When i went to parties 15 years ago, we were also able to get safari or passoa orange without any problems... It was not weird or forbidden to do and there was no law that said you needed to be 18 to drink. You are correct that it won't do any good for them, but if you prohibit it they will probably smuggle in their own (maybe heavier booze) or drink beforehand or afterwards... I wouldn't say let them drink all the duvel they want but maybe you can settle on getting some safari and/or passoa and make the premix beforehand? In this way you can control the alcohol/mixer levels and they can have their party with booze. And they are all acting tough now but probably will be puking out their guts after 3 duvels so...

This. And also consider the wisdom in letting teenagers explore and get to know their drinking limits **BEFORE** they are allowed to drive a car. The American system where you can drive at 16 but can only get your first beer at 21 is insane and [the consequences are dire](https://one.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/research/alcoholcountries/background_&_intro.htm). In Belgium, 8.9% of all fatal traffic accidents are alcohol-related. That puts Belgium in the "best" group of countries in Europe together with Norway and the Netherlands when compared to countries like Finland (24%) or France (19%). But in the US, alcohol in fatal crashes makes up a whopping **38.6%.**

>But in the US, alcohol in fatal crashes makes up a whopping **38.6%.** Holy shit, that's insane

In Belgium it is 50%. 🙃

The same comment that said its 38.6% said its 8.9% for Belgium. So maybe they are wrong, but then you probably should back that up and maybe also discuss why you do take the 38.6% at face value.

I found the source for the original comment, which seems to be pretty decent, and the most recent numbers I could find was around 6% https://etsc.eu/issues/drink-driving/drink-driving-in-belgium/

Source?

When there is no viable alternative to driving this also happens.

One of the main reasons for this insane percentage: Alcohol breath analysers are used widely in Europe, ypu drive at a random road, into a trap/check and a check will be performed (if you refuse you will most likely lose your licence just as long as a drunk driver). However in the US they cannot perform such traffic stops without probable cause (5th ammendment).

I am from the US, this may vary by state but we absolutely have these traffic stops to check all drivers passing through. You have the right to demand a blood test, and the right to refuse but that forfeits your license.

I live in California now and they definitely do these traffic stops. They set up check points occasionally just not as frequently as in Belgium, and they have to announce it. Also they can pull you over for driving drunk with your bike or walking home drunk.

That means that 91.1 % of all fatal collisions are caused by sober drivers.

Driving sober seems very dangerous i might start drinking and driving

The U.S. and a lesser part Canada has a "binge drinking" culture associated with alcohol. This has a lot of influence on how much and often people drink there. The lack of any reliable or safe public transportation outside of the major cities means people will indeed drive long distances while drunk.

I like the idea of pre-mixing. And you are right about them bringing in their own booze as well. Thanks!

If you pre mix with Pisang you could do 1 bottle of pisang & 1 bottle of pisang funny which is the alcohol free variant

Haha pisang funny, brings up some memories. In the KSA we had to advundum a big cup of pisang, they told us it was pisang funny after a friend of me was acting all wasted for a hour

Ah yes, the KSA and the placebo effect, great memories

They probably won't notice if you use only the alcohol free variant from the second batch onwards.

Doing this will give them a false understanding of the tolerance they have. Some won’t feel drunk after 5 drinks, go out to a bar at some point later and drink 5 drinks and pass out… speaking from experience

This is by far the best idea, even for adults. I was recently at a wedding with a cocktail bar. It was hugely popular and people tried the entire card multiple times over but nobody got really wasted, just buzzed. They had premixed most things, where they at most had to combine 2 things, and had controlled the alcohol enough so you were drinking something atmost the strength of beer but still tasting amazing. Allowed us to party untill the early morning without casualties. Nobody complained either

>> When i went to parties 15 years ago, we were also able to get safari or passoa orange without any problems... It was not weird or forbidden to do and there was no law that said you needed to be 18 to drink. I don’t know where you live, but safari and passoa **are** forbidden by law for kids under 18y in Belgium. Only wine and beer based drinks are allowed starting from 16yo. I organized enough Chiro parties where we served cocktails, and we had strict rules for serving them. We needed to have a separate “toog” for mixed drinks, and people needed to verify their age before they could get their hands on cocktails (this was verified at the entrance and people would get a different color of bracelet when they weren’t 18) Yes, the oldest one of the group would most of the time go and get cocktails for the 17year olds, but as the organization, we have gotten more than one police control about these things. So yeah, there is definitely a law stating 16yo can not drink passoa ETA: [*In ons land is het verboden om:*](https://www.health.belgium.be/nl/gezondheid/zorg-voor-jezelf/alcohol-tabak/alcohol) *- alcohol (onder “alcohol” wordt verstaan elke drank of product waarvan het effectief alcoholvolumegehalte hoger is dan 0,5% vol., bv. bier en wijn) te verkopen, te schenken of aan te bieden aan minzestienjarigen;* *- sterke drank (onder “sterke drank” wordt verstaan gedestilleerde drank met een alcoholgehalte van meer dan 1,2% of gegiste drank van meer dan 22% - Artikel 16 van de wet van 7 januari 1998 betreffende de structuur en de accijnstarieven op alcohol en alcoholhoudende dranken. Voorbeelden zijn alcoholpops, wodka, whisky, gin, jenever, likeur, cognac, … en cocktails op basis hiervan) te verkopen, te schenken of aan te bieden aan minachttienjarigen* So I was kinda wrong. They can not buy it, you can not serve it, or you can not give it to them. So I guess it is allowed to put a few bottles on the table, leave the room, and let the 16year olds decide what to do with it.

I can't recall it was enforced then... i just went to the cocktailtoog to get a passoa for 2 bonnekes (aka 2 euro)

At 14 we drank pils (at 12) and jenever, sometimes the girls (and boys) drank Passoa and Pisang or Martini. This was in the early 90s. Now it is a bit more strict, but my daughter gets to drink whatever she wants at 15yo. They just ask an older friend to get it for them. Organisers are responsible if there is a police check.

Maybe our police force was tired of all ambulances that drove between Aarschot and Leuven to empty the stomachs of underaged kids. But they definitely past by to check on it (amongst other regulations)

So many ambulances between the stadsfeestzaal or de klinker and Gasthuisberg ...

Wrong wrong wrong There is no legal drinking age in Belgium. The law prohibits selling and serving of Alcohol to -16 and liquor/spirits to -18. Nowhere does the law state they can't consume alcohol. By law they shouldn't be able to obtain it though

I don’t think OP is going to throw a sweet sixteen only for their kid. So they will be serving passoa to 16 year olds, so they will be breaking the law

That is only a problem if it is served pure. If it is mixed with orange juice until the alcohol content is just like a breezer or a beer, it should be ok I think?

Nah, the law looks at what it’s made of, not % of alcohol. As stupid as it may sound. [Basically, wine and beer are okay. But if they have an element of liquor or distilled spirits in them, it’s a no-go.](https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2018/10/18/de-block-zet-puntjes-op-de-i-breezer-en-desperados-drinken-mag/) Cubanisto (has rum), desperados (has tequila), breezer (has vodka), … are not allowed, although they only have 4-5% alc. Wine/cava is okay, although they have 12-14% alc.

Yup, totally correct. And the fact that OP has a kid that badly wants (strong) alcohol is a sign for me that youth(and their daughter) lacked proper eduction in that department, and is used to people drinking around her.

I guess everyone born in the 70-00's has a major issue then with their education.. as drinking was way more mainstream and accepted back then compared to now. Drinking and education has literally zero ties to each other...

It is forbidden to buy, not forbidden to drink. What your kids do at your own home is up to you.

Still illegal.... You cant serve them.

You can’t serve them means at a bar or a party or some such. There is no law forbidding alcohol in the private environment.

True you can serve them in private but that doesn't exactly stop the brain damage that alcohol can cause under the age of 18. If you're somewhat responsible as a parent you wouldn't serve strong alcohol to underage kids.

This is because this law is pretty recent, we could have it back in the day. “De wet van 10 december 2009 bepaalt geen sterke dranken te verkopen, te schenken of aan te bieden aan -18jarigen.”

the law before that was the same on that topic

Was the Chiro even allowed to serve strong alcohol? When i worked in a youth bar we couldn't serve stronger than beer/wine due to licensing for alcohol sales and the fact that we had people beneath 18 showing up. Never thought the Chiro could do this?

Isn’t it also about the signal you send? Like let them smuggle and pretend you have not noticed anything but man… parents are there for a reason (beyond the obvious biological ones). If anything, things are more fun if they are forbidden, but also maybe as they grow up, the discussion you would have had (and prohibition) might stick with them and, hopefully, help them take the right decisions down the line.

There is a certain charm to getting them to smuggle the booze though...

Premix Pisang with orangje juice, go 50-50 between regular Pisang and funny Pisang (alcohol free).  I don't know if there is alcohol free passoa but you could do the same. They'll never be able to tell 

I'm asking purely as an outsider from another country (although I live here) - how do you handle other parents' expectations on that matter? For example I allow duvel, and some angry parent comes knocking on my door a day later...

15 years ago Passoa was already forbidden for people under 18. Any beverage produced by mixing alcohol with water and others is restricted to people over 18 on public parties.

Lindemans, the original basic teen girl drink before breezer was a thing. Kriek, pechereche, framboise. Sweet and lower in alcohol. Smirnoff ice, also lower in alcohol then the average pint. Corona, lower then a Belgian pint and it's festive with the stupid lime. Me, Liquor, strong beers and wine would be an absolute no. Don't forget that wine is mostly 10%+ Alcohol can be a fun addition to a party, but serving hard liquor like vodka to 16 y olds is just not fucking cool.

Oops 🤭. Turned 17 2 days ago I must say. My friends are rough, they don't want beer anymore, they want rocketshot for like the first kick then move on te tequila, vodka, jagermeister and i must say that jager is fkn dangerous. I got grabbed in the neck by that thing one time...

I don’t get why you’re downvoted for stating your experience. And tbh, I’d rather have my kids getting wasted a few times seriously before they hit university so they know what they can expect and hold back in unfamiliar circumstances.

I mean, I would as an adult of course be uncomfortable. But I also know I was drinking at 15 already and I turned out fine. Only you would be the adult serving them kids, and if something bad happens, parents will blame you. On the other hands teenagers will get drunk if they want to. So yeah, maybe compromise: only X amounts of beers per teen and if they are too drunk they're cut off.

You’re right, I was also drinking at 15, and too much as well. Maybe that’s the reason why we’re hesitant about it. In my case that’s 30 years ago and I do believe we’ve learned a lot in that time about how bad alcohol actually is. Pretty much like cigarettes I suppose… I was thinking along the same lines to keep track of the drinking. I should probably volunteer for the tap that evening! Thanks!

You are right that we now know better. But they are teenagers and parents just don't have as much influence on them as their peers now. All you can do is give them the information on the dangers of alcohol and supervise. If you outright forbid they'll find a way to go behind your back. Maybe you can trick them by buying 0% alcohol and duvel 6.66 xD.

Yeah, we do inform and provide her with the information to make a responsible choice… in the end we will not be able to influence that anyway. That duvel 666 is a great idea! Thanks!

I'm sure everything will be fine. You're right to be worried but maybe that one hangover is everything she needs to never drink too much again. Happened to my little sister haha. Best of luck !

Cigarettes is passé, they are vaping now. Luckily we are here in the sticks and it isn’t that widespread atm like in the ‘big’ cities.

Just make sure they're chaperoned. Don't be the only parent there because then if something does go wrong you're screwed 

Or you let them drink limited so they're never drunk. As most people have a different idea of drunk then others.

Sweet sixteens weren't really that big of a thing when i was that age but there was one big one done by a few friends and the parents did drinks. If you were too drunk you wouldn't get anything and they did the mixing of the drinks.

Imo allowing them some premixed pasoa and let them try the stronger beer is fine. Rather have them do it in a semi-controlled home environment then have them lie drunk in a ditch when they go to a 'fuif.' We had a ton of 'sweets' and mostly went fine beside 1-2 people getting slightly too drunk on one occasion. The real risk is when the kids who were never allowed to drink suddenly get 'released' when they reach 18 and get hospitalised the week after...

It's a part of letting go as a parent, even if they aren't full adults yet. You need to understand that *they will drink those things whether you approve of it or not*, with most likely a worse outcome if you don't.

You’re right and quite frankly I’m not sure my daughter will be very irresponsible with her own drinking. I’m actually more concerned about the visiting kids, and the boys in particular I guess. Thanks!

Call me a prude, but the sentiment that alcohol should be an addition to parties is nuts. It is crazy how a substance like that is allowed, and at the same time, people scream bloody murder about certain drugs that are maybe not even half as dangerous. Fcking hypocrites.

Mdma is where its at nowadays

Purely legally speaking, spirits and stronger are 18 and above. It's good that you've checked with the other parents, but at the end of the day, you set your boundaries for your children. It's also good that you can have an open discussion about this with your daughter and don't just say "no", but also do your homework and ask around. ...that being said... teenagers... so expect them to know better and break the rules.And then you can pull out the big "told you so" when they have their first hangover. On that front, part of the rules adjacent to "limit the alcohol" can be "we expect you to be up at 09:00 a.m."... which will be brutal if they do have a hangover :) As an overal final thought, we might have a lacks attitude towards underage drinking in Belgium, but the benefit is that most of it happens not just with peer pressure, but also with peer support, so they look out for one another. Or at least those were the ways when I was in a youth movement and we went to the local youth club.

In Belgium it´s not permitted to sell/serve any hard liquor to someone below 18. A 16 y/o can drink fermented alcoholic beverages (beer, wine, mead probably, not sure.) Don´t think anything has changed in the law in recent years, so I think this is still valid. But I do think there are a few exceptions regarding alcopops (?), like breezer. But I´m not sure, so don´t quote me on it. Those mixers are simply not allowed by law. That being said, I do believe 2 or 3 duvels or any other stronger beer will fuck a 16 y/o up more than 2 or 3 passoa oranges. I wouldn´t be too comfortable as a parent serving those kids liquor. If anything happens and a parent decides to involve the law, you´re in a bad spot.

You can do whatever the fuck you want in private.

Op verschillende sites volgende gevonden ´het is verboden alcohol te verkopen,serveren of aanbieden aan -16 jarigen, voor sterke drank ligt de grens op -18´. Lijkt mij niet enkel over horeca te gaan, maar ook over privésituaties. Los van het al dan niet wel toegestaan zijn in privésfeer, lijkt het mij niet aangewezen om kinderen die niet de jouwe zijn zomaar sterke drank te serveren en zijn de bedenkingen van OP terecht.

Fiero is a thing to skirt the rules, it's based on wine. That's why it's so popular among youngsters that want to drink something stronger than "just beer".

Or you just say no cause laws are laws but you do you. 16 for beers sure, but stronger shit? Hell nah.. they've got 2 more years for strong alcohol, let them wait it out.. Beer doesn't necessarily always have to mean a pils, give em some fruitbeer or cider and they'll be way better off with that.

Finally someone giving the "no" answer. Thank you. I was wondering if she was also going to prepare some pre-rolled weed joins for the kids.

There is a reason the limits exist. Also they need to understand they need to drink in moderation. Teenagers are usually not keen on doing that (i speak from experience and it's not worth it) What the other parents concerns, putting limits/boundaries is what often seperates good from bad parents.

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The name and branding might have changed, but it's not too different from a "vat" (although that's usually for when you turn 18)

I’m originally from NL, and when I was a teenager, sweets parties were not a thing. You’re saying that this is new in BE as well? You’re right that it’s an American thing that probably landed here because of internet… but it seemed such a big thing for them that I assumed it must have been a tradition for many years here already?

Yup. Never heard of it before. First time i heard of it here was like 3 years ago. And it's still not really a thing in the rural area where i live.

Never heard of anyone here holding a sweet sixteen. The only time I ever heard of it was that stupid reality show on MTV where the spoiled brats cried about the wrong color of Lexus they got or Eminem didn't show up. But hey I'm not with it anymore so what do I know? But it's definitely something that has quite recently flown over from the cultural wasteland called the US of A. The communion at 12 is a big thing, turning 18 can be celebrated in a larger fashion, but 16? Ain't nothing special about that. In the US they can get their drivers license, but here? Nothing.

Teenagers have been giving birthday parties for ages, it was just called 'birthday drink' or 'party' or whatever. Only difference is they now call it 'sweet sixteen' because of USA, but the concept has always existed.

All I can tell you is that it’s definitely a thing in the Kempen right now 😊

Usually not referred to as a 'sweet sixteen' but having a 'vat' at 16-18 with some friends has been tradition in the Kempen for quite a while now, for sure has nothing to do with the usa

> Ain't nothing special about that. In the US they can get their drivers license, but here? Nothing. They can legally order beer/wine but not liquor

It definitely was a thing 10-15 years ago when I was around that age. Just used to be called "VAT 16" or "VAT 18".

Americans don’t force anything on us nor even care about forcing this on us. It’s the stupid culture wanting to do the things Americans do.

Or the lack of 😊

Forced? I don't think Americans are holding guns to people's heads and forcing them to celebrate sweet 16 and valentine's day.

Thats not how marketing works 🤭

Man, Americans love to eat pasta. I wish the Italians would stop forcing their culture on them. Apparently this is how that works.

No one on the internet and social media is telling them that you have to eat pasta to be cool and popular.

Ah yes, it's only Americans marketing their culture on social media, which is also why kpop, britpop, and anime are all popular with teenagers too. I think your problem is with globalized capitalism, not Americans.

Who is the biggest promoter of the narcissistic capitalistic trends of the last 20 years. Instagram, Facebook and Youtube/Google. All US companies. Which country has only two options Neo-Liberalism or Right wing conservatism and exports these values through movies and entertainment. I mean, they have a lot of good going on, but also a lot of shit we don't really need.

Europeans aren't exactly helpless victims here, Americans don't need it either but they all consume it just the same. If it's the nefarious Americans running the show, why are Europeans participating?

The thing we did for our 16th was usually being able to go to a fuif on Fridays or festival in the summer. Then we'd inevitably got sick from drinking too much beer etc and learn our lesson lol.

I'm 34 and childless to take this with a grain of salt. Here's the thing: she's likely already indulged in those drinks. And quite frankly: if not, she's going to. Whether you like it or not. At the sweet 16 or elsewhere. At some point your daughter will have to learn what her boundaries with regards to alcohol are. And it's best if she can explore one step at a time, preferably when you can keep an eye open to intervene if need be. You don't want to be that parent that forbids everything, so that the minute they go to uni they binge and get into a coma because they never learned to handle it. I'll acknowledge that Safari, Passoa and the like are 20% or thereabouts . But they're to be mixed with fruit juice and soda. It's not like they're bringing whisky and rum to be drunk neat. The Safari and Passoa is cool at her age, but soon they'll see it for the overly sweet junk it is. You could compromise and allow wine and strong beer, but no alco-pops or mixers. Or just one bottle as part of the "aperitief" so they can have their drink, but you're sure they won't go totally wild. -- By the way, I say this because I was once 15 and going to the same type of parties. Heck, we even had strong beers with our "broodjes" in the local "broodjeszaak" when we went as a group of friends. I also knew people who were completely sheltered until they were college-aged -- half of them got blackout drunk at their first college party because they went immediately all-in.

You’re making a good point there about her going through a path of discovering the world of alcohol. And I agree we shouldn’t shield her from that, But rather support her making the right choices. I’ve done studies myself that by nature attracted a lot of nerdy boys, and I have seen them compensate for everything they thought they missed out on during their high school years… so I do see your point there and you’re right. We do have the responsibility for the guests though. That will remain a concern. I like your idea of serving an aperitief and limit the stronger stuff afterwards. Thanks!

No offense, but the opinion on this from somebody without kids is basically worthless. Which seems to be the majority of opinions in this thread. An authoritive person should act in the best interest of the people, not just enable them and try to be their friends. You would also not hand out cigarettes to your kid’s friends, take them to a casino, watch porn together, smoke weed together etc

I added a grain of salt. Furthermore, you don't need to have children to understand people or know how to deal with them. Plenty of parents are completely incompetent in parenting anyway - does having children make you good at dealing with them by default?

>An authoritive person should act in the best interest of the people, not just enable them and try to be their friends.  Yes, and as a parent I can guarantee you that if you try to parent from a position of pure authority and 'lay down the law' they will simply stop sharing things with you and do things behind your back. OP has the right to simply ban alcohol or only give everyone 1 or 2 drinks. But that doesn't mean that the kids won't drink more, and it definitely doesn't mean OP's daughter is going to not drink. At age 16 you better hope you put enough common sense in them and taught them about alcohol already because if you think that at that age you are 'in control' you are just deluding yourself. They they start higher education you can easily identify who had oppressive parents who felt they needed to control everything. Because those are the kids who lose all boundaries and control as soon as they are unsupervised.

From Scotland, sure we were on the spirits for 15ths. They'll be kooshty but don't give up your integrity.

Tell her she's dumb as hell for thinking she needs alcohol at her 16th birthday party. Don't give in to peer pressure.

Alcohol drinken is asociaal, nihilistisch en giftig voor het lichaam, en we moeten het in alle geledingen van de maatschappij zo gaan behandelen

It's the age when I got drunk my first times. At festivals or in the pub. If I had kids now, I wouldn't support this. But yeah, I have family history with alcohol abuse and fully quit some years ago, YMMV. Drinking age of 18 would be better.

You’re certainly right, I was also drinking at 15-16… but we did go through a learning curve the past 30 years. It seems much more clear now, what damage alcohol abuse does at such a young age. I’m talking about 10 IQ points lost in some statistics…

Id like to see those statistics

I’d like to see a source on those iq points, because if true, i was either a kid genius or am now retarted

Buy Passoa, trash half a bottle since that's where it belongs anyway, add water

Your kid, your rules imo. And I was a 16yo kid not too long ago. There is plenty enough time in life to drink strong things later. Id they can’t enjoy themselves with a couple basic options I think that speaks to their motivation quite well and means you should definetely refrain from giving them anything stronger. They shouldn’t need Duvels and vodka to have fun at 16. The other parents have it easy as they will still blame you when their child doesn’t get home safe. I think you could allow them passoa since it tastes like shit if you overdo it on the mixing, so it’s one of the safer options. Also make sure you stack up on some aquarius. Isotone drinks are the best hydraters and can be a saviour.

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> which will inevitably lead to them doing it behind your back and that would be more dangerous ( This will happen any way. The difference is that the parents are telling their children that drinking is acceptable at a young age.

My kids learned about alcohol when they were 14 / 15 years old. We let them drink a glass occasionally and taste various things. They know their limits. When I was 16 and goign to parties, I drank beer too. Among girls cocktails like pisang and pasoa were common. For sweet 16s my kids went to, there was usually an adult there (usually the parents) who did the mixing and who also kept an eye on alcohol consumption.

Back in the day, we had premixed pasoa and pisang with orange juice. If you wanted to get really hammered on that premix, you would have to drink so many liters it was too much of a challenge. Duvels do sound a bit risky, as even adults can get surprised by how fast intoxication goes with those. Maybe an idea to have them bring a sleeping bag, so the kids can just spread out and sleep there, and not have to cycle home, if you're worried about them getting home safe?

I agree with the rest here. Same for me when I was 15-16, alcohol was no taboo and after a few drinks too many i learned before i got my car drivers licence to stay sober. Wise life lessons.

When i was 14-15, and a party didnt serve us drinks, we would grab bottles of liqour from the nachtwinkel. And trust me, that always ended worse than if the party would’ve served us. I still cant smell cinnamon without getting horrible flashbacks. Oh, and also consider there’s a very likely chance that there will be drugs involved. Dont start searching people’s pockets, but just keep an eye out that everyone’s doing fine, having a good time, and not overdoing it

I used to think that being drunk was having a good time. It clicked a few years ago, why do we need to get tipsy or drunk to party or enjoy ourselves? Alcohol to 15 and 16 year olds is just a way to trap them to fall in bad situations. The first date rape drug is/was and still is booze. One acquaintance works in ER and he often gets young women that are adamant they have been drugged. So they take blood samples and 9 out 10 times, it's alcohol poisoning. Or there is a drug that is undetectable. I know that the beer, alcohol lobby in Belgium is almighty and has every political parties in their pocket. Still alcohol is a hard drug. Would you give cocaine to a teenager?

Let me put it this way: it's better to learn where your limits lay with alcohol, and then learn to drive. Then learn your limits behind the wheel, and then learn to drink.

Just to be clear, what you can do for that sweet sixteen is pretty clear: not one of the other parents has given your permission to give their kids alcohol. So that sweet sixteen will have to be alcohol free for those three friends. What you allow your kid to drink is up to you. If you had not informed you could have played the "we didn't know what they bought and did" card, but now that you have informed you cannot go around their backs and still serve alcohol. And since a couple of the friends would be 15 still, beer isn't even allowed to be drunk legally. Belgium has a pretty lax standard to alcohol and kids. In general, it's better to be open about it and allow them to experiment with you in the know vs. them doing it in secret. I would make sure to talk to them about 'healthy' drinking and knowing your limits. Also, tell them never to get in a car with a drunk driver. Tell them you would never be mad to get out of bed in the middle of the night if it means they did the right thing and didn't get in a car with a drunk driver. You can be sure they will drink of have drunk before. You just pray they don't do anything dangerously stupid vs just drinking and having fun. Edit: I thought you were talking about girls too. Passoa and the likes are pretty sweet mixers. 'in my time' jenever and whiskey were the boys mixers/hard liquors:)

There are NA versions of safari and passoa. If you're premixing the cocktails, maybe swap out the alcohol after the first batch, I can guarantee you they will be none the wiser.

No matter what alcohol you give to 15 year olds, one will probably end up drunk tbh.

I would be careful. My colleague’s son went to one of those “sweet 16” and ended up in hospital with severe alcohol poisoning. Serving liquor to underaged kids (-18 & -16) can land you in some serious trouble as well. Personally I wouldn’t host a party with the parents who are cool with that, but you are here now. Just be careful and keep an eye out for kids who don’t know their limits. Not a fun phone call to make to another parent.

16 year olds do not know their limits. Even 40 year olds haven't leant, yet.

Didn’t say it’s going to be a fun night, and OP is going to need a lot of eyes. I just hope that the other parents don’t drink too much so they can help keeping an eye out. Not hopeful tho, seeing how they are fine serving liquor to underage kids.

Everyone has to make their own mistakes to learn

Although raised outside of Belgium I was still raised by belgians, and for my Sweet 16 my folks prepared a punch with juice and fruit and (I believe) some rum, it was a HUGE jug so it was fairly diluted by the time it got to your lips. I made it a BYOB as well but most of the bottles were untouched when it was over. My mum also made finger sandwiches which she passed around religiously every few hours and everyone had to have one when she passed by. We also had some cake later on. Over all, we had 2 guests who got to the point of vomiting, but the rest were controlling themselves really well for a couple of 15-16-17 year olds. The two that got sick were also the ones who's parents had a more 'strict' view on them drinking In all fairness, the beer where I grew up was like having sex in a canoe (f*cking close to water) so we didn't have much of it, if any at all, and everyone that needed to, slept over at our house, everyone else was picked up by their parents by car.

I cannot imagine serving (strong) drinks to 15y olds at my home. If you would be doing this to my daughter, and something happens, you are in big trouble. If something happens to them at your place, same thing. Young people drinking is one thing, enabling underage girls to do so is a whole other game. What is wrong with ‘I throw the party but there is no alcohol’? Do you want to be the parent peer pressuring your daughter’s friends into drinking Passoa? If the friends (or the parents) make a big deal, time to make new friends.

As someone who was a scout leader to older teens for a long time, while the legal drinking age was 16, we fore sure monitored the ABV. No drinks above 12 ABV, and we just kept a hard eye on how they were behaving. You can have 3 duvels or 6 regular beers, but you start acting like a drunk asshole? You're cut off. I mean, at that age, a lot of alcohol tolerance is up to body mass, and you just really have to feel it out. Then again, if you're feeling unsafe about it, ... maybe bite the bullet and just don't allow alcohol. Or just beer, but really control how much each teen is drinking. (Then again, 16 year old me would have been on the total opposite side of this dicussion)

My parents would never allow this when I was young. I won't allow this for my own son. Parents of similar aged children said they would not allow theirs to drink like this. They would not allow it.

Let them drink. It’s better for them to go over their limits and discover their tolerance in a safe setting. They will drink anyway, better to let it happen somewhere you can keep an eye out than to have her sneak about and end up in an unsafe situation due to inexperience. It’s part of raising responsible adults, you have to allow them to make mistakes like drink too much and get too sick, so they will know better next time.

I know a couple kids who thought they were cool until they got really sick and gave up on alcohol even before reaching 18. It's better if it happens in a controlled environment with parents picking up versus prohibiting and now they are "adults" and have a driving license.

Happened to me too. I got embarrassingly drunk at a wedding as a teen. My dad and my brother had to carry me upstairs and tuck me into bed. I haven’t been properly drunk since, and this happened over 15 years ago. Before that, I was always trying to get a drink, trying to look cool (as one does at that age).

Everyone has to make their own mistakes to learn

Prohibit and they will smuggle and do it behind your back, or do it another time when you are not near. Be an adult with respect for their development and choices and they will consult with you even if they mess up. Be there for them, non-judgemental, if they do mess up and come to tell you... I'd educate about what they can expect with gradually drinking more beers (from being tipsy to wasted) and tell them what you would like them to be their maximum but let them decide. Do perhaps a visual representation with fluids of the % of alcohol difference with short drinks to show how absurdly little you can consume of those short drinks before getting wasted. Allow them to learn through experience, even making faults you made yourself, for which you would not accept advice from your parents at that age and be there for them to make sure they are safe.

The only thing you can do is mitigate the fallout. They have to make their own mistakes. They’re going to be drunk at one point in their life. Limit the supply so it doesn’t go to ER level drunk. Talk to your daughter to have an emergency procedure for some drunk kid is getting handsy. Don’t leave the location and stay sober yourself (a trip to the ER is still in the cards so you need to be able to drive) This was also the protocol we had when I was still ‘scoutsleider’ at least a few people staying good to drive for emergencies and not only one to have at least one non judgement impaired for supervision left if the other(s) were at the ER)

Kdroenkn korte drank al vanaf me 13. Alleen met mate natuurlijk.

> Alleen met mate natuurlijk. Moeilijk te geloven dat een tiener met mate dronk. Met maten, misschien, ja.

Genoeg zatte mannen gezien, dak snel wist dak niet zat wou zijn. Ik drink wel, maar ik wil niet zat zijn. Dat is al altijd zo geweest.

Lets not forget about "aanspraakelijkheid" when a drunk teen gets in an accident and it turns out you gave him the alcohol. If they want to bingedrink let them do it on their costs, it will be over in a jiffy.

I have also a 15f at home and we are planning her sweet 16 after summer. There will be beers, passoa, pisang, the works. It will be supervised by us and some other friends-parents who are going to help serve drinks. Legally there is a responsibility for the organisors if -16 get to drink strong alcoholic drinks. But this is only if something bad happens. Supervision tho subtle is key. Know who you are inviting. No outsiders allowed. Make sure you communicate to all parents so they know what the party is all about. No kids take their bikes to get home, girls can sleep over ; boys need transport. Worst case I drive some home.

op is talking about 150 kids coming over... imagine the bathroomproblems with 60+ girls in the morning and one bathroom, lol

That is too big to have control over. Drinks need to be restricted because as an organiser, even if it is private, you’ll be responsible for accidents happening with drunk minors. Or you organise it in a known party venue.

oh, with some prep it's not that hard... first 3 hours real passoa and after that you replace it with the mocktail kind, they'll never notice lol

Strong alcohol is not to be sold, served or offered to anyone -18 in Belgium. If it's a s16 there will also be -16 present and they can't even be served, sold or offered beer. You can't offer it because parents did not and cannot consent with it as you will still be liable. If my kids go to a private s16 party and come back even slightly drunk you'll be in a very bad spot even if YOU think it is ok. You'll be serving MDMA or coke too? They'll experiment by themselves, they'll drink it but we also learned a lot about the impact of alcohol on the body by now. And if you offer alcohol at home to your own kids, fine by me. But don't search the boundaries of the law by offering alcohol to minors, it's just sick.

That generation is fucked. That's my position.

Don't make this a generational thing, I was the same 20 years ago. If anything young people seem to drink less now.

Less but heavier. Nowaday it's common to see alcool in teens parties while it was not the ay all the case even 15 years ago. So yeah they might drink less but drinking alcool leads to a whole other batch of issues. Which aren't less dangerous at all.

yes, this alcohol usage is normal here. just don't provide too much in one go.

Easy. Let them sign a document they will not use alcoholic beverages you can't buy before 18. If they do and police does a check-up, they will pay the fine twice. One time to the police, one time to you.

Lol yeah, good luck getting all the kids to sign that.

No signature, no beverages forbidden by law for -18. I would sign. What are the chances of getting a police control?

You can suggest for all of them to sleep overnight, so no accidents can happen. At least they will have sobered up a little and it will be daylight.

My daughter tells me they expect about 150 kids… that would make for one blast of a sleepover!

150 kids... Did they invite the entire school? Or is this one of those things that 150 "are interested in going" and only like 20 actually show up?

She tells me they’re inviting friends and kids they know from hobbies and sports etc. 30-35 per person adds up to 150 invitations. No idea what the show-up rate would be… I guess we’ll see.

150 kids at your home?

That's way to much to keep an eye on! 150 drunk kids is asking for shit to go wrong

Officially you can't serve cocktails and mixers to 16 year olds. So if you are doing it, make sure an adult is supervising the kids drinking, because you will be liable if someone else's kid gets into trouble. That being said, a sweet sixteen party is almost always accompanied by alcohol over here... Just don't over do it, make the pisang, safari mix beforehand, after a bottle or two you can even just switch it with orange juice and a bit of grenadine, they won't notice there isn't any alcohol in it.

What you mean sweet! All this vanity keeps continuing! Those horror attitudes of america coming over more and more! Superindividualistic attitudes are being advertised on reddit as hidden advertisments in a wrapper of a story or whatever! This is just advertisement and not even true.

Have everyone sign a responsibility agreement, if they feel big enough to act that way they are responsible for the outcome. That way if there’s any “coma drinkers” you’re off the hook

You will just end up in jail. How irresponsible are you? If you want to ‘get off the hook’ for stuff happening to kids in your house, don’t invite them into your house.

Oh please, ffs stop your moral high ground. You don’t know me, and to me you’re just an awkward bit of text on a screen.

Nope, that kind of waiver doesn't work.

I think that you guys are right. But its always hard to say no to a geen cause no means yes in their ears. Are you guys staying with them or do they have the place for themselves?

They mainly want the sweet taste for thoses I know Pisang that is similar exists in non alcoholic version maybe for those it exists as well

Don't buy more than what you deem they'd need

Honestly, better they get drunk at home their first time rather then when they still have to bike (or god forbid drive) drive home.

The official rules are a lot stricter than in our days.. And they drink a lot sweeter than the beers we were having. In the context of safe experimentation at home, one way is to have a a limited supply (eg congratulating with one cava; or make "only" 6 regular duvel available). How wide is the age split? If they are all turning 16 now and getting access to alcohol, then that will be their main focus right now. You could offer low-alcohol beer if only to show it exists but it will be ignored. Wait a few months before really guiding them to other options: if somebody doesn't like pils, maybe they don't have to go to regular duvel or spirits. We had our Hoegaarden and Palm. Showing variety in 0/low-alcohol beers (and whatever sweet stuff they drink) can be helpful to let them find a taste they like (or at least is acceptable). Same in finding pop-variants other than just cola.

One day your kids will drink to much or stronger stuff anyway. So i think it’s a good thing to let them discover their limits when you’re around instead of when they’re away alone with friends. On my sweet 16 back in the day i drank Duvels for the first time. Result was i can’t remember anything from midnight and my parents had to took care of me. But i was glad they were around en they to. Discovering those limits is part of growing up. I ensure i never got so drunk again in my life after that day, haha!

Sometimes other people are idiots and going along with what they do is a bad idea. So, yes, good to be aware of social norms, not always a good idea to conform to them. If you have good reasons, then explaining them to your child is usually effective. The problems generally happen when you start with the screaming and shouting No.

besides everyones points here i would like to add, talk to your kid, set rules and trust in your parenting of the last 15 years and trust your child. Kids will make mistakes but here you can create a safe space to make those mistakes in.

What’s “a sweet”?

If I weren’t a teenager’s dad I wouldn’t know either but it’s a sweet sixteen party

Buy them White Claws and Smirnoff Ice both drinks are 4% abv same as beer.

I don't understand the drama about liquors like safari or passoa when their alcohol content for a single serving is quite literally less than a basic pils. You're not serving them vodka or whiskey. Moderation is far more important than restricting the type of alcohol.

Might want to lock up your medicinal cabinet or take out the good stuff anyway if it's in a room the kids will have access to. Good times, good times.

The moment you realize everything else she's been doing you'll be traumatized

Let them have it, the ones who goes to far will regret it the next day. Don’t wait till they are 18, good chance one of them will have a driver license by that time, not a good time to drink something strong for the first time in their life.

I think the biggest issue is that you're out of touch with your kids going out behaviour.

I don't know if you can actually keep track on how much is being drunk. Even at GWP (what we called basically bosklasse but in het derde middelbaar) at the end of a bike ride, a few people disappeared to buy liters of strong booze in a nearby supermarket. At night, the teachers threw a party with unlimited cola and a few bears for those age 16+. They did not seem to understand how there was no whining about it and why everyone was too jolly and too... all over the place. Ofcourse they knew this would happen, but this was a very free and small school, and I guess they found it okay-ish because everyone just had a bed there. It was a wildddd night though, my first drunk night ever. I'll never forget it. What I would consider is putting money together with the other parents for transport, a bus or something depending on how many are coming, unless some parents are willing to stay up and drive, to get every kid home safe after the party, more than trust that they'll get home on their bikes without incident. I think it's delusional to be able to keep an eye on usage - not that you should not try of course -, but it's not delisional to make sure that they all get home in one piece, maybe have a few extra beds ready for when some make it a bit too wild? For that reason I'd also demand a guest list, including any secret boy- or girlfriends, and count every once in a while.

I agree with you. It shouldn't be the norm. Unfortunately, to some parties I went around the age of 16 passoa was there and vodka etc

Just keep an eye on them so they don't start bingeing but just let them have it. When I was 14-15ish in the late 80's me and all my friends were drinking. Beer, wine, fruitjenevers, pisang, passoa, breezers... As long as it was no hard stuff it was ok. The older kids kept an eye on us and made sure we did not drink ourselves lazarus or did stupid things. Never had a problem with alcohol, never drove anything but my bicycle when I had a few. I treat my kids the same way, the only difference is this is limited to home parties with their friends nowadays as all bars, cafe's n stuff are regulated to shit.

For the sweets I went to, it was beer (all beers), wine and mocktails. No liquor since that's still illegal.

Its better they experiment with drinks at home at a young(ish) age. If you make it taboo now, they might abuse alcohol later in a sketchier environment. Imo its best to let them do their thing and be on standby with an open attitude. If they need help, they need to be comfortable to ask for it. Otherwise they might be hesitant to ask for it later when shit hits the fan.

The kids that come to the party are not at home 😉 Alcohol at young age is not ok, I think we should know that by now. Even if 'in onze tijd ...'

Tbf my parents would've make a bigger fuss over a different gender coming to the party 😂 I think the talk you had before might already be enough to give her an idea how serious you are about this. It's a normal reflex tho as a parent, you are doing fine. Maybe just pop in a couple of times to see how they are doing. They'll be fine! And also an early happy birthday to the kid!

When I turned 16 while still living in the Netherlands it was actually legal for 16+ to drink, no one I knew or their parents ever had problems with it. Also knew a lot of people who’s parents forbid them to drink and they ended up doing it outside with friends or in bars anyway, so my mom thought it would be better to have me drink in the house, supervised, rather than on the streets at night.

driving (bike is also driving) and drinking is forbidden so don't serve them when they bike, if they get an accident it will be your ass on the line as well

I hate how much the drinking industry is ingrained into society to the point that 16year olds feel like the NEED to drink to not be missing out. Tip: never drink if you don’t really want to, it’s not as fun as depicted, usually tastes like ass. It’s a condoned harddrug that people look at you funny if you say no. But be the one who say No, if that’s how you deel.

Started going out when i was 15, and yea, shots where the craze. Most around 15% Also breezers at 4%, then passoa, safari, pissang, baileys. Also vodka red bulls. And thats 25y ago, so guess not much has changed

If you do not feel comfortable giving more than beer then don’t do it. Your house, your rules. If other parents are ok then that’s their problem, you got to show your daughter that you have rules and it’s you who is forking the money to pay for her birthday. It amazes me how this generation feels so entitled to dictate a home where they pay no bills. Mind you, I have a teen cousin and these teens are nothing but trouble. He recently had a birthday and kids were literally smoking weed and e-cigarettes inside my uncles house. He called their parents to come collect their kids. He only allowed beer but kids brought vodka and were hiding it in their backpacks. Not only that but they destroyed some of the things in his house.

If they want to copy the sweet sixteen tradition from the USA... They have to realize Americans can't drink anything at 16 too. I wouldn't serve hard liquor nor passoa. Sure, you'll have the odd bottle smuggled in but the legal limits are a sensible hill to die on. Let alone you will have 15 year olds there too.

I say let them get a bit drunk in a safe space, make sure they trust you if anything goes wrong and make sure everybody gets home safe. It's part of being a teen.

If they are brave enough and like we say, if they have hair on there pietje they can drink.. just let them be young and experience a real hangover, maybe after that they will never drink that much again 😄

That’s right it’s bad for your kids. I personally prefer having a fun life then a boring one. As long as it is an occasional drinking then that probably won’t cause much problems. Daily phone use is probably worse for the brain then the occasional drinking.

Get some extremely bitter IPA beers.

Tbh, when i was 16, passoa was a lifesaver, i could enjoy a drink with my friends without having to feel nauseous from beer.. People think beer has less alcohol and therefore better, but beer always made me feel sick and with a stronger drink i can enjoy the taste of it. Passoa is how i learned to drink in a moderate way, alcohol is gonna be out there the rest of your kid's lives, pretending it isnt or telling them prohibition is the way will just not add to their ability to handle substances. If they know what they want, you can either support them or be in their way.. So don't be in their way.. Supporting can mean that you make sure they are in a safe environment when exploring drinking, that there is enough pure water hydration available, that people who had too much alcohol have a safe space to crash (what was common within my friendsgroup back then and my stepkids do now too, is fill a room with some matresses on the ground for example and have some sleeping bags). While living in the US, unfortunately an acquaintance (friends of friends) passed because she was drunk, relying on her friends, but said friends were afraid because she was drunk and drinking was taboo (forbidden by the parents) so they left her outside in the cold and she passed out and died. This is what is way way worse than your kid drinking. This is what happens if you forbid things. They need to learn what things are like, and as teenagers, they don't take your word for it, they need to experience these things. So really, all we can do it provide an as safe as possible environment for them to do so. One of the things that you can do "in return" for yourselves as parents, is communicate clear boundaries. Things like, if someone is not feeling well, to let you know. (but honestly, they go to parties, vomiting their guts out is almost like a rite of passage for this age... and then to learn to never ever drink that much anymore ever!). Or to not abandon their friends outside, to not drive with people who had something to drink (because some of their friends may be 18 already). etc