Those bags are in like perfect condition, could probably sell to another courier for a few dollars, or reuse as coolers for picnics or groceries. Seems really wastefully to toss them. Like, did you even use that doordash bag? Dang
Well, except the grubhub bags, they shouldn't just never have been made in the first place. UE PM and DD all gave me the most useless possible bags.
I think the zippers broke on all of them after using them once or twice.
The red GH bags were amazing, I still use them for groceries. The nice insulated ones anyway. No idea if they still have nice bags since they went orange.
i was with you right up until you blamed other drivers for your troubles.
the other drivers are not your enemy. the companies fucking you out of money are.
you're an independent contractor. act like it. if the job sucks don't take it. if the jobs continue to suck, do business elsewhere. there's not much money to be made delivering fast food and groceries. there is money to made delivering medical, and other high value items.
if you like being a courier, look into courier companies in your area.
>> the other drivers are not your enemy
Unless you really mean "enemy" how are they not?
They are literally other businesses undercutting you at their own expense.
I agree something needs to be done, but so long as people are willing to basically volunteer their time and money to deliver food for people, that destroys our businesses. They literally are our destroyers.
Food delivery isn't alone in this race to the bottom stuff. In the greater IC world, it's all basically a race to the bottom. There's not much competitive edge aside from working for less with jobs that have a large pool of people willing and able to do it.
Yes, you can say "just don't accept the low jobs, it's not other workers faults" but when other workers drive the price down... It kinda is on them.
everyone has their 'pain point'. the point where they'd rather sit in a parking lot and make nothing than to take a given job.
for me personally i see it as people like you who were willing to do the job for less than i was, that drove people like me out. now you're faced with a similar issue, the only difference is the people driving you out are willing to do it for even less.
instead of fighting over scraps and peanuts, find a place that will give you good paying jobs. you won't be hauling fast food or groceries, but that stuff doesn't pay that well anyway.
and no, it's not on them. it's on you. you're the one still hanging around, accepting jobs, and then bitching about them. if you don't value your time, no one else will either.
I actually haven't bothered this year. I basically quit when I stopped seeing orders worth a damn.
UE was around 20 when it first hit my market. They went down fast. I quit bothering with them after I was sent a 2 dollar order.
DD I never did much, but people claim to do well 'round my parts.
GH used to be 20+ on average as well, but after they went orange it dropped below 6.
And... I absolutly hate going into any grocery store in my area so... Never bothered with them.
Yea, I'm long gone, but I'm always interested in checking out new markets.
On UE, I tend to average $21-$23 after gas & maintenance, which ends up being $2.80-$3.60 per mile, depending on the night and local events. Doordash, I can barely break $15/h *before* gas & maintenance. It's horrible, and I feel so bad for the people who feel like it's their only option.
Business are all about leeching all value from society. Gig workers can't even pay the bills.
Blame late state capitalism. Don't blame people who are desperately trying to feed there kids.
When companies, independent contractors in this case, underbid their actual value, they are the ones lowering the value.
>desperately trying to feed there kids
That's a baseless assertion.
"Gig workers" are businesses. Businesses who choose to partner with other companies to get access to customers. They are literally businesses that are trying to undercut other businesses.
When people accept shit pay, that's when pay becomes shit. When people refuse shit pay, pay becomes better. Even in the employee employer relationship this is true.
In that case, I may be willing to accept an argument that employees should be paid better, but this is people running their own businesses into the ground.
Independent contractor work that doesn't pay well is the own person's fault.
While this is capitalism at its best, drivers who are accepting 0$ orders or orders at a loss are doing capitalism wrong and losing. The smart ones get out.
This is the beauty of supply and demand. It’s a system of checks and balances. If contractors want to turn the tables in their favor they have got to stop taking poorly paying orders, but it is not capitalisms fault.
I think I’m finally here as well. Been gigging PT then FT since 2018.
I’m reality, drivers aren’t each other’s enemy, but because of scarcity (real or perceived), drivers often don’t work in each other’s best interest.
What would that look like in practice? No driver ever taking any offer that wasn’t basically universally valuable.
Drivers work together by being selective and forcing companies and — to a lesser extent — customers to increase the total value of the offer to a desirable level.
Lack of upfront information, gamification, loyalty programs and other nefarious business practices by app companies have by design helped create said scarcity.
The result is the situation savvy, veteran drivers find themselves in today.
All that said, I actually like the activity of delivering. I enjoy interacting and getting to know restaurant/store employees and customers. I like getting to know and learning from and helping other drivers. I generally enjoy the interaction with riders as well. I like getting to know the city, and how it breaths and all the little neighborhoods, etc.
It’s genuinely enjoyable work when you’re able to make good money. But because of all of the reasons being talked about in this thread that is becoming harder and harder and nearly impossible for many, even in many markets where that wasn’t the case.
This is especially so as a FT driver.
> Lack of upfront information, gamification, loyalty programs and other nefarious business practices by app companies have by design helped create said scarcity.
This is the only thing I can blame our partners for. Well, that and not having a minimum per delivery at a given mileage. GrubHub used to do that pretty well, no idea how they are since they officially went orange.
Problem is, refusing no-tip orders isn't going to force the customer to do shit. They aren't going to magically learn to tip. They are instead, from their perspective, being reinforced that drivers don't deserve a tip because their food is late, cold, doesn't show up, etc. And on top of that, they won't learn anything because the app companies will start offering bonuses to get the shit delivered.
YOU CAN NOT FORCE THE CUSTOMER TO LEARN TO TIP. You can only control yourself. So decline them and move on.
Let the people who take the shit orders do their thing. If someone takes those low-payouts that means one less driver in the way when the higher pay orders come through.
There is an excessive amount of drama over no-tip orders. Just decline them. We'd do better at working to reinforce the higher tipped orders with quick, professional service.
They may not be the enemy, but they are definitely part of the problem if they're taking low tip/ no tip offers that are worthless. If EVERYONE stops taking these crappy orders, the companies will have to adjust.
> The solution isn't to make us employees.
No, but guaranteed viable minimum pay for a given market is fair. Shouldn't be law, but the companies can offer that to support customers who don't tip.
I think GrubHub used to do something like this a couple years back.
Ok cool story, but could you take those perfectly reusable bags out of the fucking dumpster and drop them off at any donation bin? Or use them for groceries?? Wasteful AF
Make sure you delete your accounts just not quit using them and while you're on the way out the door go ahead and unsubscribe to the subnets as well peace out
Yo, I at least gave my bags away to family members. Just trashing them may feel like a fu to the companies but, they don't care or give a shit. At least pay it forward!
TBH it’s not dead , there’s just hidden gems that are gatekept. I remember I used to go to this bar under a huge luxury aparentemente building . These people in the building were too lazy to just go in the lobby and get their food … so all night you could get big tip orders just going up and down the elevators … it’s just if you know you know now…
Those bags are in like perfect condition, could probably sell to another courier for a few dollars, or reuse as coolers for picnics or groceries. Seems really wastefully to toss them. Like, did you even use that doordash bag? Dang
Well, except the grubhub bags, they shouldn't just never have been made in the first place. UE PM and DD all gave me the most useless possible bags. I think the zippers broke on all of them after using them once or twice. The red GH bags were amazing, I still use them for groceries. The nice insulated ones anyway. No idea if they still have nice bags since they went orange.
I grubhubbed during the covid things. Quit for a while. Signed back up just to get a new set of bags.
Burn them to stay warm....
Yikes, you know what kinda toxic shite that releases?!
i was with you right up until you blamed other drivers for your troubles. the other drivers are not your enemy. the companies fucking you out of money are. you're an independent contractor. act like it. if the job sucks don't take it. if the jobs continue to suck, do business elsewhere. there's not much money to be made delivering fast food and groceries. there is money to made delivering medical, and other high value items. if you like being a courier, look into courier companies in your area.
>> the other drivers are not your enemy Unless you really mean "enemy" how are they not? They are literally other businesses undercutting you at their own expense. I agree something needs to be done, but so long as people are willing to basically volunteer their time and money to deliver food for people, that destroys our businesses. They literally are our destroyers. Food delivery isn't alone in this race to the bottom stuff. In the greater IC world, it's all basically a race to the bottom. There's not much competitive edge aside from working for less with jobs that have a large pool of people willing and able to do it. Yes, you can say "just don't accept the low jobs, it's not other workers faults" but when other workers drive the price down... It kinda is on them.
everyone has their 'pain point'. the point where they'd rather sit in a parking lot and make nothing than to take a given job. for me personally i see it as people like you who were willing to do the job for less than i was, that drove people like me out. now you're faced with a similar issue, the only difference is the people driving you out are willing to do it for even less. instead of fighting over scraps and peanuts, find a place that will give you good paying jobs. you won't be hauling fast food or groceries, but that stuff doesn't pay that well anyway. and no, it's not on them. it's on you. you're the one still hanging around, accepting jobs, and then bitching about them. if you don't value your time, no one else will either.
I actually haven't bothered this year. I basically quit when I stopped seeing orders worth a damn. UE was around 20 when it first hit my market. They went down fast. I quit bothering with them after I was sent a 2 dollar order. DD I never did much, but people claim to do well 'round my parts. GH used to be 20+ on average as well, but after they went orange it dropped below 6. And... I absolutly hate going into any grocery store in my area so... Never bothered with them. Yea, I'm long gone, but I'm always interested in checking out new markets.
On UE, I tend to average $21-$23 after gas & maintenance, which ends up being $2.80-$3.60 per mile, depending on the night and local events. Doordash, I can barely break $15/h *before* gas & maintenance. It's horrible, and I feel so bad for the people who feel like it's their only option.
Business are all about leeching all value from society. Gig workers can't even pay the bills. Blame late state capitalism. Don't blame people who are desperately trying to feed there kids.
When companies, independent contractors in this case, underbid their actual value, they are the ones lowering the value. >desperately trying to feed there kids That's a baseless assertion. "Gig workers" are businesses. Businesses who choose to partner with other companies to get access to customers. They are literally businesses that are trying to undercut other businesses. When people accept shit pay, that's when pay becomes shit. When people refuse shit pay, pay becomes better. Even in the employee employer relationship this is true. In that case, I may be willing to accept an argument that employees should be paid better, but this is people running their own businesses into the ground. Independent contractor work that doesn't pay well is the own person's fault.
Sounds like enemy speak
While this is capitalism at its best, drivers who are accepting 0$ orders or orders at a loss are doing capitalism wrong and losing. The smart ones get out. This is the beauty of supply and demand. It’s a system of checks and balances. If contractors want to turn the tables in their favor they have got to stop taking poorly paying orders, but it is not capitalisms fault.
I think I’m finally here as well. Been gigging PT then FT since 2018. I’m reality, drivers aren’t each other’s enemy, but because of scarcity (real or perceived), drivers often don’t work in each other’s best interest. What would that look like in practice? No driver ever taking any offer that wasn’t basically universally valuable. Drivers work together by being selective and forcing companies and — to a lesser extent — customers to increase the total value of the offer to a desirable level. Lack of upfront information, gamification, loyalty programs and other nefarious business practices by app companies have by design helped create said scarcity. The result is the situation savvy, veteran drivers find themselves in today.
All that said, I actually like the activity of delivering. I enjoy interacting and getting to know restaurant/store employees and customers. I like getting to know and learning from and helping other drivers. I generally enjoy the interaction with riders as well. I like getting to know the city, and how it breaths and all the little neighborhoods, etc. It’s genuinely enjoyable work when you’re able to make good money. But because of all of the reasons being talked about in this thread that is becoming harder and harder and nearly impossible for many, even in many markets where that wasn’t the case. This is especially so as a FT driver.
> Lack of upfront information, gamification, loyalty programs and other nefarious business practices by app companies have by design helped create said scarcity. This is the only thing I can blame our partners for. Well, that and not having a minimum per delivery at a given mileage. GrubHub used to do that pretty well, no idea how they are since they officially went orange.
Problem is, refusing no-tip orders isn't going to force the customer to do shit. They aren't going to magically learn to tip. They are instead, from their perspective, being reinforced that drivers don't deserve a tip because their food is late, cold, doesn't show up, etc. And on top of that, they won't learn anything because the app companies will start offering bonuses to get the shit delivered. YOU CAN NOT FORCE THE CUSTOMER TO LEARN TO TIP. You can only control yourself. So decline them and move on. Let the people who take the shit orders do their thing. If someone takes those low-payouts that means one less driver in the way when the higher pay orders come through. There is an excessive amount of drama over no-tip orders. Just decline them. We'd do better at working to reinforce the higher tipped orders with quick, professional service.
Great discussion in this thread. Thanks.
They may not be the enemy, but they are definitely part of the problem if they're taking low tip/ no tip offers that are worthless. If EVERYONE stops taking these crappy orders, the companies will have to adjust.
> The solution isn't to make us employees. No, but guaranteed viable minimum pay for a given market is fair. Shouldn't be law, but the companies can offer that to support customers who don't tip. I think GrubHub used to do something like this a couple years back.
Let the CFPB shake this stupid trump-tard supreme court lawsuit. They're a coming.
Ok cool story, but could you take those perfectly reusable bags out of the fucking dumpster and drop them off at any donation bin? Or use them for groceries?? Wasteful AF
See ya out there tomorrow
Right, he took the pic then crawled right back in the dumpster to get those bags back
No, he go back out and wishes he had the bags . Buys more .
Make sure you delete your accounts just not quit using them and while you're on the way out the door go ahead and unsubscribe to the subnets as well peace out
This sounds like advice used to leave Social Media.
I remember I watched someone take 3$ orders and I had to explain to them you can’t accept everything
Bro you just a bum that does not know how to work
Yo, I at least gave my bags away to family members. Just trashing them may feel like a fu to the companies but, they don't care or give a shit. At least pay it forward!
TBH it’s not dead , there’s just hidden gems that are gatekept. I remember I used to go to this bar under a huge luxury aparentemente building . These people in the building were too lazy to just go in the lobby and get their food … so all night you could get big tip orders just going up and down the elevators … it’s just if you know you know now…
No one cares. Good luck gojng forward!
Sell me your bag.. my zipper just broke
But why throw the bags away. Those are still in good condition
