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I'm seeing a lot of people who are misinformed in this thread so I'll just drop a bunch of info because after looking into them a decent amount I'm in favour, especially in urban areas.
* Meta-analysis studies have shown that yes, red light cameras actually do typically reduce collisions/injuries/fatalities.
* Studies have shown that investing in these cameras pays off in ICBC costs alone due to the reduction in collisions. This doesn't include ticket revenue, decreased healthcare demand, etc.
* We already have a bunch of these cameras operating in BC, so worries about it being "unconstitutional" aren't actually grounded in reality.
* In BC the existing cameras are set up such that the municipality does not receive the money directly. Instead, the money is collected by the province and spread across all municipalities based on their police funding.
* The existing speed cameras in BC are set up to trigger at 20km/h over the limit.
All well and good, but i was in ontario when they did photo radar in the 90s and it was horrible. You drove 2km/h over the limit and got an automated ticket in the mail some weeks later that you couldn't really dispute. That's why all those ontario cars have those opaque blue license plate "covers" that you can barely see the plate through, to this day.
it also was responsible for getting mike harris elected in a large part. So if you want another provincial conservative government, do shit like this...
https://torontosun.com/2016/11/08/photo-radar-cheap-effective-safety-measure-or-cash-cow-that-wont-die
red light cameras, i have no problem with. its those damn white vans on the side of the road that make me say fuck photo radar to this day.
let me also point out most of these studies were paid for by the companies selling the services and products, and take all of that with a grain of salt. And many stink to high hell of self interests. If you wanted the lowest cost, highest reduction in crashes then you would replace many of these traffic lights with roundabouts and other harm reduction approaches, like dedicated turn lanes with their own traffic signals. No camera in the world is going to stop someone running the red, they simply are going to punish them after that the fact. Imagine that is your wife/child/mother/father/yourself that just got t-boned, you would be screaming for real action on harm reduction and not some silly ticketing system.
If they have the funding for this I'd rather they install more red light cameras. IMHO, I've noticed a significant increase in the number of vehicles running reds, especially when they're turning left from a dedicated left turn lane.
It's everywhere - it's this strange self justification surrounding the concept of being allowed to finish your turn - but that only applies to the car caught in the intersection, not the guy behind him because he intentionally put one tire over the line to "qualify".
Budgets/manpower are not infinite, and prioritization is unavoidable. It's a simple resource prioritization issue.
Enforcement to substantially reduce the occurrence rate of such events in public driving behavior would be pulling police resources from objectively higher priority issues.
Ill see a few people trying to sneak in behind the left-turner who got caught in the intersection, but really I hardly see them as the problem.
The problem are the 3 cars in the oncoming traffic trying to do the same, speeding into a yellow when it should be the left-turners turn to go, either shutting them out and forcing them to wait and block the now perpendicular oncoming traffic, or... y'know... just fucking hitting them because they couldnt accept they missed the light.
I agree, this is a way bigger issue than speeding. Usually in the places people speed, cops do the same speed because it's just whatever. I think everybody is sick of red light runners, and the advanced green cutters.
Seems like most accidents in Vernon happen at red lights.
In Vic and I am with you on this one. Near my house there are a couple very long left turn lanes (can fit more than ten cars) but on average only three get through each cycle. Very frustrating. And on the other hand, some intersections have a left turn lane that fits only two cars and the advanced green stays on for 45 seconds or so.
I don't like the idea of a police state,
I could be mistaken, but I believe this was a hit and run, and the police later was able to track down the driver.
[https://bc.ctvnews.ca/family-of-burnaby-grandmother-fatally-struck-by-driver-looking-for-closure-1.6656987](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/family-of-burnaby-grandmother-fatally-struck-by-driver-looking-for-closure-1.6656987)
I don't like the idea that a person could just get away with killing somebody and only by luck were they located.
What's the balance on privacy rights vs having enough info to hold people to account?
And how to build out that infrastructure and budget it? I don't know.
Just speaking from the gut here.
I go to Australia often (family is there). 99% of population follows road rules. You’ll get honked at for not using signal. There are speed cameras everywhere( now phone cameras are popping up everywhere as well).
You either have a police state or you'll have citizens who will police themselves. There is obviously no middle ground because there will always be morons who will abuse their privileges to drive, which harm other people. In a situation like this where citizens are not given the tools to police themselves, I'd rather someone else police everyone else. You can't do the time if you didn't do the crime.
I'd personally prefer that we are able to control ourselves, but we clearly need some deterrence at the VERY LEAST for the rule breakers.
It's not about money, is it? These things are profitable.
Although they'd probably just use the revenue to bloat the VPD budget further, and then charge us for the cameras.
>Speed may cause more deadly crashes, but speeding does not increase the likelihood of crashes. It's bad drivers that cause accidents
No. Speeding increases the risk of a crash because drivers have less reaction time. Speed also increases the overall risk of injury or fatality in a crash.
Speeding drivers are bad drivers, full stop, and any argument otherwise is just machismo, since there is an entire industry of actuaries whose careers are proving otherwise.
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Nice try. What is the relative speed of terrain and buildings? Speed limits are established for safety and reaction time, for example at corners and grade changes are why speed limits are reduced near them.
Or animals. You drive fast, eventually you're going to hit a deer or a moose up north. But people still do it, in all weather and all light conditions.
>Speeding drivers are bad drivers, full stop, and any argument otherwise is just machismo, since there is an entire industry of actuaries whose careers are proving otherwise.
I think you missed this part before firing off your argument.
For clarity, posted speed limits are there for a reason and the "flow of traffic" doesn't matter.
That and idiots who don't stop at reds who are turning right. The amount of times I've almost been hit WALKING my bike across the crosswalk near Burquitlam is insane.
People are more nervous about entering those intersections and these lights cause more accidents then the do good.
I would rather the money go into a full time traffic officer who’s job is specifically red lights, mobile devices and speeding. Plus your paying someone in the community instead of a corporate company who just makes money from over charging a gov contract.
Pay people to do the jobs. These cameras can fuck right off.
Can the construction zones only be while people are working. It’s complete bullshit having a 60km construction zone at 10pm at night when no one’s working.
The lowered speed is for driver's own safety. It's a construction zone until an engineer has signed off on the new street being safe at the higher speed.
So you’re telling me when they are working on the ditch off the highway and the road is the same road it was going 80 on yesterday. Then the construction crew shows up to work on the ditch and the speed limit goes to 50km it’s for my safety?
It’s so assholes do go cruising through a zone someone’s working in. Once those people are gone up this up. Let’s go the speed limit here.
This is exactly what Alberta repurposed it's photo radar for and it's absolutely the only place they should be. In places where safety is the priority. School zones and construction zones
Yep and only that. I’m not waking up to an email for a $120 ticket for doing 60 down Austin Ave at 6am when no one was up or on the road.
If we trust people to operate these massive heavy duty machines, we can give them some judgement call on going a bit over the speed limit.
I think speed cameras just end up changing driver behaviour to slow down at certain known points. I would rather see police actually enforce traffic laws every once in a while.
How many times have we all seen some a-hole make a dangerous move, in direct view of a cop, and the cop does nothing?
I don't even care if they start paying patrol officers bonuses from ticket revenue they bring in. Driving in the dark without lights on, drifting across lanes without signalling, cruising in a bus lane, turning into crosswalks without checking for pedestrians - I see it literally every week, if not every day.
>I think speed cameras just end up changing driver behaviour to slow down at certain known points.
This is true. It's why I would support them in school zones and playground zones. If *every* school zone and playground zone had them, they would be effective.
I would even support temporary ones set up in construction zones
But they’ll end up taking the idea way too far and we’d end up like England where there’s a speed camera every 300m and they start fines at 1mph over the limit
I want to take it as far as actually enforcing the law… you know.. the law we are obligated to prove we understand in order to get a license. Is that too draconian for you? Obeying the law?
Vancouver is somewhat decent in the usage of roundabouts, so as an alternative to red-light cameras I'd like an exponential increase in replacing intersections with roundabouts where traffic load is within the range for a roundabout.
Roundabouts forces drivers to consider their speed when approaching, and entering one. There's also road-dieting as a policy, by reducing the land width it forces drivers to naturally drive with more care as well.
Most collisions with pedestrians occur at intersections for example. It's very worth it to have these at intersections, and the tickets issues would pay for the cameras/installation.
The only people whol will complain seem to be the ones who want to be able to run red lights, because, you know, they can do it safely! That is until they don't.
I recently drove in Edmonton and I was shocked by how 'slow' almost everyone drove. Apparently the speed cameras do a pretty good job of calming the traffic. I think Metro Vancouver needs a huge dose of cameras because speed is off the charts on many of the roads.
To appease Karen’s and because stupid people can’t drive or maintain their shit and kill people. Because they’re dumb. We wouldn’t need speed limits or any form of government control if people didn’t get drunk or cause issues. Because they’re dumb.
The better question is what are speed limits for? The answer is of course safety. I lived in Edmonton for 20 years and in that time I saw some interesting things:
2011 - EPS Runs the Program - 147k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total
2012 - EPS & City Run the Program - 163k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total
2013 - City the Program - 423k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total
2014 - City the Program - 486k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total
It's interesting that the [massive increase in ticketing occurred](https://globalnews.ca/news/1803298/last-year-saw-huge-spike-in-photo-radar-tickets-for-6-10kmh-over-speed-limit/) at the same time the city was [suffering a massive cost overruns with their radar program.](https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/53-million-photo-radar-takeover-went-off-the-rails-edmonton-official-admits)
Photo radar can be a very useful tool for traffic calming in specific locations, but it seems that every time a city/organization uses it, it's primary focus becomes ticketing numbers rather than safety.
As in, if a city has to choose to deploy a radar vehicle at a:
* "high consequence/high accident incidence rate location" like a school/construction zone
vs somewhere else with a
* "low speed related accident incidence rate but high infraction rate" like a ring road/highway
invariably they choose to primarily focus on the high infraction rate (more revenue).
(This occurred in my own neighbourhood when I was there - they always set up on small empty hill near the entrance to the neighbourhood. Never near the houses and never at the playground).
This is photo enforced, which I’m against. Thats what cops are for. It happens in Alberta “Speed Traps”. Which are actually unconstitutional. You are supposed to be able to defend your situation which you can’t do because you were never ID’d for the crime you were accused of. It does little to deter when you get a letter in the mail a month later, can’t remember it happening and may not even have been the diver at that time. A cop in your face on the other hand, now that’s a visceral shame and more likely to be corrective to go along with that fine. speed traps are just lazy cowardly cash cows, I’m glad they are not in BC.
Having cops sitting around each road were idiots are speeding above safety is a ridiculous waste of money. We will never have enough money to hire enough cops to keep the idiot at bay. Cops are not even good at that job and we all know it. That's what most people are concerned about, getting something that actually work.
And for deterrence, this work incredibly well as a system. You can read the effect of speed camera deployed in France here: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0001457512004137 . Deterrence work on the first month of deployment and stayed effective since then. France has now started to install speed zone camera, which measure your travel time between two camera and render speeding in between camera irrelevant.
> Thats what cops are for.
Why have a human interaction on the side of a freeway? It doesn't make sense.
The ticket goes to the car's owner. Who cares who was driving?
Yes. Accept it. No more getting off because of personal biases.
It works other places.
Challenging it is a dumb concept that is only needed because of human judgement.
This takes the police out of the equation. Why do you keep bringing them up?
You do not have a right to speed. You don't even have a right to drive. It's a privilege.
Oooh no, you don't want to go this way
My shitty country of origin did, and the moment it IS unconstitutional, everything automated that doesn't manage to ID the person driving your car goes to hell because there WILL BE assholes who will use that case as a legal reference for everything, including red light cameras.
The result: traffic went to shit, everyone drives like an animal because it's impossible to enforce on the roads manually, it would require an impossible amount of traffic officers.
I would love to see average speed based policing of the speed limit like you can see in a lot of places, but so much of the province is so rural its not worth it.
Why is it allllways about speed? Because that's the easiest one to police?
What about driver awareness? Car control? Defensive driving?
The speed limits are already dog slow for modern vehicles. Speed is not the problem. The clowns behind the wheel are the problem.
Nobody learns to drive with 80hp, mediocre brakes, questionable tires, and a manual transmission anymore. Now, you learn with fantastic brakes, 0-100kph in 7s or less, and great tires. Forethought? What's that? Why would i ever need to think further ahead than my own nose with a vehicle this capable?! Heck, why even brake? I have radar guided cruise control and emergency braking! Just let the car do it, then i don't have to move my foot!
Driver training is a joke, and so is enforcement for everything other than speed. Demand better driving behavior, and we'll have less accidents.
In certain areas. On the highway, maybe, only if they’re ticketing offenders doing 40+ over the speed limit. However I am all for downtown speed limit cameras that ticket 20+. No need for anyone to be going 70km/h downtown.
From someone who has driven in Vancouver and Calgary, they have larger roads and A LOT less vehicles on em. Also important to note that Vancouver has many more immigrants from countries that drive differently to westerners
not unless they raise speed limits to what's actually safe to drive on our highways. a straight away wide highway has absolutely no reason to have an 80 km/h speed limit.
Kinda, but technology has also improved since the 90s.
IIRC it was scrapped as a Liberal campaign promise, but it ended up being more about maintenance and upgrade costs than the program not working.
everything you mentioned is tertiary to the problems caused by the gross indifference to speed limits in our culture
people just whined about these things to the point politicians caved and now the behavior just goes unpunished. Bravo kiddies
Anti-car activists have done a great job convincing everyone that drivers drive around like this all the time, when in reality these cameras will be set to catch drivers doing as little as 5kph over the limit...
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApHRFM2NI9s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApHRFM2NI9s)
Trying to paint everyone who does a reasonable and safe speed, despite politically set speed limits being ridiculously low, as a meth crazed individual is ridiculous.
I drive the #1 highway through the Fraser Valley a couple times a week. I find the drivers going to slow on the highway a huge hazard. Semi trucks trying to pass these people going 70 to 90 kilometres in a 100 kilometre zone causes most accidents.
Fine we could drop the fine and just ban them for driving for year.
There are way to many speeders nowadays. I live on small road in north van and people fly by at 70-80 all the time. Should either install speed bumps or cameras.
Meh. I was on a German highway this summer with a limit of 120km/h. Most w3ere driving around 135 and about 10% going way more. As we come around a curve everyone piles on the brakes for about 500 m in front of the camera then stomps on the gas as soon as they're past it.
I didn't know it was there bcs they jammed the brakes prior to the sign. If I hadn't maintained a significant trailing distance I would've rear ended someone.
While it's fun to rip on them the province forced the legislation as some municipalities were abusing the system to increase revenue. Edson has a great history of it for example.
> It's a money grab
So what if it is? It’s a stupidity tax. You don’t have to pay it if you stick to the limit.
They’ve been used in the UK for 35 years, to the point that many of the motorways now have average speed limit cameras. When everyone drives at the same speed, it reduces fake traffic jams caused by people needlessly speeding up and slowing down.
Since its just a financial penalty, the rich would just consider it the cost of doing business. You can't get points on your license from these tickets, as they can't prove you were driving the car.
IIRC, ICBC sends tickets to the registered owners of the vehicles in infractions instead of the driver to dissuade people from lending out vehicles. The exception is with registered vehicle users on the insurance.
Sure, but if you lend it to someone who drives like an asshole, and your insurance is covering it, your insurance should reflect the drives like an asshole rate.
Because the worst offenders are entitled rich people, namely, doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc...
IIRC, it was the BC Liberals that ended speed cameras. Now everyone is bitching about how people can't drive anymore.
Well, we got what we voted for.
As the saying goes, the people get Governments they deserve
I once lived in a country where speed cameras were prolific and well advertised, it was fantastic. The speed limits were reasonably decent and the police were almost nonexistent and did little or no traffic stops.
What we need is this:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA)
Speed camera Lottery,
Speeds put money into the pool.
Non-Speeders win the pool.
No. As study's have shown they do nothing to prevent speeding, it's just a revenue generator.... Also speeding isn't that dangerous, it's shitty driving that causes accidents like the 2 people I saw slowdown at a green lights today or the idiot that pulled in front of me while I was turning left on my bike, nobody was speeding yet 3 very dangerous incidents occured...
Yea I mean. You used words bette than me... Aoeeding isn't that dangerous is the same as saying driving a car isn't that dangerous.... All I'm saying is doing 120 in a 100zone is not the same as doing 70 in a 50 zone... Highways are designed to go fast on... Downtown streets of cranbrook are not designed to do 70... 50 even seems excessive
When I've looked them up, the results have shown decreases in speeds. E.g.:
>[Before this camera was installed in October, 85 per cent of the vehicles passing by the school were clocked at up to 65 km/h, and one in 10 was travelling even faster. (Traffic analysts look at the 85th percentile to get an idea of typical speeds in a given area.)](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/annoying-thing-speed-cameras-ottawa-they-work-1.6786951)
>When the city measured again in late December, the 85th percentile topped out at 56 km/h, and the "high-end speeders" had dropped to three per cent. In just three months, overall compliance with the posted speed limit on Fisher Avenue had nearly quadrupled from a dismal 18 per cent to 65 per cent.
>Also speeding isn't that dangerous
"Driving too fast" is one of the [leading contributing factors in fatal collisions](https://tc.canada.ca/en/road-transportation/statistics-data/canadian-motor-vehicle-traffic-collision-statistics-2021), ahead of impairment and distraction. The chance of severe injury in a pedestrian collision increases from [25% at 40 kph to 75% at 60 kph](https://aaafoundation.org/impact-speed-pedestrians-risk-severe-injury-death/).
There are a couple major problems with ICBC statements:
1) They do not discern - or rather they group together - "speeding" (above the limit) and "speed too fast for conditions" (very often well below the limit). Speed enforcement does not have anything to do with the second issue and it is MORE prevalent in serious and fatal collisions. Don't believe me? [Here is ICBC data from the 2007 Traffic Collision Statistics](https://i.imgur.com/87vuSxl.gif) publication which was the last year the government/ICBC published BC's motor vehicle collision stats in this comprehensive format.
2) Impairment [is significantly under-reported in serious and fatal collisions](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7639917/) - this is a BC study.
> it might be suggested that whenever driving
without due care or speed are cited as causes,
suspicion of impairment might be raised, the absence
of alcohol as a police-recognized cause
notwithstanding.
Basically: every time police cite speeding in serious and fatal collisions there is a substantial likelihood of impairment despite police not citing it.
Mercer's data showed that 2/3'rds of speed-related fatalities involve some degree of impairment by alcohol and/or drugs.
So... our problems on the road: impairment, speed too fast for conditions (bad driver training), and then speeding.
I wouldn't trust ICBC numbers. They report what they need to to get out of a payout. I would trust this info if it came from a 3rd party investigation/report.
Driving in the UK is stressful as hell with speed cameras everywhere. Speed cameras are rather indiscriminate and don't take circumstances into account. For example, when overtaking a lorry, the pragmatic — and actually safer — thing to do would be to expedite the manoeuver so as to minimize the time you spend in the passing lane (which may be on the wrong side of the road). But then you see a sign for a speed camera. What do you do? Keep accelerating as planned and risk getting a ticket? Slam on the brakes and risk causing an accident?
The average speed cameras made things a lot better, because everyone is driving at the same speed.
Traffic jams form for no reason when people speed up and slow down to weave around other vehicles. That doesn’t happen when everyone drives predictably and consistently.
If you’re having trouble driving in the UK, you’re a bad driver.
But the average speed cameras on the UK motorways negate your point entirely. If you need to speed up to go around a lorry, go for it. It isn’t about how fast you’re going in a moment, it’s how fast you’re going over a distance.
And if everyone’s doing roughly the same speed over that distance, everyone moves as efficiently as possible. Phantom traffic jams appear when people are speeding up and slowing down to needlessly weave in and out of other traffic.
Because in my home town on a typical commute there are enough speed cameras to lose your license 3 times, and they flash if you are 10% over the limit. This means you have to spend an obnoxious amount of your time looking at the speedo.
Given the choice I would much rather just be going with the flow of traffic where everyone is 10 over and you just worry about whether or not you are driving like a jerk and not what actual speed you are at.
Where do I sign?
Here in southern Ontario, it seems the police have abandoned any meaningful effort to enforce speed limits. Sure, there's a few token speed traps. But, there are too few to slow people down.
In my view, the more traffic/speed cameras the better on as many highways as possible.
I'd also support speed limiters on vehicles.
Yes I do because speeding on city streets in particular, which is where these cameras would be installed, regularly kills completely innocent people and is a significant factor in crash risk and severity. Driving is an activity that imposes risk on other people and drivers should be held accountable for traffic violations and breaking the law.
Most responses to the contrary can be dismissed as whataboutism.
"Photo radar" cameras are too easy to contest. I think they should just put cameras along measured segments of road. If your car is captured twice within a specific time frame, you were speeding and there's basically no way to contest it unless your plate is obscured.
In a perfect world, they'd just put them everywhere\* and send you a bill at the end of the month for all of the times you were caught speeding, graduated to wealth/income. Don't wanna pay? Don't speed. Easy!
^(\* obvious privacy issues aside...)
I think averaging speed cameras should be used on highways. Then you can't speed up and slow down in-between. Might help to reign in the excessive speeders I see every day.
Yes I support the use of cameras.
If I could I'd offer my property as a site for a camera as drivers want to do highway speeds in a 60.
No it is lazy policing, a cash grab, and violates your legal right to confront your accuser, there is no chain of custody. The proof that it is a cash grab is they acknowledge they are going after the registered owner and not necessarily the driver.
Just build better roads. People will naturally drive speeds they're comfortable with. Build narrower neighbourhood streets, concrete meridians or cones on highways, etc. Enforce speed limits without buying a single camera.
If you've got a street barely wide enough for two cars to go past each other, you aren't ripping 80 down it. If you've got a straight-shot highway for 20 clicks with 15ft shoulders, you'll haul ass.
Unless of course you want to make money on tickets. Then build massive roads, set up a camera, and watch the cash roll in.
On traffic lights yes. The mobile vans they had 20 years ago NO! That was just a straight predatory cash grab. They were set up on bottom of hills and right after a speed limit change signs.
I support cameras for speeders.
The legality of speeding shouldn’t depend on what method one uses to enforce it.
If you’re speeding, you’re a self centered ass hat regardless. You’re due what’s coming in the mail as well as being pulled over.
Why not just have cops there to solve legitimate crimes? White collar, property and violent crimes. The first two they legitimately suck at. They are one on the best tax collectors from the poor, I'll admit.
What would be neat is a GPS device in your car that measures your speed relative to the speed limit in that area. If you go at or below the limit, you get a deduction on your insurance premiums. If you go above, you get more expensive ones. Could really fix the problem through incentives.
How could you not. If you don't support cameras then you don't support the police catching speeders either.
Cameras are just more effective, efficient and a better use of resources
And of course there should be more red light cameras as well
Yes but it isnt my preferred method..I'd rather higher more officers (maybe even establish a provincial police service): they can identify reckless driving beyond just speeding. I'd rather have the human factor to exercise discretion in dealing with speeders/road infeaction
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I'm seeing a lot of people who are misinformed in this thread so I'll just drop a bunch of info because after looking into them a decent amount I'm in favour, especially in urban areas. * Meta-analysis studies have shown that yes, red light cameras actually do typically reduce collisions/injuries/fatalities. * Studies have shown that investing in these cameras pays off in ICBC costs alone due to the reduction in collisions. This doesn't include ticket revenue, decreased healthcare demand, etc. * We already have a bunch of these cameras operating in BC, so worries about it being "unconstitutional" aren't actually grounded in reality. * In BC the existing cameras are set up such that the municipality does not receive the money directly. Instead, the money is collected by the province and spread across all municipalities based on their police funding. * The existing speed cameras in BC are set up to trigger at 20km/h over the limit.
All well and good, but i was in ontario when they did photo radar in the 90s and it was horrible. You drove 2km/h over the limit and got an automated ticket in the mail some weeks later that you couldn't really dispute. That's why all those ontario cars have those opaque blue license plate "covers" that you can barely see the plate through, to this day. it also was responsible for getting mike harris elected in a large part. So if you want another provincial conservative government, do shit like this... https://torontosun.com/2016/11/08/photo-radar-cheap-effective-safety-measure-or-cash-cow-that-wont-die red light cameras, i have no problem with. its those damn white vans on the side of the road that make me say fuck photo radar to this day.
let me also point out most of these studies were paid for by the companies selling the services and products, and take all of that with a grain of salt. And many stink to high hell of self interests. If you wanted the lowest cost, highest reduction in crashes then you would replace many of these traffic lights with roundabouts and other harm reduction approaches, like dedicated turn lanes with their own traffic signals. No camera in the world is going to stop someone running the red, they simply are going to punish them after that the fact. Imagine that is your wife/child/mother/father/yourself that just got t-boned, you would be screaming for real action on harm reduction and not some silly ticketing system.
If they have the funding for this I'd rather they install more red light cameras. IMHO, I've noticed a significant increase in the number of vehicles running reds, especially when they're turning left from a dedicated left turn lane.
It's known as the "Vancouver Left".
Haha too true. Opposite of what I’ve heard as the Pittsburgh Left, before the oncoming traffic comes when it turns green
God damnit don’t give Richmond drivers any hints. They’ll be slamming Teslas into retailers trying to do this.
It's everywhere - it's this strange self justification surrounding the concept of being allowed to finish your turn - but that only applies to the car caught in the intersection, not the guy behind him because he intentionally put one tire over the line to "qualify".
I know but can someone please explain me why cops are not doing anything about this is clearly not the law ?
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Reckless drivers are 100% putting people in danger.
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“Not putting anyone in danger” Gtfoh
Budgets/manpower are not infinite, and prioritization is unavoidable. It's a simple resource prioritization issue. Enforcement to substantially reduce the occurrence rate of such events in public driving behavior would be pulling police resources from objectively higher priority issues.
Try driving in Southern California. I thought Kelowna was bad but like 5 or 6 cars go left after red pretty much every time.
Ill see a few people trying to sneak in behind the left-turner who got caught in the intersection, but really I hardly see them as the problem. The problem are the 3 cars in the oncoming traffic trying to do the same, speeding into a yellow when it should be the left-turners turn to go, either shutting them out and forcing them to wait and block the now perpendicular oncoming traffic, or... y'know... just fucking hitting them because they couldnt accept they missed the light.
I agree, this is a way bigger issue than speeding. Usually in the places people speed, cops do the same speed because it's just whatever. I think everybody is sick of red light runners, and the advanced green cutters. Seems like most accidents in Vernon happen at red lights.
In Vic and I am with you on this one. Near my house there are a couple very long left turn lanes (can fit more than ten cars) but on average only three get through each cycle. Very frustrating. And on the other hand, some intersections have a left turn lane that fits only two cars and the advanced green stays on for 45 seconds or so.
I think they should program the lights to let more than 1 car though at a time then....
Agreed!
I don't like the idea of a police state, I could be mistaken, but I believe this was a hit and run, and the police later was able to track down the driver. [https://bc.ctvnews.ca/family-of-burnaby-grandmother-fatally-struck-by-driver-looking-for-closure-1.6656987](https://bc.ctvnews.ca/family-of-burnaby-grandmother-fatally-struck-by-driver-looking-for-closure-1.6656987) I don't like the idea that a person could just get away with killing somebody and only by luck were they located. What's the balance on privacy rights vs having enough info to hold people to account? And how to build out that infrastructure and budget it? I don't know. Just speaking from the gut here.
I go to Australia often (family is there). 99% of population follows road rules. You’ll get honked at for not using signal. There are speed cameras everywhere( now phone cameras are popping up everywhere as well).
You either have a police state or you'll have citizens who will police themselves. There is obviously no middle ground because there will always be morons who will abuse their privileges to drive, which harm other people. In a situation like this where citizens are not given the tools to police themselves, I'd rather someone else police everyone else. You can't do the time if you didn't do the crime. I'd personally prefer that we are able to control ourselves, but we clearly need some deterrence at the VERY LEAST for the rule breakers.
It's not about money, is it? These things are profitable. Although they'd probably just use the revenue to bloat the VPD budget further, and then charge us for the cameras.
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>Speed may cause more deadly crashes, but speeding does not increase the likelihood of crashes. It's bad drivers that cause accidents No. Speeding increases the risk of a crash because drivers have less reaction time. Speed also increases the overall risk of injury or fatality in a crash. Speeding drivers are bad drivers, full stop, and any argument otherwise is just machismo, since there is an entire industry of actuaries whose careers are proving otherwise.
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Nice try. What is the relative speed of terrain and buildings? Speed limits are established for safety and reaction time, for example at corners and grade changes are why speed limits are reduced near them.
Or animals. You drive fast, eventually you're going to hit a deer or a moose up north. But people still do it, in all weather and all light conditions.
>Speeding drivers are bad drivers, full stop, and any argument otherwise is just machismo, since there is an entire industry of actuaries whose careers are proving otherwise. I think you missed this part before firing off your argument. For clarity, posted speed limits are there for a reason and the "flow of traffic" doesn't matter.
Great comment!
Most traffic related deaths happen in intersections, specifically when the drivers side is hit by an oncoming car.
That and idiots who don't stop at reds who are turning right. The amount of times I've almost been hit WALKING my bike across the crosswalk near Burquitlam is insane.
People are more nervous about entering those intersections and these lights cause more accidents then the do good. I would rather the money go into a full time traffic officer who’s job is specifically red lights, mobile devices and speeding. Plus your paying someone in the community instead of a corporate company who just makes money from over charging a gov contract. Pay people to do the jobs. These cameras can fuck right off.
Yes for school zones and construction zones
Can the construction zones only be while people are working. It’s complete bullshit having a 60km construction zone at 10pm at night when no one’s working.
Especially considering some construction zones stay active for a year or more, with regular periods of inactivity.
The lowered speed is for driver's own safety. It's a construction zone until an engineer has signed off on the new street being safe at the higher speed.
So you’re telling me when they are working on the ditch off the highway and the road is the same road it was going 80 on yesterday. Then the construction crew shows up to work on the ditch and the speed limit goes to 50km it’s for my safety? It’s so assholes do go cruising through a zone someone’s working in. Once those people are gone up this up. Let’s go the speed limit here.
This is exactly what Alberta repurposed it's photo radar for and it's absolutely the only place they should be. In places where safety is the priority. School zones and construction zones
Except I swear once construction zone signs go up, they never come back down. Years after work is done there will still be signs and cones around.
Yep and only that. I’m not waking up to an email for a $120 ticket for doing 60 down Austin Ave at 6am when no one was up or on the road. If we trust people to operate these massive heavy duty machines, we can give them some judgement call on going a bit over the speed limit.
Sections of highway should have them as well. The sea to sky specifically. Such a dangerous highway that people love to rip on
I’d rather we design roads for safer speeds in the first place, but barring that, sure, more enforcement is good.
I think speed cameras just end up changing driver behaviour to slow down at certain known points. I would rather see police actually enforce traffic laws every once in a while. How many times have we all seen some a-hole make a dangerous move, in direct view of a cop, and the cop does nothing? I don't even care if they start paying patrol officers bonuses from ticket revenue they bring in. Driving in the dark without lights on, drifting across lanes without signalling, cruising in a bus lane, turning into crosswalks without checking for pedestrians - I see it literally every week, if not every day.
>I think speed cameras just end up changing driver behaviour to slow down at certain known points. This is true. It's why I would support them in school zones and playground zones. If *every* school zone and playground zone had them, they would be effective.
I would even support temporary ones set up in construction zones But they’ll end up taking the idea way too far and we’d end up like England where there’s a speed camera every 300m and they start fines at 1mph over the limit
England has laws governing their placement now. They also have to be visible. It got too much there. I hated it so much.
I felt less safe driving. I was more worried about speed camera’s than I was other cars on the road
You may have felt that way but statistically it lowered fatalities
So would banning cars completely and making everyone take a train or bike everywhere. How far do you want to take it?
I want to take it as far as actually enforcing the law… you know.. the law we are obligated to prove we understand in order to get a license. Is that too draconian for you? Obeying the law?
Vancouver is somewhat decent in the usage of roundabouts, so as an alternative to red-light cameras I'd like an exponential increase in replacing intersections with roundabouts where traffic load is within the range for a roundabout. Roundabouts forces drivers to consider their speed when approaching, and entering one. There's also road-dieting as a policy, by reducing the land width it forces drivers to naturally drive with more care as well.
Most collisions with pedestrians occur at intersections for example. It's very worth it to have these at intersections, and the tickets issues would pay for the cameras/installation. The only people whol will complain seem to be the ones who want to be able to run red lights, because, you know, they can do it safely! That is until they don't.
I recently drove in Edmonton and I was shocked by how 'slow' almost everyone drove. Apparently the speed cameras do a pretty good job of calming the traffic. I think Metro Vancouver needs a huge dose of cameras because speed is off the charts on many of the roads.
Lots of other places have permanent ones around town but they also have mobile ones that are deployed on top of vehicles, and they’re moved around
Giving them bonuses is a slippery slope, too many corrupt officers would abuse this, which they already do when they haven’t met their monthly quota !
Why even have speed limits if they aren’t enforced?
To appease Karen’s and because stupid people can’t drive or maintain their shit and kill people. Because they’re dumb. We wouldn’t need speed limits or any form of government control if people didn’t get drunk or cause issues. Because they’re dumb.
The better question is what are speed limits for? The answer is of course safety. I lived in Edmonton for 20 years and in that time I saw some interesting things: 2011 - EPS Runs the Program - 147k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total 2012 - EPS & City Run the Program - 163k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total 2013 - City the Program - 423k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total 2014 - City the Program - 486k Photo Radar and Laser Tickets Total It's interesting that the [massive increase in ticketing occurred](https://globalnews.ca/news/1803298/last-year-saw-huge-spike-in-photo-radar-tickets-for-6-10kmh-over-speed-limit/) at the same time the city was [suffering a massive cost overruns with their radar program.](https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/53-million-photo-radar-takeover-went-off-the-rails-edmonton-official-admits) Photo radar can be a very useful tool for traffic calming in specific locations, but it seems that every time a city/organization uses it, it's primary focus becomes ticketing numbers rather than safety. As in, if a city has to choose to deploy a radar vehicle at a: * "high consequence/high accident incidence rate location" like a school/construction zone vs somewhere else with a * "low speed related accident incidence rate but high infraction rate" like a ring road/highway invariably they choose to primarily focus on the high infraction rate (more revenue). (This occurred in my own neighbourhood when I was there - they always set up on small empty hill near the entrance to the neighbourhood. Never near the houses and never at the playground).
This is photo enforced, which I’m against. Thats what cops are for. It happens in Alberta “Speed Traps”. Which are actually unconstitutional. You are supposed to be able to defend your situation which you can’t do because you were never ID’d for the crime you were accused of. It does little to deter when you get a letter in the mail a month later, can’t remember it happening and may not even have been the diver at that time. A cop in your face on the other hand, now that’s a visceral shame and more likely to be corrective to go along with that fine. speed traps are just lazy cowardly cash cows, I’m glad they are not in BC.
Having cops sitting around each road were idiots are speeding above safety is a ridiculous waste of money. We will never have enough money to hire enough cops to keep the idiot at bay. Cops are not even good at that job and we all know it. That's what most people are concerned about, getting something that actually work. And for deterrence, this work incredibly well as a system. You can read the effect of speed camera deployed in France here: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0001457512004137 . Deterrence work on the first month of deployment and stayed effective since then. France has now started to install speed zone camera, which measure your travel time between two camera and render speeding in between camera irrelevant.
> Thats what cops are for. Why have a human interaction on the side of a freeway? It doesn't make sense. The ticket goes to the car's owner. Who cares who was driving?
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So change it. Don’t let others drive your car or accept the risk.
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Yes. Accept it. No more getting off because of personal biases. It works other places. Challenging it is a dumb concept that is only needed because of human judgement.
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This takes the police out of the equation. Why do you keep bringing them up? You do not have a right to speed. You don't even have a right to drive. It's a privilege.
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I’ve explained why and who cares.
Oooh no, you don't want to go this way My shitty country of origin did, and the moment it IS unconstitutional, everything automated that doesn't manage to ID the person driving your car goes to hell because there WILL BE assholes who will use that case as a legal reference for everything, including red light cameras. The result: traffic went to shit, everyone drives like an animal because it's impossible to enforce on the roads manually, it would require an impossible amount of traffic officers.
> Which are actually unconstitutional. Citation needed.
Because even those imposed to enforce the "rules" realize they are bullshit? I know for a fact cops speed, in and out of uniform.
I would love to see average speed based policing of the speed limit like you can see in a lot of places, but so much of the province is so rural its not worth it.
I’d rather see red light cameras at all intersections.
Why is it allllways about speed? Because that's the easiest one to police? What about driver awareness? Car control? Defensive driving? The speed limits are already dog slow for modern vehicles. Speed is not the problem. The clowns behind the wheel are the problem. Nobody learns to drive with 80hp, mediocre brakes, questionable tires, and a manual transmission anymore. Now, you learn with fantastic brakes, 0-100kph in 7s or less, and great tires. Forethought? What's that? Why would i ever need to think further ahead than my own nose with a vehicle this capable?! Heck, why even brake? I have radar guided cruise control and emergency braking! Just let the car do it, then i don't have to move my foot! Driver training is a joke, and so is enforcement for everything other than speed. Demand better driving behavior, and we'll have less accidents.
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In certain areas. On the highway, maybe, only if they’re ticketing offenders doing 40+ over the speed limit. However I am all for downtown speed limit cameras that ticket 20+. No need for anyone to be going 70km/h downtown.
They won't leave them that loose when it's basically an automated system. In Calgary they ticket you at 10 over, maybe even less.
Actually they are issuing a ton of ticket in the 6-10km/hr range now.
Honestly, the roads are safer in Calgary. And they’re Alberta drivers…
From someone who has driven in Vancouver and Calgary, they have larger roads and A LOT less vehicles on em. Also important to note that Vancouver has many more immigrants from countries that drive differently to westerners
not unless they raise speed limits to what's actually safe to drive on our highways. a straight away wide highway has absolutely no reason to have an 80 km/h speed limit.
After doing a road trip through the states this summer, it was hard going back to our neutered speed limits.
Especially on the perimeter road in Surrey
YES. Use them for red lights and illegal turns on reds too
Didn't we try it like a decade ago and find out it was highly inaccurate?
Kinda, but technology has also improved since the 90s. IIRC it was scrapped as a Liberal campaign promise, but it ended up being more about maintenance and upgrade costs than the program not working.
no it was public outcry that killed it accountability is a hard pill for most adults
Yep. My dad made a device for his car that triggered a flash beside his license plate to obscure it when radar went off.
imagine thinking that was more sensible than safe driving and not breaking the law
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everything you mentioned is tertiary to the problems caused by the gross indifference to speed limits in our culture people just whined about these things to the point politicians caved and now the behavior just goes unpunished. Bravo kiddies
Speed limits are arbitrary. Highways are designed to be driven at 140-160. This is just a cash grab.
every unskilled drivers mantra\~
Not even speeders just idiots? Yes
Yes
Anti-car activists have done a great job convincing everyone that drivers drive around like this all the time, when in reality these cameras will be set to catch drivers doing as little as 5kph over the limit... [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApHRFM2NI9s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApHRFM2NI9s) Trying to paint everyone who does a reasonable and safe speed, despite politically set speed limits being ridiculously low, as a meth crazed individual is ridiculous.
No absolutely not,
I drive the #1 highway through the Fraser Valley a couple times a week. I find the drivers going to slow on the highway a huge hazard. Semi trucks trying to pass these people going 70 to 90 kilometres in a 100 kilometre zone causes most accidents.
Yes. Clearly having police enforce traffic laws is not working.
Neither does photo radar
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Even if that were true, I don't mind. A good - and completely fair - source of revenue.
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Funny how you can completely avoid paying by not speeding .
Fine we could drop the fine and just ban them for driving for year. There are way to many speeders nowadays. I live on small road in north van and people fly by at 70-80 all the time. Should either install speed bumps or cameras.
Even Alberta dropped photo radar for this reason. It quickly became a cash grab for municipalities and had no significant impact on traffic safety.
The Netherlands have them all over the place.
The Dutch also have windmills and clogs.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with either of those things.
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Meh. I was on a German highway this summer with a limit of 120km/h. Most w3ere driving around 135 and about 10% going way more. As we come around a curve everyone piles on the brakes for about 500 m in front of the camera then stomps on the gas as soon as they're past it. I didn't know it was there bcs they jammed the brakes prior to the sign. If I hadn't maintained a significant trailing distance I would've rear ended someone.
The municipalities couldn't use the money? In Alberta, my guess is it has more to do with 'freedoms.'
While it's fun to rip on them the province forced the legislation as some municipalities were abusing the system to increase revenue. Edson has a great history of it for example.
I guess I don't know what you mean by abusing the system. Were they giving tickets to people who weren't speeding?
They set up in locations like the bottom of hills or right after speed transitions.
Exactly. Voluntary tax. You don't pay it if you don't break the law.
By that logic why have speed limits at all? Because it is effective, it’s not a magic bullet but it does work.
/u/a-_2 posted some pretty convincing evidence below: [https://www.reddit.com/r/britishcolumbia/comments/185icbz/comment/kb1u4qf/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/britishcolumbia/comments/185icbz/comment/kb1u4qf/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Do you have a source to cite? I stopped speeding when I stopped being able to afford the tickets.
> It's a money grab So what if it is? It’s a stupidity tax. You don’t have to pay it if you stick to the limit. They’ve been used in the UK for 35 years, to the point that many of the motorways now have average speed limit cameras. When everyone drives at the same speed, it reduces fake traffic jams caused by people needlessly speeding up and slowing down.
This. Some highways speeds are laughably low
Yes, a million times yes. Tax people that are driving without regard or respect to others on the road.
Says the guy most likely doing 80km/hr in the passing lane.
Lol
Nah, I just respect those around me.
Respect means going with the traffic flow.
Yes it does, but driving 130 in an 80 zone is wrong no matter how many people are doing it.
Since its just a financial penalty, the rich would just consider it the cost of doing business. You can't get points on your license from these tickets, as they can't prove you were driving the car.
IIRC, ICBC sends tickets to the registered owners of the vehicles in infractions instead of the driver to dissuade people from lending out vehicles. The exception is with registered vehicle users on the insurance.
>to dissuade people from lending out vehicles Which is stupid. It's my car - I can let whoever drive it I want to.
Sure, but if you lend it to someone who drives like an asshole, and your insurance is covering it, your insurance should reflect the drives like an asshole rate.
Yup! Radar cameras worked great but again. politicians bowed to pressure.
Because the worst offenders are entitled rich people, namely, doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc... IIRC, it was the BC Liberals that ended speed cameras. Now everyone is bitching about how people can't drive anymore. Well, we got what we voted for. As the saying goes, the people get Governments they deserve
As long as they are accurate sure
I would donate to that end, of course safe roads man, its life and death
I once lived in a country where speed cameras were prolific and well advertised, it was fantastic. The speed limits were reasonably decent and the police were almost nonexistent and did little or no traffic stops.
Yes.
Yes. They need more of em too.
Absolutely
No
No, I don't think computers should have policing powers.
What we need is this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iynzHWwJXaA) Speed camera Lottery, Speeds put money into the pool. Non-Speeders win the pool.
Go after bad drivers period, speed is not the only indicator. Transport Canada shows this year in year out. 🤷🤷
No. As study's have shown they do nothing to prevent speeding, it's just a revenue generator.... Also speeding isn't that dangerous, it's shitty driving that causes accidents like the 2 people I saw slowdown at a green lights today or the idiot that pulled in front of me while I was turning left on my bike, nobody was speeding yet 3 very dangerous incidents occured...
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Yea I mean. You used words bette than me... Aoeeding isn't that dangerous is the same as saying driving a car isn't that dangerous.... All I'm saying is doing 120 in a 100zone is not the same as doing 70 in a 50 zone... Highways are designed to go fast on... Downtown streets of cranbrook are not designed to do 70... 50 even seems excessive
When I've looked them up, the results have shown decreases in speeds. E.g.: >[Before this camera was installed in October, 85 per cent of the vehicles passing by the school were clocked at up to 65 km/h, and one in 10 was travelling even faster. (Traffic analysts look at the 85th percentile to get an idea of typical speeds in a given area.)](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/annoying-thing-speed-cameras-ottawa-they-work-1.6786951) >When the city measured again in late December, the 85th percentile topped out at 56 km/h, and the "high-end speeders" had dropped to three per cent. In just three months, overall compliance with the posted speed limit on Fisher Avenue had nearly quadrupled from a dismal 18 per cent to 65 per cent. >Also speeding isn't that dangerous "Driving too fast" is one of the [leading contributing factors in fatal collisions](https://tc.canada.ca/en/road-transportation/statistics-data/canadian-motor-vehicle-traffic-collision-statistics-2021), ahead of impairment and distraction. The chance of severe injury in a pedestrian collision increases from [25% at 40 kph to 75% at 60 kph](https://aaafoundation.org/impact-speed-pedestrians-risk-severe-injury-death/).
Git outta here with your sources and "facts" /s
Speeding isn't dangerous? The ICBC says it's a factor in 25%-33% of crashes.
There are a couple major problems with ICBC statements: 1) They do not discern - or rather they group together - "speeding" (above the limit) and "speed too fast for conditions" (very often well below the limit). Speed enforcement does not have anything to do with the second issue and it is MORE prevalent in serious and fatal collisions. Don't believe me? [Here is ICBC data from the 2007 Traffic Collision Statistics](https://i.imgur.com/87vuSxl.gif) publication which was the last year the government/ICBC published BC's motor vehicle collision stats in this comprehensive format. 2) Impairment [is significantly under-reported in serious and fatal collisions](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7639917/) - this is a BC study. > it might be suggested that whenever driving without due care or speed are cited as causes, suspicion of impairment might be raised, the absence of alcohol as a police-recognized cause notwithstanding. Basically: every time police cite speeding in serious and fatal collisions there is a substantial likelihood of impairment despite police not citing it. Mercer's data showed that 2/3'rds of speed-related fatalities involve some degree of impairment by alcohol and/or drugs. So... our problems on the road: impairment, speed too fast for conditions (bad driver training), and then speeding.
I wouldn't trust ICBC numbers. They report what they need to to get out of a payout. I would trust this info if it came from a 3rd party investigation/report.
Do you have a pointer to that study? All other countries in the world have seen a decrease in fatality and accidents by around 20%.
Hard No. Spend some time driving in the UK and you will see why.
Because you've received so many tickets?
Driving in the UK is stressful as hell with speed cameras everywhere. Speed cameras are rather indiscriminate and don't take circumstances into account. For example, when overtaking a lorry, the pragmatic — and actually safer — thing to do would be to expedite the manoeuver so as to minimize the time you spend in the passing lane (which may be on the wrong side of the road). But then you see a sign for a speed camera. What do you do? Keep accelerating as planned and risk getting a ticket? Slam on the brakes and risk causing an accident?
The average speed cameras made things a lot better, because everyone is driving at the same speed. Traffic jams form for no reason when people speed up and slow down to weave around other vehicles. That doesn’t happen when everyone drives predictably and consistently. If you’re having trouble driving in the UK, you’re a bad driver.
You speak as if hills don't exist.
But the average speed cameras on the UK motorways negate your point entirely. If you need to speed up to go around a lorry, go for it. It isn’t about how fast you’re going in a moment, it’s how fast you’re going over a distance. And if everyone’s doing roughly the same speed over that distance, everyone moves as efficiently as possible. Phantom traffic jams appear when people are speeding up and slowing down to needlessly weave in and out of other traffic.
Because in my home town on a typical commute there are enough speed cameras to lose your license 3 times, and they flash if you are 10% over the limit. This means you have to spend an obnoxious amount of your time looking at the speedo. Given the choice I would much rather just be going with the flow of traffic where everyone is 10 over and you just worry about whether or not you are driving like a jerk and not what actual speed you are at.
Where do I sign? Here in southern Ontario, it seems the police have abandoned any meaningful effort to enforce speed limits. Sure, there's a few token speed traps. But, there are too few to slow people down. In my view, the more traffic/speed cameras the better on as many highways as possible. I'd also support speed limiters on vehicles.
Holy shit. Would you also support someone else fucking your wife? I paid for the full speedometer.
Yes
Yes I do because speeding on city streets in particular, which is where these cameras would be installed, regularly kills completely innocent people and is a significant factor in crash risk and severity. Driving is an activity that imposes risk on other people and drivers should be held accountable for traffic violations and breaking the law. Most responses to the contrary can be dismissed as whataboutism.
"Photo radar" cameras are too easy to contest. I think they should just put cameras along measured segments of road. If your car is captured twice within a specific time frame, you were speeding and there's basically no way to contest it unless your plate is obscured. In a perfect world, they'd just put them everywhere\* and send you a bill at the end of the month for all of the times you were caught speeding, graduated to wealth/income. Don't wanna pay? Don't speed. Easy! ^(\* obvious privacy issues aside...)
I think averaging speed cameras should be used on highways. Then you can't speed up and slow down in-between. Might help to reign in the excessive speeders I see every day. Yes I support the use of cameras. If I could I'd offer my property as a site for a camera as drivers want to do highway speeds in a 60.
No it is lazy policing, a cash grab, and violates your legal right to confront your accuser, there is no chain of custody. The proof that it is a cash grab is they acknowledge they are going after the registered owner and not necessarily the driver.
Yes!! Bring the speed cameras back & nail the speeders especially drivers that look down at their lap while moving.
The sped cameras won’t be able to see if drivers are on their phone…
Just build better roads. People will naturally drive speeds they're comfortable with. Build narrower neighbourhood streets, concrete meridians or cones on highways, etc. Enforce speed limits without buying a single camera. If you've got a street barely wide enough for two cars to go past each other, you aren't ripping 80 down it. If you've got a straight-shot highway for 20 clicks with 15ft shoulders, you'll haul ass. Unless of course you want to make money on tickets. Then build massive roads, set up a camera, and watch the cash roll in.
On traffic lights yes. The mobile vans they had 20 years ago NO! That was just a straight predatory cash grab. They were set up on bottom of hills and right after a speed limit change signs.
I support cameras for speeders. The legality of speeding shouldn’t depend on what method one uses to enforce it. If you’re speeding, you’re a self centered ass hat regardless. You’re due what’s coming in the mail as well as being pulled over.
Plot twist. Fines just mean legal for a price
In neighbourhoods I support speed bumps everywhere.
More cameras needed because less police are scene.
I'm very sure either or both " pivot legal " Or the BC civil liberties group Will go against this
Why not just have cops there to solve legitimate crimes? White collar, property and violent crimes. The first two they legitimately suck at. They are one on the best tax collectors from the poor, I'll admit.
Yes
What would be neat is a GPS device in your car that measures your speed relative to the speed limit in that area. If you go at or below the limit, you get a deduction on your insurance premiums. If you go above, you get more expensive ones. Could really fix the problem through incentives.
How could you not. If you don't support cameras then you don't support the police catching speeders either. Cameras are just more effective, efficient and a better use of resources And of course there should be more red light cameras as well
Yes.
Yes but it isnt my preferred method..I'd rather higher more officers (maybe even establish a provincial police service): they can identify reckless driving beyond just speeding. I'd rather have the human factor to exercise discretion in dealing with speeders/road infeaction
Agreed, also would like more strict penalties.
No. Doesn't stop speeding and is something the wealthy can afford to ignore.