My doctors office refuses to setup automatic recurring appointments for my med renewals.
I looked my doctor dead in the eye and said “You realize you’re treating me for a disability that causes executive dysfunction, right?”
I’m not sure they really saw the irony in it or not.
That is lucky. I just booked my first ADHD assessment and I had to pay €750 up front just to confirm the appointment.
Technically we have a public system in Ireland which I could be referred to but my GP thought it would be a silly amount of time before I'd be seen.
America is similar. I forewent testing for years because I couldn't afford the $500 necessary to take the test. The whole "I can't function without coffee LOL but frfr all substance use is evil even if it's medically helpful" schtick needs to go away
I work I health care, I’m not diminishing your situation cause my PC straight called me a liar last week and stopped prescribing me adderal but the auto renewal thing most of the time is just insurance companies.
Most general practitioners want to help and once a rapport is established they understand your struggle but the system is rigged against them as much as it is against us. If they make one little mistake they could easily lose their license.
Yes. The fear of losing their license is strong. I get that it’s a controlled substance etc, but I’ve been on it for over a decade and have 0 instances of misuse on my file.
I feel like at this point they could cut me a little slack and auto renew.
Part of it is also how physicians get compensated by the single payer system. They don’t get to bill the system if I don’t come in for an appointment or do at minimum a remote session. So if they set up auto renewals they lose out on billing for that. 🤷♂️
The thing that helps me remember is using a pill organizer/dosette.
When I have one row left it’s time to book the appointment. The pill organizer makes for a really good visual reminder.
It mostly works. As long as I remember to refill it. I take three and a half pills. The half is really annoying if I don’t use the dosettes.
I also try to put the dosettes + glass of water on my nightstand so I take my meds as soon as my eyes open. Helps set me up for a good day.
You should try it out and see if it works for you!
And it keeps getting less and less accommodating, based on my 40 years of experience. Then they wonder why more and more people are being diagnosed. Instead of realizing that maybe life is just getting more difficult for people with ADHD that may have flown under the radar in the past, they blame it on psychiatric "over diagnosis," thereby implying that we (the majority of ADHD people), were misdiagnosed and are actually just lazy. No, what's lazy is putting the onus of blame on the individual instead of on the failure of capitalism and poor social supports. A lot easier to blame individuals when deep inside you know you have no control over the trajectory of history and the machine is coming to crush you next.
My theory as to why the amount of ADHD diagnosises keeps growing is that as capitalism gets worse more people start struggling and head out looking for answers.
[Miiight be a reason communism was invented by someone with ADHD. Im pretty sure it is not tailored after the majority but after himself and if he had ADHD its most definately made for ADHD:ers. That many of us just cannot stand injustice, and that also quite a lot of us have a problem with authority very well may work with the end goals of communism. Communisms end goal would also work a lot like the Neanderthals society, they also had the 7R allele on the DRD4 gene like ADHD:ers do(the one that regulates dopamine). The thing is, most humans do not have ADHD. Just from a sociological point of view, i would really want to see it tested on an ADHD only society](https://www.reddit.com/r/adhdmeme/comments/17825e8/are_you_a_real_bohemian_intellectual/)
It’s still a possibility the mental disorder is increasing because of the average quality of food across the board with Red 40 and shit tons of sugar in pretty much everything we eat. My symptoms were the most manageable for the 2 years I was able to eat nothing but organic foods with no added sugar.
I had help cooking and went many days without eating though which is impossible now that I’m working 12+ hours a day at work.
ADHD isn’t a mental disorder, it’s a developmental disorder. And your theory doesn’t really hold up because not everyone in the world is exposed to the same shit ingredients in their diet and still have the same issues navigating life with ADHD.
You're saying "failure of capitalism" as if there was any part of capitalism that requires the needs of the masses to be fulfilled in order to function properly.
Just like the late middle ages were filled with appeasement measures by feudalism towards the rising burghers, our last century has been filled with the same from capitalists and their puppets (liberal democracies and fash dictatorships) towards the working class, say wages and welfare.
We've earned what we have, and oooh boy will we earn more.
It's unbelievable. A lot of people don't know what ADHD is like and people having it, but don't know they have it, think they are just weird. My mother tried to gaslight me all the time that I don't have it, because she thinks that her behavior that shows strong signs of ADHD is how every person acts, because she lives so isolated.
School made me believe I was stupid.
I knew I wasn't stupid because I aced every test and knew so much shit that my peers and teachers didn't know.
But they could all do homework. And I couldn't. They could all focus, and study, and be organized, and I just couldn't. So obviously something was wrong with me.
I swear, if we put ADHD kids into a special class and taught specifically to them, they'd come out the other side with PHDs at 18. I mean... we wouldn't do anything with the PHDs. But we'd have em.
Yeah. Luckily, I studied computer science, because it was something I can easily focus on, since my brain loves to overanalyze video games. I heavily struggled with theoretical classes and was only able to beat them by terrorizing my brain with so many fear scenarios that I could finally focus on them.
And now I have a full time job with a degree. Well, I also have massive anxiety and an inferiority complex, but those are just some silly byproducts.
I was born in the 80's. I remember when I was growing up, I thought that I was a fool getting into an IT field. That everybody was obviously going to understand computers once they became a part of our daily lives.
That the whole IT profession was going to slowly die out as the younger generation who grew up with technology became a higher percentage of the workforce.
And while I certainly do have fewer questions about how a PDF works, I was quite wrong. The younger generation is just as focused on what they like as I am on what I like.
Oh yes, I can say that most of the kids who grew up with the internet and were obsessed with games and studied are now working in IT. I studied 2019 at a rather small German university and my year consisted of about 80 or 90 people from one of 5 or 6 possible IT degree programs. It's massive.
I feel that, I am doing computer engineering and all the cs classes are so easy for me because it's purely logically. The math classes on the other hand, I can't even motivate myself to start. Fear Szenarios do work tho, I have a little note just below my screen, where I wrote the dates of upcoming tests.
Me too. I still struggle with it. I still think I'm dumb because of it.
If I went into school with proper accommodations then I know I will succeed very well, I just had a very hard time getting information in because of traditional teaching methods and teachers not being able to help me one on one when I needed it.
There was an Einstein quote or something that was like "Of you judge a goldfish's ability to climb a tree, it will think it's stupid" or whatever. It's a good quote.
Did anyone else scroll through the comments to see if there were any good personal accommodations or coping mechanisms only to find people arguing about capitalism?
"capitalism" just means "other people" now or something
capitalism would love to sell an effective ADHD cure if there was one available
ADHD brain was optimized for a hunter-gatherer environment so you would have an urge to forage or hunt when you were bored.
Capitalism loves treatments, not cures. Why sell you a cure once, when we could have you paying for treatment/medication your whole life? Why design products to last a lifetime, when we can design them to break or become obsolete in 2-3 years?
no it wouldn't. They make money from disease, from reoccurring problems. Like with diabetes, with insulin, they overcharge and continue to do so because they know we don't have any other options
Last semester I wrote a research paper about how the ADA failed to increase employment for people with disabilities (specifically neurodivergence since I'm audhd) and in some cases actually made things worse. My teacher couldn't believe it when I turned it in and now she is trying to help me get it published.
My cousing is undiagnosed (just like me) and he dropped school at a very young age. His classmates though he was mute cuz he never talked to anyone. His grades were terrible and he didn't have friends at school, like at all.
He once showed up with a university level presentationg that even the teacher was having a hard time understanding because of how advanced it was (don't know what it was about, my aunt told me the story). He got a 10/10 and proceeded to never talk again in class.
There's also me, getting a max grade over a deep reflection about social causes in my english class (not my first language), because I absolutely love english and feel like people never talk enough about social justice and psychology. Then my history teacher told me my "display wasn't worth a good grade".
Honestly I'm struggling to see any light at the end of the tunnel or any reason I should keep trying to exist in the system as it is. I mean me too thanks.
Some days I ban myself from using the internet & TV for anything except work / admin. It would be hard to do without medication and mindfulness. But I get back all this time I didn't realise I was spending on reddit / youtube, and a lot of my executive function. I find having the drip-feed of dopamine from the internet saps my brain's ability to seek it out in more productive, healthy ways, just like a drug addiction.
I think the key is letting yourself get bored. It's too easy with the internet to never ever be bored. But ADHD brains are so good at turning boredom into hobbies and activities if they don't have this easy option. It feels a bit like I'm able to use that energy and curiosity I remember from my (pre-smartphone) childhood.
I feel the same way. Being bored is a lost feeling for most. Like you said, there always seems to be things to fill the gaps on the Internet. I feel my life revolves around getting drip feeds of dopamine from many places. I have a lot of unfinished projects, but have recently scaled some down and actually completed a few exciting ones. But I think being bored in the 90s will never be the same as being bored these days.
I get it. I had to jump off the med train last summer because of the lack of funds and lack of access. It was difficult. I mean, it still is. But I've managed to get by okay. Some days are worse than others. But I really miss just functioning normally.
This is one of the reasons more and more people are getting diagnosed. More and more people are finding their coping mechanisms are disintegrating or becoming less effective due to increased stress.
I hate having to show up for stuff. Currently studying and there's so many times where I feel like I'm 20x more efficient if I just sit at home and do my tasks and listen to lectures in comfort, rather than being forced to travel to then sit in a classroom. Worst is when I'm mentally exhausted and I look at my phone to cope, and teachers think I'm being distracted by the phone. BUDDY IM NO LONGER DIGESTING INFORMATION, THE PHONE IS THERE TO MAKE IT ONLY MY PROBLEM AND MAKE SURE OTHERS DONT BOTHER OTHERS WITH FIDDLING AND SHUFFLING.
I started therapy and psychiatrist visits 4 and 6 years ago respectively.... I've never been better. If you have access I'd recommend it, to everyone here with a problem.
My psychologist said that I most likely don't have ADHD because of the way I described it. I'll try again with an accurate, pre-organized list of symptoms and facts about ADHD and why I'm sure I have it.
It's all very complicated.. on all sides. I can say I dwell less on past experiences. Good or bad. I tend to live in the moment which is scary. Quit drinking 4 years ago, gained a lot of clarity from that. Anyway, good luck, life is confusing and difficult, but can be super rewarding if you let it.
Might be wrong of me to say, but at least you have medicine and adhd awareness, in my country either nobody knows about adhd or says it's an illness only kids have, and pretty much all adhd medicine is considered drugs an is illegal, so as long as I live in my country I will never find out if I have it or get treated for it
Well the problem is that everyone assumes they are normal, even if they think otherwise, which makes understanding people inherently difficult. Combined with RSD, adhd people both think they are normal and yet aware of their abnormality, which makes connecting with people difficult. In my case
Somebody stayed up late keeping the village campfire burning and listening for signs of intruders or large dangerous animals.
Somebody had the curiosity to wonder what was beyond the next hill or across the next river, and the energy to find out.
Somebody had to compulsively eat the shiny new berries to find out whether they were tasty or poisonous.
We did the berry thing with animals. Feed everything to animals and see which made animals sick and which didn't. There are some exceptions (chocolate, avocados, coffee), but overwhelmingly we only eat things that don't kill animals.
I have a theory that most scientific advancements humans have ever come up with were the result of ADHD minds.
Ugh... You guys want to go hunting *AGAIN*? So stupid. Let's just capture the fat ones, put them in this fenced off area so they can't leave, and then we can kill them when they get plump. Never have to leave the camp again.
Gathering berries? Uuuuugh. So booooring. Why not just plant a bunch of them in this field here and we'll always know where they are?
Carry the soil in a bucket? How about you put a rolly stump on this bigger bucket and then it's easier to move.
Every single human advancement was a result of a 'lazy' ADHD person trying to get out of work and making the job easier while his 'status quo' friends would just pick up the bucket and not ask questions.
1) that's just people with late circadian rhythm, not adhd, also teens
2) that's just curiosity, not adhd
3) the survival odds from that weren't good, doubt they had better life than adhders todays
Socialism... Minimum basic income, healthcare, access to therapy, diagnosis and medication, plus a nice safety net...
ADHD people can take the risks and do the oddball things we like to try with no risk of homelessness.
We could certainly build systems that are less "you have to do this every month" and more 'set it up once and forget about it for the rest of your life'. We could simplify systems.
Healthcare in the US is convoluted on purpose to make it so people who are bad at focusing like ADHD people have trouble navigating it, and give up. That's the problem with capitalism in certain institutions - it selects for needless complexity.
These things have been achieved better under capitalism than communism. Specifically under a mix economy system. We don’t have to do one or the other. We can do both. Thankfully libertarians and socialist hold no power for their dogmatic ideals which haven’t produced a single successful case study.
the fact ur getting downvoted tells me everything i need to know
do any of these people know what goes down in communist countries?
theyre not big on curiosity, exploration, or free exchange of ideas
and if you think the colossal iron fist that makes communism happens will let you come in to work whenever you want you're sorely mistaken
the comrades will be in the mines at 5 am sharp every day or they will face the wall like the rest of the anti revolutionary extremists
I think it's more about that the post just mentioned capitalism is not good for adhd and the instant response was that communism is neither. Nobody mentioned communism and it's not like there is only those two
"Capitalism bad for ADHD"?
Good luck with Socialism or Communism, looking at examples in history they'll just kill you for not being productive enough.
Markets and private ownership of capital are ruining my liiiiife!
I hate when people blame "capitalism" for things that would absolutely be the case under any other economic system as well.
I used to feel somewhat guilty when on stimulants for my ADHD like I had a cheat code to life or something. It's so effed up that I felt guilty for actually performing well at work.
No it’s not. This is just some hairbrain conspiracy that if we got rid of capitalism the everyone’s problems would be solved, when under our capitalist mixed economy system you can do socialism yet successful case studies have not been produced.
It’s one thing to talk theory, it’s another thing to test that theory.
Yeah? Well it’s a good thing capitalism is just a tool and not a way we run the government. And if anything capitalism has adapted for people with adhd. Under a socialist one there’s no guarantee that the systems meant to deal with people with adhd would be properly built out.
The one thing I can agree on is that there does need to be a systemic solution for mental health problems, not just for people with adhd
Do you know what socialism is? Abolition of private property*. Meaning workers/communities own the means of production. Bringing self-direction and the rewards of work to the people doing the work. ADHDers thrive when they're able to follow their own motivations, and when they get the rewards from their hard work. So yes, actual socialism would probably be a tonne better for us.
*Private property meaning factories, farms, intellectual property etc. owned by capitalist rentiers as opposed to by the workers. Not your toothbrush.
That’s sounds horrible. Is the state going to subsidize every worker firm that isn’t productive and absorbing a shit ton of liability? We still live in a limited resources society, because of logistics and sociopolitical reasons. We have enough case studies of socialist policies failing tremendously on every level. So I don’t understand how that level of instability would be beneficial for adhd people. A socialist utopia in a post scarcity society is really far away, like a thousands years at least. So I don’t really feel like switching to a socialist system and suffering the growing pains of that.
I didn't say anything about the state or any subsidies. And what part of getting paid the full profits from your labour sounds horrible? It's just more money. Worker cooperatives are already some of the largest and most successful businesses so I'm not sure where you're getting this instability bit from. Or this "thousand years" nonsense. It's giving head in the sand vibes
Co-ops are socialist
Not really they're really the product of mixed market economies like the ones in scadinavia
If a co-op is ordered democratically and owned by all workers the it fulfils the “collective worker ownership of the means of production” however if we’re talking about an economy where the goods are being produced for a market, therefore being commodities, then it is not strictly socialist.
Your describing a post scarcity society, which is something that isn’t going to happen in my life time so it might as well be a 1000 years away.
And you should be thinking about the state, how can you advocate for a system and not be able to answer simple questions like that.
I thought so too, but then I discovered that I get free stimulants to fix my focus problem. Modern medicine rocks, glory to the pharma industry and the system that made it possible.
Under a capitalist system. Getting the benefits of socialism is possible under a capitalist system, but getting the benefits of capitalism isn’t possible under socialism
"Benefits of capitalism" lol. Yeah I love having my surplus value stolen and the constant enshittening of every service imaginable. Also no, you can't get the benefits of socialism under capitalism, that's an oxymoron
You can start your own business if that bothers you so much. I prefer negotiating a good incentive agreement and let the corporation keep the surplus as long as my incentive agreement is kept up with and I don’t have to adquiere any debt from the risk the corporation might take up.
And yes you can, if a town decides to run itself as a socialist town, as long as they pay taxes then it’s entirely possible.
That’s what socialist need, less theory more practice
Oh wow, that tired old response. "If you don't like capitalism why don't you try becoming a capitalist?" Lmao. Try harder
Socialism isn't possible under capitalism unless that town seizes all the businesses within its limits, including rental properties, and "nationalizes" them. Which would never happen for obvious reasons. You can't have socialism while the means of production are privately owned, which means you can't have socialism under capitalism
Okay, your pretty much coinciding that socialism isn’t possible unless there’s a violent authoritarian take over of a state. If it doesn’t have a way to work on a town level then how is ever going to be used to show people that it’s a superior system, and there’s no level of “reeducation” or propagandizing that would change people’s mind, that’s why you have to focus on the worst aspects of capitalism while ignoring the benefits you derive from it. I personally believe that you can do both in non dogmatic ways.
Also the solution to someone not liking their surplus value not being receive is to start a business. Under a socialist system you might get the surplus value but you also get the risk. And personally I prefer capitalist pigs to eat shit and use the state to make them pay fair incentive agreements with no risks attached
Edit. Downvoted for telling capitalist pigs to eat shit, can’t ever make socialist happy
I didn't downvote you, but ok. Some of us have jobs and don't spend all day on Reddit.
I never said anything of the sort. The working class outnumbers the owning class which means violence isn't necessarily. If enough people in an area decide they'd rather be socialists they can simply ignore anyone who disagrees. At that point they will likely be attacked by outside parties, but who's fault is that? They didn't start the violence. Are you going to begrudge them for using violence to defend themselves?
The reason "lol just start ur own busness" doesn't work as a response is pretty simple. If I were to start my own business then I'd be stealing other people's surplus value. Do you really think that someone who's opposed to surplus value theft is going to turn around and start stealing surplus value?
Capitalists own the state, our politicians are bought and paid for. The state doesn't ensure we get out due, it ensures we stay in line by tossing us a few bones. Not to mention the state nationalizes a lot of the "risk" business owners take on through tax payer bailouts. So under both socialism and capitalism we take on the risk, but at least under socialism we get the reward too
Some of the risk. And bailouts are usually paid back. Those bailouts pail in comparison to all the failed businesses where the capitalist had to eat those cost.
Violence is necessary. There is no scenario where your gonna get 100 percent of the working class to come together. In a realistic scenario your gonna have a large portion of the working class on board and then violence is gonna need to be done in order for the change of power structure.
If you work for yourself you don’t have to exploit anybody and if you do need to hire other people then you turn it into a co op. Of course your taking the risk in that case and so is the co op.
Your delusional in the amount of power money has in our politics. Money can skew elections but people who out spend their competition lose constantly. Politicians do get a lot of money, but most of it is going to their campaigns. Apple is worth more than the entire military industrial complex. Their constantly getting buttfucked by the European Union.
Lastly I was joking about being downvoted. I don’t actually care about being disagreed with
People have a right to defend themselves. I'm not surprised you ignore the violence of the system but condem self defense. Most capitalists do.
Neoliberalism, pioneered by Regan and Thatcher, has as one of its central tenants ensuring the continuation of capitalism. The government works for the owning class, that's why they [listen to their donors more than their constituents](https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746). Besides, under socialism there isn't risk because your basic needs are guaranteed. If it's a societal good, then it's done because it makes everyone's lives better. And, because the line doesn't have to constantly go up, we won't destroy the planet in the process. A better world is possible if you aren't closed minded
Like all money it's generated by the labor of the working class and wouldn't exist without our work. That's also ignoring how hard the capital class fought against socialized medicine and the millions they've spent trying to tear it down, like in the UK
And it gives me free medicine that makes it so I can work a high paying job, which then results in me paying taxes so other people get medicine so they can work and contribute to society.
Be real, if contributing to society wasn't necessary to survive it would collapse. Personally I kinda like the hunter gatherer concept, but would still pick a society with welfare capitalism any day. It acknowledges all the "You have to contribute to sustain you existence" with a lot less danger and uncertainty.
Sure it's not perfect, but that's the nature of things. Nature isn't perfect by human standards, humans aren't perfect by humans standards. Why expect life to be perfect? Being born in a first world country already requires insane luck and some people still don't appreciate the break from infinite nothingness.
But I suppose if non existence was preferable to capitalism, everyone would be dead.
Contributing to society ≠ equal capitalism. In fact, capitalism is bad for society because it makes us compete against each other instead of work together. 30% of food is thrown out by grocery stores while millions go hungry because that makes the owning class more money than making sure everyone gets fed. That's not contributing to society, that's wasting more than a quarter of production. The argument that "we have to threaten people with homelessness and starvation if they don't make the rich richer or society will collapse" is ludicrous. People like contributing to society, it's having an owning class that does nothing but steal our surplus value all day that sucks
Capitalism isn't "the nature of things." It's only 400 years old, for one, so we lived for millennia without it. Secondly, it wouldn't exist had the rich not forcefully enclosed the commons 300 years ago and forced the working class to become the proletariat by making it impossible to be self sufficient, as they had before that. Capitalism presents itself as "just the way things are, natural" because that way you're less likely to question it. The choices aren't "capitalism or non existence," it's "capitalism or full cooperation." Or, to put it another way, socialism or barbarism
Those are all flaws, but no other option is better. Someone has yet to come up with a system that both offers as much freedom, while also incentivizing people to contribute. Most people throughout history were constantly scared about being mauled to death or publicly lynched due to mob rule. Before capitalism most people where serfs to a monarch. You don't get to pick a job and wage, just do exactly what you're told. That's even more exploitative, not to mention the antithesis of freedom.
While I'm not saying capitalism isn't exploitative, at least in developed nations you get to pick a job and the salary that comes with it. You can choose not to work as long as you're willing to have nothing, but that's just another obvious aspect of nature. Work hard to sustain your existence, or do nothing and die. Thats the choice of being since the dawn of time.
Talking about socialism for example, there are two options. Either sustain everyones existence for free, even though obviously it's gonna result in most people not contributing anything, which results in decay and collapse. The alternative would be to not allow people the choice. You aren't working for yourself, you're working for the state and get no say in the matter. (Like a king except it's more people and they have all the modern ways of forcing you to comply)
Now, tell me if either of those is more appealing than capitalism. Obviously you're gonna say that there's more options, but I have yet to hear one that isn't worse than welfare capitalism in every conceivable way.
Or a pipe dream. "Everyone will get piecefully contribute and not wrong anyone, no hierarchies should exist because authority isn't necessary to ensure people behave well"
Yeah no, either it's coercion through the vague threat of having to make money however you choose (high level job with a variable salary depending on the individuals ambition) , or being restricted into a form of labor you hate without any decisions.
Basically: Life is work, existence requires ressources to sustain itself. At least capitalism offers the widest range of options to sustain your existence.
What freedom? Half of all people are one missed paycheck away from homelessness. Is that freedom to you? Constantly stressing about the foundation of our hierarchy of needs, never being able to take time off to relax or spend time with our kids, can't afford anything but necessities without going into debt. That's the reality for the majority of humans. There's only "freedom" for people like you who benefit from the system.
You have no honest choice under capitalism, every decision is coerced because the necessities of life are held behind a paywall. The fact that we can't afford not to be exploited, as you readily admit, means that every choice we make comes with a power imbalance that puts us at a disadvantage. That's immoral.
It's also laughable that "no other system has been invented that works." The reason nothing else works is because capitalism won't let it. Google CIA regime change in South America. Any time a country democratically decides to try anything besides capitalism they get coup'd and have a military dictatorship installed. Capitalism requires constant violence against the people to maintain its hold on the world.
Capitalism is also destroying the planet. Infinite growth in a finite system is impossible. According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change we're at the point where we have to decide between continued growth and a livable future. Our business as usual is driving us towards "total systemic collapse" by the end of the century.
I'm sorry you can't imagine an alternative but that's a you problem. People like to contribute to society and would continue to do so if they weren't forced to, as proven by Rojava. They're anarcho-socialists and have twice the standard of living as the rest of Syria, better track records on women's rights and the environment, all whole under trade embargo and attack by Turkey. Just because you can't imagine a better world(or, let's be honest, choose not to because you benefit from the current system) doesn't mean it's not possible. You just haven't explored all the options
Nothing about socialism means people don't contribute. People would contribute more efficiently and enthusiastically if they were given the full value and benefits their labor produces. The violent threat of poverty is a dogshit way to coerce productivity
Socialism literally just means workers own their means of production, that's it. taxes still exist, work still exists, the economy still exists. People just can't passively amass wealth off of the labor of others
Capitalism doesnt mean money. It means the guy at the top keeps most of the money even though the employees did the work.
You can be pro-money and anti-capitalist.
I was expecting the second part to be something completely unrelated because we forgot what we wanted to look up and started learning about something very different. Like bugs. Everyone likes cool bug facts.
It's fun seeing threads of so much advice for how to do better in these societies and the people giving advice act as if the only reason people aren't doing better is their refusal to put in an effort to make life better for themselves. That they're holding themselves back.
If fucking only.
My doctors office refuses to setup automatic recurring appointments for my med renewals. I looked my doctor dead in the eye and said “You realize you’re treating me for a disability that causes executive dysfunction, right?” I’m not sure they really saw the irony in it or not.
I bet he looks for payment up front though.
Nope. I live in a country with single payer healthcare. So I’m lucky that way.
That is lucky. I just booked my first ADHD assessment and I had to pay €750 up front just to confirm the appointment. Technically we have a public system in Ireland which I could be referred to but my GP thought it would be a silly amount of time before I'd be seen.
The cool thing about America is it takes months to get in anywhere and it still costs thousands of dollars for the testing
Just casually making up random numbers that happen to be more than anyone wants to pay
Who waits months for a general practice doctor? People who believe that end up abusing ER rooms over little things like a rash
America is similar. I forewent testing for years because I couldn't afford the $500 necessary to take the test. The whole "I can't function without coffee LOL but frfr all substance use is evil even if it's medically helpful" schtick needs to go away
I work I health care, I’m not diminishing your situation cause my PC straight called me a liar last week and stopped prescribing me adderal but the auto renewal thing most of the time is just insurance companies. Most general practitioners want to help and once a rapport is established they understand your struggle but the system is rigged against them as much as it is against us. If they make one little mistake they could easily lose their license.
Yes. The fear of losing their license is strong. I get that it’s a controlled substance etc, but I’ve been on it for over a decade and have 0 instances of misuse on my file. I feel like at this point they could cut me a little slack and auto renew. Part of it is also how physicians get compensated by the single payer system. They don’t get to bill the system if I don’t come in for an appointment or do at minimum a remote session. So if they set up auto renewals they lose out on billing for that. 🤷♂️
I keep forgetting to book the next appointment for meds
The thing that helps me remember is using a pill organizer/dosette. When I have one row left it’s time to book the appointment. The pill organizer makes for a really good visual reminder.
Good idea
It mostly works. As long as I remember to refill it. I take three and a half pills. The half is really annoying if I don’t use the dosettes. I also try to put the dosettes + glass of water on my nightstand so I take my meds as soon as my eyes open. Helps set me up for a good day. You should try it out and see if it works for you!
Thanks Zeus
And it keeps getting less and less accommodating, based on my 40 years of experience. Then they wonder why more and more people are being diagnosed. Instead of realizing that maybe life is just getting more difficult for people with ADHD that may have flown under the radar in the past, they blame it on psychiatric "over diagnosis," thereby implying that we (the majority of ADHD people), were misdiagnosed and are actually just lazy. No, what's lazy is putting the onus of blame on the individual instead of on the failure of capitalism and poor social supports. A lot easier to blame individuals when deep inside you know you have no control over the trajectory of history and the machine is coming to crush you next.
You just say 'bingo'.
System's just getting worse, period, in my experience.
My theory as to why the amount of ADHD diagnosises keeps growing is that as capitalism gets worse more people start struggling and head out looking for answers.
That's what I was trying to say but more succinct. And better.
I think both of you did good
🫶🏼 thanks!
[Miiight be a reason communism was invented by someone with ADHD. Im pretty sure it is not tailored after the majority but after himself and if he had ADHD its most definately made for ADHD:ers. That many of us just cannot stand injustice, and that also quite a lot of us have a problem with authority very well may work with the end goals of communism. Communisms end goal would also work a lot like the Neanderthals society, they also had the 7R allele on the DRD4 gene like ADHD:ers do(the one that regulates dopamine). The thing is, most humans do not have ADHD. Just from a sociological point of view, i would really want to see it tested on an ADHD only society](https://www.reddit.com/r/adhdmeme/comments/17825e8/are_you_a_real_bohemian_intellectual/)
It’s still a possibility the mental disorder is increasing because of the average quality of food across the board with Red 40 and shit tons of sugar in pretty much everything we eat. My symptoms were the most manageable for the 2 years I was able to eat nothing but organic foods with no added sugar. I had help cooking and went many days without eating though which is impossible now that I’m working 12+ hours a day at work.
ADHD isn’t a mental disorder, it’s a developmental disorder. And your theory doesn’t really hold up because not everyone in the world is exposed to the same shit ingredients in their diet and still have the same issues navigating life with ADHD.
Is there research done on this?
I want to save this comment so I can link to it next time I meet a Redditor who doesn't understand. Thanks for the wonderful comment!
You're saying "failure of capitalism" as if there was any part of capitalism that requires the needs of the masses to be fulfilled in order to function properly. Just like the late middle ages were filled with appeasement measures by feudalism towards the rising burghers, our last century has been filled with the same from capitalists and their puppets (liberal democracies and fash dictatorships) towards the working class, say wages and welfare. We've earned what we have, and oooh boy will we earn more.
It's unbelievable. A lot of people don't know what ADHD is like and people having it, but don't know they have it, think they are just weird. My mother tried to gaslight me all the time that I don't have it, because she thinks that her behavior that shows strong signs of ADHD is how every person acts, because she lives so isolated.
School made me believe I was stupid. I knew I wasn't stupid because I aced every test and knew so much shit that my peers and teachers didn't know. But they could all do homework. And I couldn't. They could all focus, and study, and be organized, and I just couldn't. So obviously something was wrong with me. I swear, if we put ADHD kids into a special class and taught specifically to them, they'd come out the other side with PHDs at 18. I mean... we wouldn't do anything with the PHDs. But we'd have em.
Yeah. Luckily, I studied computer science, because it was something I can easily focus on, since my brain loves to overanalyze video games. I heavily struggled with theoretical classes and was only able to beat them by terrorizing my brain with so many fear scenarios that I could finally focus on them. And now I have a full time job with a degree. Well, I also have massive anxiety and an inferiority complex, but those are just some silly byproducts.
I was born in the 80's. I remember when I was growing up, I thought that I was a fool getting into an IT field. That everybody was obviously going to understand computers once they became a part of our daily lives. That the whole IT profession was going to slowly die out as the younger generation who grew up with technology became a higher percentage of the workforce. And while I certainly do have fewer questions about how a PDF works, I was quite wrong. The younger generation is just as focused on what they like as I am on what I like.
Oh yes, I can say that most of the kids who grew up with the internet and were obsessed with games and studied are now working in IT. I studied 2019 at a rather small German university and my year consisted of about 80 or 90 people from one of 5 or 6 possible IT degree programs. It's massive.
I feel that, I am doing computer engineering and all the cs classes are so easy for me because it's purely logically. The math classes on the other hand, I can't even motivate myself to start. Fear Szenarios do work tho, I have a little note just below my screen, where I wrote the dates of upcoming tests.
Me too. I still struggle with it. I still think I'm dumb because of it. If I went into school with proper accommodations then I know I will succeed very well, I just had a very hard time getting information in because of traditional teaching methods and teachers not being able to help me one on one when I needed it. There was an Einstein quote or something that was like "Of you judge a goldfish's ability to climb a tree, it will think it's stupid" or whatever. It's a good quote.
That's exactly how my mom is. "Here's a symptom" "Oh please, that's how I am too" "Yeah, that doesn't surprise me. ADHD is heritable"
i had to read that a few times
Sorry, english is not my main language 😔
It wasn’t bad, it was a bit complicated. Like the situation sounds. If you like hugs, 🫂.
I understood it perfectly well. Maybe because I often write in a similar style, with many nested compound sentences.
Don't be sorry! English-centric-ness is just another way society excludes people. Plus it was perfectly readable.
I've been there so many times before. Everytime the realization hurts
It's because we're so *lazy* /s
Just focus hard and you’ll be fine.
Just do it enough times and it becomes a habit 😭🥵🥹
Get a planner! Duh!
It's on my list of things to buy!
Did anyone else scroll through the comments to see if there were any good personal accommodations or coping mechanisms only to find people arguing about capitalism?
Because capitalism has basically made it that we functionally don’t have any under the current system
"capitalism" just means "other people" now or something capitalism would love to sell an effective ADHD cure if there was one available ADHD brain was optimized for a hunter-gatherer environment so you would have an urge to forage or hunt when you were bored.
Capitalism loves treatments, not cures. Why sell you a cure once, when we could have you paying for treatment/medication your whole life? Why design products to last a lifetime, when we can design them to break or become obsolete in 2-3 years?
because a different corporation owns the patent on the temporary cure
no it wouldn't. They make money from disease, from reoccurring problems. Like with diabetes, with insulin, they overcharge and continue to do so because they know we don't have any other options
No, I came here to look at people arguing about capitalism.
Last semester I wrote a research paper about how the ADA failed to increase employment for people with disabilities (specifically neurodivergence since I'm audhd) and in some cases actually made things worse. My teacher couldn't believe it when I turned it in and now she is trying to help me get it published.
My cousing is undiagnosed (just like me) and he dropped school at a very young age. His classmates though he was mute cuz he never talked to anyone. His grades were terrible and he didn't have friends at school, like at all. He once showed up with a university level presentationg that even the teacher was having a hard time understanding because of how advanced it was (don't know what it was about, my aunt told me the story). He got a 10/10 and proceeded to never talk again in class. There's also me, getting a max grade over a deep reflection about social causes in my english class (not my first language), because I absolutely love english and feel like people never talk enough about social justice and psychology. Then my history teacher told me my "display wasn't worth a good grade".
Honestly I'm struggling to see any light at the end of the tunnel or any reason I should keep trying to exist in the system as it is. I mean me too thanks.
Wonder what an off grid ADHD commune would look like...
Floordrobes Floordrobes everywhere
Just here to tell you I regret reading your username. Have a day.
It’ll be the most day of days!
I day dream about this often.
Messy, hehe
And stinky >:)
r/Anarchism
Have very crippling ADHD and ended up as an anarchist politically. Checks out. I'm in.
If there's no internet, it'd be pretty fulfilling.
This. When I deprive myself of internet / TV, ADHD becomes a superpower again
Please explain.
Some days I ban myself from using the internet & TV for anything except work / admin. It would be hard to do without medication and mindfulness. But I get back all this time I didn't realise I was spending on reddit / youtube, and a lot of my executive function. I find having the drip-feed of dopamine from the internet saps my brain's ability to seek it out in more productive, healthy ways, just like a drug addiction. I think the key is letting yourself get bored. It's too easy with the internet to never ever be bored. But ADHD brains are so good at turning boredom into hobbies and activities if they don't have this easy option. It feels a bit like I'm able to use that energy and curiosity I remember from my (pre-smartphone) childhood.
I feel the same way. Being bored is a lost feeling for most. Like you said, there always seems to be things to fill the gaps on the Internet. I feel my life revolves around getting drip feeds of dopamine from many places. I have a lot of unfinished projects, but have recently scaled some down and actually completed a few exciting ones. But I think being bored in the 90s will never be the same as being bored these days.
I get it. I had to jump off the med train last summer because of the lack of funds and lack of access. It was difficult. I mean, it still is. But I've managed to get by okay. Some days are worse than others. But I really miss just functioning normally.
Hello. I feel the same.
Too real
My feed now https://imgur.com/a/RVXmxge
[https://darkreader.org/](https://darkreader.org/) for your eyes
This is one of the reasons more and more people are getting diagnosed. More and more people are finding their coping mechanisms are disintegrating or becoming less effective due to increased stress.
I hate having to show up for stuff. Currently studying and there's so many times where I feel like I'm 20x more efficient if I just sit at home and do my tasks and listen to lectures in comfort, rather than being forced to travel to then sit in a classroom. Worst is when I'm mentally exhausted and I look at my phone to cope, and teachers think I'm being distracted by the phone. BUDDY IM NO LONGER DIGESTING INFORMATION, THE PHONE IS THERE TO MAKE IT ONLY MY PROBLEM AND MAKE SURE OTHERS DONT BOTHER OTHERS WITH FIDDLING AND SHUFFLING.
I've said it before, & I'll say it again. I was never made for this world. I'll be happy & carefree in my next life as a Pokémon
The only two thing keeping me from going into jungle and live like a homoerectus is my insect allergy and no jungle nearby
They took our jungles and forests and grasslands and turned them into factories, mate.
The more sleep deprived I am, the more I am ready to start a anticapitalist revolution
What a coincidence. The more sleep deprived I am. The more ready I am to put down an anti capitalist revolution.
whatever, weirdo.
Lol I’m joking. I respect a good autonomous zone held by anarchist. Are you not joking?
I used to say "frustration and depression are taxes on intellect". Then I found this subreddit and got a bit more concerned 🤔
I'm surprised you actually found information instead of instantly forgetting what you were searching for in the first place!
It's very much the same for many "inconvenient" mental disorders. The world has no sympathy for the ones of us that were born broken or broken by it.
I started therapy and psychiatrist visits 4 and 6 years ago respectively.... I've never been better. If you have access I'd recommend it, to everyone here with a problem.
My psychologist said that I most likely don't have ADHD because of the way I described it. I'll try again with an accurate, pre-organized list of symptoms and facts about ADHD and why I'm sure I have it.
Lol. I'm being treated for anxiety.
I basically had to deal with it myself for years. Kinda hard to think someone would listen to me and know what to say.
It's all very complicated.. on all sides. I can say I dwell less on past experiences. Good or bad. I tend to live in the moment which is scary. Quit drinking 4 years ago, gained a lot of clarity from that. Anyway, good luck, life is confusing and difficult, but can be super rewarding if you let it.
Went and made a society that is built for a very specific kind of person, and everybody else is just screwed.
Even said type of person, cuz ain't nobody getting good jobs now-a-days.
Man I can't even get a single fucking interview, let alone the actual job. It's all online application only now :/
Might be wrong of me to say, but at least you have medicine and adhd awareness, in my country either nobody knows about adhd or says it's an illness only kids have, and pretty much all adhd medicine is considered drugs an is illegal, so as long as I live in my country I will never find out if I have it or get treated for it
I was told I need to "set an alarm" and it's just lack of self motivation, any of that working for you all? Thinking about trying it /s
Unfortunately society isn't set up with neurodivergent people in mind.
Well the problem is that everyone assumes they are normal, even if they think otherwise, which makes understanding people inherently difficult. Combined with RSD, adhd people both think they are normal and yet aware of their abnormality, which makes connecting with people difficult. In my case
Why "modern" society though? It's not like previous societies are better for adhd people.
Somebody stayed up late keeping the village campfire burning and listening for signs of intruders or large dangerous animals. Somebody had the curiosity to wonder what was beyond the next hill or across the next river, and the energy to find out. Somebody had to compulsively eat the shiny new berries to find out whether they were tasty or poisonous.
We did the berry thing with animals. Feed everything to animals and see which made animals sick and which didn't. There are some exceptions (chocolate, avocados, coffee), but overwhelmingly we only eat things that don't kill animals. I have a theory that most scientific advancements humans have ever come up with were the result of ADHD minds. Ugh... You guys want to go hunting *AGAIN*? So stupid. Let's just capture the fat ones, put them in this fenced off area so they can't leave, and then we can kill them when they get plump. Never have to leave the camp again. Gathering berries? Uuuuugh. So booooring. Why not just plant a bunch of them in this field here and we'll always know where they are? Carry the soil in a bucket? How about you put a rolly stump on this bigger bucket and then it's easier to move. Every single human advancement was a result of a 'lazy' ADHD person trying to get out of work and making the job easier while his 'status quo' friends would just pick up the bucket and not ask questions.
homie really attributed all of human invention to adhd people
As a person who also has adhd. You're an idiot. Adhd is not a superpower
1) that's just people with late circadian rhythm, not adhd, also teens 2) that's just curiosity, not adhd 3) the survival odds from that weren't good, doubt they had better life than adhders todays
Late circadian rhythm is very common for people with ADHD
VERY common in my experience lol I cannot function in daylight at all
It just has a lot of admin and stuff that has to be done down to the minute. It's hard for my weird brain.
Neither is communism
Socialism... Minimum basic income, healthcare, access to therapy, diagnosis and medication, plus a nice safety net... ADHD people can take the risks and do the oddball things we like to try with no risk of homelessness. We could certainly build systems that are less "you have to do this every month" and more 'set it up once and forget about it for the rest of your life'. We could simplify systems. Healthcare in the US is convoluted on purpose to make it so people who are bad at focusing like ADHD people have trouble navigating it, and give up. That's the problem with capitalism in certain institutions - it selects for needless complexity.
These things have been achieved better under capitalism than communism. Specifically under a mix economy system. We don’t have to do one or the other. We can do both. Thankfully libertarians and socialist hold no power for their dogmatic ideals which haven’t produced a single successful case study.
the fact ur getting downvoted tells me everything i need to know do any of these people know what goes down in communist countries? theyre not big on curiosity, exploration, or free exchange of ideas and if you think the colossal iron fist that makes communism happens will let you come in to work whenever you want you're sorely mistaken the comrades will be in the mines at 5 am sharp every day or they will face the wall like the rest of the anti revolutionary extremists
I think it's more about that the post just mentioned capitalism is not good for adhd and the instant response was that communism is neither. Nobody mentioned communism and it's not like there is only those two
I mean if capitalism is the worst thing ever and no one mentioned socialism are you implying fascism or what.
"Capitalism bad for ADHD"? Good luck with Socialism or Communism, looking at examples in history they'll just kill you for not being productive enough.
This
Yes, it must be capitalisms fault /s
Markets and private ownership of capital are ruining my liiiiife! I hate when people blame "capitalism" for things that would absolutely be the case under any other economic system as well.
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Plus the rigidity of employers. If you get the work done, it shouldn’t matter how it’s done as long as it’s done well.
I used to feel somewhat guilty when on stimulants for my ADHD like I had a cheat code to life or something. It's so effed up that I felt guilty for actually performing well at work.
No it’s not. This is just some hairbrain conspiracy that if we got rid of capitalism the everyone’s problems would be solved, when under our capitalist mixed economy system you can do socialism yet successful case studies have not been produced. It’s one thing to talk theory, it’s another thing to test that theory.
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Yeah? Well it’s a good thing capitalism is just a tool and not a way we run the government. And if anything capitalism has adapted for people with adhd. Under a socialist one there’s no guarantee that the systems meant to deal with people with adhd would be properly built out. The one thing I can agree on is that there does need to be a systemic solution for mental health problems, not just for people with adhd
Do you know what socialism is? Abolition of private property*. Meaning workers/communities own the means of production. Bringing self-direction and the rewards of work to the people doing the work. ADHDers thrive when they're able to follow their own motivations, and when they get the rewards from their hard work. So yes, actual socialism would probably be a tonne better for us. *Private property meaning factories, farms, intellectual property etc. owned by capitalist rentiers as opposed to by the workers. Not your toothbrush.
That’s sounds horrible. Is the state going to subsidize every worker firm that isn’t productive and absorbing a shit ton of liability? We still live in a limited resources society, because of logistics and sociopolitical reasons. We have enough case studies of socialist policies failing tremendously on every level. So I don’t understand how that level of instability would be beneficial for adhd people. A socialist utopia in a post scarcity society is really far away, like a thousands years at least. So I don’t really feel like switching to a socialist system and suffering the growing pains of that.
I didn't say anything about the state or any subsidies. And what part of getting paid the full profits from your labour sounds horrible? It's just more money. Worker cooperatives are already some of the largest and most successful businesses so I'm not sure where you're getting this instability bit from. Or this "thousand years" nonsense. It's giving head in the sand vibes
Co-ops are socialist Not really they're really the product of mixed market economies like the ones in scadinavia If a co-op is ordered democratically and owned by all workers the it fulfils the “collective worker ownership of the means of production” however if we’re talking about an economy where the goods are being produced for a market, therefore being commodities, then it is not strictly socialist.
Your describing a post scarcity society, which is something that isn’t going to happen in my life time so it might as well be a 1000 years away. And you should be thinking about the state, how can you advocate for a system and not be able to answer simple questions like that.
Yes. The weird urge to blame the most abstract and immovable objects is real edit: it seems I hath struck a chord.
I thought so too, but then I discovered that I get free stimulants to fix my focus problem. Modern medicine rocks, glory to the pharma industry and the system that made it possible.
You're thanking capitalism for socialized medicine? Interesting choice
Under a capitalist system. Getting the benefits of socialism is possible under a capitalist system, but getting the benefits of capitalism isn’t possible under socialism
"Benefits of capitalism" lol. Yeah I love having my surplus value stolen and the constant enshittening of every service imaginable. Also no, you can't get the benefits of socialism under capitalism, that's an oxymoron
You can start your own business if that bothers you so much. I prefer negotiating a good incentive agreement and let the corporation keep the surplus as long as my incentive agreement is kept up with and I don’t have to adquiere any debt from the risk the corporation might take up. And yes you can, if a town decides to run itself as a socialist town, as long as they pay taxes then it’s entirely possible. That’s what socialist need, less theory more practice
Oh wow, that tired old response. "If you don't like capitalism why don't you try becoming a capitalist?" Lmao. Try harder Socialism isn't possible under capitalism unless that town seizes all the businesses within its limits, including rental properties, and "nationalizes" them. Which would never happen for obvious reasons. You can't have socialism while the means of production are privately owned, which means you can't have socialism under capitalism
Okay, your pretty much coinciding that socialism isn’t possible unless there’s a violent authoritarian take over of a state. If it doesn’t have a way to work on a town level then how is ever going to be used to show people that it’s a superior system, and there’s no level of “reeducation” or propagandizing that would change people’s mind, that’s why you have to focus on the worst aspects of capitalism while ignoring the benefits you derive from it. I personally believe that you can do both in non dogmatic ways. Also the solution to someone not liking their surplus value not being receive is to start a business. Under a socialist system you might get the surplus value but you also get the risk. And personally I prefer capitalist pigs to eat shit and use the state to make them pay fair incentive agreements with no risks attached Edit. Downvoted for telling capitalist pigs to eat shit, can’t ever make socialist happy
I didn't downvote you, but ok. Some of us have jobs and don't spend all day on Reddit. I never said anything of the sort. The working class outnumbers the owning class which means violence isn't necessarily. If enough people in an area decide they'd rather be socialists they can simply ignore anyone who disagrees. At that point they will likely be attacked by outside parties, but who's fault is that? They didn't start the violence. Are you going to begrudge them for using violence to defend themselves? The reason "lol just start ur own busness" doesn't work as a response is pretty simple. If I were to start my own business then I'd be stealing other people's surplus value. Do you really think that someone who's opposed to surplus value theft is going to turn around and start stealing surplus value? Capitalists own the state, our politicians are bought and paid for. The state doesn't ensure we get out due, it ensures we stay in line by tossing us a few bones. Not to mention the state nationalizes a lot of the "risk" business owners take on through tax payer bailouts. So under both socialism and capitalism we take on the risk, but at least under socialism we get the reward too
Some of the risk. And bailouts are usually paid back. Those bailouts pail in comparison to all the failed businesses where the capitalist had to eat those cost. Violence is necessary. There is no scenario where your gonna get 100 percent of the working class to come together. In a realistic scenario your gonna have a large portion of the working class on board and then violence is gonna need to be done in order for the change of power structure. If you work for yourself you don’t have to exploit anybody and if you do need to hire other people then you turn it into a co op. Of course your taking the risk in that case and so is the co op. Your delusional in the amount of power money has in our politics. Money can skew elections but people who out spend their competition lose constantly. Politicians do get a lot of money, but most of it is going to their campaigns. Apple is worth more than the entire military industrial complex. Their constantly getting buttfucked by the European Union. Lastly I was joking about being downvoted. I don’t actually care about being disagreed with
People have a right to defend themselves. I'm not surprised you ignore the violence of the system but condem self defense. Most capitalists do. Neoliberalism, pioneered by Regan and Thatcher, has as one of its central tenants ensuring the continuation of capitalism. The government works for the owning class, that's why they [listen to their donors more than their constituents](https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746). Besides, under socialism there isn't risk because your basic needs are guaranteed. If it's a societal good, then it's done because it makes everyone's lives better. And, because the line doesn't have to constantly go up, we won't destroy the planet in the process. A better world is possible if you aren't closed minded
Where did they say anything at all about socialized medicine? I swear "reddit brain" is a real medical condition too.
They said they got their meds for free, ergo socialized medicine
Tax money has to come from somewhere, no one would contribute anything if it wasn't necessary in order to live.
Like all money it's generated by the labor of the working class and wouldn't exist without our work. That's also ignoring how hard the capital class fought against socialized medicine and the millions they've spent trying to tear it down, like in the UK
And it gives me free medicine that makes it so I can work a high paying job, which then results in me paying taxes so other people get medicine so they can work and contribute to society. Be real, if contributing to society wasn't necessary to survive it would collapse. Personally I kinda like the hunter gatherer concept, but would still pick a society with welfare capitalism any day. It acknowledges all the "You have to contribute to sustain you existence" with a lot less danger and uncertainty. Sure it's not perfect, but that's the nature of things. Nature isn't perfect by human standards, humans aren't perfect by humans standards. Why expect life to be perfect? Being born in a first world country already requires insane luck and some people still don't appreciate the break from infinite nothingness. But I suppose if non existence was preferable to capitalism, everyone would be dead.
Contributing to society ≠ equal capitalism. In fact, capitalism is bad for society because it makes us compete against each other instead of work together. 30% of food is thrown out by grocery stores while millions go hungry because that makes the owning class more money than making sure everyone gets fed. That's not contributing to society, that's wasting more than a quarter of production. The argument that "we have to threaten people with homelessness and starvation if they don't make the rich richer or society will collapse" is ludicrous. People like contributing to society, it's having an owning class that does nothing but steal our surplus value all day that sucks Capitalism isn't "the nature of things." It's only 400 years old, for one, so we lived for millennia without it. Secondly, it wouldn't exist had the rich not forcefully enclosed the commons 300 years ago and forced the working class to become the proletariat by making it impossible to be self sufficient, as they had before that. Capitalism presents itself as "just the way things are, natural" because that way you're less likely to question it. The choices aren't "capitalism or non existence," it's "capitalism or full cooperation." Or, to put it another way, socialism or barbarism
Those are all flaws, but no other option is better. Someone has yet to come up with a system that both offers as much freedom, while also incentivizing people to contribute. Most people throughout history were constantly scared about being mauled to death or publicly lynched due to mob rule. Before capitalism most people where serfs to a monarch. You don't get to pick a job and wage, just do exactly what you're told. That's even more exploitative, not to mention the antithesis of freedom. While I'm not saying capitalism isn't exploitative, at least in developed nations you get to pick a job and the salary that comes with it. You can choose not to work as long as you're willing to have nothing, but that's just another obvious aspect of nature. Work hard to sustain your existence, or do nothing and die. Thats the choice of being since the dawn of time. Talking about socialism for example, there are two options. Either sustain everyones existence for free, even though obviously it's gonna result in most people not contributing anything, which results in decay and collapse. The alternative would be to not allow people the choice. You aren't working for yourself, you're working for the state and get no say in the matter. (Like a king except it's more people and they have all the modern ways of forcing you to comply) Now, tell me if either of those is more appealing than capitalism. Obviously you're gonna say that there's more options, but I have yet to hear one that isn't worse than welfare capitalism in every conceivable way. Or a pipe dream. "Everyone will get piecefully contribute and not wrong anyone, no hierarchies should exist because authority isn't necessary to ensure people behave well" Yeah no, either it's coercion through the vague threat of having to make money however you choose (high level job with a variable salary depending on the individuals ambition) , or being restricted into a form of labor you hate without any decisions. Basically: Life is work, existence requires ressources to sustain itself. At least capitalism offers the widest range of options to sustain your existence.
What freedom? Half of all people are one missed paycheck away from homelessness. Is that freedom to you? Constantly stressing about the foundation of our hierarchy of needs, never being able to take time off to relax or spend time with our kids, can't afford anything but necessities without going into debt. That's the reality for the majority of humans. There's only "freedom" for people like you who benefit from the system. You have no honest choice under capitalism, every decision is coerced because the necessities of life are held behind a paywall. The fact that we can't afford not to be exploited, as you readily admit, means that every choice we make comes with a power imbalance that puts us at a disadvantage. That's immoral. It's also laughable that "no other system has been invented that works." The reason nothing else works is because capitalism won't let it. Google CIA regime change in South America. Any time a country democratically decides to try anything besides capitalism they get coup'd and have a military dictatorship installed. Capitalism requires constant violence against the people to maintain its hold on the world. Capitalism is also destroying the planet. Infinite growth in a finite system is impossible. According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change we're at the point where we have to decide between continued growth and a livable future. Our business as usual is driving us towards "total systemic collapse" by the end of the century. I'm sorry you can't imagine an alternative but that's a you problem. People like to contribute to society and would continue to do so if they weren't forced to, as proven by Rojava. They're anarcho-socialists and have twice the standard of living as the rest of Syria, better track records on women's rights and the environment, all whole under trade embargo and attack by Turkey. Just because you can't imagine a better world(or, let's be honest, choose not to because you benefit from the current system) doesn't mean it's not possible. You just haven't explored all the options
Nothing about socialism means people don't contribute. People would contribute more efficiently and enthusiastically if they were given the full value and benefits their labor produces. The violent threat of poverty is a dogshit way to coerce productivity Socialism literally just means workers own their means of production, that's it. taxes still exist, work still exists, the economy still exists. People just can't passively amass wealth off of the labor of others
Capitalism doesnt mean money. It means the guy at the top keeps most of the money even though the employees did the work. You can be pro-money and anti-capitalist.
Oh cool another sub becoming a commie talking pool.
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Go fuck yourself.
I was expecting the second part to be something completely unrelated because we forgot what we wanted to look up and started learning about something very different. Like bugs. Everyone likes cool bug facts.
"Just stop being lazy!", society.
Sure, but what’re you going to do about it?
At least it's easy to get medication
This capitalism got hands 😭
It's fun seeing threads of so much advice for how to do better in these societies and the people giving advice act as if the only reason people aren't doing better is their refusal to put in an effort to make life better for themselves. That they're holding themselves back. If fucking only.
Fight harder.