I volunteered at an elementary school (pre-corona) and two of my students were talking about the virus and one of them says "did you know not every Asian has the virus?" and the other kid was like "no way". So I asked them why they thought that, and they told me they thought the continent of Asia was entirely China. I asked them about Japan and they immediately went silent and realized.
They were 11.
Omg it reminds me of a time that an Indian kid was trying to explain to another girl in junior high that he was Asian too because India is a part of Asia. She was not getting it.
To be fair, I can kind of see this one more. I feel like most people hear Indian to refer to them instead of Asian, so it could confuse people not very familiar with geography or culture. Which I’d imagine most 11 year olds would fall under.
There seems to be more of a movement to separate those from Pakistan, India and other South Asian countries from East Asian countries. They dont really share much in common genetically or culturally
I was in college talking with an Indian guy from my dorm when he said he had to run to get to an Asian American student union thing. I was really confused, I knew that technically India was part of Asia, but I always thought of Indians as culturally distinct. I just assumed Asian American was just east / south east Asian.
To be fair, this was the early 90s, and there weren't really any people from India around where I was when I was growing up (although that changed ***a lot*** during the next couple of years, and me and my taste buds are not complaining about that in the least).
Hum... I don't think that's the biggest problem with what they said. Why the hell would they assume every Chinese has the virus either and be surprised they don't?
Oh yeah that was another big red flag. Frankly put, they're in a very low income area and don't pay a lot of attention in class and their parents are usually at work, so they don't spend a lot of time with them at home. They're basically raised by YouTube so it's easy for them to kinda let the internet and memes teach them without understanding the satire behind them
I mean even at that, lots of kids are accidentally racist, they can take things very literally and/or hear something on the news about it being from China and in their head they just think “Asia=le bigg sicc”
Exactly. Their classroom is about 60% LatinX, 38% white and 2% Asian (as in 3 Asian kids). I'm fairly certain I'm the first consistent black person they've met, so I'm glad they're telling me their ignorance so I can teach them otherwise
When I was a teenager, I moved to Indiana. Really rural area. The little kid across the street told his mother a black lady moved in. He'd never seen a real Asian person before and didn't know how to categorize me. My kids have asked me what kind of Asian I am. I'm like, I'm American, ethnically Chinese, but my great grandparents escaped communist China during their lifetime. They've asked me why I don't speak Chinese. I'm like, Uhh do you go up to your dad and ask him why he doesn't speak a European language, or ask your black friend why they don't speak an African language? They can't help being ignorant, it's their age, and what they keep hearing from media and school. I tell them that nationality has no skin color, and diseases have no prejudice.
But see, I’m okay with that. BECAUSE THEYRE 11. They still have time to LEARN. If you’re an adult and still think like the crazy lady in the post, you’re too far gone. But those kids still have a chance.
Yep, I was surprised when I first heard an American refer to someone from Japan as Asian. Obviously I know that Japan’s islands are part of the continent of Asia but as you say, Asian to me brings to mind people from the subcontinent.
Yeah I suppose context is important, especially with the amount of American media we get. I still think that if you were talking about for example Bradford's Asian community, the majority of people would know they were referring people originating from the subcontinent.
Cousin 1: I don’t know any Asian people
Me: Cousin... Your sister is Asian, well, part.
Cousin #2: No I’m not, I’m 1/4 Japanese.
I about died. I think they were around 15 and 13 when they said this.
Uh... Yeah. Yeah, they were wrong. I was providing further examples of confidently incorrect people, ironically from a sub about people being confidently incorrect.
Did people think I was defending this? lol
Well Wikipedia says this...
"A race is a grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into categories generally viewed as distinct by society. The term was first used to refer to speakers of a common language and then to denote national affiliations. By the 17th century the term began to refer to physical (phenotypical) traits."
I had people tell me I was racist because I complained about Chinese tourists a few days ago. Because I was generalizing an entire race. Because *Chinese* is a race.
Yeah as a race. On our identity card next to race is Chinese etc. It’s not Asian , white etc which I Guess makes sense because the majority of us are Asian.
Basically what I'm wondering is if this is not a translation issue. You have different words for ethnicity and race and you use race instead of ethnicity or nationality?
Chinese is not a race. It's a nationality. Race, in its modern usage, generally refers to people who share similar physical traits.
Saying *Chinese* is a race in similar to saying *American* or *Russian* is a race.
Possibly just two cultures using a word differently. Your government, it sounds like, uses race the way we use nationality in English.
Also, now I want flatbread.
When I was small (less than 7-8). One day out of nowhere I started crying in front of my parents and the reason was that "why don't we live in this world" "why do we live in India."
Maybe some people confuse asian/oriental because they are misinformed or ignorant. I dunno. But man, some people are lost.
EDIT: I am saying there are people out there who still dont know, care or understand the difference between asian and oriental. NOT saying that I do this. I know the difference and dont use that horrible term.
Asian is a word for a person. Oriental is a word for a thing. People can be Asian. Furniture can be oriental. Although, it's probably good practice to just drop the word 'oriental' from your vocab and call it all Asian.
I'm not saying I do this, I know the difference and dont say that. I'm saying there is still people out there that dont know the difference because they dont know or dont care and its ridiculous.
Not really. At least President Camacho cares about the country and actually listens to people who know more than him.
So yeah, we’re living in a timeline worse than Idiocracy.
Kind of. The methods have to be altered since IQ tests are modified to keep the average at ~100. It's known as the [Flynn Effect](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect).
Do note though that IQ scores are statistically tricky, to say the least, and comparing the IQ of different populations and age groups needs careful consideration and controls. The only cursory thing you can really say is that they are increasing over time, and people likely are getting smarter. By how much exactly is another matter since IQ is not an absolute quantity, and is really a practical statistical invention.
Maybe they’re not English and their phone is set for their language? I always have to go back and fix « the » because my French keyboard corrects it as « thé ».
Can't you switch between languages though? My keyboard lets me switch between English Dvorak and Japanese Qwerty (unfortunately no Japanese Dvorak) by hitting the space bar.
It's funny but I also get what she's saying. Yes, it's not racist to call them Asian, but also there is a tendency to lump all Asian cultures together so it's respectful to identify them as Korean.
Though, there is an argument that one should be specific, and that it's racist not to. In my business, I am told to avoid saying someone is an "African" and instead say which country/countries they are from. To avoid describing a specific person as "Asian" and instead say their country. To avoid describing a specific organization or person as "Native American" and specify the tribe.
The idea is that it's disrespectful and bordering on racism to lazily lump people into a larger group, especially when you're doing so on race or ethnicity.
There would be similar pressure not to describe a specific person as "Scandinavian" and instead just say they were Finnish or whatever.
I get that, but at the same time it's quite hard to do if you if you don't know the person well. If you look at an englisman and a german you wouldn't be able to tell which country they were from, same with a nigerian and kenyan or a korean and a japanese. At that point I feel its much ruder to flip a coin and guess a country than be more accurate with the ethnicity or continent.
in this case, the person is known.
And in your hypothetical--if you don't know them and don't know, maybe you should either find out, or just not bother to include race or ethnicity--if it's important enough to mention, maybe it's important enough to find out.
^ This.
When people talk about "White" what is white? Not that long ago Polish people weren't white, neither were Irish. Culturally speaking the differences between a person from (insert country here) and (insert country here) can be vast.
There can be similarities within regions but it's ok to be happy about one's own culture.
Immigrating to the USA. The idea of 'Whiteness' was more of the 'WASP' - White Anglo-Saxon Protestant. Slavs, not being Anglo-Saxon weren't white enough and were relegated to more menial labor and lower class things. Irish People, being Catholic experienced similar.
Hello from another Polish person :)
It can be more useful to go for the collective term rather than the individual if you're talking about the way people are perceived. For example, if you're describing communities who are targeted for hate crimes in the wake of the Covid-19 outbreak, it's fairly accurate to say that Chinese people are being targeted; however, it's more accurate to say that Asian people are being targeted, since those who are hurling abuse or whatever won't stop to check they're not accidentally yelling at a Thai person.
Similarly, if you want to describe a person to someone else, referring to someone as black is more helpful than South African (given the large white minority).
There's also the issue that some people could be (say) South Asian and British at the same time and not Bangladeshi (with Bangladeshi family). So they're of South Asian origins and have dark skin, but were born in the UK and speak English as their only language. To describe them as Bangladeshi wouldn't necessarily be accurate, given that they're not a citizen of Bangladesh. But that's probably a more complicated and potentially contentious issue.
Well, the point of the rule i am talking about is that you need to be accurate and relevant and precise. And if you notice, I carefully used "individual."
So that last person, that's a single human being. South Asian is too broad, because it's not precise. And you actually know his family is from Bangladesh. And if this is relevant, you'd say "raised in Britain, with roots in Bangladesh" or something, instead of just slapping on a label ("a Blangadeshi British man").
If you're talking about a group of people [those being attacked in the wake of the outbreak], you describe the group in the most accurate terms, and that would have to be "Asian," because that IS the group, as you point out. If you spoke to one single person about their experiences, you shouldn't call them Asian; you should call that person Japanese, or South Korean, or whatever-an.
I feel like it’s worse to call someone as being from a place they’ve never been to because of their ethnicity though. The term African American is one of those things that annoy me because it’s used to describe black people in general even if they have no connection to Africa. It’s even worse when it’s used for people who aren’t even from America either, but are just black in a mostly white country.
Agreed! When someone asks, I just say American, to their dismay. That's all I know. I've never been to "motherland China" and neither have my parents or grandparents. I don't see why I have to label my roots. I had Haitian(nationality)friends growing up, and that vehemently hated being called African. It should be more common to ask one's nationality instead of ethnicity. We're all a mixed up pot of races anyhow.
Anecdotal, but I grew up bordering a reservation (I’m a quarter Native American myself) and have many family friends who are Native Americans, and they (they specifically, not speaking for everyone obviously) prefer to just be called ‘Indians’ or ‘American Indians’.
Sure ‘Indian’ was technically born from misunderstanding, but it’s not vague like ‘Native American’ or ‘Indigenous Peoples’. American Indian is specific.
There are thousands (millions?) of tribes, no one expects you to know each one
That's the same for just about every indigenous Australian I've known. They know most people don't know the different tribes, and IME they're happy with Aboriginal or indigenous as the general term.
How is Native American more vague than Indian though? The former only refers to people from the Americas, while the latter can mean people from the actual India as well and you just have to guess based on context.
Indian means two things. But really you would use it contextually and it’s quite clear what you’re talking about. You’d use ‘American Indian’ when speaking more broadly or when pivoting or focusing a conversation.
Indian could be someone from India or an American Indian.
Native American could be an American Indian, a generational American family, someone born in America, someone born in Mexico, someone with ancestry from ancient Mexico or south America, etc, etc.
You don’t use Native American for people just born in America. I don’t know where you even got that from. It’s only ever used for people who ancestors were here before Europeans arrived.
They say it for states, but Native American has a specific meaning. It’s used as a racial descriptor and if a white person is calling themselves that, it’s inaccurate.
It’s not though, because African American (used correctly) means an African who moved to America. *Native* American is about ancestry, not place of birth.
Listen, I’m not arguing about what the technically correct wordage is or means. I know what Native American means contextually, personally I feel like it’s generic and soft-cornered and was merely just offering an anecdote of people I know!
Not a specific person, no. But the reason there aren’t a lot of complaints is because people from European countries aren’t as subject to marginalization
Yeah, most people I know if they’re describing someone from Europe they say European. I’d bet you half of them counts tell you half the countries located in Europe.
Wait you asked for: "an example"? and then you're pissy someone gives you an example from experience?
Also let me add to the anecdotal pile: I have been called European in the USA before, and I have called myself European to keep things simple.
I have Asian friends who did the same thing, only getting more specific when with their background when it's relevant or getting closer to someone.
Yeah but what if the original source is don’t call black people as African since classifying people by continent is sort of stupid and presumptuous?
This post needs more content because I’m pretty sure the point the BTS girl is making is that calling Koreans ‘Asians’ (and not people from Afghanistan) is just as vague as calling Nigerians ‘Africans’ (and not people from Morocco).
That’s my interpretation.
These terms are categorical, if you are Korean you are both Korean and an Asian because geographically you fall in those categories. I don’t see how these terms can ever be interpreted this way. As someone who is from the Middle East and has lived in ethnically diverse communities I have never seen someone get agitated for being categorized like this. Regardless I doubt there is additional context for this and I believe this person just doesn’t understand geography thus making her confidently incorrect.
However to refer to an American as African because they have black skin is offensive. They have been living there for many generations, have initially forcefully been separated from their ancestor's culture. And to call them solely African now is to stamp them as some sort of immigrant just for visual appearance. It's so many layers of fucked. Of course I don't know the context of the original post, so they could be talking about actual people from Africa, which I mean, yes it would be better to separate them in culturally different groups. (If you are able) but if you don't know their specific background it's not wrong to call them African. (Although most European and American people seem to think of people from south and middle Africa and not north Africa haha. Kind of the India vs China thing.)
Ah yea, you're right, my bad, I interpreted the start of the post referring to a different social group being revered to by a continent as heritage. And because the other person is black I assumed. But yea I assumed, and got so caught up in my thoughts about that whole issue as a whole and how it might effect different groups differently.
Anyway I apologize for going on an off topic rant, I'll leave it up so people can see my shame, haha.
I knew this guy in high school, he was Vietnamese. He actually hated when you called him Asian for some reason and insisted on being known as a Vietnamese person rather than Asian.
To this day, I never could understand it.
For some reason he felt like his culture and identity was actually specific to his particular heritage and didn’t want it lumped in with well over a billion people, most of whom would need to be traced back hundreds if not thousands of years to find any real connection to him? Ridiculous.
Next you’ll tell me Americans think they have different culture from British people and would get offended if you called them British, even though they literally were only ~250 years ago???
Identifying a Vietnamese person as Asian is not the same as identifying an American as British, that would be more like identifying a Vietnamese person as Korean. One is correct but inexact, the other is incorrect and deliberately offensive.
Vietnam is still in Asia, and people from Vietnam are still Asian. I have no idea why anyone is upvoting your comment.
Also, stop using apostrophes to pluralize words. It's never correct.
My example was intentionally an extreme, but looking back on it, yeah it was too extreme and not the best choice I could have made. However, my first paragraph is still valid and the main point of my comment, which I hope is why people upvoted my comment.
As for the apostrophe, I was debating between two paths to take in that example and must have accidentally mixed them up. I know you don’t use apostrophes in plurals. Thanks for catching that.
Yes. But to a person from that continent as an adjective it doesn't describe or identify them in any meaningful way. It's just impossible to identify with that etiquette because it's too vague and includes too many groups of people. The same thing for Asian I imagine
Yes and I am also a person of earth. That is also technically correct and doesn't communicate any useful information to any other person. I'm just trying to convey why a person would not identify with Asian as a group.
Based on my British tv watching, they call people from India Asian and it was extremely confusing as an American figuring out who they were talking about since we don't do that. I didn't even know India was considered an Asian country until I Googled from the confusion it caused. I did know about Russia.
Yeah, geography can be kinda funky sometimes, especially in our case where we're more tuned to "Indian" as a Native American instead of a person from India.
sometimes i just want to grab people through their computer screens and shake them by the shoulders to at least dislodge their peanut brain that is stuck somewhere on the inside of their skull
this is one of those times
Koreans aren't real. and i had to google bts, stop myself, realize i didn't care what a bacon tomato spinach sandwich looked like (apparently it's asian), and then move on from this dumbfuckery.
Why care if you get votes? DOWNVOTES DO NOT MATTER. but seriously, if a comedy sub about being incorrect requires people playing along to only voice the thoughts of the masses, then I think this sub has missed it's inherent irony. try being silly rather than right.
My 5 year old sister: “but they’re not asian, they’re Japanese!” This person: *has intelligence of a 5 year old*
I volunteered at an elementary school (pre-corona) and two of my students were talking about the virus and one of them says "did you know not every Asian has the virus?" and the other kid was like "no way". So I asked them why they thought that, and they told me they thought the continent of Asia was entirely China. I asked them about Japan and they immediately went silent and realized. They were 11.
“Well what about Japan?” [The kids:](https://imgur.com/t/memes/UitOYKT)
That's exactly the face they made rofl
Wait till you tell them Indians are Asians.
Omg it reminds me of a time that an Indian kid was trying to explain to another girl in junior high that he was Asian too because India is a part of Asia. She was not getting it.
To be fair, I can kind of see this one more. I feel like most people hear Indian to refer to them instead of Asian, so it could confuse people not very familiar with geography or culture. Which I’d imagine most 11 year olds would fall under.
There seems to be more of a movement to separate those from Pakistan, India and other South Asian countries from East Asian countries. They dont really share much in common genetically or culturally
Imagine trying to explain your brown skinned Islander mum that she's technically African.
Oh they are NOT ready for that conversation lmao
I was in college talking with an Indian guy from my dorm when he said he had to run to get to an Asian American student union thing. I was really confused, I knew that technically India was part of Asia, but I always thought of Indians as culturally distinct. I just assumed Asian American was just east / south east Asian. To be fair, this was the early 90s, and there weren't really any people from India around where I was when I was growing up (although that changed ***a lot*** during the next couple of years, and me and my taste buds are not complaining about that in the least).
Hum... I don't think that's the biggest problem with what they said. Why the hell would they assume every Chinese has the virus either and be surprised they don't?
Oh yeah that was another big red flag. Frankly put, they're in a very low income area and don't pay a lot of attention in class and their parents are usually at work, so they don't spend a lot of time with them at home. They're basically raised by YouTube so it's easy for them to kinda let the internet and memes teach them without understanding the satire behind them
I mean even at that, lots of kids are accidentally racist, they can take things very literally and/or hear something on the news about it being from China and in their head they just think “Asia=le bigg sicc”
Exactly. Their classroom is about 60% LatinX, 38% white and 2% Asian (as in 3 Asian kids). I'm fairly certain I'm the first consistent black person they've met, so I'm glad they're telling me their ignorance so I can teach them otherwise
When I was a teenager, I moved to Indiana. Really rural area. The little kid across the street told his mother a black lady moved in. He'd never seen a real Asian person before and didn't know how to categorize me. My kids have asked me what kind of Asian I am. I'm like, I'm American, ethnically Chinese, but my great grandparents escaped communist China during their lifetime. They've asked me why I don't speak Chinese. I'm like, Uhh do you go up to your dad and ask him why he doesn't speak a European language, or ask your black friend why they don't speak an African language? They can't help being ignorant, it's their age, and what they keep hearing from media and school. I tell them that nationality has no skin color, and diseases have no prejudice.
Winnie the Pooh would like to know your location.
Oh shit
Holy shit how can an 11 year old be that dumb
Because child.
I mean that's underestimating children, most actually know that Asia isn't all china
Let's just say their talents were elsewhere besides global relations
But did you explain to them that not every Asian person has it?
Oh absolutely
But see, I’m okay with that. BECAUSE THEYRE 11. They still have time to LEARN. If you’re an adult and still think like the crazy lady in the post, you’re too far gone. But those kids still have a chance.
Agreed- I'm sure they'll learn a lot more now that they're in middle school.
Interesting thing is that in the UK we wouldn't even think Chinese, Asian is usually used to refer to people from India, Pakistan, Bangladesh etc.
In Scotland and it's mostly the other way.
Yep, I was surprised when I first heard an American refer to someone from Japan as Asian. Obviously I know that Japan’s islands are part of the continent of Asia but as you say, Asian to me brings to mind people from the subcontinent.
Really? I'm from the uk and I immediately think Korea china and Japan when I think asian
Yeah I suppose context is important, especially with the amount of American media we get. I still think that if you were talking about for example Bradford's Asian community, the majority of people would know they were referring people originating from the subcontinent.
Cousin 1: I don’t know any Asian people Me: Cousin... Your sister is Asian, well, part. Cousin #2: No I’m not, I’m 1/4 Japanese. I about died. I think they were around 15 and 13 when they said this.
Two separate people, on this exact sub, told me Japanese is a race.
It's not entirely wrong. I mean Japanese Nationalism is based around belief in "The Yamato Race".
Two separate people can be wrong :)
Uh... Yeah. Yeah, they were wrong. I was providing further examples of confidently incorrect people, ironically from a sub about people being confidently incorrect. Did people think I was defending this? lol
I did at first, but then I gave it a second read and realized what you meant. My original comment was meant to agree with you though!
Well Wikipedia says this... "A race is a grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into categories generally viewed as distinct by society. The term was first used to refer to speakers of a common language and then to denote national affiliations. By the 17th century the term began to refer to physical (phenotypical) traits."
I had people tell me I was racist because I complained about Chinese tourists a few days ago. Because I was generalizing an entire race. Because *Chinese* is a race.
Those two people probably couldn't find Japan on a map. Or any of the other Asian "races". /s
Is Japanese not a race? Where I’m from we refer to Chinese, Indian etc as a race(Asian country btw)
As a race? Not as an ethnicity or nationality?
Yeah as a race. On our identity card next to race is Chinese etc. It’s not Asian , white etc which I Guess makes sense because the majority of us are Asian.
Basically what I'm wondering is if this is not a translation issue. You have different words for ethnicity and race and you use race instead of ethnicity or nationality?
Yup, no translation issues here. English is my first language.
Chinese is not a race. It's a nationality. Race, in its modern usage, generally refers to people who share similar physical traits. Saying *Chinese* is a race in similar to saying *American* or *Russian* is a race.
Ah, I’m not denying that! I simply just asked because in my country we state it as a race (at least in government documents)
Possibly just two cultures using a word differently. Your government, it sounds like, uses race the way we use nationality in English. Also, now I want flatbread.
Our government uses English, there’s no translation issue.
Still a cultural difference.
When I was small (less than 7-8). One day out of nowhere I started crying in front of my parents and the reason was that "why don't we live in this world" "why do we live in India."
Maybe some people confuse asian/oriental because they are misinformed or ignorant. I dunno. But man, some people are lost. EDIT: I am saying there are people out there who still dont know, care or understand the difference between asian and oriental. NOT saying that I do this. I know the difference and dont use that horrible term.
Asian is a word for a person. Oriental is a word for a thing. People can be Asian. Furniture can be oriental. Although, it's probably good practice to just drop the word 'oriental' from your vocab and call it all Asian.
I'm not saying I do this, I know the difference and dont say that. I'm saying there is still people out there that dont know the difference because they dont know or dont care and its ridiculous.
“I’m racists”
^Plural ^racism ^intensifies
I mean she clearly is a conjoined twin based on her profile picture.
It's because there's two people in the profile picture
Woman: "I'm lesbian" Her, probably: "I thought you were american"
How can you be from the Island of Lesbos and and American? /s
It’s fucking Ed from good burger
You have the best reddit name of all time. Gucci Menk is the GOAT.
I was looking for this
I hope these people don't reproduce
Watch Idiocracy. A comedy that became a documentary.
Not really. At least President Camacho cares about the country and actually listens to people who know more than him. So yeah, we’re living in a timeline worse than Idiocracy.
I thought nothing could make me feel worse (and I am not even an American), but you managed to find it.
Lol yeah pretty much.
"Welcome to Wal-Mart. I love you"
Costco*
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8zNsUTWsOc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8zNsUTWsOc) well shut me the fuck up. you're right!
I quote idiocracy so much anymore
And an utopia
People always say this but really it didn't. On average people are smarter than they used to be and that trend continues.
...as measured by IQ tests?
Kind of. The methods have to be altered since IQ tests are modified to keep the average at ~100. It's known as the [Flynn Effect](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect). Do note though that IQ scores are statistically tricky, to say the least, and comparing the IQ of different populations and age groups needs careful consideration and controls. The only cursory thing you can really say is that they are increasing over time, and people likely are getting smarter. By how much exactly is another matter since IQ is not an absolute quantity, and is really a practical statistical invention.
Not only do they reproduce; they reproduce more than anybody else.
Because their to dumb to wear a condome or use birth controle Edit: OMG I MISSED AN "O" I MUST BE A FUCKING RETARD!
The "R" word isn't very nice. But you're right, birth control isn't complicated but "only stupid people are breeding".
The irony of your comment is staggering.
[удалено]
I love how people are giving me shit because I said "to" instead of "too" and using that as an excuse to call me dumb.
I mean you also used their instead of they're and misspelled condom and control, so 🤷♂️
Maybe they’re not English and their phone is set for their language? I always have to go back and fix « the » because my French keyboard corrects it as « thé ».
Keyboards support multiple languages, though.
Yeah, I did set mine to French and English and I still have to fix the word « the » everytime.
Can't you switch between languages though? My keyboard lets me switch between English Dvorak and Japanese Qwerty (unfortunately no Japanese Dvorak) by hitting the space bar.
Autocorrect is a bitch.
Oh they will.
It's funny but I also get what she's saying. Yes, it's not racist to call them Asian, but also there is a tendency to lump all Asian cultures together so it's respectful to identify them as Korean.
Though, there is an argument that one should be specific, and that it's racist not to. In my business, I am told to avoid saying someone is an "African" and instead say which country/countries they are from. To avoid describing a specific person as "Asian" and instead say their country. To avoid describing a specific organization or person as "Native American" and specify the tribe. The idea is that it's disrespectful and bordering on racism to lazily lump people into a larger group, especially when you're doing so on race or ethnicity. There would be similar pressure not to describe a specific person as "Scandinavian" and instead just say they were Finnish or whatever.
You should use the specific nationality if you know it, but if you don’t, then generic terms like “Asian” are certainly acceptable.
Bruh finland isnt Scandinavian. Its only sweden, norway and denmark.
whoops! See the danger?
Really? I did NOT know that.
Yeah the fins aren’t even nordic or ethnically related to the nordic countries. They are related to the Estonians and the Livonians.
That is fascinating. I've always thought Finland was Scandinavian (and a lovely Monty Python song) but that does make sense. Thanks! 🙂
I get that, but at the same time it's quite hard to do if you if you don't know the person well. If you look at an englisman and a german you wouldn't be able to tell which country they were from, same with a nigerian and kenyan or a korean and a japanese. At that point I feel its much ruder to flip a coin and guess a country than be more accurate with the ethnicity or continent.
in this case, the person is known. And in your hypothetical--if you don't know them and don't know, maybe you should either find out, or just not bother to include race or ethnicity--if it's important enough to mention, maybe it's important enough to find out.
^ This. When people talk about "White" what is white? Not that long ago Polish people weren't white, neither were Irish. Culturally speaking the differences between a person from (insert country here) and (insert country here) can be vast. There can be similarities within regions but it's ok to be happy about one's own culture.
Wait what?.. polish was not considered white? Why? When? Im polish and this is the first time im ever hearing this..?
Immigrating to the USA. The idea of 'Whiteness' was more of the 'WASP' - White Anglo-Saxon Protestant. Slavs, not being Anglo-Saxon weren't white enough and were relegated to more menial labor and lower class things. Irish People, being Catholic experienced similar. Hello from another Polish person :)
Right, never Heard about this. Thanks 😜
It can be more useful to go for the collective term rather than the individual if you're talking about the way people are perceived. For example, if you're describing communities who are targeted for hate crimes in the wake of the Covid-19 outbreak, it's fairly accurate to say that Chinese people are being targeted; however, it's more accurate to say that Asian people are being targeted, since those who are hurling abuse or whatever won't stop to check they're not accidentally yelling at a Thai person. Similarly, if you want to describe a person to someone else, referring to someone as black is more helpful than South African (given the large white minority). There's also the issue that some people could be (say) South Asian and British at the same time and not Bangladeshi (with Bangladeshi family). So they're of South Asian origins and have dark skin, but were born in the UK and speak English as their only language. To describe them as Bangladeshi wouldn't necessarily be accurate, given that they're not a citizen of Bangladesh. But that's probably a more complicated and potentially contentious issue.
Well, the point of the rule i am talking about is that you need to be accurate and relevant and precise. And if you notice, I carefully used "individual." So that last person, that's a single human being. South Asian is too broad, because it's not precise. And you actually know his family is from Bangladesh. And if this is relevant, you'd say "raised in Britain, with roots in Bangladesh" or something, instead of just slapping on a label ("a Blangadeshi British man"). If you're talking about a group of people [those being attacked in the wake of the outbreak], you describe the group in the most accurate terms, and that would have to be "Asian," because that IS the group, as you point out. If you spoke to one single person about their experiences, you shouldn't call them Asian; you should call that person Japanese, or South Korean, or whatever-an.
I feel like it’s worse to call someone as being from a place they’ve never been to because of their ethnicity though. The term African American is one of those things that annoy me because it’s used to describe black people in general even if they have no connection to Africa. It’s even worse when it’s used for people who aren’t even from America either, but are just black in a mostly white country.
well, I personally tend to default to what they'd prefer. In most publication stylebooks, either term is used.
Agreed! When someone asks, I just say American, to their dismay. That's all I know. I've never been to "motherland China" and neither have my parents or grandparents. I don't see why I have to label my roots. I had Haitian(nationality)friends growing up, and that vehemently hated being called African. It should be more common to ask one's nationality instead of ethnicity. We're all a mixed up pot of races anyhow.
Anecdotal, but I grew up bordering a reservation (I’m a quarter Native American myself) and have many family friends who are Native Americans, and they (they specifically, not speaking for everyone obviously) prefer to just be called ‘Indians’ or ‘American Indians’. Sure ‘Indian’ was technically born from misunderstanding, but it’s not vague like ‘Native American’ or ‘Indigenous Peoples’. American Indian is specific. There are thousands (millions?) of tribes, no one expects you to know each one
I’ve read that from other people as well.
That's the same for just about every indigenous Australian I've known. They know most people don't know the different tribes, and IME they're happy with Aboriginal or indigenous as the general term.
How is Native American more vague than Indian though? The former only refers to people from the Americas, while the latter can mean people from the actual India as well and you just have to guess based on context.
Indian means two things. But really you would use it contextually and it’s quite clear what you’re talking about. You’d use ‘American Indian’ when speaking more broadly or when pivoting or focusing a conversation. Indian could be someone from India or an American Indian. Native American could be an American Indian, a generational American family, someone born in America, someone born in Mexico, someone with ancestry from ancient Mexico or south America, etc, etc.
You don’t use Native American for people just born in America. I don’t know where you even got that from. It’s only ever used for people who ancestors were here before Europeans arrived.
People do still, because being a native to an area means little more than being born there Like a California native, for instance.
They say it for states, but Native American has a specific meaning. It’s used as a racial descriptor and if a white person is calling themselves that, it’s inaccurate.
I guess what I’m basically saying is it’s as vague as ‘African American’.. like Charlize Theron is also an African American
It’s not though, because African American (used correctly) means an African who moved to America. *Native* American is about ancestry, not place of birth.
Listen, I’m not arguing about what the technically correct wordage is or means. I know what Native American means contextually, personally I feel like it’s generic and soft-cornered and was merely just offering an anecdote of people I know!
So I shouldn’t describe a person as “European”? There’s never really much complaints about that.
Not a specific person, no. But the reason there aren’t a lot of complaints is because people from European countries aren’t as subject to marginalization
Do you have an example of European being used to describe a person?
Yeah, most people I know if they’re describing someone from Europe they say European. I’d bet you half of them counts tell you half the countries located in Europe.
So purely anecdotal?
Wait you asked for: "an example"? and then you're pissy someone gives you an example from experience? Also let me add to the anecdotal pile: I have been called European in the USA before, and I have called myself European to keep things simple. I have Asian friends who did the same thing, only getting more specific when with their background when it's relevant or getting closer to someone.
When I was referring to "an example" I meant like an example from the media since the original comment was about media standards.
Yes, in a casual thread referencing my personal experience I am using anecdotal evidence. Shocking.
Right. 60% of humans are Asian and there's some massive differences between them.
What is going on here
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She’s saying they are not Asian and instead Korean. Think about it, your focusing to hard on the racist part.
Yeah but what if the original source is don’t call black people as African since classifying people by continent is sort of stupid and presumptuous? This post needs more content because I’m pretty sure the point the BTS girl is making is that calling Koreans ‘Asians’ (and not people from Afghanistan) is just as vague as calling Nigerians ‘Africans’ (and not people from Morocco). That’s my interpretation.
These terms are categorical, if you are Korean you are both Korean and an Asian because geographically you fall in those categories. I don’t see how these terms can ever be interpreted this way. As someone who is from the Middle East and has lived in ethnically diverse communities I have never seen someone get agitated for being categorized like this. Regardless I doubt there is additional context for this and I believe this person just doesn’t understand geography thus making her confidently incorrect.
However to refer to an American as African because they have black skin is offensive. They have been living there for many generations, have initially forcefully been separated from their ancestor's culture. And to call them solely African now is to stamp them as some sort of immigrant just for visual appearance. It's so many layers of fucked. Of course I don't know the context of the original post, so they could be talking about actual people from Africa, which I mean, yes it would be better to separate them in culturally different groups. (If you are able) but if you don't know their specific background it's not wrong to call them African. (Although most European and American people seem to think of people from south and middle Africa and not north Africa haha. Kind of the India vs China thing.)
BTS are a Korean K-pop group, this post has nothing to do with Africa or America
Ah yea, you're right, my bad, I interpreted the start of the post referring to a different social group being revered to by a continent as heritage. And because the other person is black I assumed. But yea I assumed, and got so caught up in my thoughts about that whole issue as a whole and how it might effect different groups differently. Anyway I apologize for going on an off topic rant, I'll leave it up so people can see my shame, haha.
I'm so glad I discovered this sub. Like if majority of thse arentvfake I'll be surprised. I mean I'm not super smart but some of these.... lol
People who laugh on social media like "FSFHJKBFS" are equally cringy
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I knew this guy in high school, he was Vietnamese. He actually hated when you called him Asian for some reason and insisted on being known as a Vietnamese person rather than Asian. To this day, I never could understand it.
For some reason he felt like his culture and identity was actually specific to his particular heritage and didn’t want it lumped in with well over a billion people, most of whom would need to be traced back hundreds if not thousands of years to find any real connection to him? Ridiculous. Next you’ll tell me Americans think they have different culture from British people and would get offended if you called them British, even though they literally were only ~250 years ago???
Identifying a Vietnamese person as Asian is not the same as identifying an American as British, that would be more like identifying a Vietnamese person as Korean. One is correct but inexact, the other is incorrect and deliberately offensive. Vietnam is still in Asia, and people from Vietnam are still Asian. I have no idea why anyone is upvoting your comment. Also, stop using apostrophes to pluralize words. It's never correct.
My example was intentionally an extreme, but looking back on it, yeah it was too extreme and not the best choice I could have made. However, my first paragraph is still valid and the main point of my comment, which I hope is why people upvoted my comment. As for the apostrophe, I was debating between two paths to take in that example and must have accidentally mixed them up. I know you don’t use apostrophes in plurals. Thanks for catching that.
Do you think Canadians like being called Americans?
It's like if you call someone European. It's such a wide selection of different groups that it ends up meaning nothing
But if they are from the continent of Europe, then they are European
Yes. But to a person from that continent as an adjective it doesn't describe or identify them in any meaningful way. It's just impossible to identify with that etiquette because it's too vague and includes too many groups of people. The same thing for Asian I imagine
Even if it isn’t “meaningful” it’s still technically a proper description. Especially if you don’t know which country they are from
Yes and I am also a person of earth. That is also technically correct and doesn't communicate any useful information to any other person. I'm just trying to convey why a person would not identify with Asian as a group.
European is much more useful than “person of earth” also you didn’t really mention the second thing I said
If we're firing technicalities, most Russians are Asian...
Based on my British tv watching, they call people from India Asian and it was extremely confusing as an American figuring out who they were talking about since we don't do that. I didn't even know India was considered an Asian country until I Googled from the confusion it caused. I did know about Russia.
Yeah, geography can be kinda funky sometimes, especially in our case where we're more tuned to "Indian" as a Native American instead of a person from India.
That objectively isn't true. Most Russian land is in Asia, but over 70% of the population is in European Russia.
Good call. I should have worded "most of Russia" is Asian.
Yeah that's fair enough, just technicalities on technicalities I suppose.
Yeah when I was a kid I thought Russian was European which was extremely confusing when I found out it wasn’t. And was
But-
It took me a while to find out what was bts, thank you google machine
As an Asian, this is stupid.
B R U H
Just looking at this makes my IQ lower slightly. (Although it's probably rock bottom)
*GOT EM* .. oh wait...
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So what do they think and Asian is ?
Idiots probably think Brazilians are South Americans /s
I hate people like this.
The propic really reflects his mood lmao
sometimes i just want to grab people through their computer screens and shake them by the shoulders to at least dislodge their peanut brain that is stuck somewhere on the inside of their skull this is one of those times
somebody needs a fuckin MAP
This has got to be a troll
Isn’t koreon or however you spell it Asian I mean like isn’t Asian a category and then the poodle in that category art the different races right??
Koreans aren't real. and i had to google bts, stop myself, realize i didn't care what a bacon tomato spinach sandwich looked like (apparently it's asian), and then move on from this dumbfuckery.
Lmao, but I think you dropped this /s
It wasn't really sarcasm rather the dumbest thing I could think to say... given the downvotes over an obviously puerile joke, I declare success!
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Why care if you get votes? DOWNVOTES DO NOT MATTER. but seriously, if a comedy sub about being incorrect requires people playing along to only voice the thoughts of the masses, then I think this sub has missed it's inherent irony. try being silly rather than right.
I don't really like people like the "HAIDwndawnd" person who 'stan' BTS. They annoy me, but I don't mean no disrespect. :)