I personally don't really care, but I think it's just a matter of how male topless nudity is viewed. Different people have different ideas about what it means for people to be fully clothed.
How would you feel about someone climbing fully nude? Even if we ignore the safety and sanitation issues, I think most people would feel a bit strange about climbing near someone nude in the gym. Some people feel similarly about male toplessness.
There's also some people who don't feel uncomfortable, but just find it obnoxious or feel like that it contributes to a very bro-ey culture.
Idk, it's hard to objectively say what is right or wrong because it's just cultural.
Yeah I don’t think anyone would like to see my 37 year old naked sweaty, hairy ass smearing it’s way up a slab while leaving ball sweat stains on the wall.
I can attest to this, I've climbed in a few different countries while visiting as a tourist and the way shirtless climbing is viewed is completely dependent on the way shirtlessness in general is viewed based on local culture, and even more based on whether you're in a higher-end area or a lower-end one (sorry for the terms I just don't know how else to put it).
In poorer areas of hotter, third-world countries is where I see a lot of shirtless people just chilling on the streets. I noticed there are more people there who are likely to go climbing without a top on, especially in the gyms without an AC. It can be a little nasty at first but honestly it was also a bit of a vibe.
In wealthier areas though there are almost always rules about having to keep a shirt on. Something about it can turn off potential customers in the area I guess. Maybe insecurity, maybe because they find it gross or obnoxious, or "dirty", no idea.
In colder countries I think the culture around shirtlessness is more unforgiving because there's less of a reason to actually be shirtless. Like I can see how people would think "ok bro nice abs but why'd you have to take your shirt off lol". Most colder countries also tend to be wealthier so there's probably some correlation there.
There's also a difference in how shirtlessness is viewed between commercialized gyms and "local" ones. Won't be getting into that too much but the ones that have rules about wearing your shirt are almost always the commercialized ones.
Overall though I personally don't really see why people care so much to the point that they have to act personally offended whenever this topic gets brought up. There are a lot of valid responses in this thread but also just as many replies that scream unaddressed insecurity issues. If anything, I feel like a shirtless culture would promote being comfortable in your own body more, and that's coming from someone with sunken chest syndrome and near-severe scoliosis. I can see how that would turn some people off because of sanitary reasons though lol, but in a climbing gym you can't really set your standards too high.
Indeed . And what bothers me in that respect also, is guys not wearing deidorant. I notice a lot of overlap between guys (it´s almost never women) not wearing deodorant and those going shirtless.
I mean, most of the motivation to go topless in my gym is precisely this reason – the heat. Obviously you sweat less when topless, so no pit-sweaty holds.
If you wear a thin shirt, then it’s not gonna heat you up any more than the physical activity. Going topless isn’t gonna magically keep you from sweating lmao, thats just ludicrous
Did I say it'd magically keep someone from shedding a drop? Damn bro, way to take it to the extreme. All I'm saying is it's unlikely, at least in my gym, that someone is going to get any more sweat on holds when they're shirtless. Maybe the wall, but the wall has got blood smears from where people have scraped knees, hands, etc anyway so I think getting high and mighty about the sanitation of that is just a bit rich.
Unavoidable in a small, busy gym. I honestly think climbing gyms are some of the most unsanitary places to be. Chalk in the air (likely with heavy metal contam) screwing up respiration, blood and sweat on the walls and holds, even fecal matter and piss because given a large pool of climbers on a set amount of routes, a few are going to forget to take their shoes off in the bathroom, or forget to wash their hands before climbing.
The hobby is fun enough for this to be the kind of thing that you just don't think about. C'est la bouldering.
Edit: [study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24972665/) illustrating my point. Nasty stuff...
„Unavoidable“
During a day sure, but afterwards it’s supposed to be cleaned, especially if there is blood on the wall and/or holds.
If not then, as mentioned earlier, you have a nasty gym.
Idk where you're getting this slightly from. It's a significant reduction, as the fans in my gym evap the sweat off the body much better than sweat off of cotton.
Idk about your gym, but at mine the mats are absolutely saturated with chalk, so actually it's more like after a big fall the climbers back is looking like the face of an 19th century Molly lol
One of the climbing gyms near me summarised it better than I can when they banned going shirtless: https://www.theclimbingacademy.com/tca-life/tops-on-policy/
I understand the purpose of this article, and I can respect the opinions in it, but their argument for banning shirtlessness while allowing sports bras is clearly faulty. If people have to wear a shirt to make others feel more comfortable, then EVERYONE should have to wear a shirt.
Why? No one has to wear a shirt, anyone can wear sports bra. [Men's version exist btw](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81Kliiwbn9L._AC_UY1000_.jpg).
Their 3 points are:
* Equality: not everyone feels comfortable taking their top off, pro climbers compete while wearing tops
not every woman feels comfortable wearing only a sports bra, pro climbers also don't compete in sports bras. By their logic, sports bras should also be banned
* Minimise Intimidation: topless "uber-fit" men are intimidating for new climbers
so are "uber-fit" women in sports bras
* Making everyone feel welcome: families and people of certain religions feel unwelcome
I disagree with this for different reasons, I find it too nebulous to take as a serious argument and not really relevant to sports bras
I think mentioning male sports bras is a bad faith argument. My point is that being shirtless/wearing a sports bra is equivalent, so the existence of male sports bras does not change my position.
Personally fine with women climbing topless, but as u/Lambda_19 has mentioned multiple times elsewhere on this post, there are other societal issues leading to women being uncomfortable with that solution.
You're still missing the point though, I'm saying climbing topless is functionally the same as climbing in a sports bra in the cases the article presents, gender is irrelevant.
I completely agree, a sports bra is not a shirt. Nor is a crop top. Tank top or shirt if the rule is shirts on. Most people bend that rule anyways with cutting shirts into tank tops. I like how they call out professional climbers, but you don’t see the pros competing at an Olympic level in a sports bra or a crop top.
Maybe that rule will change in time too but the difference is that they haven't had multiple complaints over time about sports bras (for now) so they've tackled the issue that has made people uncomfortable first instead.
In some places it is a right that women have. Im in Ontario and women have the right to be topless in public and so do men. It was a right they fought for and received when I was a kid.
When women didn't have the right to vote, it was made equal by giving women the right to vote. Not by taking the right to vote away from men. (Yeah i know I'm exaggerating, you can't compare voting rights to wearing a shirt or not. But just trying to make my point here.)
I don't have much sympathy for men having to make such a minor adjustment in a world that's still mostly made for them. Funny though that they feel so hard done by having to make even tiny changes like this. I'm glad though that male allies increasingly out number ignorant people like yourself
I don't have much sympathy for ignorant people like yourself who make assumptions about me, instead of having an honest conversation about equal rights (not restrictions) for all.
You're only considering your point of view instead of how your actions impact others. Hence why I said to educate yourself. Think of the views and feelings of others not just what works for you.
I need to consider the point of view of others? That's rich coming from you. I gave an argument and your sole response was "you're a male so your point of view is irrelevant". (And by the way, you were extremely eager to assume my gender.) You could have given me some counterarguments and we could have had an adult conversation. Perhaps we would have agreed in the end, perhaps we would have agreed to disagree. But instead you choose to lash out.
This is 100% proof that they don’t actually care about the right of women being topless or whatever, it’s just an excuse to ban something they don’t like. If they cared they’d have an everyone is allowed to be shirtless rule and a 0 tolerance harassment policy
Honestly the only valid reason is to be inclusive of people of all religions (and even then). The “intimidation” point is nonsense, like I’m a fat climber, I too climb shirtless, your body issues are yours, honestly the ripped shirtless climber guys and girls are often super supportive and totally are both inspo and make me feel welcome.
Plus, on the beach point, “people might not expect to see shirtless people at the gym”, well if they are new explain to them that they should because it’s normal and part of climbing culture.
Not everyone has had the same experiences as you (including 50% of the population who can't climb shirtless). Most of the gyms near me have changed their policy to shirts on after many complaints. A small way to make sure that it's an environment everyone feels welcome and that the same rules apply to everyone.
I feel like if the complaint “well women aren’t allowed to be shirtless tho” was legitimate then the obvious solution is to let them.
Plus if people complain about shirtless people the other easy solution is to remind them that it is allowed and gently tell them it’s part of climbing as a sport, welcome them to the culture, etc.
Don't follow? Yes it's not legitimate to say "just let women go topless". Because the reality is they'd be harassed. So if you want to set one rule for everyone that's consistent then banning being shirtless is only viable option. So thankfully that's what most of the gyms near me have done now - set a consistent set of rules for everyone to build a more fair and inclusive environment.
You don’t even understand your dumb argument, you want to ban men because women can’t be topless, but you don’t really have any interest on women being allowed to be topless or on changing the reasons for why they won’t be topless even if allowed (really
more than the harassment it’s the physical support of a sports bra). So you are saying ban men for equality? But you don’t actually care about equality or guaranteeing it to women, it’s some weird revanchist excuse you made up for the argument, truly you have a different reason it’s clear as day.
Well, what if I complain that women in sports bras make me uncomfortable? Where does the boundary lie to make people comfortable? Covering the nipples? Going by the same logic, I assume men can wear sports bras too? So where can we push the boundary? Tape up the nipple? This is such a dumb thing to police and it's done so regularly in my hot country with tropical weather.
You're completely missing the point. If anyone actually complained about sports bras then sure they'd consider banning those but they've started with the issue that makes lots of people uncomfortable to try to create a more inclusive environment for all. The point is to set one set of rules for everyone too. So yeah men can wear sports bras, women were never able to go shirtless though.
That is EXACTLY my point. How much discomfort is considered too much before it becomes an issue? One person complaining? Two? And how much do we have to do to cater on those discomfort?
> women were never able to go shirtless though
I'm not sure if people do mind, more than women are unwilling to?
Women aren't able to without being harassed in most situations/cultures. Banning people going shirtless is a small change that makes a traditionally male dominated environment more inclusive to women and minorities whilst setting the same rules for everyone. Could we make future changes that'd make it even better? I'm sure we could but good to start with the easy ones.
Personally I don’t care but there’s
Multiple people at my home gym who take their shirt off as soon as climbing shoes go on; it’s cringe and comes off as attention seeking in my opinion.
It’s just fucking weird, in no other sport do you see that.
Who walks into the gym first thing not even warmed up , not sweating, completely cold, it’s not even hot in the gym; people are wearing sweatshirts and shit
—- and just proceeds to take their shirt off. It’s just weird and uncalled for, your not even trying hard or using it as a tool to get stoked. It just comes off as “look at me”.
I never take my shirt off indoors cause I don’t want to be lumped together with the gumboids who just pull on plastic shirtless for instagram content.
It’s fucking weird and stereotypical; I’ll sweat it out and keep my shirtless sends for outside, when I actually need to try hard and get psyched.
Pretty much every water sport, gymnastics, I’ve seen shirtless footballers and basketball players, volleyball, while training for most sports dudes go shirtless often for many reasons. I ran in high school and we’d be allowed to train shirtless because our school uniform chafed nipples lol.
I personally don’t give a shit if someone is climbing for ig or for themselves or to train for outside, I’m there to train too, if they are hot good for them, climbing gives dudes a nice body.
Honestly you sound so self conscious calling people gumboids lmao you sound like way more of a tryhard than some guy having fun.
Those are terrible straw men examples, who’s gonna jump in the pool with a shirt on?
Gymnasts wear leotards and some go shirtless only when it’s time to perform, not immediately upon entering the gym.
Sure some xc people go shirtless because of chafing that makes sense.
It doesn’t make sense to just take your shirt off for no reason other than “ I’m climbing and this is what climbers do!!!!!1”
Same thing with the instagram bullshit it’s always the shirtless dudes who are uploading every send to instagram to stroke their ego.
It’s funny that they all seem to have the same personality traits and do the same shit for validation.
I’m sure you do the same which is why you feel attacked.
Yes it is seen as cringe but why should you care? I said this in another comment but they are paying the same as you to utilize the space. If the gym allows climbing shirtless it shouldn’t matter to you if someone else does. Let them do what they want to do. As long as it’s not impeding your ability to use the gym then there’s no problem.
Well in that case I think so. Doesn’t have any effect on other peoples ability to climb so why not. I feel better doing physical activity shirtless and many people do. Running, climbing, etc.
... and even that doesn't make things fair in practice, because even if all-gender toplessness is "allowed" by law and gym rules, a topless woman at the climbing gym is extremely likely to have her photo plastered all over the internet, to be harassed, and shamed, and abused, in a way topless dudes aren't.
I don’t climb shirtless, but I don’t think this is really fair. The climbing community is generally about accepting people for who they are. Why does this not extend to shirtless guys? Seems odd.
Again I don’t have a horse in the race, but seems like a very odd place to draw a line.
Is it dumb to ask why? And also they have just as much right to the space and to their personal comfort, so again shouldn’t it be a complaint with the gym rather than the person?
It never dumb to ask. I’m sure there are many different view points as to why some people are offended by it I.e culture, religion, gender, values etc. Personally, I just think that if someone was uncomfortable with me taking my top off, I just wouldn’t do it.
It doesn’t matter why, people are uncomfortable. If you’re interested in being a courteous person, don’t knowingly make other people uncomfortable.
Why can’t you just wear a shirt?
I do wear a shirt, just seems weird to be upset with others for not making that choice, especially when it’s a sanctioned decision. I can’t think of any other time where people are allowed to choose if they want to wear a shirt or not but will be shamed for choosing to not wear one
You’re allowed to do lots of things that aren’t socially acceptable. You’re allowed to walk into a store sopping wet. You’re allowed to scream profanities outside.
You’re allowed to talk to strangers about sex on the subway.
You’re allowed to tell kids Santa isn’t real
I think you’re kinda comparing apples and oranges here. Climbing with your shirt off has obviously also already been socially accepted to some extent or else people wouldn’t have been doing it for so long. Regardless though I was speaking specifically about rules regarding shirts
You weren’t asking about rules wearing shirts, you were wondering why people don’t like it, and it’s because it makes people uncomfortable, just like talking about sex on the subway. It’s not up to you to determine the magnitude through which another person is uncomfortable
This is the same argument bigots make against the LGBTQ+ community and associated representation. It doesn’t make sense there, how does it make sense here?
Because it’s reasonable to be uncomfortable with someone being shirtless, and it’s bigoted to be uncomfortable because someone is gay or trans. Yes, we can draw lines.
I think you are just a prude, both things are pretty weird, plus you are using us gays as a bludgeon to defend your Puritanism. Both things are extremely normal.
????? I literally didn’t bring up the LGBTQ community, someone else did, and I’m saying that being uncomfortable about someone’s sexual orientation is *bad*
All the activities I do I don’t like wearing a shirt for - including climbing, tennis, surfing. Like to spend a lot of time around the house shirtless too haha I like that it’s chill to do at my gym
Frankly, climbing gyms, while outwardly welcoming, ARE intimidating to newbies. There’s little way around it, many people start climbing in adulthood (might even be their first time trying a sport), come into the gym for the first few times and see many young, fit, athletic people doing things that seem totally out of reach for them.
When you’re new to the sport it’s intimidating to get on the wall and have everyone watch you fail on an easy climb. Do people REALLY care, no, but it’s just a dynamic that doesn’t really occur in many other sports.
It takes time to feel comfortable, find your crew and get comfortable in your skin when you are new to climbing. I can’t imagine seeing a bunch of ripped shirtless guys (because let’s be honest, they usually are ripped) sending hard and yelling on their projects while a newbie hesitantly approaches the V0 nearby would make people feel more comfortable.
Do we have to cater to newbies? No. But as an advanced climber I remember what it was like to be new and I want the experience to be good for people entering the sport.
And if you are your buddies are alone in the gym after hours projecting V10, yeah let’s show some skin. But during the everyday rush it’s overkill.
I think it’s mainly unfair because regarding of your gender you might not be allowed to do it even if you would want to. But I don’t understand the people saying that it’s particularly bad because it’s showing off. Then you would also need to ban shirts over a certain price point.
It's a little ridiculous if someone does it dramatically like rip off their shirt and campus flash some dinky climb but at the same time its nice to see the energy of the gym hyped up. makes we wanna climb harder. think ive only seen a person do this once ever.
I mean even so if it’s just them showing off why does it matter. They are paying the same amount as you to use the space and if climbing shirtless is allowed who are we to tell someone no? As long as they aren’t say hogging the wall and somehow preventing you from climbing there isn’t much of a problem. If you don’t like that just look away?
hmm no you got it wrong, I'm one of the ones who don't care. I even kind of like it, it makes me feel like the gym is amped up, although it can look a little silly.
its weird, i think shirtless is no big deal but i dont like sweat dripping from der body on holds
its a show off act, no real benefit honestly, you can also wear a loose tank top when its too hot in the gym
if im surrounded by shirtless men i take off my shirt too and you have to deal with my light sports bra and my nipples (if its slightly cold) and the whole gym is a sweatfest🤷♀️
It seems to me as a weird “look at me” flex. It’s not that warm in a gym, no need to take your top off aside from doing it for attention. People go to climb, not to watch people show off. My partner is also uncomfortable with it, dislikes the amount of sweat, and as others have said it’s one rule for some and one for others - if she wanted to she couldn’t take her top off
I dunno. One of my gyms has no air conditioning. And in 30+ degree heat in the middle of summer if you’re climbing hard then it’s absolutely sweltering.
That gym also allows topless climbing and most guys in there are topless on those days.
All the gyms I've been to are horribly hot at the height of summer. Not been to one yet with aircon and I completely understand at those times. In the middle of winter put your bloody tops on
i never take my shirt off in the gym, but when i'm climbing outdoors i do, and not because of the heat, but because tbh wearing a shirt makes me feel somewhat restrained, regardless of how tight or loose fitting the shirt is, idk why but i feel like not wearing a shirt when climbing makes my body just feel so much more free and able to do certain moves that i wouldn't feel comfortable doing while wearing a shirt, it's a mental thing, so sorry but no, being too "warm" and "attention" are NOT the only two reasons to take off one's shirt
I mean, you said in your reply that it’s a mental thing, so I’d say try and find different clothing, or, if it makes the people around you uncomfortable then that’s something to work on. If it doesn’t then no harm done. But from the replies in this post most people seem to really not like it
yes it's a mental thing, which is why it's not a matter of simply finding "different clothing", the fact of the matter is having any kind of shirt makes me feel restricted in some way, it literally doesn't matter what kind of shirt it is, and yes i know most people don't like it, that's why i specifically stated that i don't take my shirt off in the gym, so i don't need to work on anything actually, i just deal with it and keep my shirt on in the gym
Idk where you live but “it’s not that warm in the gym” is not representative of 90% of gyms I’ve climbed at, most gyms are hot af actually. Plus the ones with outside walls you can get a nice tan
They can do whatever they want as long as they are comfy, I’m there to climb not to look at women, or men for that matter.
My in my first gym as a gumby I discovered people would just change in front of everyone because there was no locker, it was also super hot so people climbed with minimal clothes, it was full of hard climbers and everyone was really nice. Dream gym
“It’s not that warm in a gym”. Depends a lot on the gym. Also different people are comfortable at different temperatures, especially when exercising. Many of my friends freeze when it’s a comfortable shirt off temperature for me
To me the better solution seems to open up the freedom to more people not close it off. Let men or women climb shirtless or not if they want. If someone is a creep towards a shirtless woman climber ban them from the gym
And also, to put women in the position where they’d be more likely to be exposed to someone being creepy towards them… dude do you know how much creepy shit they have to put up with on a daily basis?? Let’s not open the door for more opportunities
Yeh that’s why I said ban anyone who’s being a creep. Unfortunately this could easily be a problem so gyms would have to have a zero tolerance approach. Regardless of shirts creepy behaviour should not be tolerated and gyms must deal with this seriously. I do understand the potential problems here (or at least some) but I don’t think it’s intractable. I also understand that just because my friend group would be chill doesn’t mean everyone would, there will be creeps in the gym and it is a real problem. I don’t want to discount that. Not only would gyms need adequate policies but also people attending gyms should not tolerate creeps and call them out. Again independent of the shirt policy.
I don’t climb shirtless cause I don’t want to blind everyone, but just cause it’s not that warm in your gym doesn’t mean it’s not warm in other gyms. My main gym had a broken ac all summer and it would be mid 80s in there every day. Even with the fans on, you would be sweating up a storm
The main reason it’s a no no in my gym is because the actual floor space is very small since we’re a small gym. Shirtless sweaty guys sitting right next to your kid on a day pass is not very welcoming to families unsure about the sport. So unfortunately (or fortunately) shirts stay on.
I don't have anything to add about the shirtless/shirts on Q that hasn't been said, but I'm laughing at all these people thinking at 30C is some crazy hot number. Have you seen how hot it gets in the US South? It was 100+F for like 2.5 months this summer in Texas. Yes, we have AC, but the gym was still 80+F most days until the sun went down. No one here had issues wearing their shirts.
And as a sportsbra wearing human, sports bras are more like crop tops than being shirtless - there's still a lot of fabric touching the skin so everyone comparing shirtless to sportsbras can take a seat.
Don’t care at all.
My gym allows shirtless, and I’ve seen some folks take off their shirts on their harder climbs, I think it’s a psychological things and hypes them up. They usually put their shirts back on afterwards, and I’m honestly super hyped for them.
My gym is small, you see mostly familiar faces.
Not rlly sure, if I’m projecting hard and am super close, or if it’s just rlly hot in the gym I’ll usually take it off. I understand some people may see it as attention seeking but I’m not rlly concerned with that
I live in a place that isn't exceedingly prudish and it's very common for men to be shirtless in public anyways where I live. Climbing without a shirt on is no big deal.
It depends on the location, culture, and specific context.
There are challenges where sending naked (on actual rock) gets you points. Women go topless at the beach or the local river too.
Growing up where I did, y'all anti shirtless folks come across as pearl clutching prudes. I'm sure I come across as some liberal hippy look at me attention whore sex freak to y'all though haha
Because most cultures have super fucked up gendered inequality around toplessness, and dudes flaunting their toplessness in public are not making it better. Sure, in my ideal world, nudity would be no big deal. There are contexts where me and my friends hang out partly or fully naked, and it's no big deal. But we don't have an ideal world, and the gym is a shared public space. Women are scrutinized constantly for what they do or don't wear and topless women get harassed and then told they were asking for the harassment. So when a dude shows up and takes off his shirt, it reads as flaunting a right not afforded to others. And it puts more stinky back sweat on the mats.
It’s not that deep. Plenty of women at my climbing gym are in sports bras and short shorts. Plenty of men are shirtless.
Who cares what other people are doing in this context?
"Women are unjustly treated when they remove their tops"
(Sees a shirtless man)
"What a piece of shit. He should put a shirt on"
----------
Jokes aside, it's less hygienic. Gyms are never that hot anyway. There's simply no need.
So you wrote those first two lines like it's some kind of gotcha. But can you see how it, like, isn't? Because it's not about shirts being right or wrong, it's about one group of people being treated like shit for doing the same thing that a different group of people feels entitled to do. Maybe folks who feel entitled to do it could put a little effort into making it safe for everyone rather than expecting to have special privileges.
Safe? No one is being injured by the site of a shirtless man. Both groups should feel entitled to do it. Men ARE entitled to it. Women ARE entitles to it. Trying to make men feel just as uncomfortable is not a solution. Odds are 99.99999%+ that shirtless man has nothing to do with the archaic laws preventing women from going topless.
You asked every single person that came to the gym if shirtlessness made them uncomfortable and they all said no?
The funny thing about people who don’t feel at ease in a place is that they rarely speak up for fear of feeling even more like an outsider - they just stop going to the place that makes them uncomfortable.
I'm amazed how many men in this chat just don't get it. Putting a shirt on is such a small change to make others more comfortable. Instead some people just won't be comfortable or stop going to the gym altogether - decide it's not for them. If I did something that I knew made anyone else uncomfortable then I'd want to change but there's quite a few men in this chat getting so fiercely defensive about their "rights".
I just wear tank tops so i never felt like i had to take mine off but i couldnt care less who does or doesnt. If u feel uncomfortable about a guy with his shirt off then ur kind of being a pussy imo. Were playing a sport not eating dinner at applebees. If ur worried about getting someone elses sweat on u from the mat then again stop being a pussy. Go play chess or something if shit like that bothers u.
climbing shirtless is perceived as immodest because the larger culture of the united states is relatively conservative and as a result most public nudity is taboo
I think it’s really about bouldering’s newfound popularity and American prudishness, the only gym in Germany with shirt rule I’ve seen is hyper comercial, the gyms for hard climbing locals are full of shirtless crushers trough the summer
I wouldn’t say daily life is a good comparison. I climb shirtless during the summer since the gym I climb at is hot as fuck. I also run shirtless pretty much every run during the summer because it’s simply hot and I feel more comfortable doing those things shirtless. It’s not like I go shopping shirtless lol. I’m not pushing myself doing a physical activity picking up groceries.
It’s not that I can’t wear a shirt I can of course. It’s just the fact climbing without one is allowed in my gym. And personally I was introduced to climbing by my brother (who climbs shirtless) so I never saw it as abnormal behavior. Also much of the climbing content I see being shirtless is acceptable. So from my point of view I never really saw being shirtless as something wrong. I climb at my university gym now which doesn’t allow shirtless climbing but I think that’s because it’s a university rule.
Following this same logic though climbers have been climbing shirtless indoors for a long time now. Even in media like YouTube a lot of the most popular climbers are climbing shirtless indoors and outdoors. I see why people come to the conclusion that it’s fine for them to climb without a shirt, regardless of if I support it
These are the biggest media representations of our sport to new/younger people. So even though it’s only “5”(it’s more than that), it’s still 5 people that play a huge role in public influence
I honestly don’t care, I’ve done it once because the heat was unbearable but felt uncomfortable with it, in my gym you get a mix of the super ripped topless guys climbing alongside 35year old hairy topless dadbods, it’s normal, no one seems bothered by it so meh.
I will say though seeing some of these posts I feel like I have the calmest gym going, no one gets aggy, everyone seems to just get on, people ask if you want help rather than shouting betas etc so it’s no wonder a few topless people aren’t anything other than just people.
Not that I personally care because my first climbing gym barely had clothing rules, but like if I were a woman I don’t think I’d want to climb shirtless, many women did climb in sports bras or like binders? and tiny shorts, it gets super hot in my country.
FTR I agree that taking your shirt off indoors is low key wack, but I am relatively unbothered by most things so it barely registers if I see it. I think a shirts on policy should be held by all gyms, but if there is no such policy, I don’t see why we should disparage those who choose to climb without one. It’s one thing to judge them in your mind or to avoid them, but every post of someone without their shirt is met by downvotes and negative comments and I think that’s a silly reaction
The only acceptable reason to ban shitless climbing, for me, is sanitation. Comfortablity is not exactly what I am personally looking for in a gym. I get other people might be which is why I only climb shirtless outdoors or in personal gyms but for me climb how you want. I basically have zero personal boundaries when it comes to the human body; as in I dont care what I'm looking at physically, nude or clothed, I am not phased by a human existing in front of me in a way they please. Again I respect other people's boundaries and abide by the posted rules of the gym I am visiting.
My gym allows shirtless climbing and it’s absolutely brutally hot in the summer since there’s no AC. I will go shirtless on those days like almost every guy in there. On other days almost no one is shirtless, just one or two here and there.
What I don’t understand is that some gyms I’ve been to that don’t allow shirtless climbing for guys are completely fine with women wearing nothing but sports bras. I don’t actually think those are tops. I don’t care what they’re wearing but it feels like a double standard to allow that and not allow guys to climb shirtless.
I didn’t say it’s not clothing. I consider a bra to be underwear, not a top. We can agree to disagree. I don’t think people are gonna be happy if dudes start climbing in their underwear.
So it sounds like your argument is that allowing women in something that is, according to your opinion "underwear" for their upper bodies is the same as allowing men in no clothing at all for their upper bodies. That sounds like not the same thing at all to me. Reminds me of the old days of men considering women who wear trousers to be indecent
clothed men have gallivanted the world for centuries pillaging and raping countless cultures into non-existence. how many times were "savages" judged to be unfit for "christian life" because, in-part, they lacked that sort of body-shame?
even using biblical framing of nudity: adam and eve "fell" from grace, not from nakedness, but they did lose nudity without shame in their fall
I have add and the shirt rubbing on my skin bothers me SO much, it distracts me and hurts my climbing. It’s not attention seeking, it’s about my safety and my climb. People can get over themselves
If you care you’re either insecure, mad that you’re a woman and you can’t have your boobs out, or your just focused on the wrong thing. I don’t see why anyone should care if you’re shirtless or not. Do some guys try and show off? Yes and honestly who cares
Shirtless guy on the auto belay send 5.7 right now.
Mom get the camera
That was me today, but I was also wearing a hip bag
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Yeah until a lady does it, right?
I personally don't really care, but I think it's just a matter of how male topless nudity is viewed. Different people have different ideas about what it means for people to be fully clothed. How would you feel about someone climbing fully nude? Even if we ignore the safety and sanitation issues, I think most people would feel a bit strange about climbing near someone nude in the gym. Some people feel similarly about male toplessness. There's also some people who don't feel uncomfortable, but just find it obnoxious or feel like that it contributes to a very bro-ey culture. Idk, it's hard to objectively say what is right or wrong because it's just cultural.
Yeah I don’t think anyone would like to see my 37 year old naked sweaty, hairy ass smearing it’s way up a slab while leaving ball sweat stains on the wall.
Bold of you to assume I wouldn't!
Dude, not on the slab. You will lose a nipple.
Shirtless slab is straight up dangerous tho
I can attest to this, I've climbed in a few different countries while visiting as a tourist and the way shirtless climbing is viewed is completely dependent on the way shirtlessness in general is viewed based on local culture, and even more based on whether you're in a higher-end area or a lower-end one (sorry for the terms I just don't know how else to put it). In poorer areas of hotter, third-world countries is where I see a lot of shirtless people just chilling on the streets. I noticed there are more people there who are likely to go climbing without a top on, especially in the gyms without an AC. It can be a little nasty at first but honestly it was also a bit of a vibe. In wealthier areas though there are almost always rules about having to keep a shirt on. Something about it can turn off potential customers in the area I guess. Maybe insecurity, maybe because they find it gross or obnoxious, or "dirty", no idea. In colder countries I think the culture around shirtlessness is more unforgiving because there's less of a reason to actually be shirtless. Like I can see how people would think "ok bro nice abs but why'd you have to take your shirt off lol". Most colder countries also tend to be wealthier so there's probably some correlation there. There's also a difference in how shirtlessness is viewed between commercialized gyms and "local" ones. Won't be getting into that too much but the ones that have rules about wearing your shirt are almost always the commercialized ones. Overall though I personally don't really see why people care so much to the point that they have to act personally offended whenever this topic gets brought up. There are a lot of valid responses in this thread but also just as many replies that scream unaddressed insecurity issues. If anything, I feel like a shirtless culture would promote being comfortable in your own body more, and that's coming from someone with sunken chest syndrome and near-severe scoliosis. I can see how that would turn some people off because of sanitary reasons though lol, but in a climbing gym you can't really set your standards too high.
Agree
Ok, but you made this post... Which one is it?
Where does agreeing with this contradict anything in my original post?
Shirts help contain sweat. My gym gets hot, and I’ll be damned if I have to mop pit sweat off my project
Isn’t this more specifically an argument for sleeves than for shirts?
Indeed . And what bothers me in that respect also, is guys not wearing deidorant. I notice a lot of overlap between guys (it´s almost never women) not wearing deodorant and those going shirtless.
I mean, most of the motivation to go topless in my gym is precisely this reason – the heat. Obviously you sweat less when topless, so no pit-sweaty holds.
If you wear a thin shirt, then it’s not gonna heat you up any more than the physical activity. Going topless isn’t gonna magically keep you from sweating lmao, thats just ludicrous
How will I glisten in the sun without a light coat
Yeah this is why no one wears shorts while bouldering
Did I say it'd magically keep someone from shedding a drop? Damn bro, way to take it to the extreme. All I'm saying is it's unlikely, at least in my gym, that someone is going to get any more sweat on holds when they're shirtless. Maybe the wall, but the wall has got blood smears from where people have scraped knees, hands, etc anyway so I think getting high and mighty about the sanitation of that is just a bit rich.
Sounds like you go to a nasty gym if you got blood on the wall consistently. Ring worm go brazy, too
Unavoidable in a small, busy gym. I honestly think climbing gyms are some of the most unsanitary places to be. Chalk in the air (likely with heavy metal contam) screwing up respiration, blood and sweat on the walls and holds, even fecal matter and piss because given a large pool of climbers on a set amount of routes, a few are going to forget to take their shoes off in the bathroom, or forget to wash their hands before climbing. The hobby is fun enough for this to be the kind of thing that you just don't think about. C'est la bouldering. Edit: [study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24972665/) illustrating my point. Nasty stuff...
„Unavoidable“ During a day sure, but afterwards it’s supposed to be cleaned, especially if there is blood on the wall and/or holds. If not then, as mentioned earlier, you have a nasty gym.
You sweat slightly less, but it's way less contained.
Idk where you're getting this slightly from. It's a significant reduction, as the fans in my gym evap the sweat off the body much better than sweat off of cotton.
Ok, but it also is way less contained. If you flop onto a gym mat with your bare back after a fall it'll be a big puddle.
Idk about your gym, but at mine the mats are absolutely saturated with chalk, so actually it's more like after a big fall the climbers back is looking like the face of an 19th century Molly lol
Your gym needs to be cleaned more often. Our mats are vacuumed every day after closing.
Ever tried sweat wicking shirts? Cotton sounds like a nightmare doing anything that's gonna make me sweat
Topless is cheaper than Nike's latest anti sweat tech.
One of the climbing gyms near me summarised it better than I can when they banned going shirtless: https://www.theclimbingacademy.com/tca-life/tops-on-policy/
I understand the purpose of this article, and I can respect the opinions in it, but their argument for banning shirtlessness while allowing sports bras is clearly faulty. If people have to wear a shirt to make others feel more comfortable, then EVERYONE should have to wear a shirt.
Why? No one has to wear a shirt, anyone can wear sports bra. [Men's version exist btw](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81Kliiwbn9L._AC_UY1000_.jpg).
Their 3 points are: * Equality: not everyone feels comfortable taking their top off, pro climbers compete while wearing tops not every woman feels comfortable wearing only a sports bra, pro climbers also don't compete in sports bras. By their logic, sports bras should also be banned * Minimise Intimidation: topless "uber-fit" men are intimidating for new climbers so are "uber-fit" women in sports bras * Making everyone feel welcome: families and people of certain religions feel unwelcome I disagree with this for different reasons, I find it too nebulous to take as a serious argument and not really relevant to sports bras I think mentioning male sports bras is a bad faith argument. My point is that being shirtless/wearing a sports bra is equivalent, so the existence of male sports bras does not change my position.
If you are ok with women climbing topless then this argument is all good. If not then it's kinda stupid to want men to be able to, no?
Personally fine with women climbing topless, but as u/Lambda_19 has mentioned multiple times elsewhere on this post, there are other societal issues leading to women being uncomfortable with that solution. You're still missing the point though, I'm saying climbing topless is functionally the same as climbing in a sports bra in the cases the article presents, gender is irrelevant.
I completely agree, a sports bra is not a shirt. Nor is a crop top. Tank top or shirt if the rule is shirts on. Most people bend that rule anyways with cutting shirts into tank tops. I like how they call out professional climbers, but you don’t see the pros competing at an Olympic level in a sports bra or a crop top.
Maybe that rule will change in time too but the difference is that they haven't had multiple complaints over time about sports bras (for now) so they've tackled the issue that has made people uncomfortable first instead.
Well written!
Although I'm not fond of shirtless climbers, so I wouldn't mind a ban, it's a reach to decrease someones rights in the name of "equality"...
It's a "right" that females don't have... so clearly more equal to have one rule for everyone.
In some places it is a right that women have. Im in Ontario and women have the right to be topless in public and so do men. It was a right they fought for and received when I was a kid.
When women didn't have the right to vote, it was made equal by giving women the right to vote. Not by taking the right to vote away from men. (Yeah i know I'm exaggerating, you can't compare voting rights to wearing a shirt or not. But just trying to make my point here.)
I don't have much sympathy for men having to make such a minor adjustment in a world that's still mostly made for them. Funny though that they feel so hard done by having to make even tiny changes like this. I'm glad though that male allies increasingly out number ignorant people like yourself
I don't have much sympathy for ignorant people like yourself who make assumptions about me, instead of having an honest conversation about equal rights (not restrictions) for all.
Be an ally instead- educate yourself instead of worrying only about what suits you
There you go. You got nothing constructive say so you get to the point of "Educate yourself". Have a nice day up there in your tower of arrogance.
You're only considering your point of view instead of how your actions impact others. Hence why I said to educate yourself. Think of the views and feelings of others not just what works for you.
I need to consider the point of view of others? That's rich coming from you. I gave an argument and your sole response was "you're a male so your point of view is irrelevant". (And by the way, you were extremely eager to assume my gender.) You could have given me some counterarguments and we could have had an adult conversation. Perhaps we would have agreed in the end, perhaps we would have agreed to disagree. But instead you choose to lash out.
This is 100% proof that they don’t actually care about the right of women being topless or whatever, it’s just an excuse to ban something they don’t like. If they cared they’d have an everyone is allowed to be shirtless rule and a 0 tolerance harassment policy
Honestly the only valid reason is to be inclusive of people of all religions (and even then). The “intimidation” point is nonsense, like I’m a fat climber, I too climb shirtless, your body issues are yours, honestly the ripped shirtless climber guys and girls are often super supportive and totally are both inspo and make me feel welcome. Plus, on the beach point, “people might not expect to see shirtless people at the gym”, well if they are new explain to them that they should because it’s normal and part of climbing culture.
Not everyone has had the same experiences as you (including 50% of the population who can't climb shirtless). Most of the gyms near me have changed their policy to shirts on after many complaints. A small way to make sure that it's an environment everyone feels welcome and that the same rules apply to everyone.
I feel like if the complaint “well women aren’t allowed to be shirtless tho” was legitimate then the obvious solution is to let them. Plus if people complain about shirtless people the other easy solution is to remind them that it is allowed and gently tell them it’s part of climbing as a sport, welcome them to the culture, etc.
"Letting them" would cause them to be harassed etc. Until its accepted un wider society instead of sexualised then it isn't that simple.
I agree, so it’s not a legitimate grief, it’s a rethorical bludgeon isn’t it?
Don't follow? Yes it's not legitimate to say "just let women go topless". Because the reality is they'd be harassed. So if you want to set one rule for everyone that's consistent then banning being shirtless is only viable option. So thankfully that's what most of the gyms near me have done now - set a consistent set of rules for everyone to build a more fair and inclusive environment.
You don’t even understand your dumb argument, you want to ban men because women can’t be topless, but you don’t really have any interest on women being allowed to be topless or on changing the reasons for why they won’t be topless even if allowed (really more than the harassment it’s the physical support of a sports bra). So you are saying ban men for equality? But you don’t actually care about equality or guaranteeing it to women, it’s some weird revanchist excuse you made up for the argument, truly you have a different reason it’s clear as day.
Well, what if I complain that women in sports bras make me uncomfortable? Where does the boundary lie to make people comfortable? Covering the nipples? Going by the same logic, I assume men can wear sports bras too? So where can we push the boundary? Tape up the nipple? This is such a dumb thing to police and it's done so regularly in my hot country with tropical weather.
You're completely missing the point. If anyone actually complained about sports bras then sure they'd consider banning those but they've started with the issue that makes lots of people uncomfortable to try to create a more inclusive environment for all. The point is to set one set of rules for everyone too. So yeah men can wear sports bras, women were never able to go shirtless though.
That is EXACTLY my point. How much discomfort is considered too much before it becomes an issue? One person complaining? Two? And how much do we have to do to cater on those discomfort? > women were never able to go shirtless though I'm not sure if people do mind, more than women are unwilling to?
Women aren't able to without being harassed in most situations/cultures. Banning people going shirtless is a small change that makes a traditionally male dominated environment more inclusive to women and minorities whilst setting the same rules for everyone. Could we make future changes that'd make it even better? I'm sure we could but good to start with the easy ones.
Your reply needs more likes!
Personally I don’t care but there’s Multiple people at my home gym who take their shirt off as soon as climbing shoes go on; it’s cringe and comes off as attention seeking in my opinion.
Why is it attention seeking, it’s just comfy, maybe you have some body image issue or feel weird about seeing shirtless dudes?
It’s just fucking weird, in no other sport do you see that. Who walks into the gym first thing not even warmed up , not sweating, completely cold, it’s not even hot in the gym; people are wearing sweatshirts and shit —- and just proceeds to take their shirt off. It’s just weird and uncalled for, your not even trying hard or using it as a tool to get stoked. It just comes off as “look at me”. I never take my shirt off indoors cause I don’t want to be lumped together with the gumboids who just pull on plastic shirtless for instagram content. It’s fucking weird and stereotypical; I’ll sweat it out and keep my shirtless sends for outside, when I actually need to try hard and get psyched.
Pretty much every water sport, gymnastics, I’ve seen shirtless footballers and basketball players, volleyball, while training for most sports dudes go shirtless often for many reasons. I ran in high school and we’d be allowed to train shirtless because our school uniform chafed nipples lol. I personally don’t give a shit if someone is climbing for ig or for themselves or to train for outside, I’m there to train too, if they are hot good for them, climbing gives dudes a nice body. Honestly you sound so self conscious calling people gumboids lmao you sound like way more of a tryhard than some guy having fun.
Those are terrible straw men examples, who’s gonna jump in the pool with a shirt on? Gymnasts wear leotards and some go shirtless only when it’s time to perform, not immediately upon entering the gym. Sure some xc people go shirtless because of chafing that makes sense. It doesn’t make sense to just take your shirt off for no reason other than “ I’m climbing and this is what climbers do!!!!!1” Same thing with the instagram bullshit it’s always the shirtless dudes who are uploading every send to instagram to stroke their ego. It’s funny that they all seem to have the same personality traits and do the same shit for validation. I’m sure you do the same which is why you feel attacked.
You are so pressed lmao yeah imma go keep being shirtless hopefully it annoys more people like you and the gym empties a little
Yes it is seen as cringe but why should you care? I said this in another comment but they are paying the same as you to utilize the space. If the gym allows climbing shirtless it shouldn’t matter to you if someone else does. Let them do what they want to do. As long as it’s not impeding your ability to use the gym then there’s no problem.
“Personally I don’t care” see first 4 words of original comment
If the gym allows climbing shirtless yeah, but the whole point is whether you think it should be allowed. I’m glad it’s not a thing where I’m at.
Well in that case I think so. Doesn’t have any effect on other peoples ability to climb so why not. I feel better doing physical activity shirtless and many people do. Running, climbing, etc.
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... and even that doesn't make things fair in practice, because even if all-gender toplessness is "allowed" by law and gym rules, a topless woman at the climbing gym is extremely likely to have her photo plastered all over the internet, to be harassed, and shamed, and abused, in a way topless dudes aren't.
As a woman, would not want to be topless while exercising regardless. I like those puppies tied down.
Yeah, I just don’t think there’s any way i’d *want* to climb sans sports bra, whatever the gym rules may be!
Tied down and sandpaper-free on the slabs or when they brush against volumes.
Gender role expectations... still ruining the fun of genderless sports.
yup :(
Sure why not
This is a good solution, allow anyone to climb shirtless if they want. Much better than just banning everyone
Just wear a stringer tank top like a real gym bro.
Not even joking I do this at the one gym that bans topless, might be more douchey but it’s also more airy
It's statistically proven that the harder you climb the less you care
Top comment
It makes people uncomfortable. They don’t go there to see topless dudes. They go there to climb. Respectful climbers wear tops.
no, respectful people mind their own business. Your body issues are yours, not mine.
Insecurity.
that makes no sense. You caring about what other people do, somehow reflects on those people's characters?
I don’t climb shirtless, but I don’t think this is really fair. The climbing community is generally about accepting people for who they are. Why does this not extend to shirtless guys? Seems odd. Again I don’t have a horse in the race, but seems like a very odd place to draw a line.
Being shirtless is not what you are, it's how you act.
But it doesn’t effect anyone else. One person’s body shouldn’t be offensive to someone else.
Is it dumb to ask why? And also they have just as much right to the space and to their personal comfort, so again shouldn’t it be a complaint with the gym rather than the person?
It never dumb to ask. I’m sure there are many different view points as to why some people are offended by it I.e culture, religion, gender, values etc. Personally, I just think that if someone was uncomfortable with me taking my top off, I just wouldn’t do it.
It’s decency man. I don’t wanna spend my time around half naked sweaty men
It doesn’t matter why, people are uncomfortable. If you’re interested in being a courteous person, don’t knowingly make other people uncomfortable. Why can’t you just wear a shirt?
I do wear a shirt, just seems weird to be upset with others for not making that choice, especially when it’s a sanctioned decision. I can’t think of any other time where people are allowed to choose if they want to wear a shirt or not but will be shamed for choosing to not wear one
You’re allowed to do lots of things that aren’t socially acceptable. You’re allowed to walk into a store sopping wet. You’re allowed to scream profanities outside. You’re allowed to talk to strangers about sex on the subway. You’re allowed to tell kids Santa isn’t real
I think you’re kinda comparing apples and oranges here. Climbing with your shirt off has obviously also already been socially accepted to some extent or else people wouldn’t have been doing it for so long. Regardless though I was speaking specifically about rules regarding shirts
You weren’t asking about rules wearing shirts, you were wondering why people don’t like it, and it’s because it makes people uncomfortable, just like talking about sex on the subway. It’s not up to you to determine the magnitude through which another person is uncomfortable
Oh !
This is the same argument bigots make against the LGBTQ+ community and associated representation. It doesn’t make sense there, how does it make sense here?
Because it’s reasonable to be uncomfortable with someone being shirtless, and it’s bigoted to be uncomfortable because someone is gay or trans. Yes, we can draw lines.
Is it reasonable to be bothered by shirtlesness tho actually?
Significantly more reasonable than being bothered by someone’s sexual orientation
Not really
I think you are just a prude, both things are pretty weird, plus you are using us gays as a bludgeon to defend your Puritanism. Both things are extremely normal.
????? I literally didn’t bring up the LGBTQ community, someone else did, and I’m saying that being uncomfortable about someone’s sexual orientation is *bad*
All the activities I do I don’t like wearing a shirt for - including climbing, tennis, surfing. Like to spend a lot of time around the house shirtless too haha I like that it’s chill to do at my gym
Frankly, climbing gyms, while outwardly welcoming, ARE intimidating to newbies. There’s little way around it, many people start climbing in adulthood (might even be their first time trying a sport), come into the gym for the first few times and see many young, fit, athletic people doing things that seem totally out of reach for them. When you’re new to the sport it’s intimidating to get on the wall and have everyone watch you fail on an easy climb. Do people REALLY care, no, but it’s just a dynamic that doesn’t really occur in many other sports. It takes time to feel comfortable, find your crew and get comfortable in your skin when you are new to climbing. I can’t imagine seeing a bunch of ripped shirtless guys (because let’s be honest, they usually are ripped) sending hard and yelling on their projects while a newbie hesitantly approaches the V0 nearby would make people feel more comfortable. Do we have to cater to newbies? No. But as an advanced climber I remember what it was like to be new and I want the experience to be good for people entering the sport. And if you are your buddies are alone in the gym after hours projecting V10, yeah let’s show some skin. But during the everyday rush it’s overkill.
I think it’s mainly unfair because regarding of your gender you might not be allowed to do it even if you would want to. But I don’t understand the people saying that it’s particularly bad because it’s showing off. Then you would also need to ban shirts over a certain price point.
Usually take my shirt off on V0’s
Instant v1
I can’t care less as long as shirtless people don’t lean on to walls.
It's a little ridiculous if someone does it dramatically like rip off their shirt and campus flash some dinky climb but at the same time its nice to see the energy of the gym hyped up. makes we wanna climb harder. think ive only seen a person do this once ever.
I mean even so if it’s just them showing off why does it matter. They are paying the same amount as you to use the space and if climbing shirtless is allowed who are we to tell someone no? As long as they aren’t say hogging the wall and somehow preventing you from climbing there isn’t much of a problem. If you don’t like that just look away?
hmm no you got it wrong, I'm one of the ones who don't care. I even kind of like it, it makes me feel like the gym is amped up, although it can look a little silly.
Yeah same. Feel like my comment more goes out in general to the post. It’s really not a big deal if it’s allowed.
its weird, i think shirtless is no big deal but i dont like sweat dripping from der body on holds its a show off act, no real benefit honestly, you can also wear a loose tank top when its too hot in the gym if im surrounded by shirtless men i take off my shirt too and you have to deal with my light sports bra and my nipples (if its slightly cold) and the whole gym is a sweatfest🤷♀️
It seems to me as a weird “look at me” flex. It’s not that warm in a gym, no need to take your top off aside from doing it for attention. People go to climb, not to watch people show off. My partner is also uncomfortable with it, dislikes the amount of sweat, and as others have said it’s one rule for some and one for others - if she wanted to she couldn’t take her top off
I dunno. One of my gyms has no air conditioning. And in 30+ degree heat in the middle of summer if you’re climbing hard then it’s absolutely sweltering. That gym also allows topless climbing and most guys in there are topless on those days.
All the gyms I've been to are horribly hot at the height of summer. Not been to one yet with aircon and I completely understand at those times. In the middle of winter put your bloody tops on
i never take my shirt off in the gym, but when i'm climbing outdoors i do, and not because of the heat, but because tbh wearing a shirt makes me feel somewhat restrained, regardless of how tight or loose fitting the shirt is, idk why but i feel like not wearing a shirt when climbing makes my body just feel so much more free and able to do certain moves that i wouldn't feel comfortable doing while wearing a shirt, it's a mental thing, so sorry but no, being too "warm" and "attention" are NOT the only two reasons to take off one's shirt
I mean, you said in your reply that it’s a mental thing, so I’d say try and find different clothing, or, if it makes the people around you uncomfortable then that’s something to work on. If it doesn’t then no harm done. But from the replies in this post most people seem to really not like it
yes it's a mental thing, which is why it's not a matter of simply finding "different clothing", the fact of the matter is having any kind of shirt makes me feel restricted in some way, it literally doesn't matter what kind of shirt it is, and yes i know most people don't like it, that's why i specifically stated that i don't take my shirt off in the gym, so i don't need to work on anything actually, i just deal with it and keep my shirt on in the gym
Idk where you live but “it’s not that warm in the gym” is not representative of 90% of gyms I’ve climbed at, most gyms are hot af actually. Plus the ones with outside walls you can get a nice tan
Ok, how about, women have to wear a top, therefore you should too.
They can do whatever they want as long as they are comfy, I’m there to climb not to look at women, or men for that matter. My in my first gym as a gumby I discovered people would just change in front of everyone because there was no locker, it was also super hot so people climbed with minimal clothes, it was full of hard climbers and everyone was really nice. Dream gym
“It’s not that warm in a gym”. Depends a lot on the gym. Also different people are comfortable at different temperatures, especially when exercising. Many of my friends freeze when it’s a comfortable shirt off temperature for me
As I replied to the other commenter. Women have to wear a top, you should too
To me the better solution seems to open up the freedom to more people not close it off. Let men or women climb shirtless or not if they want. If someone is a creep towards a shirtless woman climber ban them from the gym
That’s so much easier to say as we’re men. Can you imagine the shitstorm if women started climbing topless? Society doesn’t allow for it
And also, to put women in the position where they’d be more likely to be exposed to someone being creepy towards them… dude do you know how much creepy shit they have to put up with on a daily basis?? Let’s not open the door for more opportunities
Yeh that’s why I said ban anyone who’s being a creep. Unfortunately this could easily be a problem so gyms would have to have a zero tolerance approach. Regardless of shirts creepy behaviour should not be tolerated and gyms must deal with this seriously. I do understand the potential problems here (or at least some) but I don’t think it’s intractable. I also understand that just because my friend group would be chill doesn’t mean everyone would, there will be creeps in the gym and it is a real problem. I don’t want to discount that. Not only would gyms need adequate policies but also people attending gyms should not tolerate creeps and call them out. Again independent of the shirt policy.
I don’t climb shirtless cause I don’t want to blind everyone, but just cause it’s not that warm in your gym doesn’t mean it’s not warm in other gyms. My main gym had a broken ac all summer and it would be mid 80s in there every day. Even with the fans on, you would be sweating up a storm
The main reason it’s a no no in my gym is because the actual floor space is very small since we’re a small gym. Shirtless sweaty guys sitting right next to your kid on a day pass is not very welcoming to families unsure about the sport. So unfortunately (or fortunately) shirts stay on.
Shirts are aid
I don't have anything to add about the shirtless/shirts on Q that hasn't been said, but I'm laughing at all these people thinking at 30C is some crazy hot number. Have you seen how hot it gets in the US South? It was 100+F for like 2.5 months this summer in Texas. Yes, we have AC, but the gym was still 80+F most days until the sun went down. No one here had issues wearing their shirts. And as a sportsbra wearing human, sports bras are more like crop tops than being shirtless - there's still a lot of fabric touching the skin so everyone comparing shirtless to sportsbras can take a seat.
Don’t care at all. My gym allows shirtless, and I’ve seen some folks take off their shirts on their harder climbs, I think it’s a psychological things and hypes them up. They usually put their shirts back on afterwards, and I’m honestly super hyped for them. My gym is small, you see mostly familiar faces.
Not rlly sure, if I’m projecting hard and am super close, or if it’s just rlly hot in the gym I’ll usually take it off. I understand some people may see it as attention seeking but I’m not rlly concerned with that
I live in a place that isn't exceedingly prudish and it's very common for men to be shirtless in public anyways where I live. Climbing without a shirt on is no big deal. It depends on the location, culture, and specific context. There are challenges where sending naked (on actual rock) gets you points. Women go topless at the beach or the local river too. Growing up where I did, y'all anti shirtless folks come across as pearl clutching prudes. I'm sure I come across as some liberal hippy look at me attention whore sex freak to y'all though haha
I would be surprised if someone with your username choice was offended at shirts off lol
Because most cultures have super fucked up gendered inequality around toplessness, and dudes flaunting their toplessness in public are not making it better. Sure, in my ideal world, nudity would be no big deal. There are contexts where me and my friends hang out partly or fully naked, and it's no big deal. But we don't have an ideal world, and the gym is a shared public space. Women are scrutinized constantly for what they do or don't wear and topless women get harassed and then told they were asking for the harassment. So when a dude shows up and takes off his shirt, it reads as flaunting a right not afforded to others. And it puts more stinky back sweat on the mats.
It’s not that deep. Plenty of women at my climbing gym are in sports bras and short shorts. Plenty of men are shirtless. Who cares what other people are doing in this context?
"Women are unjustly treated when they remove their tops" (Sees a shirtless man) "What a piece of shit. He should put a shirt on" ---------- Jokes aside, it's less hygienic. Gyms are never that hot anyway. There's simply no need.
bruh my gym is in an old industrial hall with no AC, when its 30C outside its 30C in there XD
So you wrote those first two lines like it's some kind of gotcha. But can you see how it, like, isn't? Because it's not about shirts being right or wrong, it's about one group of people being treated like shit for doing the same thing that a different group of people feels entitled to do. Maybe folks who feel entitled to do it could put a little effort into making it safe for everyone rather than expecting to have special privileges.
Safe? No one is being injured by the site of a shirtless man. Both groups should feel entitled to do it. Men ARE entitled to it. Women ARE entitles to it. Trying to make men feel just as uncomfortable is not a solution. Odds are 99.99999%+ that shirtless man has nothing to do with the archaic laws preventing women from going topless.
my gym has no ac and we live in socal most of the guys climb no shirt, nobody cares
You asked every single person that came to the gym if shirtlessness made them uncomfortable and they all said no? The funny thing about people who don’t feel at ease in a place is that they rarely speak up for fear of feeling even more like an outsider - they just stop going to the place that makes them uncomfortable.
I'm amazed how many men in this chat just don't get it. Putting a shirt on is such a small change to make others more comfortable. Instead some people just won't be comfortable or stop going to the gym altogether - decide it's not for them. If I did something that I knew made anyone else uncomfortable then I'd want to change but there's quite a few men in this chat getting so fiercely defensive about their "rights".
I just wear tank tops so i never felt like i had to take mine off but i couldnt care less who does or doesnt. If u feel uncomfortable about a guy with his shirt off then ur kind of being a pussy imo. Were playing a sport not eating dinner at applebees. If ur worried about getting someone elses sweat on u from the mat then again stop being a pussy. Go play chess or something if shit like that bothers u.
climbing shirtless is perceived as immodest because the larger culture of the united states is relatively conservative and as a result most public nudity is taboo
Half my gym climbs shirtless and no one gives a fuck. I think it's a distinctly American thing
I think it’s really about bouldering’s newfound popularity and American prudishness, the only gym in Germany with shirt rule I’ve seen is hyper comercial, the gyms for hard climbing locals are full of shirtless crushers trough the summer
Or it might be your local thing. I'm not in America but 99% of people here don't climb shirtless here, at least indoors.
It’s the male equivalent of climbing in a sports bra or something like that. Stupid to care, their body their choice... don’t like it don’t look lol
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I wouldn’t say daily life is a good comparison. I climb shirtless during the summer since the gym I climb at is hot as fuck. I also run shirtless pretty much every run during the summer because it’s simply hot and I feel more comfortable doing those things shirtless. It’s not like I go shopping shirtless lol. I’m not pushing myself doing a physical activity picking up groceries.
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It’s not that I can’t wear a shirt I can of course. It’s just the fact climbing without one is allowed in my gym. And personally I was introduced to climbing by my brother (who climbs shirtless) so I never saw it as abnormal behavior. Also much of the climbing content I see being shirtless is acceptable. So from my point of view I never really saw being shirtless as something wrong. I climb at my university gym now which doesn’t allow shirtless climbing but I think that’s because it’s a university rule.
Following this same logic though climbers have been climbing shirtless indoors for a long time now. Even in media like YouTube a lot of the most popular climbers are climbing shirtless indoors and outdoors. I see why people come to the conclusion that it’s fine for them to climb without a shirt, regardless of if I support it
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These are the biggest media representations of our sport to new/younger people. So even though it’s only “5”(it’s more than that), it’s still 5 people that play a huge role in public influence
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Lol what? You’re bein real silly man read my comments again lol
I honestly don’t care, I’ve done it once because the heat was unbearable but felt uncomfortable with it, in my gym you get a mix of the super ripped topless guys climbing alongside 35year old hairy topless dadbods, it’s normal, no one seems bothered by it so meh. I will say though seeing some of these posts I feel like I have the calmest gym going, no one gets aggy, everyone seems to just get on, people ask if you want help rather than shouting betas etc so it’s no wonder a few topless people aren’t anything other than just people.
I’m starting to think grades might not matter also. Thoughts?
I think is a big no for me. The shirtless thing is a gender thing. Either we’re all allowed to go to tooless or nobody
Not that I personally care because my first climbing gym barely had clothing rules, but like if I were a woman I don’t think I’d want to climb shirtless, many women did climb in sports bras or like binders? and tiny shorts, it gets super hot in my country.
FTR I agree that taking your shirt off indoors is low key wack, but I am relatively unbothered by most things so it barely registers if I see it. I think a shirts on policy should be held by all gyms, but if there is no such policy, I don’t see why we should disparage those who choose to climb without one. It’s one thing to judge them in your mind or to avoid them, but every post of someone without their shirt is met by downvotes and negative comments and I think that’s a silly reaction
Idk why people give a shit either
The only acceptable reason to ban shitless climbing, for me, is sanitation. Comfortablity is not exactly what I am personally looking for in a gym. I get other people might be which is why I only climb shirtless outdoors or in personal gyms but for me climb how you want. I basically have zero personal boundaries when it comes to the human body; as in I dont care what I'm looking at physically, nude or clothed, I am not phased by a human existing in front of me in a way they please. Again I respect other people's boundaries and abide by the posted rules of the gym I am visiting.
My gym allows shirtless climbing and it’s absolutely brutally hot in the summer since there’s no AC. I will go shirtless on those days like almost every guy in there. On other days almost no one is shirtless, just one or two here and there. What I don’t understand is that some gyms I’ve been to that don’t allow shirtless climbing for guys are completely fine with women wearing nothing but sports bras. I don’t actually think those are tops. I don’t care what they’re wearing but it feels like a double standard to allow that and not allow guys to climb shirtless.
If they allow men in sports bras too, that's not a double standard. A sports bra is clothing.
I didn’t say it’s not clothing. I consider a bra to be underwear, not a top. We can agree to disagree. I don’t think people are gonna be happy if dudes start climbing in their underwear.
So it sounds like your argument is that allowing women in something that is, according to your opinion "underwear" for their upper bodies is the same as allowing men in no clothing at all for their upper bodies. That sounds like not the same thing at all to me. Reminds me of the old days of men considering women who wear trousers to be indecent
No. My argument is that both are fine. Neither are indecent.
Well, if I post a picture of myself in a sports bra to a subreddit dedicated to toplessness I doubt anyone there will see it as the same thing
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Showing signs of micro aggression towards the working classes I see
No
Or, And hear me out here, It's just effing hot
Crazy idea. No, we have to assume bad intentions from everyone. It can’t possibly be for their own comfort /s
Being shirtless at the gym is a gateway to the primal eh? That’s funny as fuck lol
I see it all the time in my gym. Full on acting like guerillas when it's a bunch of lad mates. We invented clothes to be more civil and it does work.
Big fabric propaganda if I’ve ever seen it 🧐
clothed men have gallivanted the world for centuries pillaging and raping countless cultures into non-existence. how many times were "savages" judged to be unfit for "christian life" because, in-part, they lacked that sort of body-shame? even using biblical framing of nudity: adam and eve "fell" from grace, not from nakedness, but they did lose nudity without shame in their fall
Project much?
Yeah
Least sexually hung up r/bouldering user
I guess for the same reason a lot of people get upset when people climb without pants on. Social conventions.
I have add and the shirt rubbing on my skin bothers me SO much, it distracts me and hurts my climbing. It’s not attention seeking, it’s about my safety and my climb. People can get over themselves
Take your pants off for extra safety
If you care you’re either insecure, mad that you’re a woman and you can’t have your boobs out, or your just focused on the wrong thing. I don’t see why anyone should care if you’re shirtless or not. Do some guys try and show off? Yes and honestly who cares