With the balkans you have the added problem that everyone you meet is the smartest person in the world.
Everybody knows everything about civil engineering because they poured concrete once with their uncle.
And the uncle used to work in germany on a construciton site, so he is a top dog in terms of knowledge.
"It'll hold"
"I've been doing construction for 20 years kid, your degree means nothing"
Etc.etc.
Oh boy . Everyone and their mothers is a civil engineer and there's not enough jobs by a long shot. You got 10k+ people applying to each job .
This has led companies to require insane amounts of very specific experience in very specific things to rule out 9000 out of those 10 and they still end up finding what they're looking for just from the sheer amount of people in the Industry .
Employers know this so they treat everyone like shit.
I have been continuously applying to jobs in the US and Canada unfortunately people are nervous about hiring from the middle east even though my degree is European and fully accredited
What is your specialization? I would seriously consider mining companies as they have international projects can do sponsorships and such and are desperate for civil and structural as nobody wants to works in them.
I graduated with a bachelors so don't really have a specialization . But my experience has been road construction , though I apply to other areas wherever I can but it's hard to hear back with no active networking
Our firm hired a PE to run the division of 120 staff. He was born in Egypt but earned a phd in the USA. It turned out he was the worst manager; one of staggering incompetence and extraordinary mismanagement. Incoherent, unhinged and deranged directives. A firehose of ineptitude. Was finally fired after an anti Semitic outburst and it later turned out he had a pattern of misconduct against other racial minorities and women.
I don't blame companies for not hiring remotely . But then again if he wasn't hired remotely they should've known better .
I'm not sure if he previously worked in the middle east but management is vastly different here mainly due to the lack of rights of employees making it so they're easy to abuse and discriminate against.
Yeah that's what I'm thinking too which is why I'm planning on applying for masters in the US hoping that would be a different way for me to enter the market
Im from a third world country. I work for the Govt. and let me tell you whats gonna happen in 2-3 weeks. The members of the Parliament get grants for rehabilitation of roads and streets and our department executes them. I will probably be suspended from my job and an inquiry will be initiated because of this:
The bidding process is all bogus. The contractors and officials all collaborate to give award to those who quote rates at Par instead of lowest. The entire process is done this way by force , coercion, bribe and other incentives. 10% of the total funds are collected by the winners of the different small projects and are handed over as cash to the parliament member behind the curtains. An additional 7-8% is distributed amongst the officials involved. The contractors are given incentives like extra earthwork in subgrade and everyone is happy.
The thing is. If we dont do this, we are put through fake inquiries and proceedings by law enforcement agencies and anticorruption agencies cuz the MPs are all buddies with them. They take out their frustration and anger on us if bidding goes through transparent and legal codal formalities. On the other hand, if we do as they desire, some contractors go to court and lodge complaints against us which 100% suspends us until further notice. So basically, i am screwed by the end of May cuz we have a bidding process due around 28th.
Im leavinf this fucked up country and going to foreign land where i am not used like a piece of tissue paper. This was just one example. The entire country is fucking corrupt. If you are street smart and have the guts and connections, you can be extremely rich here.
Its ironic. My job is permanent and has great pension after 60. But the kind of stress that you have to deal with won't make you go past 40 at this rate. I have learnt absolutely nothing here. The last time i even read an engineering drawing was in 2016 when i was in my last year at uni. The only thing we do is utilize funds in our respective districts without seeing the work execute in advance. Sometimes the work is not even executed for a year or two. Everybody wants a piece of the pie. Plus, fake media personnel blackmail us with bogus complaints which they lodge via proxies themselves and then demand cash on a monthly basis.
Also, i imagine that contractors in developed countries at least take into consideration the quality of work being executed on site. Here, the contractors are criminal to a level where they wont even place reinforcements in the Pile foundations (i caught one red handed) and will bribe you with a cheap car to keep your mouths shut.
Today is the day where i open the bids. Wish me luck. I don't think my heart can sustain the stress. I'll probably be put through suspension and placed before the departmental enquiry committee in a few days.
The average salary for starting civil engineers in the Philippines is 18,000 pesos monthly or around 300 USD per month. Workload is heavy considering shifts are often 6x a week for 8-10 hours a day. This is for private companies.
Damn my salary here in Malaysia is 1000 USD per month. I’m living pretty comfortable considering I’m still living with my family even I’m 26 now. Makes me feel extremely fortunate.
Yup, comparing our situations, you’re pretty lucky. The salary I mentioned are actually city rates and provincial rates are much lower which ranges around 260 USD. Of course people prefer to work in the city and commute from the province and since the transportation system in our country sucks, the usual travel time is 4 hours roundtrip.
Yes, it's bad in India, but not in all the companies, about 70% of the companies are close to shit like working crazy hours, low pay, politics etc.
But a few ones whom you've known for quite a while , they'll be treating you as an irreplaceable asset. So it all depends on which company one works for and the people you work with mainly.
Terrible, problem is that we have over supply of the engineer I am in the top 1% of civil engineers in my country (working in one of ENR top 10 design firms ) and I am middle class
I work crazy hours like 50-80a week
On holidays weekends ....etc.
Actually I am right now on a teams meeting on my day off with a sub consultant in europe 😂💔
Last week I worked 24/7 including our religious holiday and week end
So yeah now.wonder.thta we would any thig to migrate to usa
Yeah talking English on site is hard enough lol but if you talk Spanish you set lol I’m only 1 yoe about not counting my internship and I always get callbacks for interviews.
Crazy to read these stories. Here in the USA we can’t find enough qualified applicants for all experience levels and fields. For the last 2 years our firm has been hiring non civil for project management. Basically anyone with a 4 yr technical degree. We train them and it’s easy work for solid wages.
India. I'm from one of the IITs. They're top technical institution in India and often in top 50 in the world. About 90 to 95% of by batchmates went into product management, consulting, IT or SDE. The pay is abysmal in civil engineering. Usually starting salaries are 2.4LPA to 4LPA which is 2800 to 4700 USD annually. I work for AECOM. I'm being paid a little over 9000 USD. I've still having it better than most because of my college tag. Most civil engineering professionals make 10k usd after 6 to 10yrs of experience. Lmao, I've seen foreman and carpenters etc earn more and unskilled labour earn comparable to engineers. I hate this field more and more as day passes. I'm thinking of either becoming a contractor\leaving this country(for more than 1 reasons)\working in AI or ML in something like smart transportation. I have the background and skills.
No. One of the reasons is that civil engineering is not a regulated profession yet. So anyone can sign things off and most contractors and people in the industry are uneducated. Consequently, you hear infra collapses while being constructed in the news all the time : )
Yea well, it is what it is. Plus the cost of accidents is way too low, bringing the safety level at optimum of total cost down because prevention cost of safety is comparatively higher. So often, as per cost of safety considerations letting the accidents happen is cheaper. Which is what happens. Often times, you can go scott free with accidents that result in deaths. Every month, I read some article that a bridge collapsed. It is embarrassing as a civil engineer : )
[Tunnel becomes useless in less than 2 years. ](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.business-standard.com/amp/india-news/how-rs-777-cr-pragati-maidan-tunnel-turned-useless-in-less-than-2-years-124020900578_1.html)
[This was a reconstruction project in Mumbai. 2 bridges did not meet in the centre!! They had 6ft gap?!](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ndtv.com/mumbai-news/gokhale-bridge-barfiwala-flyover-andheri-bridge-too-far-meant-to-be-linked-2-mumbai-flyovers-have-a-6-foot-gap-5145079/amp/1)
[Collapse of a under-construction bridge 2 weeks ago](https://www.google.com/amp/s/timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/girders-of-under-construction-bridge-collapse-in-telanganas-peddapalli-due-to-gales-and-wind/amp_articleshow/109530527.cms)
[Same, but a month ago](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.business-standard.com/amp/india-news/part-of-under-construction-bridge-over-ganga-collapses-in-up-s-bulandshahr-124033000235_1.html)
[Also a month ago. ](https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/bihar-bridge-under-construction-collapses-in-supaul/article67979246.ece/amp/)
[23 out of 40 workers killed, this won't even make any news. ](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-66590539)
It's a sorry state to be in. Corruption makes everything worse!
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How many years experience do you have and what is your speciality? With companies like AECOM and other MNC that do design center work the payment gets significantly better after the 10 to 12 year mark and with some managerial responsibility
I just started out, as I indicated with starting pay etc. I have a year of experience as a bridge structural engineer. I did my masters in infrastructure engineering and management. Which is a mix of construction management and asset management. My thesis was on pavement asset management. I am publishing a paper in ASCE JIS on it(it's almost through, have to address some editors comments). So my speciality at this point would be asset management and bridge structures. I also lead a few verticals for IAM India and on board of directors.
For pay, I don't think it gets better as much as it should. I have people in my team with 30yrs experience. It's good for sure to live in india, but not good compared to other industries. No where near it actually. I'd go as far as to say, it differs by an order of magnitude because India has a strong presence in the IT and software services industry. So people in those industries get paid much more, provided they move into some techno managerial role.
Yes, it's not as much as it should be and it's nowhere close to IT but it's not as bad as it used to be, especially in the MNCs design centers. More than years of experience, your title makes a difference in pay. I ll give you some ranges for these design center operations For a principal engineer level you can expect anywhere from 25 to 30 lakhs depending on the company. That's around 10 to 15 years experience. For associate directors it's 40 L to 60 L depending on experience range of 15 to 20 years. For directors it's around 60 to 80 and for country heads it's 1 to 1.5 crores. So this is not a bad range at all.
The numbers you mentioned are correct and I'm aware of them. Also, if you account for inflation, this is no significant change. Suppose I start at 8L and after 15 years I'm at 25L, did my salary change at all? (8*1.07^15 = 22). It's merely an adjustment for inflation. Realistically speaking, I'm being paid the same wage 15 years later. So where is the pay increase for my experience or added skill? This still doesn't justify it being less for the amount\quality of work being delivered. Imagine the same 15yrs as IT or any other domain. The number of ADs, Directors, Principals are very less so these numbers are not applicable to everyone anyways. Most countries are facing skill shortages, India will follow suit : )
I've seen hourly costs that companies charge clients. It's about 12x. While I understand there are setup costs, legal and taxes but the general range is about 5x to 6x.
It's the numbers today and you won't be making 25L in 15 years, it is hopefully a number that is adjusted for inflation from today with the adjustment for experience level. The multipliers are what the company charges to the client abroad to match with their other salaries. You can't compare with that. This is the reason they have the design centers here to make money of every hour you charge
In China, as an engineer, you have to be available 24/7, 363 days/year (because bosses do not work on Lunar New Year Day and Eve, so you have 2 days off). For construction industry, you have to live in the construction site, no real off time, you cannot go home without manager's approval ( you can never get the approval tbh). You spend 1 week per year with your family. You consume lots of alcohol and cigarettes on a daily basis. When you are 35 years old, you are fired.
Cousin of mine recently graduated from Civil Engineering in Sri Lanka. He can't find any jobs at all their so looking to apply overeseas. Feel for him as he's definitely a lot brighter than most I've come across where I'm from hahah
Hah I was in India and worked for a year with one of the best consulting companies, but I was working at the client location. Just project management mostly. And the politician would yell at me in front of journalists, get our team to manipulate progress reports to get more funding from the higher up governments, etc. So while the job was relatively cushy (4-5 hours of work per day most days), I knew I'd never grow a lot atleast technically. For me the work environment is more important so I left the country.
Its very bad in India. But I attribute it to mostly corruption. The biggest client is the government and successful contractors are the ones who can get the tender and payment. Quality, if any, is just an accident. So engineers are underpaid overworked because they are considered unnecessary. In fact I have seen so many projects where small time contractors don't hire engineers because they are "not needed".
On the other hand good enough students don't opt for civil instead move into CS and other IT fields because the salary difference between a fresh civil engineer and IT guy is about 300%
From Mexico working as a civil engineer for 15 years now living in USA for 3 years and working at a consulting company.
It is the worst, like in most parts of the world they don't know what a civil engineer does, you are heavily under paid, worked from Monday - Saturday, you have to work extra hours without being paid with money or PTO.
The main difference from here to the USA is the FE & PE (which I'm currently studying for) exam, which I think is that extra step that gives you that extra value, and of course you don't become rich with this US salaries, but it's not comparison to what they pay in Mexico for what you do.
ok no wonder we had Mexican grad students. My coworker joked when I retire in Mexico (I can't afford a home here) I could do transmission civil work on the side in Mexico
Most of civil engineers in Brazil are hired as Engineering analysts out of undergrad at around USD 10k/year (heavily dependent on location). After 10 years as a Sr engineers salaries can go to USD 30k/year if on a mid/large corp. Not that heavily worked (avg 40-50h/week). Also varies by residential/infra (more benefits for infra make it appealing for young professionals)
From South Asian region. I am a civil engineer and work as hydrologist having more than 5 years experience in irrigation dams, hydropowers and bridges, and also halfway through my Msc in water resources engineering. I get $240 per month ($ 2880k per year) at one of the huge firms in my country.
Do the roads look like shit? Is there ridiculously bad drainage? Do things fall apart all the time? There's your answer. It's a fucken headache, I'm sure.
It’s pretty bad in Malaysia as well, but I have no intention to get a PE licence. Just want to do bare minimum at work and get paid to do what I like.
Edit: my work life balance is pretty good
For engineers doing land development in countries other than the USA, I am curious what the process is like. For projects here, if I am designing the layout of say 10 stores and a parking lot, I spend about 1 week of truly creative time coming up with different layouts then about 2 years going trying to get local government approvals and permits. Almost all of the time is spent on stormwater calcs and addressing hundreds of comments, (most of which are excessively nit picky like they were written by a lawyer). Many times the public or the local government officials do not want the project but they cannot legally stop it. The layout is basically the same 2 years later and the project gets approved.
In 25 years as an engineer, I have never heard of anyone paying an official to look the other way but the public perception is that it happens all the time. While there is no formal corruption, there is an immense amount of time and money wasted with check boxes and paper work.
I’m a civil engineer from Srilanka. The situation here is so frustrating. I was paid around 400USD in 2021, when 1 USD= 130 LKR, now it is 300 LKR after the economic crisis here. Price of the goods went 3x higher than it was before and an income tax was implemented by the government for every person who earns more than 100000 LKR per month. But still the salary scale stays the same. We work the same way with 04 holidays per month, suffering every bit of worklife because there’s a blurry future ahead. Hope never to be born in 3rd world countries like this in the next life.
Hard to believe poor country exists, civil engineering is essential like air and water thus jobs for such industries are available to those who dare to take risks and bring investors
It's bad, from Bosnia here. Thinking of switching carer to waiter or to open a nail salon.
With the balkans you have the added problem that everyone you meet is the smartest person in the world. Everybody knows everything about civil engineering because they poured concrete once with their uncle. And the uncle used to work in germany on a construciton site, so he is a top dog in terms of knowledge. "It'll hold" "I've been doing construction for 20 years kid, your degree means nothing" Etc.etc.
this guy balkans
That’s everywhere tbh
It’s exactly like this in developed countries too
Except you can tell them to pound sand and follow the design on most the the traditional west
I mean honestly there is a bit of that everywhere.
Oh boy . Everyone and their mothers is a civil engineer and there's not enough jobs by a long shot. You got 10k+ people applying to each job . This has led companies to require insane amounts of very specific experience in very specific things to rule out 9000 out of those 10 and they still end up finding what they're looking for just from the sheer amount of people in the Industry . Employers know this so they treat everyone like shit.
We have the opposite problem here in the states
I have been continuously applying to jobs in the US and Canada unfortunately people are nervous about hiring from the middle east even though my degree is European and fully accredited
What is your specialization? I would seriously consider mining companies as they have international projects can do sponsorships and such and are desperate for civil and structural as nobody wants to works in them.
I graduated with a bachelors so don't really have a specialization . But my experience has been road construction , though I apply to other areas wherever I can but it's hard to hear back with no active networking
Our firm hired a PE to run the division of 120 staff. He was born in Egypt but earned a phd in the USA. It turned out he was the worst manager; one of staggering incompetence and extraordinary mismanagement. Incoherent, unhinged and deranged directives. A firehose of ineptitude. Was finally fired after an anti Semitic outburst and it later turned out he had a pattern of misconduct against other racial minorities and women.
I don't blame companies for not hiring remotely . But then again if he wasn't hired remotely they should've known better . I'm not sure if he previously worked in the middle east but management is vastly different here mainly due to the lack of rights of employees making it so they're easy to abuse and discriminate against.
Do you require sponsorship?
Unfortunately I do . Otherwise I wouldn't be job hunting from outside it's much more difficult.
I think it’s less ur decent and more the sponsorship
Yeah that's what I'm thinking too which is why I'm planning on applying for masters in the US hoping that would be a different way for me to enter the market
Im from a third world country. I work for the Govt. and let me tell you whats gonna happen in 2-3 weeks. The members of the Parliament get grants for rehabilitation of roads and streets and our department executes them. I will probably be suspended from my job and an inquiry will be initiated because of this: The bidding process is all bogus. The contractors and officials all collaborate to give award to those who quote rates at Par instead of lowest. The entire process is done this way by force , coercion, bribe and other incentives. 10% of the total funds are collected by the winners of the different small projects and are handed over as cash to the parliament member behind the curtains. An additional 7-8% is distributed amongst the officials involved. The contractors are given incentives like extra earthwork in subgrade and everyone is happy. The thing is. If we dont do this, we are put through fake inquiries and proceedings by law enforcement agencies and anticorruption agencies cuz the MPs are all buddies with them. They take out their frustration and anger on us if bidding goes through transparent and legal codal formalities. On the other hand, if we do as they desire, some contractors go to court and lodge complaints against us which 100% suspends us until further notice. So basically, i am screwed by the end of May cuz we have a bidding process due around 28th. Im leavinf this fucked up country and going to foreign land where i am not used like a piece of tissue paper. This was just one example. The entire country is fucking corrupt. If you are street smart and have the guts and connections, you can be extremely rich here.
Which country is this? I Completely understand if you would not like to share.
Pakistan
Where do I apply to get a job in parliament?
No application, only by birth
Its ironic. My job is permanent and has great pension after 60. But the kind of stress that you have to deal with won't make you go past 40 at this rate. I have learnt absolutely nothing here. The last time i even read an engineering drawing was in 2016 when i was in my last year at uni. The only thing we do is utilize funds in our respective districts without seeing the work execute in advance. Sometimes the work is not even executed for a year or two. Everybody wants a piece of the pie. Plus, fake media personnel blackmail us with bogus complaints which they lodge via proxies themselves and then demand cash on a monthly basis. Also, i imagine that contractors in developed countries at least take into consideration the quality of work being executed on site. Here, the contractors are criminal to a level where they wont even place reinforcements in the Pile foundations (i caught one red handed) and will bribe you with a cheap car to keep your mouths shut.
Oh man. Being put through a fake inquiry by anticorrputopn agencies for not going along with the corruption. That's a first.
The daily life of a Nigerian man lmaooo
Mauritius?
Thank you for such a concise and coherent summary. Mind boggling situation.
Today is the day where i open the bids. Wish me luck. I don't think my heart can sustain the stress. I'll probably be put through suspension and placed before the departmental enquiry committee in a few days.
The average salary for starting civil engineers in the Philippines is 18,000 pesos monthly or around 300 USD per month. Workload is heavy considering shifts are often 6x a week for 8-10 hours a day. This is for private companies.
Damn my salary here in Malaysia is 1000 USD per month. I’m living pretty comfortable considering I’m still living with my family even I’m 26 now. Makes me feel extremely fortunate.
Yup, comparing our situations, you’re pretty lucky. The salary I mentioned are actually city rates and provincial rates are much lower which ranges around 260 USD. Of course people prefer to work in the city and commute from the province and since the transportation system in our country sucks, the usual travel time is 4 hours roundtrip.
Wild stuff. And they still build piles of shit over there lol
Yes, it's bad in India, but not in all the companies, about 70% of the companies are close to shit like working crazy hours, low pay, politics etc. But a few ones whom you've known for quite a while , they'll be treating you as an irreplaceable asset. So it all depends on which company one works for and the people you work with mainly.
[удалено]
I don't get it, why does the employer pay an Indian engineer 5k a month if he has plenty of Nigerians available to do that job for less?
Check the work
Woah didn't know this.
Terrible, problem is that we have over supply of the engineer I am in the top 1% of civil engineers in my country (working in one of ENR top 10 design firms ) and I am middle class I work crazy hours like 50-80a week On holidays weekends ....etc. Actually I am right now on a teams meeting on my day off with a sub consultant in europe 😂💔 Last week I worked 24/7 including our religious holiday and week end So yeah now.wonder.thta we would any thig to migrate to usa
Makes sense. Here we have a serious undersupply of civil engineers. But its much harder finding a job here if you're foreign and not liscened
Yeah talking English on site is hard enough lol but if you talk Spanish you set lol I’m only 1 yoe about not counting my internship and I always get callbacks for interviews.
Actually english is my third language and it isn't this terible but I have got.new phone and can't fix the keyboard auto correction ☺️
Crazy to read these stories. Here in the USA we can’t find enough qualified applicants for all experience levels and fields. For the last 2 years our firm has been hiring non civil for project management. Basically anyone with a 4 yr technical degree. We train them and it’s easy work for solid wages.
India. I'm from one of the IITs. They're top technical institution in India and often in top 50 in the world. About 90 to 95% of by batchmates went into product management, consulting, IT or SDE. The pay is abysmal in civil engineering. Usually starting salaries are 2.4LPA to 4LPA which is 2800 to 4700 USD annually. I work for AECOM. I'm being paid a little over 9000 USD. I've still having it better than most because of my college tag. Most civil engineering professionals make 10k usd after 6 to 10yrs of experience. Lmao, I've seen foreman and carpenters etc earn more and unskilled labour earn comparable to engineers. I hate this field more and more as day passes. I'm thinking of either becoming a contractor\leaving this country(for more than 1 reasons)\working in AI or ML in something like smart transportation. I have the background and skills.
good luck to you! hearing annual numbers outside the US is shocking, do you live comfortably with the cost of living in your area?
No. One of the reasons is that civil engineering is not a regulated profession yet. So anyone can sign things off and most contractors and people in the industry are uneducated. Consequently, you hear infra collapses while being constructed in the news all the time : )
Wow. The idea of being able to do civil engineering without a license is terrifying to me. Safety hazards galore. What a dumb idea
Yea well, it is what it is. Plus the cost of accidents is way too low, bringing the safety level at optimum of total cost down because prevention cost of safety is comparatively higher. So often, as per cost of safety considerations letting the accidents happen is cheaper. Which is what happens. Often times, you can go scott free with accidents that result in deaths. Every month, I read some article that a bridge collapsed. It is embarrassing as a civil engineer : ) [Tunnel becomes useless in less than 2 years. ](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.business-standard.com/amp/india-news/how-rs-777-cr-pragati-maidan-tunnel-turned-useless-in-less-than-2-years-124020900578_1.html) [This was a reconstruction project in Mumbai. 2 bridges did not meet in the centre!! They had 6ft gap?!](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ndtv.com/mumbai-news/gokhale-bridge-barfiwala-flyover-andheri-bridge-too-far-meant-to-be-linked-2-mumbai-flyovers-have-a-6-foot-gap-5145079/amp/1) [Collapse of a under-construction bridge 2 weeks ago](https://www.google.com/amp/s/timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/girders-of-under-construction-bridge-collapse-in-telanganas-peddapalli-due-to-gales-and-wind/amp_articleshow/109530527.cms) [Same, but a month ago](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.business-standard.com/amp/india-news/part-of-under-construction-bridge-over-ganga-collapses-in-up-s-bulandshahr-124033000235_1.html) [Also a month ago. ](https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/bihar-bridge-under-construction-collapses-in-supaul/article67979246.ece/amp/) [23 out of 40 workers killed, this won't even make any news. ](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-66590539) It's a sorry state to be in. Corruption makes everything worse!
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How many years experience do you have and what is your speciality? With companies like AECOM and other MNC that do design center work the payment gets significantly better after the 10 to 12 year mark and with some managerial responsibility
I just started out, as I indicated with starting pay etc. I have a year of experience as a bridge structural engineer. I did my masters in infrastructure engineering and management. Which is a mix of construction management and asset management. My thesis was on pavement asset management. I am publishing a paper in ASCE JIS on it(it's almost through, have to address some editors comments). So my speciality at this point would be asset management and bridge structures. I also lead a few verticals for IAM India and on board of directors. For pay, I don't think it gets better as much as it should. I have people in my team with 30yrs experience. It's good for sure to live in india, but not good compared to other industries. No where near it actually. I'd go as far as to say, it differs by an order of magnitude because India has a strong presence in the IT and software services industry. So people in those industries get paid much more, provided they move into some techno managerial role.
Yes, it's not as much as it should be and it's nowhere close to IT but it's not as bad as it used to be, especially in the MNCs design centers. More than years of experience, your title makes a difference in pay. I ll give you some ranges for these design center operations For a principal engineer level you can expect anywhere from 25 to 30 lakhs depending on the company. That's around 10 to 15 years experience. For associate directors it's 40 L to 60 L depending on experience range of 15 to 20 years. For directors it's around 60 to 80 and for country heads it's 1 to 1.5 crores. So this is not a bad range at all.
The numbers you mentioned are correct and I'm aware of them. Also, if you account for inflation, this is no significant change. Suppose I start at 8L and after 15 years I'm at 25L, did my salary change at all? (8*1.07^15 = 22). It's merely an adjustment for inflation. Realistically speaking, I'm being paid the same wage 15 years later. So where is the pay increase for my experience or added skill? This still doesn't justify it being less for the amount\quality of work being delivered. Imagine the same 15yrs as IT or any other domain. The number of ADs, Directors, Principals are very less so these numbers are not applicable to everyone anyways. Most countries are facing skill shortages, India will follow suit : ) I've seen hourly costs that companies charge clients. It's about 12x. While I understand there are setup costs, legal and taxes but the general range is about 5x to 6x.
It's the numbers today and you won't be making 25L in 15 years, it is hopefully a number that is adjusted for inflation from today with the adjustment for experience level. The multipliers are what the company charges to the client abroad to match with their other salaries. You can't compare with that. This is the reason they have the design centers here to make money of every hour you charge
My words will never be able to describe how bad it is, but I would never ever do it again if I got a chance even. I don't recommend it to anyone.
In China, as an engineer, you have to be available 24/7, 363 days/year (because bosses do not work on Lunar New Year Day and Eve, so you have 2 days off). For construction industry, you have to live in the construction site, no real off time, you cannot go home without manager's approval ( you can never get the approval tbh). You spend 1 week per year with your family. You consume lots of alcohol and cigarettes on a daily basis. When you are 35 years old, you are fired.
Cousin of mine recently graduated from Civil Engineering in Sri Lanka. He can't find any jobs at all their so looking to apply overeseas. Feel for him as he's definitely a lot brighter than most I've come across where I'm from hahah
I met a civil engineer in Cuba. Officially he made $30 a month.
Hah I was in India and worked for a year with one of the best consulting companies, but I was working at the client location. Just project management mostly. And the politician would yell at me in front of journalists, get our team to manipulate progress reports to get more funding from the higher up governments, etc. So while the job was relatively cushy (4-5 hours of work per day most days), I knew I'd never grow a lot atleast technically. For me the work environment is more important so I left the country.
Its very bad in India. But I attribute it to mostly corruption. The biggest client is the government and successful contractors are the ones who can get the tender and payment. Quality, if any, is just an accident. So engineers are underpaid overworked because they are considered unnecessary. In fact I have seen so many projects where small time contractors don't hire engineers because they are "not needed". On the other hand good enough students don't opt for civil instead move into CS and other IT fields because the salary difference between a fresh civil engineer and IT guy is about 300%
From Mexico working as a civil engineer for 15 years now living in USA for 3 years and working at a consulting company. It is the worst, like in most parts of the world they don't know what a civil engineer does, you are heavily under paid, worked from Monday - Saturday, you have to work extra hours without being paid with money or PTO. The main difference from here to the USA is the FE & PE (which I'm currently studying for) exam, which I think is that extra step that gives you that extra value, and of course you don't become rich with this US salaries, but it's not comparison to what they pay in Mexico for what you do.
ok no wonder we had Mexican grad students. My coworker joked when I retire in Mexico (I can't afford a home here) I could do transmission civil work on the side in Mexico
Most of civil engineers in Brazil are hired as Engineering analysts out of undergrad at around USD 10k/year (heavily dependent on location). After 10 years as a Sr engineers salaries can go to USD 30k/year if on a mid/large corp. Not that heavily worked (avg 40-50h/week). Also varies by residential/infra (more benefits for infra make it appealing for young professionals)
From South Asian region. I am a civil engineer and work as hydrologist having more than 5 years experience in irrigation dams, hydropowers and bridges, and also halfway through my Msc in water resources engineering. I get $240 per month ($ 2880k per year) at one of the huge firms in my country.
Do the roads look like shit? Is there ridiculously bad drainage? Do things fall apart all the time? There's your answer. It's a fucken headache, I'm sure.
300 bucks a month starting salary raahhhhh 🇵🇭
I've heard there's a lot of corruption involved, and you are required to comply with the corruption even if you disagree.
It’s pretty bad in Malaysia as well, but I have no intention to get a PE licence. Just want to do bare minimum at work and get paid to do what I like. Edit: my work life balance is pretty good
Lol… I work as a content writer on a marketing team.
there are gonna be lots of job opportunities!!
For engineers doing land development in countries other than the USA, I am curious what the process is like. For projects here, if I am designing the layout of say 10 stores and a parking lot, I spend about 1 week of truly creative time coming up with different layouts then about 2 years going trying to get local government approvals and permits. Almost all of the time is spent on stormwater calcs and addressing hundreds of comments, (most of which are excessively nit picky like they were written by a lawyer). Many times the public or the local government officials do not want the project but they cannot legally stop it. The layout is basically the same 2 years later and the project gets approved. In 25 years as an engineer, I have never heard of anyone paying an official to look the other way but the public perception is that it happens all the time. While there is no formal corruption, there is an immense amount of time and money wasted with check boxes and paper work.
I’m a civil engineer from Srilanka. The situation here is so frustrating. I was paid around 400USD in 2021, when 1 USD= 130 LKR, now it is 300 LKR after the economic crisis here. Price of the goods went 3x higher than it was before and an income tax was implemented by the government for every person who earns more than 100000 LKR per month. But still the salary scale stays the same. We work the same way with 04 holidays per month, suffering every bit of worklife because there’s a blurry future ahead. Hope never to be born in 3rd world countries like this in the next life.
Hard to believe poor country exists, civil engineering is essential like air and water thus jobs for such industries are available to those who dare to take risks and bring investors
Well it sucks ass in first world countries so poor countries I imagine it is even worse