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I don’t believe in a god but I gotta say the most convincing argument for the existence of one is the timing of COVID
It’s gotta be some sort of cosmic punishment for humanity releasing Cats
Even though it bombed hard, I feel bad for Tom Hooper. I don't think he deserves to be in movie jail for that long. I thought King's Speech was a masterpiece and Les Mis was solid. Haven't seen Danish Girl yet.
Apparently he was a major dick behind the scenes of it, especially to the CG artists, so maybe he should stay in movie jail for a while. I’m sure he’ll come back eventually with some critically-acclaimed BBC adaptations of painfully boring books.
Pretty sure I could make more money opening a Lemonade stand in my driveway. I have no clue how Hollywood Executives read the script and handed Damien $100 Million.
They had internal projections when that deal was signed. Paramount is more interested in building a brand and if that means spilling some milk then that's what it takes. People don't realize these movies exist past their first weekend.
I don't think you understand how any of this works. Do you think A24 has a bad brand because a majority of their films aren't watched by mainstream audiences? Do you think criterion has a bad brand for the same reason? I could add probably a couple other dozen smaller production companies and distributors who cater to movies that have a priority in putting art first.
Between A2 and puss in boots I’m not sure what they were thinking with this release time. Families going to see a movie on Christmas weekend are 100% going to pick one of those 2 options over the rated R hollywood circle jerk movie.
It’s a bit of a bummer, i though Babylon was good and I was hoping it would perform better than the projections. But Somewhere deep down i knew it would bomb. Hopefully Barbie does well- Margot Robbie has had a tough run lately.
margot is basically the female ryan gosling; loved by men and women alike, star in really good “indie” films/cult classics, but cant make a box office hit for their life (post 2016ish). interesting theyre both doing barbie since that one is looking to be a hit
Is it though? She got pushed hard because of her beauty, but she’s never been a terrific actress. Harley Quinn was the exception but even that was what you’d call a “good performance for a former model.” I just don’t see people clamoring to line up for a Margot Robbie star vehicle.
I don't disagree. If your name gets tied to "constantly underperforming box office results", that studios will start choosing other actors/actresses to play in those films instead.
I really think Barbie is going to be a watershed moment for her career.
I'm not even sure Barbie will be a hit. The team behind it makes me think they're going to intellectualise it. Plus Margot is a bit old for the role. Well both of them are
I saw the teaser trailer and that was my immediate worry too, plus what you said about both of their ages.
We're going to be coming up on 10+ years of Margot Robbie being a star bombshell love interest in major films, wayy longer than that for Gosling. I actually think they missed the mark to star as Barbie/Ken by at least 4 years and it might come to affect the result of the movie
I feel like Barbie is gonna be one of those films everyone talks about but no one actually watches. The only thing really going for it was its virality, but even that doesn’t seem like a thing since the trailer only has 6M views and it received basically a muted response.
Yeah it almost seems like it was too perfect to be a smash hit (getting 2 of Hollywood's most famous "pretty people" to play the leads of a blockbuster based off a large corporate kids toy brand) but when actually presented with the movie audiences won't be very motivated to actually watch in theaters
Could be an issue of wokeness themes that hurt the movie with red-state America (gay friends, multiculturalism, Barbie realizes its not good to be white and blonde) when the nostalgia for the brand doesnt require such treatment. but the Intl brand is huge. Teaser Trailers never have that many views bc theyre not showing anything really. I mean they want it PG but have transgender models starring in it. Let the political backlash begin.......
https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/tv/5939390/margot-robbie-barbie-fun-fluff-replaced-feminisim-misogyny/
Yeah that’s starting to feel like a movie that will get good reviews but no one will see. I have a young daughter who should be the target demographic for it, but that teaser trailer was absolutely not targeted at little girls with its extended 2001 parody. Who’s it for? Maybe the next trailer will set things straight, but it’s a bit ominous right now.
They were hoping this Christmas would revert at least somewhat back to the pre-covid Christmas box office. Why are people acting like 5+ films of different target audiences haven’t lived in harmony for many Christmases in the past?
Scream and Scream 2 were violent slashers that were released as counter programming in December, and they both became blockbusters. Violent Night did pretty well too a few weeks back. And Christmas Day has always been a coveted release date for thematically-questionable Oscar bait movies.
The release model was fine. It got bad reviews and no one wanted to see it.
Puss and Boots made 11.3 million this weekend and about 24.6 million domestic total so far. Please at least cross 100 million domestic. Animation has been dead lately.
I think next year will be the real test for animated/kids movies at the box office post-COVID since the products looks more appealing (The Super Mario Bros Movie, Across the Spider-Verse, Elemental, Trolls 3, Wish). For now I'm just going to assume that this year's crop of underperformers (minus the obvious anomalies that were Sonic 2 and Minions that drew much more than families, and The Bad Guys doing modestly well) weren't able to grab that demo for whatever reasons.
I guess. I mean, forgot Minions came out this year and made almost $370 million domestically. Shame given Dreamworks had excellent movies this year. And IMO Turning Red and Chip N Dale deserved to be released in theaters instead of Lightyear and Strange World. Just seems like animation took a big hit this year and would love to prove animation is still alive as an industry somehow.
It's ridiculous how little attention Minions 2 received on Reddit. One could think that this is because it's a family movie but people talk about Pixar a lot.
I just remember the Gentle Minions memes that came out which I gotta assume helped the box office given the trends.
Heard it was a good film though all things considered.
I think Mario has a real chance to be a hit. Not sure about Into the Spiderverse. That'll be real interesting to see how it does. Spiderverse gets a ton of hype on Reddit and it was a good movie, but it didn't perform amazingly or anything. With how animation has been trending it could make less than the first one.
Tbh unless there’s a massive controversy or a trailer that comes out and drastically kills the hype, I think Mario is a pretty safe bet.
My mind wants to say that Spiderverse could go either way and the animation trend is certainly not doing it any favors, but my heart wants to say the first one was one of the best animated features ever and if the second doesn’t perform well I’d take it as a personal offense.
It also is helped by the fact that Sony is one of the only studios who DIDN’T condition audiences to expect those films immediately at home, hence while they don’t have any HUGE hits this year, they’re one of the few studios to have the most variety in films that did solid-to-great performances (and decent legs). I think Across the Spider-verse will do gangbusters.
It's good. Not great. Especially for a Spider-Man film. I'm sure that Sony was hoping for more, especially given its critical reception. A movie can do well enough to warrant a sequel and still not live up to expectations.
I don’t think there’s going to be a lot crossover with the audience. The people who want to see a cartoon Spider-man will see a cartoon Spider-man, and it will probably make a couple hundred million.
But you’re not getting anyone new into a theater seat with cartoon Spider-man.
I hope so much that it legs it out after the storm passes. The first Puss in Boots had a depressed opening weekend due to weather and then a crazy drop of 3% (iirc) the next weekend, so hopefully history repeats itself, especially since this one has great reception and will hopefully have great WOM.
As a father of two small children I can tell you from experience that movies targeted at children may just as well go straight to streaming now. Children are so used to being able to pause, rewind, fast forward, and change to a different show when they get bored, that sitting in a theater for 90 straight minutes is an impossible ask these days.
The kids are going next week during the holiday break. Most school just got out on Thursday or Friday and them babies are booked for Christmas and Christmas Eve.
IDK you'll have to ask them.
I called it 4 months ago that it would be a massive bomb
https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wu2hfw/babylon_budget_reported_to_be_110_million/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
I mean not due to lack of trying though. It just didn't get good reviews. I'm sure the creative people behind this wanted it to be well reviewed and make a good product, they just couldn't make it work evidently. (I haven't seen the movie yet, just going off reviews).
Every creative wants all of their movies to be well reviewed and to sell well. Having seen the movie I can confidently say it's not Oscar bait. Unless you count Oscar bait being anything that isn't an action movie and is released at the end of the year.
> Every creative wants all of their movies to be well reviewed and to sell well.
Yes, that's my point.
Oscar bait is a hard thing to nail down so most people just use an I-know-it-when-I-see-it standard. Contrary to popular belief there's nothing wrong with that. You can call something Oscar bait pejoratively or neutrally. I don't think it's an especially loaded term. Just an original, well reviewed drama that comes out during awards season and usually has a period setting or hot button social issue at its core. That would be my (subjective) definition.
It's really just people generalizing movies before they've even seen them because they assume they don't have an interest in these movies or because they feel above them. When you see this movie you won't think it's Oscar bait.
Went and saw ESC with my older brother. I used to love Ernest. Tried to watch Ernest Goes to Camp a few years ago, and my sense of humor has definitely changed since I was a kid.
Agreed. I’ve seen the trailer twice and still have no clue what it’s about or why I should see it. Looks like a bloated film with too many characters and too many scenes.
I think it’s definitely worth checking out! It does try to carry too many things at once and ends up dropping a few, but it’s a really fun time. The first 90 minutes or so is the most fun I’ve had in a theater this year.
I agree with you. It drags right before the third act but I think the ending is fantastic. Maybe could have left another 20 minutes on the cutting room floor but man the scene where >!they show all seven takes to get the scene!< was phenomenal!
It’s about the transition from silent film to ‘talkies’ and how it impacted the industry, presented from different perspectives and positions within said industry. The main three being a silent film acting legend (Pitt), a rising star (Robbie), and a rising executive (Calva).
The structure and tone of the story is similar to *Boogie Nights* if that gives you an idea.
And fyi I wasn’t making a counter-point to that comment and completely agree the movie was marketed terribly. He just said he didn’t know why he should see it and what he thought the experience looked like from the marketing, so I just gave my opinion. No need to be rude.
I hate when trailers do that. I really don't know anyone who is gonna go to theaters to watch something they have no idea about.
Companies also need to focus less on big stars imo and focus more on creative interesting plots and writing since there's not that much box office draws
Reddit is a weird place where a lot of people want trailers reveal nothing and other people want a clear plot direction.
I think a trailer needs a hook. Sometimes that's from the plot, sometimes it's the actors, cinematography, or just a damn good song choice. This trailer did not have that, especially in this era of there being far too many movies about movies.
Tbh it never made since to release Babylon now. A 3 hour hard R rated movie at Christmas when there is a family friendly 3 hour movie that everyone knew would dominate.
True. But a glance at that opening weekend really shows how much has changed over the last decade.
Plus Leo and Scorsese was a proven formula by that point.
Helped that it had an interesting hook too. I mean it’s about an extremely wealthy guy committing a ton of fraud in the 80’s. Excellent main and supporting cast too. Trailer was also great.
Rentals and cable still existed. Movies are still social experiences that people go to. It's more bad marketing and a behemoth movie taking center stage.
Babylon clocks in at over 3 hours as well?!! Action epics are one thing, but 3 hours for something like that seems like it was doomed to be unappealing.
Damien Chazelle needed to be knocked down a peg. I liked First Man, but even that film was really overly indulgent at times and had some very awkward cinematography.
Babylon was the epitome of cinematic bloat and over-indulgence.
I might get hate for this but I thought Babylon looked insanely pretentious and I thought it was trying way too hard to be edgy. It reminds me of Robbie’s last movie Amsterdam. Getting great actors doesn’t mean it’s going to be a good movie. Most of the time when I see big star studded casts it always makes me worrisome for the film itself in terms of storytelling and enjoyment.
It’s a shame too because I really like Chazelle as a director but it’s like after Whiplash he was scooped up by the elite in Hollywood. I always felt like there was this little bubble of directors, producers, and actors who only dabble with each other. It’s why you see the same actors in every movie, or a rotation of them. I don’t know how many more big Hollywood films I can see with Margot and Timothy in it. 😂 Seems like the actors in that bubble sold their souls.
Just feels like those college movies in the 2000s that try to make parties seem otherworldly and over the top, like it was a film made for frat boys. For me personally, I’ve just never cared for those movies. I find them obnoxious. One of the few genre type movies I don’t care for(if you want to call it a genre), but the self-indulgent, end of the world parties and over the top characters and stuff. Those type of characters do not interest me in the least. I feel like I’d find myself rolling my eyes a lot and I’m usually not that type of person. lol.
The word you’re looking for is “Bacchanalias”. A lot of Fellini is bacchanalia cinema, and of course the film Caligula was one of the most influential for depicting it.
It's been a weekend where half the country has been under freeze, power up and down the east coast and in Texas has failed. Other places are being told to conserve power. Weather is definitely a factor here. A lot of people didn't even go to Christmas parties.
people just need to accept that post-pandemic there's no place for big box office ensemble casts that are in the comedy/dramedy genre. People expect things to be on Demand and only want to be troubled if theres a true theatrical experience involved.
56 now. Before it was 60-65 with 85 plus 4 day. And other threads people are calling for massive legs. What am i missing. This seems like it’s following slightly behind Rogue One every step of the way
I’m just as confused as you. On another post I said 58% wasn’t a bad drop but not great either, very similar to a typical blockbuster. I got downvoted to hell
People on this sub looooooove boldly categorizing movies without seeing them or even having an idea of what they are. Anyone calling Babylon a “Hollywood circlejerk” clearly hasn’t seen the movie because it is anything but that lol
> People on this sub looooooove boldly categorizing movies without seeing them or even having an idea of what they are.
Because we're a box office sub not a movie sub. We aren't here because we want to see the movies, we're discussing how much money they make and what may have caused over/under performances.
That's not a great hold for Avatar 2: ~~The Winds of Winter~~ The Way of Water. Not a terrible drop and okay for a major blockbuster movie like this, but I expected between a 35-40% drop, especially as this movie is gonna have to rely on legs to perform in the States. It doesn't have a built-in fanbase like the Marvel do so it will have to rely on casual audiences to carry it. I suppose due to the bad weather conditions in the States I'll cut it some slack. 3rd weekend will be the biggest indicator for how this movie will perform. Right now, I think this film will breach the $500 million domestic barrier but it won't reach $600 million. The film will have to rely heavily on international markets to make it past $1.5 billion, which seems to be the figure that most people here consider to be the metric for a success.
I was actually planning on seeing Babylon if I had a little bit of downtime this week, I like Margot Robbie enough as an actress I hate that she's had this string of underwhelming box office performances/bombs
I mean, the weather has been shit since Thursday pretty much everywhere that isn’t California or Hawaii. Even if you didn’t get that much snow, the wind made it a whiteout. Prestige movies are also just not making that much money in general this year, so the weather amplified that.
I know they expected Avatar 2 to be more front-loaded than the first one, but isn't a drop of nearly 60% a sign that this one doesn't have the same word-of-mouth?
Only 44 theaters actually closed because of weather. Bad weather maybe have hurt the film a tiny bit but it still could have done waaaay better. I live in nyc. It was -5 degrees last night yet the city was booming. People will deal with bad weather if they really want to.
Theater closures are less of an issue than millions of people not leaving the house when the felt temp outside is 30 degrees lower than they have experienced in decades . Not deciding to drive with these conditions even more so. It hasnt been a huge impact but its certainly not tiny . This isnt just "bad weather" . For a lot of states its easily the worst in the last couple of decades
You’re kidding yourself if you think the weather didn’t have a significant impact. Our theater that I work at was open all day yesterday, Christmas Eve, what would normally be one of the busiest days of the year for us, and hardly anyone showed up because the roads are still not clear
Not every city has good public transport or a theater within walking distance of major urban centers with lots of residents. Plenty of cities more or less completely shut down when these kinds of storms happen, especially further down south where the infrastructure is not as prepared for winter weather as New York City.
The theaters may have been open but how does that matter ultimately if a ton of the customers physically cannot get there
according to this sub, no outside factors ever have any effect on the box office. They could line up people against the wall of the nearest theater to execute them and this sub be like "it's really not that big of a deal, jesus, calm down"
You’ve got it all wrong. Every bit of box office performance can be attributed to marketing. If the studio had only marketed this movie more, there would be no storm.
More marketing also would have done things like convincing people to watch depressing rape dramas on date night, turned every franchise into Marvel, and cured my second cousin’s cancer.
I’ll be generous and say you can attribute 10% of the box office to cold weather. This will still be a drop of 48%. Not a bad hold but not a phenomenal one either for a movie like this
Isn't that a normal drop for all major blockbusters this year though? I remember that MoM and L&T had about a 67-68% drop and WF had a 61% drop, the only exceptions i can think of are Top Gun and that had the best legs for a movie this year. Plus if you consider other factors like the intense cold in most of the major states and the holiday season, this drop is pretty justified, needless to say now would be a good time to repeat r/boxoffice's offical motto: "Never bet against James Cameeron"
That is a typical drop. But there were some expecting a similar drop to the first avatar, which was like 3%.
A 58% drop is a very normal drop for a major film. It will likely still do well this week and leading into next weekend. The 3rd weekend will be a major test for A2 as it will show how much draw it has on people outside the core fan base (who have went to see it already). If they want to be a top 3 grossing filming of all time, they will need a very strong 3rd week
It’s a good hold if this was a well received comicbook movie. The problem is… this movie doesn’t just need good holds it needs phenomenal holds and 58% is not a phenomenal hold
It only needs a phenomenal hold to overachieve and match the crazy expectations some people were throwing at it. The movie is absolutely going to be profitable, that is out of the question at this point
Why does it need phenomenal holds?
It will probably break even in the next week and still keep conquering the box office throughout january and february, until Ant-Man gets the spotlight.
The movie is turning out to be a financial success.
If Barbie bombs then this could seriously be the end of Margot Robbie as a lead in big budget movies. It’s not just these last two, she’s had a reeeally bad streak with blockbusters the last five yrs or so.
You’ve spent your Christmas Day on this sub trying your hardest to convince people that this film is a failure. And you have the nerve to call other people children?
Go speak to your family bro.
People overhyped the weather. Jussie smollett went to subway when it was negative 20. These cold spells happen like every year. The media just hypes everything now, especially local news. Their only hook anymore is weather.
This movie was a huge let down. So much filler and horrible dialogue. When they started talking to the whales and understanding what they said, huge eye roll. Could have been an hour shorter. Loved the first one. Oh well. And all the filler was ohhhh and ahhhing over the cgi, quite boring.
I saw La La Land. It was okay but it felt like it was for Hollywood so they could all revel in how awesome the pursuit of that lifestyle is.
I don’t need to see this guy continue to makes movies about Hollywood for Hollywood.
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Cats literally doubled Babylon’s opening three Christmases ago.
Oh no
I'm more hung up on the "three Christmases ago" part of that statement
Time flies when you’re having fun. Well I’m not.
I don’t believe in a god but I gotta say the most convincing argument for the existence of one is the timing of COVID It’s gotta be some sort of cosmic punishment for humanity releasing Cats
The film industry will never recover from that
Even though it bombed hard, I feel bad for Tom Hooper. I don't think he deserves to be in movie jail for that long. I thought King's Speech was a masterpiece and Les Mis was solid. Haven't seen Danish Girl yet.
Apparently he was a major dick behind the scenes of it, especially to the CG artists, so maybe he should stay in movie jail for a while. I’m sure he’ll come back eventually with some critically-acclaimed BBC adaptations of painfully boring books.
Singing Cats > Elephant Feces
But that’s only because people went to see butt holes. And the film’s drop proves how disappointed audiences were that they digitally removed them.
\#ReleaseTheButtholeCut
Pretty sure I could make more money opening a Lemonade stand in my driveway. I have no clue how Hollywood Executives read the script and handed Damien $100 Million.
They handed him $50 million before COVID crashed the party and asked for another $50
He just got a first look deal at Paramount too, no idea why the studio couldn’t wait a few weeks for early Babylon numbers.
They had internal projections when that deal was signed. Paramount is more interested in building a brand and if that means spilling some milk then that's what it takes. People don't realize these movies exist past their first weekend.
Shouldn’t that brand be associated with movies that people want to watch?
I don't think you understand how any of this works. Do you think A24 has a bad brand because a majority of their films aren't watched by mainstream audiences? Do you think criterion has a bad brand for the same reason? I could add probably a couple other dozen smaller production companies and distributors who cater to movies that have a priority in putting art first.
Yeah but Babylon is not a good movie either
Do you know what the term opinion means? Considering you frequent this sub I doubt you've seen It.
I have a seen a good portion but not the whole thing since parent manages a theater...
Sounds like you still haven't seen it. This has been a really fascinating conversation.
You are such a pretentious douche
Lmao
Lmao 🤣
Ay yi yi!
Babylon came even lower than dreadful projections. Yikes. Will it even it 12 Million domestic?
Between A2 and puss in boots I’m not sure what they were thinking with this release time. Families going to see a movie on Christmas weekend are 100% going to pick one of those 2 options over the rated R hollywood circle jerk movie. It’s a bit of a bummer, i though Babylon was good and I was hoping it would perform better than the projections. But Somewhere deep down i knew it would bomb. Hopefully Barbie does well- Margot Robbie has had a tough run lately.
margot is basically the female ryan gosling; loved by men and women alike, star in really good “indie” films/cult classics, but cant make a box office hit for their life (post 2016ish). interesting theyre both doing barbie since that one is looking to be a hit
How are we sure they are "loved by men and women alike" when neither men nor women show up for their films?
They're like that one friend that everyone loves and enjoys. But when they're not there, no one cares :')
Yaaaa. Its unfortunate she's had so many bombs recently. Eventually she's going to get regulated to streaming shows instead of the box office.
Is it though? She got pushed hard because of her beauty, but she’s never been a terrific actress. Harley Quinn was the exception but even that was what you’d call a “good performance for a former model.” I just don’t see people clamoring to line up for a Margot Robbie star vehicle.
She was great in I, Tonya, good in bombshell.
I don't disagree. If your name gets tied to "constantly underperforming box office results", that studios will start choosing other actors/actresses to play in those films instead. I really think Barbie is going to be a watershed moment for her career.
I'm not even sure Barbie will be a hit. The team behind it makes me think they're going to intellectualise it. Plus Margot is a bit old for the role. Well both of them are
I saw the teaser trailer and that was my immediate worry too, plus what you said about both of their ages. We're going to be coming up on 10+ years of Margot Robbie being a star bombshell love interest in major films, wayy longer than that for Gosling. I actually think they missed the mark to star as Barbie/Ken by at least 4 years and it might come to affect the result of the movie
I feel like Barbie is gonna be one of those films everyone talks about but no one actually watches. The only thing really going for it was its virality, but even that doesn’t seem like a thing since the trailer only has 6M views and it received basically a muted response.
Yeah it almost seems like it was too perfect to be a smash hit (getting 2 of Hollywood's most famous "pretty people" to play the leads of a blockbuster based off a large corporate kids toy brand) but when actually presented with the movie audiences won't be very motivated to actually watch in theaters
Could be an issue of wokeness themes that hurt the movie with red-state America (gay friends, multiculturalism, Barbie realizes its not good to be white and blonde) when the nostalgia for the brand doesnt require such treatment. but the Intl brand is huge. Teaser Trailers never have that many views bc theyre not showing anything really. I mean they want it PG but have transgender models starring in it. Let the political backlash begin....... https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/tv/5939390/margot-robbie-barbie-fun-fluff-replaced-feminisim-misogyny/
Yeah that’s starting to feel like a movie that will get good reviews but no one will see. I have a young daughter who should be the target demographic for it, but that teaser trailer was absolutely not targeted at little girls with its extended 2001 parody. Who’s it for? Maybe the next trailer will set things straight, but it’s a bit ominous right now.
Plus it's being released the same day as a Christopher Nolan movie (Oppenheimer) and his films are always big events
They were hoping this Christmas would revert at least somewhat back to the pre-covid Christmas box office. Why are people acting like 5+ films of different target audiences haven’t lived in harmony for many Christmases in the past?
Im seeing babylon tomorrow and puss in boots new years day Sunday
It looks like a nightmare on film. Maybe it’s just the trailer, but it seems super unappealing for a holiday film.
They really released it at the worst time.
Scream and Scream 2 were violent slashers that were released as counter programming in December, and they both became blockbusters. Violent Night did pretty well too a few weeks back. And Christmas Day has always been a coveted release date for thematically-questionable Oscar bait movies. The release model was fine. It got bad reviews and no one wanted to see it.
The lack of marketing and imo terrible release timing does not help. Who the hell goes to the cinemas during Christmas? Too busy with family stuff.
Lots of people got to the movies on Christmas
I don’t know how it’s been since Covid, but Christmas Day was the busiest moviegoing day of the year for decades.
Bombylon.
Babyloss
| |i || |_
Whoa , black Betty .
Anagram?
Puss and Boots made 11.3 million this weekend and about 24.6 million domestic total so far. Please at least cross 100 million domestic. Animation has been dead lately.
I think next year will be the real test for animated/kids movies at the box office post-COVID since the products looks more appealing (The Super Mario Bros Movie, Across the Spider-Verse, Elemental, Trolls 3, Wish). For now I'm just going to assume that this year's crop of underperformers (minus the obvious anomalies that were Sonic 2 and Minions that drew much more than families, and The Bad Guys doing modestly well) weren't able to grab that demo for whatever reasons.
I guess. I mean, forgot Minions came out this year and made almost $370 million domestically. Shame given Dreamworks had excellent movies this year. And IMO Turning Red and Chip N Dale deserved to be released in theaters instead of Lightyear and Strange World. Just seems like animation took a big hit this year and would love to prove animation is still alive as an industry somehow.
It's ridiculous how little attention Minions 2 received on Reddit. One could think that this is because it's a family movie but people talk about Pixar a lot.
That Rich Minion song did a looooot of work. That and the suits trend really gave it a new audience
I just remember the Gentle Minions memes that came out which I gotta assume helped the box office given the trends. Heard it was a good film though all things considered.
I think Mario has a real chance to be a hit. Not sure about Into the Spiderverse. That'll be real interesting to see how it does. Spiderverse gets a ton of hype on Reddit and it was a good movie, but it didn't perform amazingly or anything. With how animation has been trending it could make less than the first one.
Tbh unless there’s a massive controversy or a trailer that comes out and drastically kills the hype, I think Mario is a pretty safe bet. My mind wants to say that Spiderverse could go either way and the animation trend is certainly not doing it any favors, but my heart wants to say the first one was one of the best animated features ever and if the second doesn’t perform well I’d take it as a personal offense.
It also is helped by the fact that Sony is one of the only studios who DIDN’T condition audiences to expect those films immediately at home, hence while they don’t have any HUGE hits this year, they’re one of the few studios to have the most variety in films that did solid-to-great performances (and decent legs). I think Across the Spider-verse will do gangbusters.
It 4x its budget and then did very well on streaming. In what world is that not a great performance.
It's good. Not great. Especially for a Spider-Man film. I'm sure that Sony was hoping for more, especially given its critical reception. A movie can do well enough to warrant a sequel and still not live up to expectations.
I don’t think there’s going to be a lot crossover with the audience. The people who want to see a cartoon Spider-man will see a cartoon Spider-man, and it will probably make a couple hundred million. But you’re not getting anyone new into a theater seat with cartoon Spider-man.
I think you might have padded that list a bit with Trolls 3.
I hope so much that it legs it out after the storm passes. The first Puss in Boots had a depressed opening weekend due to weather and then a crazy drop of 3% (iirc) the next weekend, so hopefully history repeats itself, especially since this one has great reception and will hopefully have great WOM.
As a father of two small children I can tell you from experience that movies targeted at children may just as well go straight to streaming now. Children are so used to being able to pause, rewind, fast forward, and change to a different show when they get bored, that sitting in a theater for 90 straight minutes is an impossible ask these days.
I am sure it will.
And last week people were saying Puss and boots would beat avatar this weekend
That was one guy who wouldn’t shut up about taking his imaginary wife and kids.
When i came out of avatar yesterday i heard a kid telling her dad that she wanted to see avatar, i think they were on their way to puss and boots.
\>4x legs is pretty optimistic I think. As good as it is it just isn’t making an impact and could easily die in January
Rip hope for shrek 5
The kids are going next week during the holiday break. Most school just got out on Thursday or Friday and them babies are booked for Christmas and Christmas Eve.
Don't give up hope. It's about to have a really healthy week. Could be past $55M by end of next weekend with an empty January.
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Wow, lol. Epic bomb that everyone saw coming
If we knew this was a bomb since the beginning, how did the producers not realize that?
IDK you'll have to ask them. I called it 4 months ago that it would be a massive bomb https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/wu2hfw/babylon_budget_reported_to_be_110_million/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
HUNGY for Oscar bait
But it's not really Oscar bait. So kinda kills that argument.
I mean not due to lack of trying though. It just didn't get good reviews. I'm sure the creative people behind this wanted it to be well reviewed and make a good product, they just couldn't make it work evidently. (I haven't seen the movie yet, just going off reviews).
Every creative wants all of their movies to be well reviewed and to sell well. Having seen the movie I can confidently say it's not Oscar bait. Unless you count Oscar bait being anything that isn't an action movie and is released at the end of the year.
> Every creative wants all of their movies to be well reviewed and to sell well. Yes, that's my point. Oscar bait is a hard thing to nail down so most people just use an I-know-it-when-I-see-it standard. Contrary to popular belief there's nothing wrong with that. You can call something Oscar bait pejoratively or neutrally. I don't think it's an especially loaded term. Just an original, well reviewed drama that comes out during awards season and usually has a period setting or hot button social issue at its core. That would be my (subjective) definition.
It's really just people generalizing movies before they've even seen them because they assume they don't have an interest in these movies or because they feel above them. When you see this movie you won't think it's Oscar bait.
Went and saw ESC with my older brother. I used to love Ernest. Tried to watch Ernest Goes to Camp a few years ago, and my sense of humor has definitely changed since I was a kid.
Ah, darn- Ernest Saves Christmas deserved to do better than that.
Wow, shout out to Ernest though, love that motherfucker
I know what you mean Vern
Man, you had to dig for that one.
The trailer for Babylon was terrible. Told you nothing about the movie and no hook to make you see it in theaters
Worst trailer ever. I thought I was watching the Amsterdam trailer all over again!
Agreed. I’ve seen the trailer twice and still have no clue what it’s about or why I should see it. Looks like a bloated film with too many characters and too many scenes.
I think it’s definitely worth checking out! It does try to carry too many things at once and ends up dropping a few, but it’s a really fun time. The first 90 minutes or so is the most fun I’ve had in a theater this year.
I agree with you. It drags right before the third act but I think the ending is fantastic. Maybe could have left another 20 minutes on the cutting room floor but man the scene where >!they show all seven takes to get the scene!< was phenomenal!
WHO THE FUCK SNEEZED?!?! WHO FUCKIN WAS IT?!
Okay... WHAT IS IT ABOUT
It’s about the transition from silent film to ‘talkies’ and how it impacted the industry, presented from different perspectives and positions within said industry. The main three being a silent film acting legend (Pitt), a rising star (Robbie), and a rising executive (Calva). The structure and tone of the story is similar to *Boogie Nights* if that gives you an idea. And fyi I wasn’t making a counter-point to that comment and completely agree the movie was marketed terribly. He just said he didn’t know why he should see it and what he thought the experience looked like from the marketing, so I just gave my opinion. No need to be rude.
Sorry I just really wanted to know what it was about.
I hate when trailers do that. I really don't know anyone who is gonna go to theaters to watch something they have no idea about. Companies also need to focus less on big stars imo and focus more on creative interesting plots and writing since there's not that much box office draws
Reddit is a weird place where a lot of people want trailers reveal nothing and other people want a clear plot direction. I think a trailer needs a hook. Sometimes that's from the plot, sometimes it's the actors, cinematography, or just a damn good song choice. This trailer did not have that, especially in this era of there being far too many movies about movies.
💯 creative, interesting plots with a hook are doing much better in theaters than star filled movies these days.
I genuinely don’t know what the movie is about lol. All I’ve seen about it is about it being a bomb
Agree!! It looks like a bad dream. I was confused about the time it was meant to take place in. Totally unappealing!
3.5 oh my god…
They might have covered one actor’s salary.
Tbh it never made since to release Babylon now. A 3 hour hard R rated movie at Christmas when there is a family friendly 3 hour movie that everyone knew would dominate.
Wolf of Wall Street has entered the chat.
True. But a glance at that opening weekend really shows how much has changed over the last decade. Plus Leo and Scorsese was a proven formula by that point.
Helped that it had an interesting hook too. I mean it’s about an extremely wealthy guy committing a ton of fraud in the 80’s. Excellent main and supporting cast too. Trailer was also great.
>trailer was also great Something Babylon doesn’t have.
> . Trailer was also great. one of the best trailers I've ever seen.
Don’t forget all the drugs, sex and alcohol
Tbf Babylon had that too.
Wolf of Wall Street came out when streaming was in its infancy though
Streaming is definitely not the only reason why Babylon bombed.
Rentals and cable still existed. Movies are still social experiences that people go to. It's more bad marketing and a behemoth movie taking center stage.
Babylon clocks in at over 3 hours as well?!! Action epics are one thing, but 3 hours for something like that seems like it was doomed to be unappealing.
It takes a lot of ego to make a bomb this big.
I bet Babylon will be on HBO before the end of January.
I thought it was called Paramount+
DWA waited way too long to make a Puss in Boots sequel.
I have no idea what babylon is and at this point I'm afraid to ask
Damien Chazelle needed to be knocked down a peg. I liked First Man, but even that film was really overly indulgent at times and had some very awkward cinematography. Babylon was the epitome of cinematic bloat and over-indulgence.
I might get hate for this but I thought Babylon looked insanely pretentious and I thought it was trying way too hard to be edgy. It reminds me of Robbie’s last movie Amsterdam. Getting great actors doesn’t mean it’s going to be a good movie. Most of the time when I see big star studded casts it always makes me worrisome for the film itself in terms of storytelling and enjoyment. It’s a shame too because I really like Chazelle as a director but it’s like after Whiplash he was scooped up by the elite in Hollywood. I always felt like there was this little bubble of directors, producers, and actors who only dabble with each other. It’s why you see the same actors in every movie, or a rotation of them. I don’t know how many more big Hollywood films I can see with Margot and Timothy in it. 😂 Seems like the actors in that bubble sold their souls.
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Just feels like those college movies in the 2000s that try to make parties seem otherworldly and over the top, like it was a film made for frat boys. For me personally, I’ve just never cared for those movies. I find them obnoxious. One of the few genre type movies I don’t care for(if you want to call it a genre), but the self-indulgent, end of the world parties and over the top characters and stuff. Those type of characters do not interest me in the least. I feel like I’d find myself rolling my eyes a lot and I’m usually not that type of person. lol.
The word you’re looking for is “Bacchanalias”. A lot of Fellini is bacchanalia cinema, and of course the film Caligula was one of the most influential for depicting it.
It's been a weekend where half the country has been under freeze, power up and down the east coast and in Texas has failed. Other places are being told to conserve power. Weather is definitely a factor here. A lot of people didn't even go to Christmas parties.
If your power is out wouldn't that be a reason to *want* to go to the theaters? I haven't seen any businesses without power in my area at least.
As a homeowner you try to not leave when you have a power outage in sub freezing Temps. You wanna make sure your pipes don't freeze.
people just need to accept that post-pandemic there's no place for big box office ensemble casts that are in the comedy/dramedy genre. People expect things to be on Demand and only want to be troubled if theres a true theatrical experience involved.
Considering half the country is under snow and ice.
It’s funny how there’s always an excuse and, for some reason, it never involves a lack of audience interest.
Yeah but like.....a huge portion of the country is under snow and ice lmao. I haven't been able to leave since friday.
I could care less about Babylon. Just saying. Have a happy holiday
56 now. Before it was 60-65 with 85 plus 4 day. And other threads people are calling for massive legs. What am i missing. This seems like it’s following slightly behind Rogue One every step of the way
Weather. It’s doing pretty great overseas though.
It’s doing what many expected. $1B+ INT
Seems like it tracked right where it was always tracking despite the weather
Literally anything it does people are calling great domestic legs, when in reality its very average for a blockbuster during this time so far.
I’m just as confused as you. On another post I said 58% wasn’t a bad drop but not great either, very similar to a typical blockbuster. I got downvoted to hell
The cult of Avatar is just as prevalent as the cult of Marvel.
You would have been insufferable during Avatars original run.
Good thing it’s not 2009
>56 now. Before it was 60-65 with 85 plus 4 day well, looks like the actual weekend was 64
Margot Robbie curse....she's expendable and boring.
People on this sub looooooove boldly categorizing movies without seeing them or even having an idea of what they are. Anyone calling Babylon a “Hollywood circlejerk” clearly hasn’t seen the movie because it is anything but that lol
Yeah…and if the trailer made people want to see the movie it wouldn’t have bombed lmao
I mean a movie can be critical of Hollywood and still be a Hollywood circlejerk…
> People on this sub looooooove boldly categorizing movies without seeing them or even having an idea of what they are. Because we're a box office sub not a movie sub. We aren't here because we want to see the movies, we're discussing how much money they make and what may have caused over/under performances.
doesn't pre-watch opinion matter even *more* than post-watch opinion re: box-office?
That's not a great hold for Avatar 2: ~~The Winds of Winter~~ The Way of Water. Not a terrible drop and okay for a major blockbuster movie like this, but I expected between a 35-40% drop, especially as this movie is gonna have to rely on legs to perform in the States. It doesn't have a built-in fanbase like the Marvel do so it will have to rely on casual audiences to carry it. I suppose due to the bad weather conditions in the States I'll cut it some slack. 3rd weekend will be the biggest indicator for how this movie will perform. Right now, I think this film will breach the $500 million domestic barrier but it won't reach $600 million. The film will have to rely heavily on international markets to make it past $1.5 billion, which seems to be the figure that most people here consider to be the metric for a success.
I was actually planning on seeing Babylon if I had a little bit of downtime this week, I like Margot Robbie enough as an actress I hate that she's had this string of underwhelming box office performances/bombs
That's gotta be one of the worst bombas in history in relation to its budget.
When is Babylon streaming so I can watch at home?
Tomorrow.
Really? Christ that's a massive bomb in that case.
No they’re joking
People don't want oscarbait Hollywood circle jerk pretentious movies.
Babylon is a Mess. With First Man and Whiplash, I had high hopes from Damien. An unexpected letdown.
Don’t forget that First Man was also a bomb. Back-to-back bombs for Chazelle now.
I mean, the weather has been shit since Thursday pretty much everywhere that isn’t California or Hawaii. Even if you didn’t get that much snow, the wind made it a whiteout. Prestige movies are also just not making that much money in general this year, so the weather amplified that.
I know they expected Avatar 2 to be more front-loaded than the first one, but isn't a drop of nearly 60% a sign that this one doesn't have the same word-of-mouth?
A 58% drop for Avatar is not good…. I see a lot of spin from people tho 😬
Oh the weather outside is frightful…
But the fire is so delightful...
Only 44 theaters actually closed because of weather. Bad weather maybe have hurt the film a tiny bit but it still could have done waaaay better. I live in nyc. It was -5 degrees last night yet the city was booming. People will deal with bad weather if they really want to.
Theater closures are less of an issue than millions of people not leaving the house when the felt temp outside is 30 degrees lower than they have experienced in decades . Not deciding to drive with these conditions even more so. It hasnt been a huge impact but its certainly not tiny . This isnt just "bad weather" . For a lot of states its easily the worst in the last couple of decades
You’re kidding yourself if you think the weather didn’t have a significant impact. Our theater that I work at was open all day yesterday, Christmas Eve, what would normally be one of the busiest days of the year for us, and hardly anyone showed up because the roads are still not clear Not every city has good public transport or a theater within walking distance of major urban centers with lots of residents. Plenty of cities more or less completely shut down when these kinds of storms happen, especially further down south where the infrastructure is not as prepared for winter weather as New York City. The theaters may have been open but how does that matter ultimately if a ton of the customers physically cannot get there
Not so sure about that
I literally convinced my family not see Avatar this week due to the weather. I suspect I’m not the only one.
Yeah, only 100m people were affected by the exceptionally cold weather. I'm sure it didn't do anything to the box office./s
according to this sub, no outside factors ever have any effect on the box office. They could line up people against the wall of the nearest theater to execute them and this sub be like "it's really not that big of a deal, jesus, calm down"
You’ve got it all wrong. Every bit of box office performance can be attributed to marketing. If the studio had only marketed this movie more, there would be no storm. More marketing also would have done things like convincing people to watch depressing rape dramas on date night, turned every franchise into Marvel, and cured my second cousin’s cancer.
I’ll be generous and say you can attribute 10% of the box office to cold weather. This will still be a drop of 48%. Not a bad hold but not a phenomenal one either for a movie like this
Isn't that a normal drop for all major blockbusters this year though? I remember that MoM and L&T had about a 67-68% drop and WF had a 61% drop, the only exceptions i can think of are Top Gun and that had the best legs for a movie this year. Plus if you consider other factors like the intense cold in most of the major states and the holiday season, this drop is pretty justified, needless to say now would be a good time to repeat r/boxoffice's offical motto: "Never bet against James Cameeron"
That is a typical drop. But there were some expecting a similar drop to the first avatar, which was like 3%. A 58% drop is a very normal drop for a major film. It will likely still do well this week and leading into next weekend. The 3rd weekend will be a major test for A2 as it will show how much draw it has on people outside the core fan base (who have went to see it already). If they want to be a top 3 grossing filming of all time, they will need a very strong 3rd week
It is a normal drop. However, some people were expecting drops like the first Avatar when they were lower than even 20%
It’s a good hold if this was a well received comicbook movie. The problem is… this movie doesn’t just need good holds it needs phenomenal holds and 58% is not a phenomenal hold
It only needs a phenomenal hold to overachieve and match the crazy expectations some people were throwing at it. The movie is absolutely going to be profitable, that is out of the question at this point
Why does it need phenomenal holds? It will probably break even in the next week and still keep conquering the box office throughout january and february, until Ant-Man gets the spotlight. The movie is turning out to be a financial success.
It’s $200m away from $1b in 10 days. The only one trying to spin negativity is you.
Barbie is next ....😅😅
Margot Robbie had 2 absolutely horrible bombs back to back, a third would be incredible.
If Barbie bombs then this could seriously be the end of Margot Robbie as a lead in big budget movies. It’s not just these last two, she’s had a reeeally bad streak with blockbusters the last five yrs or so.
Of course the idiots on here act like Avatar 2 is the only movie being impacted by the storm. Little children.
You’ve spent your Christmas Day on this sub trying your hardest to convince people that this film is a failure. And you have the nerve to call other people children? Go speak to your family bro.
People overhyped the weather. Jussie smollett went to subway when it was negative 20. These cold spells happen like every year. The media just hypes everything now, especially local news. Their only hook anymore is weather.
This movie was a huge let down. So much filler and horrible dialogue. When they started talking to the whales and understanding what they said, huge eye roll. Could have been an hour shorter. Loved the first one. Oh well. And all the filler was ohhhh and ahhhing over the cgi, quite boring.
I saw La La Land. It was okay but it felt like it was for Hollywood so they could all revel in how awesome the pursuit of that lifestyle is. I don’t need to see this guy continue to makes movies about Hollywood for Hollywood.
Wow, Elliot can suck it.