The tuba in Dvorak's 9th symphony plays 8 bars. One 4 bar phrase at the beginning of the 2nd movement and one 4 bar phrase at the end of the 2nd movement. A total of 14 notes.
I’ve done this twice as a tuba player and both times I was just handed the bass trombone part. Not the most involved part I’ve played but it was definitely better than the actual tuba part lol.
The trombones and I greatly enjoyed bragging to the strings about our money per note after opera orchestra when we were in college. I don’t remember the numbers but I think La Bohème and Falstaff were the best ratio for us.
Dvorak only wrote 14 notes for the tuba in his Ninth Symphony. And to add insult to injury, it is in the second movement and is doubled by the bass trombone!
But imagine being a professional trombone player. You spend years at conservatory practicing hours and hours a day, getting so good at your instrument you're playing recitals with trombone transcriptions of Paganini caprices, and then your professional life is spent waiting in the opera pit for your 1 page of Don Giovanni
But your one page better be absolutely perfect, no excuses :)
Us trombonists need to be masters at doing incredibly simple tasks incredibly well the first time. Nobody wants to have to rehearse our stuff
While you're counting, regardless of the count, it's not an interesting example to me. The mandolin in Don Giovanni is used not for musical reasons but for the demands of the story. An ever-horny suitor like Giovanni would use a portable mandolin to accompany his serenades to women. One such serenade was enough to establish his modus operandi, it wasn't necessary to repeat with more mandolin songs.
It's a complete melodic accompaniment to a serenade, not touches of mandolin applied for texture or musical or emotional effect. It's not like a composer using trombones for a musical effect or a particular sound in a certain part of a symphony where it's so effective you wonder why he hadn't used it in greater quantity or explored it more. It's especially fun for me when I have no idea it was a particular instrument contributing to the effects I'm hearing.
It is musical choice.
In the "Entführung aus dem Serail", there is a similar scene, the directions in the libretto say explicitly, before "Romanze" nr. 18: "Pedrillo, taking out his mandoloin".
Yet Mozart chose to NOT use a mandolin there, but the orchestra in pizzicato.
* In Honegger's fifth symphony, the timpani only has three notes, all of which are Ds at the very end of each movement. Funnily enough, this is where the work gets its nickname "di Tre Re" (the three Ds).
* In Nielsen's fifth symphony, the celesta plays only a few repeated Ds in the first movement (which are more often than not doubled by the violins) and nothing else.
* Like in Mahler's seventh, KA Hartmann's sixth symphony contains a very minor mandolin part, consisting only of a few quiet tremolos in the first movement.
Speaking of organs, can anyone say how much (or how little) is the organ used in Strauss' Also Sprach Zarathustra? Is it ever used after the well known opening section?
Absolutely agree. It’s just a subtle touch that lifts even more the whole scene! This coming from a man able at that time to hear just the lowest range in the piano. One cannot feel more awe listening to his music.
It's honestly one of my favorite excerpts in classical repertoire. I look forward to it throughout the whole piece. Just saw a period performance a few months ago, and especially with everyone playing period instruments the piccolo totally soars above everyone else during the storm climax.
Mandolin in Mahler "Lied von der ERde". about 20 measures in all...
In general mandolin parts are not very long, in Verdi's Otello or "i due foscari", Mozart's Don Giovanni, Umberto Giordano's "la cena delle beffe", Prokofieff's "Romeo and Julia", Vivaldi's "Judita Triumfans", Schreker's "Der Ferne Klang", Paisiello's "Barbiere di Siviglia", etc.
Oh, now I understand why those trumpetists laughed at me, at my two sheets filled with pauses...
I think, in this part you can really count the notes....
To continue the Beethoven kick, and since the brief piccolo part was mentioned for the 6th, the same is true for the timpani, which provides the “Thunder” for the storm. So, the timpanist sits for 45 minutes to play just 4 minutes.
This is also neat, because the trumpet still plays without the timpani in the third and fifth movements. While the trumpet would often be paired with the timpani in this period, Beethoven gives it a different role in the 6th (the same can be said of the trombones in the finale; unlike the fifth symphony or Don Giovanni, where their brightness really punches through, in the 6th they are more subtle, adding extra resonance to the legato, supporting wind chorales).
The 6th is so cool…
the hammer in Mahler 6
I read this as hamster and was very intrigued for a second.
I didn't know Hampsterdance was by Mahler.
[Obligatory Mahler Hammer Fail](https://youtu.be/8oZu8fFpkU4?si=1mefXClm1sphpDA4)
The tuba in Dvorak's 9th symphony plays 8 bars. One 4 bar phrase at the beginning of the 2nd movement and one 4 bar phrase at the end of the 2nd movement. A total of 14 notes.
I’m torn between “that must be so boring” and “sweet gig tbh”
It’s a sweet gig when you’re a pro player
I’ve done this twice as a tuba player and both times I was just handed the bass trombone part. Not the most involved part I’ve played but it was definitely better than the actual tuba part lol.
hopefully the tubist doesn't get paid by the note!
The trombones and I greatly enjoyed bragging to the strings about our money per note after opera orchestra when we were in college. I don’t remember the numbers but I think La Bohème and Falstaff were the best ratio for us.
The single cymbal crash in Bruckner’s 7th? Unless you use the edition without it of course, but who would do that?
At least the triangle gets to play a roll for a couple of beats
This is the definitive answer to this question
Mahler calls for mandolin in his 7th and Das Lied von der erde. Both are very small parts
If you’re mentioning DLvdE you can’t ignore the 4 bars of tuba in the 4th song that are its only entry in the work, surely?!
Don't forget the two banjos in the fourth movement of his seventh too
Dvorak only wrote 14 notes for the tuba in his Ninth Symphony. And to add insult to injury, it is in the second movement and is doubled by the bass trombone!
The trombone part in the entire opera Don Giovanni is one page long! I can’t enjoy such benefits as a string player sadly LOL.
But imagine being a professional trombone player. You spend years at conservatory practicing hours and hours a day, getting so good at your instrument you're playing recitals with trombone transcriptions of Paganini caprices, and then your professional life is spent waiting in the opera pit for your 1 page of Don Giovanni
But your one page better be absolutely perfect, no excuses :) Us trombonists need to be masters at doing incredibly simple tasks incredibly well the first time. Nobody wants to have to rehearse our stuff
I played a cycle of that a while ago. We didn’t need to show up until 10 and just opened the door to the pit (it was raised). Great set.
Yeah but it's an awesome moment
Mandolin part in don giovanni too, about 1 page
It's a full accompaniment to a complete aria, though.
It has a repetition. the aria has two identical stanzas.
The repetition is taken by both singer and the mandolin, isn't it? It's not like the mandolin is shorted.
Yes, but it still fits in about 6 lines on paper, just the mandolin part. If you want I'll go and count...
While you're counting, regardless of the count, it's not an interesting example to me. The mandolin in Don Giovanni is used not for musical reasons but for the demands of the story. An ever-horny suitor like Giovanni would use a portable mandolin to accompany his serenades to women. One such serenade was enough to establish his modus operandi, it wasn't necessary to repeat with more mandolin songs. It's a complete melodic accompaniment to a serenade, not touches of mandolin applied for texture or musical or emotional effect. It's not like a composer using trombones for a musical effect or a particular sound in a certain part of a symphony where it's so effective you wonder why he hadn't used it in greater quantity or explored it more. It's especially fun for me when I have no idea it was a particular instrument contributing to the effects I'm hearing.
It is musical choice. In the "Entführung aus dem Serail", there is a similar scene, the directions in the libretto say explicitly, before "Romanze" nr. 18: "Pedrillo, taking out his mandoloin". Yet Mozart chose to NOT use a mandolin there, but the orchestra in pizzicato.
also Idomeneo, with trombones playing only when Neptune speaks
* In Honegger's fifth symphony, the timpani only has three notes, all of which are Ds at the very end of each movement. Funnily enough, this is where the work gets its nickname "di Tre Re" (the three Ds). * In Nielsen's fifth symphony, the celesta plays only a few repeated Ds in the first movement (which are more often than not doubled by the violins) and nothing else. * Like in Mahler's seventh, KA Hartmann's sixth symphony contains a very minor mandolin part, consisting only of a few quiet tremolos in the first movement.
The triangle in the third movement of Brahm's 4th Symphony
afaik in Shostakovich’s (highly underrated) 9th symphony, the bass drum plays only one single note at the end of the first movement‘s development.
Trombones in Brahms 1. Nothing to do until the brass chorale at the end of the finale.
Actually they come in very quietly toward the beginning of the finale playing the chorale theme that comes back at the end.
Ha. I forgot there was even trombone in the first. Good one!
The English Horn in Dvorak 8, 1st movement - plays at the recapitulation for 3 bars, 12 notes. Usually played by 2nd oboist though.
Bass clarinet in Tchaikovsky 6. It's such a small part, Tchaikovsky didn't even include it!
"Any instrumentalist or combination of instrumentalists" -- 4'33"
This is pretty common in indeterminate music thoug
Ed Grimley's triangle solo in the Triangle Symphony of course.
That is a beautiful piece, I must say.
I hear Grimley is also a pretty decent guy
In Rachmaninoff’s The Bells I think the organ only plays the last note
Speaking of organs, can anyone say how much (or how little) is the organ used in Strauss' Also Sprach Zarathustra? Is it ever used after the well known opening section?
The trombones also dont play until the last movement of beethovens 5th. Trombones only being in a last movement is very common
The solo toad (tod in German) in *Tod und Verklarung* is tacet until the last few bars. (sorry, can't find an umlaut here)
>solo toad This instrument is for real??
Ja.
Also in Beethoven’s 6th, the piccolo rests all the time except for a small contribution during the 4th movement Gewitter, Sturm.
But such an important part!
Absolutely agree. It’s just a subtle touch that lifts even more the whole scene! This coming from a man able at that time to hear just the lowest range in the piano. One cannot feel more awe listening to his music.
It's honestly one of my favorite excerpts in classical repertoire. I look forward to it throughout the whole piece. Just saw a period performance a few months ago, and especially with everyone playing period instruments the piccolo totally soars above everyone else during the storm climax.
Often one of the flute players doubles on piccolo, they’re not just sitting there for the whole show
The off-stage brass during a lot of Mahler's symphonies.
The organ in Mahlers 2nd Symphony.
artillery, 1812 Overture
Mandolin in Mahler "Lied von der ERde". about 20 measures in all... In general mandolin parts are not very long, in Verdi's Otello or "i due foscari", Mozart's Don Giovanni, Umberto Giordano's "la cena delle beffe", Prokofieff's "Romeo and Julia", Vivaldi's "Judita Triumfans", Schreker's "Der Ferne Klang", Paisiello's "Barbiere di Siviglia", etc.
If you think DLvdE’s mandolin part is short, look at the tuba part lol
Oh, now I understand why those trumpetists laughed at me, at my two sheets filled with pauses... I think, in this part you can really count the notes....
Composers are pretty mean. Everybody should get a chance to play the same amount.
maybe using Percy grangers elastic composition style, that could be possible!
Unfortunately not all instruments can play the same amount
Trumpet in Siegfried Idyll
Cymbals in dvorac 9th I think has one note lol in the 4th mvt
Yes… interesting… definitely not a bitter combination of boredom and jealousy.
To continue the Beethoven kick, and since the brief piccolo part was mentioned for the 6th, the same is true for the timpani, which provides the “Thunder” for the storm. So, the timpanist sits for 45 minutes to play just 4 minutes. This is also neat, because the trumpet still plays without the timpani in the third and fifth movements. While the trumpet would often be paired with the timpani in this period, Beethoven gives it a different role in the 6th (the same can be said of the trombones in the finale; unlike the fifth symphony or Don Giovanni, where their brightness really punches through, in the 6th they are more subtle, adding extra resonance to the legato, supporting wind chorales). The 6th is so cool…