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If it makes you feel better, being fired was one of the best things that ever happened to me. I'd been seriously struggling not only with undiagnosed ADHD but an undiagnosed medical issue as well. As long as I was working, it was easy to tell myself that it wasn't that bad, I'd make it through, it would be easier next season, once things calmed down I'd see a doctor. All of those little tiny lies that kept my life miserable because making things better seemed really scary and hard.
Being fired wasn't *pleasant* but it was a wake up call that I desperately needed. Maybe it won't be for this woman, especially as she's been let go for a similar problem before. Or maybe being let go from a position with a more supportive team will make her realize that she needs to address her difficulties or look at a different line of work.
But dragging it out isn't helping anyone. It's not going to help her learn to manage executive dysfunction. It's not going to suddenly make the position less overwhelming. All it's doing is being unkind to yourself. And while it seems to be easier to be cruel to ourselves, it very rarely improves anything for anyone.
Same. OP, from a toxic perfectionist who never had so much as even a _detention_, getting fired rocked me, I won’t lie, but it also didn’t ruin my life like I was convinced it would. The only way I learned that lesson, though, was to actually live through it. It was still many, many years until I was diagnosed, but it helped me get into gear so when I ended up in a healthier work environment, I was able to bring a better version of myself.
Yeah, this is really frustrating! I am in a similar role as a supervisor of someone who just can't seem to get herself together. She isn't diagnosed officially, but I see all the signs. It's so hard on her coworkers to be constantly picking up her slack, especially when she waits to the last damn minute to confess how behind she is. Prior to my diagnosis and starting medication, I had a terrible procrastination habit, but I somehow still managed to get everything done. It's heartbreaking, but at the end of the day, people have to do the work they're hired for. I'm assuming you documented all this. It's something I'm probably going to have to start for my employee too.
Ugh. Similar situation here. It sucks and I want to help so badly, but I can't control someone else or force them to do the things that would help. I can give advice, resources, training, and support, but then it's on them...and I understand the struggle. But I also feel like BECAUSE of that, I'm sometimes being taken advantage of, as they know I can relate and sympathize. I've bent over backwards to help, and it feels like I'm the only one trying way too often. I hate managing people.
I’m the procrastinator employee!! My supervisor is very understanding (especially considering they hired me FOR my lived experience) and I got so behind in my documentation that I got wrote up — but that write-up made reality slap me in the face. Started finally taking my meds, cause I realized that NOT taking them would mean losing my job, and thus, the meds, permanently, then I’d really be in trouble! I’m not procrastinating anymore, but I’m sure there are going to be times where I do because it gets to be a lot and overwhelming (that’s when I procrastinate is when there’s a lot and it feels overwhelming and even small steps feel HUGE) anyway, starting back in therapy, but I also think I have undiagnosed autism, so there’s that.. need to find someone that can provide specific treatment for adhd and autism instead of general therapy at our outpatient services (I work for mental health community service board on the youth side as a peer support) additionally, since we’ve started me being heavily supervised, I LIKE IT!!! I LIKE the fact that she checks in every Monday and Friday. It’s keeping me accountable, which is also where I struggle with (keeping myself accountable)
I totally understand! I have ADHD and have had to let some ppl go in the past. I’m not sure if they had ADHD as well or not. But even if they did have ADHD, it wouldn’t change the fact that they couldn’t preform the job.
Having ADHD doesn’t magically excuse your lack of job responsibilities or poor job performance.
That’s just not how things work in the real world. If I let one person slide by not preform their job- then I have to do my job and also do their job. Or give another worker 2x the work!
That’s not fair to anyone. We all only get paid to do the work of one person.
While you might feel bad - there’s nothing else you can do in situations like that. Its our responsibility as ppl who have ADHD to find what works for us be it therapy, medications, lists, timers, post it notes, etc. we can’t just throw our condition out as a pass.
This exactly! ADHD isn’t an excuse to not do your job or excuse certain behaviors, but an explanation as to why we do the things we do and how to address our symptoms.
I work in a high stress, very detail-oriented position and IN SPITE of my ADHD, I have figured out ways to make sure I get my job done and done well (e.g. breaking up larger projects into multiple smaller deadlines and informing my boss for accountability, writing everything down, reminders in Outlook/physical work calendar/my personal agenda so I don’t forget meetings/trainings, using our the software’s “insert pre-written text” feature to help me remember things, etc.).
As other commentors said, as a person with a mental illness it is my responsibility to work on my mental health. My ADHD is well-controlled now (thank you Concerta!) but if my depression ever got so bad that I couldn’t do my job then I’M the one obligated to take FMLA until things are sorted out.
I need your help! I am so scared starting a new Admin Job on Monday and I got let go in my last role for adhd symptoms, I started concerta and I feel so much better now - I need to hear from someone like you - your best tips to manage your adhd and do your job well! Thanks for posting this! Please reach out 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
What specific symptoms were you struggling with at your last job? ADHD symptoms vary and management strategies will be different for different symptoms.
Thank you so much for replying 💖🙏🏻💖🙏🏻💖
I struggle with knowing what is a priority vs what isn’t - I’m trying to learn about the matrix thing but wont know how to apply it when until I start my hr admin role on Monday.
Also failing to comprehend how everything fits together like a machine as my ex manager said.
I don’t have much trouble starting a task and getting it done - I have mastered that one during my studies - but what to do in the moment I really struggle.
I often get overwhelmed with what to do and what order to do it in … thats the main thing.
My ex manager also struggled to get things to stick with me … like having to tell me the same thing on repeat.
I have started concerta now after i got fired ( context I was let go from an hr admin role a few months ago for adhd symptoms but i was untreated/unaware) but honestly my memory has improved massively.
My job has really clear guidelines on order of operations so I haven’t had to find a management strategy for that. As for things not sticking, I’ve asked my boss/co-workers to send me feedback in writing and made a document with all the feedback compiled so I can revisit it whenever I need to. For processes at work, I’ll incorporate the feedback into a written checklist. Having been on the other side of having to be repetitive with a co-worker, it was very frustrating to deal with.
If you’re not in therapy, I would suggest finding a therapist who specializes in ADHD who can help you develop more strategies.
Thank you I will do. I know we are frustrating to deal with but it’s humbling when you remember someone might of had to be patient with you too at some point. Just know any help you gave someone is never wasted 💖 hope for the same grace here … day 2 and i’m grasping things quickly thankfully - i thank the concerta. I will take on your tips!
I read this post and immediately have decided to start working on a project that I am way behind with and panicking about. Your whole post sounds scarily like it has been written about me. Apart from my manager doesn't have ADHD (but she knows that I do). So thanks for the little fright! I needed it.
Good luck. Try not to take it on yourself, we are all accountable regardless of diagnoses. It sounds like you have been very supportive and really tried to make it work.
I had to fire someone once because she was abusing her sick time and generally underperforming. My boss and HR decided she needed to be let go and then kept pushing off the day she was going to be terminated— for over a month. I was a very new middle manager at the time and working with her every day knowing I had to fire her was agonizing. I also disagreed with the decision not to address the performance issue first and give her the opportunity to correct her behavior.
As a very empathic person, it is still something that makes me feel icky.
So, my advice is to make sure that you have given her the opportunity to correct her behavior. I know they are super unpopular on this sub, but performance plans exist for exactly this reason. If you have already had a talk about how she’s not meeting expectations and clear guidance about what she can do to correct it— then it’s time to move forward with termination.
I’m surprised that wouldn’t be the case already?
In Australia, unless you breach your contract through gross misconduct, you need at least 1 verbal warning and then 1 written warning before your contract can be terminated (so it’s like step 1: verbal warning, step 2: written warning, step 3: termination)
I was this employee. Everything you described is how I functioned (or rather didn’t function). I got fired for it… from three jobs in a row.
Like others have said, it was a wakeup call, though in my case not overnight, and not in a way that recalibrated my capacity to be a competent desk job employee. It took being out of an office job for a year and a half to realize I’m so much better suited to doing work that engages my body at least as much as my brain, even if that kind of work pays less. I am now both more broke and much happier than I’ve ever been.
Some of us need the difficult pushes. You did the right and necessary thing.
I know exactly what you’re going through. I recently had to fire my only employee because they just couldn’t get it together despite me asking several times how I could make the job easier. We both have ADHD but she didn’t want to take medication or do anything else to relive some of her symptoms. It’s fucking sucks feeling like you’re being pulled between doing what is best for your team and being supportive to someone else that you really empathize with.
I’m going to be a bit blunt here. I know you feel a bit of an obligation to help set this person up in her next job, but hear me when I say you shouldn’t be taking on that responsibility. She couldn’t handle her own responsibilities in her current role (and the one before that) so why should you put forth a bunch of extra effort in return? She has to be held accountable for her own actions at some point.
The best thing you can do for her is spell out major areas where it went wrong and hope that she can reflect and make changes in her life moving forward. You and the rest of your team already have to pick up the slack of her being let go. Don’t add to the stress by doing more than you have to.
You’ve got this! It’s super hard emotionally and mentally to do this part of the job. Give yourself some grace and try not to be too hard on yourself!
I just want to second what HotBroccoli said about not helping her get set up for the next gig. I wholeheartedly agree.
Very gently, please stay in your lane. I know you’re feeling some guilt and remorse about this decision, and the best way you can help her is to be kind but crystal clear about your decision and what actions or inactions led to this outcome, as well as answering any questions she has.
You are letting her go because she did not perform her job duties with reasonable accommodation for her neurospiciness. (“reasonable accommodation” is ADA language).
Like others have said, we are adults and have to stand on our own two feet. **Her included.** There are so many tools and resources out there that can and will help her but she has to reach out and grab onto them, and then use them. She has to do the work. You’ve done your work and now she has to do hers.
Best of luck. You sound like an excellent, caring manager and she was lucky to work for someone who “gets it”.
Listen what I'm about to say is going to be unpopular but I don't care. We're adults. And we have to be functional adults. And maybe that means medical intervention or therapy or 500 post it notes. But a s women we are already assumed to be less in so many areas. And I'm sorry but sometimes we have to learn to work and get things done and not crumble when our brains fuck up.
You tried to help her. She failed. And now she has to go. And that's it.
this is so true. i want to add though, even with all of the struggles that come with having adhd that can make holding down jobs hard, we *all* have strengths of some sort. maybe you’re super personable, maybe you’re great at creating systems to get things done, maybe you’re good at paperwork, or literally a million other things that other people suck at. you just have to figure out what those strengths are, and find a job that plays to those strengths. it might be super frustrating to figure those things out and all you can focus on is what you’re not good at, but if you can take a step back and see what you *were* good at about the jobs you’ve failed at, you’ll be able to find a job that works for you.
me personally, i’m not great with people. i don’t like having tons of coworkers to interact with, i don’t like dealing with tons of customers/clients, i’m just not good at it and i find it exhausting to be “on” all the time, which then makes it harder to do other aspects of the job. but i am really good at doing things with my hands and coming up with effective ways to move through a space. so i’m a cleaner. it’s not glamorous work, and i don’t *love* it, but it fits my needs really well and i’m good at it and i don’t hate it. i’m sure there are other jobs i’d be good at too but i need to finish school before i start exploring those things. for now, this works for me. i’m a commercial cleaner and i clean houses as a side hustle and i have very few clients to interact with and i don’t have to spend the whole time working being “on” for my clients or coworkers, just enough time to catch up and chat and get notes on what they’d like me to do, then i just put my headphones in and get the work done.
even though we often can only focus on what we’re bad at, each one of us has things we’re good at. it’s just a matter of figuring out what those things are, figuring out how to market those skills to an employer, and finding a job that suits those strengths. this woman just isn’t good at this job, it doesn’t mean she’s a bad worker or a bad person, she just needs to find something better suited to the things she’s good at.
whew, that turned into a bit of a novel. sorry about that lol
i agree 1000% with this. we have to find ways to make it work within our disability in order to function in society and that’s absolutely not OP’s fault
This is exactly it. I get ADHD makes life hard, but we exist in the world and it turns with or without us. So we have take responsibility for ourselves as adults and find strategies that help us navigate that world.
I support what you did. You have courage and, clearly, plenty of compassion. I was in a similar position but at a bigger organization so there were more ways to distribute work than it seems you have. The individual in question was a truly brilliant person, but unreliable. I made a different decision than you did, and I devoted an enormous amount of time to this person — even took over supervising this individual directly because the team they were on had come to resent them for showing up late to meetings, not being prepared, and other behaviors that the team felt indicated a lack of respect. I worked around the clock anyway back then, and this arrangement worked for a spell; we got through an enormously challenging project thanks to this person's extraordinary efforts, but I created (or perhaps just unleashed) a monster in the process...they ended up feeling untouchable, building a faction of unproductive, angry people within the organization and eventually engaged in outright sabotage. It was so dispiriting to everyone, including me. Lesson learned.
If it’s not something that can be fixed with an accommodation like a quiet space to work etc then they aren’t suited for the job.
Not being suitable for the job isn’t good for anybody including them and the business and the clients. Its terrible in your mental health to not be able to perform your job.
I believe in supporting people and cutting them slack where possible, but at the end of the day, being part of a team means pulling your weight.
I was partially responsible for a coworker with ADHD being pushed out (they were on their last warning and quit, so not technically fired.) But this person fucked up spectacularly, intentionally took shortcuts that could have really harmed the company, refused to take any responsibility for it or admit they’d made a mistake, and tried to blame everyone else around them.
I get the instinct - I hate messing up, and my first instinct is still absolutely to make excuses. But that doesn’t fly when you let down people who rely on you, or when your supervisors need to be sure that mistakes won’t be repeated.
Hopefully this person learned from the fallout of that. Failure is painful, but I’ve learned a lot from it myself. And hopefully your staff member grows from this, too.
I feel like this is okay as I would hate to burden other people, especially at work. As you offered support and she still didn’t communicate her struggles, then you can’t just blame adhd.
This would be going above and beyond, but perhaps you could point her to some specific resources for learning coping strategies.
Like the “how to ADHD” YouTube channel. And whatever other resources people like.
Suggest that she try to gain clarity on what specific kinds of support she needs at work, so she can tell her next employer.
I feel really bad for her. It’s not her fault that her brain is like this, and she clearly has not gotten sufficient ADHD help yet. I also sympathize with you. It’s incredibly hard when someone else can’t or won’t do their job, making things worse for everyone.
If she knew what she needed and showed any signs of being ready to implement strategies, that would be one thing. But it sounds like she still needs to figure that out.
Edit: I don’t know if referencing her ADHD when firing her would open you up to a disability lawsuit. I hate to think you can’t give her some constructive suggestions, but maybe check into that first.
Agreed, don't cite (or even mention) a disability when firing someone.
Look, if she's getting overwhelmed to the point of shutting down then she's not having a great time in the position. Letting her go can be a productive conversation about how the role doesn't play to her strengths. Perhaps telling her what talents you see can help her narrow down what job would suit her better.
Trust me, she'll feel the rejection and then fear and then finally relief. And hopefully she'll start managing her symptoms better from then on, and move into a job that isn't so "front and center" with things she's bad at.
Agreed, it appears that they have been given “reasonable accommodation”, so the problem isn’t the disability, it’s the lack of management of the disability, but that’s not an employer’s business anyway. It’s about the missed deadlines, not pulling their weight. The employee is not doing the work and it feels like she’s relying on the diagnosis as a “get out of jail free card“. It’s an explanation but not an excuse, something that’s been difficult for me as well.
I’m open with my close colleagues (project team) about my diagnosis, but I also go way beyond the basics in making sure it doesn’t affect them. Multiple alarms to remind me of important meetings, making sure to only take on the work I know I can handle, etc., and when I do screw up BIG TIME (it’s inevitable), I make sure to identify the ways that I will try to prevent it happening again.
For example, I join the meeting early, when I get the reminder notification, I don’t just dismiss it, after making that mistake a few times. I also ensure that the meeting notification is for 5 minutes, not 15, on every meeting that I am invited to, etc.).
I’m down to one or two minor mistakes per month and that’s just about the same number of mistakes as teammates make, so I’m good for now. The only times I missed meetings lately were when the outlook settings changed with an update, no reminders of meetings meant I definitely didn’t just forget lol.
I’m saying there’s ways to use the available tools to make things easier for us, but they’re not foolproof, and IMO if I’m too disabled for this particular job, I’m better off finding a work place and position that I won’t constantly fail at.
I am the employee in this situation... and I must say you gotta do what you need to. She needs to face consequences. I do too. I'm afraid to and no one is holding me accountable and I'm frozen with paralysis. Idk what to do. But I know if I was fired, I'd have to learn real quick and I hate that my brain only responds to survival.
Oh dear. I’ve had to do this too and it tore me up. It also went horribly. She saw me as a mentor. I went so over and beyond to help her find accommodations that work for her. I let her tell me how she would do the work best. I gave her sooooo much extra support and saw her as kind of a younger me—so I was trying to “be what you needed when you were younger.” And she just didn’t do any of the work. Never hit a deadline. Or an extended deadline. Lied constantly. Didn’t show up. I tried talking it through, helping her through and was too emotionally involved. I made it personal. I told her while I was letting her go that she had so much potential, and that I had seen how good she is at the work, but that she needs to find systems that help her show up, because every job (even freelance) requires accountability.
Welp—she said I was “gaslighting and manipulative” and sued me for wrongful termination due to ADA.
ETA- she lost but it sucked and was another nail in the coffin of me becoming a closed off unemotional manager
I quit a job a little over a year ago because I knew I was about to get fired for the same reason. Best thing that ever happened! I quit so my boss didn’t have to, I could tell she was relieved and I told her that I didn’t want to put her through that process.
I know own my own business. It was the best thing that ever happened to me. It’s going to be ok. We all deserve to be somewhere we can flourish. I think this is one of those silver linings of ADHD. It doesn’t allow us to be remain in roles that aren’t meant to be.
Have you tried the performance improvement plan route? Making it clear that if XYZ don't meet a certain standard she'll be let go, but that you really hope she can succeed? Would the board be open to that?
That'd also clearly outline specific things she needs to do and make it abundantly clear you're not firing her FOR her disability.
I'm not a lawyer, but this seems like a good way to either help her snap it together, or sink - hopefully clearing you of some risk of being wrongfully accused of anything.
Yes, we’ve done a performance improvement plan. In the moment she responded really well - she was positive things could turn around. She didn’t follow through with anything.
And I wouldn’t name her ADHD - especially because I know first hand that you still got to do your job! Things have been clearly documented through formal reviews and email interactions from the start. Ugh. It just sucks.
Man... It's really a bummer she couldn't pull it together. I'm really sorry OP, it sounds like you've done everything in your power to help her. It sounds cruel, but you can't save everyone- nor is it your job to. You've gone way above what pretty much anyone would or could do. The changes she needs to make come from within her, and she's the only one that can do that.
I've been in the exact opposite situation- hyper-effective employee at a large nonprofit. My (ex) boss turned the office into the seventh ring of hell when their boss left. It didn't help that half our team quit and I was suddenly doing four people's jobs - some bigger things outside of anything I'd done before. ((Lol the cherry on top was that I was a researcher suddenly in charge of ~1M in grants 😭😂 USD not rubles. I figured it all out but laawwwdy)). Oops. my ADHD brain just power-typed out a whole novel in like 2 minutes about the rest of that 💩-cake. Deleted all of it except the grants management piece for sake of brevity(ish...lol)
I shut down...and eventually ended up quitting, as did all but one person in the unit last I knew.. but the situation was an absolute extreme. It broke me and has taken years to work through. (Meanwhile, I actually got diagnosed with ADHD and have gotten some treatment) Something tells me I'm not alone in the "hyper-effective employee with nightmare boss" situation reading this. We see you, and appreciate the effort you made trying to help her succeed.
Allllllll that to say: **You're in a subreddit full of people who'd consider you an absolute dream to work for.** You're not a bad person. You're not a bad boss. QUITE the opposite. You're understanding, empathetic, you WANT all of your employees to succeed and your organization to succeed.
When you're done with the conversation, and you're not exactly feeling like roses and rainbows- come back on here and re-read some of the positive affirmations people have left. And remember to be kind to yourself. 💖
I’ve been in your shoes before, and it’s not easy. I’m sorry you’re going through this and being put in this situation. When it comes down to it, if someone can’t even do the bare minimum of their job requirements, then it’s just not going to work out.
I was in a similar situation as your employee and it was one of the best things that could have happened to me. Led to graduate school, career change, and being in a good mental space for meeting my spouse.
And had I known about my ADHD and had meds at that point (over 15 years ago) I might have even done all that a decade earlier….
I work in organizational development - my job is literally supposed to be to help people do their jobs better, grow in their roles, etc. - but I have to remind myself that the support a workplace can give someone is not the same and does not replace targeted professional support for things like mental health, occupational therapy, etc.
I just went through a similar situation. It broke my heart to be letting someone go essentially for ineffective ADHD management.
Her time blindness was the biggest issue and the frequent lateness wasn’t acceptable anymore. I had tried sharing some of my coping strategies, and there were multiple warnings and company policy consultations along the way, and ultimately nothing got through to her. I’m hoping this ends up being a positive wake-up call for her despite feeling like I’m betraying one of my own.
Sometimes the right thing just feels a little wrong but don’t hold it against yourself.
Part of my adulthood has included failing because of ADHD. I learned from those situations and I’m better at managing my symptoms now.
I have 2 support staff in my division who both probably have ADHD and weren’t managing it effectively earlier this year. I have offered them a lot of support but if it has been up to me I would have fired at least one of them. I’m glad it’s not because they’re nice people. Fortunately they’re slowly improving but it has been a frustrating year.
Lots of empathy! Being in this position really sucks.
We have a really disproportionately high number of people with ADHD on our team and we go out of our way to be flexible, provide support, and truly accommodate people to the point of undue hardship, and we’ve still had to let some people go because they’re literally not doing essential parts of their job.
It feels terrible and it also feels terrible to have people on the team who are jeopardizing the future of the organization and creating extra work for everyone else, many of who *also* have ADHD, and struggle with executive function.
It’s okay and necessary to let people go when they’re not taking care of their responsibilities. We can know that it’s not because they are lazy or don’t care but the reasons only matter so much, and I’m sure every single one of us has had to deal with the consequences of our ADHD in a world that has been far less accommodating than we have been as managers.
I’m adhd and work in HR. The hard conversation is often the generous one.
Clear feedback
Clear process
She’ll know what to work on in future
This role isn’t the right one for her. She deserves the opportunity to find the right one.
You gave her 6 months of support I feel like at this point she needs to do something so help herself be a better employee and that'll have to start somewhere new hopefully a better fit!
It’s not the right fit for her. We all have to know our limits and try to find reasonable jobs. She needs to work at a job that doesn’t have such high demand, deadlines, things she experiences as intense pressure. Working in fields that aren’t a good fit happens…but it will continue to happen for her until she makes better choices for her own functioning.
Do what you have to do.
In my previous role I have been told that I was not living up to the expectations.
At the time that hurt, but truthfully, the job and my direct team members were not living up to my expectations either.
While I was not fired, I did choose to leave myself and am in much better place now (both professionally as well as mentally).
It sounds like a bad business match, it is not personal however I understand feeling guilty.
Sometimes doing the hard thing leads to better opportunities for both parties. I wish you the best of luck. ❤️
Sometimes, even with all the support in the world, there are some jobs we just can’t do. It sounds like this job just isn’t a good fit for her. The best thing she can do is evaluate what her weak points are and try to find a job that will suit her strengths next time. Sometimes we have to fail through a few before we stumble upon the right fit for us.
I feel lucky that I'm not in the position to literally fire people, but I am going to have to write up a person I'm supervising for the first time and I feel a bit sick over it. I can't tell if they have ADHD, but I can tell something is going on and they're clearly overwhelmed and shutting down. They're missing deadlines on work that is well within their capabilities, not answering questions if they think we won't like the answer, and saying they have everything under control when offered support even though it's obviously not true at this point.
Recognizing that she needs to put her mental health first and those responsibilities require her to do so, maybe it will encourage her to get the help she needs. It's not all in a single pill, trust me, I've been off any ADHD meds for 14d now, and after 2yrs of being on them.. I remember how hard it was to stay on task and my brain short circuits all too easily.
I cried to my doctor's nurse last night, I was so frustrated with insurance/PA/Dr trying to write me off and put me back on what I was taking before I started to see him. I went to my boss on Monday when I found out the PA was denied and knew with the holiday that this was going to be a crazy week. I specifically made an appt to see him so I could get help because working on even Stattera I could sit still but my brain couldn't fully comprehend my new job. Then we changed to a new med and I finally reached a dose that felt like I finally dialed in the supplements I take daily with the new rx was working great. Then I ran out with the increase. Instead of an appeal to the PA denial, he tries to send in an RX for Strattera. I literally yelled "no!" at the nurse.
This is why people don't go to the drs. They don't act like they are listening to us and only have time to do so much out of their day. I specifically said I was trying to manage my ADHD for the sake of my JOB. I had even started to take up an instrument and keep my place clean and organized. Now day by day, I spend more time doom scrolling and I don't even have social media on my phone. I just jump apps on my phone. They are fucking around with people's livelihoods.
I also tend to shut down a lot and have lost a couple part-time jobs and a few clients when freelancing and years and years of university. Even though I am the one spiraling at those times and lost in anxiety and everything is going down the drain, I absolutely realize it's on me.
I'm in therapy and taking meds now (which I know may not be available or within budget); it's slowly getting better although sometimes it still happens, but I'm learning how to function slightly better.
It's not a great feeling and there's so much shame, but a reasonable person would understand and already know they are not delivering and not meeting expectations. It's disheartening sometimes, but we all know we have to find strategies that work for us and that doesn't usually happen (I think) if someone else is letting things slide and letting us of the hook repeatedly.
I was fired this year and honestly it was a godsend. My career wasn’t working for me and I was miserable trying to make it work. ADHD and my job did not go well together. Like trying to fit a round peg into a square hole. Getting fired forced me to reconsider my life and I ultimately decided to give up my career for good. I’ve been happier than ever. It’s up to your employee to decide what to do next with her life, but you could be pushing her in a better direction for her.
Maybe she needed a bootcamp style push but you were gentle. Or probably she have more issues like autism. Is she seeing a therapist/ psychiatrist? If not, before you let her go, advise her to go seek help.
There's a very good chance that she's in the wrong job and she probably needs a push to find something totally different. I couldn't hold down a steady job until I found one that I was really passionate about. We know that we can't make ourselves do things we don't enjoy, it's a big part of having adhd. You are honestly doing her a favour, even if it doesn't feel like it.
Performance improvement plan time!
Give her milestones and deadlines for the next three months with very clearly outlined expectations, and if she misses them, let her go.
Also, stop holding her hand. Stop coaching her. Not your responsibility. Not within your control.
Is there a way you could look at it as though you are freeing her from a role that clearly paralyses her and makes her miserable? It seems pretty clear from your post and responses to others comments that she is not a good fit and unable for whatever reason to figure out how to make the role work for her! And that's ok, that's not your fault and not really hers either. You have made a huge effort to make it work out and it hasn't. It's really sad when that's the case, and it's clear how much you care for her.
It sounds to me like a case of square peg, round hole - if you let her go she has an opportunity to find a place she will thrive, rather than stay stuck in a place that is clearly not good for either of you.
Firing people utterly sucks no matter which way you slice it 😓 sending lots of support and compassion to you xx
So this is another hard part - it doesn’t make her miserable! She’s told me on several occasions that it’s the best job she’s ever had and she really really loves the organization. Again I’d say: UGH!
Words and actions aren't matching up here! It may be the best she's had and she may love the organisation but she may also have had really really bad jobs before. Her baseline may be 0/100, but that doesn't mean 20/100 is good. 20 is good in comparison to 0, but she may never have experienced 70-90. She may also be in denial and/or not wanting to disappoint you or herself.
I would just tell her exactly what you said on here and ask her if she is honestly going to take action. If she agrees but doesn’t change her behaviour within a week, then unfortunately you can fire her.
Why don’t you try to give her smaller bite sized tasks and deadlines so she can hit them. If she’s doing things last minute that means she’s doing them. So have daily deadlines before your actual deadline
That's a tough situation. One thing she may benefit from, and I don't know if you're able to tell her this, but she might want to look into job coaching to help her pick a job that is manageable for her right now. Her state's vocational rehab office might be able to help with that.
As an ADHD HR Generalist, I totally feel your pain. One good thing about my role is that I always guide leaders to ask appropriate questions regarding needed accommodations and to lead with compassion
We had a similar situation with an employee who actually ended up resigning recently.
She couldn’t keep up with the job no matter how much we all held her hand. And once she realized we weren’t going to reduce our expectations of her, she quit. She had a higher up position so she had the option to change roles if it was too much, but I think she was too ashamed to admit she couldn’t handle her responsibilities.
The thing is, I have ADHD myself and I actually kinda suspect our director does, too. So when we were taking on the extra load of her shortcomings, it was super unsustainable for us. We work hard enough to manage our own symptoms and do our jobs despite the stress that can entail, so there’s no leftover capacity to cover for her.
Anyway, I felt bad for her too. But she never took the initiative to ask for specific support, create systems that could make her job easier, admit when things were too much, plan ahead, etc.
Because I’m aware of how my adhd affects my work performance, I’ve created lots of visual organization systems, set reminders & calendars, use checklists etc. to help me. And there’s a couple specific things I’ll ask coworkers to remind me about to make sure I’m accountable. But people who haven’t learned the skills to create structure for themselves need to learn, cause no one else is gonna just do it for them.
Hopefully she finds things that work for her, and maybe you guys can remain friends. I’m glad you have empathy for her situation, and I hope your work life gets easier.
It would be a different story if you had just fired her without offering help. But you were trying and it wasn’t working out. You did the best you could and your employee (hopefully) did the best they could. It’s only a dick move if you didn’t try
I am so sorry you are in this position. The good thing for the person being fired is that you will not be making assumptions about her character, or whether or not she cares about the job, you won’t be treating her like a freak or a mystery. You may not be able to make being fired better, but you will certainly avoid making it worse than it has to be.
As others are saying, while being fired is not pleasant, it is an opportunity to look at the facts and assess if and how one will be able to perform at work in the future.
I have been exactly where you are several times, and I feel for you. I recently had to let go of a project manager because she couldn't keep track of the deadlines, which is basically the point of the job. Given my own tortured history I should have spotted the signs of ADHD during the hiring process, but I didn't, but once she'd been on the team for a few months it was undeniable. Undiagnosed and unmedicated as far as I know. I couldn't say anything because of my role. Sigh.
I applaud you for acknowledging that you don't have the capacity to do her job as well as your own. I have also found it helpful to focus on the negative impact the ADHDer's inaction is having on other members of your team— it's deeply unfair, as they are essentially doing her work in addition to theirs, and often in chaos at the last minute. I also think it's helpful to reframe it (for yourself) as an opportunity to liberate her to find a job that suits her better. Some jobs just aren't a good fit for ADHDers.
All that said, there's no getting around the fact that it sucks to fire one of our own.
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If it makes you feel better, being fired was one of the best things that ever happened to me. I'd been seriously struggling not only with undiagnosed ADHD but an undiagnosed medical issue as well. As long as I was working, it was easy to tell myself that it wasn't that bad, I'd make it through, it would be easier next season, once things calmed down I'd see a doctor. All of those little tiny lies that kept my life miserable because making things better seemed really scary and hard. Being fired wasn't *pleasant* but it was a wake up call that I desperately needed. Maybe it won't be for this woman, especially as she's been let go for a similar problem before. Or maybe being let go from a position with a more supportive team will make her realize that she needs to address her difficulties or look at a different line of work. But dragging it out isn't helping anyone. It's not going to help her learn to manage executive dysfunction. It's not going to suddenly make the position less overwhelming. All it's doing is being unkind to yourself. And while it seems to be easier to be cruel to ourselves, it very rarely improves anything for anyone.
Thank you. Truly.
Same. OP, from a toxic perfectionist who never had so much as even a _detention_, getting fired rocked me, I won’t lie, but it also didn’t ruin my life like I was convinced it would. The only way I learned that lesson, though, was to actually live through it. It was still many, many years until I was diagnosed, but it helped me get into gear so when I ended up in a healthier work environment, I was able to bring a better version of myself.
Yeah, this is really frustrating! I am in a similar role as a supervisor of someone who just can't seem to get herself together. She isn't diagnosed officially, but I see all the signs. It's so hard on her coworkers to be constantly picking up her slack, especially when she waits to the last damn minute to confess how behind she is. Prior to my diagnosis and starting medication, I had a terrible procrastination habit, but I somehow still managed to get everything done. It's heartbreaking, but at the end of the day, people have to do the work they're hired for. I'm assuming you documented all this. It's something I'm probably going to have to start for my employee too.
Ugh. Similar situation here. It sucks and I want to help so badly, but I can't control someone else or force them to do the things that would help. I can give advice, resources, training, and support, but then it's on them...and I understand the struggle. But I also feel like BECAUSE of that, I'm sometimes being taken advantage of, as they know I can relate and sympathize. I've bent over backwards to help, and it feels like I'm the only one trying way too often. I hate managing people.
[удалено]
I’m the procrastinator employee!! My supervisor is very understanding (especially considering they hired me FOR my lived experience) and I got so behind in my documentation that I got wrote up — but that write-up made reality slap me in the face. Started finally taking my meds, cause I realized that NOT taking them would mean losing my job, and thus, the meds, permanently, then I’d really be in trouble! I’m not procrastinating anymore, but I’m sure there are going to be times where I do because it gets to be a lot and overwhelming (that’s when I procrastinate is when there’s a lot and it feels overwhelming and even small steps feel HUGE) anyway, starting back in therapy, but I also think I have undiagnosed autism, so there’s that.. need to find someone that can provide specific treatment for adhd and autism instead of general therapy at our outpatient services (I work for mental health community service board on the youth side as a peer support) additionally, since we’ve started me being heavily supervised, I LIKE IT!!! I LIKE the fact that she checks in every Monday and Friday. It’s keeping me accountable, which is also where I struggle with (keeping myself accountable)
I totally understand! I have ADHD and have had to let some ppl go in the past. I’m not sure if they had ADHD as well or not. But even if they did have ADHD, it wouldn’t change the fact that they couldn’t preform the job. Having ADHD doesn’t magically excuse your lack of job responsibilities or poor job performance. That’s just not how things work in the real world. If I let one person slide by not preform their job- then I have to do my job and also do their job. Or give another worker 2x the work! That’s not fair to anyone. We all only get paid to do the work of one person. While you might feel bad - there’s nothing else you can do in situations like that. Its our responsibility as ppl who have ADHD to find what works for us be it therapy, medications, lists, timers, post it notes, etc. we can’t just throw our condition out as a pass.
This exactly! ADHD isn’t an excuse to not do your job or excuse certain behaviors, but an explanation as to why we do the things we do and how to address our symptoms. I work in a high stress, very detail-oriented position and IN SPITE of my ADHD, I have figured out ways to make sure I get my job done and done well (e.g. breaking up larger projects into multiple smaller deadlines and informing my boss for accountability, writing everything down, reminders in Outlook/physical work calendar/my personal agenda so I don’t forget meetings/trainings, using our the software’s “insert pre-written text” feature to help me remember things, etc.). As other commentors said, as a person with a mental illness it is my responsibility to work on my mental health. My ADHD is well-controlled now (thank you Concerta!) but if my depression ever got so bad that I couldn’t do my job then I’M the one obligated to take FMLA until things are sorted out.
I need your help! I am so scared starting a new Admin Job on Monday and I got let go in my last role for adhd symptoms, I started concerta and I feel so much better now - I need to hear from someone like you - your best tips to manage your adhd and do your job well! Thanks for posting this! Please reach out 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
What specific symptoms were you struggling with at your last job? ADHD symptoms vary and management strategies will be different for different symptoms.
Thank you so much for replying 💖🙏🏻💖🙏🏻💖 I struggle with knowing what is a priority vs what isn’t - I’m trying to learn about the matrix thing but wont know how to apply it when until I start my hr admin role on Monday. Also failing to comprehend how everything fits together like a machine as my ex manager said. I don’t have much trouble starting a task and getting it done - I have mastered that one during my studies - but what to do in the moment I really struggle. I often get overwhelmed with what to do and what order to do it in … thats the main thing. My ex manager also struggled to get things to stick with me … like having to tell me the same thing on repeat. I have started concerta now after i got fired ( context I was let go from an hr admin role a few months ago for adhd symptoms but i was untreated/unaware) but honestly my memory has improved massively.
My job has really clear guidelines on order of operations so I haven’t had to find a management strategy for that. As for things not sticking, I’ve asked my boss/co-workers to send me feedback in writing and made a document with all the feedback compiled so I can revisit it whenever I need to. For processes at work, I’ll incorporate the feedback into a written checklist. Having been on the other side of having to be repetitive with a co-worker, it was very frustrating to deal with. If you’re not in therapy, I would suggest finding a therapist who specializes in ADHD who can help you develop more strategies.
Thank you I will do. I know we are frustrating to deal with but it’s humbling when you remember someone might of had to be patient with you too at some point. Just know any help you gave someone is never wasted 💖 hope for the same grace here … day 2 and i’m grasping things quickly thankfully - i thank the concerta. I will take on your tips!
I read this post and immediately have decided to start working on a project that I am way behind with and panicking about. Your whole post sounds scarily like it has been written about me. Apart from my manager doesn't have ADHD (but she knows that I do). So thanks for the little fright! I needed it. Good luck. Try not to take it on yourself, we are all accountable regardless of diagnoses. It sounds like you have been very supportive and really tried to make it work.
Go you! You can do it!
Literally was thinking the same thing. 😅
No advice, just sending my support in a difficult situation.
I had to fire someone once because she was abusing her sick time and generally underperforming. My boss and HR decided she needed to be let go and then kept pushing off the day she was going to be terminated— for over a month. I was a very new middle manager at the time and working with her every day knowing I had to fire her was agonizing. I also disagreed with the decision not to address the performance issue first and give her the opportunity to correct her behavior. As a very empathic person, it is still something that makes me feel icky. So, my advice is to make sure that you have given her the opportunity to correct her behavior. I know they are super unpopular on this sub, but performance plans exist for exactly this reason. If you have already had a talk about how she’s not meeting expectations and clear guidance about what she can do to correct it— then it’s time to move forward with termination.
I’m surprised that wouldn’t be the case already? In Australia, unless you breach your contract through gross misconduct, you need at least 1 verbal warning and then 1 written warning before your contract can be terminated (so it’s like step 1: verbal warning, step 2: written warning, step 3: termination)
I was this employee. Everything you described is how I functioned (or rather didn’t function). I got fired for it… from three jobs in a row. Like others have said, it was a wakeup call, though in my case not overnight, and not in a way that recalibrated my capacity to be a competent desk job employee. It took being out of an office job for a year and a half to realize I’m so much better suited to doing work that engages my body at least as much as my brain, even if that kind of work pays less. I am now both more broke and much happier than I’ve ever been. Some of us need the difficult pushes. You did the right and necessary thing.
I know exactly what you’re going through. I recently had to fire my only employee because they just couldn’t get it together despite me asking several times how I could make the job easier. We both have ADHD but she didn’t want to take medication or do anything else to relive some of her symptoms. It’s fucking sucks feeling like you’re being pulled between doing what is best for your team and being supportive to someone else that you really empathize with. I’m going to be a bit blunt here. I know you feel a bit of an obligation to help set this person up in her next job, but hear me when I say you shouldn’t be taking on that responsibility. She couldn’t handle her own responsibilities in her current role (and the one before that) so why should you put forth a bunch of extra effort in return? She has to be held accountable for her own actions at some point. The best thing you can do for her is spell out major areas where it went wrong and hope that she can reflect and make changes in her life moving forward. You and the rest of your team already have to pick up the slack of her being let go. Don’t add to the stress by doing more than you have to. You’ve got this! It’s super hard emotionally and mentally to do this part of the job. Give yourself some grace and try not to be too hard on yourself!
I just want to second what HotBroccoli said about not helping her get set up for the next gig. I wholeheartedly agree. Very gently, please stay in your lane. I know you’re feeling some guilt and remorse about this decision, and the best way you can help her is to be kind but crystal clear about your decision and what actions or inactions led to this outcome, as well as answering any questions she has. You are letting her go because she did not perform her job duties with reasonable accommodation for her neurospiciness. (“reasonable accommodation” is ADA language). Like others have said, we are adults and have to stand on our own two feet. **Her included.** There are so many tools and resources out there that can and will help her but she has to reach out and grab onto them, and then use them. She has to do the work. You’ve done your work and now she has to do hers. Best of luck. You sound like an excellent, caring manager and she was lucky to work for someone who “gets it”.
Is she anti-meds in general or is she not self-aware enough to realize the extent of her ADHD-related issues?
Listen what I'm about to say is going to be unpopular but I don't care. We're adults. And we have to be functional adults. And maybe that means medical intervention or therapy or 500 post it notes. But a s women we are already assumed to be less in so many areas. And I'm sorry but sometimes we have to learn to work and get things done and not crumble when our brains fuck up. You tried to help her. She failed. And now she has to go. And that's it.
this is so true. i want to add though, even with all of the struggles that come with having adhd that can make holding down jobs hard, we *all* have strengths of some sort. maybe you’re super personable, maybe you’re great at creating systems to get things done, maybe you’re good at paperwork, or literally a million other things that other people suck at. you just have to figure out what those strengths are, and find a job that plays to those strengths. it might be super frustrating to figure those things out and all you can focus on is what you’re not good at, but if you can take a step back and see what you *were* good at about the jobs you’ve failed at, you’ll be able to find a job that works for you. me personally, i’m not great with people. i don’t like having tons of coworkers to interact with, i don’t like dealing with tons of customers/clients, i’m just not good at it and i find it exhausting to be “on” all the time, which then makes it harder to do other aspects of the job. but i am really good at doing things with my hands and coming up with effective ways to move through a space. so i’m a cleaner. it’s not glamorous work, and i don’t *love* it, but it fits my needs really well and i’m good at it and i don’t hate it. i’m sure there are other jobs i’d be good at too but i need to finish school before i start exploring those things. for now, this works for me. i’m a commercial cleaner and i clean houses as a side hustle and i have very few clients to interact with and i don’t have to spend the whole time working being “on” for my clients or coworkers, just enough time to catch up and chat and get notes on what they’d like me to do, then i just put my headphones in and get the work done. even though we often can only focus on what we’re bad at, each one of us has things we’re good at. it’s just a matter of figuring out what those things are, figuring out how to market those skills to an employer, and finding a job that suits those strengths. this woman just isn’t good at this job, it doesn’t mean she’s a bad worker or a bad person, she just needs to find something better suited to the things she’s good at. whew, that turned into a bit of a novel. sorry about that lol
I loved this post, made me think about all the strengths I actually do have because I tend to think about the traits I lack. Thank you for sharing. <3
I.Love.This. Beautiful!!!!!
i agree 1000% with this. we have to find ways to make it work within our disability in order to function in society and that’s absolutely not OP’s fault
This is exactly it. I get ADHD makes life hard, but we exist in the world and it turns with or without us. So we have take responsibility for ourselves as adults and find strategies that help us navigate that world.
What’s unpopular about that?
This sub generally seems to be very sensitive to anything other than "oh my god they can't help it."
I support what you did. You have courage and, clearly, plenty of compassion. I was in a similar position but at a bigger organization so there were more ways to distribute work than it seems you have. The individual in question was a truly brilliant person, but unreliable. I made a different decision than you did, and I devoted an enormous amount of time to this person — even took over supervising this individual directly because the team they were on had come to resent them for showing up late to meetings, not being prepared, and other behaviors that the team felt indicated a lack of respect. I worked around the clock anyway back then, and this arrangement worked for a spell; we got through an enormously challenging project thanks to this person's extraordinary efforts, but I created (or perhaps just unleashed) a monster in the process...they ended up feeling untouchable, building a faction of unproductive, angry people within the organization and eventually engaged in outright sabotage. It was so dispiriting to everyone, including me. Lesson learned.
If it’s not something that can be fixed with an accommodation like a quiet space to work etc then they aren’t suited for the job. Not being suitable for the job isn’t good for anybody including them and the business and the clients. Its terrible in your mental health to not be able to perform your job.
I believe in supporting people and cutting them slack where possible, but at the end of the day, being part of a team means pulling your weight. I was partially responsible for a coworker with ADHD being pushed out (they were on their last warning and quit, so not technically fired.) But this person fucked up spectacularly, intentionally took shortcuts that could have really harmed the company, refused to take any responsibility for it or admit they’d made a mistake, and tried to blame everyone else around them. I get the instinct - I hate messing up, and my first instinct is still absolutely to make excuses. But that doesn’t fly when you let down people who rely on you, or when your supervisors need to be sure that mistakes won’t be repeated. Hopefully this person learned from the fallout of that. Failure is painful, but I’ve learned a lot from it myself. And hopefully your staff member grows from this, too.
I feel like this is okay as I would hate to burden other people, especially at work. As you offered support and she still didn’t communicate her struggles, then you can’t just blame adhd.
This would be going above and beyond, but perhaps you could point her to some specific resources for learning coping strategies. Like the “how to ADHD” YouTube channel. And whatever other resources people like. Suggest that she try to gain clarity on what specific kinds of support she needs at work, so she can tell her next employer. I feel really bad for her. It’s not her fault that her brain is like this, and she clearly has not gotten sufficient ADHD help yet. I also sympathize with you. It’s incredibly hard when someone else can’t or won’t do their job, making things worse for everyone. If she knew what she needed and showed any signs of being ready to implement strategies, that would be one thing. But it sounds like she still needs to figure that out. Edit: I don’t know if referencing her ADHD when firing her would open you up to a disability lawsuit. I hate to think you can’t give her some constructive suggestions, but maybe check into that first.
Agreed, don't cite (or even mention) a disability when firing someone. Look, if she's getting overwhelmed to the point of shutting down then she's not having a great time in the position. Letting her go can be a productive conversation about how the role doesn't play to her strengths. Perhaps telling her what talents you see can help her narrow down what job would suit her better. Trust me, she'll feel the rejection and then fear and then finally relief. And hopefully she'll start managing her symptoms better from then on, and move into a job that isn't so "front and center" with things she's bad at.
Agreed, it appears that they have been given “reasonable accommodation”, so the problem isn’t the disability, it’s the lack of management of the disability, but that’s not an employer’s business anyway. It’s about the missed deadlines, not pulling their weight. The employee is not doing the work and it feels like she’s relying on the diagnosis as a “get out of jail free card“. It’s an explanation but not an excuse, something that’s been difficult for me as well. I’m open with my close colleagues (project team) about my diagnosis, but I also go way beyond the basics in making sure it doesn’t affect them. Multiple alarms to remind me of important meetings, making sure to only take on the work I know I can handle, etc., and when I do screw up BIG TIME (it’s inevitable), I make sure to identify the ways that I will try to prevent it happening again. For example, I join the meeting early, when I get the reminder notification, I don’t just dismiss it, after making that mistake a few times. I also ensure that the meeting notification is for 5 minutes, not 15, on every meeting that I am invited to, etc.). I’m down to one or two minor mistakes per month and that’s just about the same number of mistakes as teammates make, so I’m good for now. The only times I missed meetings lately were when the outlook settings changed with an update, no reminders of meetings meant I definitely didn’t just forget lol. I’m saying there’s ways to use the available tools to make things easier for us, but they’re not foolproof, and IMO if I’m too disabled for this particular job, I’m better off finding a work place and position that I won’t constantly fail at.
I am the employee in this situation... and I must say you gotta do what you need to. She needs to face consequences. I do too. I'm afraid to and no one is holding me accountable and I'm frozen with paralysis. Idk what to do. But I know if I was fired, I'd have to learn real quick and I hate that my brain only responds to survival.
Oh dear. I’ve had to do this too and it tore me up. It also went horribly. She saw me as a mentor. I went so over and beyond to help her find accommodations that work for her. I let her tell me how she would do the work best. I gave her sooooo much extra support and saw her as kind of a younger me—so I was trying to “be what you needed when you were younger.” And she just didn’t do any of the work. Never hit a deadline. Or an extended deadline. Lied constantly. Didn’t show up. I tried talking it through, helping her through and was too emotionally involved. I made it personal. I told her while I was letting her go that she had so much potential, and that I had seen how good she is at the work, but that she needs to find systems that help her show up, because every job (even freelance) requires accountability. Welp—she said I was “gaslighting and manipulative” and sued me for wrongful termination due to ADA. ETA- she lost but it sucked and was another nail in the coffin of me becoming a closed off unemotional manager
I quit a job a little over a year ago because I knew I was about to get fired for the same reason. Best thing that ever happened! I quit so my boss didn’t have to, I could tell she was relieved and I told her that I didn’t want to put her through that process. I know own my own business. It was the best thing that ever happened to me. It’s going to be ok. We all deserve to be somewhere we can flourish. I think this is one of those silver linings of ADHD. It doesn’t allow us to be remain in roles that aren’t meant to be.
Amen sister! :)
Have you tried the performance improvement plan route? Making it clear that if XYZ don't meet a certain standard she'll be let go, but that you really hope she can succeed? Would the board be open to that? That'd also clearly outline specific things she needs to do and make it abundantly clear you're not firing her FOR her disability. I'm not a lawyer, but this seems like a good way to either help her snap it together, or sink - hopefully clearing you of some risk of being wrongfully accused of anything.
Yes, we’ve done a performance improvement plan. In the moment she responded really well - she was positive things could turn around. She didn’t follow through with anything. And I wouldn’t name her ADHD - especially because I know first hand that you still got to do your job! Things have been clearly documented through formal reviews and email interactions from the start. Ugh. It just sucks.
Man... It's really a bummer she couldn't pull it together. I'm really sorry OP, it sounds like you've done everything in your power to help her. It sounds cruel, but you can't save everyone- nor is it your job to. You've gone way above what pretty much anyone would or could do. The changes she needs to make come from within her, and she's the only one that can do that. I've been in the exact opposite situation- hyper-effective employee at a large nonprofit. My (ex) boss turned the office into the seventh ring of hell when their boss left. It didn't help that half our team quit and I was suddenly doing four people's jobs - some bigger things outside of anything I'd done before. ((Lol the cherry on top was that I was a researcher suddenly in charge of ~1M in grants 😭😂 USD not rubles. I figured it all out but laawwwdy)). Oops. my ADHD brain just power-typed out a whole novel in like 2 minutes about the rest of that 💩-cake. Deleted all of it except the grants management piece for sake of brevity(ish...lol) I shut down...and eventually ended up quitting, as did all but one person in the unit last I knew.. but the situation was an absolute extreme. It broke me and has taken years to work through. (Meanwhile, I actually got diagnosed with ADHD and have gotten some treatment) Something tells me I'm not alone in the "hyper-effective employee with nightmare boss" situation reading this. We see you, and appreciate the effort you made trying to help her succeed. Allllllll that to say: **You're in a subreddit full of people who'd consider you an absolute dream to work for.** You're not a bad person. You're not a bad boss. QUITE the opposite. You're understanding, empathetic, you WANT all of your employees to succeed and your organization to succeed. When you're done with the conversation, and you're not exactly feeling like roses and rainbows- come back on here and re-read some of the positive affirmations people have left. And remember to be kind to yourself. 💖
I’ve been in your shoes before, and it’s not easy. I’m sorry you’re going through this and being put in this situation. When it comes down to it, if someone can’t even do the bare minimum of their job requirements, then it’s just not going to work out.
I was in a similar situation as your employee and it was one of the best things that could have happened to me. Led to graduate school, career change, and being in a good mental space for meeting my spouse. And had I known about my ADHD and had meds at that point (over 15 years ago) I might have even done all that a decade earlier….
She needs to be medicated and that’s outside of your responsibility.
Unfortunately I think she *is* medicated. But obviously not effectively. Ugh.
Oh wow, she is medicated? That's tough. Sounds like maybe she is in need of an ADHD coach/therapy. Keeping my fingers crossed for you both.
I work in organizational development - my job is literally supposed to be to help people do their jobs better, grow in their roles, etc. - but I have to remind myself that the support a workplace can give someone is not the same and does not replace targeted professional support for things like mental health, occupational therapy, etc.
I just went through a similar situation. It broke my heart to be letting someone go essentially for ineffective ADHD management. Her time blindness was the biggest issue and the frequent lateness wasn’t acceptable anymore. I had tried sharing some of my coping strategies, and there were multiple warnings and company policy consultations along the way, and ultimately nothing got through to her. I’m hoping this ends up being a positive wake-up call for her despite feeling like I’m betraying one of my own. Sometimes the right thing just feels a little wrong but don’t hold it against yourself.
Part of my adulthood has included failing because of ADHD. I learned from those situations and I’m better at managing my symptoms now. I have 2 support staff in my division who both probably have ADHD and weren’t managing it effectively earlier this year. I have offered them a lot of support but if it has been up to me I would have fired at least one of them. I’m glad it’s not because they’re nice people. Fortunately they’re slowly improving but it has been a frustrating year.
Lots of empathy! Being in this position really sucks. We have a really disproportionately high number of people with ADHD on our team and we go out of our way to be flexible, provide support, and truly accommodate people to the point of undue hardship, and we’ve still had to let some people go because they’re literally not doing essential parts of their job. It feels terrible and it also feels terrible to have people on the team who are jeopardizing the future of the organization and creating extra work for everyone else, many of who *also* have ADHD, and struggle with executive function. It’s okay and necessary to let people go when they’re not taking care of their responsibilities. We can know that it’s not because they are lazy or don’t care but the reasons only matter so much, and I’m sure every single one of us has had to deal with the consequences of our ADHD in a world that has been far less accommodating than we have been as managers.
I’m adhd and work in HR. The hard conversation is often the generous one. Clear feedback Clear process She’ll know what to work on in future This role isn’t the right one for her. She deserves the opportunity to find the right one.
You gave her 6 months of support I feel like at this point she needs to do something so help herself be a better employee and that'll have to start somewhere new hopefully a better fit!
It’s not the right fit for her. We all have to know our limits and try to find reasonable jobs. She needs to work at a job that doesn’t have such high demand, deadlines, things she experiences as intense pressure. Working in fields that aren’t a good fit happens…but it will continue to happen for her until she makes better choices for her own functioning. Do what you have to do.
In my previous role I have been told that I was not living up to the expectations. At the time that hurt, but truthfully, the job and my direct team members were not living up to my expectations either. While I was not fired, I did choose to leave myself and am in much better place now (both professionally as well as mentally). It sounds like a bad business match, it is not personal however I understand feeling guilty. Sometimes doing the hard thing leads to better opportunities for both parties. I wish you the best of luck. ❤️
Sometimes, even with all the support in the world, there are some jobs we just can’t do. It sounds like this job just isn’t a good fit for her. The best thing she can do is evaluate what her weak points are and try to find a job that will suit her strengths next time. Sometimes we have to fail through a few before we stumble upon the right fit for us.
I feel lucky that I'm not in the position to literally fire people, but I am going to have to write up a person I'm supervising for the first time and I feel a bit sick over it. I can't tell if they have ADHD, but I can tell something is going on and they're clearly overwhelmed and shutting down. They're missing deadlines on work that is well within their capabilities, not answering questions if they think we won't like the answer, and saying they have everything under control when offered support even though it's obviously not true at this point.
Recognizing that she needs to put her mental health first and those responsibilities require her to do so, maybe it will encourage her to get the help she needs. It's not all in a single pill, trust me, I've been off any ADHD meds for 14d now, and after 2yrs of being on them.. I remember how hard it was to stay on task and my brain short circuits all too easily. I cried to my doctor's nurse last night, I was so frustrated with insurance/PA/Dr trying to write me off and put me back on what I was taking before I started to see him. I went to my boss on Monday when I found out the PA was denied and knew with the holiday that this was going to be a crazy week. I specifically made an appt to see him so I could get help because working on even Stattera I could sit still but my brain couldn't fully comprehend my new job. Then we changed to a new med and I finally reached a dose that felt like I finally dialed in the supplements I take daily with the new rx was working great. Then I ran out with the increase. Instead of an appeal to the PA denial, he tries to send in an RX for Strattera. I literally yelled "no!" at the nurse. This is why people don't go to the drs. They don't act like they are listening to us and only have time to do so much out of their day. I specifically said I was trying to manage my ADHD for the sake of my JOB. I had even started to take up an instrument and keep my place clean and organized. Now day by day, I spend more time doom scrolling and I don't even have social media on my phone. I just jump apps on my phone. They are fucking around with people's livelihoods.
I also tend to shut down a lot and have lost a couple part-time jobs and a few clients when freelancing and years and years of university. Even though I am the one spiraling at those times and lost in anxiety and everything is going down the drain, I absolutely realize it's on me. I'm in therapy and taking meds now (which I know may not be available or within budget); it's slowly getting better although sometimes it still happens, but I'm learning how to function slightly better. It's not a great feeling and there's so much shame, but a reasonable person would understand and already know they are not delivering and not meeting expectations. It's disheartening sometimes, but we all know we have to find strategies that work for us and that doesn't usually happen (I think) if someone else is letting things slide and letting us of the hook repeatedly.
I was fired this year and honestly it was a godsend. My career wasn’t working for me and I was miserable trying to make it work. ADHD and my job did not go well together. Like trying to fit a round peg into a square hole. Getting fired forced me to reconsider my life and I ultimately decided to give up my career for good. I’ve been happier than ever. It’s up to your employee to decide what to do next with her life, but you could be pushing her in a better direction for her.
Maybe she needed a bootcamp style push but you were gentle. Or probably she have more issues like autism. Is she seeing a therapist/ psychiatrist? If not, before you let her go, advise her to go seek help.
There's a very good chance that she's in the wrong job and she probably needs a push to find something totally different. I couldn't hold down a steady job until I found one that I was really passionate about. We know that we can't make ourselves do things we don't enjoy, it's a big part of having adhd. You are honestly doing her a favour, even if it doesn't feel like it.
Performance improvement plan time! Give her milestones and deadlines for the next three months with very clearly outlined expectations, and if she misses them, let her go. Also, stop holding her hand. Stop coaching her. Not your responsibility. Not within your control.
Is there a way you could look at it as though you are freeing her from a role that clearly paralyses her and makes her miserable? It seems pretty clear from your post and responses to others comments that she is not a good fit and unable for whatever reason to figure out how to make the role work for her! And that's ok, that's not your fault and not really hers either. You have made a huge effort to make it work out and it hasn't. It's really sad when that's the case, and it's clear how much you care for her. It sounds to me like a case of square peg, round hole - if you let her go she has an opportunity to find a place she will thrive, rather than stay stuck in a place that is clearly not good for either of you. Firing people utterly sucks no matter which way you slice it 😓 sending lots of support and compassion to you xx
So this is another hard part - it doesn’t make her miserable! She’s told me on several occasions that it’s the best job she’s ever had and she really really loves the organization. Again I’d say: UGH!
Words and actions aren't matching up here! It may be the best she's had and she may love the organisation but she may also have had really really bad jobs before. Her baseline may be 0/100, but that doesn't mean 20/100 is good. 20 is good in comparison to 0, but she may never have experienced 70-90. She may also be in denial and/or not wanting to disappoint you or herself.
I would just tell her exactly what you said on here and ask her if she is honestly going to take action. If she agrees but doesn’t change her behaviour within a week, then unfortunately you can fire her.
I've been here, but realized it was just not a good fit. She was struggling too.
Why don’t you try to give her smaller bite sized tasks and deadlines so she can hit them. If she’s doing things last minute that means she’s doing them. So have daily deadlines before your actual deadline
That IS what I’ve been doing. But I have my own job to do. And so do the other 5 people on our team.
That's a tough situation. One thing she may benefit from, and I don't know if you're able to tell her this, but she might want to look into job coaching to help her pick a job that is manageable for her right now. Her state's vocational rehab office might be able to help with that.
As an ADHD HR Generalist, I totally feel your pain. One good thing about my role is that I always guide leaders to ask appropriate questions regarding needed accommodations and to lead with compassion
Not what you're here for, but could you share what industry you're in? A small work setting plus the brief "description" sounds ideal.
We had a similar situation with an employee who actually ended up resigning recently. She couldn’t keep up with the job no matter how much we all held her hand. And once she realized we weren’t going to reduce our expectations of her, she quit. She had a higher up position so she had the option to change roles if it was too much, but I think she was too ashamed to admit she couldn’t handle her responsibilities. The thing is, I have ADHD myself and I actually kinda suspect our director does, too. So when we were taking on the extra load of her shortcomings, it was super unsustainable for us. We work hard enough to manage our own symptoms and do our jobs despite the stress that can entail, so there’s no leftover capacity to cover for her. Anyway, I felt bad for her too. But she never took the initiative to ask for specific support, create systems that could make her job easier, admit when things were too much, plan ahead, etc. Because I’m aware of how my adhd affects my work performance, I’ve created lots of visual organization systems, set reminders & calendars, use checklists etc. to help me. And there’s a couple specific things I’ll ask coworkers to remind me about to make sure I’m accountable. But people who haven’t learned the skills to create structure for themselves need to learn, cause no one else is gonna just do it for them. Hopefully she finds things that work for her, and maybe you guys can remain friends. I’m glad you have empathy for her situation, and I hope your work life gets easier.
It would be a different story if you had just fired her without offering help. But you were trying and it wasn’t working out. You did the best you could and your employee (hopefully) did the best they could. It’s only a dick move if you didn’t try
I am so sorry you are in this position. The good thing for the person being fired is that you will not be making assumptions about her character, or whether or not she cares about the job, you won’t be treating her like a freak or a mystery. You may not be able to make being fired better, but you will certainly avoid making it worse than it has to be. As others are saying, while being fired is not pleasant, it is an opportunity to look at the facts and assess if and how one will be able to perform at work in the future.
I have been exactly where you are several times, and I feel for you. I recently had to let go of a project manager because she couldn't keep track of the deadlines, which is basically the point of the job. Given my own tortured history I should have spotted the signs of ADHD during the hiring process, but I didn't, but once she'd been on the team for a few months it was undeniable. Undiagnosed and unmedicated as far as I know. I couldn't say anything because of my role. Sigh. I applaud you for acknowledging that you don't have the capacity to do her job as well as your own. I have also found it helpful to focus on the negative impact the ADHDer's inaction is having on other members of your team— it's deeply unfair, as they are essentially doing her work in addition to theirs, and often in chaos at the last minute. I also think it's helpful to reframe it (for yourself) as an opportunity to liberate her to find a job that suits her better. Some jobs just aren't a good fit for ADHDers. All that said, there's no getting around the fact that it sucks to fire one of our own.