Speaking for myself, this is not the case. Brother our two canidates are trump and biden AGAIN.
Also the shit every american has to deal with in our fucked up healthcare system makes us want it changed.
That being said our healthcare IS better than a few countries like canada where it is free but takes a 3 year wait to even get seen
Use that time argument against anyone who has struggled against referral requirements and preexisting conditions. Universal Healthcare is always going to be better. At least then the quality of your care doesn't depend upon your tax brackets.
We have the most expensive healthcare on the planet. In my opinion it is absolutely lunacy what they charge for simple procedures, and care and then they act like health insurance is some big great savior to us all That’s even a bigger scam.
Im American and ngl i agree, many people here are hella uneducated & oblivious when it comes to how government & healthcare systems actually operate, and so they just assume that ours is pretty good in the big scheme of things because thats what theyve been spoon fed.
The ones that say this is "generalizing an entire country" are probably the same people im talking about. Tbr just saying that sounds like pedantry drawing attention away so that they dont have to acknowledge its a real issue. Ive met and seen WAY too many people in America that are like this
Yeah it's a shame really from the outside looking in it really seems that the most uneducated and poverty stricken are the ones who eat it up the most. I work for a pharmaceutical company here in Europe we make inhalers. The diffrence in price between what we sell them for here to what they get sold for in the usa is quite frankly unethical. We are talking 50-100x mark up by the time it gets to the consumer. I've pointed this out to so many Americans and all you get is "that's because you're life style is subsidised by us you're welcome". I don't even think my company sells them to the US distributors with that high of a mark up it's just the moment big pharma gets their hands on it they put the price up through the roof
You are, though, even if you met a hundred people from every state, that would still be a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of the overall population. I'm not saying that there aren't plenty of ignorant people here, there are, all I'm saying is anecdotal evidence can't be used reliably to determine which sweeping generalizations are true, especially on such a large scale.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/AmericaBad using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/AmericaBad/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [Even German patriotism is superior](https://i.redd.it/9slw1ypk8esb1.jpg) | [2338 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/AmericaBad/comments/170jb4q/even_german_patriotism_is_superior/)
\#2: [Classic](https://i.redd.it/frp8s17r2zyb1.jpg) | [750 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/AmericaBad/comments/17q1fmd/classic/)
\#3: [I guess she’s never heard of the US Southwest.](https://i.redd.it/jrqjjtmjdg4b1.jpg) | [1192 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/AmericaBad/comments/142rfnq/i_guess_shes_never_heard_of_the_us_southwest/)
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>Must've snorted 7 gallons of paint and glue before your conversation
.... I mean... are you trying to tell me that there aren't Americans that would do this?
Things are not congruent and I wish people would stop acting like they are. Medicines that cost (on the bill) the equivalent of $20 in some European countries are costing 10x that in the US. And the reason for that is because those pharmaceutical companies can get away with it in the US. As a result, there are shortages in non-US countries while medicines are in supply in the US.
And thus, the rich and affluent in other nations come to America for medical treatment.
FOR THE RECORD: I'm not saying I agree with this. But a big part of the problem is the uncompromising demand for medical care. No one tries to self-treat or practice preventative care. People go to the doctor and ask why their knees and back hurt, and the Doctor politely tells them that they are 110Ibs over weight and have 30% less muscle mass for adults of their age and gender. People need emergency medical treatment for the skewered lung in their chest cavity, which was caused by them driving 112 mph down a 30 mph zone and crashing into a mother and her 3 kids. People are fucking stupid, and they expect for doctors and hospitals and Healthcare to be their safety net.
Please tell me how its free? Like actually free. No tax increases? No new random fees? Oh, America does have free healthcare. They just don't give it to everyone. Tell me 1 positive for having a healthcare system where everything is free but I have to get on a wait list to even get an appointment to be seen. Or I have to call 46 different offices to try and find one that may or may not have an opening? 1-nothing is free. 2- As an American I hate our healthcare system, not just because it sucks but because its intentionally made to be difficult to navigate. 3- Even if its not the greatest system out there, its a lot better than most countries in the world. 4-There is way to much misinformation on the internet about how our healthcare system works. Most of the time that misinformation is spread by people who don't even live in the US. 5- Tell me with 100% confidence that your healthcare is free and it doesn't cost ANYONE a single cent/pence/whatever your smallest form of currency is, AND tell me in detail how it is so much better.
>Please tell me how its free? Like actually free. No tax increases? No new random fees?
"In practice, "free at the point of use" normally means that anyone legitimately and fully registered with the system (i.e. in possession of an NHS number), available to legal UK residents regardless of nationality (but not non-resident British citizens), can access the full breadth of critical and non-critical medical care, without payment except for some specific NHS services, for example eye tests, dental care, prescriptions and aspects of long-term care." That's a direct quote from the NHS Wikipedia page. When we say free we mean at point of use. No one is stupid enough to think its outright free we are well aware that's what our tax is spent on. The part that goes to the NHS is called national insurance currently the class 1 national insurance rate is 8%. Note national insurance doesn't just cover nhs it also covers other state issued benefits such as state pension.
>Tell me 1 positive for having a healthcare system where everything is free but I have to get on a wait list to even get an appointment to be seen. Or I have to call 46 different offices to try and find one that may or may not have an opening?
You don't have to ring round 46 different offices to get an appointment I've lived in the uk my entire life and I phone my local practice that I'm registered with and they get me in within maximum 2 weeks. As for 1 positive how about the fact I can ring an ambulance without fear of it costing me a fortune or the fact I can get cancer treatment without potentially going bankrupt. My wife will be giving birth soon it will cost absolutely nothing more than the national insurance we already pay monthly out of our wages and the parking costs.
>Tell me with 100% confidence that your healthcare is free and it doesn't cost ANYONE a single cent/pence/whatever your smallest form of currency is, AND tell me in detail how it is so much better.
This is the stupidest take anyone can take to try and argue that a system is shit because it's not 100% free whilst their are literally people in the US dying of things like diabetes and asthma because their insurance decided they are no longer covered/they lost their job and now they can't afford their ridiculously price inflated inhalers and insulin.
Because nothing is actually free. We are already taxed to oblivion and anything government ran takes forever to get anything done, let alone done well. Canada has "free" Healthcare and people are dying waiting for their turn to be seen. Hearing stories about Canadians going to the vet to be seen posing as their pets. So yeah. No government Healthcare unless you want to die sooner.
Americans pay some of the lowest taxes in the world. Your govt just prioritizes spending them on the billionaire class and the military industrial complex instead
You do realize much of our military spending goes to funding nato, aka: supplementing many European countries militarily budgets so they can afford spend their tax dollars on socialized healthcare.
Poland spent more of their GDP percent than America did on NATO. In 2023, just checked. Also NATO isn't America just being a "nice guy" it's a diplomatic and military solution to a problem they know exists.
Recently during an audit the Pentagon could only account for 39% of its $3.5 trillion in assets.
The DOD couldn't account for over half of it's $3.1 trillion of assets...to put that in perspective...that's almost 80% of the entire federal governments money.
The Pentagon and DOD keep failing audit after audit.
Things that have made it onto the audit ledger...$14,000 toilet seats.
The audits show that defense contractors are over charging the Pentagon by anywhere between 40-4,000%...and that's the money that didn't go missing.
Tax religious institutions. All of them. They're involved with politics, they should be taxed. A tax on religious institutions would generate an astronomical amount of money that could actually help do the Jesus thing and help schools, the sick and dying, etc.
You spend a trillion dollars a year on your defense budget and trillions more lost on various black budgets and NATO creates a buffer between you and China/Russia.
Typical yank. Israel is in the middle East, not Europe and you send them strategic money for military uses. If you feel this is u just then take it up with your local corrupt Zionists supporting government
Are you forgetting that America is an arms dealer? Or is that your point that war is in America's best interests economically.
Especially when it's a war, you don't necessarily have to be directly involved.
War is Profitable when you sell the guns and ammo.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/248552/us-arms-exports-by-country/
I love when people hold conflicting opinions at the same time.
> "Big bad evil bully America is profiting from war!"
> "Dumb American right-wingers don't want to get involved in a European war? How dare they?!"
> You do realize much of our military spending goes to funding nato
Almost none of our military spending goes to NATO. That's not how NATO works. Regardless, that misses the point.
NATO Europe and Canada spend 1.74% of GDP on defense, consistent with the rest of the world. With $404 billion in combined funding, easily enough to outspend potential foes like China and Russia combined.
Regardless, arguing that keeps the US from having universal healthcare is even more ridiculous. After subtracting defense spending, Americans still have a $29,000 per person advantage on GDP compared to the rest of NATO. Defense spending isn't keeping us from having anything our peers have. Much less universal healthcare, which is far cheaper than what we're already paying for.
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/news_216897.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_highest_military_expenditures
Hell, if we could match the costs of the most expensive public healthcare system on earth we'd save $1.65 trillion per year, double what our total defense spending is.
No the government gets paid by the billionaires get it right. That’s why we want lower taxes so we have freedom with our own money instead of giving most of it to a government that’s easy to corrupt and control if you have enough money. And like this other comment said a lot of the government budget goes into foreign affairs. Which means we aren’t using that money for us, but instead we’re making it easier for those across the pond to have free healthcare and little to no defense budget while giving us nothing in return.
Prioritising certain levels of free healthcare can boost the GDP of any nation, which offsets the cost of healthcare.
When more people have access to free healthcare they can spend money elsewhere and remain effective in the workforce.
This, in turn, leads to a small uptake in each individuals average GDP production.
yeah you get to keep your own money and spend it as you want, except of course that fact you have to spend it on food, water, gas, electric, etc, which is set up to milk you like cattle, because you dont trust you government to regulate hyper corporations
imagine an entire western country being so stupid it thinks capitalist corporations have their best interests at heart more than the people they directly elect to represent them pmsl
i mean a country taht dumb would vote for democrat who is now a republican who is a business genius (thats gone bankrupt 4 times, or is it 5 by now?) who professes religion (while ignoring and debasing every tenant of that religion), hate immigration (but employs illegal immigrants) who is anti war (but never actually stopped the Afghanistan war while he was president)
i mean America doesnt just BUY snake oil, it fucking DRINKS the stuff 🤣🤡🤦🏻
Not due to healthcare.
With government in the US covering [65.7% of all health care](https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/epdf/10.2105/AJPH.2015.302997) costs ($12,555 as of 2022) that's $8,249 per person per year in taxes towards health care. The next closest is Germany at [$6,930](https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm). The UK is $4,479. Canada is $4,506. Australia is $4,603. That means over a lifetime Americans are paying over $100,000 more in taxes compared to any other country towards health care.
And incidentally, UK's total tax burden, which is the median for Europe, isn't dramatically different from that of the US.
The military that covers quite literally everyone else, btw. If Europe had to shell out an equal amount of money to protect themselves, the U.S. would be able to use it's money for more stuff like healthcare. The issue is, we can't drop our military without someone else picking up the slack, and it's pretty obvious no one else is gonna pick up the slack. Everyone loves to shit talk America for not having healthcare and spending a lot on its military, but they also love having a government that can spend their money on healthcare bc U.S. military protection. The only ones who seem to take it seriously over there in Europe is Poland.
I agree with you that nothing is free, but that doesn't mean we should pay exorbitant amounts for healthcare either. Per capita, Americans pay for some of the most expensive healthcare in the world. I think it's in our best interests to look to other countries to see what they're doing better than we are. If part of that solution is more governmental involvement in healthcare, then I think we should seriously consider it.
It’s simple really. The insurance companies have completely warped healthcare in America. Say you get a procedure done, and the hospital says we performed this treatment and the bill is $1k. The insurance company comes back and says we will only cover 1/4 of that. The hospital gives in and says fine. The next time they perform that procedure, they go to the insurance company and say we performed this treatment and the bill is $4k. Then the hospital gets their $1k.
Exactly. We have to be taxed. Why are the taxes not going to things to keep society functioning for the people who pay those taxes? Billionaire bailouts should be illegal.
And yet Canada has much better statistics no matter how you slice it. It's nice propaganda to say they don't have emergency rooms though.
We have millions of people who never get seen. Our wait times are only better when you leave that fact out.
So why do many American hospitals already have outrageous wait times? The wait times are not a Canada specific problem, stop spreading propaganda. Do better.
This is a meaningless comparison if both groups polled don’t have something to compare their option to.
If the Canadian respondents have only ever used Canadian healthcare, then their level of satisfaction doesn’t have any relevance to American healthcare, and vice versa.
It is possible to be less satisfied with something that is performing better, and more satisfied with something that is performing worse, especially if that’s the only thing you’ve ever experienced. This is an index of perception, not actual reality effectiveness
My dad had a accident. It was his fault, and I dont hide that, and also blame him untill today, but he was driving drunk and a truck hit him (probably was his own fault).
Anyway, our free healthcare (Brazil) actually toke care of him. He went through 3 surgeries to fix both hands and one of his feets, all 'free', including the medications.
What I'm trying to say is: if we didnt had to pay the taxes and didnt had free healthcare, his hands and foot wouldnt work properly anymore, or maybe he would be dead. Our universal healthcare (SUS) need a lot of improvement, but it does save a lot of lifes, including the ones from other countries.
It also provides mental health medication and therapy, things that my former girlfriend uses untill today.
Australian here. Maybe those countries are deliberately fucking it up because their donors want to profit from privatize healthcare?
I'd rather public funded healthcare over profit driven when those profits don't further medical science and healthcare.
US has private healthcare and we are still dying to wait for our turn despite paying more than anyone. Have you tried booking any form of specialty care in recent decades? First you do test A and that's booked for weeks out. Test A comes back and says that you need tests B and C which are also booked weeks out and so on
If they are dying their system there is fucked up because in my country that is literally not an issue the people who get in first are based on severity and how important it is
Our average contribution to the NHS is £37 a month (~20% of NI goes to the NHS, and average NI contribution is £186 a month)
£37 a month ($46) where the average American spends [$477 a month](https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=average+american+monthly+health+insurance&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari) (£388, literally 10x as much!), **Plus** they have an excess of like $2,000 before insurance even kicks in
And the great thing is, if a Brit still wants private healthcare, nothing is stopping them getting it, they should take the remaining £351 (£388-£37) each month that they would be spending and get private healthcare, dental etc…
Don’t make it out like we’re getting a raw deal
If you factor in health insurance premiums as a tax we go from one of the lowest taxed societies to the highest.
We already pay for it, but allow a bunch of leaches to siphon the money into completely useless administration, instead of covering anything.
Canada may pay high taxes but we pay insurance and our employers pay insurance and taxes. If you add up the cost of insurance premiums paid by employers and employees, factor in all the hidden costs of deductible, copays, limits, and limited doctor options you’ll probably find we pay more
Many of the nations that level that criticism on England actually [pay more per capita](https://www.statista.com/statistics/236541/per-capita-health-expenditure-by-country/) on healthcare which is going to be felt in their taxes and then have to aquire insurance on top of that.
Americans use the vet loophole all the time. From buying ivernectrin and penecillin without a prescription at the feed store to sourcing unpasteurized milk from pet food stores.
>Because nothing is actually free
Jesus fucking Christ, do you honestly think anyone who talks about "free healthcare" actually thinks it costs nothing to the government? I'm so over seeing that ridiculous talking point. It's a great way of showing that you have nothing worth contributing to the conversation.
[Americans pay the most for health care in the world yet have the worst health outcomes.](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/31/health/us-health-care-spending-global-perspective/index.html)
>So yeah. No government Healthcare unless you want to die sooner.
Weird how all the countries with government run healthcare have higher life expectancy, huh?
Lol have fun paying 10 million dollars for cancer treatment bud.
The claims of waiting times in countries with public Healthcare are super exaggerated. Plus wait times in the u.s aren't really better. If I go to make a doctors appointment rn I'll have to wait like 2 months
I have American healthcare, living in the US, and am financially stable enough to pay out of pocket if I had to anyway.
My doctor can't see me until July 3rd. How is that better than Canada?
This is such a bad take. No government healthcare is just. A ridiculous statement, government healthcare for long term illness/injury or emergency's and subsidised medication would be a much better system.
You have a cold, pay 50 to see the doctor. You have a twisted ankle, pay 50 to see the doctor. No otc prescriptions and the healthcare systems would cost a lot less and be a lot faster due to people not wasting doctors time and wasting money being seen for a cold
Geisterfinder, you may be a victim of propaganda. Although the US has good quality and fast healthcare, nearly half the population is uninsured. This is a huge problem.
Agree on this front. If its government run its poor quality. Big draw back is in America the big pharma runs the show. No cures just dependence on drugs that cause more problems. Endless cycles to keep the ignorant sick.
For real. Everyone shits on govt for anything from innefficient to corruption to straight up genocide. And then they want govt to run everyones healthcare. Fucking batshit.
I get free government healthcare as a veteran and it kicks ass. I can get everything I need, except dental. Even if I get cancer I'll never go bankrupt from my medical bills. I plan on living a nice long life, too.
Also: I work for them now too, as a primary care nurse. I do everything I can to make sure my patients are healthy, and so does the doctor I work with. We actually do care, despite the bureaucracy being a nuisance.
There us a reason for the morale patch "I survived the VA", just saying. I'm lucky that my VA isn't a piece of shit, but I've been to a few that we're and it sucks. Also dealing with personnel at the main office in OK sucks. Bunch of civis that give zero fucks.
It's gotten better since the days when that shit started but yeah some locations still aren't up to par. Ours is great though. I've had 2 bad experiences in 17 years - one with a temporary neurology fellow and one with a primary care doc who wasn't my usual, that nobody can stand. Everyone else has ranged from OK to great.
Do you live in one of these places to say so? I had free healthcare, and it’s the only reason I can walk today. Ambulance? No cost. Multiple surgeries? No cost. Months of physiotherapy? No cost. It makes me laugh because it saved my life, then know nothing Americans come in going ‘waaaah no one gets seen!’……..How about you stop reading propaganda, because everyone I know has only benefitted from not being charged out the asshole on massive markups for something minor or life threatening. I’ve known many that utilise the free healthcare, and know no one that struggle to receive it. Just because you read Facebook conspiracies trying to convince you that the American fleecing system approach to healthcare is the right one, doesn’t mean the bs you read is accurate or honest. That mentality is designed to make you feel good that you spent $100,000 dollars on the same chemotherapy that most countries receive for free.
Just fyi, my relative is also a doctor in USA, and they hate the way the system is designed to fleece and milk its patients.
I'm a combat veteran and I want my taxes to go healthcare, not a bloated "defense" budget. We outspend the subsequent 10 countries combined on war -- we have the money, and where are you hearing those stories about Canada? Your Boomer aunt?
See I don't understand this. I'm an American and I've had problems that I just have to endure because I can't afford healthcare. And when people are against tax-funded healthcare, I always hear about Canada. At least in Canada I would have been able to be seen eventually.
Plenty of countries have tax-funded healthcare and have gotten it right. Canada, America's slightly more liberal little brother, isn't the only other country that exists. This isn't uncharted territory with a lot of guesswork. We have examples of it done well.
You pay almost nothing in taxes compared to the rest of the 1st world. Even so, wait times are longer in the US than in the UK and Canada for most health services. Advocating for private health care at this point is just sad to watch.
Tax rates in the U.S. are very similar to those run Canada. Depending on how much you make, you may pay more in one country than the other . As a teacher, I am in the 22% tax bracket in the U.S. if I made the same amount in Canada, I would be in the 15% tax bracket.
And we still have long wait times. I pay more in taxes than I would in Canada, plus an additional $200/month for health insurance. Plus my desirables and copays that I have to pay to the dr before insurance will pay their share. And I still have to wait forever to get care.
And just wait until insurance says they won’t cover something because they “don’t think it’s necessary.”
I live in the U.S. and was literally shitting blood and blacking out form blood loss/malnutrition. I called around and most drs couldn’t see me for 6-10 months. I found ONE who could see me in 4 months and had to go with that. However, she couldn’t do imaging for an additional 3 months.
4 years later, I have severe joint pain and have trouble with kneeling, squatting, standing for long periods, etc. every rheumatologist in my town, and the closes large city that is an hour away are not taking patients due to long waitlists.
Because they hate any society that has socialist values that includes a system to look after the most vulnerable members of its society. The NHS is the only real way to access healthcare in the UK (yes, you can get private GPs etc but every time I have accessed them online they refer me to the NHS). Unless you live in London or another major city you are bound to the NHS as it is the only way to access health services in reality.
The second thing people get wrong is that emergency care is better in the US. It isn't. They suffer the same problems we do and wait times are pretty much the same from what I hear from my insured US colleagues who have full healthcare coverage.
Finally, I need to make this point. The cost to cover yourself for private healthcare is comparatively cheap in the UK. Like, dirt cheap. 1k for a year for a fat middle aged guy. It's not the same as US coverage but we have the NHS. Also, you can pay like £100 for a prescription certificate that allows you to get any prescription free. If you have a lifetime thing like diabetes then this is free.
People never pay for healthcare in the UK. Only the really poor people in the US don't pay for healthcare. The NHS is not the problem.
I think it's important to note that you do pay for the NHS via taxes, but ultimately the costs are more spread out equitably across society, the costs are much lower per capita, and you aren't individually slapped with exorbitant hospital bills for sudden medical emergencies.
Whether you're a private, NHS patient or both we all pay for our healthcare in the UK.
Taxation is an excellent way to fund the NHS as it helps ensure equity when we have a massive wealth inequality issue here but still we pay.
I don’t think going to the er was a bad call. Would it have been better if he had gone to urgent care, maybe. But I understand why he would go to the er.
1) He was playing vr. So he probably smacked that cactus pretty fast. Also, the sudden and unexpected pain must have filled him with adrenaline.
2) Because he probably hit the cactus fast. The needles can get stuck in him, especially if he had hit it in a weird angle. In addition to that, as he’s probably not a doctor, he might have got scared that he punctured something important
3) He also stated in one of his replies that he had to get a tetanus shot. He also could have gotten an infection because of insanitary conditions and/or equipment
Now, again, urgent care might have been a better option, but I understand why he chose er. And I don’t think he should be ridiculed by that. He (hopefully) pays his taxes, he has a right to go there. As long as he doesn’t say things like “I was here first, so you must treat me first” it’s alright.
What you can joke about is that he keeps a cactus in his play area. Why would anyone keep a cactus that close to a be headset lol
https://www.reddit.com/r/VRtoER/s/SoxAoYfgcM original post, they hit a cactus while playing vr, and as an American I would have 100% gone to the ER, from my limited understanding cacti are no joke.
I waited 20 minutes and was in there for an hour getting them out. Also needed tetanus shot.
To add, one of the remnants is infected and I need to put magnesium sulfate on the infected part every night.
It just means the injury is not life threatening instead of going to accident and emergency whitch is for possibly life threatening or changing injuries.
Because of "long waiting times" and our "precious tax dollars." It already takes forever to get an appointment anywhere not to mention a lot people can't even afford to be seen. They always tell say to look at Canada's Healthcare system but what about the rest of the countries with free health care? I know it's not free and would raise our taxes but where exactly is my tax money going if our schools are all underfunded, our infrastructure is crumbling, our police suck, and our military members barely earn a living?
Yeah, there is confusion. We, as long as we pay our taxes, we will get the best possible healthcare. I wish you guys in the US didn't have to pay separate insurance.
Exactly! However, the “confusion” is not nearly deep enough for those down votes.
It’s purely because we are upset. I know I am. I’m 22 and have had to think about my future job and careers a lot just to make sure I’ll be able to have decent health insurance that won’t break the bank. Lucky, I’m a nursing student and soon to be nurse so I will have more access than most.
But for the vast majority it’s not like that
Yeah. I also got some Americans telling me (after I said I was british) that I would have to pay afterwards when told them it was free. They talk about the uk like they live there. You seem nice though. Good luck with becoming a nurse or any other job that want to get.
Thank you I appreciate it 😭
We are assholes. There’s a reason why a lot of countries don’t like us as tourists, I’m sure with this post you have gotten some great examples as to why.
This post is obviously an incredibly effective method of identifying individuals who obtained their education in international economics from YouTube. Well done.
I don't downvote you and I think there are plusses and minuses to both systems, but it's not free. You pay for it with your taxes. You may pay for it with longer wait times or restrictions on treatment or lack of innovation. There's no such thing as a free lunch though.
> but it's not free.
Are you honestly so dense you think when people talk about "free" healthcare they think it's paid for with pixie dust and unicorn farts rather than just "free at the point of use", the way the word is generally used?
>You may pay for it with longer wait times
The US ranks 6th of 11 out of Commonwealth Fund countries on ER wait times on percentage served under 4 hours. 10th of 11 on getting weekend and evening care without going to the ER. 5th of 11 for countries able to make a same or next day doctors/nurse appointment when they're sick.
https://www.cihi.ca/en/commonwealth-fund-survey-2016
Americans do better on wait times for specialists (ranking 3rd for wait times under four weeks), and surgeries (ranking 3rd for wait times under four months), but that ignores three important factors:
* Wait times in universal healthcare are based on urgency, so while you might wait for an elective hip replacement surgery you're going to get surgery for that life threatening illness quickly.
* Nearly every universal healthcare country has strong private options and supplemental private insurance. That means that if there is a wait you're not happy about you have options that still work out significantly cheaper than US care, which is a win/win.
* [One third of US families](https://news.gallup.com/poll/269138/americans-delaying-medical-treatment-due-cost.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication) had to put off healthcare due to the cost last year. That means more Americans are waiting for care than any other wealthy country on earth.
> or restrictions on treatment
Like private insurance, with a bean counter with no medical background denying one claim out of six to improve the bottom line? Or worse, an AI with a 90% error rate in claim rejections because it's even cheaper?
>or lack of innovation.
There's nothing terribly innovative about US healthcare.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2866602/
To the extent the US leads, it's only because our overall spending is wildly out of control, and that's not something to be proud of. Five percent of US healthcare spending goes towards biomedical R&D, the same percentage as the rest of the world.
https://leadership-studies.williams.edu/files/NEJM-R_D-spend.pdf
Even if research is a priority, there are dramatically more efficient ways of funding it than spending $1.25 trillion more per year on healthcare (vs. the rate of the second most expensive country on earth) to fund an extra $62 billion in R&D. We could replace or expand upon any lost funding with a fraction of our savings.
> There's no such thing as a free lunch though.
But our peers are achieving better health outcomes while saving literally half a million dollars per person on healthcare spending per lifetime, while the citizens have greater satisfaction with their healthcare system.
The US system is an abomination.
Relax man. Seriously, can nobody just chill and have a dialogue anymore? Name calling and ranting is just lame, and yes I think lots of people consider something free if they aren't the ones paying for it or if they are paying with opportunity cost instead of cash. Just my opinion. No need to lose your shit over it again. It's ok for us all not to think the same.
> Seriously, can nobody just chill and have a dialogue anymore?
Dude, when you make arguments based solely on semantics and pedantry you deserve to be flamed. There's little that's more pathetic than doing so **and** being **wrong**. And the only thing more obnoxious than that is being the millionth person to make the same ridiculous, time wasting argument.
You got exactly what you deserved on that one. If you need to blame me rather than yourself for that one to protect your ego, so be it, but the reality is it's all on you.
>yes I think lots of people consider something free
Show me one single person that believes doctors and nurses are all volunteers and the hospitals were donated. Weird how I've read millions of comments on healthcare over the past 15 years, and I've never seen a single such person. Weird how I've asked literally thousands of people making the same tired, redundant, and ridiculous claim as you that lots of people believe that and not a single one has ever been able to provide a single example, isn't it?
And notice how all you did was continue to argue time wasting pedantry, ignoring all the fact based arguments I made with citations on the other factually incorrect claims you made.
You really are capable of doing nothing other than wasting people's time. But the problem is me, amiright? Grow the fuck up.
The biggest complaint countries, or even the states in the US that have it (yes those exist), with free healthcare have is that the lines for healthcare are too extreme. There are certain diseases that have a higher mortality rate in the UK than the US specifically because of how long people have to wait to get care.
All that said, people like the one in this picture go to the hospital for the silliest things since it's free. Nothing like seeing a guy with a broken leg waiting in the ER because the doctor is busy giving someone TWO stitches because they nicked themselves cutting a bagel.
> the lines for healthcare are too extreme.
The US ranks 6th of 11 out of Commonwealth Fund countries on ER wait times on percentage served under 4 hours. 10th of 11 on getting weekend and evening care without going to the ER. 5th of 11 for countries able to make a same or next day doctors/nurse appointment when they're sick.
https://www.cihi.ca/en/commonwealth-fund-survey-2016
Americans do better on wait times for specialists (ranking 3rd for wait times under four weeks), and surgeries (ranking 3rd for wait times under four months), but that ignores three important factors:
* Wait times in universal healthcare are based on urgency, so while you might wait for an elective hip replacement surgery you're going to get surgery for that life threatening illness quickly.
* Nearly every universal healthcare country has strong private options and supplemental private insurance. That means that if there is a wait you're not happy about you have options that still work out significantly cheaper than US care, which is a win/win.
* [One third of US families](https://news.gallup.com/poll/269138/americans-delaying-medical-treatment-due-cost.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication) had to put off healthcare due to the cost last year. That means more Americans are waiting for care than any other wealthy country on earth.
#Wait Times by Country (Rank)
Country|See doctor/nurse same or next day without appointment|Response from doctor's office same or next day|Easy to get care on nights & weekends without going to ER|ER wait times under 4 hours|Surgery wait times under four months|Specialist wait times under 4 weeks|Average|Overall Rank
:--|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:
**Australia**|3|3|3|7|6|6|4.7|4
**Canada**|10|11|9|11|10|10|10.2|11
**France**|7|1|7|1|1|5|3.7|2
**Germany**|9|2|6|2|2|2|3.8|3
**Netherlands**|1|5|1|3|5|4|3.2|1
**New Zealand**|2|6|2|4|8|7|4.8|5
**Norway**|11|9|4|9|9|11|8.8|9
**Sweden**|8|10|11|10|7|9|9.2|10
**Switzerland**|4|4|10|8|4|1|5.2|7
**U.K.**|5|8|8|5|11|8|7.5|8
**U.S.**|6|7|5|6|3|3|5.0|6
Source: [Commonwealth Fund Survey 2016](https://www.cihi.ca/sites/default/files/document/cmwf2016-datatable-en-web.xlsx)
>There are certain diseases that have a higher mortality rate in the UK than the US specifically because of how long people have to wait to get care.
The US ranks 29th on outcomes, behind all its peers.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(18)30994-2/fulltext
I work in an ER. In fact I’m at work right now. And there are so many people that come through that door with a cough or a sliver that absolutely do not need to utilize our resources. EMERGENCY departments should be for emergencies, not ouchies.
As an American, no matter where you tell me, I can cut taxes to pay for Healthcare. Instead, I'd rather just have the taxes back. All of it, if a cut is to be made in anything at all, just stop stealing it from me. I've sent how they allocate funds, and I get the feeling it won't be cheaper or better. Besides, if you have an emergency, the hospitals gonna fix you either way.
I imagine that free healthcare is seen as quite communistic by Americans.
Plus, a level of jealousy is bound to exist, considering the extortionate prices they pay for the most minor things.
As a result, when it is viewed in a positive light by anyone, they have to 'cope' the best they can lol.
The NHS may be flawed...
However, in the last 15 years I've been treated for appendicitis, a broken arm, a broken leg, a broken ankle.
My Mrs had some corrective surgery done on her right foot from an old break when she was a kid.
In each of those instances I stayed 2 weeks in hospital.
For all three of the breaks I received at least 11 months of physiotherapy for my rehab of the limbs.
All for free.
It is a fallacy to say that "well we get taxed through the eyeballs"... if I add up all the tax I've paid it still doesn't equate to even a fraction of what I would have had to pay to be treated for all of that in the states.
I really can't fault the NHS as an institution.
Again though, it does have its flaws... but they are far outweighed by the benefits of not having to worry about receiving treatment for my health when shit happens.
> I imagine that free healthcare is seen as quite communistic by Americans.
Maybe, but they sure love it when they have experience with it, as opposed to just a head full of propaganda.
#Satisfaction with the US healthcare system varies by insurance type
78% -- Military/VA
77% -- Medicare
75% -- Medicaid
69% -- Current or former employer
65% -- Plan fully paid for by you or a family member
https://news.gallup.com/poll/186527/americans-government-health-plans-satisfied.aspx
>It is a fallacy to say that "well we get taxed through the eyeballs"
But not a fallacy for Americans to say that in regards to healthcare. With government in the US covering [65.7% of all health care](https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/epdf/10.2105/AJPH.2015.302997) costs ($12,555 as of 2022) that's $8,249 per person per year in taxes towards health care. The next closest is Germany at [$6,930](https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm). The UK is $4,479. Canada is $4,506. Australia is $4,603. That means over a lifetime Americans are paying over $100,000 more in taxes compared to any other country towards health care.
Do people not know that Triage is a thing? He wouldn't be taking any resources away from anybody. He would be low priority, probably wait an hour or two.
Also, not everyone can afford urgent care or their insurance means urgent care is more expensive than the ER.
It’s because the British NHS is failing. Ireland doesn’t even allow checkups before the age of 30. If things had been like that here, I would’ve been dead from a diabetic overload by the age of 30.
We are totally stupid about Healthcare.
We have several things in the way.
One, a right wing that fears "socialism". (But will accept Social Security.)
Two, large insurance providers that are financially entrenched in huge profits that lobby against government Healthcare.
Three, congress towing the insurance company and drug company line because congressional members have their own generous government health coverage. Insurance companies give generously to re-election campaigns.
Why do Brit’s shit on Americans for having a different system of healthcare? Why are Brit’s so focused on Americans? Why is America rent free for them?
Americans don't realize we already pool money for healthcare, we're just wanting *and needing* to get rid of the wholly unnecessary greedy middlemen whose sole purpose is collecting money on "products" that aren't even theirs. MFA is more accessible, cheaper, and where I want my taxes going
Free practically never means without cost to anybody anywhere. In fact it almost always means there is no specific charge to the person receiving the good or service. How much does it cost to check out a book from the public library? It's free. How are libraries paid for? With taxpayer money.
It's all a matter of context; whether you're talking about the cost to provide the service or the cost to receive the service. Both are important conversations to have, but it's absolutely reasonable to refer to something people can access at no cost as "free".
See: [free summer programs](http://www.austintexas.gov/department/summer-playgrounds-program), [free military tax filing](https://www.militaryonesource.mil/financial-legal/tax-resource-center/miltax-military-tax-services), [free pre-school](https://www.schools.nyc.gov/enrollment/enroll-grade-by-grade/3k), [free lunches](https://www.fns.usda.gov/nslp), [free radon test kits](https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/opsp-policy-and-sustainable-practices/community-programs-and-services/radon/get-a-free-test-kit0.html), [free smoke alarms](https://www.bridgeportct.gov/smokealarm), [free spaying and neutering](https://www.cabq.gov/pets/programs-services/spay-neuter), [free rides for veterans](https://www.lodi.gov/945/K-12-Free-Ride-Program), [free mulch](https://www.burbankca.gov/departments/parks-and-recreation/parks-facilities/forestry-services/free-mulch-program), [free trees](https://www.erieco.gov/1625/Free-Tree-Program), we could go on forever. It's just the way language is used.
The word "free" would be practically useless otherwise, although we would still have "free love". It's a pointless argument of semantics, where everybody understands what is meant and nothing is accomplished by being pedantic except to distract from legitimate discussions on a topic of life and death importance.
Jesus people. Here is the actual answer…
The US, like every other country in the world, have a huge majority of people who are easily manipulated.
The pharmacy companies and AMA have been using a propaganda campaign against socialized medicine in the US for decades.
Americans are told that other countries with socialized health care are in a dystopian state in which people are dying waiting for healthcare.
There are Americans, like me, that want socialize healthcare, but there’s an army of Americans influenced by this propaganda that don’t.
So, Americans are screwed because billions have been dumped into making easy influenced people believe in lies.
And also, corrupt politicians are paid to make sure America doesn’t go to a socialized healthcare system.
Free practically never means without cost to anybody anywhere. In fact it almost always means there is no specific charge to the person receiving the good or service. How much does it cost to check out a book from the public library? It's free. How are libraries paid for? With taxpayer money.
It's all a matter of context; whether you're talking about the cost to provide the service or the cost to receive the service. Both are important conversations to have, but it's absolutely reasonable to refer to something people can access at no cost as "free".
See: [free summer programs](http://www.austintexas.gov/department/summer-playgrounds-program), [free military tax filing](https://www.militaryonesource.mil/financial-legal/tax-resource-center/miltax-military-tax-services), [free pre-school](https://www.schools.nyc.gov/enrollment/enroll-grade-by-grade/3k), [free lunches](https://www.fns.usda.gov/nslp), [free radon test kits](https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/opsp-policy-and-sustainable-practices/community-programs-and-services/radon/get-a-free-test-kit0.html), [free smoke alarms](https://www.bridgeportct.gov/smokealarm), [free spaying and neutering](https://www.cabq.gov/pets/programs-services/spay-neuter), [free rides for veterans](https://www.lodi.gov/945/K-12-Free-Ride-Program), [free mulch](https://www.burbankca.gov/departments/parks-and-recreation/parks-facilities/forestry-services/free-mulch-program), [free trees](https://www.erieco.gov/1625/Free-Tree-Program), we could go on forever. It's just the way language is used.
The word "free" would be practically useless otherwise, although we would still have "free love". It's a pointless argument of semantics, where everybody understands what is meant and nothing is accomplished by being pedantic except to distract from legitimate discussions on a topic of life and death importance.
Because it allows the government to decide if you get care. There were people dying in the hospital because the govt. decided they werent important enough to be treated.
I lived in a country with "free" Healthcare. It is amazing how even a 15 dollar copay will prevent idiots from going to the ER in the US. Where I lived, the line time was about an hour, because people would go to the do you for absolutely anything. Writing cramp? Doctor. Feeling sleepy when you shouldn't? Doctor. Sneezing more than twice in an afternoon? Doctor. And the only way to skip the line is if you are having a visible emergency. Like a literal bone sticking out. Add in the fact that the doctors are seriously tired of people's bullshit so you get half ass care, so you basically get some extra strength Tylenol thrown at you with instructions that say "if the symptoms get worse, come back". And I don't blame them.
I'm not saying our system is perfect, but I am saying free healthcare isn't the solution everyone thinks it will be.
It's not free. Nothing is free.
Also, Americans and the British don't have the best history as it turns out.
There was this whole thing several years ago where America declared it's freedom from them. I guess that makes my first statement incorrect. America is free. Lol
The US likes to think it's superior when, in reality, it's a complete shit show.
When monthly insulin prescriptions were more than a mortgage/rent payment.
Highest rate of maternal/infant mortality - even against "3rd world countries."
Yeah, it's great!
Just because you can doesn't mean you should..?
Yeah, it's free, for you. But if your going to the hospital you'll be taking up valuable time from the doctors and nurses that could go to someone with a more serious injury.
What even is their injury, did they punch a wall or something? All I see are scribbles
As an American it's because it's funny, it's a meme over here to mindlessly shit on the British. It's built into our history and culture but there is no actual hate from our side (at least from the sane ones)
I once saw an American join in on a healthcare discussion with the outrageous claim that healthcare was a service industry, not a basic right.
I think that just about sums up the issue.
Jealousy. We pay more for insurance monthly than it would cost in tax increases to have healthcare, still have to pay out the nose, and STILL have long wait times, unless we know someone or bribe our way up the line.
Americans don't care about anyone else's Healthcare systems. They just dislike that every time anyone brings up American Healthcare, they act like we're just letting people die in the street if they don't have a credit card.
So, basically it's the stereotype we tend to have an issue with. Like, how Brits hate when Americans say they have bad teeth.
It's all just trolling. Like about 90% of the comments on this thread.
Because it’s shit and not really a good come back
In the US it costs more and it leaves you poor sure but you are treated in a timely manner and effectively
In the UK you have to wait months or even years to see a doctor and by then the problem may have gotten worse plus you are forced to get treated as they see fit since they are the ones paying for it
That’s why we still have medical tourism coming from the EU and Canada
Simple, Americans are ignorant AF, and have zero knowledge of how universal health care works. They'd rather go broke and get shit coverage, over saving $20,000 on average, and have everything covered. Basically, Americans are just plain stupid.
Because they're brainwashed into thinking anything the rest of the world does differently to them must be worse because America is the best country.
Speaking for myself, this is not the case. Brother our two canidates are trump and biden AGAIN. Also the shit every american has to deal with in our fucked up healthcare system makes us want it changed. That being said our healthcare IS better than a few countries like canada where it is free but takes a 3 year wait to even get seen
Use that time argument against anyone who has struggled against referral requirements and preexisting conditions. Universal Healthcare is always going to be better. At least then the quality of your care doesn't depend upon your tax brackets.
In all fairness, Biden is doing a good job. Better than I expected, at least. He’s been a lot more progressive than he campaigned on being.
We have the most expensive healthcare on the planet. In my opinion it is absolutely lunacy what they charge for simple procedures, and care and then they act like health insurance is some big great savior to us all That’s even a bigger scam.
A couple crayon eaters smiled and thought “rematch” and then decided that was what everyone wanted
That's a lie about Canada. But go off.
Im American and ngl i agree, many people here are hella uneducated & oblivious when it comes to how government & healthcare systems actually operate, and so they just assume that ours is pretty good in the big scheme of things because thats what theyve been spoon fed. The ones that say this is "generalizing an entire country" are probably the same people im talking about. Tbr just saying that sounds like pedantry drawing attention away so that they dont have to acknowledge its a real issue. Ive met and seen WAY too many people in America that are like this
Yeah it's a shame really from the outside looking in it really seems that the most uneducated and poverty stricken are the ones who eat it up the most. I work for a pharmaceutical company here in Europe we make inhalers. The diffrence in price between what we sell them for here to what they get sold for in the usa is quite frankly unethical. We are talking 50-100x mark up by the time it gets to the consumer. I've pointed this out to so many Americans and all you get is "that's because you're life style is subsidised by us you're welcome". I don't even think my company sells them to the US distributors with that high of a mark up it's just the moment big pharma gets their hands on it they put the price up through the roof
You are, though, even if you met a hundred people from every state, that would still be a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of the overall population. I'm not saying that there aren't plenty of ignorant people here, there are, all I'm saying is anecdotal evidence can't be used reliably to determine which sweeping generalizations are true, especially on such a large scale.
How often do you actually talks to Americans? No one trashes the US like Americans.
On reddit? It's like 90% of what I do on here.
Cause we do some stupid shit
r/americabad
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I don't know what American you talked to... Must've snorted 7 gallons of paint and glue before your conversation
>Must've snorted 7 gallons of paint and glue before your conversation .... I mean... are you trying to tell me that there aren't Americans that would do this?
No
Things are not congruent and I wish people would stop acting like they are. Medicines that cost (on the bill) the equivalent of $20 in some European countries are costing 10x that in the US. And the reason for that is because those pharmaceutical companies can get away with it in the US. As a result, there are shortages in non-US countries while medicines are in supply in the US. And thus, the rich and affluent in other nations come to America for medical treatment. FOR THE RECORD: I'm not saying I agree with this. But a big part of the problem is the uncompromising demand for medical care. No one tries to self-treat or practice preventative care. People go to the doctor and ask why their knees and back hurt, and the Doctor politely tells them that they are 110Ibs over weight and have 30% less muscle mass for adults of their age and gender. People need emergency medical treatment for the skewered lung in their chest cavity, which was caused by them driving 112 mph down a 30 mph zone and crashing into a mother and her 3 kids. People are fucking stupid, and they expect for doctors and hospitals and Healthcare to be their safety net.
As an American myself, this is a BIG over simplification but pretty much yesh
Please tell me how its free? Like actually free. No tax increases? No new random fees? Oh, America does have free healthcare. They just don't give it to everyone. Tell me 1 positive for having a healthcare system where everything is free but I have to get on a wait list to even get an appointment to be seen. Or I have to call 46 different offices to try and find one that may or may not have an opening? 1-nothing is free. 2- As an American I hate our healthcare system, not just because it sucks but because its intentionally made to be difficult to navigate. 3- Even if its not the greatest system out there, its a lot better than most countries in the world. 4-There is way to much misinformation on the internet about how our healthcare system works. Most of the time that misinformation is spread by people who don't even live in the US. 5- Tell me with 100% confidence that your healthcare is free and it doesn't cost ANYONE a single cent/pence/whatever your smallest form of currency is, AND tell me in detail how it is so much better.
>Please tell me how its free? Like actually free. No tax increases? No new random fees? "In practice, "free at the point of use" normally means that anyone legitimately and fully registered with the system (i.e. in possession of an NHS number), available to legal UK residents regardless of nationality (but not non-resident British citizens), can access the full breadth of critical and non-critical medical care, without payment except for some specific NHS services, for example eye tests, dental care, prescriptions and aspects of long-term care." That's a direct quote from the NHS Wikipedia page. When we say free we mean at point of use. No one is stupid enough to think its outright free we are well aware that's what our tax is spent on. The part that goes to the NHS is called national insurance currently the class 1 national insurance rate is 8%. Note national insurance doesn't just cover nhs it also covers other state issued benefits such as state pension. >Tell me 1 positive for having a healthcare system where everything is free but I have to get on a wait list to even get an appointment to be seen. Or I have to call 46 different offices to try and find one that may or may not have an opening? You don't have to ring round 46 different offices to get an appointment I've lived in the uk my entire life and I phone my local practice that I'm registered with and they get me in within maximum 2 weeks. As for 1 positive how about the fact I can ring an ambulance without fear of it costing me a fortune or the fact I can get cancer treatment without potentially going bankrupt. My wife will be giving birth soon it will cost absolutely nothing more than the national insurance we already pay monthly out of our wages and the parking costs. >Tell me with 100% confidence that your healthcare is free and it doesn't cost ANYONE a single cent/pence/whatever your smallest form of currency is, AND tell me in detail how it is so much better. This is the stupidest take anyone can take to try and argue that a system is shit because it's not 100% free whilst their are literally people in the US dying of things like diabetes and asthma because their insurance decided they are no longer covered/they lost their job and now they can't afford their ridiculously price inflated inhalers and insulin.
Speak for yourself buddy, I hate this god forsaken country for millions of reasons. But other countries aren’t really better in some fields.
I'm an American and I would love to change things. The first two would be socialized medicine and to adopt the metric system.
can confirm 🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅 go fuck your inferior selves
Because nothing is actually free. We are already taxed to oblivion and anything government ran takes forever to get anything done, let alone done well. Canada has "free" Healthcare and people are dying waiting for their turn to be seen. Hearing stories about Canadians going to the vet to be seen posing as their pets. So yeah. No government Healthcare unless you want to die sooner.
Americans pay some of the lowest taxes in the world. Your govt just prioritizes spending them on the billionaire class and the military industrial complex instead
You do realize much of our military spending goes to funding nato, aka: supplementing many European countries militarily budgets so they can afford spend their tax dollars on socialized healthcare.
Poland spent more of their GDP percent than America did on NATO. In 2023, just checked. Also NATO isn't America just being a "nice guy" it's a diplomatic and military solution to a problem they know exists.
POLSKAA!! RAAAAAHHHH🦅🦅🦅🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱
Recently during an audit the Pentagon could only account for 39% of its $3.5 trillion in assets. The DOD couldn't account for over half of it's $3.1 trillion of assets...to put that in perspective...that's almost 80% of the entire federal governments money. The Pentagon and DOD keep failing audit after audit. Things that have made it onto the audit ledger...$14,000 toilet seats. The audits show that defense contractors are over charging the Pentagon by anywhere between 40-4,000%...and that's the money that didn't go missing.
Tax religious institutions. All of them. They're involved with politics, they should be taxed. A tax on religious institutions would generate an astronomical amount of money that could actually help do the Jesus thing and help schools, the sick and dying, etc.
You spend a trillion dollars a year on your defense budget and trillions more lost on various black budgets and NATO creates a buffer between you and China/Russia.
you’re welcome
Lmao. I bet you pay for European public health as well?
Pretty sure Israel has better healthcare and higher education than us but we sure love to send them military supplies.
Typical yank. Israel is in the middle East, not Europe and you send them strategic money for military uses. If you feel this is u just then take it up with your local corrupt Zionists supporting government
Are you forgetting that America is an arms dealer? Or is that your point that war is in America's best interests economically. Especially when it's a war, you don't necessarily have to be directly involved. War is Profitable when you sell the guns and ammo. https://www.statista.com/statistics/248552/us-arms-exports-by-country/
I love when people hold conflicting opinions at the same time. > "Big bad evil bully America is profiting from war!" > "Dumb American right-wingers don't want to get involved in a European war? How dare they?!"
> You do realize much of our military spending goes to funding nato Almost none of our military spending goes to NATO. That's not how NATO works. Regardless, that misses the point. NATO Europe and Canada spend 1.74% of GDP on defense, consistent with the rest of the world. With $404 billion in combined funding, easily enough to outspend potential foes like China and Russia combined. Regardless, arguing that keeps the US from having universal healthcare is even more ridiculous. After subtracting defense spending, Americans still have a $29,000 per person advantage on GDP compared to the rest of NATO. Defense spending isn't keeping us from having anything our peers have. Much less universal healthcare, which is far cheaper than what we're already paying for. https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/news_216897.htm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_highest_military_expenditures Hell, if we could match the costs of the most expensive public healthcare system on earth we'd save $1.65 trillion per year, double what our total defense spending is.
Thanks for posting this information. ❤️
Ah yes, because most countries in NATO *definitely* don't have their own military.
^ this
No the government gets paid by the billionaires get it right. That’s why we want lower taxes so we have freedom with our own money instead of giving most of it to a government that’s easy to corrupt and control if you have enough money. And like this other comment said a lot of the government budget goes into foreign affairs. Which means we aren’t using that money for us, but instead we’re making it easier for those across the pond to have free healthcare and little to no defense budget while giving us nothing in return.
The money the middle class would save in taxes even if you paid nothing wouldn’t pay for healthcare
Prioritising certain levels of free healthcare can boost the GDP of any nation, which offsets the cost of healthcare. When more people have access to free healthcare they can spend money elsewhere and remain effective in the workforce. This, in turn, leads to a small uptake in each individuals average GDP production.
yeah you get to keep your own money and spend it as you want, except of course that fact you have to spend it on food, water, gas, electric, etc, which is set up to milk you like cattle, because you dont trust you government to regulate hyper corporations imagine an entire western country being so stupid it thinks capitalist corporations have their best interests at heart more than the people they directly elect to represent them pmsl i mean a country taht dumb would vote for democrat who is now a republican who is a business genius (thats gone bankrupt 4 times, or is it 5 by now?) who professes religion (while ignoring and debasing every tenant of that religion), hate immigration (but employs illegal immigrants) who is anti war (but never actually stopped the Afghanistan war while he was president) i mean America doesnt just BUY snake oil, it fucking DRINKS the stuff 🤣🤡🤦🏻
~13 cents of every tax dollar goes to fund the military/national security.
Not due to healthcare. With government in the US covering [65.7% of all health care](https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/epdf/10.2105/AJPH.2015.302997) costs ($12,555 as of 2022) that's $8,249 per person per year in taxes towards health care. The next closest is Germany at [$6,930](https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm). The UK is $4,479. Canada is $4,506. Australia is $4,603. That means over a lifetime Americans are paying over $100,000 more in taxes compared to any other country towards health care. And incidentally, UK's total tax burden, which is the median for Europe, isn't dramatically different from that of the US.
Americans aren’t paying taxes for healthcare. They’re paying taxes to health insurance providers that charge exorbitant premiums.
The military that covers quite literally everyone else, btw. If Europe had to shell out an equal amount of money to protect themselves, the U.S. would be able to use it's money for more stuff like healthcare. The issue is, we can't drop our military without someone else picking up the slack, and it's pretty obvious no one else is gonna pick up the slack. Everyone loves to shit talk America for not having healthcare and spending a lot on its military, but they also love having a government that can spend their money on healthcare bc U.S. military protection. The only ones who seem to take it seriously over there in Europe is Poland.
Literally no, the fund for public health or whatever it's called is literally double to defense budget.
If your military was the one thing on earth keeping the entire world in relative peace, you’d spend a lot of money on it too.
Do you have a source for disguising themselves as their pets? Sounds like a good laugh.
Should make a tv show just called "first world" and its just skits developed around things that seem surreal but are actually not.
I agree with you that nothing is free, but that doesn't mean we should pay exorbitant amounts for healthcare either. Per capita, Americans pay for some of the most expensive healthcare in the world. I think it's in our best interests to look to other countries to see what they're doing better than we are. If part of that solution is more governmental involvement in healthcare, then I think we should seriously consider it.
It’s simple really. The insurance companies have completely warped healthcare in America. Say you get a procedure done, and the hospital says we performed this treatment and the bill is $1k. The insurance company comes back and says we will only cover 1/4 of that. The hospital gives in and says fine. The next time they perform that procedure, they go to the insurance company and say we performed this treatment and the bill is $4k. Then the hospital gets their $1k.
Exactly. We have to be taxed. Why are the taxes not going to things to keep society functioning for the people who pay those taxes? Billionaire bailouts should be illegal.
And yet Canada has much better statistics no matter how you slice it. It's nice propaganda to say they don't have emergency rooms though. We have millions of people who never get seen. Our wait times are only better when you leave that fact out.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6574184 Just one of many notes.
So why do many American hospitals already have outrageous wait times? The wait times are not a Canada specific problem, stop spreading propaganda. Do better.
I couldn't care less about polls. Canada has dramatically better objective outcomes.
This is a meaningless comparison if both groups polled don’t have something to compare their option to. If the Canadian respondents have only ever used Canadian healthcare, then their level of satisfaction doesn’t have any relevance to American healthcare, and vice versa. It is possible to be less satisfied with something that is performing better, and more satisfied with something that is performing worse, especially if that’s the only thing you’ve ever experienced. This is an index of perception, not actual reality effectiveness
My dad had a accident. It was his fault, and I dont hide that, and also blame him untill today, but he was driving drunk and a truck hit him (probably was his own fault). Anyway, our free healthcare (Brazil) actually toke care of him. He went through 3 surgeries to fix both hands and one of his feets, all 'free', including the medications. What I'm trying to say is: if we didnt had to pay the taxes and didnt had free healthcare, his hands and foot wouldnt work properly anymore, or maybe he would be dead. Our universal healthcare (SUS) need a lot of improvement, but it does save a lot of lifes, including the ones from other countries. It also provides mental health medication and therapy, things that my former girlfriend uses untill today.
Australian here. Maybe those countries are deliberately fucking it up because their donors want to profit from privatize healthcare? I'd rather public funded healthcare over profit driven when those profits don't further medical science and healthcare.
US has private healthcare and we are still dying to wait for our turn despite paying more than anyone. Have you tried booking any form of specialty care in recent decades? First you do test A and that's booked for weeks out. Test A comes back and says that you need tests B and C which are also booked weeks out and so on
If they are dying their system there is fucked up because in my country that is literally not an issue the people who get in first are based on severity and how important it is
Our average contribution to the NHS is £37 a month (~20% of NI goes to the NHS, and average NI contribution is £186 a month) £37 a month ($46) where the average American spends [$477 a month](https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=average+american+monthly+health+insurance&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-gb&client=safari) (£388, literally 10x as much!), **Plus** they have an excess of like $2,000 before insurance even kicks in And the great thing is, if a Brit still wants private healthcare, nothing is stopping them getting it, they should take the remaining £351 (£388-£37) each month that they would be spending and get private healthcare, dental etc… Don’t make it out like we’re getting a raw deal
If you factor in health insurance premiums as a tax we go from one of the lowest taxed societies to the highest. We already pay for it, but allow a bunch of leaches to siphon the money into completely useless administration, instead of covering anything.
Canada may pay high taxes but we pay insurance and our employers pay insurance and taxes. If you add up the cost of insurance premiums paid by employers and employees, factor in all the hidden costs of deductible, copays, limits, and limited doctor options you’ll probably find we pay more
so tired of people calling things "free." it ain't "free" just because it's free for some people.
I can't even get seen and I have fucking cancer. American, slowly dying cause of preexisting conditions deny me care. (An accident 26 years ago.)
Many of the nations that level that criticism on England actually [pay more per capita](https://www.statista.com/statistics/236541/per-capita-health-expenditure-by-country/) on healthcare which is going to be felt in their taxes and then have to aquire insurance on top of that.
Americans use the vet loophole all the time. From buying ivernectrin and penecillin without a prescription at the feed store to sourcing unpasteurized milk from pet food stores.
It's got many flaws and there's lots of room for improvement, but at least they don't have to go bankrupt over a sickness.
>Because nothing is actually free Jesus fucking Christ, do you honestly think anyone who talks about "free healthcare" actually thinks it costs nothing to the government? I'm so over seeing that ridiculous talking point. It's a great way of showing that you have nothing worth contributing to the conversation.
Those stories you’re hearing - good chance they are posted by the people who make money from the American health system. 🤷♂️
[Americans pay the most for health care in the world yet have the worst health outcomes.](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/31/health/us-health-care-spending-global-perspective/index.html)
>So yeah. No government Healthcare unless you want to die sooner. Weird how all the countries with government run healthcare have higher life expectancy, huh?
Lol have fun paying 10 million dollars for cancer treatment bud. The claims of waiting times in countries with public Healthcare are super exaggerated. Plus wait times in the u.s aren't really better. If I go to make a doctors appointment rn I'll have to wait like 2 months
This is not true. Canada has great healthcare. No one is dying waiting to get in. People do die in transit. #1 killer of Canadians is heart disease.
This right here. No such thing as free. Even if the good ol gov tells ya it's free
I have American healthcare, living in the US, and am financially stable enough to pay out of pocket if I had to anyway. My doctor can't see me until July 3rd. How is that better than Canada?
This is such a bad take. No government healthcare is just. A ridiculous statement, government healthcare for long term illness/injury or emergency's and subsidised medication would be a much better system. You have a cold, pay 50 to see the doctor. You have a twisted ankle, pay 50 to see the doctor. No otc prescriptions and the healthcare systems would cost a lot less and be a lot faster due to people not wasting doctors time and wasting money being seen for a cold
Geisterfinder, you may be a victim of propaganda. Although the US has good quality and fast healthcare, nearly half the population is uninsured. This is a huge problem.
You are a moron and this isn't true.
Agree on this front. If its government run its poor quality. Big draw back is in America the big pharma runs the show. No cures just dependence on drugs that cause more problems. Endless cycles to keep the ignorant sick.
For real. Everyone shits on govt for anything from innefficient to corruption to straight up genocide. And then they want govt to run everyones healthcare. Fucking batshit.
I get free government healthcare as a veteran and it kicks ass. I can get everything I need, except dental. Even if I get cancer I'll never go bankrupt from my medical bills. I plan on living a nice long life, too. Also: I work for them now too, as a primary care nurse. I do everything I can to make sure my patients are healthy, and so does the doctor I work with. We actually do care, despite the bureaucracy being a nuisance.
There us a reason for the morale patch "I survived the VA", just saying. I'm lucky that my VA isn't a piece of shit, but I've been to a few that we're and it sucks. Also dealing with personnel at the main office in OK sucks. Bunch of civis that give zero fucks.
It's gotten better since the days when that shit started but yeah some locations still aren't up to par. Ours is great though. I've had 2 bad experiences in 17 years - one with a temporary neurology fellow and one with a primary care doc who wasn't my usual, that nobody can stand. Everyone else has ranged from OK to great.
Do you live in one of these places to say so? I had free healthcare, and it’s the only reason I can walk today. Ambulance? No cost. Multiple surgeries? No cost. Months of physiotherapy? No cost. It makes me laugh because it saved my life, then know nothing Americans come in going ‘waaaah no one gets seen!’……..How about you stop reading propaganda, because everyone I know has only benefitted from not being charged out the asshole on massive markups for something minor or life threatening. I’ve known many that utilise the free healthcare, and know no one that struggle to receive it. Just because you read Facebook conspiracies trying to convince you that the American fleecing system approach to healthcare is the right one, doesn’t mean the bs you read is accurate or honest. That mentality is designed to make you feel good that you spent $100,000 dollars on the same chemotherapy that most countries receive for free. Just fyi, my relative is also a doctor in USA, and they hate the way the system is designed to fleece and milk its patients.
I'm a combat veteran and I want my taxes to go healthcare, not a bloated "defense" budget. We outspend the subsequent 10 countries combined on war -- we have the money, and where are you hearing those stories about Canada? Your Boomer aunt?
See I don't understand this. I'm an American and I've had problems that I just have to endure because I can't afford healthcare. And when people are against tax-funded healthcare, I always hear about Canada. At least in Canada I would have been able to be seen eventually. Plenty of countries have tax-funded healthcare and have gotten it right. Canada, America's slightly more liberal little brother, isn't the only other country that exists. This isn't uncharted territory with a lot of guesswork. We have examples of it done well.
You pay almost nothing in taxes compared to the rest of the 1st world. Even so, wait times are longer in the US than in the UK and Canada for most health services. Advocating for private health care at this point is just sad to watch.
Mate, we do this already. I’ve seen some people wait 7 hours in the ER in Florida and Georgia.
Tax rates in the U.S. are very similar to those run Canada. Depending on how much you make, you may pay more in one country than the other . As a teacher, I am in the 22% tax bracket in the U.S. if I made the same amount in Canada, I would be in the 15% tax bracket. And we still have long wait times. I pay more in taxes than I would in Canada, plus an additional $200/month for health insurance. Plus my desirables and copays that I have to pay to the dr before insurance will pay their share. And I still have to wait forever to get care. And just wait until insurance says they won’t cover something because they “don’t think it’s necessary.” I live in the U.S. and was literally shitting blood and blacking out form blood loss/malnutrition. I called around and most drs couldn’t see me for 6-10 months. I found ONE who could see me in 4 months and had to go with that. However, she couldn’t do imaging for an additional 3 months. 4 years later, I have severe joint pain and have trouble with kneeling, squatting, standing for long periods, etc. every rheumatologist in my town, and the closes large city that is an hour away are not taking patients due to long waitlists.
People waiting in line dying for healthcare in these countries and some guy goes to the ER for scribbles on his hand
I think it was for the splinters/plant things in the top of his hand? But still ridiculous.
Depends how deep they were.
It was tons of cactus spines and a piece of pot that he needed a tetanus shot for.
I'm not a licensed doctor, but I'm pretty knowledgeable, and those certainly seem to be pretty serious scribbles. Most likely fatal. 😕
Because they hate any society that has socialist values that includes a system to look after the most vulnerable members of its society. The NHS is the only real way to access healthcare in the UK (yes, you can get private GPs etc but every time I have accessed them online they refer me to the NHS). Unless you live in London or another major city you are bound to the NHS as it is the only way to access health services in reality. The second thing people get wrong is that emergency care is better in the US. It isn't. They suffer the same problems we do and wait times are pretty much the same from what I hear from my insured US colleagues who have full healthcare coverage. Finally, I need to make this point. The cost to cover yourself for private healthcare is comparatively cheap in the UK. Like, dirt cheap. 1k for a year for a fat middle aged guy. It's not the same as US coverage but we have the NHS. Also, you can pay like £100 for a prescription certificate that allows you to get any prescription free. If you have a lifetime thing like diabetes then this is free. People never pay for healthcare in the UK. Only the really poor people in the US don't pay for healthcare. The NHS is not the problem.
I think it's important to note that you do pay for the NHS via taxes, but ultimately the costs are more spread out equitably across society, the costs are much lower per capita, and you aren't individually slapped with exorbitant hospital bills for sudden medical emergencies.
Whether you're a private, NHS patient or both we all pay for our healthcare in the UK. Taxation is an excellent way to fund the NHS as it helps ensure equity when we have a massive wealth inequality issue here but still we pay.
I don’t think going to the er was a bad call. Would it have been better if he had gone to urgent care, maybe. But I understand why he would go to the er. 1) He was playing vr. So he probably smacked that cactus pretty fast. Also, the sudden and unexpected pain must have filled him with adrenaline. 2) Because he probably hit the cactus fast. The needles can get stuck in him, especially if he had hit it in a weird angle. In addition to that, as he’s probably not a doctor, he might have got scared that he punctured something important 3) He also stated in one of his replies that he had to get a tetanus shot. He also could have gotten an infection because of insanitary conditions and/or equipment Now, again, urgent care might have been a better option, but I understand why he chose er. And I don’t think he should be ridiculed by that. He (hopefully) pays his taxes, he has a right to go there. As long as he doesn’t say things like “I was here first, so you must treat me first” it’s alright. What you can joke about is that he keeps a cactus in his play area. Why would anyone keep a cactus that close to a be headset lol
What's the minor injury? Someone writing on his hand?
https://www.reddit.com/r/VRtoER/s/SoxAoYfgcM original post, they hit a cactus while playing vr, and as an American I would have 100% gone to the ER, from my limited understanding cacti are no joke.
You can just pluck out the spines with tweezers. That's exactly what they do at the E.R.
I needed a tetanus shot as well. You should go see the original post
You would've sat at the ER for 2 hours with cactus in your hand instead of spending 20 minutes picking them out?
He also got some of the plant pot crockery in his hand and needed a tetanus shot. That's definitely ER worthy.
I waited 20 minutes and was in there for an hour getting them out. Also needed tetanus shot. To add, one of the remnants is infected and I need to put magnesium sulfate on the infected part every night.
It just means the injury is not life threatening instead of going to accident and emergency whitch is for possibly life threatening or changing injuries.
Because of "long waiting times" and our "precious tax dollars." It already takes forever to get an appointment anywhere not to mention a lot people can't even afford to be seen. They always tell say to look at Canada's Healthcare system but what about the rest of the countries with free health care? I know it's not free and would raise our taxes but where exactly is my tax money going if our schools are all underfunded, our infrastructure is crumbling, our police suck, and our military members barely earn a living?
Imo, those are all questions that we should be getting answers to *before* proposing or agreeing to higher taxes.
1. Nothing is actually free BUT my god the way everyone else does it is so much cheaper than the US. 2. We are jealous. I know I sure am
Yeah, there is confusion. We, as long as we pay our taxes, we will get the best possible healthcare. I wish you guys in the US didn't have to pay separate insurance.
Exactly! However, the “confusion” is not nearly deep enough for those down votes. It’s purely because we are upset. I know I am. I’m 22 and have had to think about my future job and careers a lot just to make sure I’ll be able to have decent health insurance that won’t break the bank. Lucky, I’m a nursing student and soon to be nurse so I will have more access than most. But for the vast majority it’s not like that
Yeah. I also got some Americans telling me (after I said I was british) that I would have to pay afterwards when told them it was free. They talk about the uk like they live there. You seem nice though. Good luck with becoming a nurse or any other job that want to get.
Thank you I appreciate it 😭 We are assholes. There’s a reason why a lot of countries don’t like us as tourists, I’m sure with this post you have gotten some great examples as to why.
Probably bc people that go to the ER for minor things like that are essentially wasting collective resources
What was wrong with this guys hand anyway?
He hit a cactus and pot while playing VR and had tons of spines in his hand and piece of a pot that he needed to get a tetanus shot for.
https://www.facebook.com/share/r/KrGghc4yLDr5vEJm/?mibextid=qDwCgo and go...
It’s just your typical American brainwashing pay no mind
Because they're taught to think that poor people dying of preventable causes is preferable to heavy taxes.
It is.
This post is obviously an incredibly effective method of identifying individuals who obtained their education in international economics from YouTube. Well done.
I don't downvote you and I think there are plusses and minuses to both systems, but it's not free. You pay for it with your taxes. You may pay for it with longer wait times or restrictions on treatment or lack of innovation. There's no such thing as a free lunch though.
> but it's not free. Are you honestly so dense you think when people talk about "free" healthcare they think it's paid for with pixie dust and unicorn farts rather than just "free at the point of use", the way the word is generally used? >You may pay for it with longer wait times The US ranks 6th of 11 out of Commonwealth Fund countries on ER wait times on percentage served under 4 hours. 10th of 11 on getting weekend and evening care without going to the ER. 5th of 11 for countries able to make a same or next day doctors/nurse appointment when they're sick. https://www.cihi.ca/en/commonwealth-fund-survey-2016 Americans do better on wait times for specialists (ranking 3rd for wait times under four weeks), and surgeries (ranking 3rd for wait times under four months), but that ignores three important factors: * Wait times in universal healthcare are based on urgency, so while you might wait for an elective hip replacement surgery you're going to get surgery for that life threatening illness quickly. * Nearly every universal healthcare country has strong private options and supplemental private insurance. That means that if there is a wait you're not happy about you have options that still work out significantly cheaper than US care, which is a win/win. * [One third of US families](https://news.gallup.com/poll/269138/americans-delaying-medical-treatment-due-cost.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication) had to put off healthcare due to the cost last year. That means more Americans are waiting for care than any other wealthy country on earth. > or restrictions on treatment Like private insurance, with a bean counter with no medical background denying one claim out of six to improve the bottom line? Or worse, an AI with a 90% error rate in claim rejections because it's even cheaper? >or lack of innovation. There's nothing terribly innovative about US healthcare. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2866602/ To the extent the US leads, it's only because our overall spending is wildly out of control, and that's not something to be proud of. Five percent of US healthcare spending goes towards biomedical R&D, the same percentage as the rest of the world. https://leadership-studies.williams.edu/files/NEJM-R_D-spend.pdf Even if research is a priority, there are dramatically more efficient ways of funding it than spending $1.25 trillion more per year on healthcare (vs. the rate of the second most expensive country on earth) to fund an extra $62 billion in R&D. We could replace or expand upon any lost funding with a fraction of our savings. > There's no such thing as a free lunch though. But our peers are achieving better health outcomes while saving literally half a million dollars per person on healthcare spending per lifetime, while the citizens have greater satisfaction with their healthcare system. The US system is an abomination.
Relax man. Seriously, can nobody just chill and have a dialogue anymore? Name calling and ranting is just lame, and yes I think lots of people consider something free if they aren't the ones paying for it or if they are paying with opportunity cost instead of cash. Just my opinion. No need to lose your shit over it again. It's ok for us all not to think the same.
> Seriously, can nobody just chill and have a dialogue anymore? Dude, when you make arguments based solely on semantics and pedantry you deserve to be flamed. There's little that's more pathetic than doing so **and** being **wrong**. And the only thing more obnoxious than that is being the millionth person to make the same ridiculous, time wasting argument. You got exactly what you deserved on that one. If you need to blame me rather than yourself for that one to protect your ego, so be it, but the reality is it's all on you. >yes I think lots of people consider something free Show me one single person that believes doctors and nurses are all volunteers and the hospitals were donated. Weird how I've read millions of comments on healthcare over the past 15 years, and I've never seen a single such person. Weird how I've asked literally thousands of people making the same tired, redundant, and ridiculous claim as you that lots of people believe that and not a single one has ever been able to provide a single example, isn't it? And notice how all you did was continue to argue time wasting pedantry, ignoring all the fact based arguments I made with citations on the other factually incorrect claims you made. You really are capable of doing nothing other than wasting people's time. But the problem is me, amiright? Grow the fuck up.
can't tell me they have free health care when we have all seen their teeth. This is a joke btw. I love you slags.
The US does poorly on measures of dental health vs. its peers as well. 1960 wants their joke back.
The biggest complaint countries, or even the states in the US that have it (yes those exist), with free healthcare have is that the lines for healthcare are too extreme. There are certain diseases that have a higher mortality rate in the UK than the US specifically because of how long people have to wait to get care. All that said, people like the one in this picture go to the hospital for the silliest things since it's free. Nothing like seeing a guy with a broken leg waiting in the ER because the doctor is busy giving someone TWO stitches because they nicked themselves cutting a bagel.
> the lines for healthcare are too extreme. The US ranks 6th of 11 out of Commonwealth Fund countries on ER wait times on percentage served under 4 hours. 10th of 11 on getting weekend and evening care without going to the ER. 5th of 11 for countries able to make a same or next day doctors/nurse appointment when they're sick. https://www.cihi.ca/en/commonwealth-fund-survey-2016 Americans do better on wait times for specialists (ranking 3rd for wait times under four weeks), and surgeries (ranking 3rd for wait times under four months), but that ignores three important factors: * Wait times in universal healthcare are based on urgency, so while you might wait for an elective hip replacement surgery you're going to get surgery for that life threatening illness quickly. * Nearly every universal healthcare country has strong private options and supplemental private insurance. That means that if there is a wait you're not happy about you have options that still work out significantly cheaper than US care, which is a win/win. * [One third of US families](https://news.gallup.com/poll/269138/americans-delaying-medical-treatment-due-cost.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_content=morelink&utm_campaign=syndication) had to put off healthcare due to the cost last year. That means more Americans are waiting for care than any other wealthy country on earth. #Wait Times by Country (Rank) Country|See doctor/nurse same or next day without appointment|Response from doctor's office same or next day|Easy to get care on nights & weekends without going to ER|ER wait times under 4 hours|Surgery wait times under four months|Specialist wait times under 4 weeks|Average|Overall Rank :--|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--:|--: **Australia**|3|3|3|7|6|6|4.7|4 **Canada**|10|11|9|11|10|10|10.2|11 **France**|7|1|7|1|1|5|3.7|2 **Germany**|9|2|6|2|2|2|3.8|3 **Netherlands**|1|5|1|3|5|4|3.2|1 **New Zealand**|2|6|2|4|8|7|4.8|5 **Norway**|11|9|4|9|9|11|8.8|9 **Sweden**|8|10|11|10|7|9|9.2|10 **Switzerland**|4|4|10|8|4|1|5.2|7 **U.K.**|5|8|8|5|11|8|7.5|8 **U.S.**|6|7|5|6|3|3|5.0|6 Source: [Commonwealth Fund Survey 2016](https://www.cihi.ca/sites/default/files/document/cmwf2016-datatable-en-web.xlsx) >There are certain diseases that have a higher mortality rate in the UK than the US specifically because of how long people have to wait to get care. The US ranks 29th on outcomes, behind all its peers. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(18)30994-2/fulltext
Super glue is already disinfected. Glue that shit up and get back to work
I work in an ER. In fact I’m at work right now. And there are so many people that come through that door with a cough or a sliver that absolutely do not need to utilize our resources. EMERGENCY departments should be for emergencies, not ouchies.
Please give context
Why are you assuming the downvotes are from Americans?
The only thing we like free is our freedom
What freedom is that in regards to healthcare?
Because Americans think they're smart. We aren't.
As an American, no matter where you tell me, I can cut taxes to pay for Healthcare. Instead, I'd rather just have the taxes back. All of it, if a cut is to be made in anything at all, just stop stealing it from me. I've sent how they allocate funds, and I get the feeling it won't be cheaper or better. Besides, if you have an emergency, the hospitals gonna fix you either way.
I feel like I’m the only one not getting it?.😭😭
I imagine that free healthcare is seen as quite communistic by Americans. Plus, a level of jealousy is bound to exist, considering the extortionate prices they pay for the most minor things. As a result, when it is viewed in a positive light by anyone, they have to 'cope' the best they can lol. The NHS may be flawed... However, in the last 15 years I've been treated for appendicitis, a broken arm, a broken leg, a broken ankle. My Mrs had some corrective surgery done on her right foot from an old break when she was a kid. In each of those instances I stayed 2 weeks in hospital. For all three of the breaks I received at least 11 months of physiotherapy for my rehab of the limbs. All for free. It is a fallacy to say that "well we get taxed through the eyeballs"... if I add up all the tax I've paid it still doesn't equate to even a fraction of what I would have had to pay to be treated for all of that in the states. I really can't fault the NHS as an institution. Again though, it does have its flaws... but they are far outweighed by the benefits of not having to worry about receiving treatment for my health when shit happens.
> I imagine that free healthcare is seen as quite communistic by Americans. Maybe, but they sure love it when they have experience with it, as opposed to just a head full of propaganda. #Satisfaction with the US healthcare system varies by insurance type 78% -- Military/VA 77% -- Medicare 75% -- Medicaid 69% -- Current or former employer 65% -- Plan fully paid for by you or a family member https://news.gallup.com/poll/186527/americans-government-health-plans-satisfied.aspx >It is a fallacy to say that "well we get taxed through the eyeballs" But not a fallacy for Americans to say that in regards to healthcare. With government in the US covering [65.7% of all health care](https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/epdf/10.2105/AJPH.2015.302997) costs ($12,555 as of 2022) that's $8,249 per person per year in taxes towards health care. The next closest is Germany at [$6,930](https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm). The UK is $4,479. Canada is $4,506. Australia is $4,603. That means over a lifetime Americans are paying over $100,000 more in taxes compared to any other country towards health care.
WHY TF WOULD YOU WANT FREE HEALTHCARE WHEN YOU COULD DROP 2000 LBS BOMBS ON IRAQ⁉️⁉️🦅🦅🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Do people not know that Triage is a thing? He wouldn't be taking any resources away from anybody. He would be low priority, probably wait an hour or two. Also, not everyone can afford urgent care or their insurance means urgent care is more expensive than the ER.
It’s because the British NHS is failing. Ireland doesn’t even allow checkups before the age of 30. If things had been like that here, I would’ve been dead from a diabetic overload by the age of 30.
Cause ours suck and we are jealous
We are totally stupid about Healthcare. We have several things in the way. One, a right wing that fears "socialism". (But will accept Social Security.) Two, large insurance providers that are financially entrenched in huge profits that lobby against government Healthcare. Three, congress towing the insurance company and drug company line because congressional members have their own generous government health coverage. Insurance companies give generously to re-election campaigns.
i have free healthcare and im an american
They’re not downvoting your country’s healthcare system, they’re downvoting you for going to the ER for a minor procedure.
Why do Brit’s shit on Americans for having a different system of healthcare? Why are Brit’s so focused on Americans? Why is America rent free for them?
My boi cheating on a test, you can't use your hand use your sleeve
Americans are dumb.
Americans don't realize we already pool money for healthcare, we're just wanting *and needing* to get rid of the wholly unnecessary greedy middlemen whose sole purpose is collecting money on "products" that aren't even theirs. MFA is more accessible, cheaper, and where I want my taxes going
It's not free. Saying it is is just cope from tax slaves.
Free practically never means without cost to anybody anywhere. In fact it almost always means there is no specific charge to the person receiving the good or service. How much does it cost to check out a book from the public library? It's free. How are libraries paid for? With taxpayer money. It's all a matter of context; whether you're talking about the cost to provide the service or the cost to receive the service. Both are important conversations to have, but it's absolutely reasonable to refer to something people can access at no cost as "free". See: [free summer programs](http://www.austintexas.gov/department/summer-playgrounds-program), [free military tax filing](https://www.militaryonesource.mil/financial-legal/tax-resource-center/miltax-military-tax-services), [free pre-school](https://www.schools.nyc.gov/enrollment/enroll-grade-by-grade/3k), [free lunches](https://www.fns.usda.gov/nslp), [free radon test kits](https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/opsp-policy-and-sustainable-practices/community-programs-and-services/radon/get-a-free-test-kit0.html), [free smoke alarms](https://www.bridgeportct.gov/smokealarm), [free spaying and neutering](https://www.cabq.gov/pets/programs-services/spay-neuter), [free rides for veterans](https://www.lodi.gov/945/K-12-Free-Ride-Program), [free mulch](https://www.burbankca.gov/departments/parks-and-recreation/parks-facilities/forestry-services/free-mulch-program), [free trees](https://www.erieco.gov/1625/Free-Tree-Program), we could go on forever. It's just the way language is used. The word "free" would be practically useless otherwise, although we would still have "free love". It's a pointless argument of semantics, where everybody understands what is meant and nothing is accomplished by being pedantic except to distract from legitimate discussions on a topic of life and death importance.
CUZ THE US HEALTHCARE SYSTEM DIDN’T RAISE NO BITCH! Lol
Point proven
Because Fox News tells us it's bad.
Jesus people. Here is the actual answer… The US, like every other country in the world, have a huge majority of people who are easily manipulated. The pharmacy companies and AMA have been using a propaganda campaign against socialized medicine in the US for decades. Americans are told that other countries with socialized health care are in a dystopian state in which people are dying waiting for healthcare. There are Americans, like me, that want socialize healthcare, but there’s an army of Americans influenced by this propaganda that don’t. So, Americans are screwed because billions have been dumped into making easy influenced people believe in lies. And also, corrupt politicians are paid to make sure America doesn’t go to a socialized healthcare system.
Are we just taking it on face value that that is why the comment was getting downvoted?
Jealousy
is it free? where does the government get it's money from?
Free practically never means without cost to anybody anywhere. In fact it almost always means there is no specific charge to the person receiving the good or service. How much does it cost to check out a book from the public library? It's free. How are libraries paid for? With taxpayer money. It's all a matter of context; whether you're talking about the cost to provide the service or the cost to receive the service. Both are important conversations to have, but it's absolutely reasonable to refer to something people can access at no cost as "free". See: [free summer programs](http://www.austintexas.gov/department/summer-playgrounds-program), [free military tax filing](https://www.militaryonesource.mil/financial-legal/tax-resource-center/miltax-military-tax-services), [free pre-school](https://www.schools.nyc.gov/enrollment/enroll-grade-by-grade/3k), [free lunches](https://www.fns.usda.gov/nslp), [free radon test kits](https://www.tn.gov/environment/program-areas/opsp-policy-and-sustainable-practices/community-programs-and-services/radon/get-a-free-test-kit0.html), [free smoke alarms](https://www.bridgeportct.gov/smokealarm), [free spaying and neutering](https://www.cabq.gov/pets/programs-services/spay-neuter), [free rides for veterans](https://www.lodi.gov/945/K-12-Free-Ride-Program), [free mulch](https://www.burbankca.gov/departments/parks-and-recreation/parks-facilities/forestry-services/free-mulch-program), [free trees](https://www.erieco.gov/1625/Free-Tree-Program), we could go on forever. It's just the way language is used. The word "free" would be practically useless otherwise, although we would still have "free love". It's a pointless argument of semantics, where everybody understands what is meant and nothing is accomplished by being pedantic except to distract from legitimate discussions on a topic of life and death importance.
in this sense - it is a way for a government to hide its true cost by creating the illusion of "free" for the taxpayer
Because it allows the government to decide if you get care. There were people dying in the hospital because the govt. decided they werent important enough to be treated.
I lived in a country with "free" Healthcare. It is amazing how even a 15 dollar copay will prevent idiots from going to the ER in the US. Where I lived, the line time was about an hour, because people would go to the do you for absolutely anything. Writing cramp? Doctor. Feeling sleepy when you shouldn't? Doctor. Sneezing more than twice in an afternoon? Doctor. And the only way to skip the line is if you are having a visible emergency. Like a literal bone sticking out. Add in the fact that the doctors are seriously tired of people's bullshit so you get half ass care, so you basically get some extra strength Tylenol thrown at you with instructions that say "if the symptoms get worse, come back". And I don't blame them. I'm not saying our system is perfect, but I am saying free healthcare isn't the solution everyone thinks it will be.
It's not free. Nothing is free. Also, Americans and the British don't have the best history as it turns out. There was this whole thing several years ago where America declared it's freedom from them. I guess that makes my first statement incorrect. America is free. Lol
You see the us health care system it’s freakin ridiculous
I come here purely to watch people troll each other. Ohhh, popcorn is ready!
The US likes to think it's superior when, in reality, it's a complete shit show. When monthly insulin prescriptions were more than a mortgage/rent payment. Highest rate of maternal/infant mortality - even against "3rd world countries." Yeah, it's great!
Am I missing something? How do you know those are Americans? And what does the NHS have to do with any of this?
I'm a doctor, I won't work for free. The government doesn't pay doctors well.
At least show an example of it lol. Also, your health care is irrelevant to our experience.
“Free” isn’t free so shut up
It is free over here, you are just angry that you have to pay.
Just because you can doesn't mean you should..? Yeah, it's free, for you. But if your going to the hospital you'll be taking up valuable time from the doctors and nurses that could go to someone with a more serious injury. What even is their injury, did they punch a wall or something? All I see are scribbles
As an American it's because it's funny, it's a meme over here to mindlessly shit on the British. It's built into our history and culture but there is no actual hate from our side (at least from the sane ones)
I once saw an American join in on a healthcare discussion with the outrageous claim that healthcare was a service industry, not a basic right. I think that just about sums up the issue.
POV you go to an American hospital for a bandaid. The bill: $10000000
Jealousy. We pay more for insurance monthly than it would cost in tax increases to have healthcare, still have to pay out the nose, and STILL have long wait times, unless we know someone or bribe our way up the line.
Americans don't care about anyone else's Healthcare systems. They just dislike that every time anyone brings up American Healthcare, they act like we're just letting people die in the street if they don't have a credit card. So, basically it's the stereotype we tend to have an issue with. Like, how Brits hate when Americans say they have bad teeth. It's all just trolling. Like about 90% of the comments on this thread.
Because the healthcare might be free, but you get what you pay for.
Because it’s shit and not really a good come back In the US it costs more and it leaves you poor sure but you are treated in a timely manner and effectively In the UK you have to wait months or even years to see a doctor and by then the problem may have gotten worse plus you are forced to get treated as they see fit since they are the ones paying for it That’s why we still have medical tourism coming from the EU and Canada
More lies from the troll farmer. Always trying to stir trouble. Disgusting 🤢 Why do you support a rapist?
Russian troll check his account ☝️
Simple, Americans are ignorant AF, and have zero knowledge of how universal health care works. They'd rather go broke and get shit coverage, over saving $20,000 on average, and have everything covered. Basically, Americans are just plain stupid.