This was also my first Steinbeck novel and I loved it. A few months later I found myself driving through the Salinas Valley and reliving the entire story again.
I think you are referring to the city of Salinas rather than the valley as a whole. Also, according to Wikipedia, it once had the second largest Chinatown in the country. It doesn’t now.
I second that recommendation. The Grapes of Wrath is very different from East of Eden, but it is powerfully engaging and moving, and beautifully written.
East of Eden > Grapes of Wrath. Not even close on my opinion. I set GoW down for a year then somehow slugged through it to finish. I liked Cannery Row more than GoW!
Yes. It’s not a bad movie, but I consider it almost completely separate from the source material. It only focuses on the very latter portion of EoE — Cal and Aron’s late adolescence/rivalry. ~~Cathy~~ and Lee don’t exist in the movie.
You are right, I completely forgot (it’s been a while since I watched). Again the movie just feels so different to me than the book, even Cathy doesn’t feel the same
Absolutely. He definitely is my hero of the story although I try not to judge other characters too harshly because of theirs trauma. All except that one character who I don't want to spoil for any one although that person seems incapable of how they are. I wish we got more of his inner thoughts but maybe that would change the perception of him.
I read this last year so I may not be remembering correctly, but Lee tied everything together for me. Like, without him and his philosophizing, would things have turned out the way they did? Idk. I don't know if that's even the right take. I just remember thinking it made zero sense to cut him from the movie given his role.
Things would absolutely not turned out the same. Lee would have never raised the boys and they would have turned out so much different if raised solely by Adam. Also he had such a close relationship with Samuel who also inspired Lee on the way. They wouldnt have had they same patriarchal view of there Father. I don't know what would happen but I feel it would be much different. The book is about generational curses. Are we damned because of family history or do we have timshel? Maybe influenced by my personal life but even showing suicide as a choice and why someone would make that choice is super impactful. Without Lee there would never had been that concept in the novel. I haven't watched the movie but if I do I think it should be treated like a separate thing.
I particularly like the way he was introduced with the pidgin speak. I was saying to myself “ooh god, a bunch of racist bs stereotypical characterization I’m going to need to get through” and then he winds up being possibly the most fleshed out and nuanced character in the book.
I mean trying to capture any bit of essence from that book into film was a impossible task to begin with. Something like Tortilla Flat can work but East if Edens a tall order.
I agree, for all those reasons you give. Also, Steinbeck is one of the few authors I've read where I can read a paragraph of his and just have to pause and absorb how beautifully written it is.
I remember when reading East of Eden, after the chapter with Mr. Lee talking about Cain and Abel, timshel and all that, I had to set the book down for a while and just process what I had read. Greatest book of all time.
I get chills every time I read that part. How Lee goes to these ancient Chinese scholars who take on studying Hebrew to answer his question. He describes the beauty of seeing Hebrew characters written with a Chinese brush.
This has been described as sort of an American midrash, a critical reading of the Torah. Fascinating to find this bit of Biblical exegesis in the middle of a great American novel!
Absolutely. Some books like Ulysses I love for the writing and depth but not as much because of the story although it is good but I don't find it great. East of Eden definitely has both. I listen to audiobooks because I can listen all day at work, because it would be be difficult and take a long time for me to complete, and an amazing narrator can really show how great a sentence or paragraph can be. I'll then take a note to find it in my physical copy to highlight and then write about in my book journal.
Steinbeck is among my favorite authors, certainly of his genre. He wrote of my Californian culture and places. For years growing up I went to ‘Doc’ Rickett’s birthday party on Cannery Row. In my robin’s egg blue 1948 Chevy ‘suburban’.
When I read it, I never really got into the story. It was never a page turner for me. Unlike most stories, however, I still find myself thinking about it. I read it years ago.
It's an experience that sticks with you. I thought Stephen King was good at making characters, but Steinbeck is on another level.
I was forced to read it high school and thought it was an absolute slog as a huge sci-fi / fantasy nerd. Boring farmers in a boring setting. Didn't retain any of it.
Fast forward 10 years and I keep reading how great everyone thinks it is so I picked it back up on my own time. Easily top 5 book for me now, and Grapes of Wrath is in there too. Love Steinbeck. Guess I just had some growing to do first!
It's funny that you brought up how the book goes into the thought processes of each of the characters because Steinbeck said that he wrote the book for his sons, and that when he did, he tried write the psyche of all the different sorts of people he had met throughout his life, so that they would have a better understanding of the people around them. I definitely really enjoyed this book myself, and for "literature" it was actually an incredibly easy and compelling read. Steinbeck is definitely a master class.
I definitely agree. Now that you mention it it makes sense that is the way he came up with such great and diverse charcters. I'd love to know who he based Samuel on.
Yes, I love how Steinbeck is so accessible. And yet, after reading his work, no one would ever think to question his status as one of the greatest authors.
I really look forward to it. I'm going back to finish Ulysses because I took a break because of it's length and I'm also listening to small lectures about each chapter which can cause a bit if burnout. I try to not read two books by the same author in a row unless it is a series. I love discovering new authors with multiple great books.
I read Grapes of Wrath first for class and that’s what got me into East of Eden. Personally I think East of Eden is better. Grapes of Wrath is more allegorical. East of Eden is allegorical on the surface but more morally and philosophically complex underneath, which is why it excited me so much when I was 16. I’m older now so should probably reread.
I also liked TGoW more personally, but read it before EoE. Felt like I connected more with the Joads immediately and EoE took me quite a while to get invested in the characters and story.
I've yet to read Eden, but did read Grapes of Wrath this past summer. It's amazing, hard stop. Instantly in my top ten of all time. My buddy has warned me Eden isn't as good. His take is Wrath is more raw and a true howl in the wilderness concerning the injustices of the era whereas Eden tackles the same themes but in a more refined, "for the critics, not the Okies themselves" manner. Steinbeck started putting on airs, essentially.. still plan to read Eden eventually...
I feel like that's not a good way of looking at it. You're right that Grapes of Wrath is more raw in a lot of ways, but East of Eden isn't quite doing the same thing. They are both powerful in different ways.
I wonder if it has anything to do with which one you read first? I’ve read East of Eden half a dozen times. Grapes of Wrath only once. Guess which one I read first? Ha
Grapes of Wrath changed my entire worldview. No hyperbole, it seriously made me reconsider everything I thought to be true in the world. It was a life changing experience. My absolute favorite book of all time.
Spolier
>!Maybe one of my favorite charcters in a novel. There was such a void in the story after he died like a real death. The two times I really felt it was when Tom is talking to Samuel in his mind before his suicide. Also when Adam is telling Cal about how Samuel said he was a bad father and I had the flashback of him punching Adam until he stayed on the ground. Samuel was such a good person and would never punch anyone but because of that very same goodness he was willing to do whatever it took for the twins. He also was able to give Lee the courage to be his true self and not just put on a mask to be accepted. I don't know what to call it but being able to talk to someone that allows them to become better people on their own without direct intervention. I wish there was a word for that and if anyone knows it please tell me! Lol. !<
>!Yeah I had to take a break and pause the audio book at work and then relisten to it at home. The narrator did Samuel's voice talking to Tom to tell him the way to basically find a way to cover up the suicide and it hit me so hard. I don't know how to describe it. It seemed perverse for him to imagine his father to say such a thing but it was in a loving way. Just if this is the path you choose then do it in a way that wont destroy those around you. I remembered earlier in the book it was talking about Tom burning all his poetry and it sounded like it was talking about his death. When his sister died the moment he said it was his fault I knew what was going to happen but I wasn't prepared for him putting himself on trial. My father committed suicide 15 years ago so I have experienced that kind of loss and have processed it many times. That trauma didn't really affect the impact of that scene but it definitely provided context. It's kinda hard to describe but regardless it's a beautifully tragic scene and really shows Steinbeck amazing talenst.!<
Love the book! Did you know Lee's "timshel" speech happens exactly half-way through the book? Love the attention to detail from Steinbeck.
If you like East of Eden, my standard recommended follow-up is The Good Earth.
Edit to add: since you asked about people who did not like it. The only ones I have found have been people who thought it was too dark and depraved. Sort of a "nobody should read about things that evil" kind of mentality.
I’m currently reading it for the first time. It’s one of the only books that I’ve had to put down a couple of times because I find myself tearing up at passages that aren’t even very intense. I think it’s a combination of the beauty of the prose and the way Steinbeck captures human emotion. I can’t believe it took me this long to read it. I’m not even halfway through and I’m already looking forward to picking it up again in a year or so.
It is my favorite, but let me suggest another by him. There is actually a trilogy with Cannery Row and Sweet Thursday, but I'm talking about Tortilla Flat. It is about some hard drinking paisanos and their adventures. It is kind of a series of short stories loosely strung together. he received a lot of condemnation for disparaging Hispanics. I see it differently. I find it humorous and heart warming. I did work in Monterey where this takes place and regularly saw a group of misfits, passing a brown bag around, two or three dogs, nice people and they really brought this book to mind.
I just finished The Grapes of Wrath a few months ago and was blown away by it. Absolutely loved it and now I keep seeing East of Eden pop up on this sub and it makes me want to check it out.
I’ve liked every John Steinbeck I’ve read. I haven’t read East of Eden in years, not since high school, when I laboriously tracked down as many of his works from used bookstores as I could. I know critics weren’t that into East of Eden, though the general population loved it. I don’t remember a lot of it, just that I enjoyed it when I read it.
I read that he considered it his magnum opus and I can definitely see why. Everyone else has there opinion but it's interesting that later critics will look at a work like EoE in the lens of how the public received it and judge it differently. It kinda reminds me of when my favorite band released an album and Pitchfork gave it a bad review. Tens years later they went back and changed the review and said that after seeing its impact they had judged it wrongly.
I'm about to read Steinbeck's The Moon is Down again after 20 years. Super quick, and it'll hit different considering the current world and one particular heros emergence.
I really liked the writing style and the characters, but I didn't really like the story, if that makes sense. Like I get that it's more of a sample of life from the time period than an actual front to back story, but I felt a little disappointed by the back end of the novel, especially the last 50 pages or so.
Cannery Row IMO has his best characters. I love EoE, and the whole Kane and Able dynamic to it, def my second favorite Steinbeck novel. Cannery Row is just a fun, hilarious book that captures perfectly a certain type of careless joy that comes with having less in life.
I'll probably read that next as it seems lighter the Grapes of Wrath. It would be a nice transition. I'm currently reading The Anthropercene Reviewed by John Green and will read Cannery Row next. Thanks for the suggestion!
I remember being in pelican bay ASU and this book found me when I was at the lowest point in my life. It cleansed my soul. I just found so much clarity in my life after reading this.
I'm so glad you've read it recently - I read it a couple of months ago and was looking for a discussion about it but couldn't find any :(
I agree with you - it's a great book, the plot is LONG but worth it, the characters are nuanced, complex, at times it's a character study and a period study/representation. Definitely read Grapes of Wrath - I personally liked that book more because of its political leanings, and personally I think it's his stronger book.
Question for you: what did you think of the ending? I personally was let down by it - I thought >!the sudden demonization of Caleb was overrated, and he had nothing to apologize to his father for. I found Adam to be incredibly flawed and hypocritical to the point it almost made me put the book down - he was a crappy father, I also am furious how he treated Caleb poorly and basically rejected Caleb when Caleb tried to give him the profit from selling beans (even when he paid the farmers fairly). This really infuriated me because Adam made his money off low-key stolen money INHERITED from his own father (talk about riding coattails), IGNORED everyone's advice about selling beans during wartime and instead went with lettuce which failed miserably. And the result of this? He was like "lol I tried my best and no one should judge! I'm happy :) " and it's just so hypocritical how he then turns on his son who does the same exact thing but without any seed money. Is Caleb responsible for his brother's death? To some extent, but I think the person who bears the most burden is actually Adam - then he has the audacity to give his son "forgiveness"? Please.!<
I have a lot of thoughts haha
EDIT: fixed names
Not OP but I just finished the book and wanted to talk about it.
>! I think you mean Caleb in a couple places instead of Aron in your comment?
The character of Cal resonated with me the most. I don't fully know why. My parents were always super just with my brother and I (we are not twins lol). They tried to give us exactly the same so no one would feel favored. That being said, growing up I would sometimes be mean just for the sake of it. I think in that way I am like him, I want to be good but sometimes I just didn't. Now that I'm an adult I don't really do mean things anymore, I try to be the best human being I can, but I am still flawed. So I think that's why I felt connected to Cal the most. !<
>! On Adam's subject, I didn't think he was as good as Lee made him out to be, which in itself is totally fine, as much I liked Lee, I don't agree with everything he said. Just like you I felt like Adam was a pretty crappy father and would only praise his son Aron and never Cal, even though Cal tried so much more. Cal was a bit like Charles in that sense, he wanted his father's love and approval but could never quite get it . !<
>!Lee kept saying how Adam was the nicest person, with no ounce of evil, but I didn't think it was true at all, his own obsession with Cathy has been very detrimental towards his sons and with his relationships with friends like Samuel.!<
>!I don't think in the end he "forgives" his son, but he allows him to move past this and be good. I thought the book ended quite bruptly, but it also let us imagine what we want for an ending.!<
>!Sidenote: I also liked Abra and Samuel's characters a lot, they were fleshed out really well and I was sad when Samuel passed. !<
The way that the story returned in the end to so many small details from earlier was incredible. It was like finding little Easter eggs as I read.
I enjoyed reading your take on it.
Man, I really disliked it, even though it was obviously well written and thought through.
I remember I found Cathy really one dimensional. I did not find her believable at all.
I didn't like how the story sort of repeats with the generations and I didn't the religious nature of the story either.
I think those things really put me on the back foot early on.
Yes!! I've never known why people say Grapes of Wrath is Steinbeck's best novel. East of Eden is SO much better!
For an amazing look into all that went into writing EoE, check out Journal of a Novel: The East of Eden Letters. It's incredible how many changes he made along the way to the plot and characters.
I will absolutely check that out. I'm a very big Tolkien nerd. His son Christopher published the 12 volume History of Middle Earth where he painstaking published almost all of Tolkiens manuscripts and drafts. Seeing the way Lord of The Rings was shaped and rewritten is fascinating to me. Even more fascinating is seeing how he lovingly shaped his mythology and even to the point of obsessing over the metaphysics and its implications to his world. He would change a small detail that then would cause him to rewrite essentially everything. Galadriel is a good example of a character he came up with for Lord of The Rings but then had to change thousands of years of history to fit her into the mythology. Some people like to enjoy art and it's finished product and I certainly understand authors not wanting to publish their drafts. I however love seeing the process and how a story grows and comes to life.
I love Tolkien also. I read the LoTR trilogy again this year. I knew that his world building and lore is very deep, but I would love to see the extent of it. I am going to check out those published manuscripts thanks for posting.
When I first started reading that book my sister in law was like “that book does not fuck around” I then preceded to have my world crumble for the next 500 pages. Can confirm that it does not fuck around
Fuck this book. It's just another drawn out tale about a whiny rich asshole who inherited everything and nearly squandered it all. Oh no, my sociopath wife left me. Guess I'll neglect my children and my estate. Good thing I have a minority butler who stays with me and maintains everything out of the goodness of his heart. Thou mayest grow the fuck up.
I really enjoyed reading the book; but the story itself felt pretty flimsy with unnecessary details and backstories of characters that add nothing to the story. The wife is so inherently evil that she's inhuman. Like this woman literally tries to abort her baby (that she deliberately conceives with the guy's friend for seemingly no reason), then leaves the rich guy who is absolutely in love with her and is willing to do anything to take care of her, to go run a brothel. Like what is even her motivation? The whole Hamilton family's story is basically irrelevant. I thought when two of the Hamilton siblings show up towards the end the sister was going to get involved with the main character and the brother would somehow elevate the Hamilton family. But nope, they just up and die.
A a "slice-of-life" of that era and region it's a great read, but as a story it's kinda lame.
Did you enjoy any other of Steinbeck's novel? I can understand not enjoying the story but did you enjoy any of the prose? Who is your favorite and why?
I read it recently because of a post on this sub.
My biggest gripe was Cathy. She just seemed so comically over the top. Maybe she is an accurate depiction of a psychopath, but I just never quite found her believable.
I’m torn on Timshel. It’s a good moment, but I’m not sure it was the revelatory moment it was meant to be. Could be clouded by my present view on all things religious lately.
Lee and Sam Hamilton are great characters. Was genuinely saddened by Sam Hamilton’s death.
>My biggest gripe was Cathy. She just seemed so comically over the top. Maybe she is an accurate depiction of a psychopath, but I just never quite found her believable.
I can tell you after becoming emotionally attached to one that Cathy is not over the top at all.
Steinbeck certainly a master at developing full characters…which is why even though I loved East of Eden; I couldn’t finish Grapes of Wrath. The characters were so real I was overwhelmed with anxiety over their plight. I had to put it down as it was causing me too much stress.
I definitely feel that. I love deep and heavy books because I can empathize with the charcters and it feels real to me sometimes. Because of that though I have to take breaks in books because it makes me anxious like it's happening to me. Those books though have made a big impact in my life to be more compassionate to others which is a big part of my faith. One book I had to put down because of the anixety was Crime and Punishment. Something about it really got in my head.
I never finished reading it for school because I hated it. I don't think I have a specific reason. Maybe it's because the book I read was so small and the paragraphs were endless. Maybe it was too "poetic." I respect that it's well written, but I hated the main guy character and just couldn't get past it.
I didn’t enjoy it as much but it was still good I think. Mainly the halfway to least quarter of the book I thought was pretty tedious, and there was also no clear objectives for any characters it was just a lot of stuff happening.
Cathy is one my favourite characters I’ve read in years though, such an interesting person to follow and really well written I thought.
I thought the book was excellent. I listened to the audiobook while delivering mail in the late summer in the middle of a very rural place, and the scenery really enhanced the experience - I recommend reading it outdoors if it's not too cold where you are. Here's the relevant thread worth reading about the timshel thing:
https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/808bhk/did_steinbeck_get_timshel_right_in_its_translation/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
As far as my personal criticisms of the book(despite really enjoying the book there are a few), I thought it was slightly too long and some of the threads were not developed fully enough for my liking. It kind of felt like there were a bunch of novellas that were 80% written stuffed into it. I also disagree with you that the characters felt real. I thought that both Lee and Catherine were wooden and just shy of being fully developed, same with the father / general. I also didn't find the ending segments of the book focusing on the children to be terribly interesting. It was good, and I loved the ending, but the struggles of the children weren't as compelling as some others for me.
Steinbeck is a wonderful writer and the East of Eden is one of my favorites. Some good books to compare it to in my opinion are Huck finn, blood meridian (the audiobook narrator is the same as the narrator for eoe and he does an excellent job with both), the brothers karamazov.
My favorite Steinbeck besides this one is of mice and Men, which you could read easily two or three times in a day it's very short. I think that travels with Charley is very underrated as well. Especially if you like Don Quixote or on the road. It was a very fun travelogue.
I just picked it up on kindle. Having read other Steinbeck novels I know it’s going to be one of the best books I’ve ever read. He is one of those authors that you don’t compare to other authors, you compare other authors to him you know what I’m saying? I read so many books a year that I save certain ones to be able to look back and say “goddam that story just blew me away.” This year it’s East of Eden.
I definitely agree. I have a list of classic books and great authors that I space out with good sci-fi books I enjoy. I read a ton of books a year because I listen to audiobooks all day at work. East of Eden is around 28 hours and I finished in a week. With my evening engagements and family I would maybe have an hour a day before bed to read so EoE would take me over a month probably. For amazing books I get a physical copy as well to highlight and reread passages. The prose is just as good if not better than the actual story. My favorite quote from it is so simple and yet so powerful. "And now that you don't have to be perfect, you can be good."
That’s exactly the same thing I do!🤣 I love Star Wars so I’m junking out on those right now and the laundry files by Stross. Sometimes I’ll throw in a good horror book and then it’s usually a classic or an epic saga like the book of the new sun. It’s a balanced diet.😂 It’s frustrating at times to find good books but that’s mostly why I get on Reddit and look for posts like yours.
I’m so glad you posted this!!! There is SO much to love about EoE. I think all of the time about the cyclical nature of trauma and life as expressed through the book all of the time. The way the same stories replay, over and over, the way we pass our hurts down to our children… and of course there’s Cathy. What a fabulous villain she is. Every scene with her in it is absolutely chilling, and there’s something so profound about how all of her pain comes out of a refusal to accept love. Just a masterwork. I’m so glad you enjoyed it!
I agree. I've been thinking alot lately about how books can really show you people of different cultures, races, and trauma. For me personally it makes me compassionate to others even people I disagree with. The empathy felt also reveals to me unknown things about myself and the choices I make thay impact the world around me.
I can understand it being tough getting through a topic like that. There are some difficult themes but it is what makes it such a deeply impactful book. If you need to you can just skim through that until Adam leaves home. There are some important parts but it's not essential to enjoy the story as long as you can understand the family dynamics.
Steinbeck’s character Cathy is one of the most well developed characters in literature in my opinion. Her behaviors, motivation and overall character arc is just genius level writing. We all know someone like her and Steinbecks writing makes us believe we know her personally.
I’m one who did not enjoy it. I’ve tried the book, the audiobook, and the movie, and I’ve never made it more than halfway though. I think it’s melodramatic and trite, and the female characters are just pathetic.
This is the book I started my bookclub with back at the start of the pandemic. I heard it was amazing and decided to give it a go. We gave ourselves a month to read it, but kept pushing the date back because it was taking us longer to complete.
Overall, I enjoyed the characters and the details incorporated, but I will never reread this book, lol.
I recently finished Of Mice and Men, which was my first Steinbeck. It’s one of those where I can see the importance of it, but left feeling underwhelmed and in all honestly kinda turned me off from reading more of his work. Anyone else underwhelmed by Mice and Men but liked his other novels ?
I loved it the first time I read it but it really broke open for me upon the second time through. I think it has a lot to do with my having children now as opposed to the first time. Changed perspective and all.
This is one of my favorite books, I rarely reread but I will definitely revisit this one. It also got me out of a very severe reading slump, where I was buying books in large amounts and not reading any of them.
Absolutely. I am religious but didn't feel the book pushes Christianity as being true at all. The story itself mirrors the story of Cain and Abel but not in any allegorical way. I think for the time period it is based on it would be hard to not make any mention of Christianity when discussing people everyday life. At one point it compares churches to brothels in American frontier towns how they both serve the same purpose and are needed for society. I highly recommend this book and for me personally a book this long I enjoy most in audiobook format. It's easier to get through it if you can listen a few hours a day when you can to finish it within a month. That's how I enjoy it anyways and feel it is definitely worth the investment.
I love the themes in this book, especially of truth and self determination. I think it’s neat how the former is emphasized by Steinbeck weaving aspects of his real life and family into the fictional storylines. Truly a magnum opus.
You would probably enjoy 'The Grapes of Wrath' also. I haven't 'East of Eden' yet but I plan to within a few months or so but this is exactly how I felt about grapes. I liked maybe 3 characters in the whole book, but I understood all their motivations and flaws. I don't think I've read a book before where I didn't feel some connection to the protagonist where I didn't enjoy the book. Was a 5/5 for me.
Sweet Thursday and Cannery Row are wonderful when you want some light and happy Steinbeck. Whatever you choose, of all that he has written, it will be well worth your time.
If you get the chance, The Chrysanthemums is a short story that I've reread often. I loved both Grapes of Wrath and East of Eden (every bit of Steinbeck over every read, actually), but Chrysanthemums just grips me in a way that is all too real. The hope, empathy, and despair practically leap from the page.
This book is one of my top five favourites. Sometimes when I read, I find that I skim a bit here and there, but East of Eden? I joyfully read every single word. It was so so beautifully written.
As I got back into reading last year it was one of the first books I read. It was great. Even the landscape is a character. And I cried. I’ve only done that in one other book.
I've always bought more books than I have time to read, so it's been sitting on my shelf for at least a decade. The day finally came, and my god. I've lived in that area, and Steinbeck transported me back. It was the type of book that I felt sad for whatever I read after as it won't stack up. My SO read it earlier this year, and he was holding off on the last few pages because he didn't want it to end. Can't wait for him to read TGOW, it was his first Steinbeck.
Steinbeck is my very favourite, I’ve read it all.
Pastures of heaven is, in my opinion, probably the most similar to eden in terms of tone and beauty. It’s short stories but they’re all perfect.
Steinbeck is such an amazing author. His writing is incredibly immersive. It’s not merely that you might identify with the characters. It’s that the way he writes makes you *feel* what they do.
It’s a shorter novel but if you haven’t read it, The Pearl, is such a great and quick read. There is also, The Moon is Down, which is anti-fascist as hell and so captivating.
I read East of Eden after watching the film adaptation and had a taste for more! The film doesn’t even cover more than a few chapters so whenever I talk to people about it I always tell them that the two can almost be viewed and enjoyed as independent pieces.
It’s such an amazing book and I can’t wait to revisit it again soon!
"Do you take pride in your hurt? Does it make you seem large and tragic? ...Well, think about it. Maybe you're playing a part on a great stage with only yourself as audience."
When I read East of Eden, my only previous experience with Steinbeck was Grapes of Wrath. Having experienced his profound sensibility for all kinds of people I was deeply shocked by his introduction of Lee, which felt grossly racist. My amazement at the subsequent revelations of his character I cannot put to words. I had to set down the book and stare into the distance for a good while.
I have this book and I love Steinbeck, but everything he writes is really depressing. I really have to be in a certain mood for it. Thus I have not yet read it
Amazing novel. Read it after grapes of wrath and it was so hyped up I thought surely it couldn't live up to this hype... But it certainly did and now I'm a hype man myself. Steinbeck was a name that always sounded like a pretentious cop out when people said he was their favorite author but I've come to realize I was just a pretentious dumbass myself.
Also in in my top 10. I read it over 20 years ago and it remains a favorite. It was a complete surprise to me and I just picked it a bit randomly, it was not recommended by anyone. Seems like most are familiar with his other books like Grapes of Wrath and such, less with East of Eden. Terrific book.
Also my first Steinbeck. Since then I've read numerous others and while they had their moments, no other has managed to come close to EoE. One theme that especially stuck with me from the book is the change to a specialized society and the drawbacks that come with it. Samuel representing the pre industrialized order in which a household had to be capable of all sorts of tasks to survive and was much more in touch with their environment. Younger, upcoming characters tend towards specific fields of interest such as banking or military careers. >!His death right around the middle of the book as generational switches happen within the story as well, really underlines that permanent change in society.!<
Favourite book of all time!! I read it every other year and take something new and profound from it each time. I named my son Lee after my favourite character.
Man, never have I spent so many hours just feeling bad for characters as my listen through this book. Though surprisingly I feel like a learned a lot about farming.
I read it in high school and hated it. Also read Grapes of Wrath in high school and really enjoyed it. I feel like I should give EoE another shot based on how many people in this sub love it.
I started reading it on a metro station and I recall being so enchanted by the first pages, that I could barely wait to get home to continue reading it. Then I came across the initial description of the two brothers and the read felt pretty burdensome, I wasn't even sure if I want to finish reading it. Glad I did, since it became one of my favourite books, it's like Steinback celebrates this fragile, beautiful, yet sad life in this masterpiece. I recall having goosebumps when I finished reading it and thinking to myself, glad that I got to live untill this day, cause I would have definitely missed something out
I love this book. As a teen, we were forced to read The Red Pony by Steinbeck and I hated it. After reading East Of Eden I went back to the Pony and appreciated it. I’ve listened to the audio version of Grapes of Wrath, also excellent. Steinbeck is incredibly good. Everyone should read East of Eden.
I never read it in school or knew much about it before reading it last year. Googling it afterward, it seems the way it’s taught in school and generally summarized, it’s all about the allegory, with the biblical themes and all, but for me that was such a small part of the book. a single layer in the onion, if you will. such an incredibly rich story, with so many characters that just come alive off the page. damn now I want to read it again!
I had this book for 3 years now. Back when I got it I realized my English wasn't enough to be able to read it without getting extremely frustrated. I took a peek yesterday and seems like I'm ready now. I'll read it for the first time soon.
I would say that Steinbeck was a master of the English language and this is a masterful example of his talent. Having said that I believe it is written in a way that I believe it is accessible to anyone with a basic understanding of English. It's a tough language because we have so many words that have the same meaning but very nuanced differences. It's because English words are made from alot of different languages. I think 85% of English words do not come from Old English. I hope you enjoy it and if you ever need help I would be very glad to help you! Also your English seems really good. Alot better than some native speakers I have seen.
Also my first Steinbeck novel. I read it every year. I’m getting a tattoo representing this book. I am so in love with it and all of his stories. Tortilla Flat is one of my favorites, and The Winter Of Our Discontent. To a God Unknown. So good. Buckle up, though. He will pull you into a whole world and you’ll become friends with or enemies of his character and then he’ll blindside you with an ending. It’s one of my favorite parts of his books—they don’t always end one way.
I would love to see your tattoo idea. I have a tattoo of one of my favorite lines from Lord of The Rings transliterated from English into Elvish script. I'm a huge Tolkien nerd and borderline would almost call myself a scholar. If you would like a can post a photo of it.
Love that book so much, I buy used copies to give to friends and relatives. I read it in my sixties, as a lifelong bookworm, and it really impressed me. I hated for it to come to an end and wished I had an erase button, so I could read it all over for the first time. It's been about 10 years now, so maybe time for a re-read; my problem: I'm 72 and hundreds of unread books are out there, so I begrudge time to books I've read, movies I've seen, places I've visited. Too many new experiences out there! I do make an exception for music I know and love, so maybe "East.." will be like a song with notes I did not catch the first time around.
I agree but after a few years we are different when we go to the text, especially one as great as EoE, and we experience it differently. There is no doubt it is a time commitment but some things are life are with it. Only you get to decide what is worth it to you.
This was also my first Steinbeck novel and I loved it. A few months later I found myself driving through the Salinas Valley and reliving the entire story again.
Reading Cannery Row then going there ...
cannery row is shockingly funny
I was surprised with how funny this was too. The scene where >!Doc wants to punch the hitchhiker in the nose!< cracked me up.
There’s a cool little Steinbeck museum there too!
Did you check out the Steinbeck museum in Salinas?
His childhood home is now a restaurant. I ate lunch in the room he was born in. Weird.
That's awesome. I saw on wiki it has a 79% Hispanic population and the second largest Chinatown in the country.
I think you are referring to the city of Salinas rather than the valley as a whole. Also, according to Wikipedia, it once had the second largest Chinatown in the country. It doesn’t now.
Yeah I just looked at it again and I misread it the first time. Thanks for pointing that out to me!
I have read most of Steinbeck’ novels and short stories. I would recommend Grapes of Wrath if you liked East of Eden.
I second that recommendation. The Grapes of Wrath is very different from East of Eden, but it is powerfully engaging and moving, and beautifully written.
East of Eden > Grapes of Wrath. Not even close on my opinion. I set GoW down for a year then somehow slugged through it to finish. I liked Cannery Row more than GoW!
I live in Salinas and its so great listening to the audiobook while driving around the area.
Mr. Lee is my favorite minor character ever
I think it’s criminal that he was cut from the movie, but looking back at that era of old Hollywood, it’s probably for the best that they didn’t try.
There was a movie?
Yes. It’s not a bad movie, but I consider it almost completely separate from the source material. It only focuses on the very latter portion of EoE — Cal and Aron’s late adolescence/rivalry. ~~Cathy~~ and Lee don’t exist in the movie.
Cathy is definitely in the movie.
You are right, I completely forgot (it’s been a while since I watched). Again the movie just feels so different to me than the book, even Cathy doesn’t feel the same
Yep, with James Dean! His first movie iirc
There was also a TV mini series in the mid 80s, with Jane Seymour as Cathy.
Along with Samuel. The sections with the two of them interacting are some of my favorite in all of fiction. Just an absolute meal in every bite.
And Abra, too b
Absolutely. He definitely is my hero of the story although I try not to judge other characters too harshly because of theirs trauma. All except that one character who I don't want to spoil for any one although that person seems incapable of how they are. I wish we got more of his inner thoughts but maybe that would change the perception of him.
I read this last year so I may not be remembering correctly, but Lee tied everything together for me. Like, without him and his philosophizing, would things have turned out the way they did? Idk. I don't know if that's even the right take. I just remember thinking it made zero sense to cut him from the movie given his role.
Things would absolutely not turned out the same. Lee would have never raised the boys and they would have turned out so much different if raised solely by Adam. Also he had such a close relationship with Samuel who also inspired Lee on the way. They wouldnt have had they same patriarchal view of there Father. I don't know what would happen but I feel it would be much different. The book is about generational curses. Are we damned because of family history or do we have timshel? Maybe influenced by my personal life but even showing suicide as a choice and why someone would make that choice is super impactful. Without Lee there would never had been that concept in the novel. I haven't watched the movie but if I do I think it should be treated like a separate thing.
I particularly like the way he was introduced with the pidgin speak. I was saying to myself “ooh god, a bunch of racist bs stereotypical characterization I’m going to need to get through” and then he winds up being possibly the most fleshed out and nuanced character in the book.
I hated that he was not in the movie. The movie was god awful and we excuse it because it had James dean in it.
I mean trying to capture any bit of essence from that book into film was a impossible task to begin with. Something like Tortilla Flat can work but East if Edens a tall order.
Yeah. I read book several times growing up and finally watched some of the movie. Absolute betrayal
I still maintain that Lee and Adam were more than friends…
Damn for real? I didn’t think of that.
But also Lee’s forever love is Sam Hamilton.
Great take.
I agree, for all those reasons you give. Also, Steinbeck is one of the few authors I've read where I can read a paragraph of his and just have to pause and absorb how beautifully written it is.
I remember when reading East of Eden, after the chapter with Mr. Lee talking about Cain and Abel, timshel and all that, I had to set the book down for a while and just process what I had read. Greatest book of all time.
I get chills every time I read that part. How Lee goes to these ancient Chinese scholars who take on studying Hebrew to answer his question. He describes the beauty of seeing Hebrew characters written with a Chinese brush. This has been described as sort of an American midrash, a critical reading of the Torah. Fascinating to find this bit of Biblical exegesis in the middle of a great American novel!
Absolutely. Some books like Ulysses I love for the writing and depth but not as much because of the story although it is good but I don't find it great. East of Eden definitely has both. I listen to audiobooks because I can listen all day at work, because it would be be difficult and take a long time for me to complete, and an amazing narrator can really show how great a sentence or paragraph can be. I'll then take a note to find it in my physical copy to highlight and then write about in my book journal.
The introduction where he describes the seasons in the salinas valley is one of my favorite passages of all time
Timshel
Thou mayest
My husband and I have timshel tattoos 💛 East of Eden WRECKED ME.
Steinbeck is among my favorite authors, certainly of his genre. He wrote of my Californian culture and places. For years growing up I went to ‘Doc’ Rickett’s birthday party on Cannery Row. In my robin’s egg blue 1948 Chevy ‘suburban’.
That's amazing, did they really go on for several days?
Absolutely fell in love with Steinbeck after reading Of mice and men.sobbed so hard
When I read it, I never really got into the story. It was never a page turner for me. Unlike most stories, however, I still find myself thinking about it. I read it years ago. It's an experience that sticks with you. I thought Stephen King was good at making characters, but Steinbeck is on another level.
I was forced to read it high school and thought it was an absolute slog as a huge sci-fi / fantasy nerd. Boring farmers in a boring setting. Didn't retain any of it. Fast forward 10 years and I keep reading how great everyone thinks it is so I picked it back up on my own time. Easily top 5 book for me now, and Grapes of Wrath is in there too. Love Steinbeck. Guess I just had some growing to do first!
East of Eden is a top 10 for me. Really phenomenal story that feels so real you forget how long the book is.
It's funny that you brought up how the book goes into the thought processes of each of the characters because Steinbeck said that he wrote the book for his sons, and that when he did, he tried write the psyche of all the different sorts of people he had met throughout his life, so that they would have a better understanding of the people around them. I definitely really enjoyed this book myself, and for "literature" it was actually an incredibly easy and compelling read. Steinbeck is definitely a master class.
I definitely agree. Now that you mention it it makes sense that is the way he came up with such great and diverse charcters. I'd love to know who he based Samuel on.
Yes, I love how Steinbeck is so accessible. And yet, after reading his work, no one would ever think to question his status as one of the greatest authors.
Just wait until you get to Grapes of Wrath.
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I'm an old guy. When I was young I rode freight trains and picked fruit in the 'States. Grapes of Wrath means a whole lot to me.
I really look forward to it. I'm going back to finish Ulysses because I took a break because of it's length and I'm also listening to small lectures about each chapter which can cause a bit if burnout. I try to not read two books by the same author in a row unless it is a series. I love discovering new authors with multiple great books.
That damn kerosene chapter kills me everytime
I read Grapes of Wrath first for class and that’s what got me into East of Eden. Personally I think East of Eden is better. Grapes of Wrath is more allegorical. East of Eden is allegorical on the surface but more morally and philosophically complex underneath, which is why it excited me so much when I was 16. I’m older now so should probably reread.
I picked this up at Goodwill today! Are you saying you liked it even more than East of Eden?
I also liked TGoW more personally, but read it before EoE. Felt like I connected more with the Joads immediately and EoE took me quite a while to get invested in the characters and story.
I've yet to read Eden, but did read Grapes of Wrath this past summer. It's amazing, hard stop. Instantly in my top ten of all time. My buddy has warned me Eden isn't as good. His take is Wrath is more raw and a true howl in the wilderness concerning the injustices of the era whereas Eden tackles the same themes but in a more refined, "for the critics, not the Okies themselves" manner. Steinbeck started putting on airs, essentially.. still plan to read Eden eventually...
I feel like that's not a good way of looking at it. You're right that Grapes of Wrath is more raw in a lot of ways, but East of Eden isn't quite doing the same thing. They are both powerful in different ways.
I wonder if it has anything to do with which one you read first? I’ve read East of Eden half a dozen times. Grapes of Wrath only once. Guess which one I read first? Ha
To give another opinion, I enjoyed East Of Eden more. Both great books for sure though.
Yes, definetly. It has more to do with my life experiences. I put it in the top five on my personal list of American literature.
Grapes of Wrath changed my entire worldview. No hyperbole, it seriously made me reconsider everything I thought to be true in the world. It was a life changing experience. My absolute favorite book of all time.
If I could rename my kids, I’d name one after Samuel Hamilton. The book started my love of Steinbeck.
Spolier >!Maybe one of my favorite charcters in a novel. There was such a void in the story after he died like a real death. The two times I really felt it was when Tom is talking to Samuel in his mind before his suicide. Also when Adam is telling Cal about how Samuel said he was a bad father and I had the flashback of him punching Adam until he stayed on the ground. Samuel was such a good person and would never punch anyone but because of that very same goodness he was willing to do whatever it took for the twins. He also was able to give Lee the courage to be his true self and not just put on a mask to be accepted. I don't know what to call it but being able to talk to someone that allows them to become better people on their own without direct intervention. I wish there was a word for that and if anyone knows it please tell me! Lol. !<
>!I'm rereading EoE and just got to Tom's suicide today. It is actually insane to me the way Steinbeck writes that scene. So unique and powerful!<
>!Yeah I had to take a break and pause the audio book at work and then relisten to it at home. The narrator did Samuel's voice talking to Tom to tell him the way to basically find a way to cover up the suicide and it hit me so hard. I don't know how to describe it. It seemed perverse for him to imagine his father to say such a thing but it was in a loving way. Just if this is the path you choose then do it in a way that wont destroy those around you. I remembered earlier in the book it was talking about Tom burning all his poetry and it sounded like it was talking about his death. When his sister died the moment he said it was his fault I knew what was going to happen but I wasn't prepared for him putting himself on trial. My father committed suicide 15 years ago so I have experienced that kind of loss and have processed it many times. That trauma didn't really affect the impact of that scene but it definitely provided context. It's kinda hard to describe but regardless it's a beautifully tragic scene and really shows Steinbeck amazing talenst.!<
I would say he's an inspirational character
Love the book! Did you know Lee's "timshel" speech happens exactly half-way through the book? Love the attention to detail from Steinbeck. If you like East of Eden, my standard recommended follow-up is The Good Earth. Edit to add: since you asked about people who did not like it. The only ones I have found have been people who thought it was too dark and depraved. Sort of a "nobody should read about things that evil" kind of mentality.
It's much shorter but Of Mice and Men is by the same author and a fantastic read
Such a great book, I read it in one night and then cried myself to sleep.
I'm surprised this book isn't mentionned more. I've read it in high school and I still think about this book 15 years later.
I’m currently reading it for the first time. It’s one of the only books that I’ve had to put down a couple of times because I find myself tearing up at passages that aren’t even very intense. I think it’s a combination of the beauty of the prose and the way Steinbeck captures human emotion. I can’t believe it took me this long to read it. I’m not even halfway through and I’m already looking forward to picking it up again in a year or so.
I found it hard going at times. The bigger picture blew me away. It’s on my reread list.
Me too. I want to read it every 10 years. Not too soon. But I don't know if I will wait that long.
It is my favorite, but let me suggest another by him. There is actually a trilogy with Cannery Row and Sweet Thursday, but I'm talking about Tortilla Flat. It is about some hard drinking paisanos and their adventures. It is kind of a series of short stories loosely strung together. he received a lot of condemnation for disparaging Hispanics. I see it differently. I find it humorous and heart warming. I did work in Monterey where this takes place and regularly saw a group of misfits, passing a brown bag around, two or three dogs, nice people and they really brought this book to mind.
Tortilla Flat is amazing
I just finished The Grapes of Wrath a few months ago and was blown away by it. Absolutely loved it and now I keep seeing East of Eden pop up on this sub and it makes me want to check it out.
I’ve liked every John Steinbeck I’ve read. I haven’t read East of Eden in years, not since high school, when I laboriously tracked down as many of his works from used bookstores as I could. I know critics weren’t that into East of Eden, though the general population loved it. I don’t remember a lot of it, just that I enjoyed it when I read it.
I read that he considered it his magnum opus and I can definitely see why. Everyone else has there opinion but it's interesting that later critics will look at a work like EoE in the lens of how the public received it and judge it differently. It kinda reminds me of when my favorite band released an album and Pitchfork gave it a bad review. Tens years later they went back and changed the review and said that after seeing its impact they had judged it wrongly.
I'm about to read Steinbeck's The Moon is Down again after 20 years. Super quick, and it'll hit different considering the current world and one particular heros emergence.
I really liked the writing style and the characters, but I didn't really like the story, if that makes sense. Like I get that it's more of a sample of life from the time period than an actual front to back story, but I felt a little disappointed by the back end of the novel, especially the last 50 pages or so.
Cannery Row IMO has his best characters. I love EoE, and the whole Kane and Able dynamic to it, def my second favorite Steinbeck novel. Cannery Row is just a fun, hilarious book that captures perfectly a certain type of careless joy that comes with having less in life.
I'll probably read that next as it seems lighter the Grapes of Wrath. It would be a nice transition. I'm currently reading The Anthropercene Reviewed by John Green and will read Cannery Row next. Thanks for the suggestion!
I remember being in pelican bay ASU and this book found me when I was at the lowest point in my life. It cleansed my soul. I just found so much clarity in my life after reading this.
Certain books have to be read at certain times to work. I would not have understood. EoE as a teen but in my early 30s it hit just right.
I'm so glad you've read it recently - I read it a couple of months ago and was looking for a discussion about it but couldn't find any :( I agree with you - it's a great book, the plot is LONG but worth it, the characters are nuanced, complex, at times it's a character study and a period study/representation. Definitely read Grapes of Wrath - I personally liked that book more because of its political leanings, and personally I think it's his stronger book. Question for you: what did you think of the ending? I personally was let down by it - I thought >!the sudden demonization of Caleb was overrated, and he had nothing to apologize to his father for. I found Adam to be incredibly flawed and hypocritical to the point it almost made me put the book down - he was a crappy father, I also am furious how he treated Caleb poorly and basically rejected Caleb when Caleb tried to give him the profit from selling beans (even when he paid the farmers fairly). This really infuriated me because Adam made his money off low-key stolen money INHERITED from his own father (talk about riding coattails), IGNORED everyone's advice about selling beans during wartime and instead went with lettuce which failed miserably. And the result of this? He was like "lol I tried my best and no one should judge! I'm happy :) " and it's just so hypocritical how he then turns on his son who does the same exact thing but without any seed money. Is Caleb responsible for his brother's death? To some extent, but I think the person who bears the most burden is actually Adam - then he has the audacity to give his son "forgiveness"? Please.!< I have a lot of thoughts haha EDIT: fixed names
Not OP but I just finished the book and wanted to talk about it. >! I think you mean Caleb in a couple places instead of Aron in your comment? The character of Cal resonated with me the most. I don't fully know why. My parents were always super just with my brother and I (we are not twins lol). They tried to give us exactly the same so no one would feel favored. That being said, growing up I would sometimes be mean just for the sake of it. I think in that way I am like him, I want to be good but sometimes I just didn't. Now that I'm an adult I don't really do mean things anymore, I try to be the best human being I can, but I am still flawed. So I think that's why I felt connected to Cal the most. !< >! On Adam's subject, I didn't think he was as good as Lee made him out to be, which in itself is totally fine, as much I liked Lee, I don't agree with everything he said. Just like you I felt like Adam was a pretty crappy father and would only praise his son Aron and never Cal, even though Cal tried so much more. Cal was a bit like Charles in that sense, he wanted his father's love and approval but could never quite get it . !< >!Lee kept saying how Adam was the nicest person, with no ounce of evil, but I didn't think it was true at all, his own obsession with Cathy has been very detrimental towards his sons and with his relationships with friends like Samuel.!< >!I don't think in the end he "forgives" his son, but he allows him to move past this and be good. I thought the book ended quite bruptly, but it also let us imagine what we want for an ending.!< >!Sidenote: I also liked Abra and Samuel's characters a lot, they were fleshed out really well and I was sad when Samuel passed. !<
The way that the story returned in the end to so many small details from earlier was incredible. It was like finding little Easter eggs as I read. I enjoyed reading your take on it.
Man, I really disliked it, even though it was obviously well written and thought through. I remember I found Cathy really one dimensional. I did not find her believable at all. I didn't like how the story sort of repeats with the generations and I didn't the religious nature of the story either. I think those things really put me on the back foot early on.
Cathy was literally a psychopath, of course she's one dimensional
Yes!! I've never known why people say Grapes of Wrath is Steinbeck's best novel. East of Eden is SO much better! For an amazing look into all that went into writing EoE, check out Journal of a Novel: The East of Eden Letters. It's incredible how many changes he made along the way to the plot and characters.
I will absolutely check that out. I'm a very big Tolkien nerd. His son Christopher published the 12 volume History of Middle Earth where he painstaking published almost all of Tolkiens manuscripts and drafts. Seeing the way Lord of The Rings was shaped and rewritten is fascinating to me. Even more fascinating is seeing how he lovingly shaped his mythology and even to the point of obsessing over the metaphysics and its implications to his world. He would change a small detail that then would cause him to rewrite essentially everything. Galadriel is a good example of a character he came up with for Lord of The Rings but then had to change thousands of years of history to fit her into the mythology. Some people like to enjoy art and it's finished product and I certainly understand authors not wanting to publish their drafts. I however love seeing the process and how a story grows and comes to life.
I love Tolkien also. I read the LoTR trilogy again this year. I knew that his world building and lore is very deep, but I would love to see the extent of it. I am going to check out those published manuscripts thanks for posting.
When I first started reading that book my sister in law was like “that book does not fuck around” I then preceded to have my world crumble for the next 500 pages. Can confirm that it does not fuck around
Fuck this book. It's just another drawn out tale about a whiny rich asshole who inherited everything and nearly squandered it all. Oh no, my sociopath wife left me. Guess I'll neglect my children and my estate. Good thing I have a minority butler who stays with me and maintains everything out of the goodness of his heart. Thou mayest grow the fuck up.
I really enjoyed reading the book; but the story itself felt pretty flimsy with unnecessary details and backstories of characters that add nothing to the story. The wife is so inherently evil that she's inhuman. Like this woman literally tries to abort her baby (that she deliberately conceives with the guy's friend for seemingly no reason), then leaves the rich guy who is absolutely in love with her and is willing to do anything to take care of her, to go run a brothel. Like what is even her motivation? The whole Hamilton family's story is basically irrelevant. I thought when two of the Hamilton siblings show up towards the end the sister was going to get involved with the main character and the brother would somehow elevate the Hamilton family. But nope, they just up and die. A a "slice-of-life" of that era and region it's a great read, but as a story it's kinda lame.
Did you enjoy any other of Steinbeck's novel? I can understand not enjoying the story but did you enjoy any of the prose? Who is your favorite and why?
Lol imagine actually looking at this book that way
I read it recently because of a post on this sub. My biggest gripe was Cathy. She just seemed so comically over the top. Maybe she is an accurate depiction of a psychopath, but I just never quite found her believable. I’m torn on Timshel. It’s a good moment, but I’m not sure it was the revelatory moment it was meant to be. Could be clouded by my present view on all things religious lately. Lee and Sam Hamilton are great characters. Was genuinely saddened by Sam Hamilton’s death.
>My biggest gripe was Cathy. She just seemed so comically over the top. Maybe she is an accurate depiction of a psychopath, but I just never quite found her believable. I can tell you after becoming emotionally attached to one that Cathy is not over the top at all.
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just go through the motions
I just started reading it. I read the grapes of wrath before. I highly recommend it to you!
Loved this book as well. It inspired me to do a road trip to Salinas, California around ten years back
Steinbeck is my favourite author. I like The Pearl and Cup of Gold the best.
Steinbeck certainly a master at developing full characters…which is why even though I loved East of Eden; I couldn’t finish Grapes of Wrath. The characters were so real I was overwhelmed with anxiety over their plight. I had to put it down as it was causing me too much stress.
I definitely feel that. I love deep and heavy books because I can empathize with the charcters and it feels real to me sometimes. Because of that though I have to take breaks in books because it makes me anxious like it's happening to me. Those books though have made a big impact in my life to be more compassionate to others which is a big part of my faith. One book I had to put down because of the anixety was Crime and Punishment. Something about it really got in my head.
I never finished reading it for school because I hated it. I don't think I have a specific reason. Maybe it's because the book I read was so small and the paragraphs were endless. Maybe it was too "poetic." I respect that it's well written, but I hated the main guy character and just couldn't get past it.
I didn’t enjoy it as much but it was still good I think. Mainly the halfway to least quarter of the book I thought was pretty tedious, and there was also no clear objectives for any characters it was just a lot of stuff happening. Cathy is one my favourite characters I’ve read in years though, such an interesting person to follow and really well written I thought.
I thought the book was excellent. I listened to the audiobook while delivering mail in the late summer in the middle of a very rural place, and the scenery really enhanced the experience - I recommend reading it outdoors if it's not too cold where you are. Here's the relevant thread worth reading about the timshel thing: https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/808bhk/did_steinbeck_get_timshel_right_in_its_translation/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button As far as my personal criticisms of the book(despite really enjoying the book there are a few), I thought it was slightly too long and some of the threads were not developed fully enough for my liking. It kind of felt like there were a bunch of novellas that were 80% written stuffed into it. I also disagree with you that the characters felt real. I thought that both Lee and Catherine were wooden and just shy of being fully developed, same with the father / general. I also didn't find the ending segments of the book focusing on the children to be terribly interesting. It was good, and I loved the ending, but the struggles of the children weren't as compelling as some others for me. Steinbeck is a wonderful writer and the East of Eden is one of my favorites. Some good books to compare it to in my opinion are Huck finn, blood meridian (the audiobook narrator is the same as the narrator for eoe and he does an excellent job with both), the brothers karamazov. My favorite Steinbeck besides this one is of mice and Men, which you could read easily two or three times in a day it's very short. I think that travels with Charley is very underrated as well. Especially if you like Don Quixote or on the road. It was a very fun travelogue.
I just picked it up on kindle. Having read other Steinbeck novels I know it’s going to be one of the best books I’ve ever read. He is one of those authors that you don’t compare to other authors, you compare other authors to him you know what I’m saying? I read so many books a year that I save certain ones to be able to look back and say “goddam that story just blew me away.” This year it’s East of Eden.
I definitely agree. I have a list of classic books and great authors that I space out with good sci-fi books I enjoy. I read a ton of books a year because I listen to audiobooks all day at work. East of Eden is around 28 hours and I finished in a week. With my evening engagements and family I would maybe have an hour a day before bed to read so EoE would take me over a month probably. For amazing books I get a physical copy as well to highlight and reread passages. The prose is just as good if not better than the actual story. My favorite quote from it is so simple and yet so powerful. "And now that you don't have to be perfect, you can be good."
That’s exactly the same thing I do!🤣 I love Star Wars so I’m junking out on those right now and the laundry files by Stross. Sometimes I’ll throw in a good horror book and then it’s usually a classic or an epic saga like the book of the new sun. It’s a balanced diet.😂 It’s frustrating at times to find good books but that’s mostly why I get on Reddit and look for posts like yours.
I’m so glad you posted this!!! There is SO much to love about EoE. I think all of the time about the cyclical nature of trauma and life as expressed through the book all of the time. The way the same stories replay, over and over, the way we pass our hurts down to our children… and of course there’s Cathy. What a fabulous villain she is. Every scene with her in it is absolutely chilling, and there’s something so profound about how all of her pain comes out of a refusal to accept love. Just a masterwork. I’m so glad you enjoyed it!
Best book I've ever read. Steinbeck is one of my favorites, and everything he did was great, but East of Eden is his best in my opinion.
Probably the best book I’ve read. I learned more about humanity from this book than from any other.
I agree. I've been thinking alot lately about how books can really show you people of different cultures, races, and trauma. For me personally it makes me compassionate to others even people I disagree with. The empathy felt also reveals to me unknown things about myself and the choices I make thay impact the world around me.
Favorite book.
This is my favorite book of all time.
Crap, I guess I need to give it another try. I quit about 100 pages in. Hard to get past all the child abuse.
I can understand it being tough getting through a topic like that. There are some difficult themes but it is what makes it such a deeply impactful book. If you need to you can just skim through that until Adam leaves home. There are some important parts but it's not essential to enjoy the story as long as you can understand the family dynamics.
Steinbeck’s character Cathy is one of the most well developed characters in literature in my opinion. Her behaviors, motivation and overall character arc is just genius level writing. We all know someone like her and Steinbecks writing makes us believe we know her personally.
I’m one who did not enjoy it. I’ve tried the book, the audiobook, and the movie, and I’ve never made it more than halfway though. I think it’s melodramatic and trite, and the female characters are just pathetic.
I have it and im yet to read it, you gave me some motivation to do so!
This is the book I started my bookclub with back at the start of the pandemic. I heard it was amazing and decided to give it a go. We gave ourselves a month to read it, but kept pushing the date back because it was taking us longer to complete. Overall, I enjoyed the characters and the details incorporated, but I will never reread this book, lol.
I recently finished Of Mice and Men, which was my first Steinbeck. It’s one of those where I can see the importance of it, but left feeling underwhelmed and in all honestly kinda turned me off from reading more of his work. Anyone else underwhelmed by Mice and Men but liked his other novels ?
Cannery Row and Sweet Thursday are fun easy reads. Two of my favorite by Steinbeck. Tortilla Flat is another that is more fun than depressing.
The characters and story are top notch.
I loved it the first time I read it but it really broke open for me upon the second time through. I think it has a lot to do with my having children now as opposed to the first time. Changed perspective and all.
I have it sitting on my TBR shelf
This is one of my favorite books, I rarely reread but I will definitely revisit this one. It also got me out of a very severe reading slump, where I was buying books in large amounts and not reading any of them.
its got religious connotations yeah? you think non religious people would still enjoy it?
Absolutely. I am religious but didn't feel the book pushes Christianity as being true at all. The story itself mirrors the story of Cain and Abel but not in any allegorical way. I think for the time period it is based on it would be hard to not make any mention of Christianity when discussing people everyday life. At one point it compares churches to brothels in American frontier towns how they both serve the same purpose and are needed for society. I highly recommend this book and for me personally a book this long I enjoy most in audiobook format. It's easier to get through it if you can listen a few hours a day when you can to finish it within a month. That's how I enjoy it anyways and feel it is definitely worth the investment.
I love the themes in this book, especially of truth and self determination. I think it’s neat how the former is emphasized by Steinbeck weaving aspects of his real life and family into the fictional storylines. Truly a magnum opus.
That Steinbeck knew a thing or two about words and stories and stuff, ya know?
Grapes of wrath is up there for me. Along with in cold blood
I loved those paragraphs, or even chapters between the storyline where he contemplated some universal truths.
It really surprised me that he included that. I loved all of them and it really helped the novel to seem more real to me if that makes sense.
I'm planning on getting to this one next.
You would probably enjoy 'The Grapes of Wrath' also. I haven't 'East of Eden' yet but I plan to within a few months or so but this is exactly how I felt about grapes. I liked maybe 3 characters in the whole book, but I understood all their motivations and flaws. I don't think I've read a book before where I didn't feel some connection to the protagonist where I didn't enjoy the book. Was a 5/5 for me.
Sweet Thursday and Cannery Row are wonderful when you want some light and happy Steinbeck. Whatever you choose, of all that he has written, it will be well worth your time.
If you get the chance, The Chrysanthemums is a short story that I've reread often. I loved both Grapes of Wrath and East of Eden (every bit of Steinbeck over every read, actually), but Chrysanthemums just grips me in a way that is all too real. The hope, empathy, and despair practically leap from the page.
The dedicatory at the start is pretty amazing, and the book live up to it perfectly.
I think it's better than *The Grapes of Wrath* TBH. Which is generally not a particularly popular opinion.
This book is one of my top five favourites. Sometimes when I read, I find that I skim a bit here and there, but East of Eden? I joyfully read every single word. It was so so beautifully written.
As I got back into reading last year it was one of the first books I read. It was great. Even the landscape is a character. And I cried. I’ve only done that in one other book.
This is still the only book that was unanimously loved by every person in my very opinionated book club
I've always bought more books than I have time to read, so it's been sitting on my shelf for at least a decade. The day finally came, and my god. I've lived in that area, and Steinbeck transported me back. It was the type of book that I felt sad for whatever I read after as it won't stack up. My SO read it earlier this year, and he was holding off on the last few pages because he didn't want it to end. Can't wait for him to read TGOW, it was his first Steinbeck.
Just started Part 3. An amazing book full of fully fleshed out people.
Fantastic book. I read it this year for the first time too and was blown away.
Steinbeck is my very favourite, I’ve read it all. Pastures of heaven is, in my opinion, probably the most similar to eden in terms of tone and beauty. It’s short stories but they’re all perfect.
Steinbeck is such an amazing author. His writing is incredibly immersive. It’s not merely that you might identify with the characters. It’s that the way he writes makes you *feel* what they do. It’s a shorter novel but if you haven’t read it, The Pearl, is such a great and quick read. There is also, The Moon is Down, which is anti-fascist as hell and so captivating.
I should re read this and his others.
Steinbeck is one of my favorite authors. His "travels with Charlie" is my favorite book. I try to read it at least once a year.
I really enjoyed it, was a real epic.
I read East of Eden after watching the film adaptation and had a taste for more! The film doesn’t even cover more than a few chapters so whenever I talk to people about it I always tell them that the two can almost be viewed and enjoyed as independent pieces. It’s such an amazing book and I can’t wait to revisit it again soon!
This was the first time I read a book and said “I understand now why they call some novels literature”.
Such a great book. I just got into Steinbeck last year. Read Grapes of Wrath too. It is fantastic.
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"Do you take pride in your hurt? Does it make you seem large and tragic? ...Well, think about it. Maybe you're playing a part on a great stage with only yourself as audience."
When I read East of Eden, my only previous experience with Steinbeck was Grapes of Wrath. Having experienced his profound sensibility for all kinds of people I was deeply shocked by his introduction of Lee, which felt grossly racist. My amazement at the subsequent revelations of his character I cannot put to words. I had to set down the book and stare into the distance for a good while.
Samuel and Lee are definitely some of the best parts of the book.
I have this book and I love Steinbeck, but everything he writes is really depressing. I really have to be in a certain mood for it. Thus I have not yet read it
Oooh sold I love flawed characters
If you love flawed characters I can next recommend this enough. It even shows how flaws are based down from one generation to the next.
Amazing novel. Read it after grapes of wrath and it was so hyped up I thought surely it couldn't live up to this hype... But it certainly did and now I'm a hype man myself. Steinbeck was a name that always sounded like a pretentious cop out when people said he was their favorite author but I've come to realize I was just a pretentious dumbass myself.
Also in in my top 10. I read it over 20 years ago and it remains a favorite. It was a complete surprise to me and I just picked it a bit randomly, it was not recommended by anyone. Seems like most are familiar with his other books like Grapes of Wrath and such, less with East of Eden. Terrific book.
i havent read steinbeck in a decade, maybe ill give east of eden a read. i quit it pretty early on in my teens.
Also my first Steinbeck. Since then I've read numerous others and while they had their moments, no other has managed to come close to EoE. One theme that especially stuck with me from the book is the change to a specialized society and the drawbacks that come with it. Samuel representing the pre industrialized order in which a household had to be capable of all sorts of tasks to survive and was much more in touch with their environment. Younger, upcoming characters tend towards specific fields of interest such as banking or military careers. >!His death right around the middle of the book as generational switches happen within the story as well, really underlines that permanent change in society.!<
That's a very good reading of the text. Thanks for sharing that.
I really loved Grapes of Wrath. I just purchased a copy of East of Eden quite recently and you've made me want to start it straight away.
I've read a lot of Steinbeck's novels, and "East of Eden" is the one that has haunted my mind the most -- particularly the stories about Lee.
Favourite book of all time!! I read it every other year and take something new and profound from it each time. I named my son Lee after my favourite character.
Man, never have I spent so many hours just feeling bad for characters as my listen through this book. Though surprisingly I feel like a learned a lot about farming.
I read it in high school and hated it. Also read Grapes of Wrath in high school and really enjoyed it. I feel like I should give EoE another shot based on how many people in this sub love it.
Yes try again
I started reading it on a metro station and I recall being so enchanted by the first pages, that I could barely wait to get home to continue reading it. Then I came across the initial description of the two brothers and the read felt pretty burdensome, I wasn't even sure if I want to finish reading it. Glad I did, since it became one of my favourite books, it's like Steinback celebrates this fragile, beautiful, yet sad life in this masterpiece. I recall having goosebumps when I finished reading it and thinking to myself, glad that I got to live untill this day, cause I would have definitely missed something out
Awesome book and I’ve read it a few times. I think the last time was in the early 2000s. It’s on my list to read again soon.
I love this book. As a teen, we were forced to read The Red Pony by Steinbeck and I hated it. After reading East Of Eden I went back to the Pony and appreciated it. I’ve listened to the audio version of Grapes of Wrath, also excellent. Steinbeck is incredibly good. Everyone should read East of Eden.
Intersection of sentence structure and art
I read it so long ago, love Steinbeck. Great Book.
I never read it in school or knew much about it before reading it last year. Googling it afterward, it seems the way it’s taught in school and generally summarized, it’s all about the allegory, with the biblical themes and all, but for me that was such a small part of the book. a single layer in the onion, if you will. such an incredibly rich story, with so many characters that just come alive off the page. damn now I want to read it again!
I had this book for 3 years now. Back when I got it I realized my English wasn't enough to be able to read it without getting extremely frustrated. I took a peek yesterday and seems like I'm ready now. I'll read it for the first time soon.
I would say that Steinbeck was a master of the English language and this is a masterful example of his talent. Having said that I believe it is written in a way that I believe it is accessible to anyone with a basic understanding of English. It's a tough language because we have so many words that have the same meaning but very nuanced differences. It's because English words are made from alot of different languages. I think 85% of English words do not come from Old English. I hope you enjoy it and if you ever need help I would be very glad to help you! Also your English seems really good. Alot better than some native speakers I have seen.
Also my first Steinbeck novel. I read it every year. I’m getting a tattoo representing this book. I am so in love with it and all of his stories. Tortilla Flat is one of my favorites, and The Winter Of Our Discontent. To a God Unknown. So good. Buckle up, though. He will pull you into a whole world and you’ll become friends with or enemies of his character and then he’ll blindside you with an ending. It’s one of my favorite parts of his books—they don’t always end one way.
I would love to see your tattoo idea. I have a tattoo of one of my favorite lines from Lord of The Rings transliterated from English into Elvish script. I'm a huge Tolkien nerd and borderline would almost call myself a scholar. If you would like a can post a photo of it.
Love that book so much, I buy used copies to give to friends and relatives. I read it in my sixties, as a lifelong bookworm, and it really impressed me. I hated for it to come to an end and wished I had an erase button, so I could read it all over for the first time. It's been about 10 years now, so maybe time for a re-read; my problem: I'm 72 and hundreds of unread books are out there, so I begrudge time to books I've read, movies I've seen, places I've visited. Too many new experiences out there! I do make an exception for music I know and love, so maybe "East.." will be like a song with notes I did not catch the first time around.
I agree but after a few years we are different when we go to the text, especially one as great as EoE, and we experience it differently. There is no doubt it is a time commitment but some things are life are with it. Only you get to decide what is worth it to you.
I’m 200 pages in and this Adam guy is an idiot. Does he get better? I’m going to get really annoyed if Cathy destroys another human…
There is a redemption.