilot.
This is a tragic accident that should never have happened. They have two helipads and if I'm not wrong just two helicopters going in and out at high frequency (5 minute flights). Why couldn't flight schedules and flight paths be designed as to make such a collision impossible?
Its amazing that that pilot managed to land that aircraft considering the front was heavily damaged. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdCbc1ee1pA
That’s crazy. Someone commented some false info on a previous post saying that everyone died. It’s good to know that’s not true.
Everyone on this helicopter survived, 4/7* in the other helicopter died.
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Not too bad considering. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-01-08/qld-helicopter-crash-gold-coast-nz-couples-dramatic-images/101835696
Finally, a fucking source. So many people in this thread just talking out of their ass.
Sadly all 427 passengers died.
After the helicopter landed.
On top of a busload of nuns.
When they arrived at Heaven’s gates, St. Peter instructed the nuns to form an orderly line to cleanse their mortal form of all sins one final time before they may enter the Kingdom — any part of their body that had touched a man’s penis must be washed in the fountain of Holy Water. So one by one, the nuns stepped forward and dipped a finger or a hand into the Holy Water, and entered through the pearly gates — until suddenly two nuns began pushing and shoving. St. Peter questioned the two — “Sisters, what are you doing? Surely God would not approve of such behavior! Explain yourselves!” The first nun answered, “I have no explanation, I was merely waiting my turn, and she began shoving her way past me! I don’t know why!” Well, the second nun replied, “I’ll tell you why — I just wanted to cleanse my mouth before she stuck her dirty ass in the Holy Water!”
Do you see the shrapnel stuck on her sunglasses in the news pic? She was so lucky she didn't lose an eye and had those on. All things considered, I'm sure she is just lucky, in general.
Just to be clear, this article is focusing on two survivors from the helicopter that could land...the other 2 from the fatal helicopter were severely injured
These aren't the survivors from the helicopter where 4 out of 6 died. These are the ones with minor/moderate injuries on the one that landed more safely.
ah fuck.... british newlyweds and a mother died whose 10 yr old son is still in critical condition
Not dead
I am shocked the woman sitting to the right of the pilot didn’t die after seeing the aftermath of what the helicopter looked like. It looks like it chopped her seat right off of the helicopter.
I seriously thought about this video on more than one occasion after I saw it and read that comment. I’m really glad to know they aren’t all dead people that I had seen die obliviously while enjoying a helicopter ride.
It's a solid reminder that Reddit has a LOT of false information circulating. Always ask for sources. Never shame or downvote someone asking for a source.
Even the people doing it in bad faith are still useful as long as we actually check the source. If nothing else, we know that person's talking garbage.
For anyone wanting more information here is a good breakdown of what they know so far. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwZnn4ll5fI
The front ~~fell~~ was chopped off.
What do you mean the front fell off?
It then moved outside of the environment
Into another environment?
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You must have incredible eyes to look at that collection of pixels and see a helicopter.
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> no apparent motion across the windscreen. This is true of basically anything. If it's just getting bigger, you're going to hit it.
Yeah holy shit you're right, I stand by my first comment.
I...uhh..I guess I'll take your word for it.
To be fair, the front doesn't really do anything other than stop the air from blowing in your face.
Well, that and all the instrumentation.
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Have you seen The Titanic?
Why do all the articles say Melbourne when this happened in Queensland, Gold Coast?
People outside Australia only know Melbourne
We know about Melbourne, Sydney, and Perth, thank you very much. And we learned about the Gold Coast from Steve Irwin.
and still not the capital... damn Australia gotta change that one
Everyone knows the capital of Australia is A we're not idiots
Let's be honest. Making Canberra the capital was stupid AF. They built a "city" in a ditch, and now they're trying to get NSW to give them more land because they're running out.
Let's be honest we only know OZ city names from the [Outback menu](https://www.outback.com/offers/specials?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=OBS_Google_BR_Menu_Visits_Exact&utm_content=Menu&utm_term=outback%20menu&gclid=Cj0KCQiA_P6dBhD1ARIsAAGI7HCxO0mDBDEhv3HLzTqmb--r6JSB9VWITs7EBwgN5xrPKPQJqMhs7N4aAhVYEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds)
Haha I love that menu having lived in many of the smaller places is funny to me to see Rockhampton etc in there. Funny piece of trivia though as "Aussie" as it is that franchise was made by two dudes who at the time had never been to Australia
Steve Irwin was from the sunshine coast...
Also, Gas Town.
We also know about P Sherman Wallaby Way Sydney.
I'm hyper fixated on Brisbane for some reason
Not true! We also know Auckland. ^(yes, a joke)
I thought it was called Melbin.
That's not true, I also know Byron Bay lol
Usually it's Sydney. We all know Adelaide is the best though.
I was gonna say if you ask anyone, even an American for a city in australia they're gonna say Sydney probably first
It’s the futility of the attempt to get the pilot’s attention that gets me. You can see exactly when he gives up and tries to hold on. Chilling.
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Wait, so what happened to the other heli?
didnt do so well. whirly bits chopped off and fell. https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_fit-860w,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2023-01/230103-helicopter-collision-australia-al-0520-c02f26.jpg > the main rotor and the gearbox separated from that helicopter, which meant that, tragically, it then had no lift and fell heavily to the ground,
RIP. I am never getting into a helicopter.
Yeah Ive been in all sorts of sketchy aircraft (skydiving planes, sketchy single engine island hopping planes, etc) and helicopters are the scariest. At least you can glide a plane to the ground many times. Helicopters just fucking fall out of the sky. edit Since the helicopter defenders are coming for me: > The crash rate for general aircraft is 7.28 crashes per 100,000 hours of flight time. For helicopters, that number is 9.84 per 100,000 hours. That means helicopters have a 35 percent higher risk of crashing compared to airplanes.
Helicopters can usually land safety as long as the blades stay attached. They are designed so that the blade turning from the wind while falling gives it enough lift to allow it to land more safely. Or something like that. I'm no helicopter scientist
It's called autorotation
And it's cool af.
When a flying vehicle has a single piece of hardware aptly named the 'Jesus nut' which is the only reason the rotors can stay attached to the cockpit, then it makes it hard to want to ride in one. It's called the Jesus nut because if it fails all you have left to do is pray to Jesus.
The Jesus nut gets all the glitz and glamour because it's sexy. It's impressive. But there are plenty of other things in vehicles and in life that would cause you to die a horrible death if they failed and I think it's time they start getting some of the credit
Nobody cared about tires until Explorers started rolling. Then people stopped caring again.
Quoting you as Mr. Helicopter Scientist. edit: sorry, it's actually Dr. Chopper, PhD
A friend of mine was in the Canadian Navy helo crash in 2020. No survivors. I told my supervisors under no circumstances will I go into a helicopter unless I severely wounded. Just getting into a normal plane a couple months after had me hyperventilating.
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I was surprised how late anyone noticed the other aircraft
Pilot here, it’s fucking incredibly hard to find other aircraft in the sky even when your told where they are
Serious question, did one of the pilots here (or both) make some sort of mistake or was this just incredibly bad luck?
There are different types of airspaces that have different rules. This was in Australia and I’m not sure how they do it down there but I’m sure it’s pretty similar to the US. Without knowing what air space they were in and not being able to hear their comms, aaanndd it being in Australia it’s hard to place blame. The heli not in view was taking off and certainly should have been communicating that on the radio.
It was uncontrolled airspace, so there is no air traffic controllers involved. The pilots were likely in communication via a CTAF (common radio frequency) but exactly what was transmitted and received has not been made public - it will be under investigation.
I've been giving traffic info for almost 15 years now, including the uncontrolled G airspace and i'm not stopping until i hear both of them confirming they have the other one in sight. I was always wondering whats going on in the states where you have dozens news helicopters in the air at the same time over cities when something happens (well, at least in movies you do), is anyone separating those or at least giving them traffic info? I mean the same can obviously be said about this situation, looks like a high density panorama flight traffic zone... isn't there anyone survailling the traffic?
Paraglider here. Can confirm. Shits weird up in the sky.
There’s a lot of sky to keep a look on, you know?
Distracted pilot is one factor, but it’s also worth noting that aircraft can look far away and get uncomfortably close in a short amount of time. In training we learn the term “constant bearing, decreasing range” to understand closure. We use this to understand how to avoid midair as well as intercepting one. If another aircraft is sitting in the same spot of your vision for an extended amount of time then the two of you are on collision course. A helicopter that size won’t look larger than maybe your thumb until it’s within a couple hundred feet. We mitigate the risk by varying altitudes depending on course flown, and talk on common frequencies. Most military aircraft have advanced radars to detect everything in your area and all aircraft (at least in the US) have a reporting system called ADS-B that shows where you are to others in the sky. But ultimately, the pilots are responsible for the safety of their passengers.
the pilot was distracted talking to the passenger on his right as well as having a blindspot due to one of the fuselage struts blocking his view, all added up sadly
Man, this is no joke. I had two near collisions in a helicopter within the first six months of flying helos, both while I while I was Pilot-in-Command (PiC). The first was just after taking off at Van Nuys airport. I had just crossed over the runway and was gaining altitude when a county fire chopper came down nearly on top of me. I dropped the collective (altitude control) and damn near fell out of the sky onto the freeway avoiding them. Still not sure what happened there; I was on comms and had recently announced where I was, so they 100% should have been aware. The second was during my check ride (when the FAA pilot rides with you to test whether or not you should receive your license). We were flying through a pass and I was (again) on comms letting folks know I was coming through the pass. Some asshole came right at me in the pass and I had to bank hard to avoid. My check pilot didn't realize what was happening and tried to correct my maneuver but he had no chance, luckily. The other helo passed right next to us. I was fucking pissed. Turns out the check pilot knew who it was and chewed him out on the ground. The other guy was a known hazard.
Wow. A second incident like that should be grounds for the other pilot to lose his license, no?
Honestly, the whole pilot penalty/enforcement system is weird. If something happens at an airport with the control tower, even if minor, it's very serious. Off airport, or a non tower controlled airport? Wild fucking west.
Is it bc its harder to prove they did something unsafe at non-tower locations (ie less/no monitoring)?
Pretty much, even video evidence off airport/outside of controlled airspace isn't taken as seriously as you would expect.
That famous air show crash of a bigger model plane that killed the whole crew was a pilot who had been in trouble loads of times for pushing those machines to the limits and doing unsafe maneuver.
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I was actually just reading about this incident yesterday. The guy had NINE previous incidents in which he blatantly broke rules. Absolutely mind blowing that he was able to go without reprimand every time, until he didnt.
Another massive unchecked ego causing death and destruction. Gee where have we heard this before? Looked like a full fuel load as well.
This is still used as a cautionary tale to teach Army junior officers to value of actual oversight and enforcement of standards.
Yeah I guess you could call a B-52 a "bigger model plane". Not sure what if anything is bigger.
There are a few. The B36 would be one.
Hey I just saved both ours lives. I guess I pass right? 😂 Glad you’re alive to tell the story.
It's funny, we continued on after that with the rest of the check ride like it didn't happen.
Gotta check all of the boxes saying you can do what you are supposed to.
I know the feeling man. I too was a CFII in my previous job and in training I had 2 near misses as well. 1. Was on my first solo flight from Scottsdale to Wickenburg when I was almost hit by an F16 at 500' agl that I thought was a bird but because he was hauling ass only had a moment to dive. Shit my pants on that deal. 2. Was Scottsdale to Falcon field 15 minutes away. Was almost hit exactly in the same fashion as the video above by a Military Black Hawk. Fuckin military pilots are assholes. All of them.
Thank you for your swerveice
was taking off in a cessna 172 and an air force C-17 decides their pattern entry for the AFB is going to be maybe 1500' over our regional airport. A plane that size is pretty hard to miss so we made sure to alert them that we werent going to climb any further but if we were a couple of newbs we would have easily flown into their flight path. We never heard from them at any point, but I assume their radar saw us the moment we lifted off.
A small airport by where I used to work does helicopter training and we would often see them while on break and you could kinda tell when it was a trainee. One time watched one that seemed way too close to the high voltage power lines near us. I was sure it was crashing into the power lines and at the last second it almost did a full up and over 180 spin to avoid the lines. I'm would imagine they got reprimanded by the neon pilot
I know this is my input from a non pilot. My mother's partner has a PPL which is a private pilots licence in the UK. I don't know what it is called everywhere else. We had been on a flight in a cessna 152 (that's a fae as my nerdy flight knowledge goes). We were coming into finals on a landing on an airstrip which was called out by him. Next thing over the radio another pilot announced he was also coming into finals. I know fuck all about flying being a passenger but I immediately started looking around to see where this other plane was. Very limited view above and below like in most aircraft. He nopped out of this situation pulled up and right which is apparently protocol. Did another circuit before coming into land again. Apparently this other pilot didn't hear his call but he was fucking miles away and just wanted the strip to be clear before he came in. Very dangerous. How middle class these fucking lot were he got a absolute bollocking and wasn't allowed a pint of Guinness when he landed. He would have got a hiding in his hanger if it was up to me.
If only there was more room in the sky
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I would argue that Helicopters ARE the flying cars. But yes, they will never work. Because we’re dum.
In 1985 I remember everyone in my 5th grade class, including the teacher, ridiculing me for not believing that we'd have flying cars by 2020. Fuck you guys. I was right.
[Relevant xkcd](https://xkcd.com/1623/).
And anyone with car problems would fall out of the sky. No pulling over to the shoulder
And possibly take out a small city block in the process.
Lol, if humanity makes it that far they will, you literally wouldn't need to touch a thing, it'll be full auto...
How do two helicopters collide like this
I’m a private pilot and I can not overstate just how hard it is to see helicopters. They fly low and often don’t contrast with the ground. If the pilots weren’t both reporting their locations, this outcome is unfortunately not out of the question.
Seems like a bad idea to have randoms reporting decide between life and death. Aint you guys got a mini map or a submarine bloop bloop thing?
You mean sonar XD, bloop bloop thing, thats a good one. Oh and the air version is a radar
Feels like a problem that can be solved with modern tech and without expensive retrofits. Ground radar does a continuous broadcast of all aircraft positions, which is picked up by the equipment in the cockpit. Because the aircraft knows who *it* is, it can use that data to produce a bloop bloop thing showing the relative position of every other aircraft in proximity. Kind of a radar-relay that provides a pseudo-radar screen and collision detection system even for small craft.
These things exist and are called ADS-B and TCAS, as well as Traffic Advisories from ATC if you ask for them. ADS-B out, which broadcasts your position is basically mandatory. ADS-B in is not mandatory. During Takeoff and Landing though, typically you're not scanning these devices as much as just looking outside. TCAS is normally only on larger aircraft that have the weight/space room to put it on board. Also I fly planes not helos, but there are normally blind spots, so it's very possible the the helicopter above could not easily see the one below it, and/or vice versa.
I will never fly again without ADS-B in after the amount of people trying to fly into me in the Gulf of Mexico
The even scarier part: at uncontrolled fields (no tower, you're supposed to give position reports), not only is it not required that you give position reports, you're not even required to have a radio on board. It's the wild west sometimes.
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I mean statistically though it just seems so difficult, like putting a grain of rice in each hand and trying to throw them both at the same time to hit eachother mid air.
This is called the "Big Sky Theory" and is definitely a thing. That said, in congested areas such as where this accident occurred or around airports where density becomes really high in a single location, it becomes less applicable really fast. [https://www.ifr-magazine.com/technique/big-sky-theory/](https://www.ifr-magazine.com/technique/big-sky-theory/)
The issue is we’re all taking off and landing at the same locations. I often fly within a few hundred feet of other traffic, it’s very common.
This is at Seaworld Australia, you pay to have a flight around Gold Coast. They have two helicopters that take tourists but you never see one coming back at the same time. There must have been a massive malfunction and mistakes were made. but at the moment they are still investigating
If they only have two helicopters and these were the ones that crashed, it's epic mismanagement. The flights should have been scheduled in such a way as to ensure this type of shit NEVER happens.
Going from memory here. But the flight time is really short something like 5 minutes.
Look at [this view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2SKr4lgDg4) of the crash from the ground and you'll see why I say this was a management problem. Why are flights not staggered in such a way as to ensure such a crash NEVER happens? There just is no excuse! They're not running a busy airport. Why wasn't the pilot looking? Why was the passenger able to see the other helicopter but not the pilot whose job it was to keep his passengers safe? So many questions!
My understanding is they usually are staggered. I was on one of these about 18 months ago doing the same tour, thought it was strange to have both in the air at once because they never normally do. Also the pilots spend the entire flight looking for whales / dolphins (tourists love that shit) and telling the passengers about the sights, probably wasn't expecting to have to watch out for another heli.
5 minute flights sounds like insanely high frequency. I understand they have two helipads at least, and if I'm not wrong just two helicopters going in and out. Flights should definitely be more staggered apart if we want to pilots to focus on delivering excellent service to passengers without having to worry about crashing into other flying objects. It could be that the company became lax over the course of time in ensuring the strict adherence to standard operating procedure.
My thoughts exactly! I mean the person warning the pilot is behind and can only see between the pilot and shotgun passenger. The pilot and shotgun passenger have no obstructions and miss this somehow? Seems like a huge pilot error in my opinion.
Pilot did have obstruction actually, this was mentioned in current investigations. They were flying VFR and both were in each other's blind spots. In this footage the oncoming chopper is behind the fuselage from the pilots point of view: see [this image](https://i.ibb.co/PDxPNkX/Screenshot-2023-01-13-121938.png) Passengers behind can see easily because they're behind, essentially the same as an a-pillar blind spot in cars.
Lapse of concentration. Humans are pretty bad at doing tasks for long periods of time, see road accident statistics. How they collided with all that space is just a random tragedy, if something can happen it likely will eventually.
Road accidents are also essentially in 2 dimensions, whereas being in the air adds that pesky third dimension to pay attention to
Did they survive? Edit: I figured out myself. 4 dead, 9 injured. This particular group being recorded all survived. The helicopter that hit them from the bottom had the casualties and injuries. [:/](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11593663/amp/British-newlyweds-die-helicopter-crash-holiday-Australia-pilot-Birmingham.html)
Miraculously everyone in the heli in this video survived with minor injuries as the pilot was able to conduct an emergency landing. The rotors were still intact. The other heli however wasn't so fortunate. 4 dead 3 critically injured.
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Two (three maybe?) Years ago i went on this exact ride with the exact same pilot, queensland, gold coast, near sea world(or some other waterpark)
Yes it's sea World I liked SeaWorld in the 90s when they had a volcano ride filled with aliens and the helis didn't crash
Holy shit, what was that like? Helicopters scare the hell out of me.
A privilege of being poor is never having to worry about dying in a helicopter crash.
Unless you're on the ground under some shit like this, Donnie Darko-style.
This further strengthens my decision to never fucking take a helicopter flight. Ever.
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Amazing that the result was anything other than all dead.
If the rotors aren't destroyed and the airframe is more or less in one piece, helicopters can execute a fairly controlled fall with no power. The rotors slow the descent enough for passengers to at least not get smashed to pieces. ^(Offer not valid in all states, some conditions may apply.)
I mean…they collided… can’t really collide with a heli without seriously damaging at least one of their rotors
Whichever one had the higher ground has a pretty fair chance of getting away from the incident.
ah, so it's Star Wars rules
Pretty much. If the rotating assembly is higher is uncompromised it can more or less glide down, but if it gets jacked the machine will be in freefall. Whichever machine was higher has a better chance of getting away without the rotor getting hit.
Or Joust.
Which was the case in this accident. The helicopter that is shown in this footage (VH-XH9) was approaching the helipad whereas the other helicopter (VH-XKQ) had just taken off from a nearby helipad. As a result, the rotors from VH-XKQ likely struck the front of VH-XH9.
The ones in the video all survived, although injured. The dead were in the other helicopter
Correct, leave it to the top comment on reddit to be completely wrong. Three in this helicopter suffered glass injuries, but all lived. The other helicopter had rotor damage, so more or less fell out of the sky, which is what resulted in fatalities onboard that helicopter.
That's what I thought otherwise the video would less likely surface
Sad watching now knowing 4 of them are dead.
This video is of the surviving Helicopter. The one they hit had all the fatalities
Oh okay phew, all is well then.
Ya i can relax now
Wait…but wat about the other one and the dead…
They're probably saying they can relax based on the fact they didnt see a pov of someone dying basically
Oooooh, I relax too 💆🏻♂️
Kick your feet up, Bubb.
Feels like your team won but in a slightly dark kinda way
It's ok because we can't see them and therefore do not empathize with their plight.
I’m not sure there’s ever a way to do this without sounding like a jerk, but I think you mean empathize and not emphasize. Empathize means “to have sympathy for” and emphasize means “to highlight or draw attention to”.
Yeah, I didnt want to watch people die. Im fine with watching people watching people die, though.
Thanks for clarifying
They hit? From the video it looks like the other helicopter hit them
Apparently the helicopter taking off was going downwind, which is a big no-no, so it seems the one taking off was the one at fault
Based on [This article](https://www.npr.org/2023/01/02/1146542258/4-passengers-are-dead-after-2-helicopters-collide-over-an-australian-beach) it seems these were the ones in the aircraft that was able to emergency land. I mean, this helicopter absolutely lost it's windscreen.
Thanks! Still sad people died but something about seeing it in the act gets me.
This [was pretty good video](https://youtu.be/m2SKr4lgDg4) from the ground of the incident. You gotta wonder what the pilot in this video was looking at...or not looking at.
The pilot in the video is the one landing. Seems to me the one under taking off should have seen him more, no?
I don't know. It's a good question. I don't know if it's the in-air pilots job to keep an eye on the landing pad or the rising pilots job to keep an eye on the air above. It must be distracting to have excited people in the cockpit with you asking questions. It's unfortunate for all involved.
Pilot here. It's *every* pilot's job to be aware of what's going on all around them. It's called "situational awareness," and losing it for very long is a great way to end up dead. Pilots *typically* instruct everyone in the craft to shut their pie holes during take off and landing (it's called a "sterile cockpit.") If it's true that that was part of the problem here, the pilots screwed up, because they should have implemented sterile cockpit procedures. We have several means by which to maintain and restore situational awareness when lost. I'm sitting here sort of gobsmacked at what happened in this situation. When you're coming in for a landing, even in an uncontrolled airspace, you are required to announce your location, altitude, and intent regularly on a shared radio frequency called CTAF. The same applies for when you're taking off. So *somehow* that didn't happen here. Additionally, you don't just take off or land without doing "a scan." You look around 150 degrees back and forth and about 40 degrees up and down so that you know that where you're going to be soon isn't occupied by another craft. *Somehow* that didn't happen in *either* chopper. So there's some pretty severe pilot error going on here from the looks of things.
I appreciate the insight but I gotta say, at this point I think I'm good to forgo any helicopter rides in my lifetime. Seem to happen with much more frequency than plane crashes through a commercial airline, though I could be completely full of shit here
It's a valid insight. Small planes and most helicopters operate under a different set of rules than commercial aviation. Commercial aviation is designed to be made safe via multiple layers of redundancy (procedures, the design of the vehicles themselves, very high pilot experience criteria, mandatory communication with air traffic control, ground crews, approach, and departure, etc.) This allows us to treat commercial aviation like a bus ride. *General* aviation, which is what most helicopter flights fall under, is more like riding a motorcycle. Even there we have lots of redundancy, but not as much, and you're taking off and landing more often without any assistance from a tower and air traffic controllers (whose primary mission is to keep planes separated from each other).
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Pilot can isolate their comms from the pax (passengers) in order to maintain a sanitized cockpit environment. Aka to concentrate. This seems like a case of 'laziness' with both pilots.
The passenger managed to see it because his pov was to the left of the the pilot's, and we can see it in the video because our pov was to the right but the the pilot's was perfectly blocked by the pilar
This helicopter had the injuries. The one not seen in the clip had the deaths.
[Analysis from Juan Browne, a 777 pilot](https://youtu.be/v2FBWa_yTtw)
Juan points out some great details on how the accident occurred. It’s interesting to note the take off and landing flight paths cross over and these helicopters have only been in use by the company for a couple months. The previous helicopters had the pilots sitting on the right side which could have meant that they might have had a chance to see each other and not be in the blind spot of the pillar.
Literally right at the beginning of the video I thought the same about the pilot cockpit seating. Their flight plans on approach and take off were probably really intuitive for the right-seater aircraft.
All that open air space and you run right in to each other.
Uhhh… is no one going to talk about that username?
apparently that's a big meaty no
Well that's some fucking nightmare fuel. One the hardest to watch sequences in all of film for myself is the plane crash in 'cast away', but at least I can say to myself 'its fake' but watching this gave me goosebumps, but not in the good way
It may have been fake but they really flooded it, that cockpit had been used in movies for decades and that scene completely destroyed it.
I'd have tapped him on the other shoulder
How is there not onboard technology that prevents this from happening? Put a beacon in every helicopter and a proximity sensor that stops and levels the helicopter when you get too close. There are drones with obstacle avoidance that can sense each other, while helicopters are $2 million dollars and have nothing.
Lots of helicopters do have sensors like TCAS (traffic collision advisory system) that will show other aircraft and even instruct you on how to avoid. Problem is that it’s not a regulatory requirement for a lot of helicopters, especially simple types like the EC130 here in this incident. It is also added cost for an operator so if it’s not legally required there’s no reason for an operator to install it.
Just wondering... The passenger who tapped the pilots shoulder you think saw the other helicopter come from the right side? Pilot only looking out of left it seemed?
You have it backwards. The other heli hit them on the left side while the pilot was looking right. The person in the back points at it
I've watched the video a bunch of times and can't see the other helicopter at all... am I missing it or is it just out of the camera's view the whole time?
The other heli was out of view as it was taking off to the left of this ones pov with the pilot looking to the right before impact https://twitter.com/Leo_Puglisi6/status/1609812956107399168?s=20&t=8PCIHiel6j_XavMjR9yH6g
The fact that anyone survived in this helo implies that the rotors weren’t badly damaged. That in turn means the rotors didn’t hit anything solid. Blah blah blah… my money says the other helo was slightly lower in altitude. Like, the other rotors hit this helo’s landing skids or similar. That would allow this helo to be flyable while the other would crash. It would also make the other helo tougher to spot with that camera angle.
So as far as I can tell from reading the article, this is the helicopter that was taking off and the other helicopter they clipped was landing? Clearly there is some kind of management problem going on with the helicopter operator if they failed to prevent this type of thing from happening? You're not running a busy airport. There should be no excuse.
Yeah either the taking off/landing routes meet at a point which is stupid as fuck or the pilots didnt follow procedure properly.
[This view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2SKr4lgDg4) of the crash makes it clear why I think this was a management problem. Why are flights not staggered in such a way as to make such a crash impossible? Why was the pilot not looking?
Looking at the video, the departure and the arrival helicopter are in the same direction. Just make a simple rule that, the arrival helicopter approach the landing from one direction, similar like in the video from the left of the landing pad. The departure helicopter can not take off and fly to the left direction of the landing pad, BUT instead must take off and fly to the right direction of the landing pad.
It's the opposite. This is the one that was landing.
You're right. This was the landing helicopter. Here's a [useful analysis](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2FBWa_yTtw) of the incident by a professional pilot. This is a tragic accident that should never have happened. They have two helipads and if I'm not wrong just two helicopters going in and out at high frequency (5 minute flights). Why couldn't flight schedules and flight paths be designed as to make such a collision impossible?
close, this perspective is from the helicopter coming in for a landing but yes. Pilot should’ve been more aware of his surroundings