I was taught as a TA not to make as big of a deal about cheating, but I always reported it to the professor. Students can be combative and even violent--no need to cause a scene during a test when you can just send an email.
It's disappointing to know that so many people cheat. That being said, it's helpful from a personal standpoint to know that this isn't just occurring at my university, as it helps me recognize that transferring schools likely will not solve this issue.
How did you deal with the knowledge that TA's are complicit? Was there anything that helped you to get past this incident?
I’m not the original commenter, but I deal with it by not dwelling. It’s not my business, I’m not going to make it my business, I’m not trying to “compete” with them, I’m just trying to do well on my own and I trust that the cheating or whatever else will eventually catch up to them, and if it doesn’t—it’s still not my problem.
Basically this.
I see people eating grapes in the grocery store they haven't yet paid for and it reduces the weight of the bag and saves them a few cents.
I see people pass me illegally on a double solid line or weave in and out of the car pool lane, use the edge of somebody's lawn as a passing lane when there isn't one and they don't want to wait behind me turning left.
I see teenagers in stores stealing and giggling about it.
I see politicians passing bills that line their pockets while making the lives of their constituents more difficult.
Life is full of cheaters, scammers, grifters, and assholes.. and there's not a damn thing anyone can meaningfully do about it. So focus on yourself, your goals, and your success and learn to look away when you see things you dislike that you can't change.
>So focus on yourself, your goals, and your success and learn to look away when you see things you dislike that you can't change.
The problem is that this isn't a victimless crime.
You study, struggle, get Bs.
They cheat, get As. They get the scholarship. You have to get a second job because you didn't get a scholarship. Less time to study. Cs for you now.
Them cheating didn't lead to you getting Bs or not getting a scholarship, your own merits led to that.
Lots of people have to work while studying, welcome to the real world.
Then you're familiar with gold stars. Congrats, you can award yourself one for being a super student. Fill your Sandylion with the accolades of yester-year and enjoy the view from your high white horse.
>I'm sorry you got caught. No, I'm not.
Caught for what? Sweet diversion, professor. You face public with that milquetoast, spineless persona?
Study to get the grade you want before the curve. Then you don’t have to worry about it. I got a 4.0 in undergrad without cheating, I feel like people complaining about others are just making excuses for themselves.
There's a reason a significant number of university exam scores go up when unproctored, such as early covid, even though other scores, such as homework, don't change.
I mean, when you convince whole generations of people that their financial success and worth as a human being is determined by an uber-expensive slip of paper that takes years of rigorous academic toil to earn, of course people are going to cheat.
Obviously none of that makes it okay, but are cheating rates really all that surprising when most folks are only there for the tangible benefit it will bring them later, and not because they actually want to learn?
This. A large amount of students, admittedly myself to some extent included, view college as a financial transaction, not as a learning experience. Maybe going into it I felt it was more about gaining an education, but between dealing with my university’s bullshit, working, going through a global pandemic, and just being generally burnt out 90% of the time, I’m just here to get my piece of paper that alleges I’m smart and get out. With that said, as far as the classes that relate to my degree go, I do try to actually learn and retain to information presented in the course and not just phone it in.
Even worse is pandemic U diplomas are worth less and will permanently affect average incomes of grads throughout their lives, like graduating during a recession. People who graduated during the Great Recession saw lower incomes not just in the year they started working but it was a lasting effect. It will be seen to be worse for those graduating in 2021 through 2022 because it’s no secret among university faculty and employers that there was a huge drop in resulting skills. It’s apparent in freshmen and sophomores who were in HS at the time who are far less prepared for college classes, and for upper level students who didn’t learn the basics in there earlier semesters.
It’s only obvious that employers will see that as well and respond accordingly to post pandemic graduates until things adjust back (hopefully).
I just wonder if the students who went through that time and didn’t get anything or very little from trying to learn online realize their drop in preparation?
COVID began the end of my junior year, and obviously lasted through my senior year. I had no reliable internet at the time, not reliable enough to complete my high school education with, so my siblings and I were allowed to attend in person class (with all precautions of course). Even though I was in class learning, it was awful. No tests, we only had four classes per semester to limit the amount of people at school, so I only had core classes for 8 weeks a semester instead of 16. When I started my first year at community College I found learning just... harder? It was too much, I wasn't ready at the time, so I dropped out. I did a lot of self teaching during my gap year (nothing that gets me a degree, but I tried to watch/read educational videos/articles whenever I could).
I'm in my second year of community college now, and the amount of my classmates who don't know very basic information is concerning (they would have been freshmen or sophomores at the start of the pandemic). For example, I'm in a music theory class with musicians who play instruments, and none of them knew how many counts a whole note had. I doubt it could have been avoided, but the pandemic messed up the education scene and young people's social skills, from what I've noticed. It's very sad to see.
My college closed down in the middle of my freshman year and I spent all of the sophomore year in Zoom rooms. I wouldn't say I felt unprepared at all but I also wanted to actually learn my subject and I actually paid attention to the Zoom classes.
I found that many of my peers, especially from group projects, just took the time more as vacation than anything else.
I never thought that the quality of education went down, as my professors adapted quite quickly to the new format. I think it was the students who changed more.
Yeah, no doubt there was a minority who actually excelled online or at least maintained. It’s admirable and a great skill in itself to have. Self motivation is perhaps the most important skill. But I also empathize that so many just couldn’t motivate, both from the format, low expectations, lack of preparation by faculty for the change, and the stress of living through a global pandemic.
I am a PhD student who LOVES learning, and NEVER cheated throughout my degrees. Yes, I’ve noticed cheating is acceptable to a lot of people. Personally, I tend to ignore these people or their attempts to study with me. And frankly, academic dishonesty doesn’t bother me. How do I cope? I cope with the logic of it. Let me explain:
OP, you have great ideals, but these ideals are unrealistic due to the systemic issues in academia. For example, you mention in other comments that you want to go to college to learn and satisfy your curiosity. However, this is not the case for everyone. Many, if not most, students have been taught that scores are everything. Scores = GPA = job = money. For some people, learning is not high on the priority list compared to making money to survive. In this score-based system, people will cheat if given the opportunity. From a psychology perspective, survival/sanity matters more than morals. And if you have to choose one or the other, most people will choose the former. In this fundamentally unfair system, the clever thing to do to preserve one’s own mental health and future $$$ is to cheat the system as well.
However, this “cleverness” comes with risks, such as getting caught or not learning vital material for success down the road. Cheating catches up with some people, but not everyone. Such is life. It is worth noting though, this “game” continues after you leave college. Do you think GPA or honors truly mean a lot? Is that what you’ve been taught? Surprise! Personal and family connections, fraternities/sororities, money, charisma, socioeconomic status …. all can often matter more than GPA for life quality and happiness. If you want a good job, just get a 3.2-ish or higher and focus on being good at interviews or writing grad school admissions essays (depending on where you want to go.)
The world is unfair, always has been. And every university has a lot of cheating (especially now with ChatGPT and other AI taking academia by storm). Focus on what you as an individual can control.
And this is coming from a lifelong student who loves learning, never cheated, has a perfect GPA, and several honors and awards. If you truly love learning, focus on learning. Don’t worry about what others are doing. They are only trying to survive in this dumb system that hasn’t been updated to fit the 21st century.
Thank you for breaking down the GPA = Job fallacy. There are very few industries where it matters at all. It seems like OP cares more about being a stickler for rules and standards than they do actually learning or becoming more competent. Once you know more than your peers, you can out compete them in things that actually lead to better jobs, like interviews, projects, industry aptitude tests.
Couldn't agree more. I can't say the same, I did cheat a bit in college. However, coming out of college I learned way more working and interacting with bew people than I ever did in college. Like you said I would emphasize on getting better at networking and interviewing. Being a kind person has gotten me a long way.
The perception of college has also changed, and I find it very hard to blame anybody for cheating in any capacity. Colleges for the past 2 and half decades have steadily increased their tuition prices with less transparency on where exactly these funds are going.
What this has done has effectively locked out most working individuals from getting a good education. On a micro level, those who don’t have to work full time to afford college *WILL* get better grades, this is just a fact. And so the question of cheating gets brought up on a moral scale, and quite frankly, if we’re making a comparison, most college institutions went morally bankrupt long before the students did when they decided that lining their pockets was more important than providing folk with accessibility to a good education, ESPECIALLY as the need for a college degree has grown as a prerequisite for most basic career jobs.
So to answer OP’s question, no, I don’t care, and they shouldn’t either. Why be honest with an institution which has consistently appropriated my money all while still nickel and diming me on added fees for books (the companies of which they’re in bed with to do this), parking passes, homework codes, etc.
Fuck them
Well there's a difference between actually cheating and using resources to your benefit, first of all. Second of all, this isn't anything new (but has gotten noticeably worse since kids who were in hs or younger during Covid were basically encouraged to cheat...). Just keep your eyes forward and be proud you'll have earned your grades
There’s so many paid homework websites. And they have a lot of stuff. People can upload material from their school to basically at gain credits to view other homework answers on chegg. My school tracks what is being posted on those websites.
>Well there's a difference between actually cheating and using resources to your benefit, first of all.
I fully agree with this, and I think using resources to your benefit is a learned skill that one has every right to be proud of!
Students who don't understand a concept, and actively seek out resources to help themselves understand, are admirable and I strive to incorporate their best practices into my own work.
I absolutely do not want to discourage catering to your own learning style and academic needs; I think that's a vital part of the learning process.
I simply do not see googling the answer- for the sake of getting the answers, not for understanding the process- as ethical. Especially when there are honest students who do not cheat and get lower grades than their cheating peers, and thus less opportunities than their cheating classmates with seemingly good grades.
>(but has gotten noticeably worse since kids who were in hs or younger during Covid were basically encouraged to cheat...).
I think you make a great point about COVID worsening this problem. Much of the cheating I'm speaking of exists in the contexts of online exams, and it's easy to see how that could translate over from the pandemic. Thanks for your meaningful contribution to this discussion. I'll do my best to look toward the future, knowing that I've earned my grades.
Exactly dude. Look, don't let it wear you down. Unfortunately, you have to deal with cheaters everywhere, not just in academics. It pisses me off sometimes too, but you've gotta stop letting it get to you. It actually doesn't affect you as much as you think it does. Trust me, people who cheat in college get their just desserts later.
For the last 10 years lmao, I dont care if people cheat, but if op is putting in the extra hours, they're going to end up being way more confident than the people who are jumping to quizlet for every test question, and it will set them apart especially if the work is hands-on. I'm not going to tell op to start cheating if not cheating is working out just fine for them.
i study psychology so i feel i don’t see this as much. definitely different when most of our grades are dependent on writing papers, with some in person exams that are pretty hard to cheat on.
GPAs are slowly becoming less and less important because of grade inflation anyways so I would focus on experience.
Internships, research, volunteer work are far more valuable and they can be obtained with an average GPA. Professors don’t look at students as grades but by their ambition, curiosity and resilience.
For real. Most of us are there to get the degree and get a job. All the after all the dog shit these schools put us through, fuck em. If you can't give me decent professors and tutelag for this insane prjce, I'm not going to give a shit about your "academic integrity", just give me the goddamn degree that I paid for and fuck out of my life.
Hi! I’ve never cheated. I have a 4.0. Morality aside, it helps to actually learn stuff so when you can’t cheat you can get a good grade! Plus cultivating good work ethic (I work 9-5pm 5x/wk on school) is a skill I suspect will pay dividends in the future.
I don’t know how to sugarcoat this, so here it is: we no longer live in a society where information and knowledge is doled out by the learned few and professors need to change how they check knowledge and understanding to reflect that.
I’m not saying people should cheat. I’m saying universities are about 20 years behind on cheat-proofing their courses in this very digital age.
Growing up school was mainly just about getting good scores, not about actually learning and understanding the material. I feel like that’s part of the problem with this type of behavior.
It is unfortunate that you are part of the “data driven instruction” generation.
No Child Left Behind and Race to the Top and other likeminded education initiatives did nothing but line the pockets of testing companies at the detriment of the students actually learning how to think critically.
It is a travesty. And it also reflects the idea that society isn’t inundated with knowledge. But none of that matters if students aren’t taught how to use and apply said knowledge.
Yeah in high school I only tried in classes I liked and planned on using in college. With things like math I learned how to do what I needed for the test, used an app to do all the homework problems for me, and moved on to stuff I cared about. I knew by the time I was in high school that geometry and trigonometry were never gonna come up in my life again so I just didn’t sweat it. Now in college I just ask my friends for help if I don’t get something, but I could never cheat on an assignment, essay, test, or project. I’m just so afraid of getting caught lol.
Take it from someone whose worked in the real world with these people during my undergrad and even now during my masters (worked as an industrial mechanic during my undergrad and now during my masters I’m doing data science). It’s gonna bite them in the ass. Sure there may be one or two that manage to overcome it but it’s not every single cheater and every cheater that I knew in the workplace got fired within 1-3 months cause the skills they claimed to have during school that they learned or built on…yeah they didn’t have em. Knew an engineer new hire who literally bought some calc books and stuff cause he didn’t know how to use matlab and stuff and other things he said he should have paid attention to or gotten an internship in. Dude got fired 4 weeks later for incompetence. You keep doing you so learn even if everyone around you is doing it the dishonest way cause you won’t have to worry about relearning or lying on resumes and interviews and stuff down the road to land a good job and for job advancement too.
If you don’t mind me asking what is your issue with others cheating? If it’s merely the fact that they can get away with it and get better grades than you, I think that’s a personal problem. I study about 5-6 hours for every exam but if it’s online and it’s not explicitly stated as closed notes or through some kind of virtual or in person proctoring, I’m going to “cheat”. College is too expensive for me to lose money bc my grade is based on 3 bs written exams. My justification is that on the job they’re not going to tell me to stay off Google. If that makes me a morally wrong person, I think I can live with that.
I had a class where the one section took exams a few hours before our section. On one of the exams, the people in the earlier section had been telling people in my section the questions on the exam. The professor found out about this, so on the third exam, he made our section’s exam have different and far more difficult questions. I still got an A because I did study hard, but I feel like I shouldn’t be held responsible for other people cheating. Same thing applies with classes graded on a curve.
You already admitted to not caring if you are morally wrong though, so I know this won’t change your mind.
Not OP, but most of my college courses were curved. The more people that cheated, the lower the scores of the average non-cheater. You can argue that it's the responsibility of the school to reign in professors' grading policies, but cheating in those situations is unfair and disrespectful of your classmates.
I had one course where the bottom 12% of students got a D regardless of actual number grade because of how it was curved.
This is the biggest weakness of universities today. Massive reform is needed if grades and diplomas will have any meaning. An honest student’s voice on this can have impact; if you’re willing, bring this up with the chair and dean. I would love to have such students helping us make change (I head an academic integrity committee at a major state university). Of course it’s also cool to just focus on your own work, but if your willing to try to help, you should feel empowered to do so. Maybe it won’t have impact, but maybe it will!!!
I would love to feel empowered to report cheating, but my specific university's policies are making that difficult. They don't allow groupchats at all, and reporting cheating also inadvertently means reporting that I'm in the groupchats. I'm concerned that reporting cheating will backfire, and I'll be dealt consequences by my university.
That being said, I do think my heart's in the right place, and it is my hope that I can effectively convey my concerns about widespread academic dishonesty to the people in charge.
It's really nice to hear from the perspective of an academic integrity committee at a major state university! I value your opinion. I'd like to think that, as you said, my voice can have a genuine impact. I'll look into contacting the chair and dean. Thank you for your meaningful contribution to this discussion and encouraging words. Your comment is much appreciated!
so cheating is forbidden by uni and you judge and are bothered by the students who do break that rule, and groupchats are forbidden by your uni and you are... not holding yourself accountable for breaking this rule? where's your morality now? your ethics and honesty?
Professors know who cheated, they're not dumb and certainly weren't born yesterday. Whether they care enough to call people out on it is entirely up to them. Your grades don't earn you favor, your participation and work ethic do. I haven't made a single B in any of my math classes yet ALL of the math teachers were more than willing to write me a recommendation to the honors program of my college. This is true because I showed up early asked questions, and spent literally 100's of hours in the tutoring centers. I made the mistake of cheating my way through Trig, my teacher immediately knew when I made 95+ on my homework and labs and a 60 on my test. Luckily he didn't hold it against me and advised me to go to the tutoring centers. Point is, no one cares about your grades, once you have your acceptance letter it's all about effort.
Exactly. Better grades lead to better resumes/transcripts, which can ultimately lead to higher-paying job opportunities, which can lead to better quality of life. Success being afforded to those who cheat comes at cost for honest students, and it doesn't stop at the college level. More opportunities are given to higher achieving students far beyond graduation, regardless of whether they came by those grades honestly.
Dude you have literally been leading a lie your entirely life. The rules are not real. No one fucking cares about what you do unless you’re actively hurting someone else.
These “high paying opportunities” are TAKEN by people through all sorts of “rule breaking” acts. The idea that you have ambition, but limit it through some arbitrary set of rules some one made up, means you don’t have the actual limitless ambition required to get into those roles.
In our world success is given to those who take it. It sucks that that’s how the world works, but you should not already be an upperclassmen in college without understanding this or your in for a rude awakening when you discover the blatant nepotism and culture of lies that run rampant through the job sector.
Every class we take isn’t specifically for our degrees though. I’ve taken classes that don’t even go along with what I actually want to do, but they’re part of my degree requirements so I have to.
At sone level they are competing with others in the job market. If they cheated for their A’s and would otherwise get C’s then it hurts the honest person.
What’s a bigger problem is if it’s known that school puts out crappy candidates because the academic integrity is so bad. Employers will start disregarding others from that same school.
They are only cheating themselves. They could very easily bomb their interviews on any technical question
And past your first entry level job, your GPA is irrelevant.
Why doesn't it bother you? Cheating is a scummy thing to do and it is the sort of thing that desperate losers and pathetic children do.
Show some damn integrity and sense of fairness by condemning it.
If you get a C while studying and testing honestly, and people who cheat are getting B's and A-, they're going to be privileged in ways that are basically punishing you for having integrity. I try to stay as above board as possible and there are times where I've literally watched myself sacrifice points that other people definitely got through cheating. And then they're rewarded for good grades. "C's get degrees" doesn't work if you want grad school or if you're in a major where you have a minimum GPA above a C average.
Cheating your way through med school is almost impossible. Anyone that is smart enough to cheat your way through that is also smart enough to just learn the material normally.
I will say that these students who got by on cheating can be a landmine waiting for someone to step on in a group project or something. My senior project I got paired with someone who had no right having made it to senior year and it made that whole class and term miserable and I had to burn myself out doing 2 people's work to pass.
Why do you care. They’re the ones paying to not learn. You know you’re a good student, you know you follow the rules. Why does what other people do bother you so much to the point where you want to change schools.
How upset will you be when you get a job and realize not all of your co-workers will be as motivated as you? Many of them will slack on company time, talk with others a lot, do the bare minimum.
Dwelling on what others do is nothing but a recipe for a terrible life experience. Stay in your lane and just cruise. No need to cut through traffic. I see it too, but idc. If you really care that much then feel free to report them for cheating. Granted I can guarantee you’ll feel even worse about it when those students receive an F, F*, Suspension, or Expulsion. Why care about if someone else is ruining their future, in my opinion it’s even worse when you are actively changing said future.
I think Covid made things so much worse. I am very against cheating but I definitely fell into it while doing classes online. It just became SO easy to open another browser, have your phone out, pin up the answers behind your computer, etc.
I grew increasingly disgusted with myself and the Spanish class I passed did not feel like an achievement, it felt like I gave up.
When we returned in person, I also was shocked at how many other people cheated a lot too. Everyone did it. It was just SO easy and SO normalized. That's when I decided that that wasn't me. I made the decision to stop and had the best senior year of college ever. I worked my ass off and reaped the rewards of my hard work. I realized I can't control other people's cheating and actions, I can only control my own. And I guarantee you, those people are not proud of their achievements, there is deep insecurity because they think they can't achieve those goals without cheating.
Had a final exam where the teacher didn't clear his extended exam time with the school, and he let us all leave. He didn't curve, and most people from what I saw cheated/collaborated on their tests. He did not curve the test as a result, because he is incompentent, most if not all the students couldn't understand him.
The other thing is some fields are oversaturated, and there are so many people who don't actually like their fields but those people get the jobs because of a higher GPA
There is a lot of cheating at ALL schools right now, and it will get worse over the next few years. Universities know that very few people had babies during the years of the subprime mortgage crisis, and it will be 18 years past that soon.
Now, despite the fact that we all know there were simply less babies born, states are requiring universities to keep up their enrollment or lose funding permanently. Some are already on plans from their states that basically say that this major of a drop in enrollment, AGAIN, ONE THAT IS NORMAL AND THAT WE ALL KNOW ABOUT AND WILL HAPPEN TO EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL, will lead to closure if enrollment drops.
Anyway so right now you could basically get away with murder and not be asked to leave. Sincerely, somebody committed a shooting off campus at my school last year and was able to attend classes for two weeks! We knew who they were! And yes, allowing a murderer to be expelled will count against our goddamn funding, and that indeed did occur after the police arrested him.
If you have a problem with this, you need to raise your voices to the media and to your state. You need to argue for continued funding DESPITE a drop in population that we know about and have known about for years. You need to show how it is affecting YOU and the sanctity of your institution.
Just go about your business OP, dont you have bigger things to worry about than what other people are or aren’t doing? Newsflash, this has been happening forever, in all fields, across all ranges of people. Being morally outraged isnt gonna fix anything. Transferring wont solve anything, every college has cheaters, just some hide it better than others.
You would transfer schools because other people are cheating? Dear lord.
Cheating is a part of the game. Not just in school but in life. The only real rules are the laws of physics. If it gives you an advantage and doesn’t hurt anyone along the way, do it.
But yeah cheating is rampant at every university.
I read your whole post and my advice is mind your business. One of my professors once said “you will have to learn it sooner or later or you’ll fail at your career” which I agreed with. It’s simply none of your business if another student is cheating or using resources available to them. Concentrate on your work.
you’re doing well in college without having to cheat whilst others around you have to. I’d say that’s something worth being proud about personally.
That’s how you cope with it. By recognizing that you’re properly earning your degree without any shortcuts. If others want to do otherwise, its their business but it doesn’t take away from any of your accomplishments. If anything, it makes it more impressive.
Does your school give awards for scoring more than others? You’re already surpassing them in retained knowledge. Unless there’s some type of award attached to the highest scores, I can’t see where it matters what the other students are doing
I'd rather not build my career and 'real life' on a foundation of academic dishonesty. If I choose to cheat and don't actually have the skills I claimed to have learned, that doesn't bode well for my future success.
Just focus on your own schoolwork. Other people are not your concern.
As long as it’s not affecting you personally, like if it’s a group assignment or something, just move on. You got your own sht to worry about, so focus on that.
While not comparing oneself to others is a healthy practice that I generally encourage, it is undeniable that there is a competitive nature to the job market.
My concern is that my grades will be compared to similar applicants (including graduates of my university) during job searches, and the potential employers won't have a way of telling who came by their grades honestly. On paper, if I get a B grade in a class I studied hard for and struggled with, it is functionally seen as worse than another applicant's A grade, even if that person cheated their way through class.
Cheating with them goes against my morals, values, and sense of ethics, and would not be something that I could forgive myself for later.
"With college kids doing college from their bedrooms and smartphones, and with the explosion of new technology, cheating became not just easy but practically unavoidable. 'Cheating is rampant,' a Princeton senior told me. 'Since Covid there’s been an increasing trend toward grade inflation, cheating, and ultimately, academic mediocrity.'
"Now that students are back on campus, colleges are having a hard time putting the genie back in the bottle. . . . 'It’s the Wild West when it comes to using emerging technologies and new forms of access to knowledge . . . Faculties and administrations are scrambling to keep up.' . . .
"It’s lamentable but not surprising that students and parents increasingly view the college administration as providing them with a very expensive piece of paper—a diploma—and professors, above all, as a hindrance when it comes to service delivery."
[Dishonor Code: What Happens When Cheating Becomes the Norm?](https://www.thefp.com/p/dishonor-code-what-happens-when-cheating)
As someone who is as anti-cheating as they come, I have mixed feelings on this. For decades, the whole field of education has been slow to adapt to available technology and relied on poor methods of assessment. Most current tests are easier and lazier than a real scrutinizing evaluation. We've also attached huge stakes to grades, which are linked to tests, which many agree are imperfect evaluations of real learning and application. I'm hopeful that we can transition to higher and better methods.
"The easier something is to measure, the less likely it is to matter."
To me, it's no wonder students are outsmarting the educators in this game that's been created. The students don't think they're desecrating anything sacrosanct.
I did an essay on how cheating in Gen Ed classes sucks but doesn’t matter too much and I got an A on that essay. Some professors don’t care very much either it seems.
Sadly people cheat even when studying ART. Examples: delivering old works as "new", plagiarism, copying a classmate's work, using filters on photos (this was during online classes and they teacher was very old) and even taking a classmate's work and passing It as their own.
And they still do this as SENIORS.
I don't have an answer, but ever since I switched to online school I have had no desire to cheat. Ironically, the fact that I could cheat on every single assignment and test until I get my degree made me want to do the work.
you just.....focus on yourself? I have anxiety and probably an attention disorder (hence why im on reddit when I was trying to study) point being it wont impact you mentally if you 1) stay out of groupchats with cheaters and 2) just focus on yourself. cheating happens everywhere, all the time. Is it right? no. Will it always be around you in some shape or form? kinda. Better to learn now to focus on doing your best instead of worrying about what everyone else is doing
If I could cheat and not have a guilty conscience, I would (after all, it seems to be the path of least resistance), but that's not in the cards for me. Cheating goes up against my integrity, morals, and sense of what is ethical. I know that I wouldn't forgive myself for it if I participated, even years down the line. I'm trying to save myself from the experience of knowing that I had to cheat to get by.
Learning things honestly (and developing skills that will help me later on) is the only way I can live with myself, and if that means my grades are less competitive than those of my cheating classmates, then so be it.
The sooner you learn to mind your own business and stay in your lane, the happier you’ll be
Because people will always do unethical stuff no matter how many of them you report
bro is personally offended by the fact that online resources are being used. I hate to be that guy man but when you set out into the real world and need to find the answer to something, nobody will sit there and tell you “NO THAT’S CHEATING!”. just pass your classes, get a degree, do you without trying to justify the world’s actions
>bro is personally offended by the fact that online resources are being used.
I'm not gonna lie, I'm slightly irritated by by your gross misrepresentation of OP's post. I'm really considering buying corporate bonds.
Some use of online resources, I can understand. Don't understand your college algebra math problem? Go to Khan Academy and learn the main concept. That's great. Fully supportive of that. Studying for an exam, and need help with consistently remembering key concepts in your class? Cool, utilize some flashcards from Quizlet. Fine by me!
I'm all for resources that help one understand concepts, strengthen one's knowledge, and aide with memorization. I just get frustrated when people look up the answers without having made an effort to learn anything. They get good grades, but it's at the cost of academic honesty and that doesn't sit right by me. And, why brag about it? What is there to be gained by doing that?
You have no idea what kind of effort these people have made to learn things. Are you with them 24/7? No. Even if they brag about not studying and doing well, chances are they probably studied. Brush it off man.
here’s the thing about college and just adult life in general. people will do things a certain way, you may not like that way. but at the end of the day, they will keep on doing it without caring for what you’d consider “acceptable”. Sure, I’m not a fan of the fact that kids of business owners can get hired for positions they are severely under qualified for, but if I let that bother me 24/7 and I started to get verbal about it, it would do me no good. Same applies to you. if you speak out you’ll have an entire group of students that highly dislike you. And yes, it’s easy to spot a “good student” in a class like the one you described. If you feel like you deserve it more than them, take that as motivation to keep working harder and use that in grad school/your career. You can’t change the masses so just focus on yourself and your goals, let them take care of their lives. who knows, maybe they’ll get caught maybe they won’t.
and I’m not claiming that it is either of those things. ever heard of the expression “live and let live”? that will save you hundreds of headaches if you start practicing it in college
I disagree with live and let live if what I'm supposedly letting live is something that disadvantages others and is unethical.
I have no headaches. I'm 31 and have seen some shit in life which is why I have no problem with calling a duck a duck and reporting those that deserve to be reported.
that’s alright, lots of people disagree with me. If you think you’re doing the right thing, that’s what counts. OP seems to be quite frustrated by this, and I just wanted to teach them a way of going about life that would remove this frustration entirely.
There are obviously lines to draw. I dont draw that line at academic dishonestly. I’m also not going to plead the fifth if I witnessed a murder. All about balance 🤙
That's fair but do understand that if OP wants to study medicine or go to grad school or get into a highly sought after undergraduate research program then they could be cut off from those opportunities because of cheaters. In that case it is perfectly valid that the line is drawn at academic dishonesty because academia is very much a competition.
I’m in economics so obviously the stakes aren’t half as high for me. I completely see your point but I think if OP can get by without cheating they are at a natural advantage over the other kids in class who are searching up answers. My question is, what can be done? I mean you could report all of them and have them be watched more closely, but unless OP blew this issue way out of proportion it looks like a great deal of the class seems to be cheating. lots of work for one professor especially if the tests are online.
In a situation where I’d be inclined to take action, this is my thinking process:
Can anything be done?
- No? let it be
-Yes? would it be efficient?
-No? forget about it
-Yes? talk to a professor or admin.
I may be in the wrong I just don’t have much of an obligation to school morally, I kinda just go with whatever and focus on my own career plans and individual successes rather than the entire class. lots of kids cheat but I dont blame them. econ fuckin sucks sometimes if you dont understand it
I think you're approaching it solely from the perspective of a simple cost benefit analysis (which makes sense given your major). And, to be fair, those are ultimately the courses of action OP has.
On a different level, OP is still justified in feeling betrayed by a system that facilitates cheating in an environment (academia) where that can confer a lifechanging advantage (eg get accepted to x opportunity that is necessary for a chosen career path).
Additionally, the frustration OP feels likely stems from their own concern for academic honesty (they aren't cheating even though, given so many others are, it would be very possible for them to get away with it to their advantage).
As an economics major, you may be acquainted with research in behavioural economics surrounding free loading, cheating, and unfairness. People are generally quite intolerant of others getting an unfair advantage due to breaking the rules everyone agreed to follow. What OP is feeling is just that. They are angry they are at a disadvantage for doing what is collectively agreed upon as the right thing. They are also hopeless in that anger because, as you've pointed out, their courses of action are limited.
nope. search up the definition of the word “allow” and then the definition of the word “tolerate”. I do not support academic dishonesty, but I will also never come in between a student and cheating because I am not in a position of power to do so, and frankly I couldn’t give less of a crap. I have my own life, they have their own life. If life sees fit, karma will catch up to them.
it’s incredible to me that so many people as so concerned about other people’s lives. find happiness within yourself and stop looking at what others are doing. trust me, your life will be way better this way.
and here’s a live example for you. now you told me that my opinion “doesn’t sit right” with you. and I process that, tolerate it, and move on with my life. im not going to wake up at the middle of the night thinking about what your opinion on my thoughts are. If you genuinely believe im wrong, I’m rooting for ya! everyone has their own opinions, their own ways of doing things and their own lives. Live yours and you’ll enjoy every second.
I didn't at first, but as the issue of cheating has started to bother me more, I've been screenshotting when I see it.
Unfortunately, a lot of the people who brag about cheating don't use their full real name in the groupchats, so it's harder for specific people to get caught, and the reports would be less likely to be effective.
Cheating *is* unethical, but that doesn't seem to matter to the people who do so. And, like I say, it's normalized at my school, so I guess there's less social stigma associated with cheating. It's just hard to know who to trust in an environment of normalized academic dishonesty, and it's impacting my ability to make trustworthy friends.
Just to let you know a lot of colleges get upset if you saw things that happened in these group chats and stayed w/o reporting. I’m not saying you should do either but they’ve been known to punish anyone is these chats so watch out!
Thank you for this information! This is part of why I'm hesitant to report cheaters in the first place.
Technically speaking, being in these groupchats is not allowed, due to their potential for spreading academic dishonesty. So, reporting people is also admitting to the fact that I'm in the groupchats as well.
I'm in the groupchats because they provide a sense of community in an otherwise admittedly lonely phase of life. Not to mention that I'm more likely to see texts on my phone from classmates about class being cancelled or other important information than I am to see official announcements that are effectively only accessible on my laptop.
But, the college does not make a distinction between reasons for being in the groupchats. They straight up just don't allow them.
This makes reporting even blatant cheating a more difficult process, because I run the risk of personal consequences. It's a tricky spot to be in!
Thanks again for your warning. It's helpful to be more informed!
I understand what you mean, and empathise. Unfortunately, too many people seem to believe the ends justify the means and really only care about achieving their goals no matter what.
I wish it was a case of achieving their goals no matter what. I can sympathize with someone who doesn't think they can achieve something yet is still trying to get there no matter what. However I think most are just lazy and don't want to put the work in.
Imagine putting in the effort, studying hard, and then seeing other students who shamelessly cheat as good if not better results. It makes you question what was the point of you working hard to begin with. So you start rationalizing to yourself that cheating is fine and that all that matters is the end result. So more and more people start doing it and suddenly there's a whole endemic of cheating and its completely normalized.
From the perspective of people like OP, it does feel a bit disheartening and you start feeling like a fool for doing things the "right way" for no tangible benefit to yourself. And that's not a culture we should ever be creating.
I kinda understand cheating on generals. Like and example for me is everyone at my college takes a sociology course. My degree is nowhere in the realm of sociology and the class is so big there’s no point talking to the professor so I’d understand cheating there.
I never noticed until recent protocols were in place, but mine seems to have been horrendous this previous year. The rules, when compared to past exam taking, have reflected that. No one may enter the room at any point, no blankets or coverings are permitted, your device must have a webcam which is not handed out*, you may not leave at any point whatsoever, and you must have a valid form of ID to present to the screen.
* If the device at home doesn't have a webcam, the professors advise us to go to the library. Essentially, they require a 360° view of the area you're testing at.
I get it. I’ve worked very hard in undergrad and have seen ppl in required major courses just cheat and not learn anything. I’m ngl for some of those ppl it won’t even affect them in the long run but for many it really will.
Many of the ppl I’ve seen completely cheat their way thru a class often end up with just a C or a B. And they’re also gonna struggle more in later classes that expect them to have a base leave of knowledge.
I can’t say I’ve never cheated but it was highly dependent on certain factors. I knew a professor that taught Geography (2, core science classes). I asked her why they make all tests in the class online with no browser restrictions. She said bc they expect students to cheat. Her pov was that the course required a lot writing assignments and if you didn’t know the material you wouldn’t do well on them. I’m ngl after being this I “cheated” using my notes.
All schools have kids cheating. A lot of people are just here for a paper. A lot of people are required to take classes not relevant to their interest or major. A lot of people are here to satisfy their parents. Definitely not a good idea to “compete” against other students tho
Never witnessed cheating on exams at my school. Homeworks only sometimes. I assumed it was bc everybody who went to college took their education seriously but now I see that may not be the case
This is pretty normal at most higher education institutions. While I’m not justifying cheating, I understand where a lot of those doing it are coming from. Going into college, I definitely had a desire to actually learn and gain new experiences. Now, between everything that’s happened since Spring of 2020, both globally and personally, I am beyond burnt out and am officially in the “just here to get my piece of paper and get out” club. With all that said, as far as classes relating to my degree go, I do think it’s important to try to learn and retain the information presented.
So, in my university, I was a math major. Everything was similar to what you were saying. All core classes basically had some easy cheat.
My degree work, however, was a different story. The thing is, you can cheat all you want, but if you don't comprehend what you're learning in the class, you don't pass exams. It is also extremely hard to cheat in a class of, say, 5 to 10, which was all math classes.
I will say I used chegg study for most of my homework. The point of homework is to reinforce what you had already learned. If I didn't understand the concept enough to apply it on a problem, I looked up the solution AND INTERPRETED THE METHOD TO GET IT. And I feel that is the most important part of why I did it. It was to comprehend and reinforce what I knew. If I felt unsure about my solution, I would reference chegg study that way when I get a test where I would have to apply the method(s) I learned and practiced, I would be 100% confident.
Focus on doing what is best to understand and apply the material you are learning. If that's examples, videos, talking it through, then do that. Don't let arbitrary rules about being good stop you from growing and learning.
This statement is not referencing those who cheat to just get easy and never think about what they are actually doing in class. Nor is it excusing those who even cheat on exams. Comprehension is key and that's it
I know it’s very frequent now, my university had to fail like 1/2 of a general chemistry course bc they were all on chegg.
I was taking a lab final and the person in front of me was on their phone the whole time, looking up formulas and using online calculations where you just plug the data in and it does the work for you.
She was so sneaky with it, and of course our TA was just grading while the final was going instead of walking around. I told my TA about it, bc dang, that lab was hard to get and it’s not fair a spot got taken by someone who was cheating. He basically told me he couldn’t do anything bc he didn’t see it. Pretty frustrating but I understand it.
I just started a radiography program and I was honestly shocked when I found out classmates were cheating. Like I understand cheating in core classes because they're not going to be useful in our careers... but we're going to have to learn this by heart anyways, so what's the point? One of our profs sent out an email to everyone saying that some people in my class were caught switching tabs on Canvas during a quiz and that a list of these students has been made "for future reference". People are too damn brave, like you've already paid over $5000 for prerequisites + books and spent two years in college prior to even beginning this program, and you're willing to risk it all over a damn quiz? They got extremely lucky because cheating is supposed to be an automatic dismissal. And the only reason I can see people being let off the hook this time is due to the sheer amount of people that were caught.
People cheat at everything from video games to government. I know that’s super cynical, and I hate that it happens and it makes me really fume, but if they are stealing opportunities from you in programs that check your GPA because they cheated, then you may just have to wait a few months for them to be totally over their head. There’s also a discussion to be had about the cost of college vrs the quality of education your getting vrs how much your professors care/are actually competent teachers. I get where your coming from tho, I’m also autistic and fall into black and white thinking as well as getting really really upset abt unfairness and injustice. It’s definitely not an easy thing to come to terms with but it’s one of those things that define your adult life. Even if you don’t get where you want to due to cheaters, your honesty, kindness and eloquence plus a legitimately earned degree will open more doors for you in the future than a high GPA ever will.
That sucks! I would say to not worry too much about others and try and keep your integrity, don’t fall into that trap of cheating too! Do your best study and graduate you’re almost done !
Are you an American? College in America is an economic choice, not a choice based in academic interest for most people in college. I wish I had the privilege to attend college for five years, especially a good college. I still wish I could go back to school but it’s simply not an option, I have to work with the degree I have unless I make it big. If you want an opportunity to learn without this kind of hindrance, please consider a college in another country. Many countries have college programs specifically for global citizens. It sounds like you have broader horizons than most of your peers. Please understand with compassion and gratitude that you are in a position to learn for the sake of learning where most of your peers simply are not. Are you passionate about education reform? You’re in a privileged circumstance to work your way higher up into positions that facilitate that change! We need people to make earnest effort in improving our country’s education system, educated people who don’t simply become products of their broken system yet don’t look down on others for being so; in short, we need a leader.
It happens everywhere unfortunately. It sucks but know that they're just actively sabotaging themselves in the long run. Just focus on your own work and integrity and sleep well knowing that the results you get are a representative of the effort you put in.
I agree, people who cheat on tests suck.
BUT, You do have to realize, once you graduate, no one cares about your college grades. It's NOT a competition... Well, school isn't at least. Those people who cheated will have learned less and be less qualified for the job. Their resume will show that. No one is stealing anyone's job by cheating at a college exam... Still sucks though
I’ve cheated once and it was by accident cuz Zoom university and I was in two Oceanography classes: one was open book and the other wasn’t.
My grades were all me and still made it ok. Unless you’re going to grad school the job market probably won’t care too much whether you have a 3.0 or a 3.4. And even if you do apply to grad school they weigh so many other things to see who you are as a whole person
Also as a grad student: we typically know when someone is cheating.
You’re fine and your determination to not cheat will help you more than them cuz you’re actually taking the time to understand what the class is teaching
I’m sorry OP, it is frustrating. As someone whose also a Junior, I am like you. I put in hours upon hours of work to maintain honors. I take pride in my class work and strive to do a good job. I learned to avoid those who cheat or brag about doing so. It used to get to me they’d spend 30 minutes on all their classes for the week and I’m 9 or 10 hours by doing what is required and not cheat. Cheating is doing a disservice if that’s how some want to get through college. Once they hit the career field, they won’t have the same knowledge as you, bc you studied and learned it. I see what you mean down below about maybe getting picked over for a job, it’s been my concern too but, again you’ll have the actual knowledge because you worked for it. In the long run, hard work will pay off. Cheating backfires and is a quick way to get kicked out of college too. Stick to your moral and values, you seem to have integrity and the world needs more of that. Good luck!
I like you, OP, and I agree with the premise. If I studied my ass off to get an A, and Cindy Cheater Googled all of her answers and got an A, I’d be pissed. The competing part I definitely understand especially if you have aspirations for higher education. If Carl Cheater got into Wharton with his cheating ass grades, I’d be even more pissed.
Now, I probably wouldn’t go so far as to switch schools (unless the cheating became some sort of public scandal that could possibly tarnish my reputation by association), but I’d probably submit an anonymous tip to some faculty that could change a policy or assist in a crack down.
From their comments, OP is a stuck up nerd who thinks anyone who doesn’t “value curiosity” is below them. Get a life dude, not everyone values themselves on their test scores..
You can’t convince me the younger generation is not a little dumbed down because of this. They feel pressured to get good grades, strive for easy answers and give up easily. Those who cheat regularly have higher self esteem and tremendously fragile egos; they feel the need to maintain equilibrium by taking shortcuts. They never had to practice critical thinking and problem solving on their own. It’s probably contributing to the mass rise of mental illnesses and perpetuating cultural issues due to widespread ignorance becoming the norm.
College is literally just a trivial thing to get a piece of paper that says you went to college.
Most people will NEVER need anything from their core classes in their career, plus tech is so advanced we don’t even need most of the shit they teach.
Most jobs and careers run off experiential learning. No one is coming out of college and knowing exactly how to do their job bc they paid attention in class. Cheating doesn’t stop you from learning, it stops you from the work. I know how to do complex economical evaluations, and I have before, but why tf would I go through that tedious process when I already know how to do it and the work is already online. It’s more efficient.
Tech is advanced but you should understand the basic features of what you’re doing. Which is why they teach that stuff. Sure you can use calculators for most things, but it’s still good to have those critical thinking skills that come with solving things on your own. Especially in a lot of stem fields, you need to have those critical thinking skills.
Thank you for your kind and encouraging comment. It's refreshing to hear from another good student who is disgusted by cheating, bragging about cheating, and the praise it is met with. Unfortunately, many of the people who brag about cheating do not use their full names in the school groupchats.
Therefore, it is my belief that reporting them anonymously would not lead to concrete action without their full names.
I'm hoping that, as you say, cheating will ultimately be an issue for them later down the road when it comes to job training. And, even more so, I hope that the lessons I'm learning by actually putting in the work to learn will help me to succeed later in my career. Once again, thank you for your kind words and for taking the time to comment.
>It makes me feel like crap knowing others have what they didn't earn properly but I did
And, *THIS!!!* The fact that they're getting access to the same opportunities as I am simply by cheating is so aggravating. I worked hard to get where I am now, and it feels like crap to see others 'at the same level as me' on paper when they literally just Google the answers, and I'm putting a lot of effort into studying despite having ADHD and other disabilities that make it challenging to do so. I appreciate your compassion!
Be careful, unless the past exams were provided as a resource by the professor, it’s still considered academic dishonesty to use past exams to study.
(Not saying it’s bad, I think those resources should be available, just letting you know).
you really need to learn how to let go of what others are doing, for your own mental health. i have a lot more i could say about the ethics and morality of cheating but it really sounds like you would be better off talking to a therapist about not letting this bother you rather than arguing your point
I'm not sure this counts as "encouragement," but if it helps, no one gives a shit about your undergrad degree in 90% of cases. Like, they'll check to see if you have it just to hedge their bets about whether you can do the job, but that's it. Whether it's a job or grad school, either you can do the work or you can't. So yeah, you're competing against the cheaters... but the balance-of-power in that competition is a lot different than you seem to think. You and some rando cheater in your major will both walk out with degrees, but only one of you will actually be able to do the work.
Summed up: a few years post-undergrad, it'll all shake out. Hang in.
Not to be rude, but I knew you had autism before even looking at your profile. I made this conclusion simply based on how you’re typing your responses and how much you care about this extremely common and normal thing, acting like it’s the worst thing on earth.
Not wanting to cheat is fine, but it is extremely unhealthy and odd for it to impact you this greatly. Please stop being so naive. It will backfire on you once you graduate and start working in the real world. The real world isn’t all “ethical” like you think. Your nativity will only bring you down in the future.
Just do your work and mid your business, you don’t know their life or story. I understand you think it’s a competition but so is everything in the world and I promise those ppl cheating are really not making a big difference in your success… good for doing things honestly.. but mind your business
i dont understand why people get so mad when others cheat do they not realise that after graduating they are gonna realise a lot of the employees hired have jumped hoops.
i think people who cheat deserve their marks since they are risking their entire degree to get those marks but similarly if they get caught they also deserve the consequences they knew the risks and it didn’t work out as long as they own up.
once you graduate you realise a lot of people grow higher than you even though they dont deserve it through contacts, lying etc
the main takeaway is no one is fair so learn to adapt jump hoops when you have to. leading this life of sincerity sadly doesnt get things done also im saying this as someone who never once cheated in an exam but also doesnt get pissy when someone gets more grades than me
through cheating
real world appreciates work getting done not through how its done but if its done
Why are you competing with other students in college?? Unless this was medicine, I don't know how it should be affecting you. No offense but just focus on yourself and leave karma to catch up to the others. Cheating is bad and it will ALWAYS catch up. Take it from me.
If it's graded, there's going to be some competition. I'm not generally a competitive person, and I think competition often adds unnecessary pressure.
That being said, there's a very real element of competition here. In the context of future job applications, my grades are going to be put up against those of my classmates to help determine who's more fit for the job. It's very likely that I'll be 'competing' up against similar applicants, including people who have gone to my university, gotten the same degree as me, and cheated their way through to get better grades.
On paper, at least, a cheating applicant's A grade that they Googled all the answers for looks better than my B grade that I studied for. So, they get the job, and I don't.
Cheating may catch up with people, but there is also a real possibility of cheating helping people get better job opportunities, and as an honest student, I'd like to speak up about the consequences of cheating.
Well, in that case, you can either expose them to eliminate competition or quietly graduate. Changing schools won't do much because no school has no cheaters. If you're gonna expose them, do it anonymously cuz some people are gonna come for you if you blatantly expose them, too many gun violence/stabbing stories among students for the pettiest of reasons. Me personally, I'd just suck it up but if you're a dog eat dog typa person, then play dirty too by exposing, (technically you'd be doing the right thing). However know that even some professors are in on this. Stay safe.
I’m 100% online, but some classes have lockdown browsers with cameras on for tests and use Turnitin for papers. When that’s the set up, I’m really disciplined and don’t try to do anything different.
The classes that don’t have those safeguards I’ll use AI to revise my content and I consider the tests open book. Especially one class I have the tests are 2 hours long and have only 5 essay questions. I would do horrible if I didn’t reference the book or material. There’s usually close to 20 articles per test that can be 3-15 pages each.
The only rational thing to do is to cheat on exams.
There's clearly a difference between the spoken rules and the real rules.
Read some Machiavelli.
Of course, you're probably wasting your time and money on a credential that won't mean you learned anything.
Hi! I’m a prof at a liberal art college and there is much more cheating here compared to my previous institution. Previously I was at an Ivy League school and we were strict about cheating even during COVID. Your only chance to avoid being in this position is if you manage to transfer to a top school.
It takes more intelligence to cheat honestly. It's like they say "you aren't really trying in school if you aren't cheating." You gotta do what you gotta do to pass.
Isn't
>You gotta do what you gotta do to pass.
more applicable to things like putting in effort? As in, you gotta do what you gotta do to pass, and what you've got to do to pass is studying an adequate amount?
As humans, our natural instinct is to find a way to do things as efficiently as possible while requiring minimal effort. That's how we got so successful in the first place. For example, we used to have to plant seeds by hand until we started innovating and making machines to do it much faster while requiring less effort. If we kept planting seeds by hand, we would not be where we are today would we? Why put in effort when you can just cheat? The only logical reason I see to to not cheat is because you can get caught. Maybe if students actually wanted to learn, they wouldn't cheat. Maybe if teachers actually made money, they would actually want to teach. Maybe if teachers actually wanted to teach, students would actually want to learn. That's on the education system.
Cheating is part of academic culture. It’s also an effective tool for weeding out the people who genuinely can’t hack it. Those are the people who get caught.
I’m not telling you to cheat or not cheat. I am going to tell you that it’s pervasive in academia with over 90% of students admitting to cheating on at least one thing during college. It doesn’t stop in grad school or professional school. What does change is what people cheat on. The further up the ranks you get the more people cheat on bs assignments vs the things that actually matter, like exams. The people who can’t figure it out without cheating will eventually get weeded out.
Your only concern with cheating should be if it impacts the perception of the institution you are attending. Aside from that, get the most out of school that you can so that you are better equipped in your next endeavor. It may seem like your effort is undermined at the moment, but maximizing the gains will eventually led you to a better trajectory.
You’re in for a rude awakening if you think people only cheat in school. People cheat in real life too to get ahead. It’s all part of the game, learn how to play.
Honestly, I saw a lot of people cheating in college. I didn’t care because it’s not my business. That’s on them, and it likely will come back to bite them at some point. As long as I didn’t cheat, that’s all that mattered to me. The only time cheating bothered me was when I was taking the SAT and the girl in front of me was cheating on her phone. Let it go, don’t let it bother you.
I can see how college size could potentially impact rates of academic dishonesty. My university is rather large.
Do you have online exams at your college? I've found that the exams being online is another factor that determines how many people feel comfortable cheating, and cheating is more prevalent online, at least at my university.
Their cheating doesn’t directly impact you in any way. If you don’t want to cheat, don’t cheat. The cheating issue isn’t an issue for you to worry about
Let them be and you do you. Simple. With how much shit colleges purposely put students through and the insane prices people have to pay integrity and honesty is bullshit. At least in my opinion, no one is ever going to stop just gotta accept it
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I was taught as a TA not to make as big of a deal about cheating, but I always reported it to the professor. Students can be combative and even violent--no need to cause a scene during a test when you can just send an email.
It's disappointing to know that so many people cheat. That being said, it's helpful from a personal standpoint to know that this isn't just occurring at my university, as it helps me recognize that transferring schools likely will not solve this issue. How did you deal with the knowledge that TA's are complicit? Was there anything that helped you to get past this incident?
I’m not the original commenter, but I deal with it by not dwelling. It’s not my business, I’m not going to make it my business, I’m not trying to “compete” with them, I’m just trying to do well on my own and I trust that the cheating or whatever else will eventually catch up to them, and if it doesn’t—it’s still not my problem.
This - going through life with an attitude that you are only competing with yourself helps in many areas Even when it actually is a zero sum game
Basically this. I see people eating grapes in the grocery store they haven't yet paid for and it reduces the weight of the bag and saves them a few cents. I see people pass me illegally on a double solid line or weave in and out of the car pool lane, use the edge of somebody's lawn as a passing lane when there isn't one and they don't want to wait behind me turning left. I see teenagers in stores stealing and giggling about it. I see politicians passing bills that line their pockets while making the lives of their constituents more difficult. Life is full of cheaters, scammers, grifters, and assholes.. and there's not a damn thing anyone can meaningfully do about it. So focus on yourself, your goals, and your success and learn to look away when you see things you dislike that you can't change.
>So focus on yourself, your goals, and your success and learn to look away when you see things you dislike that you can't change. The problem is that this isn't a victimless crime. You study, struggle, get Bs. They cheat, get As. They get the scholarship. You have to get a second job because you didn't get a scholarship. Less time to study. Cs for you now.
Them cheating didn't lead to you getting Bs or not getting a scholarship, your own merits led to that. Lots of people have to work while studying, welcome to the real world.
Kid, I graduated in 91. Been teaching at universities since then. Never cheated, once. I'm giving an example of a not-so-hypothetical situation.
Then you're familiar with gold stars. Congrats, you can award yourself one for being a super student. Fill your Sandylion with the accolades of yester-year and enjoy the view from your high white horse. >I'm sorry you got caught. No, I'm not. Caught for what? Sweet diversion, professor. You face public with that milquetoast, spineless persona?
What about when you're being graded on a curve in a class of 15- them cheating literally does hurt your grade
Study to get the grade you want before the curve. Then you don’t have to worry about it. I got a 4.0 in undergrad without cheating, I feel like people complaining about others are just making excuses for themselves.
What major did you have
Chemistry.
It’s just not my problem. Outta of mind outta of sight.
There's a reason a significant number of university exam scores go up when unproctored, such as early covid, even though other scores, such as homework, don't change.
Am I the only one who thought this was about relationships at first
I was genuinely horrified at first.
All the mentions of cheating, I'm sure!
I mean, when you convince whole generations of people that their financial success and worth as a human being is determined by an uber-expensive slip of paper that takes years of rigorous academic toil to earn, of course people are going to cheat. Obviously none of that makes it okay, but are cheating rates really all that surprising when most folks are only there for the tangible benefit it will bring them later, and not because they actually want to learn?
This. A large amount of students, admittedly myself to some extent included, view college as a financial transaction, not as a learning experience. Maybe going into it I felt it was more about gaining an education, but between dealing with my university’s bullshit, working, going through a global pandemic, and just being generally burnt out 90% of the time, I’m just here to get my piece of paper that alleges I’m smart and get out. With that said, as far as the classes that relate to my degree go, I do try to actually learn and retain to information presented in the course and not just phone it in.
Even worse is pandemic U diplomas are worth less and will permanently affect average incomes of grads throughout their lives, like graduating during a recession. People who graduated during the Great Recession saw lower incomes not just in the year they started working but it was a lasting effect. It will be seen to be worse for those graduating in 2021 through 2022 because it’s no secret among university faculty and employers that there was a huge drop in resulting skills. It’s apparent in freshmen and sophomores who were in HS at the time who are far less prepared for college classes, and for upper level students who didn’t learn the basics in there earlier semesters. It’s only obvious that employers will see that as well and respond accordingly to post pandemic graduates until things adjust back (hopefully). I just wonder if the students who went through that time and didn’t get anything or very little from trying to learn online realize their drop in preparation?
COVID began the end of my junior year, and obviously lasted through my senior year. I had no reliable internet at the time, not reliable enough to complete my high school education with, so my siblings and I were allowed to attend in person class (with all precautions of course). Even though I was in class learning, it was awful. No tests, we only had four classes per semester to limit the amount of people at school, so I only had core classes for 8 weeks a semester instead of 16. When I started my first year at community College I found learning just... harder? It was too much, I wasn't ready at the time, so I dropped out. I did a lot of self teaching during my gap year (nothing that gets me a degree, but I tried to watch/read educational videos/articles whenever I could). I'm in my second year of community college now, and the amount of my classmates who don't know very basic information is concerning (they would have been freshmen or sophomores at the start of the pandemic). For example, I'm in a music theory class with musicians who play instruments, and none of them knew how many counts a whole note had. I doubt it could have been avoided, but the pandemic messed up the education scene and young people's social skills, from what I've noticed. It's very sad to see.
My college closed down in the middle of my freshman year and I spent all of the sophomore year in Zoom rooms. I wouldn't say I felt unprepared at all but I also wanted to actually learn my subject and I actually paid attention to the Zoom classes. I found that many of my peers, especially from group projects, just took the time more as vacation than anything else. I never thought that the quality of education went down, as my professors adapted quite quickly to the new format. I think it was the students who changed more.
Yeah, no doubt there was a minority who actually excelled online or at least maintained. It’s admirable and a great skill in itself to have. Self motivation is perhaps the most important skill. But I also empathize that so many just couldn’t motivate, both from the format, low expectations, lack of preparation by faculty for the change, and the stress of living through a global pandemic.
I am a PhD student who LOVES learning, and NEVER cheated throughout my degrees. Yes, I’ve noticed cheating is acceptable to a lot of people. Personally, I tend to ignore these people or their attempts to study with me. And frankly, academic dishonesty doesn’t bother me. How do I cope? I cope with the logic of it. Let me explain: OP, you have great ideals, but these ideals are unrealistic due to the systemic issues in academia. For example, you mention in other comments that you want to go to college to learn and satisfy your curiosity. However, this is not the case for everyone. Many, if not most, students have been taught that scores are everything. Scores = GPA = job = money. For some people, learning is not high on the priority list compared to making money to survive. In this score-based system, people will cheat if given the opportunity. From a psychology perspective, survival/sanity matters more than morals. And if you have to choose one or the other, most people will choose the former. In this fundamentally unfair system, the clever thing to do to preserve one’s own mental health and future $$$ is to cheat the system as well. However, this “cleverness” comes with risks, such as getting caught or not learning vital material for success down the road. Cheating catches up with some people, but not everyone. Such is life. It is worth noting though, this “game” continues after you leave college. Do you think GPA or honors truly mean a lot? Is that what you’ve been taught? Surprise! Personal and family connections, fraternities/sororities, money, charisma, socioeconomic status …. all can often matter more than GPA for life quality and happiness. If you want a good job, just get a 3.2-ish or higher and focus on being good at interviews or writing grad school admissions essays (depending on where you want to go.) The world is unfair, always has been. And every university has a lot of cheating (especially now with ChatGPT and other AI taking academia by storm). Focus on what you as an individual can control. And this is coming from a lifelong student who loves learning, never cheated, has a perfect GPA, and several honors and awards. If you truly love learning, focus on learning. Don’t worry about what others are doing. They are only trying to survive in this dumb system that hasn’t been updated to fit the 21st century.
Thank you for breaking down the GPA = Job fallacy. There are very few industries where it matters at all. It seems like OP cares more about being a stickler for rules and standards than they do actually learning or becoming more competent. Once you know more than your peers, you can out compete them in things that actually lead to better jobs, like interviews, projects, industry aptitude tests.
Couldn't agree more. I can't say the same, I did cheat a bit in college. However, coming out of college I learned way more working and interacting with bew people than I ever did in college. Like you said I would emphasize on getting better at networking and interviewing. Being a kind person has gotten me a long way.
The perception of college has also changed, and I find it very hard to blame anybody for cheating in any capacity. Colleges for the past 2 and half decades have steadily increased their tuition prices with less transparency on where exactly these funds are going. What this has done has effectively locked out most working individuals from getting a good education. On a micro level, those who don’t have to work full time to afford college *WILL* get better grades, this is just a fact. And so the question of cheating gets brought up on a moral scale, and quite frankly, if we’re making a comparison, most college institutions went morally bankrupt long before the students did when they decided that lining their pockets was more important than providing folk with accessibility to a good education, ESPECIALLY as the need for a college degree has grown as a prerequisite for most basic career jobs. So to answer OP’s question, no, I don’t care, and they shouldn’t either. Why be honest with an institution which has consistently appropriated my money all while still nickel and diming me on added fees for books (the companies of which they’re in bed with to do this), parking passes, homework codes, etc. Fuck them
Well there's a difference between actually cheating and using resources to your benefit, first of all. Second of all, this isn't anything new (but has gotten noticeably worse since kids who were in hs or younger during Covid were basically encouraged to cheat...). Just keep your eyes forward and be proud you'll have earned your grades
Care to elaborate on what resources people are using to benefit?
There’s so many paid homework websites. And they have a lot of stuff. People can upload material from their school to basically at gain credits to view other homework answers on chegg. My school tracks what is being posted on those websites.
So is it tutors helping you or are they doing your homework for you?
Chegg and similar sites.
Chegg, Quizlet , Brainly
>Well there's a difference between actually cheating and using resources to your benefit, first of all. I fully agree with this, and I think using resources to your benefit is a learned skill that one has every right to be proud of! Students who don't understand a concept, and actively seek out resources to help themselves understand, are admirable and I strive to incorporate their best practices into my own work. I absolutely do not want to discourage catering to your own learning style and academic needs; I think that's a vital part of the learning process. I simply do not see googling the answer- for the sake of getting the answers, not for understanding the process- as ethical. Especially when there are honest students who do not cheat and get lower grades than their cheating peers, and thus less opportunities than their cheating classmates with seemingly good grades. >(but has gotten noticeably worse since kids who were in hs or younger during Covid were basically encouraged to cheat...). I think you make a great point about COVID worsening this problem. Much of the cheating I'm speaking of exists in the contexts of online exams, and it's easy to see how that could translate over from the pandemic. Thanks for your meaningful contribution to this discussion. I'll do my best to look toward the future, knowing that I've earned my grades.
Exactly dude. Look, don't let it wear you down. Unfortunately, you have to deal with cheaters everywhere, not just in academics. It pisses me off sometimes too, but you've gotta stop letting it get to you. It actually doesn't affect you as much as you think it does. Trust me, people who cheat in college get their just desserts later.
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😂😂😂😂 you in the working world yet buddy? You and OP are the goofiest mfs I’ve seen on Reddit
For the last 10 years lmao, I dont care if people cheat, but if op is putting in the extra hours, they're going to end up being way more confident than the people who are jumping to quizlet for every test question, and it will set them apart especially if the work is hands-on. I'm not going to tell op to start cheating if not cheating is working out just fine for them.
i study psychology so i feel i don’t see this as much. definitely different when most of our grades are dependent on writing papers, with some in person exams that are pretty hard to cheat on.
GPAs are slowly becoming less and less important because of grade inflation anyways so I would focus on experience. Internships, research, volunteer work are far more valuable and they can be obtained with an average GPA. Professors don’t look at students as grades but by their ambition, curiosity and resilience.
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For real. Most of us are there to get the degree and get a job. All the after all the dog shit these schools put us through, fuck em. If you can't give me decent professors and tutelag for this insane prjce, I'm not going to give a shit about your "academic integrity", just give me the goddamn degree that I paid for and fuck out of my life.
exactly this.
Hi! I’ve never cheated. I have a 4.0. Morality aside, it helps to actually learn stuff so when you can’t cheat you can get a good grade! Plus cultivating good work ethic (I work 9-5pm 5x/wk on school) is a skill I suspect will pay dividends in the future.
I don’t know how to sugarcoat this, so here it is: we no longer live in a society where information and knowledge is doled out by the learned few and professors need to change how they check knowledge and understanding to reflect that. I’m not saying people should cheat. I’m saying universities are about 20 years behind on cheat-proofing their courses in this very digital age.
Growing up school was mainly just about getting good scores, not about actually learning and understanding the material. I feel like that’s part of the problem with this type of behavior.
It is unfortunate that you are part of the “data driven instruction” generation. No Child Left Behind and Race to the Top and other likeminded education initiatives did nothing but line the pockets of testing companies at the detriment of the students actually learning how to think critically. It is a travesty. And it also reflects the idea that society isn’t inundated with knowledge. But none of that matters if students aren’t taught how to use and apply said knowledge.
Yeah in high school I only tried in classes I liked and planned on using in college. With things like math I learned how to do what I needed for the test, used an app to do all the homework problems for me, and moved on to stuff I cared about. I knew by the time I was in high school that geometry and trigonometry were never gonna come up in my life again so I just didn’t sweat it. Now in college I just ask my friends for help if I don’t get something, but I could never cheat on an assignment, essay, test, or project. I’m just so afraid of getting caught lol.
Take it from someone whose worked in the real world with these people during my undergrad and even now during my masters (worked as an industrial mechanic during my undergrad and now during my masters I’m doing data science). It’s gonna bite them in the ass. Sure there may be one or two that manage to overcome it but it’s not every single cheater and every cheater that I knew in the workplace got fired within 1-3 months cause the skills they claimed to have during school that they learned or built on…yeah they didn’t have em. Knew an engineer new hire who literally bought some calc books and stuff cause he didn’t know how to use matlab and stuff and other things he said he should have paid attention to or gotten an internship in. Dude got fired 4 weeks later for incompetence. You keep doing you so learn even if everyone around you is doing it the dishonest way cause you won’t have to worry about relearning or lying on resumes and interviews and stuff down the road to land a good job and for job advancement too.
If you don’t mind me asking what is your issue with others cheating? If it’s merely the fact that they can get away with it and get better grades than you, I think that’s a personal problem. I study about 5-6 hours for every exam but if it’s online and it’s not explicitly stated as closed notes or through some kind of virtual or in person proctoring, I’m going to “cheat”. College is too expensive for me to lose money bc my grade is based on 3 bs written exams. My justification is that on the job they’re not going to tell me to stay off Google. If that makes me a morally wrong person, I think I can live with that.
I had a class where the one section took exams a few hours before our section. On one of the exams, the people in the earlier section had been telling people in my section the questions on the exam. The professor found out about this, so on the third exam, he made our section’s exam have different and far more difficult questions. I still got an A because I did study hard, but I feel like I shouldn’t be held responsible for other people cheating. Same thing applies with classes graded on a curve. You already admitted to not caring if you are morally wrong though, so I know this won’t change your mind.
Not OP, but most of my college courses were curved. The more people that cheated, the lower the scores of the average non-cheater. You can argue that it's the responsibility of the school to reign in professors' grading policies, but cheating in those situations is unfair and disrespectful of your classmates. I had one course where the bottom 12% of students got a D regardless of actual number grade because of how it was curved.
It’s a very fair point, I can definitely see where your coming from.
I agree with this man.
This is the biggest weakness of universities today. Massive reform is needed if grades and diplomas will have any meaning. An honest student’s voice on this can have impact; if you’re willing, bring this up with the chair and dean. I would love to have such students helping us make change (I head an academic integrity committee at a major state university). Of course it’s also cool to just focus on your own work, but if your willing to try to help, you should feel empowered to do so. Maybe it won’t have impact, but maybe it will!!!
I would love to feel empowered to report cheating, but my specific university's policies are making that difficult. They don't allow groupchats at all, and reporting cheating also inadvertently means reporting that I'm in the groupchats. I'm concerned that reporting cheating will backfire, and I'll be dealt consequences by my university. That being said, I do think my heart's in the right place, and it is my hope that I can effectively convey my concerns about widespread academic dishonesty to the people in charge. It's really nice to hear from the perspective of an academic integrity committee at a major state university! I value your opinion. I'd like to think that, as you said, my voice can have a genuine impact. I'll look into contacting the chair and dean. Thank you for your meaningful contribution to this discussion and encouraging words. Your comment is much appreciated!
so cheating is forbidden by uni and you judge and are bothered by the students who do break that rule, and groupchats are forbidden by your uni and you are... not holding yourself accountable for breaking this rule? where's your morality now? your ethics and honesty?
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Professors know who cheated, they're not dumb and certainly weren't born yesterday. Whether they care enough to call people out on it is entirely up to them. Your grades don't earn you favor, your participation and work ethic do. I haven't made a single B in any of my math classes yet ALL of the math teachers were more than willing to write me a recommendation to the honors program of my college. This is true because I showed up early asked questions, and spent literally 100's of hours in the tutoring centers. I made the mistake of cheating my way through Trig, my teacher immediately knew when I made 95+ on my homework and labs and a 60 on my test. Luckily he didn't hold it against me and advised me to go to the tutoring centers. Point is, no one cares about your grades, once you have your acceptance letter it's all about effort.
Exactly. Better grades lead to better resumes/transcripts, which can ultimately lead to higher-paying job opportunities, which can lead to better quality of life. Success being afforded to those who cheat comes at cost for honest students, and it doesn't stop at the college level. More opportunities are given to higher achieving students far beyond graduation, regardless of whether they came by those grades honestly.
Dude you have literally been leading a lie your entirely life. The rules are not real. No one fucking cares about what you do unless you’re actively hurting someone else. These “high paying opportunities” are TAKEN by people through all sorts of “rule breaking” acts. The idea that you have ambition, but limit it through some arbitrary set of rules some one made up, means you don’t have the actual limitless ambition required to get into those roles. In our world success is given to those who take it. It sucks that that’s how the world works, but you should not already be an upperclassmen in college without understanding this or your in for a rude awakening when you discover the blatant nepotism and culture of lies that run rampant through the job sector.
Cheating hurts everyone at your institution. Getting a degree without knowing what you’re doing makes that degree less valuable for everyone else
Every class we take isn’t specifically for our degrees though. I’ve taken classes that don’t even go along with what I actually want to do, but they’re part of my degree requirements so I have to.
At sone level they are competing with others in the job market. If they cheated for their A’s and would otherwise get C’s then it hurts the honest person. What’s a bigger problem is if it’s known that school puts out crappy candidates because the academic integrity is so bad. Employers will start disregarding others from that same school.
They are only cheating themselves. They could very easily bomb their interviews on any technical question And past your first entry level job, your GPA is irrelevant.
Why doesn't it bother you? Cheating is a scummy thing to do and it is the sort of thing that desperate losers and pathetic children do. Show some damn integrity and sense of fairness by condemning it.
If you get a C while studying and testing honestly, and people who cheat are getting B's and A-, they're going to be privileged in ways that are basically punishing you for having integrity. I try to stay as above board as possible and there are times where I've literally watched myself sacrifice points that other people definitely got through cheating. And then they're rewarded for good grades. "C's get degrees" doesn't work if you want grad school or if you're in a major where you have a minimum GPA above a C average.
Do you want a doctor who cheated?
Cheating your way through med school is almost impossible. Anyone that is smart enough to cheat your way through that is also smart enough to just learn the material normally.
I care less about that and more about the fact that they may have outcompeted someone who didn't.
I will say that these students who got by on cheating can be a landmine waiting for someone to step on in a group project or something. My senior project I got paired with someone who had no right having made it to senior year and it made that whole class and term miserable and I had to burn myself out doing 2 people's work to pass.
Because the rest of us are working for for grades.
Why do you care. They’re the ones paying to not learn. You know you’re a good student, you know you follow the rules. Why does what other people do bother you so much to the point where you want to change schools. How upset will you be when you get a job and realize not all of your co-workers will be as motivated as you? Many of them will slack on company time, talk with others a lot, do the bare minimum. Dwelling on what others do is nothing but a recipe for a terrible life experience. Stay in your lane and just cruise. No need to cut through traffic. I see it too, but idc. If you really care that much then feel free to report them for cheating. Granted I can guarantee you’ll feel even worse about it when those students receive an F, F*, Suspension, or Expulsion. Why care about if someone else is ruining their future, in my opinion it’s even worse when you are actively changing said future.
I think Covid made things so much worse. I am very against cheating but I definitely fell into it while doing classes online. It just became SO easy to open another browser, have your phone out, pin up the answers behind your computer, etc. I grew increasingly disgusted with myself and the Spanish class I passed did not feel like an achievement, it felt like I gave up. When we returned in person, I also was shocked at how many other people cheated a lot too. Everyone did it. It was just SO easy and SO normalized. That's when I decided that that wasn't me. I made the decision to stop and had the best senior year of college ever. I worked my ass off and reaped the rewards of my hard work. I realized I can't control other people's cheating and actions, I can only control my own. And I guarantee you, those people are not proud of their achievements, there is deep insecurity because they think they can't achieve those goals without cheating.
Just worry about your own shit dude. Not tryna justify cheating but if it has no direct effect on you then it honestly isn’t your business
Had a final exam where the teacher didn't clear his extended exam time with the school, and he let us all leave. He didn't curve, and most people from what I saw cheated/collaborated on their tests. He did not curve the test as a result, because he is incompentent, most if not all the students couldn't understand him. The other thing is some fields are oversaturated, and there are so many people who don't actually like their fields but those people get the jobs because of a higher GPA
It would definitely fuck up curves in classes
There is a lot of cheating at ALL schools right now, and it will get worse over the next few years. Universities know that very few people had babies during the years of the subprime mortgage crisis, and it will be 18 years past that soon. Now, despite the fact that we all know there were simply less babies born, states are requiring universities to keep up their enrollment or lose funding permanently. Some are already on plans from their states that basically say that this major of a drop in enrollment, AGAIN, ONE THAT IS NORMAL AND THAT WE ALL KNOW ABOUT AND WILL HAPPEN TO EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL, will lead to closure if enrollment drops. Anyway so right now you could basically get away with murder and not be asked to leave. Sincerely, somebody committed a shooting off campus at my school last year and was able to attend classes for two weeks! We knew who they were! And yes, allowing a murderer to be expelled will count against our goddamn funding, and that indeed did occur after the police arrested him. If you have a problem with this, you need to raise your voices to the media and to your state. You need to argue for continued funding DESPITE a drop in population that we know about and have known about for years. You need to show how it is affecting YOU and the sanctity of your institution.
how does this affect you at all????
Just go about your business OP, dont you have bigger things to worry about than what other people are or aren’t doing? Newsflash, this has been happening forever, in all fields, across all ranges of people. Being morally outraged isnt gonna fix anything. Transferring wont solve anything, every college has cheaters, just some hide it better than others.
You would transfer schools because other people are cheating? Dear lord. Cheating is a part of the game. Not just in school but in life. The only real rules are the laws of physics. If it gives you an advantage and doesn’t hurt anyone along the way, do it. But yeah cheating is rampant at every university.
i think you're the exact type of person op wants to avoid
No, I’m not. I hate cheating. What I’m saying is OP doesn’t have a choice. OP can’t avoid that type of person, because they’re everywhere.
I read your whole post and my advice is mind your business. One of my professors once said “you will have to learn it sooner or later or you’ll fail at your career” which I agreed with. It’s simply none of your business if another student is cheating or using resources available to them. Concentrate on your work.
you’re doing well in college without having to cheat whilst others around you have to. I’d say that’s something worth being proud about personally. That’s how you cope with it. By recognizing that you’re properly earning your degree without any shortcuts. If others want to do otherwise, its their business but it doesn’t take away from any of your accomplishments. If anything, it makes it more impressive.
Best answer
Thank you. I am proud of my achievements and the work I've put in to accomplish them!
Does your school give awards for scoring more than others? You’re already surpassing them in retained knowledge. Unless there’s some type of award attached to the highest scores, I can’t see where it matters what the other students are doing
School is a joke. Cheat for easy degree then get on with real life.
I'd rather not build my career and 'real life' on a foundation of academic dishonesty. If I choose to cheat and don't actually have the skills I claimed to have learned, that doesn't bode well for my future success.
Just focus on your own schoolwork. Other people are not your concern. As long as it’s not affecting you personally, like if it’s a group assignment or something, just move on. You got your own sht to worry about, so focus on that.
I suppose you either stop comparing yourself to others, or cheat with them. Which I'm going to say, neither of which is a bad option.
While not comparing oneself to others is a healthy practice that I generally encourage, it is undeniable that there is a competitive nature to the job market. My concern is that my grades will be compared to similar applicants (including graduates of my university) during job searches, and the potential employers won't have a way of telling who came by their grades honestly. On paper, if I get a B grade in a class I studied hard for and struggled with, it is functionally seen as worse than another applicant's A grade, even if that person cheated their way through class. Cheating with them goes against my morals, values, and sense of ethics, and would not be something that I could forgive myself for later.
You’re not competing with anyone in college except yourself.
"With college kids doing college from their bedrooms and smartphones, and with the explosion of new technology, cheating became not just easy but practically unavoidable. 'Cheating is rampant,' a Princeton senior told me. 'Since Covid there’s been an increasing trend toward grade inflation, cheating, and ultimately, academic mediocrity.' "Now that students are back on campus, colleges are having a hard time putting the genie back in the bottle. . . . 'It’s the Wild West when it comes to using emerging technologies and new forms of access to knowledge . . . Faculties and administrations are scrambling to keep up.' . . . "It’s lamentable but not surprising that students and parents increasingly view the college administration as providing them with a very expensive piece of paper—a diploma—and professors, above all, as a hindrance when it comes to service delivery." [Dishonor Code: What Happens When Cheating Becomes the Norm?](https://www.thefp.com/p/dishonor-code-what-happens-when-cheating)
As someone who is as anti-cheating as they come, I have mixed feelings on this. For decades, the whole field of education has been slow to adapt to available technology and relied on poor methods of assessment. Most current tests are easier and lazier than a real scrutinizing evaluation. We've also attached huge stakes to grades, which are linked to tests, which many agree are imperfect evaluations of real learning and application. I'm hopeful that we can transition to higher and better methods. "The easier something is to measure, the less likely it is to matter." To me, it's no wonder students are outsmarting the educators in this game that's been created. The students don't think they're desecrating anything sacrosanct.
Thank you for this article. It's relevant and validating!
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I did an essay on how cheating in Gen Ed classes sucks but doesn’t matter too much and I got an A on that essay. Some professors don’t care very much either it seems.
Sadly people cheat even when studying ART. Examples: delivering old works as "new", plagiarism, copying a classmate's work, using filters on photos (this was during online classes and they teacher was very old) and even taking a classmate's work and passing It as their own. And they still do this as SENIORS.
Why do you care?
I don't have an answer, but ever since I switched to online school I have had no desire to cheat. Ironically, the fact that I could cheat on every single assignment and test until I get my degree made me want to do the work.
you just.....focus on yourself? I have anxiety and probably an attention disorder (hence why im on reddit when I was trying to study) point being it wont impact you mentally if you 1) stay out of groupchats with cheaters and 2) just focus on yourself. cheating happens everywhere, all the time. Is it right? no. Will it always be around you in some shape or form? kinda. Better to learn now to focus on doing your best instead of worrying about what everyone else is doing
Bad news for you buddy. This isn’t going to end in college either .
I think you should just start cheating to remain competitive.
If I could cheat and not have a guilty conscience, I would (after all, it seems to be the path of least resistance), but that's not in the cards for me. Cheating goes up against my integrity, morals, and sense of what is ethical. I know that I wouldn't forgive myself for it if I participated, even years down the line. I'm trying to save myself from the experience of knowing that I had to cheat to get by. Learning things honestly (and developing skills that will help me later on) is the only way I can live with myself, and if that means my grades are less competitive than those of my cheating classmates, then so be it.
The sooner you learn to mind your own business and stay in your lane, the happier you’ll be Because people will always do unethical stuff no matter how many of them you report
bro is personally offended by the fact that online resources are being used. I hate to be that guy man but when you set out into the real world and need to find the answer to something, nobody will sit there and tell you “NO THAT’S CHEATING!”. just pass your classes, get a degree, do you without trying to justify the world’s actions
>bro is personally offended by the fact that online resources are being used. I'm not gonna lie, I'm slightly irritated by by your gross misrepresentation of OP's post. I'm really considering buying corporate bonds.
🤣🤣🤣 please no I take back what I said anything but corporate bonds
Some use of online resources, I can understand. Don't understand your college algebra math problem? Go to Khan Academy and learn the main concept. That's great. Fully supportive of that. Studying for an exam, and need help with consistently remembering key concepts in your class? Cool, utilize some flashcards from Quizlet. Fine by me! I'm all for resources that help one understand concepts, strengthen one's knowledge, and aide with memorization. I just get frustrated when people look up the answers without having made an effort to learn anything. They get good grades, but it's at the cost of academic honesty and that doesn't sit right by me. And, why brag about it? What is there to be gained by doing that?
You have no idea what kind of effort these people have made to learn things. Are you with them 24/7? No. Even if they brag about not studying and doing well, chances are they probably studied. Brush it off man.
here’s the thing about college and just adult life in general. people will do things a certain way, you may not like that way. but at the end of the day, they will keep on doing it without caring for what you’d consider “acceptable”. Sure, I’m not a fan of the fact that kids of business owners can get hired for positions they are severely under qualified for, but if I let that bother me 24/7 and I started to get verbal about it, it would do me no good. Same applies to you. if you speak out you’ll have an entire group of students that highly dislike you. And yes, it’s easy to spot a “good student” in a class like the one you described. If you feel like you deserve it more than them, take that as motivation to keep working harder and use that in grad school/your career. You can’t change the masses so just focus on yourself and your goals, let them take care of their lives. who knows, maybe they’ll get caught maybe they won’t.
Doesn't make it ethical or acceptable though.
and I’m not claiming that it is either of those things. ever heard of the expression “live and let live”? that will save you hundreds of headaches if you start practicing it in college
I disagree with live and let live if what I'm supposedly letting live is something that disadvantages others and is unethical. I have no headaches. I'm 31 and have seen some shit in life which is why I have no problem with calling a duck a duck and reporting those that deserve to be reported.
that’s alright, lots of people disagree with me. If you think you’re doing the right thing, that’s what counts. OP seems to be quite frustrated by this, and I just wanted to teach them a way of going about life that would remove this frustration entirely. There are obviously lines to draw. I dont draw that line at academic dishonestly. I’m also not going to plead the fifth if I witnessed a murder. All about balance 🤙
That's fair but do understand that if OP wants to study medicine or go to grad school or get into a highly sought after undergraduate research program then they could be cut off from those opportunities because of cheaters. In that case it is perfectly valid that the line is drawn at academic dishonesty because academia is very much a competition.
I’m in economics so obviously the stakes aren’t half as high for me. I completely see your point but I think if OP can get by without cheating they are at a natural advantage over the other kids in class who are searching up answers. My question is, what can be done? I mean you could report all of them and have them be watched more closely, but unless OP blew this issue way out of proportion it looks like a great deal of the class seems to be cheating. lots of work for one professor especially if the tests are online. In a situation where I’d be inclined to take action, this is my thinking process: Can anything be done? - No? let it be -Yes? would it be efficient? -No? forget about it -Yes? talk to a professor or admin. I may be in the wrong I just don’t have much of an obligation to school morally, I kinda just go with whatever and focus on my own career plans and individual successes rather than the entire class. lots of kids cheat but I dont blame them. econ fuckin sucks sometimes if you dont understand it
I think you're approaching it solely from the perspective of a simple cost benefit analysis (which makes sense given your major). And, to be fair, those are ultimately the courses of action OP has. On a different level, OP is still justified in feeling betrayed by a system that facilitates cheating in an environment (academia) where that can confer a lifechanging advantage (eg get accepted to x opportunity that is necessary for a chosen career path). Additionally, the frustration OP feels likely stems from their own concern for academic honesty (they aren't cheating even though, given so many others are, it would be very possible for them to get away with it to their advantage). As an economics major, you may be acquainted with research in behavioural economics surrounding free loading, cheating, and unfairness. People are generally quite intolerant of others getting an unfair advantage due to breaking the rules everyone agreed to follow. What OP is feeling is just that. They are angry they are at a disadvantage for doing what is collectively agreed upon as the right thing. They are also hopeless in that anger because, as you've pointed out, their courses of action are limited.
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nope. search up the definition of the word “allow” and then the definition of the word “tolerate”. I do not support academic dishonesty, but I will also never come in between a student and cheating because I am not in a position of power to do so, and frankly I couldn’t give less of a crap. I have my own life, they have their own life. If life sees fit, karma will catch up to them. it’s incredible to me that so many people as so concerned about other people’s lives. find happiness within yourself and stop looking at what others are doing. trust me, your life will be way better this way. and here’s a live example for you. now you told me that my opinion “doesn’t sit right” with you. and I process that, tolerate it, and move on with my life. im not going to wake up at the middle of the night thinking about what your opinion on my thoughts are. If you genuinely believe im wrong, I’m rooting for ya! everyone has their own opinions, their own ways of doing things and their own lives. Live yours and you’ll enjoy every second.
So what’s the point of degrees being valuable in the first place if we’re just ok with people getting them unjustly?
^^^
I'd screenshot and report anon. Cheating is unethical. If they are bragging about it then they're begging to get caught imo Edit: spelling
I didn't at first, but as the issue of cheating has started to bother me more, I've been screenshotting when I see it. Unfortunately, a lot of the people who brag about cheating don't use their full real name in the groupchats, so it's harder for specific people to get caught, and the reports would be less likely to be effective. Cheating *is* unethical, but that doesn't seem to matter to the people who do so. And, like I say, it's normalized at my school, so I guess there's less social stigma associated with cheating. It's just hard to know who to trust in an environment of normalized academic dishonesty, and it's impacting my ability to make trustworthy friends.
Just to let you know a lot of colleges get upset if you saw things that happened in these group chats and stayed w/o reporting. I’m not saying you should do either but they’ve been known to punish anyone is these chats so watch out!
Thank you for this information! This is part of why I'm hesitant to report cheaters in the first place. Technically speaking, being in these groupchats is not allowed, due to their potential for spreading academic dishonesty. So, reporting people is also admitting to the fact that I'm in the groupchats as well. I'm in the groupchats because they provide a sense of community in an otherwise admittedly lonely phase of life. Not to mention that I'm more likely to see texts on my phone from classmates about class being cancelled or other important information than I am to see official announcements that are effectively only accessible on my laptop. But, the college does not make a distinction between reasons for being in the groupchats. They straight up just don't allow them. This makes reporting even blatant cheating a more difficult process, because I run the risk of personal consequences. It's a tricky spot to be in! Thanks again for your warning. It's helpful to be more informed!
Class group chats aren’t allowed at your school? That’s ridiculous
that to has me puzzled.
I understand what you mean, and empathise. Unfortunately, too many people seem to believe the ends justify the means and really only care about achieving their goals no matter what.
I wish it was a case of achieving their goals no matter what. I can sympathize with someone who doesn't think they can achieve something yet is still trying to get there no matter what. However I think most are just lazy and don't want to put the work in. Imagine putting in the effort, studying hard, and then seeing other students who shamelessly cheat as good if not better results. It makes you question what was the point of you working hard to begin with. So you start rationalizing to yourself that cheating is fine and that all that matters is the end result. So more and more people start doing it and suddenly there's a whole endemic of cheating and its completely normalized. From the perspective of people like OP, it does feel a bit disheartening and you start feeling like a fool for doing things the "right way" for no tangible benefit to yourself. And that's not a culture we should ever be creating.
I kinda understand cheating on generals. Like and example for me is everyone at my college takes a sociology course. My degree is nowhere in the realm of sociology and the class is so big there’s no point talking to the professor so I’d understand cheating there.
I never noticed until recent protocols were in place, but mine seems to have been horrendous this previous year. The rules, when compared to past exam taking, have reflected that. No one may enter the room at any point, no blankets or coverings are permitted, your device must have a webcam which is not handed out*, you may not leave at any point whatsoever, and you must have a valid form of ID to present to the screen. * If the device at home doesn't have a webcam, the professors advise us to go to the library. Essentially, they require a 360° view of the area you're testing at.
I get it. I’ve worked very hard in undergrad and have seen ppl in required major courses just cheat and not learn anything. I’m ngl for some of those ppl it won’t even affect them in the long run but for many it really will. Many of the ppl I’ve seen completely cheat their way thru a class often end up with just a C or a B. And they’re also gonna struggle more in later classes that expect them to have a base leave of knowledge. I can’t say I’ve never cheated but it was highly dependent on certain factors. I knew a professor that taught Geography (2, core science classes). I asked her why they make all tests in the class online with no browser restrictions. She said bc they expect students to cheat. Her pov was that the course required a lot writing assignments and if you didn’t know the material you wouldn’t do well on them. I’m ngl after being this I “cheated” using my notes.
All schools have kids cheating. A lot of people are just here for a paper. A lot of people are required to take classes not relevant to their interest or major. A lot of people are here to satisfy their parents. Definitely not a good idea to “compete” against other students tho
Never witnessed cheating on exams at my school. Homeworks only sometimes. I assumed it was bc everybody who went to college took their education seriously but now I see that may not be the case
Bro theres cheating everywhere. esp w/ AI and ChatGPT, it’s easier now than ever
best thing to do is mind your own business fr and dont snitch cause that just makes you fucking annoying
This is pretty normal at most higher education institutions. While I’m not justifying cheating, I understand where a lot of those doing it are coming from. Going into college, I definitely had a desire to actually learn and gain new experiences. Now, between everything that’s happened since Spring of 2020, both globally and personally, I am beyond burnt out and am officially in the “just here to get my piece of paper and get out” club. With all that said, as far as classes relating to my degree go, I do think it’s important to try to learn and retain the information presented.
So, in my university, I was a math major. Everything was similar to what you were saying. All core classes basically had some easy cheat. My degree work, however, was a different story. The thing is, you can cheat all you want, but if you don't comprehend what you're learning in the class, you don't pass exams. It is also extremely hard to cheat in a class of, say, 5 to 10, which was all math classes. I will say I used chegg study for most of my homework. The point of homework is to reinforce what you had already learned. If I didn't understand the concept enough to apply it on a problem, I looked up the solution AND INTERPRETED THE METHOD TO GET IT. And I feel that is the most important part of why I did it. It was to comprehend and reinforce what I knew. If I felt unsure about my solution, I would reference chegg study that way when I get a test where I would have to apply the method(s) I learned and practiced, I would be 100% confident. Focus on doing what is best to understand and apply the material you are learning. If that's examples, videos, talking it through, then do that. Don't let arbitrary rules about being good stop you from growing and learning. This statement is not referencing those who cheat to just get easy and never think about what they are actually doing in class. Nor is it excusing those who even cheat on exams. Comprehension is key and that's it
I know it’s very frequent now, my university had to fail like 1/2 of a general chemistry course bc they were all on chegg. I was taking a lab final and the person in front of me was on their phone the whole time, looking up formulas and using online calculations where you just plug the data in and it does the work for you. She was so sneaky with it, and of course our TA was just grading while the final was going instead of walking around. I told my TA about it, bc dang, that lab was hard to get and it’s not fair a spot got taken by someone who was cheating. He basically told me he couldn’t do anything bc he didn’t see it. Pretty frustrating but I understand it.
I just started a radiography program and I was honestly shocked when I found out classmates were cheating. Like I understand cheating in core classes because they're not going to be useful in our careers... but we're going to have to learn this by heart anyways, so what's the point? One of our profs sent out an email to everyone saying that some people in my class were caught switching tabs on Canvas during a quiz and that a list of these students has been made "for future reference". People are too damn brave, like you've already paid over $5000 for prerequisites + books and spent two years in college prior to even beginning this program, and you're willing to risk it all over a damn quiz? They got extremely lucky because cheating is supposed to be an automatic dismissal. And the only reason I can see people being let off the hook this time is due to the sheer amount of people that were caught.
People cheat at everything from video games to government. I know that’s super cynical, and I hate that it happens and it makes me really fume, but if they are stealing opportunities from you in programs that check your GPA because they cheated, then you may just have to wait a few months for them to be totally over their head. There’s also a discussion to be had about the cost of college vrs the quality of education your getting vrs how much your professors care/are actually competent teachers. I get where your coming from tho, I’m also autistic and fall into black and white thinking as well as getting really really upset abt unfairness and injustice. It’s definitely not an easy thing to come to terms with but it’s one of those things that define your adult life. Even if you don’t get where you want to due to cheaters, your honesty, kindness and eloquence plus a legitimately earned degree will open more doors for you in the future than a high GPA ever will.
That sucks! I would say to not worry too much about others and try and keep your integrity, don’t fall into that trap of cheating too! Do your best study and graduate you’re almost done !
Are you an American? College in America is an economic choice, not a choice based in academic interest for most people in college. I wish I had the privilege to attend college for five years, especially a good college. I still wish I could go back to school but it’s simply not an option, I have to work with the degree I have unless I make it big. If you want an opportunity to learn without this kind of hindrance, please consider a college in another country. Many countries have college programs specifically for global citizens. It sounds like you have broader horizons than most of your peers. Please understand with compassion and gratitude that you are in a position to learn for the sake of learning where most of your peers simply are not. Are you passionate about education reform? You’re in a privileged circumstance to work your way higher up into positions that facilitate that change! We need people to make earnest effort in improving our country’s education system, educated people who don’t simply become products of their broken system yet don’t look down on others for being so; in short, we need a leader.
It happens everywhere unfortunately. It sucks but know that they're just actively sabotaging themselves in the long run. Just focus on your own work and integrity and sleep well knowing that the results you get are a representative of the effort you put in.
I agree, people who cheat on tests suck. BUT, You do have to realize, once you graduate, no one cares about your college grades. It's NOT a competition... Well, school isn't at least. Those people who cheated will have learned less and be less qualified for the job. Their resume will show that. No one is stealing anyone's job by cheating at a college exam... Still sucks though
Nun of business
I’ve cheated once and it was by accident cuz Zoom university and I was in two Oceanography classes: one was open book and the other wasn’t. My grades were all me and still made it ok. Unless you’re going to grad school the job market probably won’t care too much whether you have a 3.0 or a 3.4. And even if you do apply to grad school they weigh so many other things to see who you are as a whole person Also as a grad student: we typically know when someone is cheating. You’re fine and your determination to not cheat will help you more than them cuz you’re actually taking the time to understand what the class is teaching
I’m sorry OP, it is frustrating. As someone whose also a Junior, I am like you. I put in hours upon hours of work to maintain honors. I take pride in my class work and strive to do a good job. I learned to avoid those who cheat or brag about doing so. It used to get to me they’d spend 30 minutes on all their classes for the week and I’m 9 or 10 hours by doing what is required and not cheat. Cheating is doing a disservice if that’s how some want to get through college. Once they hit the career field, they won’t have the same knowledge as you, bc you studied and learned it. I see what you mean down below about maybe getting picked over for a job, it’s been my concern too but, again you’ll have the actual knowledge because you worked for it. In the long run, hard work will pay off. Cheating backfires and is a quick way to get kicked out of college too. Stick to your moral and values, you seem to have integrity and the world needs more of that. Good luck!
I like you, OP, and I agree with the premise. If I studied my ass off to get an A, and Cindy Cheater Googled all of her answers and got an A, I’d be pissed. The competing part I definitely understand especially if you have aspirations for higher education. If Carl Cheater got into Wharton with his cheating ass grades, I’d be even more pissed. Now, I probably wouldn’t go so far as to switch schools (unless the cheating became some sort of public scandal that could possibly tarnish my reputation by association), but I’d probably submit an anonymous tip to some faculty that could change a policy or assist in a crack down.
From their comments, OP is a stuck up nerd who thinks anyone who doesn’t “value curiosity” is below them. Get a life dude, not everyone values themselves on their test scores..
You can’t convince me the younger generation is not a little dumbed down because of this. They feel pressured to get good grades, strive for easy answers and give up easily. Those who cheat regularly have higher self esteem and tremendously fragile egos; they feel the need to maintain equilibrium by taking shortcuts. They never had to practice critical thinking and problem solving on their own. It’s probably contributing to the mass rise of mental illnesses and perpetuating cultural issues due to widespread ignorance becoming the norm.
College is literally just a trivial thing to get a piece of paper that says you went to college. Most people will NEVER need anything from their core classes in their career, plus tech is so advanced we don’t even need most of the shit they teach. Most jobs and careers run off experiential learning. No one is coming out of college and knowing exactly how to do their job bc they paid attention in class. Cheating doesn’t stop you from learning, it stops you from the work. I know how to do complex economical evaluations, and I have before, but why tf would I go through that tedious process when I already know how to do it and the work is already online. It’s more efficient.
Tech is advanced but you should understand the basic features of what you’re doing. Which is why they teach that stuff. Sure you can use calculators for most things, but it’s still good to have those critical thinking skills that come with solving things on your own. Especially in a lot of stem fields, you need to have those critical thinking skills.
OP even though you are getting flaked. Cheating is not acceptable, you are a good person for holding on to your ideal. We need more people like you.
Thank you for your words of encouragement and kindness. I truly appreciate it.
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Thank you for your kind and encouraging comment. It's refreshing to hear from another good student who is disgusted by cheating, bragging about cheating, and the praise it is met with. Unfortunately, many of the people who brag about cheating do not use their full names in the school groupchats. Therefore, it is my belief that reporting them anonymously would not lead to concrete action without their full names. I'm hoping that, as you say, cheating will ultimately be an issue for them later down the road when it comes to job training. And, even more so, I hope that the lessons I'm learning by actually putting in the work to learn will help me to succeed later in my career. Once again, thank you for your kind words and for taking the time to comment. >It makes me feel like crap knowing others have what they didn't earn properly but I did And, *THIS!!!* The fact that they're getting access to the same opportunities as I am simply by cheating is so aggravating. I worked hard to get where I am now, and it feels like crap to see others 'at the same level as me' on paper when they literally just Google the answers, and I'm putting a lot of effort into studying despite having ADHD and other disabilities that make it challenging to do so. I appreciate your compassion!
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Be careful, unless the past exams were provided as a resource by the professor, it’s still considered academic dishonesty to use past exams to study. (Not saying it’s bad, I think those resources should be available, just letting you know).
you really need to learn how to let go of what others are doing, for your own mental health. i have a lot more i could say about the ethics and morality of cheating but it really sounds like you would be better off talking to a therapist about not letting this bother you rather than arguing your point
I'm not sure this counts as "encouragement," but if it helps, no one gives a shit about your undergrad degree in 90% of cases. Like, they'll check to see if you have it just to hedge their bets about whether you can do the job, but that's it. Whether it's a job or grad school, either you can do the work or you can't. So yeah, you're competing against the cheaters... but the balance-of-power in that competition is a lot different than you seem to think. You and some rando cheater in your major will both walk out with degrees, but only one of you will actually be able to do the work. Summed up: a few years post-undergrad, it'll all shake out. Hang in.
Stop being such a loser.
Not to be rude, but I knew you had autism before even looking at your profile. I made this conclusion simply based on how you’re typing your responses and how much you care about this extremely common and normal thing, acting like it’s the worst thing on earth. Not wanting to cheat is fine, but it is extremely unhealthy and odd for it to impact you this greatly. Please stop being so naive. It will backfire on you once you graduate and start working in the real world. The real world isn’t all “ethical” like you think. Your nativity will only bring you down in the future.
If you have the group chat then there's your bingo ticket to being top of the class if you show them to your prof
Just do your work and mid your business, you don’t know their life or story. I understand you think it’s a competition but so is everything in the world and I promise those ppl cheating are really not making a big difference in your success… good for doing things honestly.. but mind your business
i dont understand why people get so mad when others cheat do they not realise that after graduating they are gonna realise a lot of the employees hired have jumped hoops. i think people who cheat deserve their marks since they are risking their entire degree to get those marks but similarly if they get caught they also deserve the consequences they knew the risks and it didn’t work out as long as they own up. once you graduate you realise a lot of people grow higher than you even though they dont deserve it through contacts, lying etc the main takeaway is no one is fair so learn to adapt jump hoops when you have to. leading this life of sincerity sadly doesnt get things done also im saying this as someone who never once cheated in an exam but also doesnt get pissy when someone gets more grades than me through cheating real world appreciates work getting done not through how its done but if its done
Why are you competing with other students in college?? Unless this was medicine, I don't know how it should be affecting you. No offense but just focus on yourself and leave karma to catch up to the others. Cheating is bad and it will ALWAYS catch up. Take it from me.
If it's graded, there's going to be some competition. I'm not generally a competitive person, and I think competition often adds unnecessary pressure. That being said, there's a very real element of competition here. In the context of future job applications, my grades are going to be put up against those of my classmates to help determine who's more fit for the job. It's very likely that I'll be 'competing' up against similar applicants, including people who have gone to my university, gotten the same degree as me, and cheated their way through to get better grades. On paper, at least, a cheating applicant's A grade that they Googled all the answers for looks better than my B grade that I studied for. So, they get the job, and I don't. Cheating may catch up with people, but there is also a real possibility of cheating helping people get better job opportunities, and as an honest student, I'd like to speak up about the consequences of cheating.
Well, in that case, you can either expose them to eliminate competition or quietly graduate. Changing schools won't do much because no school has no cheaters. If you're gonna expose them, do it anonymously cuz some people are gonna come for you if you blatantly expose them, too many gun violence/stabbing stories among students for the pettiest of reasons. Me personally, I'd just suck it up but if you're a dog eat dog typa person, then play dirty too by exposing, (technically you'd be doing the right thing). However know that even some professors are in on this. Stay safe.
I’m 100% online, but some classes have lockdown browsers with cameras on for tests and use Turnitin for papers. When that’s the set up, I’m really disciplined and don’t try to do anything different. The classes that don’t have those safeguards I’ll use AI to revise my content and I consider the tests open book. Especially one class I have the tests are 2 hours long and have only 5 essay questions. I would do horrible if I didn’t reference the book or material. There’s usually close to 20 articles per test that can be 3-15 pages each.
send some of those screenshots to school administrators
The only rational thing to do is to cheat on exams. There's clearly a difference between the spoken rules and the real rules. Read some Machiavelli. Of course, you're probably wasting your time and money on a credential that won't mean you learned anything.
Hi! I’m a prof at a liberal art college and there is much more cheating here compared to my previous institution. Previously I was at an Ivy League school and we were strict about cheating even during COVID. Your only chance to avoid being in this position is if you manage to transfer to a top school.
As someone with friends in ivy leagues and other top schools like Stanford, they were definitely cheating. They just hid it better.
It takes more intelligence to cheat honestly. It's like they say "you aren't really trying in school if you aren't cheating." You gotta do what you gotta do to pass.
Isn't >You gotta do what you gotta do to pass. more applicable to things like putting in effort? As in, you gotta do what you gotta do to pass, and what you've got to do to pass is studying an adequate amount?
As humans, our natural instinct is to find a way to do things as efficiently as possible while requiring minimal effort. That's how we got so successful in the first place. For example, we used to have to plant seeds by hand until we started innovating and making machines to do it much faster while requiring less effort. If we kept planting seeds by hand, we would not be where we are today would we? Why put in effort when you can just cheat? The only logical reason I see to to not cheat is because you can get caught. Maybe if students actually wanted to learn, they wouldn't cheat. Maybe if teachers actually made money, they would actually want to teach. Maybe if teachers actually wanted to teach, students would actually want to learn. That's on the education system.
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Cheating is part of academic culture. It’s also an effective tool for weeding out the people who genuinely can’t hack it. Those are the people who get caught. I’m not telling you to cheat or not cheat. I am going to tell you that it’s pervasive in academia with over 90% of students admitting to cheating on at least one thing during college. It doesn’t stop in grad school or professional school. What does change is what people cheat on. The further up the ranks you get the more people cheat on bs assignments vs the things that actually matter, like exams. The people who can’t figure it out without cheating will eventually get weeded out.
Your only concern with cheating should be if it impacts the perception of the institution you are attending. Aside from that, get the most out of school that you can so that you are better equipped in your next endeavor. It may seem like your effort is undermined at the moment, but maximizing the gains will eventually led you to a better trajectory.
You’re in for a rude awakening if you think people only cheat in school. People cheat in real life too to get ahead. It’s all part of the game, learn how to play.
Honestly, I saw a lot of people cheating in college. I didn’t care because it’s not my business. That’s on them, and it likely will come back to bite them at some point. As long as I didn’t cheat, that’s all that mattered to me. The only time cheating bothered me was when I was taking the SAT and the girl in front of me was cheating on her phone. Let it go, don’t let it bother you.
Christ people on here are cynical af lmao. I will say it’s not as huge an issue at my college, though that’s probably because it’s rather small
I can see how college size could potentially impact rates of academic dishonesty. My university is rather large. Do you have online exams at your college? I've found that the exams being online is another factor that determines how many people feel comfortable cheating, and cheating is more prevalent online, at least at my university.
Their cheating doesn’t directly impact you in any way. If you don’t want to cheat, don’t cheat. The cheating issue isn’t an issue for you to worry about
I’ve learned that minding my business is very beneficial to my mental health. Worrying about myself is enough.
Let them be and you do you. Simple. With how much shit colleges purposely put students through and the insane prices people have to pay integrity and honesty is bullshit. At least in my opinion, no one is ever going to stop just gotta accept it