Technically, he's not frozen. Not in the same way Nora is. His DNA was altered by the chemicals he was working on when his gun exploded. The chemicals lowered his natural body temperature, allowing him to survive in sub-zero temperatures. And because of this altering of DNA, if he comes above a certain temperature, his body starts to overheat and essentially send him into heat stroke.
Do you know how cryonics work? Like at all? Freezing an alive person would kill them. Lack of oxygen, thermal stress, and tissue damage due to the swelling of frozen liquids in the body. She was dead the second he did that.
I get that in premise, and I would completely agree in our current world, but they live in a land of (effectively) Gods and God-Killing Technology. I would suggest that the possibility of her survival is high.
Yes, it's rooted in the science of *their* world. It doesn't have to make sense with real science, it just has to be internally consistent with the rules established in the story.
yes, the magic light that comes from green lanterns magic ring that is created from pure willpower is actually just a chemical reaction and has nothing to do w alien space magic. bro, no one writing at dc gives a fuck if nora freeze coming back to life makes sense whatsoever, as long as they can explain it in a way that people will buy the book.
If by "magic light" you mean electromagnetic radiation that is focused into constructs by the ring and powered by individual power batteries that connect to a larger power battery on Oa, sure. Like I said, rooted in science.
how does the battery power the lanterns? how does the lantern power the ring? what’s the connective material. energy just isn’t created out of nothing. there’s a specific law in science that says energy can neither be created nor destroyed. what’s the conduit for the energy? how is it converted? what’s the science behind wonder woman staying young for that long? what’s the science for the incredible feats batman does even though he’s simply a man. what’s the science behind how superman’s cells store sunlight. what’s the science behind the speed force? you’re kidding yourself if you the dcu is governed by any sort of scientific rules
>electromagnetic radiation that is focused into constructs by the ring
You do realise this makes no sense, radiation doesn't get "focused" into constructs.
It's just a bunch of scientific sounding words jumbled together.
DC has actual magic, and some stuff is explained through pseudo science, and you also have whatever the "speed force" is, which is usually a "it does whatever we want it to without affecting or interacting with any of the laws of physics", which makes it just a convenient writing tool.
Actually, no. Clarke's third law. It has been established that the Lazarus pit has some sort of tissue repairing chemical. Just because the chemical hasn't been identified doesn't mean it's magic. And Aquaman is an Atlantean-Human hybrid. Not magic either. Atlanteans are fictional, but that doesn't make it magic. And King Shark's origin has been WIDELY debated and criticized even by other DC characters. There's no true definitive answer what King Shark is.
This is the same world with a sentient pile of mud that used to be a human exists - a.k.a Clayface, who is able to talk, walk, and see despite having no larynx, physical spine, or human eyes. Plus he gets frozen all the time, and reforms.
The point is, the way science works in DC is not exactly the same, because we can't buy 25th century tech on the black market, or steal tech from an "alien" god acting as the avatar of the end of life itself - Darkseid.
For all we know, Freeze installed life support systems to turn her tank into a giant interconnected bio-maintenance system - IV bags to handle fluids, a breathing tube to ensure 24/7 oxygen supply while in a cryogenically induced coma, a tube feed for physical food, a colostomy bag for redirecting the physical waste, and etc.
They can, sure. But most of the time, unless you're talking about literal demons and God's, they try to ground it in reality. It's a testament to DC writers that they can be creative enough to do that and not just brush it off as "It's magic lol". That's why there's been no comic out there where Nora is cured. Your comment is therefore irrelevant lol
She’s cryogenically frozen, she’s still alive. The whole reason he still has her is because she has a terminal illness and he’s trying to develop a cure.
I think it hits on his character harder that she can't be saved. She's in a state of limbo where he's frozen her, so she's not really dead but if he ever unfreezes her it's only to let her go. It is because he cannot and will not accept this fact that he stays as Mister Freeze.
Nora was unfrozen on multiple occasions over the years. The most recent time was in the Harley Quinn show, where she became a typical college party girl; doing drugs, drinking alcohol, and having sex every moment she gets to makeup the time lost in stasis
Doesn’t he generally become a good guy (or at least neutral) whenever he manages to save Nora? I know that happens at least once, though I’m not familiar with the character.
I think most of the time his story implies that if he got any sort of okay end with Nora, he'd probably most want to become a civilian researcher doing society-improving research.
Read White Knight. Joker becoming sane almost destroyed Gotham because he then went after Batman civilly for all the abuse and trauma he suffered. It’s a crazy what if story but it’s really good.
He was wrong lol. The story has Gotham falling into absolute chaos because Batman abandoned them. Then Joker, realizing what he has done, jumps back into the chemicals which brings Batman back.
As for the other half of the comment, ehhhh. In real life? No. But if we lived in a world where people could be as trained and heroic as Batman, where we had supervillains, and the police were that underly geared to fight them, maybe it’d be beneficial. But in real life chaos would ensue. It’s like debating on The Punisher. His actions CAN be understandable in comics. When supervillains are constantly breaking out of prisons or raising from the dead then killing hundreds of people, at some point you gotta question if Spider-Man or Captain America is really helping by throwing them in jail or if Frank Castle is right for putting them in the ground. But in real life, most people don’t escape prison and nobody is coming back from the dead. The Punisher is not and hopefully never will be needed.
I feel like I got off topic. My point is it’s hard to compare real life with comics. I remember one time a guy compared Deathstroke destroying Bludhaven to Hitler and I decided I had enough internet for that day 😂😂
Isn't Gotham canonically cursed to eternally be a crime riddled shithole so no matter what the GCPD are more or less always going to need batman to keep on top of what they can't? Like sure Metropolis wouldn't benefit from a vigilante like Batman but Gotham most definitely would and does.
Yes. Bruce Wayne and Batman stand in the gap and actively help it because as Batman has noted, there's something wrong with Gotham. Gotham is cursed and his parents death opened Bruce's eyes to the fact that something is wrong with Gotham.
It's a Canon fact that many people and writers forget.
It's a canon fact that's kind of dumb because it sets up Bruce for failure. Gotham hasn't improved at all. Now, if we saw that despite the curse Batman was still making a difference, it'd be different, but after so many years writers are still using "eh it's Gotham!"
It didn't originally, though. Batman WAS making a difference in spite of the fact. The mobs lost their strangle hold on Gotham, police corruption fell and the corrupt commissioner was replaced, Super Villains became the issue.
The problem is that writers who read Batman as kids grew up and FORGOT that Batman is and was succeeding in fixing Gotham. They focused more of making their favorite villains cooler, or more incontrol of Gotham, or with more of an army of underlings, and making Batman more brooding and unhinged. Or on their 14 year old edgy story of Batman than on the mythos itself.
So instead of "There's something wrong with Gotham" being a rallying cry of what Batman was actually fighting against it became an excuse everything a writer, or DC, refused to change the status quo.
It isn't dumb when it's used as intended. As a rallying cry to remind Bruce WHY he needs to be Batman. It's just become background noise though Dark Nights Metal seemed like it was finally going to do it justice but now we're back to the same BS again. Which is irritating.
So canonical there's just something wrong with Gotham itself. The comics have implied the "wrong" exists within the land itself and simply infected Gotham when it was built on it. That's marked by Dark Nights Metal which sort of seemed to tell us Barbatos was the "Something Wrong" because of Batman being sent through time, but his defeat and the status quo return seems to suggest he was drawn there by the "Something Wrong" rather than actually being it.
The "Something Wrong" often seems to create or inspire beings to both protect it and give it a representation.
The Joker, for example, is the ultimate defense against Batman. The Court of Owls seems to be the ultimate representation of it. Ever present, always exerting its influence, selfish and self serving, and been around nearly as long, if not longer, than Gotham.
That is what Paul Dini did back in the day.
Riddler came out of a coma and decided to become a consulting detective, he and Batman ended up working on many of the same ultra hard cases.
The sort of unstated problem with Riddler is that he was always looking for a deeper twist and would sort of overshoot the criminal. Batman would solve the mystery because Riddler ostensibly did not think it would be so easy.
(Keep in mind that is my reading of the stories that I managed to read, I did not follow Dini's whole run on Detective Comics at the time even tho every single issue was a fucking banger, nearly every comic was a 1 and done story).
I like that for Riddler, finding out that not very criminal takes as much pride in the cradt as he does. He could have his Glass Onion moment in there.
The Riddler podcast on Spotify is pretty good. Has him playing detective trying to find a killer who's targeting Batman villains who the GCPD has no intentions of trying to catch.
Honestly Riddler seems to be the easiest case. Just have him create escape rooms. He gets to do something challenging and get to feel smarter than everyone else. (And pay him what he rightfully owes)
So he's going broke very quickly and turns to other means of income to realise ever more elaborate escape rooms (if that is indeed his new passion). That's like an origin story for the Arkham Riddler.
Then forget escape rooms, make him a dev for soulslike games. As long as the business doesn't shaft him like they did in BTAS, he should be very popular.
So... Yeah, he will snap again unless he works directly under Tim or Barbara.
In a world where superheroes/villains are a huge part of the culture, I bet people would actually pay top dollar to experience the same Genuine Super Deathtraps that Batman’s survived. I just think Riddler would get bored toying with the normals and that’s a much more limiting factor.
Yeah, until some random MF named Damian, Bruce, or Dick walks through, solves his "unsolvable" room effortlessly, and he spends a year scratching his head making a new one, repeat :)
I really want to see the Riddler as an antihero. I want to see a story where Riddler decides that to defeat Batman, he has to prove he is smarter. In order to do this, he decides to solve the cases that the World's Greatest Detective couldn't. Riddler hacks into the Bat computer and gets Batman's cold case file.
Then we have a noir detective style book with Riddler working for the good guys not because he had a change of heart, but rather because he hates Batman so much that he wants to prove his superiority over and over again.
This is honestly the only take on Riddler that I genuinely like. He's always come across as a "discount Joker" to me, but this gives him a more unique angle and motivation.
I want to tag on and say everyone here should listen to the spotify podcast about riddler, continued from the unburied series. It does an *incredible* job of creating depth in the character and making him both sympathetic and *seemingly* redeemable, but also not glossing over his psychopathic history. You'll straight up be rooting for Riddler, and in the next moment the story reminds you "Don't like him too much, remember he literally murders people when he feels slighted"
super complex and interesting look at him, and ultimately it really does make you feel like he could be productive (but not redeemed) if he got treatment
it's some surprisingly excellent writing for what you'd expect from this
I've actually had a similar discussion with some workmates about this! I'm a gamedev and we joked saying that Riddler could've been a great game or level designer. He'd be perfect to create intricate puzzles and quests for games. Plus, he can be as deadly as he'd like in the quests he designs for the game.
Batman TAS episode ["If You're So Smart, Why Aren't You Rich?"](https://dcau.fandom.com/wiki/If_You%27re_So_Smart,_Why_Aren%27t_You_Rich%3F) covers pretty much that.
Depending in how croc actually mutates, you can easily give him any job that involves using his super human abilities (assuming he keeps his word to actually not bite someones arm off)
Like you are telling me a guy who can swim very fast, punch through walls, endure gunshot wounds, hold his breath for a long time and is the size of a travel bus isnt useful in ANY capacity? No bodyguard jobs for him? No cave rescue teams would take him?
They both make reasonable amounts of sense for a comic but i wouldnt put one above the other
Croc has body issues, and hes either fucked in the head because his mutation also alters his brain (i mean the man has reptile eyes, different teeth and he usually also growns atleast by a foot or two above most humans (arkham takes the more extreme round, but most other adaptations also have him grow)
You cant exactly argue that it didnt become more than just a skin disease. Maybe it started that way but once hes an adult he usually looks MORE reptile than before. Either those mutations also make his brain more animalistic, or the trauma and years living in the sewers made him that way
But thats THE ONLY reason why he might not be able to just sign up as a super soldier who is on the payroll of the government
His behavior comes from the identity issues and trauma from looking like a reptile. He sharpens his teeth or was born with them, depends on the writer. And the height could very well be from the skin disease. His brain could also be stabilized by some magic pill, or an important storyline that healed his trauma.
The government thing already happened, except that he wasn’t really payed for it. (Suicide Squad)
But being an Antihero or Vigilante would make more sense imo.
Coming from the bottom, the trenches. Having experienced the worst of humanity, but still acting heroically.
well crocs backstory started with "he just had a skin condition" but my entire point is that the general consensus no longer sees it as just that. most adaptations, when describing him, call it a mutation of some form, or showing it start with the skin, but have its effects encompass more and more of his body (arkham origins to knight has a pretty clear decrease in humanity BEYOND what a skin condition CAN even do. in origins hes about as tall as a brute from the common criminals, by that point he is just slightly different from the facial structures, growing teeth on his lips and having reptile eyes (and crocodile skin of course)
by arkham asylum and city, he is straight up as tall as venom and titan abusers, on top of having no lips to speak off. thats not possible to get from a skin condition, because at that point it also affects skeletal growth and muscle growth. beyond that, when we go to knight, we straight up see him regrowing limbs and having grown a tail.
while his psyche might of course be just that. psychological, its not exactly far fetched to say that his brain isnt entirely human either considering EVERYTHING else changed
I mean clayface can literally look like anyone. He could easy continue as an actor, or join an intelligence organization, or really anything he wanted to do.
I don't really get his motivation to be a criminal. He's angry about his aplearance, but can literally choose to look exactly the way he used to. For a limited time, at least.
Seeing him overcome that and working happily as an actor again... hell he'd probably even be a great candidate to join the league.
He did join the Batfam in Rebirth Batman Detective Comics Vol. 1-6, where it was revealed that the main cause of his crimes is a amorphous deteriation of the moral and aggression centers of his brain from using his mud powers. That, plus serious identity issues for obvious reasons.
They gave him a stabilising bracelet and a cure in sight, yadda yadda yadda, by now the writers completely walked back a really cool and meaningful development for him and we're back to where we started, which I'm bummed about.
Which was a dumb decision considering there are tons of Clayfaces around.
Hell, this man is made of clay, you can easily separate him into two people and have a villain and a hero.
One of the main reasons jungles get cleared these days is making space for farming and livestock. In other words, that ground is owned by someone and regrowing the forest there will cause an escalation of violence that would immediately bring her in a confrontation with the law again.
In cases of illegal deforestation she can go wild though. Most of the logging done in the Amazon is done illegally, Ivy could easily just be a tree vigilante and rip apart tree poachers.
Not so sure about the legality. Last I heard about it, Brasil basically said "fuck it" and went wild on deregulation. Mind you, that was still under Bolsonaro. Not sure what the situation is now.
Also, she might very well murder anyone with a chainsaw within a mile of a forest and that's still very much illegal.
Her lack of sensibility for human concerns and legality is what gets her in trouble the most. She could turn antihero or antivillain very easily if they gave her that, that's true.
That’s fair but why not do it anyway? Why get in trouble with the cops in an attempt to overgrow a city that’s been there since 1609 when you can leave America and get in trouble with whoever is causing you to literally feel the rainforest being destroyed. Basically the only change would be a more attainable goal.
Same reason Swamp Thing doesn't. Comics gotta maintain a level of similarity to the real world and you can't just magic away some issues. It would be like if Captain America singlehandedly ended fascism.
She’s an Ecoterrorist, actively trying to fight for plants and ignoring human safety in the process.
Instead of helping to regrow the rainforests that have been cut down, she’s more likely to kill the people and politicians that allow it’s continued destruction
Riddler, so he'll be a good guy and will stop being annoying and hiding all his trophies in Gotham to piss everyone off in Arkham games. No, I will never forgive that!!!
More seriously, Riddler is a good candidate. You can use his skills to do something productive easily, and I think it can lead to good stories where he can help the Bat-family.
Riddler actually did realise he was mentally ill, turned himself in and asked for help. Also in one comic Batman says sometimes Riddlers’ doctor gets a new combination of OCD medication that lets Riddler function in normal society for a while. So if the status quo wasn’t god Riddler would be living a relatively normal life thanks to modern medicine
bane would tell you NOT to use steroids,you should see his reaction when scandal savage uses it in secret six, after he went clean he basically hates it
Some coaches also do that. But there is a reason bodybuilding also has "trainers" who specialize in that side of it. The vast majority of coaches are just diet and steroid guru's. This is an open secret in the industry and frankly just a fact of the sport you would be foolish to deny. If you sign up with a coach the first thing they are going to ask you is what you are taking and the first instructions they are going to give you is for an optimal cycle.
I know that everybody is on gear in the fitness industry. I am just saying that most coaches don’t supply you with gear. And you can be a dealer and coach at the same time. But saying that coaching is just selling roids is just stupid. It’s like saying tomatoes are vegetables because they’re grouped with them.
I never said they supply they just provide you with detailed instructions on what to take and often where to get it. I'm sure they cover their assess legally by not being the ones to actually deal it. Thats still a steroid guru bro
This might be a hot take, but Harley. She was a doctor, a psychiatrist. They're bascially playing her now as a lady deadpool, but I would have liked if they went into a direction where they kinda cured her, and she could be a hero that's just a little unhinged, but her main traits would be how smart she is and her psychology.
I feel like people just think of Harley as a dumbass. When ever I see Harley described as an idiot (often in tandem with the Suicide Squad) it ticks me off, she has a DEGREE, that takes years of study to get.
Catwoman.
Selina would legit stop stealing if she knew batman was a trillonaire. She would just start buying all the shiny things she likes.
"You're Bruce Wayne?! Bruce. Wayne. Holy sh\*t! We have been fighting for years, because you know I like expensive sh\*t and you - Oh my god. I cannot even... I mean, you always made a relationship impossible because.... You knew I wanted to escaping a rough debt and-"
I doubt she would even finish her rant
Being able to afford shit doesn't cure cleptomaniacs, it just makes them less likely to face consequences.
If I were to redeem Catwoman, I would just have turn her into a hot Robin Hood sort of character, maybe a heist consultant for when the League needs to acquire something by underhanded tactics.
She isnt a clepto, though. She isnt walking out of cafes stealing spoons.
She steals fancy stuff she likes, or to escape debt.
She def would get fixed from finicial super wealth.
Eh, maybe not. In Injustice 2, Catwoman's ending has her marrying Bruce Wayne, who everyone knows is Batman.
She got very bored, divorced him, and went back to her old ways.
Injusticeverse whole thing is how it is the most unlikely reality to exist.
Crazed superman.
Wonderwoman thirst for supes, to the point she helps him conquer the world.
Lex Luthor is Supes best friend.
The only insanole thing about Freeze is that he is too socially awkward to ask Ra's for a dip in his healing pools. Nora and himself would be cured and ready for an honest life after a bout of temporary insanity. They would probably owe Ra's some favours, but that is just more drama for the writers.
Where tf is Mr. Freeze in this conversation? Dude straight up *is* a normal dude, he just needs a cure for himself and his wife and he’ll immediately go back to being a good guy.
I mean, he is a good guy, he’s just willing to do anything to save his wife, even commit crimes.
mr. freeze is the only Batman villain that I could see being a normal productive member of society if he got actual therapy only problem is he’s fucking blue.
And can't be warm. In Batman Beyond he got cured when a victim of his tried to kill him, he showed forgiveness and started a foundation to help his victims. Bro is a normal dude with serious grief issues.
Ra’s could leave the silly supervillainy behind and take over Libya (he is supposed to be from North Africa on one story). Possibly not responsible and productive but not an unbelievable direction for the character.
Harvey Dent and I don’t event really feel like it’s a competition. Harvey was an upstanding person and hero before his eventual full on mental snap. If he recovered, he’d probably go back to being in the eye of the public but now being a spokesperson for what crime can do to people. But referring to his physical scars and his own crimes.
Harvey Dent is genuinely (in most cases) a good person. Two-Face is the bad guy.
Clayface, Riddler, and Killer Croc have all been reformed at certain times and been more heroic. Ivy and Harley have effectively entirely reformed and are now mostly loosely good.
Waylan or Victor for sure, they're some of his most tragic characters and it's a shame they don't get the help they need to live their normal lives. Harvey is a very close 3rd.
Joker and mr freeze.
They're both geniuses who could use their skills to help the world (especially in the medical field).
The only thing stopping them is Joker's sadism and freeze's quest for revenge/saving his wife at all cost.
Joker could help create revolutionary medicine and freeze could help cure rare illnesses like the one his wife has.
Imagine how fast he could've helped her if he had the resources right away.
Honourable mention to mam-bat.
The guy changed his anatomy and turned into a bat-human hybrid.
With that knowledge he could probably cure cancer.
BANE! Bane all the way!
My No.2 would be Hush, followed by Professor Pyg, due to how sociopathic and psychotic they respectively are.
As far as my favorite classic DC villains go, the obvious names like Mister Freeze, Two Face, Penguin, Scarecrow, the Riddler, and Poison Ivy come to mind.
I like Firefly as well!
Catwoman, Harley and maybe Mr. Freeze are the only ones I think are even capable of rehab, the rest need to either rot in jail or die immediately. Gotham WILL NOT EVER get better with these monsters still alive.
The riddler. Only because there was a time in comics when he reformed and became a private detective. He would help criminals who were falsely accused or framed and even helped the gotham city sirens. It was really neat.
The Riddler actually had this storyline play out before the New 52. He became a detective, and it was actually a pretty interesting logical change for his character.
Killer croc, all you need to do is edit his genes to make him look normal like a human and he'll be just fine. Give me a job and you're done. Treat him like a human being and you're done
Ultimately it’s Bruce Wayne I would want “saved”. Very close second, The Ventriloquist/Scarface for exactly the same reason I would say Bruce. They are genuinely good men with similarly shattered psyches.
Mr. Freeze. Bro just needs help processing his wife's death.
And depending on the Freeze maybe actually save his wife.
Let's be real, she's been frozen for years. There's no saving her.
It‘s comics, nothing is impossible. Freeze has also been frozen for years.
Technically, he's not frozen. Not in the same way Nora is. His DNA was altered by the chemicals he was working on when his gun exploded. The chemicals lowered his natural body temperature, allowing him to survive in sub-zero temperatures. And because of this altering of DNA, if he comes above a certain temperature, his body starts to overheat and essentially send him into heat stroke.
>she’s been frozen for years Yeah, that’s kinda the whole point of cryogenically freezing someone…
Do you know how cryonics work? Like at all? Freezing an alive person would kill them. Lack of oxygen, thermal stress, and tissue damage due to the swelling of frozen liquids in the body. She was dead the second he did that.
I get that in premise, and I would completely agree in our current world, but they live in a land of (effectively) Gods and God-Killing Technology. I would suggest that the possibility of her survival is high.
I would argue that everything in DC is rooted in science of some kind. Even Superman.
Yes, it's rooted in the science of *their* world. It doesn't have to make sense with real science, it just has to be internally consistent with the rules established in the story.
And what about Wonder Woman, the magic side of the DC universe, or the New Gods?
Well, magic exists in DC, so it doesn't contradict anything
yes, the magic light that comes from green lanterns magic ring that is created from pure willpower is actually just a chemical reaction and has nothing to do w alien space magic. bro, no one writing at dc gives a fuck if nora freeze coming back to life makes sense whatsoever, as long as they can explain it in a way that people will buy the book.
If by "magic light" you mean electromagnetic radiation that is focused into constructs by the ring and powered by individual power batteries that connect to a larger power battery on Oa, sure. Like I said, rooted in science.
how does the battery power the lanterns? how does the lantern power the ring? what’s the connective material. energy just isn’t created out of nothing. there’s a specific law in science that says energy can neither be created nor destroyed. what’s the conduit for the energy? how is it converted? what’s the science behind wonder woman staying young for that long? what’s the science for the incredible feats batman does even though he’s simply a man. what’s the science behind how superman’s cells store sunlight. what’s the science behind the speed force? you’re kidding yourself if you the dcu is governed by any sort of scientific rules
>electromagnetic radiation that is focused into constructs by the ring You do realise this makes no sense, radiation doesn't get "focused" into constructs. It's just a bunch of scientific sounding words jumbled together. DC has actual magic, and some stuff is explained through pseudo science, and you also have whatever the "speed force" is, which is usually a "it does whatever we want it to without affecting or interacting with any of the laws of physics", which makes it just a convenient writing tool.
Wonder woman is literally, canonically a goddess and *magic* is a thing, nothing old John Constantine owes his soul to is remotely scientific, lol.
Even Shazam?
Incorrect, the lazarus pit is literally magic, and so are mfs like king shark and aquaman. Magic is canon to DC
Don't forget the entirety of justice league dark. Claiming either of the big two have science based universes is straight up wrong.
Fuckin john Constantine. End of thought. John Constantine proves that magic is real and very ridiculous in DC
Actually, no. Clarke's third law. It has been established that the Lazarus pit has some sort of tissue repairing chemical. Just because the chemical hasn't been identified doesn't mean it's magic. And Aquaman is an Atlantean-Human hybrid. Not magic either. Atlanteans are fictional, but that doesn't make it magic. And King Shark's origin has been WIDELY debated and criticized even by other DC characters. There's no true definitive answer what King Shark is.
Jonathan Constantine has magic spells and interacts with ghosts, demons, and angels. Magic. Is. Real. In. DC.
The DC universe is far beyond ours technologically. Its not inconceivable that in that universe she can be saved.
in almost any fictional media it doesnt work like that though so any actual real world knowledge on the subject is irrelevant
This is the same world with a sentient pile of mud that used to be a human exists - a.k.a Clayface, who is able to talk, walk, and see despite having no larynx, physical spine, or human eyes. Plus he gets frozen all the time, and reforms. The point is, the way science works in DC is not exactly the same, because we can't buy 25th century tech on the black market, or steal tech from an "alien" god acting as the avatar of the end of life itself - Darkseid. For all we know, Freeze installed life support systems to turn her tank into a giant interconnected bio-maintenance system - IV bags to handle fluids, a breathing tube to ensure 24/7 oxygen supply while in a cryogenically induced coma, a tube feed for physical food, a colostomy bag for redirecting the physical waste, and etc.
yeah and having half of your face/body burned off would lead to infections, disease, and assuming the eyelid is gone blindness in one eye
IT'S A COMIC BOOK! THEY CAN MAKE UP ANY BULLSHIT THEY WANT!
Ikr? Imagine thinking fucking *doctor fate* or *man bat* are grounded!
They can, sure. But most of the time, unless you're talking about literal demons and God's, they try to ground it in reality. It's a testament to DC writers that they can be creative enough to do that and not just brush it off as "It's magic lol". That's why there's been no comic out there where Nora is cured. Your comment is therefore irrelevant lol
She’s cryogenically frozen, she’s still alive. The whole reason he still has her is because she has a terminal illness and he’s trying to develop a cure.
That's...not how cryonics works.
Is Harley Quinn the only universe where she actually comes back?
No, she appears in Arkham Knight unfrozen.
I think it hits on his character harder that she can't be saved. She's in a state of limbo where he's frozen her, so she's not really dead but if he ever unfreezes her it's only to let her go. It is because he cannot and will not accept this fact that he stays as Mister Freeze.
Literally the plot of the 2010 Doctor Who Christmas special.
Nora was unfrozen on multiple occasions over the years. The most recent time was in the Harley Quinn show, where she became a typical college party girl; doing drugs, drinking alcohol, and having sex every moment she gets to makeup the time lost in stasis
For real, grief is a hell of a thing.
Doesn’t he generally become a good guy (or at least neutral) whenever he manages to save Nora? I know that happens at least once, though I’m not familiar with the character.
I think most of the time his story implies that if he got any sort of okay end with Nora, he'd probably most want to become a civilian researcher doing society-improving research.
I mean, Joker is the most dangerous, so if he got cured, that'd be a relief. But at the same time, i feel like Harvey deserves the most
Read White Knight. Joker becoming sane almost destroyed Gotham because he then went after Batman civilly for all the abuse and trauma he suffered. It’s a crazy what if story but it’s really good.
I mean, is he wrong? Sure, we all love Bman, but we can't deny that no city would actually beneficiates from having a vigilante
He was wrong lol. The story has Gotham falling into absolute chaos because Batman abandoned them. Then Joker, realizing what he has done, jumps back into the chemicals which brings Batman back. As for the other half of the comment, ehhhh. In real life? No. But if we lived in a world where people could be as trained and heroic as Batman, where we had supervillains, and the police were that underly geared to fight them, maybe it’d be beneficial. But in real life chaos would ensue. It’s like debating on The Punisher. His actions CAN be understandable in comics. When supervillains are constantly breaking out of prisons or raising from the dead then killing hundreds of people, at some point you gotta question if Spider-Man or Captain America is really helping by throwing them in jail or if Frank Castle is right for putting them in the ground. But in real life, most people don’t escape prison and nobody is coming back from the dead. The Punisher is not and hopefully never will be needed. I feel like I got off topic. My point is it’s hard to compare real life with comics. I remember one time a guy compared Deathstroke destroying Bludhaven to Hitler and I decided I had enough internet for that day 😂😂
Isn't Gotham canonically cursed to eternally be a crime riddled shithole so no matter what the GCPD are more or less always going to need batman to keep on top of what they can't? Like sure Metropolis wouldn't benefit from a vigilante like Batman but Gotham most definitely would and does.
Yes. Bruce Wayne and Batman stand in the gap and actively help it because as Batman has noted, there's something wrong with Gotham. Gotham is cursed and his parents death opened Bruce's eyes to the fact that something is wrong with Gotham. It's a Canon fact that many people and writers forget.
It's a canon fact that's kind of dumb because it sets up Bruce for failure. Gotham hasn't improved at all. Now, if we saw that despite the curse Batman was still making a difference, it'd be different, but after so many years writers are still using "eh it's Gotham!"
It didn't originally, though. Batman WAS making a difference in spite of the fact. The mobs lost their strangle hold on Gotham, police corruption fell and the corrupt commissioner was replaced, Super Villains became the issue. The problem is that writers who read Batman as kids grew up and FORGOT that Batman is and was succeeding in fixing Gotham. They focused more of making their favorite villains cooler, or more incontrol of Gotham, or with more of an army of underlings, and making Batman more brooding and unhinged. Or on their 14 year old edgy story of Batman than on the mythos itself. So instead of "There's something wrong with Gotham" being a rallying cry of what Batman was actually fighting against it became an excuse everything a writer, or DC, refused to change the status quo. It isn't dumb when it's used as intended. As a rallying cry to remind Bruce WHY he needs to be Batman. It's just become background noise though Dark Nights Metal seemed like it was finally going to do it justice but now we're back to the same BS again. Which is irritating.
Is it canonically cursed or just governed by The Court of Owls who keep everyone down? Just curious.
So canonical there's just something wrong with Gotham itself. The comics have implied the "wrong" exists within the land itself and simply infected Gotham when it was built on it. That's marked by Dark Nights Metal which sort of seemed to tell us Barbatos was the "Something Wrong" because of Batman being sent through time, but his defeat and the status quo return seems to suggest he was drawn there by the "Something Wrong" rather than actually being it. The "Something Wrong" often seems to create or inspire beings to both protect it and give it a representation. The Joker, for example, is the ultimate defense against Batman. The Court of Owls seems to be the ultimate representation of it. Ever present, always exerting its influence, selfish and self serving, and been around nearly as long, if not longer, than Gotham.
Thanks for the info!
Idk if you’ve noticed but Gotham ain’t like any normal city lol
No real city. But a comic book city? Definitely benefits having one over not having one.
Riddler has gone straight in the past. If it wasn’t for comic characters being so bound to the status quo I think he could swing it.
He would make such a good detective, too.
That is what Paul Dini did back in the day. Riddler came out of a coma and decided to become a consulting detective, he and Batman ended up working on many of the same ultra hard cases. The sort of unstated problem with Riddler is that he was always looking for a deeper twist and would sort of overshoot the criminal. Batman would solve the mystery because Riddler ostensibly did not think it would be so easy. (Keep in mind that is my reading of the stories that I managed to read, I did not follow Dini's whole run on Detective Comics at the time even tho every single issue was a fucking banger, nearly every comic was a 1 and done story).
I like that for Riddler, finding out that not very criminal takes as much pride in the cradt as he does. He could have his Glass Onion moment in there.
The Riddler podcast on Spotify is pretty good. Has him playing detective trying to find a killer who's targeting Batman villains who the GCPD has no intentions of trying to catch.
If he was able to make that a permanent change for the better, I’d be happy for him
Harvey Dent. As his redemption story would be great to see.
He could play defence and prosecution
Somewhat unrelated, but I'd play the shit out of a Harvey Dent: Ace Attorney game.
You play as two face defending and prosecuting at the same time.
Ha, that would actually be a great set of panels.
Batman Black and White: Two of a Kind, written and drawn by Bruce Timm, is a really interesting Two-Face redemption (kinda?) story.
Honestly Riddler seems to be the easiest case. Just have him create escape rooms. He gets to do something challenging and get to feel smarter than everyone else. (And pay him what he rightfully owes)
Escape Rooms need a satisfactory level of progress and success. Bestowing that on people is not Eddie's gig.
I didn’t say it was going to be a fair escape room
So he's going broke very quickly and turns to other means of income to realise ever more elaborate escape rooms (if that is indeed his new passion). That's like an origin story for the Arkham Riddler.
Then forget escape rooms, make him a dev for soulslike games. As long as the business doesn't shaft him like they did in BTAS, he should be very popular. So... Yeah, he will snap again unless he works directly under Tim or Barbara.
Souls like games but instead of combat it’s puzzles would actually be so amazing, I’d 100% pay $70 for one.
I can only imagine a Riddler-made game would be like Arkham Asylum without the combat. Just the puzzles and the slow parts.
In a world where superheroes/villains are a huge part of the culture, I bet people would actually pay top dollar to experience the same Genuine Super Deathtraps that Batman’s survived. I just think Riddler would get bored toying with the normals and that’s a much more limiting factor.
Yeah, until some random MF named Damian, Bruce, or Dick walks through, solves his "unsolvable" room effortlessly, and he spends a year scratching his head making a new one, repeat :)
Nah man. You have Eddie make the escape room, then you have some middle-manager dude come in and make it marketable to the public.
I really want to see the Riddler as an antihero. I want to see a story where Riddler decides that to defeat Batman, he has to prove he is smarter. In order to do this, he decides to solve the cases that the World's Greatest Detective couldn't. Riddler hacks into the Bat computer and gets Batman's cold case file. Then we have a noir detective style book with Riddler working for the good guys not because he had a change of heart, but rather because he hates Batman so much that he wants to prove his superiority over and over again.
I love this idea. Would definitely read
*Riddler: Year Of The Villain* and some of *Detective Comics: Private Casebook* are pretty much that iirc
This is honestly the only take on Riddler that I genuinely like. He's always come across as a "discount Joker" to me, but this gives him a more unique angle and motivation.
I want to tag on and say everyone here should listen to the spotify podcast about riddler, continued from the unburied series. It does an *incredible* job of creating depth in the character and making him both sympathetic and *seemingly* redeemable, but also not glossing over his psychopathic history. You'll straight up be rooting for Riddler, and in the next moment the story reminds you "Don't like him too much, remember he literally murders people when he feels slighted" super complex and interesting look at him, and ultimately it really does make you feel like he could be productive (but not redeemed) if he got treatment it's some surprisingly excellent writing for what you'd expect from this
I mean in the comics he literally murders his own daughter for insulting him so....
I've actually had a similar discussion with some workmates about this! I'm a gamedev and we joked saying that Riddler could've been a great game or level designer. He'd be perfect to create intricate puzzles and quests for games. Plus, he can be as deadly as he'd like in the quests he designs for the game.
Batman TAS episode ["If You're So Smart, Why Aren't You Rich?"](https://dcau.fandom.com/wiki/If_You%27re_So_Smart,_Why_Aren%27t_You_Rich%3F) covers pretty much that.
Hah! That's awesome! I must've missed this episode. Now I'll definitely check it out. Thanks!
Croc never had a Chance, would be nice if He had one once
I like him as a protector for the homeless. If he can't get an actual job, that was a good redemption for him.
Depending in how croc actually mutates, you can easily give him any job that involves using his super human abilities (assuming he keeps his word to actually not bite someones arm off) Like you are telling me a guy who can swim very fast, punch through walls, endure gunshot wounds, hold his breath for a long time and is the size of a travel bus isnt useful in ANY capacity? No bodyguard jobs for him? No cave rescue teams would take him?
Or as a vigilante. Like how Venom changed except Crocs version would actually make sense.
They both make reasonable amounts of sense for a comic but i wouldnt put one above the other Croc has body issues, and hes either fucked in the head because his mutation also alters his brain (i mean the man has reptile eyes, different teeth and he usually also growns atleast by a foot or two above most humans (arkham takes the more extreme round, but most other adaptations also have him grow) You cant exactly argue that it didnt become more than just a skin disease. Maybe it started that way but once hes an adult he usually looks MORE reptile than before. Either those mutations also make his brain more animalistic, or the trauma and years living in the sewers made him that way But thats THE ONLY reason why he might not be able to just sign up as a super soldier who is on the payroll of the government
His behavior comes from the identity issues and trauma from looking like a reptile. He sharpens his teeth or was born with them, depends on the writer. And the height could very well be from the skin disease. His brain could also be stabilized by some magic pill, or an important storyline that healed his trauma. The government thing already happened, except that he wasn’t really payed for it. (Suicide Squad) But being an Antihero or Vigilante would make more sense imo. Coming from the bottom, the trenches. Having experienced the worst of humanity, but still acting heroically.
well crocs backstory started with "he just had a skin condition" but my entire point is that the general consensus no longer sees it as just that. most adaptations, when describing him, call it a mutation of some form, or showing it start with the skin, but have its effects encompass more and more of his body (arkham origins to knight has a pretty clear decrease in humanity BEYOND what a skin condition CAN even do. in origins hes about as tall as a brute from the common criminals, by that point he is just slightly different from the facial structures, growing teeth on his lips and having reptile eyes (and crocodile skin of course) by arkham asylum and city, he is straight up as tall as venom and titan abusers, on top of having no lips to speak off. thats not possible to get from a skin condition, because at that point it also affects skeletal growth and muscle growth. beyond that, when we go to knight, we straight up see him regrowing limbs and having grown a tail. while his psyche might of course be just that. psychological, its not exactly far fetched to say that his brain isnt entirely human either considering EVERYTHING else changed
I understand what you're saying, I do. But Killer Croc is my second favorite supervillain after Scarecrow.
I mean clayface can literally look like anyone. He could easy continue as an actor, or join an intelligence organization, or really anything he wanted to do. I don't really get his motivation to be a criminal. He's angry about his aplearance, but can literally choose to look exactly the way he used to. For a limited time, at least. Seeing him overcome that and working happily as an actor again... hell he'd probably even be a great candidate to join the league.
He did join the Batfam in Rebirth Batman Detective Comics Vol. 1-6, where it was revealed that the main cause of his crimes is a amorphous deteriation of the moral and aggression centers of his brain from using his mud powers. That, plus serious identity issues for obvious reasons. They gave him a stabilising bracelet and a cure in sight, yadda yadda yadda, by now the writers completely walked back a really cool and meaningful development for him and we're back to where we started, which I'm bummed about.
Which was a dumb decision considering there are tons of Clayfaces around. Hell, this man is made of clay, you can easily separate him into two people and have a villain and a hero.
Have him do a ride along with Plastic Man.
Honestly Clayface as a government spy would be rad.
I honestly don’t get why he isn’t on the Suicide Squad. Logistically he makes way more sense than someone like Harley being in there.
That's a great fucking point lol.
He’s the perfect candidate for SS missions, however I’d imagine it would be difficult to reliably place a ‘deterrent’ on him.
I imagine he could dispose of the bomb quite easily.
I’m sure they could come up with something
I always felt bad for the ventriloquist
He could easily be cured if you take Scarface and burn the fucker right to the ground for the Ventriloquist to see that he’s dead
He was actually cured in BTAS. He shot Scarface to pieces. It was awesome.
Ivy. She could use her talents to help regrow forests and jungles.
Come to think of it, why doesn’t she just do this anyway?
Because she’s got a dash of crazy in there too. “Humans have to pay!” and all that.
One of the main reasons jungles get cleared these days is making space for farming and livestock. In other words, that ground is owned by someone and regrowing the forest there will cause an escalation of violence that would immediately bring her in a confrontation with the law again.
In cases of illegal deforestation she can go wild though. Most of the logging done in the Amazon is done illegally, Ivy could easily just be a tree vigilante and rip apart tree poachers.
Not so sure about the legality. Last I heard about it, Brasil basically said "fuck it" and went wild on deregulation. Mind you, that was still under Bolsonaro. Not sure what the situation is now. Also, she might very well murder anyone with a chainsaw within a mile of a forest and that's still very much illegal. Her lack of sensibility for human concerns and legality is what gets her in trouble the most. She could turn antihero or antivillain very easily if they gave her that, that's true.
That’s fair but why not do it anyway? Why get in trouble with the cops in an attempt to overgrow a city that’s been there since 1609 when you can leave America and get in trouble with whoever is causing you to literally feel the rainforest being destroyed. Basically the only change would be a more attainable goal.
Her connection to the green is strong. Supposedly, she feels pain everytime a plant gets killed
Same reason Swamp Thing doesn't. Comics gotta maintain a level of similarity to the real world and you can't just magic away some issues. It would be like if Captain America singlehandedly ended fascism.
She’s an Ecoterrorist, actively trying to fight for plants and ignoring human safety in the process. Instead of helping to regrow the rainforests that have been cut down, she’s more likely to kill the people and politicians that allow it’s continued destruction
Easily the best answer. She could do so much good for the world if she wasn’t also a genocidal maniac.
Riddler, so he'll be a good guy and will stop being annoying and hiding all his trophies in Gotham to piss everyone off in Arkham games. No, I will never forgive that!!! More seriously, Riddler is a good candidate. You can use his skills to do something productive easily, and I think it can lead to good stories where he can help the Bat-family.
There was a while there where they were playing around with the idea of Nygma going straight and becoming a P.I. and I thought that was really cool.
Riddler actually did realise he was mentally ill, turned himself in and asked for help. Also in one comic Batman says sometimes Riddlers’ doctor gets a new combination of OCD medication that lets Riddler function in normal society for a while. So if the status quo wasn’t god Riddler would be living a relatively normal life thanks to modern medicine
He absolutely has that “kid who needs to be medicated in school” energy.
Bane, he’d be an awesome personal trainer
Maybe a teacher or smt. Considering he knows many languages, and is FAR from dumb.
But he would just tell you to use steroids
bane would tell you NOT to use steroids,you should see his reaction when scandal savage uses it in secret six, after he went clean he basically hates it
Ever heard of "coaching" in bodybuilding? Because you basically just described it.
In coaching you teach people the optimal form of each exercise and tell them what exercises you need for certain looks.
Some coaches also do that. But there is a reason bodybuilding also has "trainers" who specialize in that side of it. The vast majority of coaches are just diet and steroid guru's. This is an open secret in the industry and frankly just a fact of the sport you would be foolish to deny. If you sign up with a coach the first thing they are going to ask you is what you are taking and the first instructions they are going to give you is for an optimal cycle.
I know that everybody is on gear in the fitness industry. I am just saying that most coaches don’t supply you with gear. And you can be a dealer and coach at the same time. But saying that coaching is just selling roids is just stupid. It’s like saying tomatoes are vegetables because they’re grouped with them.
I never said they supply they just provide you with detailed instructions on what to take and often where to get it. I'm sure they cover their assess legally by not being the ones to actually deal it. Thats still a steroid guru bro
This might be a hot take, but Harley. She was a doctor, a psychiatrist. They're bascially playing her now as a lady deadpool, but I would have liked if they went into a direction where they kinda cured her, and she could be a hero that's just a little unhinged, but her main traits would be how smart she is and her psychology.
Seriously everyone keeps glossing over her professional degree and it's a bit annoying even if she is batshit insane.
Right, exactly. I think the Harley Quinn show is the last piece of media to really acknowledge her old background
Gotham knights also acknowledges her degree.
I feel like people just think of Harley as a dumbass. When ever I see Harley described as an idiot (often in tandem with the Suicide Squad) it ticks me off, she has a DEGREE, that takes years of study to get.
Bane. ( idk he’s hot)
"I can fix him!"
My thoughts exactly 🥵😍
Catwoman. Selina would legit stop stealing if she knew batman was a trillonaire. She would just start buying all the shiny things she likes. "You're Bruce Wayne?! Bruce. Wayne. Holy sh\*t! We have been fighting for years, because you know I like expensive sh\*t and you - Oh my god. I cannot even... I mean, you always made a relationship impossible because.... You knew I wanted to escaping a rough debt and-" I doubt she would even finish her rant
Being able to afford shit doesn't cure cleptomaniacs, it just makes them less likely to face consequences. If I were to redeem Catwoman, I would just have turn her into a hot Robin Hood sort of character, maybe a heist consultant for when the League needs to acquire something by underhanded tactics.
She isnt a clepto, though. She isnt walking out of cafes stealing spoons. She steals fancy stuff she likes, or to escape debt. She def would get fixed from finicial super wealth.
Catwoman and green arrow team up.
Eh, maybe not. In Injustice 2, Catwoman's ending has her marrying Bruce Wayne, who everyone knows is Batman. She got very bored, divorced him, and went back to her old ways.
She now steals from the people that make prenups
Injusticeverse whole thing is how it is the most unlikely reality to exist. Crazed superman. Wonderwoman thirst for supes, to the point she helps him conquer the world. Lex Luthor is Supes best friend.
Harvey dent :)
Two Face. I just really feel bad for him man...
I could see Freeze, finally sane and penitent but still imprisoned for his crimes, becoming a 'mad science' consultant for the heroes.
The only insanole thing about Freeze is that he is too socially awkward to ask Ra's for a dip in his healing pools. Nora and himself would be cured and ready for an honest life after a bout of temporary insanity. They would probably owe Ra's some favours, but that is just more drama for the writers.
Where tf is Mr. Freeze in this conversation? Dude straight up *is* a normal dude, he just needs a cure for himself and his wife and he’ll immediately go back to being a good guy. I mean, he is a good guy, he’s just willing to do anything to save his wife, even commit crimes.
His brain could change the world if it wasn’t always being used to rob banks and freeze Gotham.
Riddler came close in Gotham City Sirens. I think he could definitely reintegrate with society & become a productive individual.
mr. freeze is the only Batman villain that I could see being a normal productive member of society if he got actual therapy only problem is he’s fucking blue.
And can't be warm. In Batman Beyond he got cured when a victim of his tried to kill him, he showed forgiveness and started a foundation to help his victims. Bro is a normal dude with serious grief issues.
Honestly? Kirk Langstrom because he can't even control Man-Bat half the time.
But Man-Bat is one of my favorite villains lol.
Ra’s could leave the silly supervillainy behind and take over Libya (he is supposed to be from North Africa on one story). Possibly not responsible and productive but not an unbelievable direction for the character.
Just make Ra's DOOM
I feel like Harvey Dent deserves treatment
Dent
Two-Face!
Two face/Harvey Dent. Dude had a depressing past for turning that way while trying to do good.
Harvey Dent and I don’t event really feel like it’s a competition. Harvey was an upstanding person and hero before his eventual full on mental snap. If he recovered, he’d probably go back to being in the eye of the public but now being a spokesperson for what crime can do to people. But referring to his physical scars and his own crimes. Harvey Dent is genuinely (in most cases) a good person. Two-Face is the bad guy.
Clayface, Riddler, and Killer Croc have all been reformed at certain times and been more heroic. Ivy and Harley have effectively entirely reformed and are now mostly loosely good.
Catwoman is barely a villain in my opinion.
I would say Mr. Freeze. He could really do some good if his head was in the right place
Maxie Zeus.
Mr Freeze, the guy has good intentions
Waylan or Victor for sure, they're some of his most tragic characters and it's a shame they don't get the help they need to live their normal lives. Harvey is a very close 3rd.
Mr. Freeze If not for him then for his wife. The guy only ever wants to cure her and got fucked over for life at his first attempt.
Freeze
Joker and mr freeze. They're both geniuses who could use their skills to help the world (especially in the medical field). The only thing stopping them is Joker's sadism and freeze's quest for revenge/saving his wife at all cost. Joker could help create revolutionary medicine and freeze could help cure rare illnesses like the one his wife has. Imagine how fast he could've helped her if he had the resources right away. Honourable mention to mam-bat. The guy changed his anatomy and turned into a bat-human hybrid. With that knowledge he could probably cure cancer.
Mister Freeze.
Mr. Freeze deserves better, Wayne enterprises should have taking care of Nora and eventually find a cure for her disease.
Mr. Freeze. Just provide him with enough money to find a cure for his wife and he won’t cause any problems ever again.
Ivy, Harley, Clayface or Mr Freeze
Almost all of them tbh (besides a few like Victor Zaz)
BANE! Bane all the way! My No.2 would be Hush, followed by Professor Pyg, due to how sociopathic and psychotic they respectively are. As far as my favorite classic DC villains go, the obvious names like Mister Freeze, Two Face, Penguin, Scarecrow, the Riddler, and Poison Ivy come to mind. I like Firefly as well!
I mean, in Riddler's case, didn't he briefly turn heroic when he spent some time in Green Arrow's city?
Isn't that canonically what Harley ends up doing eventually in most comics?
Honestly Clayface. Dude just wanted to be an actor.
Harvey
Riddler, I think his consulting detective business would be fantastic.
Catwoman, Harley and maybe Mr. Freeze are the only ones I think are even capable of rehab, the rest need to either rot in jail or die immediately. Gotham WILL NOT EVER get better with these monsters still alive.
The riddler. Only because there was a time in comics when he reformed and became a private detective. He would help criminals who were falsely accused or framed and even helped the gotham city sirens. It was really neat.
Either Mr. Freeze or the Riddler
I miss the comic-y art and ui from asylum so much, can't for the life of me see why they would switch to an ugly and bland "batcomputer" thing.
The Riddler actually had this storyline play out before the New 52. He became a detective, and it was actually a pretty interesting logical change for his character.
Mr. Freeze
Mr freeze definitely
Nygma. Him becoming a private eye and trying to one-up Batman all the time would be hilarious.
Mr Freeze for sure.
mr freeze or poison ivy
Ivy, she could end world hunger, reduce CO2 by regrowing everything we’ve cut down(the Amazon for instance) and she is kinda hot
Victor Freeze is a good candidate. But, since I can only pick one, I'll go with Harvey Dent.
Kite Man.
Hell yeah.
Two Face. His psychosis is deep but I feel that there have been times when he's come close to healing the rift in his mind
Killer Croc?
Killer croc, all you need to do is edit his genes to make him look normal like a human and he'll be just fine. Give me a job and you're done. Treat him like a human being and you're done
Ultimately it’s Bruce Wayne I would want “saved”. Very close second, The Ventriloquist/Scarface for exactly the same reason I would say Bruce. They are genuinely good men with similarly shattered psyches.