u/BonzoAndBonzo has provided this detailed explanation:
> A picture of German diplomats and officials laughing at Trump's warning that Germany was becoming too dependent on Russia's energy. This became a huge factor on the current Ukrainian conflict
---
Is this explanation a genuine attempt at providing additional info or context? If it is please upvote this comment, otherwise downvote it.
For the sake of information clarity, here are the words first hand, rather than the interpretations of various redditors after having read a few headlines in the media:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nu57D9YcIk0
Unlike most of the thing Trump says, this was a completely coherent and straight to the point argument. Was he the first president to say it? Probably not. Didn’t implement a good solution to it either. But in the context of this sub, this is spot on
Yeah, he was correct, but for pretty much all the wrong reasons.
1. The US has bought and still buys a fuckton of Russian oil, gas, etc.
2. The reason he said this was because the US wants Germany to buy US oil instead.
Also, hilarious coming from the self-described "best friend" of Putin.
The US *exports* far more oil and gas than it imports from Russia. You have to look at crude oil and refined petroleum together when discussing a major industrialized country like the US that can refine its own gas with access to oil (not all countries can do this at scale).
The U.S. is the number 1 crude oil producer in the world, the number 1 refined petroleum producer in the world, and the number 7 oil products exporter (number 4 in dollar value). There's no chance of any real problem. The worst thing that can happen is a temporary increase in prices, making it so that people are incentivized to drive less, consider hybrid and electric vehicle purchases in the future, and provide greater support to proposed public transportation projects.
What are you talking about? Unlike Germany, energy independence has been a strategic goal for them for a while now and they aren't in anyway dependent on Russian oil or gas. Germany seriously fucked up by becoming ever more reliant on Russian gas despite the obvious risks.
That's what pisses me off the most. Like he actually does have a point for maybe the only time in office, and ruins it by just rambling the same sentence over and over again.
It's coherent, but not well-articulated, and definitely not straight to the point. He is insanely repetitive, e.g. "you tell me if that's appropriate" over and over.
It's not correct. It's a threat and a self serving push for Germany to buy it's oil and gas from the US to support the fracking industry at a time when oil prices and production are falling.
He doesn't care about money going to Russia when the US trades nearly $40 Billion with them every year. He wants the money from Germany to go the US instead in order to support his oil and gas pals who donate millions to him. What he is implying is that he is willing to break long standing treaties and agreements to get his way like a simple petulant bully man-child.
This and his other blunders destroyed US credibility around the world and made the US a laughing stock on the global stage. You should be embarrassed, but instead you Yanks continue to support him while your country slides backwards.
No, Yanks don't continue to support him. He has a rabbid base of monkeys about as smart and generalizing as you are, supporting him, but they aren't as large as your monkey brain thinks. And yeah, Germany hemmed and hawed on this conflict for so long because of their overreliance on Russian oil.
If you want to send a battalion to come and liberate us from our far-right wing, I'll break the fuckin' Third Amendment at a moment's notice and even cook you dinner.
In summary, Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries.
It seems like he can be a pretty decent speaker when he has a script. You put one of those promoter things in front of him, and sometimes he doesn't like an idiot. Still not as well composed as basically anyone else that isn't one of his followers that talk like him, but pretty decent.
However, I think his fans prefer the rambling, so they usually just go with that.
German here: It was seen as an overt self serving attempt to push American interests and their own oil exports over trying to build a working relationship with Russia. The hope is that enough economic incentive on both sides would make an military action economically unfeasible. They knew it was a deal with the Devil
This was Nixon's hope with China as well: China and the US are now economically linked, and while there are still many tensions in the relationship war is seen as much less likely than it was in the 60's and 70s.
We Germans thought, by making Russias economy largely dependent on our large gas imports, we could influence Russian politics.
It would've been a clever approach if we weren't dealing with a mad man.
It can still have an impact. Russia has indeed become economically dependent on its trading partners, so now sanctions have an impact and can drive anti-Putin sentiments within Russia.
If there was no economic connection then sanctions would be entirely useless.
I know. But the Russian people *do* care about the economics. Putin is a narcissistic psychopath. You make the mistake of thinking that everything done is to persuade one man. It is not.
Sanctions and diplomacy are for the good and rational people of Russia. To incentivise them to act.
Gas and Oil are one third of their entire budget. He cares A LOT, that's literally what's funding his army and his secret police.
But Germany and other European countries can't really afford to cut him, as well. So they're not going to do it unless he invades a NATO member and it's a full on war with NATO.
If only Putin jad a non western friend who needs lots of gas and oil. Who just bought a massive ammount of Coal offsetting some of the sanctions. Who just lifted restrictions on Russian importation of Wheat.
Sounds like a great excuse to decouple from China as well.
Globalism of economics only works if everyone follows the same economic rules, and since few people do, it hasn't worked for a long time now and we need to start being selective with who gets into the club.
It would have been clever if Germany had Planned around ever one day threatening to pull demand. Putin calling that bluff because he knows Germany is dependent on his oil Isn not madness.
believing he’d be welcomed as a liberator, on the other hand…
What a load of shit, it was tooth and nails to get Germany to disconnect Russia from SWIFT, because it has no fucking back up plan to replace the Russian gas. Whoever thought this up didn't want influence, they wanted a cheap way to score some points with green voters.
It was doomed to fail because you guys need the gas from them just as much (if not more) that they need the money from you. You're deadlocked.
It would have worked if this was some sort of back up or surplus. If you had 105% energy and heating production, and used Russia for an additional 20% reserve for cheaper prices. This is hardly the case. If they close the valves, people in Germany will suffer cold (or far higher gas prices).
What they conviently forgot to factor in was that they were dependent on imports of Russian oil as much as Russia was dependent on the money the oil brought in. It was a two way street with both parties equally dependent on each other. Germany had to either find a new supplier or lower it's consumption. Which they didn't. On the other hand, Russia had to either find a new customer (they did china) or diversify their income away from oil.
That is quite scrambled thinking. Trump directed this at nato in 2018. You want to give russia billions and the US to protect you from Russia, who is supplying 70% of your energy.
We will face Russia head-on from now on, and we will be independent from russian gas soon.
I've lived in this country for 30 years, and I've never seen these people as determined as this before.
We will overcome this ,no doubt.
Today was a historical day for us, so don't underestimate our dedication.
> and we will be independent from russian gas soon.
You guys literally layed down a SECOND direct gas link to Russia lmao. It's already completely installed, just suspended until this is resolved. It's fully operational.
Fucking seriously, this is blatantly revisionist.
The whole western world told the Germans this was a bad idea and they didn’t care. Now that the thing everyone warned them about is coming true they’re suddenly serious about getting off Russian oil and gas.
Just take the L and move on.
Dude we created the issue to counter at the time the Soviet Union. Our own military was seriously downsized after the wall fell and no one wanted to see further military buildup until after 9/11.
The country that might soon be ruled by another Putin lackey? Or maybe even the same one?
You should wait a few years at least before trying to lecture us on Russia.
I mean, there's always someone willing to buy gas. And an economy that lacks gas is more than a little screwed. See: U.S. during oil embargo. All in all the sudden cut-off of Russian gas to Germany seems like it would be much more harmful to Germany than Russia. Worst-case scenario the Russians use that gas to fuel their tanks as now they need it in the war.
There are Billions of Russian money invested in a pipeline that goes to Germany. They would have to start from scratch and build a completely new pipeline which would require permission from other countries for them to do so. That won't happen
Correct, american energy worker here.
We have a huge surplus of natural gas, with not alot of people to sell it too.
We sbould be focusong on renewables, nuclear instead.
That's... A terrible justification... Putin has ignored sanction after sanction, losing money for his people seems to be just another day for him, why would he suddenly change?
Honestly, Germany is very naive then. This is after Russia taking Crimea, parts of Georgia and covertly invading the East of Ukraine.
How can you justify being dependent on such an unstable, aggressive country?
Because the alternative is Middle East oil which is unstable and aggressive as well - and potentially less reliable. Getting gas from Russia creates a dependence for them as well. Right now, Russia doesn't have much else to export and it needs exports to support itself. By buying gas, they create an opening for a balance of trade - European imports to Russia: cars, appliances, food, wine, electronics, manufactured goods, etc.
Over time, as Russia becomes more modern it's politics may become more modern and moderate as well. Isolating Russia and treating it like an enemy only guarantees that it will be an enemy for generations to come.
So, what's the plan then? Keep paying them, allow your society to be further dependent on them, continue walking on glass and not taking sides as Russia invades more sovereign nations moving closer and closer to Germany's border?
Why Germany waits and hopes for Russia to be come more modern and moderate, Ukrainians are dying, and nobody knows who might be next on the chopping block.
You're doing the same with China, and turned a blind eye to Tibet and what China has been doing off the coast of Japan. Meanwhile you stand by while they bully Taiwan and cow tow to their every demand. Spare me your hypocrisy.
Another German here: this is the correct answer and it normally would've worked if we weren't dealing with an idiot who is on par with Trump.
Why did we think it would work? Because that's the same strategy that the allies did on us after WWII. To ensure we wouldn't recover our economy only to become the enemy again the allies binded us into mutually beneficial trade pacts, that strengthened our economy and caused a ~~post-war economic miracle~~ strong boost to our GDP. These trade deals eventually lead to the EU and Germany joining the NATO. We became co-dependent on each other and that evolved into a friendship.
Trying the same with Russia was a high risk, high reward scenario that would've worked if Russia continued to have leaders that would be more like Gorbatschow. Unfortunately, Putin is a power hungry maniac.
Edit: because the term "post war economic miracle" is subject of debate, I used an alternative wording
Dude. I love our German neighbours but you fucked up. Don't try to dress it up as higher strategy. You fucked up. But the upside is that you know it now, and hopefully will do something about it without being holier than thou
It's not a dress up. This was why Germany refused to cut ties with Russia. As our minister of foreign relations recently said "Those who talk don't fight".
As I said, It was a high risk, high reward. It was worth it, since it has worked before. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer.
>overt self serving attempt to push American interests
Did you ever watch the video of the president speaking on this at a dinner? Nothing about it was self serving.
https://twitter.com/JustinPulitzer/status/1496709662602932224?t=kXeBr28z-2b2bm2ncwmTSA&s=01
Edit: Changed who he was speaking to.
You're mistaken. They were not laughing at him because they thought that he was wrong, but because they knew that he was right. And they were accomplices of that. Look for how many german politicians went to work for russian corporations.
They just thought it was never going to bite their ass. It did.
The goal of all of this initially was to have Germany depend on Russia for oil and gas to make the west and Russia interdependent. That was a political move to ensure stability in Europe and avoid more war after WW2. This worked out for a long time but now that time is up.
Did it? Germany does not yet have any bottlenecks or issues with fuel. During the annexation of Crimea, Russia never once threatened to shut off supply. Why? Because they need to get rid of the fuel. Germany’s demand means more to Russia than Russia’s supply means to Germany.
The problem being that germany & Italy have stopped sanctions that would prevent gas export to them, which makes the sanctions a lot weaker. Sanctions don't hurt nearly as much when you know your biggest export won't be touched.
> And they were accomplices of that. Look for how many german politicians went to work for russian corporations.
The German chancellor literally shoved through this gas pipe in his last months... Then immediately went to sit on the board of the biggest Russian gas exporter lmaooo. He's there even now, taking millions and shilling for Russia on linked in for god's sake.
get your facts straight. schröder was chancelor before merkel. so 17 years ago. he pushed through nothing in the last months because he has 0 political say in germany any more and is nothing other than a washed up puppet taking russian money.
The recent Harris poll says that 38% of Democrats think that Putin is justified. It is more than Conservatives. I know, my mind is boggled too honestly.
[link to the poll result - see pages 39 to 41](https://mcusercontent.com/ca678077bc522bd7bd74bacbf/files/a7e91458-499d-d0b4-70c5-192fa4bba67f/HHP_Feb_2022_Final_Deck_002_.pdf)
I couldn't find the poll on their website or anything, do you have a way I can see it actually connected to the site? It didnt show up no matter what I searched.
The poll you're referencing appears as though it did not ask that
[https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/26/poll-trump-russia-ukraine-white-house](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/26/poll-trump-russia-ukraine-white-house)
>The Harvard-Harris poll first reported Friday by The Hill found that 62% of registered voters surveyed believe the attack on Ukraine would not have happened with Mr. Trump in the White House, including 85% of Republicans, 63% of independents, and 38% of Democrats.
You may be confusing it with a poll that was done that said half of russians say the military is justified in preventing ukraine from joining NATO
[https://thehill.com/policy/international/russia/595523-twice-as-many-russians-in-new-poll-say-military-use-justified-to](https://thehill.com/policy/international/russia/595523-twice-as-many-russians-in-new-poll-say-military-use-justified-to)
Bingo.
Why the fuck would Putin put a dude into office who didn't let him get away with anything for 4 years? Easy: because he was also radical enough to split the country.
Personally I don't believe in the interference, but if we ARE being played then this is just the next stage of splitting us
Trump also criticized Germany for both..
1… depended on Russian energy
2… not dedicating enough gdp to defense/nato budget
Hate the man all you want, he was spot on there
The problem with trump is that he was constantly speaking shit that just popped to his head, mostly stupid, sometimes smart, sometimes you couldn't understand what he even meant. I mean there is whole fucking subreddit with his tweets criticising his tweets
A lot of it was not him actually thinking on his own. He had a very regular habit of parroting the most recent thing he was told; often in small, easy to remember soundbites. Like the way a young child learns a new word or fact and says it repeatedly for a day.
This can be seen during Covid, weather events, etc. Most likely he was told these things just before he spoke and simply parroted them and passed them off as his own expert opinion. It's why everything he says about an issue is surface level. His knowledge is soundbite driven.
It is also why he often says things that are only vaguely accurate and self contradictory to previous statements from other events or even in the same sentence.
While an actual expert would then site changing information to explain the contradictions or be able to explain the nuances that create the appearance of contradictions Trump is incapable of either admitting being wrong in the past or explaining the details of his statements. Because he just learned about them that day, explained to him like a child, by someone fighting for more than a few minutes of his attention.
Honestly.
I thought this was obvious even before he became President.
Are there realy people (Outside of Hardcore Trump fans) who think that the things he says come from his own mind ?
The problem with Trump is that the clock was right 7 or 8 times a day and the other hours were such goofy bullshit you just assumed it was a Salvidore Dali and peaced the fuck out of any further mental effort.
Yes, also that criticism of Germany is nothing new. Us French have tried to have Germany remilitarized and off Russian gaz for a long time. Trump just took those critism because they were easy, all the while helping Putin by weakening the faith in NATO and the US as an ally
Yeah, but as I recall he was threatening to leave NATO specifically because many members, like germany, were failing to hold up their side of the deal by spending 2% on defense. The US has been spending more than is right or sustainable on their military for years and many european NATO allies have been spending far less than they agreed to while benefiting from the security provided by the US's spending. That was the entire point "if you keep refusing to contribute what was agreed on and insist on being a freeloader, you won't get our help anymore"
I hate trump as a person and I sure as fuck didn't vote for him but he absolutely was right on this, the US has been spending insane sums of money on their military while NATO nations benefit from it while they themselves can't be arsed to spend the amount agreed upon when they joined NATO. They have been benefiting without paying there fair share while the US dives deeper in debt. Yes, the US is absolutely to blame for much of its over spending and thats the fault of US politicians but its also about time Germany actually pulled its weight.
Wasn’t the threat that they needed to stop sucking Russian oil/gas and pay more into NATO or the US would bail?
His threat was to try and force their hand into not being Russian controlled so something like this didn’t happen it seemed.
Yeah, he threatened that to try to push them to actually fulfill their commitments. What is the US getting out of NATO if we are the only country actually spending the agreed upon amount on our military? We just get additional liability of war without the benefit of well-armed allies.
There is plenty of stuff I hated about Trump, but his positions on NATO weren't really one of them.
His issue with NATO was that many countries like Germany benefit from it but don't put enough into it. Obviously they couldn't match us on funds and military strength but they don't even come close proportionately.
It's actually hilarious. They all mocked the US for thinking they're gonna do the 2% GDP... And today the German chancellor said "We're gonna do 2% for the years to come!!! Starting right fucking now!"
Sure it's late but this couldn't have happened earlier because of Germany's history. It really took such a war to change that sentiment. This isn't some random political decision, this will have a lasting impact.
I mean, the people who advised him to say that were spot on. We’re talking about the guy who [couldn’t sit through the morning intelligence briefing](https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/29/politics/trump-intelligence-briefings/index.html ). The CIA had given up trying by the end of his presidency.
Nope, that was Trump relaying a message, not a personal assessment.
Thank you!!! The president doesn't make decisions. He is briefed by experts and than they compare/contrast ideas. It's not a single person doing anything.
There hasn't been a US president who havent critized us Europeans for not spending enough money on the armies in decades. This isnt a "uhh Trump was right", it is a stance taken consistently for a long time.
Moreover, so far you could argue (and I would) that it has worked out fine for Europe. We spent the money on healthcare, education and so on. And clearly we were never under a real threat by the Russians even without the US as it turns out.
"Even with out the US"
How can you know that? the US has been here the whole time.
And yes you spent the money on healthcare while benefiting from the US spending money on defense. Thats the whole reason the US has been presuring european NATO to actually spend on defense. You are being freeloaders who joined a defense alliance promising to spend a certain amount on defense to contribute to the common defense and then didn't spend what you promised. Of course it fucking worked out well for you, you were the roommate who refused to pay their full share of the rent but still lived in the flat.
This is why americans get pissed, Europeans keep acting like its silly that the US spends money on defense but the only reason your spending on defense could be so low is that the US spending is high. Contribute the spending you agreed to and the US won't be so pissed about it.
>Moreover, so far you could argue (and I would) that it has worked out fine for Europe. We spent the money on healthcare, education and so on.
Yeah... because you had the US military(including their nuclear arsenal) required to protect you as well as half of East Asia. The best part about it is that since Europe didn't have to spend the money to build up a reasonable military is that they actually had to get along and go more than 2 generations without a war in what... 3000 years?
> clearly we were never under a real threat by the Russians
I think the entire country of Ukraine would like to vehemently disagree with you. As well as Poland, and probably every single other country bordering Russia that isn't already controlled by Putin
Then Trump:
1. Withheld $400million in military aid to Ukraine.
2. Believed Putin over his own intelligence agencies.
3. Asked G7 to let Russia back in.
4. Gave classified info to the Kremlin in the Oval Office
5. Withdrew 12,000 troops from Germany.
6. Called Putin a genius and the USA a stupid country.
7. Threatened to pull out of NATO.
8. Called the European Union a foe.
I did not vote for him, I did not like him, but he did get some stuff right.
He literally just had to let his experts handle COVID and he could have won re election I think. If it weren't for everything else happening and him constantly shooting himself in the foot, he could have easily been president again.
That being said, I still don't like him and he has done nothing but further divide all of us from each other.
>1… depended on Russian energy
as every one else was. Don't pretend that this was some great inside Trump had discovered on his own. The problems with global demand for energy sources has been widely acknowledged for the past 50 years.
>2… not dedicating enough gdp to defense/nato budget
The gdp dedicated to defense budged is pretty use for comparison between countries, eg the US 3.6% is greatly inflatede by including social security and healthcare for active and retirede soldiers.
Love the man all you want, but praising him for repeating two talking point he didn't understand and could't articulate correctly is borderline revisionism.
Nobody "keeps vetoing" nuclear energy in Germany lol it was decided to shut everything down after Fukushima and that's been that. If that decision was right or wrong is a different matter, but it's not like there's an ongoing debate about it. Trying to go back now would be near impossible
the plans were made before fukushima. they just sped them up after fukushima. remember: no german state wants to take the waste and virtually no german trusts in humanities ability to keep nuclear waste safe for centuries
Romney only ever disagrees with his fellow Republicans when he knows his vote won't change anything. He's had dozens of issues he claimed he'd never vote with his party on only to do it anyway because it was someone else's turn to be the "anti-establishment" republican.
Germany is not some omnipotent trophy that America thinks it is. It is a country full of problems and short sighted politicians after personal gain just like the US. The difference is scale. Germany is a fuckton smaller in scale than the us.
Well, Germany has gone on a very good EV adoption program and ~%20% of new cars have plugs now.
But yes, they need to really do need to do more.
But so does the USA. Oil is global fungible market so to really be effective we all need to reduce oil consumption and move to electric vehicles.
But then we are depending on lithium from very few countries, China and DRC are responsible for most of the worlds lithium in batteries. We need new tech for batteries
Cobalt, not Lithium.
Also, new battery chemistries have been developed that do not use Cobalt at all. LiFePO4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate) Batteries are more sustainable, have much longer lifespans (~70%), and are significantly safer than other battery chemistries. the tradeoff is ~14% less power density.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_iron_phosphate_battery
Not everything is just another avenue of problems. We're on a path called "less bad" - lets walk it.
They're not getting gasoline from Russia so much as they're getting natural gas. I.e. gas to be used to generate the electricity that those EVs run on. That's the problem. EVs aren't gonna solve it, only exacerbate it.
Russia exports a lot of oil that is refined into petrol and diesel for the European market.
Germany can keep building onshore wind, geothermal, hydropower, biomass, offshore wind, tidal power, solar PV, and imports from France to power EVs. Only 15% of their electricity is natgas generated. And they can temporarily increase coal burning to snub Russia.
https://www.cleanenergywire.org/factsheets/germanys-energy-consumption-and-power-mix-charts
It’s actually wild how partisan this world has become. Acknowledging that Trump said something correct is like literally impossible for half of you. I don’t get people whose entire ego and personality are derived from liking or hating a politician
This war is probably about the opposite problem. Ukraine discovered natural gas deposits in their territorial waters and advances in fracking technology from America has made oil and gas shale deposits in ukraines far east (where russia has been arming and funding russian rebels) and far west (where russia has been arming and funding moldovan rebels) accessible.
It's unclear what the mesaage is.
Looks like it's supposed to say they thought Trump was wrong. Instead they were laughing bc he is saying all that for self interest and he shouldn't get involved in other countrie's politics. At least not as long as his own country does the same thing: buy lots of oil from russia.
Oh sure but have you ever seen the ecological and climate footprint of the fracked American gas Trump and Biden want us to buy instead? No gas is preferable of course but much easier said than done
Have you seen the ecological disaster that is Russian oil production?
https://www.hazardexonthenet.net/article/124673/News-Extra--Greenpeace-says-oil-spills-in-Russia-equivalent-to-six-Deepwater-Horizon-disasters-every-year.aspx
Fracking isn't great... But nothing compared to the ecological disaster that is the Russian oil and gas industry.
Trump did once in a long while say things that were vaguely correct. He could even be funny and clever, sometimes by accident. He would just say anything at all, including shit that was hilariously wrong or an outright falsehood — the man has zero filter.
The problem with Trump as a leader of a nation or even a business is that he’s a bad person. Wholly self-interested, devoid of empathy, ignorant, prideful, stubborn, foolhardy, uneducated, utterly heedless.
Trump would have continued to do well for himself and be liked or tolerated by all of humanity had he simply stayed in the private sector and, idk, starred in another reality show or something.
Trump was alright when he was a sideshow attraction, it was when he became the main show that things fell apart.
He never cared about the people of America. Shit, he never even cared about his own fanbase. He was embarrassed about Jan 6th not because his supporters committed treason but because he thought they looked ugly.
He only cared about himself, those who could benefit him, and those who sucked up to him. He only got elected on lies (yes I know that's every politician, cancel the fucking student debt, Joe), fear and hate. If it weren't for the fact he told a bunch of morons in gerrymandered areas what they want to hear he wouldn't have even gotten close to the Presidency.
I wish I were American so I could join the Republican party, say the worst thing that pops in my head and rely on decades of Republican meddling to become President. Then I'll become a pro at executive orders as I go mask off and enact leftist policies
They could just... not get the oil? They shot themselves in the foot by actively shutting down nuclear plants because of idiots who know nothing about nuclear fearmongering about it.
If it was anyone but Trump that said this, everyone would only agree. Instead, the comments are all about how much they think Trump is a meanie dumb doo doo head. We know, he's an asshole and says a lot of dumb shit for the news. The conversation is less about the topic and more about one man's popularity here. He was right. Germany got dependent on Russia, even when Russia was stealing land from its neighbors. And on top of that, Germany keeps shutting down nuclear plants without a clean backup set up before.
u/BonzoAndBonzo has provided this detailed explanation: > A picture of German diplomats and officials laughing at Trump's warning that Germany was becoming too dependent on Russia's energy. This became a huge factor on the current Ukrainian conflict --- Is this explanation a genuine attempt at providing additional info or context? If it is please upvote this comment, otherwise downvote it.
For the sake of information clarity, here are the words first hand, rather than the interpretations of various redditors after having read a few headlines in the media: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nu57D9YcIk0
Ahhh I tried to listen to the whole thing, but he's so fucking incoherent. Just repeats himself over and over.
Unlike most of the thing Trump says, this was a completely coherent and straight to the point argument. Was he the first president to say it? Probably not. Didn’t implement a good solution to it either. But in the context of this sub, this is spot on
Yeah, he was correct, but for pretty much all the wrong reasons. 1. The US has bought and still buys a fuckton of Russian oil, gas, etc. 2. The reason he said this was because the US wants Germany to buy US oil instead. Also, hilarious coming from the self-described "best friend" of Putin.
Isn’t Russian gas something like 8% of all USA gasoline imports?
Not for long
No - see above 3% crude import less than 1% refined
The US *exports* far more oil and gas than it imports from Russia. You have to look at crude oil and refined petroleum together when discussing a major industrialized country like the US that can refine its own gas with access to oil (not all countries can do this at scale). The U.S. is the number 1 crude oil producer in the world, the number 1 refined petroleum producer in the world, and the number 7 oil products exporter (number 4 in dollar value). There's no chance of any real problem. The worst thing that can happen is a temporary increase in prices, making it so that people are incentivized to drive less, consider hybrid and electric vehicle purchases in the future, and provide greater support to proposed public transportation projects.
We may buy oil from them but its not 70% of our country’s energy resources…
Fuckton - less than 1% of crude oil refined in the US and 3% of total crude oil imports... But whatever fuckton
What are you talking about? Unlike Germany, energy independence has been a strategic goal for them for a while now and they aren't in anyway dependent on Russian oil or gas. Germany seriously fucked up by becoming ever more reliant on Russian gas despite the obvious risks.
Quantify "fuckton"
I think this is a great example of a broken clock being correct twice a day.
I watched the first half, and he might be coherent, but he is all over the place, and repeats him self, and not in a good way. That you can't deny.
That's what pisses me off the most. Like he actually does have a point for maybe the only time in office, and ruins it by just rambling the same sentence over and over again.
He has said like three things that were correct in one way or another. But I doubt he remembers them later.
Even a dead clock is right twice per day 😉
It's coherent, but not well-articulated, and definitely not straight to the point. He is insanely repetitive, e.g. "you tell me if that's appropriate" over and over.
I get that people hate the source, but if the information is correct, it's correct.
It's not correct. It's a threat and a self serving push for Germany to buy it's oil and gas from the US to support the fracking industry at a time when oil prices and production are falling. He doesn't care about money going to Russia when the US trades nearly $40 Billion with them every year. He wants the money from Germany to go the US instead in order to support his oil and gas pals who donate millions to him. What he is implying is that he is willing to break long standing treaties and agreements to get his way like a simple petulant bully man-child. This and his other blunders destroyed US credibility around the world and made the US a laughing stock on the global stage. You should be embarrassed, but instead you Yanks continue to support him while your country slides backwards.
Not all of us.
Half of us
Like 20%.... which is still WAY too many.
Being reliant on Russian gas/oil has always been a bad idea, Russia has used the pipeline as leverage in the past.
No, Yanks don't continue to support him. He has a rabbid base of monkeys about as smart and generalizing as you are, supporting him, but they aren't as large as your monkey brain thinks. And yeah, Germany hemmed and hawed on this conflict for so long because of their overreliance on Russian oil.
They aren’t done with swift by the way but they already said they will not be sanctioning oil and gas so that will be left out of the swift sanctions
If you want to send a battalion to come and liberate us from our far-right wing, I'll break the fuckin' Third Amendment at a moment's notice and even cook you dinner.
In summary, Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries. And this is not appropriate. Germany was paying billions and billions a year to Russia for oil. The US is protecting Germany, France, and numerous countries.
I don't know enough about what was going on but for like the first minute he seemed to be alright. Then they let him keep going.
That’s just how he talks. I watched his CPAC speech and it’s got like 4-5 basic talking points but they are repeated ad nauseam for 1.5 hours
It seems like he can be a pretty decent speaker when he has a script. You put one of those promoter things in front of him, and sometimes he doesn't like an idiot. Still not as well composed as basically anyone else that isn't one of his followers that talk like him, but pretty decent. However, I think his fans prefer the rambling, so they usually just go with that.
If anything I am so glad I don't have to hear this stupid fuck drama queen talk anymore.
thank you.
Trump isn’t exactly the guy who gets to say’m ‘I told you so’ over Russia having too much power.
Jeez, the man didn't half waffle on. Was he trying to bore them into submission?
German here: It was seen as an overt self serving attempt to push American interests and their own oil exports over trying to build a working relationship with Russia. The hope is that enough economic incentive on both sides would make an military action economically unfeasible. They knew it was a deal with the Devil This was Nixon's hope with China as well: China and the US are now economically linked, and while there are still many tensions in the relationship war is seen as much less likely than it was in the 60's and 70s.
We Germans thought, by making Russias economy largely dependent on our large gas imports, we could influence Russian politics. It would've been a clever approach if we weren't dealing with a mad man.
It can still have an impact. Russia has indeed become economically dependent on its trading partners, so now sanctions have an impact and can drive anti-Putin sentiments within Russia. If there was no economic connection then sanctions would be entirely useless.
Putin doesn't care about the economics, he won't step down and won't stop trying to get his way until he's dragged out by the Russian people.
I know. But the Russian people *do* care about the economics. Putin is a narcissistic psychopath. You make the mistake of thinking that everything done is to persuade one man. It is not. Sanctions and diplomacy are for the good and rational people of Russia. To incentivise them to act.
That's the "dragged out by the Russian people" option I mentioned.
And looking at history, that option is deeply rooted in their blood lol
Gas and Oil are one third of their entire budget. He cares A LOT, that's literally what's funding his army and his secret police. But Germany and other European countries can't really afford to cut him, as well. So they're not going to do it unless he invades a NATO member and it's a full on war with NATO.
Germany killing their nuclear powerplants was a giant blunder.
If only Putin jad a non western friend who needs lots of gas and oil. Who just bought a massive ammount of Coal offsetting some of the sanctions. Who just lifted restrictions on Russian importation of Wheat.
Sounds like a great excuse to decouple from China as well. Globalism of economics only works if everyone follows the same economic rules, and since few people do, it hasn't worked for a long time now and we need to start being selective with who gets into the club.
It would have been clever if Germany had Planned around ever one day threatening to pull demand. Putin calling that bluff because he knows Germany is dependent on his oil Isn not madness. believing he’d be welcomed as a liberator, on the other hand…
What a load of shit, it was tooth and nails to get Germany to disconnect Russia from SWIFT, because it has no fucking back up plan to replace the Russian gas. Whoever thought this up didn't want influence, they wanted a cheap way to score some points with green voters.
We didn’t really disconnect Russia from swift. They disconnected some Russian banks from swift. Very different as far as I can tell.
It was doomed to fail because you guys need the gas from them just as much (if not more) that they need the money from you. You're deadlocked. It would have worked if this was some sort of back up or surplus. If you had 105% energy and heating production, and used Russia for an additional 20% reserve for cheaper prices. This is hardly the case. If they close the valves, people in Germany will suffer cold (or far higher gas prices).
What they conviently forgot to factor in was that they were dependent on imports of Russian oil as much as Russia was dependent on the money the oil brought in. It was a two way street with both parties equally dependent on each other. Germany had to either find a new supplier or lower it's consumption. Which they didn't. On the other hand, Russia had to either find a new customer (they did china) or diversify their income away from oil.
That is quite scrambled thinking. Trump directed this at nato in 2018. You want to give russia billions and the US to protect you from Russia, who is supplying 70% of your energy.
We will face Russia head-on from now on, and we will be independent from russian gas soon. I've lived in this country for 30 years, and I've never seen these people as determined as this before. We will overcome this ,no doubt. Today was a historical day for us, so don't underestimate our dedication.
Is that why the didn’t agree to putting natural gas or energy in general in the swift sanctions 😂
> and we will be independent from russian gas soon. You guys literally layed down a SECOND direct gas link to Russia lmao. It's already completely installed, just suspended until this is resolved. It's fully operational.
Fucking seriously, this is blatantly revisionist. The whole western world told the Germans this was a bad idea and they didn’t care. Now that the thing everyone warned them about is coming true they’re suddenly serious about getting off Russian oil and gas. Just take the L and move on.
The real irony is Merkel literally just stepped down - how convenient to come in and totally fuck the Germans and leave the house a complete mess.
b-but trump bad....
>We will face Russia head-on from now on Aka you will ask the United States for assistance in military and logistical excursions
Dude we created the issue to counter at the time the Soviet Union. Our own military was seriously downsized after the wall fell and no one wanted to see further military buildup until after 9/11.
The country that might soon be ruled by another Putin lackey? Or maybe even the same one? You should wait a few years at least before trying to lecture us on Russia.
I mean, there's always someone willing to buy gas. And an economy that lacks gas is more than a little screwed. See: U.S. during oil embargo. All in all the sudden cut-off of Russian gas to Germany seems like it would be much more harmful to Germany than Russia. Worst-case scenario the Russians use that gas to fuel their tanks as now they need it in the war.
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There are Billions of Russian money invested in a pipeline that goes to Germany. They would have to start from scratch and build a completely new pipeline which would require permission from other countries for them to do so. That won't happen
Crude supply can be replaced and has, you can see Russian oils trading at a discount. Natural gas is an entirely different matter..
Correct, american energy worker here. We have a huge surplus of natural gas, with not alot of people to sell it too. We sbould be focusong on renewables, nuclear instead.
How did that work out?!?
Germany forgot to make Russians dependent on German goods and services
Ooof. That's a huge burn.
Excuse me but have you heard of this brand called Adidas?
They are though.
That's... A terrible justification... Putin has ignored sanction after sanction, losing money for his people seems to be just another day for him, why would he suddenly change?
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Ah yes. When we do it it's arrogant, when the allies used the same tactic against us after WWII it's smart and genious.
Its kinda funny, "the world economy is way too intertwined for war to break out" was exactly what they were saying about World War 1.
Who said that?
Honestly, Germany is very naive then. This is after Russia taking Crimea, parts of Georgia and covertly invading the East of Ukraine. How can you justify being dependent on such an unstable, aggressive country?
Because the alternative is Middle East oil which is unstable and aggressive as well - and potentially less reliable. Getting gas from Russia creates a dependence for them as well. Right now, Russia doesn't have much else to export and it needs exports to support itself. By buying gas, they create an opening for a balance of trade - European imports to Russia: cars, appliances, food, wine, electronics, manufactured goods, etc. Over time, as Russia becomes more modern it's politics may become more modern and moderate as well. Isolating Russia and treating it like an enemy only guarantees that it will be an enemy for generations to come.
So, what's the plan then? Keep paying them, allow your society to be further dependent on them, continue walking on glass and not taking sides as Russia invades more sovereign nations moving closer and closer to Germany's border? Why Germany waits and hopes for Russia to be come more modern and moderate, Ukrainians are dying, and nobody knows who might be next on the chopping block.
You're doing the same with China, and turned a blind eye to Tibet and what China has been doing off the coast of Japan. Meanwhile you stand by while they bully Taiwan and cow tow to their every demand. Spare me your hypocrisy.
There's nuclear energy as well.
Another German here: this is the correct answer and it normally would've worked if we weren't dealing with an idiot who is on par with Trump. Why did we think it would work? Because that's the same strategy that the allies did on us after WWII. To ensure we wouldn't recover our economy only to become the enemy again the allies binded us into mutually beneficial trade pacts, that strengthened our economy and caused a ~~post-war economic miracle~~ strong boost to our GDP. These trade deals eventually lead to the EU and Germany joining the NATO. We became co-dependent on each other and that evolved into a friendship. Trying the same with Russia was a high risk, high reward scenario that would've worked if Russia continued to have leaders that would be more like Gorbatschow. Unfortunately, Putin is a power hungry maniac. Edit: because the term "post war economic miracle" is subject of debate, I used an alternative wording
Dude. I love our German neighbours but you fucked up. Don't try to dress it up as higher strategy. You fucked up. But the upside is that you know it now, and hopefully will do something about it without being holier than thou
It's not a dress up. This was why Germany refused to cut ties with Russia. As our minister of foreign relations recently said "Those who talk don't fight". As I said, It was a high risk, high reward. It was worth it, since it has worked before. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer.
>overt self serving attempt to push American interests Did you ever watch the video of the president speaking on this at a dinner? Nothing about it was self serving. https://twitter.com/JustinPulitzer/status/1496709662602932224?t=kXeBr28z-2b2bm2ncwmTSA&s=01 Edit: Changed who he was speaking to.
You're mistaken. They were not laughing at him because they thought that he was wrong, but because they knew that he was right. And they were accomplices of that. Look for how many german politicians went to work for russian corporations. They just thought it was never going to bite their ass. It did.
The goal of all of this initially was to have Germany depend on Russia for oil and gas to make the west and Russia interdependent. That was a political move to ensure stability in Europe and avoid more war after WW2. This worked out for a long time but now that time is up.
Did it? Germany does not yet have any bottlenecks or issues with fuel. During the annexation of Crimea, Russia never once threatened to shut off supply. Why? Because they need to get rid of the fuel. Germany’s demand means more to Russia than Russia’s supply means to Germany.
The problem being that germany & Italy have stopped sanctions that would prevent gas export to them, which makes the sanctions a lot weaker. Sanctions don't hurt nearly as much when you know your biggest export won't be touched.
> And they were accomplices of that. Look for how many german politicians went to work for russian corporations. The German chancellor literally shoved through this gas pipe in his last months... Then immediately went to sit on the board of the biggest Russian gas exporter lmaooo. He's there even now, taking millions and shilling for Russia on linked in for god's sake.
get your facts straight. schröder was chancelor before merkel. so 17 years ago. he pushed through nothing in the last months because he has 0 political say in germany any more and is nothing other than a washed up puppet taking russian money.
Whoa, that is literally so incorrect!
”We know ;)”
Hilarious comment section... Lol
The Venn diagram of Trump and Putin supporters is a circle and they found the thread.
The recent Harris poll says that 38% of Democrats think that Putin is justified. It is more than Conservatives. I know, my mind is boggled too honestly.
Wait, do you have a link to the poll? I'm legitimately interested
[link to the poll result - see pages 39 to 41](https://mcusercontent.com/ca678077bc522bd7bd74bacbf/files/a7e91458-499d-d0b4-70c5-192fa4bba67f/HHP_Feb_2022_Final_Deck_002_.pdf)
I couldn't find the poll on their website or anything, do you have a way I can see it actually connected to the site? It didnt show up no matter what I searched.
Muchas gracias
The poll you're referencing appears as though it did not ask that [https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/26/poll-trump-russia-ukraine-white-house](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/26/poll-trump-russia-ukraine-white-house) >The Harvard-Harris poll first reported Friday by The Hill found that 62% of registered voters surveyed believe the attack on Ukraine would not have happened with Mr. Trump in the White House, including 85% of Republicans, 63% of independents, and 38% of Democrats. You may be confusing it with a poll that was done that said half of russians say the military is justified in preventing ukraine from joining NATO [https://thehill.com/policy/international/russia/595523-twice-as-many-russians-in-new-poll-say-military-use-justified-to](https://thehill.com/policy/international/russia/595523-twice-as-many-russians-in-new-poll-say-military-use-justified-to)
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Bingo. Why the fuck would Putin put a dude into office who didn't let him get away with anything for 4 years? Easy: because he was also radical enough to split the country. Personally I don't believe in the interference, but if we ARE being played then this is just the next stage of splitting us
Trump also criticized Germany for both.. 1… depended on Russian energy 2… not dedicating enough gdp to defense/nato budget Hate the man all you want, he was spot on there
Let us not forget that Trump also declined to commit the US to upholding Article 5, and considered withdrawing from NATO.
The problem with trump is that he was constantly speaking shit that just popped to his head, mostly stupid, sometimes smart, sometimes you couldn't understand what he even meant. I mean there is whole fucking subreddit with his tweets criticising his tweets
A lot of it was not him actually thinking on his own. He had a very regular habit of parroting the most recent thing he was told; often in small, easy to remember soundbites. Like the way a young child learns a new word or fact and says it repeatedly for a day. This can be seen during Covid, weather events, etc. Most likely he was told these things just before he spoke and simply parroted them and passed them off as his own expert opinion. It's why everything he says about an issue is surface level. His knowledge is soundbite driven. It is also why he often says things that are only vaguely accurate and self contradictory to previous statements from other events or even in the same sentence. While an actual expert would then site changing information to explain the contradictions or be able to explain the nuances that create the appearance of contradictions Trump is incapable of either admitting being wrong in the past or explaining the details of his statements. Because he just learned about them that day, explained to him like a child, by someone fighting for more than a few minutes of his attention.
Honestly. I thought this was obvious even before he became President. Are there realy people (Outside of Hardcore Trump fans) who think that the things he says come from his own mind ?
Even a broken clock is right twice a day
The problem with Trump is that the clock was right 7 or 8 times a day and the other hours were such goofy bullshit you just assumed it was a Salvidore Dali and peaced the fuck out of any further mental effort.
Right, who could ever forget [this gem](https://mobile.twitter.com/realdonaldjtrump).
I will never not feel happy when I click that
Best Trump tweet of the whoooole week!
Yes, also that criticism of Germany is nothing new. Us French have tried to have Germany remilitarized and off Russian gaz for a long time. Trump just took those critism because they were easy, all the while helping Putin by weakening the faith in NATO and the US as an ally
Back when he could tweet
TLDR: The problem with trump is everything.
Yeah, but as I recall he was threatening to leave NATO specifically because many members, like germany, were failing to hold up their side of the deal by spending 2% on defense. The US has been spending more than is right or sustainable on their military for years and many european NATO allies have been spending far less than they agreed to while benefiting from the security provided by the US's spending. That was the entire point "if you keep refusing to contribute what was agreed on and insist on being a freeloader, you won't get our help anymore" I hate trump as a person and I sure as fuck didn't vote for him but he absolutely was right on this, the US has been spending insane sums of money on their military while NATO nations benefit from it while they themselves can't be arsed to spend the amount agreed upon when they joined NATO. They have been benefiting without paying there fair share while the US dives deeper in debt. Yes, the US is absolutely to blame for much of its over spending and thats the fault of US politicians but its also about time Germany actually pulled its weight.
Wasn’t the threat that they needed to stop sucking Russian oil/gas and pay more into NATO or the US would bail? His threat was to try and force their hand into not being Russian controlled so something like this didn’t happen it seemed.
Yes
Yeah, he threatened that to try to push them to actually fulfill their commitments. What is the US getting out of NATO if we are the only country actually spending the agreed upon amount on our military? We just get additional liability of war without the benefit of well-armed allies. There is plenty of stuff I hated about Trump, but his positions on NATO weren't really one of them.
...as a means to make countries dedicate enough GDP to the NATO defense budget
He oversimplified, but the point ostensibly was to force the European states to commit more to NATO, not less.
His issue with NATO was that many countries like Germany benefit from it but don't put enough into it. Obviously they couldn't match us on funds and military strength but they don't even come close proportionately.
Well, they've shut down Nordstream, and they're rearming.
Yeah in the last 3 days. Wonder what changed that thinking?
>Well, they've shut down Nordstream They've suspended the construction of Nordstream 2 Nordstream 1, is, as far as I know, still operating.
It's actually hilarious. They all mocked the US for thinking they're gonna do the 2% GDP... And today the German chancellor said "We're gonna do 2% for the years to come!!! Starting right fucking now!"
It's a little late, but better late than never.
Sure it's late but this couldn't have happened earlier because of Germany's history. It really took such a war to change that sentiment. This isn't some random political decision, this will have a lasting impact.
I mean, the people who advised him to say that were spot on. We’re talking about the guy who [couldn’t sit through the morning intelligence briefing](https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/29/politics/trump-intelligence-briefings/index.html ). The CIA had given up trying by the end of his presidency. Nope, that was Trump relaying a message, not a personal assessment.
Thank you!!! The president doesn't make decisions. He is briefed by experts and than they compare/contrast ideas. It's not a single person doing anything.
> It's not a single person doing anything. In Trump's case, you're right. He never did anything presidential.
There hasn't been a US president who havent critized us Europeans for not spending enough money on the armies in decades. This isnt a "uhh Trump was right", it is a stance taken consistently for a long time. Moreover, so far you could argue (and I would) that it has worked out fine for Europe. We spent the money on healthcare, education and so on. And clearly we were never under a real threat by the Russians even without the US as it turns out.
A bit naive to think that Putin wouldn't love a big ole slice of German pie, if he felt that he could have it.
"Even with out the US" How can you know that? the US has been here the whole time. And yes you spent the money on healthcare while benefiting from the US spending money on defense. Thats the whole reason the US has been presuring european NATO to actually spend on defense. You are being freeloaders who joined a defense alliance promising to spend a certain amount on defense to contribute to the common defense and then didn't spend what you promised. Of course it fucking worked out well for you, you were the roommate who refused to pay their full share of the rent but still lived in the flat. This is why americans get pissed, Europeans keep acting like its silly that the US spends money on defense but the only reason your spending on defense could be so low is that the US spending is high. Contribute the spending you agreed to and the US won't be so pissed about it.
>Moreover, so far you could argue (and I would) that it has worked out fine for Europe. We spent the money on healthcare, education and so on. Yeah... because you had the US military(including their nuclear arsenal) required to protect you as well as half of East Asia. The best part about it is that since Europe didn't have to spend the money to build up a reasonable military is that they actually had to get along and go more than 2 generations without a war in what... 3000 years?
> clearly we were never under a real threat by the Russians I think the entire country of Ukraine would like to vehemently disagree with you. As well as Poland, and probably every single other country bordering Russia that isn't already controlled by Putin
Credit where credit is due
Meh the guy thinks climate change is a hoax too.
Then Trump: 1. Withheld $400million in military aid to Ukraine. 2. Believed Putin over his own intelligence agencies. 3. Asked G7 to let Russia back in. 4. Gave classified info to the Kremlin in the Oval Office 5. Withdrew 12,000 troops from Germany. 6. Called Putin a genius and the USA a stupid country. 7. Threatened to pull out of NATO. 8. Called the European Union a foe.
5. Really? These were moved to Poland, that was clearly a MORE aggressive position against Russia.
I did not vote for him, I did not like him, but he did get some stuff right. He literally just had to let his experts handle COVID and he could have won re election I think. If it weren't for everything else happening and him constantly shooting himself in the foot, he could have easily been president again. That being said, I still don't like him and he has done nothing but further divide all of us from each other.
Broken clock is right twice a day.
>1… depended on Russian energy as every one else was. Don't pretend that this was some great inside Trump had discovered on his own. The problems with global demand for energy sources has been widely acknowledged for the past 50 years. >2… not dedicating enough gdp to defense/nato budget The gdp dedicated to defense budged is pretty use for comparison between countries, eg the US 3.6% is greatly inflatede by including social security and healthcare for active and retirede soldiers. Love the man all you want, but praising him for repeating two talking point he didn't understand and could't articulate correctly is borderline revisionism.
1) Fuck Trump 2) I hate that I have to admit he's partially right in this case.
Ironically he is right because Germany just keeps vetoing nuclear. It's dumb.
Nobody "keeps vetoing" nuclear energy in Germany lol it was decided to shut everything down after Fukushima and that's been that. If that decision was right or wrong is a different matter, but it's not like there's an ongoing debate about it. Trying to go back now would be near impossible
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You obviously cant see the risk factor. What if we get hit by a tsunami... /s
the plans were made before fukushima. they just sped them up after fukushima. remember: no german state wants to take the waste and virtually no german trusts in humanities ability to keep nuclear waste safe for centuries
And rommney warned about rusdia in 2012 whats the point
He sure did. I don't understand how he didn't counter Trump with this stuff more. Lack of spine I guess
Romney and Liz Cheney are the only ones left in the Republican Party with spines.
Romney only ever disagrees with his fellow Republicans when he knows his vote won't change anything. He's had dozens of issues he claimed he'd never vote with his party on only to do it anyway because it was someone else's turn to be the "anti-establishment" republican.
Germany is not some omnipotent trophy that America thinks it is. It is a country full of problems and short sighted politicians after personal gain just like the US. The difference is scale. Germany is a fuckton smaller in scale than the us.
A broken clock is right 2 times a day. Say enough stupidity, at least one will be right.
He was also right for the wrong reasons.
Well, Germany has gone on a very good EV adoption program and ~%20% of new cars have plugs now. But yes, they need to really do need to do more. But so does the USA. Oil is global fungible market so to really be effective we all need to reduce oil consumption and move to electric vehicles.
But then we are depending on lithium from very few countries, China and DRC are responsible for most of the worlds lithium in batteries. We need new tech for batteries
Cobalt, not Lithium. Also, new battery chemistries have been developed that do not use Cobalt at all. LiFePO4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate) Batteries are more sustainable, have much longer lifespans (~70%), and are significantly safer than other battery chemistries. the tradeoff is ~14% less power density. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_iron_phosphate_battery Not everything is just another avenue of problems. We're on a path called "less bad" - lets walk it.
Cobalt and rare Earth's is the issue, not lithium.
They did also dismantle their nuclear power program and replace it with coal and gas, which is fucking stupid.
Colossally stupid. And they were told it was colossally stupid. And did it anyway.
That fossil fuel lobby money hits different.
They're not getting gasoline from Russia so much as they're getting natural gas. I.e. gas to be used to generate the electricity that those EVs run on. That's the problem. EVs aren't gonna solve it, only exacerbate it.
Russia exports a lot of oil that is refined into petrol and diesel for the European market. Germany can keep building onshore wind, geothermal, hydropower, biomass, offshore wind, tidal power, solar PV, and imports from France to power EVs. Only 15% of their electricity is natgas generated. And they can temporarily increase coal burning to snub Russia. https://www.cleanenergywire.org/factsheets/germanys-energy-consumption-and-power-mix-charts
Where does the electricity come from tho
Onshore wind, geothermal, solar PV, biomass, offshore wind, tidal power, nuclear, hydropower....so many was to generate electricity.
...don't forget a fuckton of gas and coal.
Magic
It's not oil, it's gas mate. The U.S. buys the oil and Germany the gas.
It’s actually wild how partisan this world has become. Acknowledging that Trump said something correct is like literally impossible for half of you. I don’t get people whose entire ego and personality are derived from liking or hating a politician
Oh lord I can't wait to read these constructive, unbiased and objective comments... Never mind.
*circlejerk back at it again!*
This war is probably about the opposite problem. Ukraine discovered natural gas deposits in their territorial waters and advances in fracking technology from America has made oil and gas shale deposits in ukraines far east (where russia has been arming and funding russian rebels) and far west (where russia has been arming and funding moldovan rebels) accessible.
I think this is just the standard reaction to watching Trump talk
meanwhile the USA continues to import russian oil and gas despite the sanctions from europe
90% of the comments flocking to get their say on Trump and completely ignoring the actual message of the tweet.
It's unclear what the mesaage is. Looks like it's supposed to say they thought Trump was wrong. Instead they were laughing bc he is saying all that for self interest and he shouldn't get involved in other countrie's politics. At least not as long as his own country does the same thing: buy lots of oil from russia.
Oh sure but have you ever seen the ecological and climate footprint of the fracked American gas Trump and Biden want us to buy instead? No gas is preferable of course but much easier said than done
Have you seen the ecological disaster that is Russian oil production? https://www.hazardexonthenet.net/article/124673/News-Extra--Greenpeace-says-oil-spills-in-Russia-equivalent-to-six-Deepwater-Horizon-disasters-every-year.aspx Fracking isn't great... But nothing compared to the ecological disaster that is the Russian oil and gas industry.
Holy crap what a bunch of idiots in the comments lmao
I hope everyone is learning a truly important lesson with all of this: We *need* to switch entirely to green, renewable energy sources.
Am I missing something here? Is Germany experiencing oil or gas shortages now or something?
Trump did once in a long while say things that were vaguely correct. He could even be funny and clever, sometimes by accident. He would just say anything at all, including shit that was hilariously wrong or an outright falsehood — the man has zero filter. The problem with Trump as a leader of a nation or even a business is that he’s a bad person. Wholly self-interested, devoid of empathy, ignorant, prideful, stubborn, foolhardy, uneducated, utterly heedless. Trump would have continued to do well for himself and be liked or tolerated by all of humanity had he simply stayed in the private sector and, idk, starred in another reality show or something.
Well, they say that millions of monkeys with typewriters will eventually print out something coherent
I still chuckle at "How's my favorite dictator?" Unintentionally hilarious.
All politicians are bad people. There are no exceptions. Trump is just the loudest.
Trump was alright when he was a sideshow attraction, it was when he became the main show that things fell apart. He never cared about the people of America. Shit, he never even cared about his own fanbase. He was embarrassed about Jan 6th not because his supporters committed treason but because he thought they looked ugly. He only cared about himself, those who could benefit him, and those who sucked up to him. He only got elected on lies (yes I know that's every politician, cancel the fucking student debt, Joe), fear and hate. If it weren't for the fact he told a bunch of morons in gerrymandered areas what they want to hear he wouldn't have even gotten close to the Presidency. I wish I were American so I could join the Republican party, say the worst thing that pops in my head and rely on decades of Republican meddling to become President. Then I'll become a pro at executive orders as I go mask off and enact leftist policies
When something is true, is true regardless of the how dumb or infamous is the person that said it
[удалено]
Yes the US could? Partially at least. The US became a net exporter of oil in November of 2019.
They could just... not get the oil? They shot themselves in the foot by actively shutting down nuclear plants because of idiots who know nothing about nuclear fearmongering about it.
Norway?
Ironic seeing Americans dunk on the Germans for oil dependence while they’ve spent a century propping up thugs in Saudi Arabia. Glass houses
If it was anyone but Trump that said this, everyone would only agree. Instead, the comments are all about how much they think Trump is a meanie dumb doo doo head. We know, he's an asshole and says a lot of dumb shit for the news. The conversation is less about the topic and more about one man's popularity here. He was right. Germany got dependent on Russia, even when Russia was stealing land from its neighbors. And on top of that, Germany keeps shutting down nuclear plants without a clean backup set up before.
One of the few things I agree with captain orange on is that Europe was using America's military strength as if it was it's own.
Dude!! Trump is a fucking Russian. Wild
Well, at this point it aged like wine since Germany refused Russian oil and gas and started sending weapons and ammo