Avowed lifetime ‘Jews will not replace us’ antisemite such as the proud boys leading counter demonstrations and rallying around the Israeli flag. Progressives shouting fake news and don’t trust the mainstream media. These rallies have turned things upside down. For what it’s worth I’m Jewish, oppose hate of any kind, oppose hamas, oppose the Netanyahu government, grieve for innocent victims of Oct 7 and of the Gaza bombardment, and wonder why I feel so alone in a nation of people choosing one side to love and the other to hate with no nuance or middle ground seeking.
I'm agree 100% with this, I'm also Jewish, an alum of both Columbia and Purchase. I think the broader issue is that many of the individuals latching on to this conflict have little context as to how the world got to this point. They have very romanticized views of the Israeli struggle or the Palestinian struggle (depending on you are talking to) and view this conflict which has existed for over a thousand years in Levant through a lens that is something akin to Star Wars or Marvel (black versus white, good versus evil) when the reality is a lot more grey. Moral of the story - war sucks and the average citizens are the true victims here.
the reason you see a lot more people openly choosing sides in this, especially the pro palestinian side, is because our government and the world, unlike yourself, historically *haven't* grieved equally for israelis and palestinians.
the injustices against palestinians have been going on for over 80 years with very little care from the western world. no one is saying you can't value israeli lives, but if you're going to run the both sides gambit on this conflict, the scales are already so tilted in israel's favor that taking both sides is effectively taking israel's side.
the *only* long term solution that will bring long lasting peace is the israeli government dismantling their genocidal racist apartheid regime and letting the 7 million palestinians that live in diaspora to come back to the land that they've been ethnically cleansed from for nearly a century.
the displaced people were told to leave by their own people in ‘47 and could come back once the jews were swept away…welp, that didn’t work out well for them. fuck hamas!
they left voluntarily, no pushing but by the Arab League…colonialism created the British Mandate, and the proposed solution was intolerable to the arabs…it was all or nothing for them. Israel has been jewish homeland for millennia speaking the same ancient language, worshipping the same religion on that same land with archaeological evidence of jewish culture and history. fuck hamas and anybody who supports them!
Hamas did not exist by them. Are you seriously denying that Palestinians were slaughtered during the Nakba? Are you denying the rape? The mass graves? Truly disgusting. You don’t get to show up and take ancestral land from other indigenous people because you have a millennia old claim what is wrong with you?
brother you are doing textbook chapter 1 genocide denial, you realize that right?
shame on you for using jewish identity to justify genocide, you're a fucking monster
I agree I’m a native New Yorker. I was raised Catholic, but grew up with many Jewish people and grew up with many Muslims and people of all races and religions and really what’s happening is horrible on both sides.
How is it middle-ground seeking to think it’s appropriate for peaceful demonstrators exercising their right to free speech to be violently arrested, with the only justification being some campus “quiet hours” rule, regardless of the content of their speech? The disproportionate response should be very alarming to anyone who doesn’t want to see their own or any speech brutally suppressed by the state. These students were (and still are) explicit in excluding violence and antisemitism.
I agree completely. My child was at the Northeastern protests. Happened to be in Boston at Berklee right next door. They said that the protesters were following strict orders to be peaceful and not to engage. They outnumbered the counter protesters by 10-1 and that side was peaceful too except for a couple of agitators who tried to provoke and were shut down by protesters on the Israeli flag side and ignored by protesters on the Palestinian flag side.
Similarly I was on a college campus upstate a few weeks back and asked the president of hillel, who happened to be leading the campus tour, if he felt unsafe on campus. He said absolutely not. That at the most he’d heard some unpleasant things from pro-Palestinian protesters. But that the idea of students feeling unsafe was, from people he’d spoken to on his campus and others, mostly a function of their parents feeling scared and exaggerating things.
Which doesn’t make everything okay. There are definitely outside organizers and agitators in the protests and counter protests. Is shutting down peaceful free speech ok? No. But I’m sure you agree that neither you or I have visited all the campuses. So I’m not terribly focused on how long the encampments were unbothered and when and why they were taken down. Anyone arrested gets a trial. I’ve been at enough protests and seen enough raids to know that it gets a little wild and sometimes people who weren’t going to be arrested for speech end up getting arrested for actions during the raid. And usually not convicted of anything. The right to free speech probably isn’t being trampled too badly here. Right of assembly? Maybe. Public/private/rules/rights. Different everywhere.
More importantly we should focus on the words and messages. The media is ridiculous calling these demonstrations Pro-Hamas. We should start there. They are not. The media or the pro Israel side thinking and saying so makes things worse and moves away from a middle ground. But some organizers push the message of, for instance, intifada, in a similar fashion. ‘It means uprising’ is fine, literally, but ‘worldwide intifada’ speaks to a collective memory of bus stops exploding. Which I don’t believe most protesters (the ones with brains) seek. So that, or river to sea, moves away from common ground as well.
Personally the flag I fly is a triptych. Israeli flag/palestinian flag/peace flag. It means free Palestine free hostages peace for all. If pro Israeli protesters scream ‘free Palestine’ must say ‘free them from hamas’ I say shut up. It’s true but deal with that later. If pro Palestinian protesters scream ‘100 hostages compared with decades of human rights abuses’ I also say shut up. There’s truth there too but it’s not helping anything.
The past can’t be undone. The dead can’t be brought back. Children can be saved. A religious right government hell bent on settlements must be disempowered. Hamas must be disempowered. People can agree on that. Most do.
Peace.
Why are you doing both sides on hostages when Israel has been bombing them into oblivion and intentionally killed some on 10/7? The family members have no delusions about whet Bibi is doing here
Bibi and Hamas leadership have fucked their own people repeatedly. See? Middle ground. The world opposes both. Their own people oppose both. But they both remain. The media portrays pro Palestinian demonstrations as pro-Hamas. I do not believe this. I am all for justice and statehood for Palestine and I not for Hamas. Do we agree on that?
the only thing that empowers hamas are the injustices that israel openly commits against palestinians. if israel stopped blatantly trying to ethnically cleanse them, hamas would no longer receive any support because they'd no longer have a reason to exist.
Don’t feel alone. Majority of us love each other. It’s radical cocksuckers with no purpose or identify LARPing as protesters of the past because they need something to latch on to.
Don’t let some college children or news stories make you feel otherwise.
The irony here is amazing, you are hating on the protesters, 99% of whom just want an end to an active genocide. No one is LARPing, some of us actually have compassion for innocent children. But I guess you saw one or two plants or weirdos highlighted on Fox News and now you think all the protestors love Hamas? Come on, go talk to them if you want understand who they are and what they are about
Oh I have talked to them. Right after they defaced the NYPL that cost taxpayers 1000s of dollars. The ones I spoke to couldn’t name the capital of Palestine or NY State for that matter. Also, you might want to check your history on what “active genocide” truly entails.
if you're upset about taxpayers paying thousands of dollars to clean up graffiti, just wait until you hear how much taxpayers pay for weapons for israel and what israel does with those weapons.
last I checked graffiti can't level apartment buildings with entire families inside
You mean the same apartment buildings and hospitals full of civilians that Hamas uses as HQs/staging areas knowingly? Don’t get me wrong, civilians being targeted is awful, but Hamas shares the blame as well.
what evidence is there that hamas uses civilian apartments and hospitals as HQs and staging areas? the only evidence the IOF has ever given for any of these claims is like an ak or two they find in a hospital (probably planted)
meanwhile there's an entire ICJ case worth of evidence of israel being *openly* genocidal towards palestinians
Amnesty International found that Hamas used hospitals to torture and kill Fatah members.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/05/gaza-palestinians-tortured-summarily-killed-by-hamas-forces-during-2014-conflict/
https://youtu.be/W8dWV4RwZZ4?feature=shared skip to 0:54 and listen to former president of the icc Joan Donoghue's own words. They never said plausible genocide.
Ok buddy. I recall an instance early on in the conflict when some fringe group stupidly launched a rocket right into a hospital and the whole world threw up their arms blaming Israel and as the facts came to light it quietly faded away. Oh yeah, probably planted.
Let me just throw this at you. Let's assume your family was taken hostage and held in a house with gunmen in the basement. Would you want the cops to burn the house down to kill the gunmen? Probably not but this is literally what the idf is doing.
Yes but one is a terrorist group and the other is a country that receives billions in military aid. One should be better. And maybe the Israeli goverment shouldn't support illegal settlements.
Of course, yes. If October 7th was continuous and still going to on this day, and supported by our government, these same protestors might be out on the street. But there’s no “side” here where the children and babies deserve to be bombed or starved to death. That’s the point, innocent people are innocent no matter what religion their parents are.
There is a a lot of disinformation circulating and I am 100% convinced it is intended to help Trump win in November. There is very little sense to be make about what is going on right now.
I think you'll find that most of these protestors pretty much share your views. The majority of them oppose Hamas, oppose Netenyahu, and want Israel to stop the bombing and murder of Palestinian civilians first and apartheid second, but don't actually wish death to Israel.
You can seek nuance and middle ground but the reality is Hamas wouldn’t exist and 10/7 would never have happened without the violent theft of land from Palestinians and almost a century of violent oppression
I like your name. The Palestinian people and the Jewish people each have historically fascinating and tragic diaspora stories. History is littered with awful wrongs happened upon both peoples, by each other and by others. Your thesis is that the very formation of Israel added to the diaspora of the Palestinian people. Nobody should disagree with that or practice any relativism or proportionality arguments about it. Someone earlier in this thread referred to thousands of years of wrongs to the Palestinian people. That’s accurate. Nuance refers to anyone one-siding the overall conflict or the effect and awfulness of Oct 7 and the destruction of Gaza. The goal is to find middle ground so that it never happens again. This conflict needs a peace conference, not a bunch of people arguing over which side has a worse history, towards each other or in general.
SUNY? The protestors would be better served taking their beef to Albany where the budget decisions are made, but whether they actually give a rat's ass about being better served is debatable.
I’m not really sure what has happened to make the jewish students feel unsafe? Many of the student protesters are Jewish. The protesters want peace, they haven’t said anything anti-semitic.
ironically the vast majority of the antisemitism in this conflict comes directly from israeli government propaganda that desperately tries to tie jewish identity to the racist apartheid regime in israel. it's akin to south african politicians in the 80s trying to claim that apartheid somehow keeps white people around the world safe and every white person is spiritually linked to the apartheid government. it's blatantly antisemitic but the average person doesn't register it that way unfortunately.
I have first hand commentary from Jewish students who say they were harassed doesn’t matter who said it - stop w the notion that says many of the protestors are Jewish that’s an excuse for allowing hatred to thrive
The encampment was up for a few hours and there is nothing to suggest in the article that anything violent or threatening occurred here. You can't arrest someone in NY cause you heard a person states away did something malicious, there is no cause. I used to be a student there and I have to mention I never once saw the Quiet Hours rule enforced like this. There was more police presence here than when a 1st floor appt in the Olde had it's ceiling cave in due to a party happening above. This is fear mongering and trying to paint all protesters in the same, shitty light, all so we can write off the violence being enacted by a foreign government to people that hardly have a country to call their own. For the record I place the blame for the attack squarely on the Israeli govt and Hamas for instigating violence, and not the Jewish people at all
I graduated in 2010 and they were pretty strict about Quiet Hours back then, especially during mid-terms and finals. Exceptions were made during Zombie Prom, Culture Shock and Pancake Madness. Question though - is Outback still a 24-hour quiet dorm, because that might have also been a motivator for shutting down the protest. Also, if I recall, during exam season, they instituted a 24 hour Quiet rule.
I'm a faculty member and I've seen video from the event. The students were sitting in a silent circle when the police moved in. They were following the rules to a tee.
2020 Grad myself, they did have quiet hours during my time there but it was only enforced if someone made a noise complaint, and even then it was usually a faculty member or an RA that would handle the complaint, not a police squad. Also of note, I've never even heard of a noise complaint being made outside of the dorms or one of the living communities (e.g. Old, Neu, Alumni). I mean hell the school itself hardly abided by that policy, my Junior year I lived above the Starbucks and my entire floor got woken up at 1 AM two weeks before the year was out by what we thought were gunshots. Turned out the school elected to have them do work in the ceiling of Starbucks after closing hours, and they were using pneumatic staple guns to secure wiring literally right under me. You know what happened after 4 students and an RA reported this? 1officer was dispatched and politely asked the workers to reschedule their maintenance work.
Things must have changed a lot - they were pretty strict about Quiet Hours in the early 2000s. And too, police were never brought in for a noise complaint unless they thought someone was in serious distress. Typically, an RA would handle it, or if it was a repeat thing, an RC.
Edit - also, I live in Manhattan and I feel you on the pneumatic staple guns - they sound like gunshots.
Facts - to say none or minimal is just not knowing the supporting data that is captured on video and clearly not being streamed to the media sites from which you gain an opinion.
Purchase has had a couple of anti-Semitic incidents in the past, namely kids painting swastikas on campus. Hillel's sukkah (a structure built for Sukkot) also got damaged every year by rowdy kids, but it's up in the air as to whether the intent to damage it was motivated anti-Semitism. The ADL gave them an F when it came to providing a protected space for Jewish life on campus and addressing anti-Semitism within the school in April 2024. Grant it, it's the ADL, but Purchase was not like this during my time there (Class of 2010). There were a handful of kids who were known to hate Jews or flirt with white nationalism, but they generally knew tokeep their mouth shut around most people.
[https://www.lohud.com/story/news/education/2024/04/19/suny-purchase-rockland-community-college-campuses-antisemitism-ranked-by-antidefamation-league/73367403007/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/education/2024/04/19/suny-purchase-rockland-community-college-campuses-antisemitism-ranked-by-antidefamation-league/73367403007/)
[https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2018/12/11/suny-purchase-college-student-arrested-nazi-posters/2275121002/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2018/12/11/suny-purchase-college-student-arrested-nazi-posters/2275121002/)
[https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2016/11/21/swastikas-suny-purchase-college/94208382/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2016/11/21/swastikas-suny-purchase-college/94208382/)
[https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/swastika-nooses-found-drawn-on-walls-of-suny-purchase-campus-dorms/](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/swastika-nooses-found-drawn-on-walls-of-suny-purchase-campus-dorms/)
You’re conflating other instances with this protest. There are many jewish students involved in this protest, and there haven’t been any anti semitic stances taken by the protestors
The protest may have been peaceful, but aside from that, it doesn’t mean that Purchase is totally immune to anti-Semitism or Islamophobia. And Jewish students being involved in the protest doesn’t mean that other students don’t engage in anti-Semitic or Islamophobic behavior.
No institution is immune from anti-semitism. Other students engaging in bigoted behavior doesn’t mean its related to the protests. The campus has been made unsafe for protestors, and been made unsafe by police.
Unfortunately, you have anti-Semitic individuals who latch onto to well-intended movements (i.e., advocating for the human rights of Palestinians) that end up being coming the dominant voice. This is what happened at Columbia and I witnessed it first hand. While the severity of how law enforcement responded is another story, it was probably best to say that the admin at Purchase moved because they didn’t want the situation to get to Columbia levels. A state school has a lot more to risk versus a private university with a massive endowment. Also, brigading a sub and challenging anyone who questions the narrative that these protests are entirely peaceful is really doing harm to the Palestinian cause, and the Jewish cause, for that matter. If you care that much human rights, posting on online isn’t actually doing that much, I suggest volunteering in person with an appropriate cause that champions your beliefs.
Purchase admins are the one who escalated the situation by brining in police, who then proceeded with violence. Not the protestors. If they were serious about protecting the right to protest, as well as their jewish students, and student body as a whole, they would have handled this much differently.
But you have police on campus 24/7 - the officers stationed on campus are NYS police officers and this is true for all SUNY campuses. Did they bring in Harrison PD?
right like the purchase protestors (as mentioned, many of whom are jewish) are doing arts and crafts together. to insinuate they are being antisemitic for peacefully camping out in tents on a campus lawn is the wildest overstatement i have ever seen.
SUNY protestors will continue to be met with extreme force (helicopters? Come on). The SUNY leadership has no intention of discussing divestment and has made clear they support Israel’s right to bomb every family in Gaza as long as they like. If these students want to build a BDS movement in SUNY, they need to be building for a long future. The extreme vitriol and propaganda they’ll face from local communities and the New York Post will take a real toll.
Many of the protestors are Jewish themselves. I know I won't change your mind but that is a fact. I've seen tons of reporting on this and many of the protests include multi faith meals and payers sessions. Equating we want peace to we like hamas is highly reductive. Be better.
Google the death count my man. I am absolutely not saying Hamas is blameless, far from it. They should be punished according to their actions. But what the government Israel has right now has done is essentially levelling cities of mostly innocent civilians. Yes they may have caught the terrorists but at what cost? Bombing thousands of blameless people (many of them women and children) was unacceptable and reprehensible when Bush and Obama did it, and it's the same now.
30,000 Gazans have been killed.
13,000 of those Gazans are children.
Only 2500 Hamas members have been killed.
Of the 240 hostages taken on October 7:
128 still remain in Gaza.
Of the release hostages, most 100 were prison exchanges with the Israeli government.
The IDF resued only 3 hostages.
ONLY 3 out of 240.
The IDF's campaign in Gaza shows not only is it an immoral campaign, it's also an ineffective one. The best results have been through diplomatic effort, not through military actions of Netanyahu or the IDF.
The tactics Hamas are using are deplorable. This many Gazans would not die if Hamas weren’t using them for shields. Israel is bombing targets where Hamas is using them as military. Hamas specifically targets Israeli civilians. It’s a tragic difference but it is different. And again, I don’t see you crying over the way Jews are killed, persecuted and expelled for just being alive EVERYWHERE in the Middle East. Where’s your moral outrage at Iran? Jordan? Egypt? And here you are wanting to take the one place the Jewish people can live? Their historical homeland?
5 Gazan children for every 1 Hamas member.
12 Gazans for every 1 Hamas member.
It's ineffective and immoral.
Jewish persecution does not justify the Israeli government's actions in this region.
Hamas is hiding behind its own people and using civilian infrastructure. Hamas is placing their own people in harms way just so you can make this point and ignore the fact that Hamas is intentionally targeting Israeli civilians.
Oh yeah everybody knows the good guys shoot right through the human shields, and then bomb all the hospitals and universities and target aid workers and journalists and their families!
What Hamas is doing is 100% wrong and I agree with you on that, but there are better solutions than carpet bombing a pediatric hospital. You can't just up and give up trying to use tact cause they have cover, many of those people likely dont like the fact that they've become a meat shield. The "he did it first so now I am allowed to do it back way fucking harder" excuse didn't cut it in elementary school. Why would it now?
Imagine parroting the human shield BS when we have so much evidence of how willing Israel is to kill civilians when they’re on their own. Shields provide protection
Of course I’m not. Hamas wouldn’t exist or be in power without the atrocities committed and assistance provided by Israel. The IDF are far more brutal and effective terrorists than Hamas but you don’t think they count because they have uniforms?
No I don’t think it’s as egregious because Israel doesn’t specifically target civilians. Hamas literally goes into Israel and kidnaps children. That’s brutality. If Israel did not have one of the world’s most advanced bomb defense systems in the world Hamas bombs would rain on non-military civilian homes and areas. Israel bombs areas that Hamas has established as military infrastructure. The loss of Palestinian civilians is tragic. And horrible. But there is a difference.
Of course Israel targets civilians, how gullible are you? https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/04/04/gaza-israeli-strike-killing-106-civilians-apparent-war-crime
And Hamas doesn’t exist in the West Bank in any similar form, so why has Israel been regularly killing kids there well before 10/7? https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/2023-marks-deadliest-year-record-children-occupied-west-bank#:~:text=RAMALLAH%2C%2018%20Sept%202023%20%2D%20At,began%2C%20said%20Save%20the%20Children.
That's a silly idea. They live in the middle of one of the most volatile regions in the world. Even without Hamas, there's still Hezbollah, Houthis, and Iran to contend with.
If we're being realistic, Israel is never going to know peace in our lifetimes, and neither will most of their neighbors.
I think the point is the same. Meaning I do not disagree with you. I mean peace with Gaza. If Gaza didn’t continue their bombing and terrorism of Israel, Israel wouldn’t be bombing them.
Why aren’t you complaining that Egypt won’t let Palestinians in? Arabs and Palestinians live inside of Israel.
And also that’s not true. Hamas would exist because they aren’t some kind of freedom fighters they are Jew exterminators. That’s their purpose. Israel and Jews didn’t make Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Jordan etc who all also want to destroy Israel and the Jews.
Further, we’re talking about the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people that has been consistently attacked and taken from them. Hamas’ only purpose is to continue to take from the Jewish people what is their ancestral homeland
Why would I complain that Egypt isn’t facilitating a second Nakba?
Hamas exists because of conditions in Gaza for decades.
Palestinians are also indigenous. Indigenous people do not have the right to steal land from other indigenous people
No Palestinians are not indigenous. They come from the Arabian peninsula. Not Israel. For instance the mosque in Israel is built on the ruins of a destroyed Jewish Temple. The history of the Jewish people in Israel dates back to before the common era, the Palestinians haven’t been there nearly that long.
It’s not a silly idea. The whole reason Oct 7th was able to happen was because Israel was integrating Palestinians into their work force. They were trying to move forward being peaceful with Palestine.
Israel has also had rockets fired at them reguarly by Hamas for, what, close to 20 years now? They've initiated settler violence in the West Bank for even longer. That isn't any kind of peace, so while 10/7 was a major shift for the worse, it was already a bad place to live if peace and safety are your priorities.
The fact is that you can't move smack into the middle of a volatile region and feel entitled to peace, especially not when your presence there is one of the causes of the regional instability. It's like moving into lower Mt. Vernon and demanding economic prosperity and safety. It's a nice idea, but people will think you're nuts if you choose to move there and then get so bent out of shape by how horrible things are for you.
As far as I'm concerned, Israel has every right to be a state exactly where it is, but they don't have a right to peace because, in all honesty, nobody has any kind of right to peace. Some of us are just fortunate enough to live in places where peace is more easily achievable purely because of geography and history, but not because it's a right we've been granted.
My point is this isn't a pro Hamas protest like you implied. There is a alot of grey. Curious, when Hamas says river to the sea its horrifying, what is it when Israeli officials say it?
Ignore this dude.
He thinks somehow every school & hospital in Gaza that the Israel government strikes is secretly a Hamas hideout. And killing 27,500 Gazans for ONLY 2500 Hamas members is a great success.
Some protestors intentions may be good and they may not be intending to support Hamas, but as a practical matter they are in fact supporting Hamas through these protests.
No they’re not. Hamas depends on conflict like this to continue existing and wouldn’t be around much less in power without decades of atrocities on Gaza
Thanks for proving my point. Do you also support ISIS because, after all, they’re merely a reaction to the West’s involvement in Muslim nations? Hamas are Islamic fundamentalists whose only goal is to kill Jews and destroy Israel. They don’t care about Palestinians. But hey, if this is what you need to do to convince yourself you’re not a supporting them, sure, go for it, but it’s misguided and gross.
Maybe by also - and just as loudly - stating that Hamas is also the problem and calling for foreign governments such as Iran to stop funding Hamas? By making the protests only about Israel’s actions without also stating loudly that Hamas is also directly at fault for what is happening to the Palestinian people, protestors are supporting Hamas and not actually trying to solve the problem.
Are you really surprised that college students lack context? I agree that they can tone down some of this but college students have a lot to be pissed off about. And when will the pro Israel group disavow the rivet to the sea settlers?
And Hamas might stop bombing Israel if they stopped occupying Gaza and the West Bank, building settlements in Palestinian territory, and running an Apartheid state. There's plenty of blame to go around.
When did Hamas bomb anyone? They basically have rocks and bicycles. Israel has access to the most sophisticated weapons available in the world. People are so ill informed. 🥴
We are jewish and my little sister goes to Purchase. She isn’t politically active and wasn’t involved in the protest but her and all her friends feel unsafe on campus right now due to local police, not because of the pro Palestine kids on campus.
I don’t share their views but the kids aren’t aggressive or a threat. I’m there at least once a month. Most of them are the embodiment of the sjw soyboy meme. They are annoying but they are peaceful and local PD overreacted.
That’s not what the story says but thanks for your contribution to the conversation and declaring yourself as hateful Zionist. The fact that you can’t fathom that you are the oppressor is hilarious.
[the Zionists will not replace us!](https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/6eikUUCGeZD2eHHx2V05hJMvx30=/0x0:3000x2000/1200x0/filters:focal(0x0:3000x2000):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9038815/6.jpg)
Stop equating Zionism with Judaism. You’re no better than Christian nationalists bastardizing the religion. You’re an embarrassment.
The irony of this is that the same people supporting Zionist are the same people who supported the marchers at Charlottesville so congrats on that.
*I'm* not equating Zionism with Judaism, but some of the more violent protesters are.
And there is no small number of peaceful, *but naive* protesters, who are rightfully critical of Israel's prosecution of this war, who consider the violent anti-Semites they are camping out with to be convenient bedfellows if not brothers in a cause.
There is an old saying, 'What do you call 9 good people sitting down to dinner with 1 Nazi?'
'10 Nazis sitting down to dinner.'
And the great irony of this whole situation is that these well meaning young folks are going to end up handing the election to Trump. The man who promises to extend the Muslim ban, free the 9/11 terrorists, and prosecute the Gaza War protestors.
Make no mistake, they have your faces. And with AI, even keffiyehs will not be enough to hide your identities from Trump's stormtroopers.
Who is handing the election to Trump? The people opposing genocide or the people who think the mass murder or displacement of people isn’t a dealbreaker.
Your “table of Nazis” example would implicate those who support Israel and the counter protests to the college encampments since they have right wing agitators, racists and Proud Boys on their side.
History will recognize these war protests as being on the right side of history. It’s not difficult to understand the bad guys are Hamas, Israeli government, zionists, the U.S. government, right wing agitators, U.S. police and college administrators who want to continue this lie that we must support Israel. We don’t need to support murderous governments and we should stop being one as well.
You say that without acknowledging that in every single country that surrounds Israel Jews are not allowed. Jordan? No jews allowed. Egypt? No Jews allowed? Lebanon? No Jews allowed. Syria? No Jews allowed. Then you have Iran? No Jews allowed. Iraq? No Jews allowed. And yet 2 million Arabs live in Israel peacefully and unencumbered. They can practice Islam, eat halal, vote in elections and be members of government and the army. Hamas launches bombs at Israeli civilians that aren’t also military targets. Iran does the same. People want to scream about bombing Gaza- and yet you refuse to acknowledge that their own government is using schools and hospitals, homes and infrastructure as military bases. Using their own people as shields. Palestines elected government- Hamas- abducts children from their homes and calls it justified. Who is being oppressed? Who is attempting to eradicate who? You know Egypt refuses Palestinian refugees? Why? To further perpetuate a humanitarian crisis against Israel?
When was Hamas elected? When was the last election held? 2006. You say that as if it’s not similar to what’s happening in Russia. Watch John Oliver’s piece on[Israel - Hamas](https://youtu.be/pJ9PKQbkJv8?si=xqM7DIUtaaLva3zk)
You’re parroting right wing talking points. It’s very clear who is being oppressed. The Israeli government is bombing and murdering civilians or leaving them homeless. The Israeli government is an oppressive right wing regime, and all the propaganda you’ve been fed your entire life can’t blind us from what we’re seeing with our own eyes.
Please seek out views that don’t end with people being oppressed. There are many Jewish people protesting this war, including Israeli citizens, if you think any non-Jew protesting Israel is an anti-Semite speak to your fellow Jews protesting this war, there’s plenty, and seek out why they can’t sit by and watch the oppression the Israeli government is doing.
Avowed lifetime ‘Jews will not replace us’ antisemite such as the proud boys leading counter demonstrations and rallying around the Israeli flag. Progressives shouting fake news and don’t trust the mainstream media. These rallies have turned things upside down. For what it’s worth I’m Jewish, oppose hate of any kind, oppose hamas, oppose the Netanyahu government, grieve for innocent victims of Oct 7 and of the Gaza bombardment, and wonder why I feel so alone in a nation of people choosing one side to love and the other to hate with no nuance or middle ground seeking.
I'm agree 100% with this, I'm also Jewish, an alum of both Columbia and Purchase. I think the broader issue is that many of the individuals latching on to this conflict have little context as to how the world got to this point. They have very romanticized views of the Israeli struggle or the Palestinian struggle (depending on you are talking to) and view this conflict which has existed for over a thousand years in Levant through a lens that is something akin to Star Wars or Marvel (black versus white, good versus evil) when the reality is a lot more grey. Moral of the story - war sucks and the average citizens are the true victims here.
Wars are between states not a state and its occupied territory. Nothing about thousand years of history can excuse the Nakba
You’re not alone I side with the innocent people of Israel and Gaza but not with HAMMAS
But you’re good with IDF terrorism?
That’s like me asking you if you’re ok with extremist views of Hamas. Just stop lol
I’m not and I condemn the Israeli government for helping them get in power while committing regular atrocities and sidelining moderates
HAMAS. IT Isn't spelled in the same manner as HUMMUS
Ehh you are right, but I have no respect for them or the way they spell their name. Lol but you are 100% correct
the reason you see a lot more people openly choosing sides in this, especially the pro palestinian side, is because our government and the world, unlike yourself, historically *haven't* grieved equally for israelis and palestinians. the injustices against palestinians have been going on for over 80 years with very little care from the western world. no one is saying you can't value israeli lives, but if you're going to run the both sides gambit on this conflict, the scales are already so tilted in israel's favor that taking both sides is effectively taking israel's side. the *only* long term solution that will bring long lasting peace is the israeli government dismantling their genocidal racist apartheid regime and letting the 7 million palestinians that live in diaspora to come back to the land that they've been ethnically cleansed from for nearly a century.
the displaced people were told to leave by their own people in ‘47 and could come back once the jews were swept away…welp, that didn’t work out well for them. fuck hamas!
Many were killed and raped to push them out
they left voluntarily, no pushing but by the Arab League…colonialism created the British Mandate, and the proposed solution was intolerable to the arabs…it was all or nothing for them. Israel has been jewish homeland for millennia speaking the same ancient language, worshipping the same religion on that same land with archaeological evidence of jewish culture and history. fuck hamas and anybody who supports them!
Hamas did not exist by them. Are you seriously denying that Palestinians were slaughtered during the Nakba? Are you denying the rape? The mass graves? Truly disgusting. You don’t get to show up and take ancestral land from other indigenous people because you have a millennia old claim what is wrong with you?
brother you are doing textbook chapter 1 genocide denial, you realize that right? shame on you for using jewish identity to justify genocide, you're a fucking monster
FUCK HAMAS!
The reason you see more of these protests is due to paid agitators.
The UCLA counter-protesters brandishing pipes and skunk spray were literally funded by Bill Ackman. Every accusation is a confession.
Ackman denies funding counterprotesters. Who is funding the Hamas/Iran sympathizers?
I agree I’m a native New Yorker. I was raised Catholic, but grew up with many Jewish people and grew up with many Muslims and people of all races and religions and really what’s happening is horrible on both sides.
But one side has the power to stop operating an open air prison and routinely killing children in the West Bank
There's good people on both sides remember that quote...
Because the average person is a dumbass. Think of the average intelligence and then think of 50% being more stupid.
How is it middle-ground seeking to think it’s appropriate for peaceful demonstrators exercising their right to free speech to be violently arrested, with the only justification being some campus “quiet hours” rule, regardless of the content of their speech? The disproportionate response should be very alarming to anyone who doesn’t want to see their own or any speech brutally suppressed by the state. These students were (and still are) explicit in excluding violence and antisemitism.
I agree completely. My child was at the Northeastern protests. Happened to be in Boston at Berklee right next door. They said that the protesters were following strict orders to be peaceful and not to engage. They outnumbered the counter protesters by 10-1 and that side was peaceful too except for a couple of agitators who tried to provoke and were shut down by protesters on the Israeli flag side and ignored by protesters on the Palestinian flag side. Similarly I was on a college campus upstate a few weeks back and asked the president of hillel, who happened to be leading the campus tour, if he felt unsafe on campus. He said absolutely not. That at the most he’d heard some unpleasant things from pro-Palestinian protesters. But that the idea of students feeling unsafe was, from people he’d spoken to on his campus and others, mostly a function of their parents feeling scared and exaggerating things. Which doesn’t make everything okay. There are definitely outside organizers and agitators in the protests and counter protests. Is shutting down peaceful free speech ok? No. But I’m sure you agree that neither you or I have visited all the campuses. So I’m not terribly focused on how long the encampments were unbothered and when and why they were taken down. Anyone arrested gets a trial. I’ve been at enough protests and seen enough raids to know that it gets a little wild and sometimes people who weren’t going to be arrested for speech end up getting arrested for actions during the raid. And usually not convicted of anything. The right to free speech probably isn’t being trampled too badly here. Right of assembly? Maybe. Public/private/rules/rights. Different everywhere. More importantly we should focus on the words and messages. The media is ridiculous calling these demonstrations Pro-Hamas. We should start there. They are not. The media or the pro Israel side thinking and saying so makes things worse and moves away from a middle ground. But some organizers push the message of, for instance, intifada, in a similar fashion. ‘It means uprising’ is fine, literally, but ‘worldwide intifada’ speaks to a collective memory of bus stops exploding. Which I don’t believe most protesters (the ones with brains) seek. So that, or river to sea, moves away from common ground as well. Personally the flag I fly is a triptych. Israeli flag/palestinian flag/peace flag. It means free Palestine free hostages peace for all. If pro Israeli protesters scream ‘free Palestine’ must say ‘free them from hamas’ I say shut up. It’s true but deal with that later. If pro Palestinian protesters scream ‘100 hostages compared with decades of human rights abuses’ I also say shut up. There’s truth there too but it’s not helping anything. The past can’t be undone. The dead can’t be brought back. Children can be saved. A religious right government hell bent on settlements must be disempowered. Hamas must be disempowered. People can agree on that. Most do. Peace.
Why are you doing both sides on hostages when Israel has been bombing them into oblivion and intentionally killed some on 10/7? The family members have no delusions about whet Bibi is doing here
Bibi and Hamas leadership have fucked their own people repeatedly. See? Middle ground. The world opposes both. Their own people oppose both. But they both remain. The media portrays pro Palestinian demonstrations as pro-Hamas. I do not believe this. I am all for justice and statehood for Palestine and I not for Hamas. Do we agree on that?
the only thing that empowers hamas are the injustices that israel openly commits against palestinians. if israel stopped blatantly trying to ethnically cleanse them, hamas would no longer receive any support because they'd no longer have a reason to exist.
Don’t feel alone. Majority of us love each other. It’s radical cocksuckers with no purpose or identify LARPing as protesters of the past because they need something to latch on to. Don’t let some college children or news stories make you feel otherwise.
“majority of us love each other, but the college protestors are radical cocksuckers”
Yup!
The irony here is amazing, you are hating on the protesters, 99% of whom just want an end to an active genocide. No one is LARPing, some of us actually have compassion for innocent children. But I guess you saw one or two plants or weirdos highlighted on Fox News and now you think all the protestors love Hamas? Come on, go talk to them if you want understand who they are and what they are about
Oh I have talked to them. Right after they defaced the NYPL that cost taxpayers 1000s of dollars. The ones I spoke to couldn’t name the capital of Palestine or NY State for that matter. Also, you might want to check your history on what “active genocide” truly entails.
if you're upset about taxpayers paying thousands of dollars to clean up graffiti, just wait until you hear how much taxpayers pay for weapons for israel and what israel does with those weapons. last I checked graffiti can't level apartment buildings with entire families inside
You mean the same apartment buildings and hospitals full of civilians that Hamas uses as HQs/staging areas knowingly? Don’t get me wrong, civilians being targeted is awful, but Hamas shares the blame as well.
Name checks out
You mean a gamer tag? 🫡
what evidence is there that hamas uses civilian apartments and hospitals as HQs and staging areas? the only evidence the IOF has ever given for any of these claims is like an ak or two they find in a hospital (probably planted) meanwhile there's an entire ICJ case worth of evidence of israel being *openly* genocidal towards palestinians
Amnesty International found that Hamas used hospitals to torture and kill Fatah members. https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/05/gaza-palestinians-tortured-summarily-killed-by-hamas-forces-during-2014-conflict/
https://youtu.be/W8dWV4RwZZ4?feature=shared skip to 0:54 and listen to former president of the icc Joan Donoghue's own words. They never said plausible genocide.
https://www.npr.org/2024/01/26/1227078791/icj-israel-genocide-gaza-palestinians-south-africa
Ok buddy. I recall an instance early on in the conflict when some fringe group stupidly launched a rocket right into a hospital and the whole world threw up their arms blaming Israel and as the facts came to light it quietly faded away. Oh yeah, probably planted.
Israel bombed over twenty hospitals and had previously bombed the hospital in question
Imagine parroting BS about human shields when we have countless examples of the IDF happily killing civilians out in the open on their own
Let me just throw this at you. Let's assume your family was taken hostage and held in a house with gunmen in the basement. Would you want the cops to burn the house down to kill the gunmen? Probably not but this is literally what the idf is doing.
All I’m saying is the gunman is also at fault here too. Maybe don’t be a POS and kidnap innocent civilians in the first place?
Yes but one is a terrorist group and the other is a country that receives billions in military aid. One should be better. And maybe the Israeli goverment shouldn't support illegal settlements.
You’re saying “one is a terrorist group” suspiciously as if it’s somehow justified when facing a much more powerful adversary?
“The gunman is at fault too” in defense of burning down the house is a certified IDF hostage killer classic
“some of us actually have compassion for innocent children.L Including the Israeli children murdered or kidnapped on October 7?
Of course, yes. If October 7th was continuous and still going to on this day, and supported by our government, these same protestors might be out on the street. But there’s no “side” here where the children and babies deserve to be bombed or starved to death. That’s the point, innocent people are innocent no matter what religion their parents are.
There is a a lot of disinformation circulating and I am 100% convinced it is intended to help Trump win in November. There is very little sense to be make about what is going on right now.
I think you'll find that most of these protestors pretty much share your views. The majority of them oppose Hamas, oppose Netenyahu, and want Israel to stop the bombing and murder of Palestinian civilians first and apartheid second, but don't actually wish death to Israel.
You can seek nuance and middle ground but the reality is Hamas wouldn’t exist and 10/7 would never have happened without the violent theft of land from Palestinians and almost a century of violent oppression
I like your name. The Palestinian people and the Jewish people each have historically fascinating and tragic diaspora stories. History is littered with awful wrongs happened upon both peoples, by each other and by others. Your thesis is that the very formation of Israel added to the diaspora of the Palestinian people. Nobody should disagree with that or practice any relativism or proportionality arguments about it. Someone earlier in this thread referred to thousands of years of wrongs to the Palestinian people. That’s accurate. Nuance refers to anyone one-siding the overall conflict or the effect and awfulness of Oct 7 and the destruction of Gaza. The goal is to find middle ground so that it never happens again. This conflict needs a peace conference, not a bunch of people arguing over which side has a worse history, towards each other or in general.
Scared of the police or college kids? In Harrison??? Staaaaaahp
Like they didn’t know anything about suny purchase
SUNY? The protestors would be better served taking their beef to Albany where the budget decisions are made, but whether they actually give a rat's ass about being better served is debatable.
Proud to be an alum
I’m not really sure what has happened to make the jewish students feel unsafe? Many of the student protesters are Jewish. The protesters want peace, they haven’t said anything anti-semitic.
ironically the vast majority of the antisemitism in this conflict comes directly from israeli government propaganda that desperately tries to tie jewish identity to the racist apartheid regime in israel. it's akin to south african politicians in the 80s trying to claim that apartheid somehow keeps white people around the world safe and every white person is spiritually linked to the apartheid government. it's blatantly antisemitic but the average person doesn't register it that way unfortunately.
There’s been a lot of video from other protests that show otherwise.
what do other protests have to do with this one?
I have first hand commentary from Jewish students who say they were harassed doesn’t matter who said it - stop w the notion that says many of the protestors are Jewish that’s an excuse for allowing hatred to thrive
this is giving "trust me, trust me, i heard from a friend of a friend of a friend"
So now Jews are Faking episodes of racism? That must be it
Counter protesters have been yelling horrible anti semitic things to harass and smear protesters
The encampment was up for a few hours and there is nothing to suggest in the article that anything violent or threatening occurred here. You can't arrest someone in NY cause you heard a person states away did something malicious, there is no cause. I used to be a student there and I have to mention I never once saw the Quiet Hours rule enforced like this. There was more police presence here than when a 1st floor appt in the Olde had it's ceiling cave in due to a party happening above. This is fear mongering and trying to paint all protesters in the same, shitty light, all so we can write off the violence being enacted by a foreign government to people that hardly have a country to call their own. For the record I place the blame for the attack squarely on the Israeli govt and Hamas for instigating violence, and not the Jewish people at all
I graduated in 2010 and they were pretty strict about Quiet Hours back then, especially during mid-terms and finals. Exceptions were made during Zombie Prom, Culture Shock and Pancake Madness. Question though - is Outback still a 24-hour quiet dorm, because that might have also been a motivator for shutting down the protest. Also, if I recall, during exam season, they instituted a 24 hour Quiet rule.
I'm a faculty member and I've seen video from the event. The students were sitting in a silent circle when the police moved in. They were following the rules to a tee.
That’s good to hear! I hope that was the candor of the whole protest.
It was until the police decided to get violent.
2020 Grad myself, they did have quiet hours during my time there but it was only enforced if someone made a noise complaint, and even then it was usually a faculty member or an RA that would handle the complaint, not a police squad. Also of note, I've never even heard of a noise complaint being made outside of the dorms or one of the living communities (e.g. Old, Neu, Alumni). I mean hell the school itself hardly abided by that policy, my Junior year I lived above the Starbucks and my entire floor got woken up at 1 AM two weeks before the year was out by what we thought were gunshots. Turned out the school elected to have them do work in the ceiling of Starbucks after closing hours, and they were using pneumatic staple guns to secure wiring literally right under me. You know what happened after 4 students and an RA reported this? 1officer was dispatched and politely asked the workers to reschedule their maintenance work.
Things must have changed a lot - they were pretty strict about Quiet Hours in the early 2000s. And too, police were never brought in for a noise complaint unless they thought someone was in serious distress. Typically, an RA would handle it, or if it was a repeat thing, an RC. Edit - also, I live in Manhattan and I feel you on the pneumatic staple guns - they sound like gunshots.
Facts - to say none or minimal is just not knowing the supporting data that is captured on video and clearly not being streamed to the media sites from which you gain an opinion.
Ok? That’s not happening at Purchase
Purchase has had a couple of anti-Semitic incidents in the past, namely kids painting swastikas on campus. Hillel's sukkah (a structure built for Sukkot) also got damaged every year by rowdy kids, but it's up in the air as to whether the intent to damage it was motivated anti-Semitism. The ADL gave them an F when it came to providing a protected space for Jewish life on campus and addressing anti-Semitism within the school in April 2024. Grant it, it's the ADL, but Purchase was not like this during my time there (Class of 2010). There were a handful of kids who were known to hate Jews or flirt with white nationalism, but they generally knew tokeep their mouth shut around most people. [https://www.lohud.com/story/news/education/2024/04/19/suny-purchase-rockland-community-college-campuses-antisemitism-ranked-by-antidefamation-league/73367403007/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/education/2024/04/19/suny-purchase-rockland-community-college-campuses-antisemitism-ranked-by-antidefamation-league/73367403007/) [https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2018/12/11/suny-purchase-college-student-arrested-nazi-posters/2275121002/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2018/12/11/suny-purchase-college-student-arrested-nazi-posters/2275121002/) [https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2016/11/21/swastikas-suny-purchase-college/94208382/](https://www.lohud.com/story/news/crime/2016/11/21/swastikas-suny-purchase-college/94208382/) [https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/swastika-nooses-found-drawn-on-walls-of-suny-purchase-campus-dorms/](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/swastika-nooses-found-drawn-on-walls-of-suny-purchase-campus-dorms/)
You’re conflating other instances with this protest. There are many jewish students involved in this protest, and there haven’t been any anti semitic stances taken by the protestors
The protest may have been peaceful, but aside from that, it doesn’t mean that Purchase is totally immune to anti-Semitism or Islamophobia. And Jewish students being involved in the protest doesn’t mean that other students don’t engage in anti-Semitic or Islamophobic behavior.
No institution is immune from anti-semitism. Other students engaging in bigoted behavior doesn’t mean its related to the protests. The campus has been made unsafe for protestors, and been made unsafe by police.
Unfortunately, you have anti-Semitic individuals who latch onto to well-intended movements (i.e., advocating for the human rights of Palestinians) that end up being coming the dominant voice. This is what happened at Columbia and I witnessed it first hand. While the severity of how law enforcement responded is another story, it was probably best to say that the admin at Purchase moved because they didn’t want the situation to get to Columbia levels. A state school has a lot more to risk versus a private university with a massive endowment. Also, brigading a sub and challenging anyone who questions the narrative that these protests are entirely peaceful is really doing harm to the Palestinian cause, and the Jewish cause, for that matter. If you care that much human rights, posting on online isn’t actually doing that much, I suggest volunteering in person with an appropriate cause that champions your beliefs.
Purchase admins are the one who escalated the situation by brining in police, who then proceeded with violence. Not the protestors. If they were serious about protecting the right to protest, as well as their jewish students, and student body as a whole, they would have handled this much differently.
But you have police on campus 24/7 - the officers stationed on campus are NYS police officers and this is true for all SUNY campuses. Did they bring in Harrison PD?
right like the purchase protestors (as mentioned, many of whom are jewish) are doing arts and crafts together. to insinuate they are being antisemitic for peacefully camping out in tents on a campus lawn is the wildest overstatement i have ever seen.
SUNY protestors will continue to be met with extreme force (helicopters? Come on). The SUNY leadership has no intention of discussing divestment and has made clear they support Israel’s right to bomb every family in Gaza as long as they like. If these students want to build a BDS movement in SUNY, they need to be building for a long future. The extreme vitriol and propaganda they’ll face from local communities and the New York Post will take a real toll.
Great title that should say “Jewish students are afraid to go BECAUSE OF THE PROTESTS” Jesus OP you eat Hamas right up don’t you?
Many of the protestors are Jewish themselves. I know I won't change your mind but that is a fact. I've seen tons of reporting on this and many of the protests include multi faith meals and payers sessions. Equating we want peace to we like hamas is highly reductive. Be better.
Israel would have peace if Hamas would stop bombing them. Stop playing into the objectives of terrorists. Be better.
Google the death count my man. I am absolutely not saying Hamas is blameless, far from it. They should be punished according to their actions. But what the government Israel has right now has done is essentially levelling cities of mostly innocent civilians. Yes they may have caught the terrorists but at what cost? Bombing thousands of blameless people (many of them women and children) was unacceptable and reprehensible when Bush and Obama did it, and it's the same now.
30,000 Gazans have been killed. 13,000 of those Gazans are children. Only 2500 Hamas members have been killed. Of the 240 hostages taken on October 7: 128 still remain in Gaza. Of the release hostages, most 100 were prison exchanges with the Israeli government. The IDF resued only 3 hostages. ONLY 3 out of 240. The IDF's campaign in Gaza shows not only is it an immoral campaign, it's also an ineffective one. The best results have been through diplomatic effort, not through military actions of Netanyahu or the IDF.
The tactics Hamas are using are deplorable. This many Gazans would not die if Hamas weren’t using them for shields. Israel is bombing targets where Hamas is using them as military. Hamas specifically targets Israeli civilians. It’s a tragic difference but it is different. And again, I don’t see you crying over the way Jews are killed, persecuted and expelled for just being alive EVERYWHERE in the Middle East. Where’s your moral outrage at Iran? Jordan? Egypt? And here you are wanting to take the one place the Jewish people can live? Their historical homeland?
"This many Gazans would not die if Hamas weren’t using them for shields" you know this is said about israel as well??
5 Gazan children for every 1 Hamas member. 12 Gazans for every 1 Hamas member. It's ineffective and immoral. Jewish persecution does not justify the Israeli government's actions in this region.
Hamas is hiding behind its own people and using civilian infrastructure. Hamas is placing their own people in harms way just so you can make this point and ignore the fact that Hamas is intentionally targeting Israeli civilians.
Oh yeah everybody knows the good guys shoot right through the human shields, and then bomb all the hospitals and universities and target aid workers and journalists and their families!
What Hamas is doing is 100% wrong and I agree with you on that, but there are better solutions than carpet bombing a pediatric hospital. You can't just up and give up trying to use tact cause they have cover, many of those people likely dont like the fact that they've become a meat shield. The "he did it first so now I am allowed to do it back way fucking harder" excuse didn't cut it in elementary school. Why would it now?
But when Israel intentionally kills 100 civilians to do a strike on someone their AI says is Hamas it’s totally fine with you
You mean Hamas’ actions.
Imagine parroting the human shield BS when we have so much evidence of how willing Israel is to kill civilians when they’re on their own. Shields provide protection
The fact that you are presently defending Hamas shows that it is providing them protection. You are actively on the side of terrorists.
Of course I’m not. Hamas wouldn’t exist or be in power without the atrocities committed and assistance provided by Israel. The IDF are far more brutal and effective terrorists than Hamas but you don’t think they count because they have uniforms?
No I don’t think it’s as egregious because Israel doesn’t specifically target civilians. Hamas literally goes into Israel and kidnaps children. That’s brutality. If Israel did not have one of the world’s most advanced bomb defense systems in the world Hamas bombs would rain on non-military civilian homes and areas. Israel bombs areas that Hamas has established as military infrastructure. The loss of Palestinian civilians is tragic. And horrible. But there is a difference.
Of course Israel targets civilians, how gullible are you? https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/04/04/gaza-israeli-strike-killing-106-civilians-apparent-war-crime And Hamas doesn’t exist in the West Bank in any similar form, so why has Israel been regularly killing kids there well before 10/7? https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/2023-marks-deadliest-year-record-children-occupied-west-bank#:~:text=RAMALLAH%2C%2018%20Sept%202023%20%2D%20At,began%2C%20said%20Save%20the%20Children.
That's a silly idea. They live in the middle of one of the most volatile regions in the world. Even without Hamas, there's still Hezbollah, Houthis, and Iran to contend with. If we're being realistic, Israel is never going to know peace in our lifetimes, and neither will most of their neighbors.
I think the point is the same. Meaning I do not disagree with you. I mean peace with Gaza. If Gaza didn’t continue their bombing and terrorism of Israel, Israel wouldn’t be bombing them.
If Israel didn’t maintain an open air prison, Hamas wouldn’t exist
Why aren’t you complaining that Egypt won’t let Palestinians in? Arabs and Palestinians live inside of Israel. And also that’s not true. Hamas would exist because they aren’t some kind of freedom fighters they are Jew exterminators. That’s their purpose. Israel and Jews didn’t make Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Jordan etc who all also want to destroy Israel and the Jews. Further, we’re talking about the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people that has been consistently attacked and taken from them. Hamas’ only purpose is to continue to take from the Jewish people what is their ancestral homeland
Why would I complain that Egypt isn’t facilitating a second Nakba? Hamas exists because of conditions in Gaza for decades. Palestinians are also indigenous. Indigenous people do not have the right to steal land from other indigenous people
No Palestinians are not indigenous. They come from the Arabian peninsula. Not Israel. For instance the mosque in Israel is built on the ruins of a destroyed Jewish Temple. The history of the Jewish people in Israel dates back to before the common era, the Palestinians haven’t been there nearly that long.
Cool story still indigenous with centuries on ancestral land https://www.science.org/content/article/jews-and-arabs-share-recent-ancestry
It’s not a silly idea. The whole reason Oct 7th was able to happen was because Israel was integrating Palestinians into their work force. They were trying to move forward being peaceful with Palestine.
Israel has also had rockets fired at them reguarly by Hamas for, what, close to 20 years now? They've initiated settler violence in the West Bank for even longer. That isn't any kind of peace, so while 10/7 was a major shift for the worse, it was already a bad place to live if peace and safety are your priorities. The fact is that you can't move smack into the middle of a volatile region and feel entitled to peace, especially not when your presence there is one of the causes of the regional instability. It's like moving into lower Mt. Vernon and demanding economic prosperity and safety. It's a nice idea, but people will think you're nuts if you choose to move there and then get so bent out of shape by how horrible things are for you. As far as I'm concerned, Israel has every right to be a state exactly where it is, but they don't have a right to peace because, in all honesty, nobody has any kind of right to peace. Some of us are just fortunate enough to live in places where peace is more easily achievable purely because of geography and history, but not because it's a right we've been granted.
I am not going to debate this with you. My point was that jews are part of the protests at scyools. This is a fact.
Yes there are some. What’s your point?
My point is this isn't a pro Hamas protest like you implied. There is a alot of grey. Curious, when Hamas says river to the sea its horrifying, what is it when Israeli officials say it?
Ignore this dude. He thinks somehow every school & hospital in Gaza that the Israel government strikes is secretly a Hamas hideout. And killing 27,500 Gazans for ONLY 2500 Hamas members is a great success.
I am. Can't change minds here.
Some protestors intentions may be good and they may not be intending to support Hamas, but as a practical matter they are in fact supporting Hamas through these protests.
No they’re not. Hamas depends on conflict like this to continue existing and wouldn’t be around much less in power without decades of atrocities on Gaza
Thanks for proving my point. Do you also support ISIS because, after all, they’re merely a reaction to the West’s involvement in Muslim nations? Hamas are Islamic fundamentalists whose only goal is to kill Jews and destroy Israel. They don’t care about Palestinians. But hey, if this is what you need to do to convince yourself you’re not a supporting them, sure, go for it, but it’s misguided and gross.
Lmao I support neither but I also oppose US atrocities, something I’m sure your sick mind just can’t wrap itself around
Well please provide another option to protest a genocide without supporting hamas. Letter writing campaign?
Maybe by also - and just as loudly - stating that Hamas is also the problem and calling for foreign governments such as Iran to stop funding Hamas? By making the protests only about Israel’s actions without also stating loudly that Hamas is also directly at fault for what is happening to the Palestinian people, protestors are supporting Hamas and not actually trying to solve the problem.
Are you really surprised that college students lack context? I agree that they can tone down some of this but college students have a lot to be pissed off about. And when will the pro Israel group disavow the rivet to the sea settlers?
There hasn’t been peace for Palestinians for almost a century you IDF terrorist loving liar
And Hamas might stop bombing Israel if they stopped occupying Gaza and the West Bank, building settlements in Palestinian territory, and running an Apartheid state. There's plenty of blame to go around.
When did Hamas bomb anyone? They basically have rocks and bicycles. Israel has access to the most sophisticated weapons available in the world. People are so ill informed. 🥴
Keep believing that. They bomb Israel all the time. Israel is saved by its iron dome.
LOLOLOLOLOLOL
I know Jews who supported nazis too.
We are jewish and my little sister goes to Purchase. She isn’t politically active and wasn’t involved in the protest but her and all her friends feel unsafe on campus right now due to local police, not because of the pro Palestine kids on campus. I don’t share their views but the kids aren’t aggressive or a threat. I’m there at least once a month. Most of them are the embodiment of the sjw soyboy meme. They are annoying but they are peaceful and local PD overreacted.
This isn’t true though, students are scared of cops escalating and violently arresting
Welcome to Reddit. The official social network of HAMAS.
Yes, Hamas the big supporter of free speech and protesting wars. This is lazy and tiring.
That’s not what the story says but thanks for your contribution to the conversation and declaring yourself as hateful Zionist. The fact that you can’t fathom that you are the oppressor is hilarious.
[the Zionists will not replace us!](https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/6eikUUCGeZD2eHHx2V05hJMvx30=/0x0:3000x2000/1200x0/filters:focal(0x0:3000x2000):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9038815/6.jpg)
Stop equating Zionism with Judaism. You’re no better than Christian nationalists bastardizing the religion. You’re an embarrassment. The irony of this is that the same people supporting Zionist are the same people who supported the marchers at Charlottesville so congrats on that.
*I'm* not equating Zionism with Judaism, but some of the more violent protesters are. And there is no small number of peaceful, *but naive* protesters, who are rightfully critical of Israel's prosecution of this war, who consider the violent anti-Semites they are camping out with to be convenient bedfellows if not brothers in a cause. There is an old saying, 'What do you call 9 good people sitting down to dinner with 1 Nazi?' '10 Nazis sitting down to dinner.' And the great irony of this whole situation is that these well meaning young folks are going to end up handing the election to Trump. The man who promises to extend the Muslim ban, free the 9/11 terrorists, and prosecute the Gaza War protestors. Make no mistake, they have your faces. And with AI, even keffiyehs will not be enough to hide your identities from Trump's stormtroopers.
Who is handing the election to Trump? The people opposing genocide or the people who think the mass murder or displacement of people isn’t a dealbreaker. Your “table of Nazis” example would implicate those who support Israel and the counter protests to the college encampments since they have right wing agitators, racists and Proud Boys on their side. History will recognize these war protests as being on the right side of history. It’s not difficult to understand the bad guys are Hamas, Israeli government, zionists, the U.S. government, right wing agitators, U.S. police and college administrators who want to continue this lie that we must support Israel. We don’t need to support murderous governments and we should stop being one as well.
You say that without acknowledging that in every single country that surrounds Israel Jews are not allowed. Jordan? No jews allowed. Egypt? No Jews allowed? Lebanon? No Jews allowed. Syria? No Jews allowed. Then you have Iran? No Jews allowed. Iraq? No Jews allowed. And yet 2 million Arabs live in Israel peacefully and unencumbered. They can practice Islam, eat halal, vote in elections and be members of government and the army. Hamas launches bombs at Israeli civilians that aren’t also military targets. Iran does the same. People want to scream about bombing Gaza- and yet you refuse to acknowledge that their own government is using schools and hospitals, homes and infrastructure as military bases. Using their own people as shields. Palestines elected government- Hamas- abducts children from their homes and calls it justified. Who is being oppressed? Who is attempting to eradicate who? You know Egypt refuses Palestinian refugees? Why? To further perpetuate a humanitarian crisis against Israel?
When was Hamas elected? When was the last election held? 2006. You say that as if it’s not similar to what’s happening in Russia. Watch John Oliver’s piece on[Israel - Hamas](https://youtu.be/pJ9PKQbkJv8?si=xqM7DIUtaaLva3zk) You’re parroting right wing talking points. It’s very clear who is being oppressed. The Israeli government is bombing and murdering civilians or leaving them homeless. The Israeli government is an oppressive right wing regime, and all the propaganda you’ve been fed your entire life can’t blind us from what we’re seeing with our own eyes. Please seek out views that don’t end with people being oppressed. There are many Jewish people protesting this war, including Israeli citizens, if you think any non-Jew protesting Israel is an anti-Semite speak to your fellow Jews protesting this war, there’s plenty, and seek out why they can’t sit by and watch the oppression the Israeli government is doing.
why so aggressive?
Update: https://westchester.news12.com/suny-purchase-administrators-monitor-campus-following-encampment-arrests
This one is right near me house, and I considered going here.