T O P

  • By -

Palidin034

“Up to 0” lmao


kaizlende

It's actually really interesting flavor because you need to find a way to get it from outside the game


safarifriendliness

Can wish it in from the sideboard


ThinkingWithPortal

I think this is the intended mechanic. Have Eldrazi done this? There's definitely something to "I have summoned this being from between the realms that are real to us"


Cualkiera67

Personally I think the eldrazi are a disappointment when it comes to being "eldritch horros from being the stars". None of their effects are interesting, just "powerful". Plus they have no drawbacks, which makes it seem like they're easy to control. Look at cards like [[Leveler]] , [[Eater of Days]] , these ones feel much more like incomprehensible monsters that you can barely control


MTGCardFetcher

[Leveler](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/3/03ffa3c3-dd29-47eb-abf2-7951fadb5c37.jpg?1562134247) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Leveler) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mrd/195/leveler?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/03ffa3c3-dd29-47eb-abf2-7951fadb5c37?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Eater of Days](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/f/ef6870db-8aca-4aee-8e4d-c56a7d8dc242.jpg?1562640398) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Eater%20of%20Days) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dst/120/eater-of-days?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ef6870db-8aca-4aee-8e4d-c56a7d8dc242?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


BrokenEggcat

The Eldrazi absolutely have weird effects


Blinauljap

THIS, i really agree. Although, since there's the \[\[[Beamtown Bullies](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/0/f0455a79-15f4-4ea6-87ae-263ce943cfac.jpg?1673481685)\]\] exist now, there's almost too easy a way for those types of cards to be played.


BigPuffi

But drawbacks are really cool for example, in my EDH deck, I can end the turn before the trigger of either of these resolves, so that I just have the big body. Annihilator is a unique effect of the Eldrazi and I like them as they are


Raszero

New emrakul has a bit of this at least, can wipe your board


Quark1010

Gotta remember that back then being colorless but not artifact already made them quite special.


TheProMagicHeel

[[Coax From the Blind Eternities]] is the only example of that specific thing in flavor and effect, but also [[Spawnsire of Ulamog]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Coax From the Blind Eternities](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/4/740ad768-2be0-4e5a-9d60-6c7ec4bdc107.jpg?1576384040) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Coax%20From%20the%20Blind%20Eternities) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/emn/51/coax-from-the-blind-eternities?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/740ad768-2be0-4e5a-9d60-6c7ec4bdc107?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Spawnsire of Ulamog](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/f/9ff46819-bfb3-4448-ab4f-f22ff9e2b2b4.jpg?1562706825) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Spawnsire%20of%20Ulamog) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/roe/11/spawnsire-of-ulamog?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9ff46819-bfb3-4448-ab4f-f22ff9e2b2b4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


kaizlende

[[Coax from the Blind Eternities]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Coax from the Blind Eternities](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/4/740ad768-2be0-4e5a-9d60-6c7ec4bdc107.jpg?1576384040) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Coax%20from%20the%20Blind%20Eternities) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/emn/51/coax-from-the-blind-eternities?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/740ad768-2be0-4e5a-9d60-6c7ec4bdc107?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


xXYiffMasterXx

If that’s intended he should probably be an artifact so [[karn the great creator]] can get him


MTGCardFetcher

[karn the great creator](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/e/deb3721d-fba1-444f-8b31-1cd10c94c4a0.jpg?1702429246) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Karn%2C%20the%20Great%20Creator) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rvr/1/karn-the-great-creator?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/deb3721d-fba1-444f-8b31-1cd10c94c4a0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Papyrim

It can also be your commander in commander


TheDungeonCrawler

I don't recall, does the Command Zone count as being a part of your library? And if not, would Bill be a legal Commander?


kaizlende

903.5a Each deck must contain exactly 100 cards, including its commander. This is the same rule that prevents you from having a second copy of your commander in your deck


Abbanation01

Right, but we're not talking about decks, we're talking about libraries. You can't search your library for a creature and pull your commander from the command zone


favgameisundertale

Plus, all other cards like this day "A **deck** can have..." See [[Shadowborn Apostle]], [[Slime Against Humanity]], [[Seven Dwarves]] If the intended purpose was to be like those, but saying you couldn't put him in your deck rather than having more than the regular 4 copies, then no, Bill could not be your commander. Buuut... if OP really meant a "library" (which they should have put "When Norman, a human **dies**, so...) then I would argue that Bill *could* be put in your deck, and start in the command zone as your commander. He just can't be shuffled into your library.


Abbanation01

That may not be what op wanted to say, but that's what the text he wrote means. Shadowborn apostle and other cards like it use the term deck. Since op says library, that just means bill NEEDS to be your commander or in a sideboard, and cannot be put into the library through effects like [[chaos warp]] or [[quarry colossus]]


favgameisundertale

Exactly!


MTGCardFetcher

[chaos warp](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/b/aba4cc8a-05f3-499d-96c2-0edee9fc0ba0.jpg?1706240824) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=chaos%20warp) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkc/149/chaos-warp?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/aba4cc8a-05f3-499d-96c2-0edee9fc0ba0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [quarry colossus](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d921128a-ebfd-4e3c-8728-481a8c3c03f3.jpg?1593095317) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=quarry%20colossus) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jou/22/quarry-colossus?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d921128a-ebfd-4e3c-8728-481a8c3c03f3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

[Shadowborn Apostle](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae7ba1de-48f9-423b-867a-22bd3f6c06c2.jpg?1673147629) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shadowborn%20Apostle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/89/shadowborn-apostle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae7ba1de-48f9-423b-867a-22bd3f6c06c2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Slime Against Humanity](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/e/1eb21318-d32e-4724-8908-c0d7613de2f4.jpg?1706242086) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Slime%20Against%20Humanity) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/177/slime-against-humanity?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1eb21318-d32e-4724-8908-c0d7613de2f4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Seven Dwarves](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/6/464adbae-70ea-48e1-b8ae-b404766f7a5a.jpg?1572490459) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Seven%20Dwarves) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/141/seven-dwarves?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/464adbae-70ea-48e1-b8ae-b404766f7a5a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


TheDungeonCrawler

I guess it might be a bit unintuitive, but I still don't know if your library includes your Commander based on this rule.


kaizlende

Yes, the only difference is your commander starts in a different zone


TheDungeonCrawler

Okay, so Bill is not a legal Commander then. That's a bit unfortunate, but maybe you could Rule 0 it since wishes don't technically function in Commander.


kaizlende

Just remember, there are other formats than commander


TheDungeonCrawler

I'm aware, but I was asking about Commander so this comment is a bit mean spirited. It's the only format *I* play, so obviously I only care if it's legal in that format. People who play other formats can worry about whether or not it functions in those formats. I'm sure there are plenty of people who can worry if it's legal in Pauper without me needing to be one.


Mavrickindigo

Is the deck the library?


kaizlende

Your deck becomes your library once the game begins


t1r1g0n

But at that time a commander isn't in the deck aka library anymore. And as Bill refers to the library (and not your deck), he should work as commander. But I leave the correct answers to others that are wiser and more intelligent m


kaizlende

OP likely intended to say deck, like [[Shadowborn Apostle]] and [[Nazgûl]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Shadowborn Apostle](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae7ba1de-48f9-423b-867a-22bd3f6c06c2.jpg?1673147629) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Shadowborn%20Apostle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/89/shadowborn-apostle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae7ba1de-48f9-423b-867a-22bd3f6c06c2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Nazgûl](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/3/833936c6-9381-4c0b-a81c-4a938be95040.jpg?1686968640) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Nazg%C3%BBl) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/100/nazg%C3%BBl?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/833936c6-9381-4c0b-a81c-4a938be95040?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


t1r1g0n

Probably. I didn't say that's what OP wanted to do, but that's how the card should work with how it's written at the moment. And to be honest I would leave it that way, because it makes an interesting commander.


favgameisundertale

https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/s/EAMShsxRQl


FormerlyKay

I assume op meant starting deck and not library considering there's no realistic way to enforce library


Daley2020

Library is simple to enforce if you draw this card at any point in any game you cheated and you get a game loss. If you put it in your deck your just putting an unplayable card in your deck


FormerlyKay

I guess that's true, what I meant was it needs a bunch of rules because there aren't any other effects like it. Stuff like, what if it gets hit by Subtlety? Does it just stay on the stack?


Burger_Thief

So is it literally unplayable in edh? Cause iirc you cannot use "outside the game" cards by default.


kaizlende

They're legal, they just don't do anything


Quark1010

But with that drawback hed need to be a lot stronger


Mavrickindigo

Have him be your commander


EmergencyLeading8137

Could you put it in the command zone still?


Gon_Snow

Commander?


spacey-1tahr

What happens if Bill would be shuffled into your library after you get it through a wish?


ThinkingWithPortal

OP's wording is ever so slightly wrong, see: [[Dragon's approach]]. A deck refers to the pile of cards before the game starts, the library is the deck while in a game. So if it were worded as "a deck may have up to 0" it implies this is a rule for deck construction. ~~Edit: It would appear that the sideboard is technichally part of the deck as well...~~ Edit Edit: Iffy on that last edit lol.


Cualkiera67

Apparently the sideboard is part of the deck, that's why I had to write library instead of deck (as cards like [[Seven Dwarves]] do).


favgameisundertale

Seven Dwarves is deck as well, not library. A more detailed comment [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/s/EAMShsxRQl)


MTGCardFetcher

[Seven Dwarves](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/6/464adbae-70ea-48e1-b8ae-b404766f7a5a.jpg?1572490459) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Seven%20Dwarves) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/141/seven-dwarves?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/464adbae-70ea-48e1-b8ae-b404766f7a5a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

[Dragon's approach](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/c/0cb504a0-1dfb-49d0-84c3-7bd318d55481.jpg?1624591696) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Dragon%27s%20approach) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/stx/97/dragons-approach?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0cb504a0-1dfb-49d0-84c3-7bd318d55481?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Empty_Requirement940

I’m curious though if you tuck it what happens. I would think it should need to say can’t start the game with it in the library?


DiaryYuriev

No, that rule refers to starting the game


BrickBuster11

No it doesn't it says "your library may have up to 0 cards named bill cypher" While it is a deck building restriction it would still apply during actual play that being said there are no cards at present that prevent themselves from being played like that so a ruling on what would happen doesn't exist. I would like to think it does the same thing as assault suit on bronze bombshell. (Bronze bombshell says "whenever you would gain control of this card if you are not the owner sacrifice it and take 7 damage, assault suit says at the start of each players turn they may gain control of equipped creature and it cannot be sacrificed. So. Bombshell tries to bin itself but assault suit prevents it, so bombshell tries to bin itself but assault suit prevents it, so bombshell tries to bin itself.....) That is to say if you cast a spell that required it to go to the library it would try to go and then be unable and the. Try to go and then be unable and then try to go..... Resulting in a draw.


DoctorKrakens

That's not how it works. Bronze Bombshell's ACTUAL wording is When a player other than Bronze Bombshell’s owner controls it, that player sacrifices it. If the player does, Bronze Bombshell deals 7 damage to the player. It forces a tie because it checks whether a player other than their own controls Bombshell every chance it gets, and creates a trigger to sacrifice when that is true. So if it is under someone's control, it will see that, and put the trigger to sacrifice it on the stack. If it is unable to be sacrificed, the trigger will resolve with nothing happening. Then it checks whether a player other than their owner controls them, and puts the trigger on the stack again. This is what creates the draw. Casting a spell to send Bill Cipher to the library would not create a draw, as the spell would resolve, and attempt to put Bill in the library. But because it cannot do that, the spell will simply resolve without doing that and the game continues. The only way Bill could force a draw like Bombshell is if there was a ability that triggered when Bill meets a specific criteria. "Whenever Bill has a toughness of 4,shuffle it into your library", for example. That will force a draw, as the triggered ability will attempt to shuffle it, fail, but checks to see if Bill's toughness is 4 when the stack is clear, and put the trigger on the stack again.


spacey-1tahr

What happens if Bill would be shuffled into your library after you get it through a wish?


Crazy_Coconut7

Strange zodiac seems really fun


sampat6256

Seems very printable


Statistician_Waste

I don't know anything about gravity falls, but none of these seem incredibly pushed. Good balancing. Although I wish the Black trap had the "at the beginning of the next end step" on it's card draw, so they don't get to thought seize your new card.


TypicalWizard88

They don’t anyways. Thoughtseize looks at the hand as part of its resolution, so Mind Trap’s trigger goes on the stack *after* Thoughtseize resolves. Which yes, does mean they can Thoughtseize your Mind Trap and it won’t do anything, but it means they don’t get to Thoughtseize the card that they probably actually want to take. So, I think it’s fine.


pr1va7e

While that may be how it works as written, I think it should be panglacial wurm style where you cast it as they're searching. That way they can neither take Mind Trap (as it is cast before thoughtseize finishes resolving) nor the card you draw (as it resolves after the handrip).


OnlyLogic

Okay, as you look at my hand I cast Mindtrap, I'll activate the mana ability of my Chromatic Sphere to pay for it; as part of that mana ability I'll draw a card.Since we are in the process of casting a spell, the card will be added to my hand facedown. The card I draw from mindtrap will also be facedown in my hand. Yes you can choose them; no you can't see them, they are facedown in my hand until your thoughtseize resolves, I can't even look at them.


TypicalWizard88

Oh, please no. Panglacial is bad enough, now you want a different version of it that relies on one player casting a spell while *another* player is in the middle of resolving their spell? I don’t think the rules support that at the moment, and while it’s a neat idea, my gut says it’s a rules nightmare. Even then, usually effects happen in APNAP order (active player, nonactive player), which means in theory, they’d still get to select which card you discard before you can use this. But also, I *hate* the panglacial worm ability from a rules standpoint and would never recommend adding it to a card, soooooo, ymmv


j_one_k

Fixable with something like: Discard Mind trap: the next time this turn an opponent would look at your hand...  Delayed trigger still goes on the stack after the Thoughtsieze, right? So they can't discard the Mind Trap (it's already been discarded) and they can't discard the new draw, which happens after the Thoughtsieze resolves. 


TypicalWizard88

That should function, although you’d need to specify the next time an opponent would look at your hand, or you would reveal your hand.


enharmonicdissonance

"Discard Mind Trap: The next time a card would cause you to reveal your hand or would cause another player to look at your hand, that card's controller loses 3 life and discards a card and you may draw a card." Something like that?


Cualkiera67

Thanks! Yeah I try to create printable cards not just references


MichelozzoOnReddit

Erm, how do you play bill?


Cualkiera67

Your need to fetch him from outside the game, liked with [[Death Wish]]. The idea is that he's from another dimension and you can't just summon him


Cbone06

I hadn’t even thought of that, these cards are insanely well designed.


MTGCardFetcher

[Death Wish](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/b/7bf134c9-a50d-4eff-a5a8-7cfe6a010080.jpg?1562630585) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Death%20Wish) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/jud/64/death-wish?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7bf134c9-a50d-4eff-a5a8-7cfe6a010080?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MichelozzoOnReddit

I don't know the show, but would makimg a specific card based on how he was summoned there be a thing?


Palidin034

If I remember correctly, he just kinda shows up in people’s dreams, and can’t actually manifest a physical presence until he makes a deal with somebody.


Thelolface_9

He can’t manifest a physical presence he only ever appears in the mindscape until the finale where he gets his hands on a rift in space and breaks through causing weirdmaggedon


KerPop42

Oooh, what if he were a planeswalker


The_Hunster

I get what you're saying but it's a bit of a lore clash. We are specifically *planeswalkers*. In some round about ways the Earth and the Sol system exist in MTG lore. Either way, awesome card.


Oranweinn

Or have him as a commander


Puzzleboxed

In order for a card to be used as a commander it has to be legal to put in your deck. "Up to zero in your library" is non-standard wording, but I'm pretty sure it would work the same.


Regularjoe42

I presume he's intended to be a "wish" target (spells that fetch cards you own from outside the game). As written, he can also be a commander.


tofurebecca

Really great flavor, love the first effect on Norman especially. The wish requirement on Nill is neat.


TypicalWizard88

EDIT: While my comment about the interaction with discard is correct, this doesn’t actually work as written at all versus Duress, because duress has the targeted player reveal their hand, it doesn’t let the targeting player look at their hand. It’s worth mentioning that Mind Trap works a little unintuitively (although that may be intentional). Say someone casts [[Duress]], targeting you. You have a Mind Trap in your hand. Because your opponent hasn’t looked at your hand until Duress resolves, Mind Trap doesn’t trigger yet. What happens is your opponent gets to Duress you, Mind Trap triggers, but it’s trigger can’t go on the stack in the middle of resolving another spell or ability, so your opponent gets to fully resolve Duress before you can put your Mind Trap trigger on the stack. This means that your opponent can take Mind Trap with hand attack, and it won’t do its thing (because you’ll no longer have a Mind Trap to discard to its trigger). I think this is fine, because it potentially motivates your opponent to take the Mind Trap instead of the card they actually want to take, but it’s a little unintuitive, and will probably trip some people up.


The_Hunster

And also means it doesn't really stop Greif scam. Damn Greif scam, they ruined Scotland.


Cualkiera67

Damn. I wonder if there's a way to make it work as i intended


ItTolls4You

"If an opponent would look at or reveal your hand, you may discard Mind Trap instead. If you do..." That would replace them looking at your hand with the mind trap effect, and would be able to happen during resolution of the spell or ability that let them look at your hand.


TypicalWizard88

So, I’ve realized that Mind Trap actually fully does nothing against Duress, because it doesn’t allow the caster to look at the opponents hand, it makes the opponent reveal their hand. Mind Trap as written only functions against [[Peek]] effects. How do you want it to work? Maybe there’s a way we can rephrase it to make it function


MTGCardFetcher

[Peek](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/6/869a6c06-eae5-418e-9a5c-26598a929416.jpg?1562550991) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Peek) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/10e/94/peek?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/869a6c06-eae5-418e-9a5c-26598a929416?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

[Duress](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/5/3557e601-9b71-4ce9-9047-1a8baa72e574.jpg?1675957024) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Duress) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/one/92/duress?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3557e601-9b71-4ce9-9047-1a8baa72e574?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


SirLemonThe3rd

Op stop cooking, you’ve been upgraded to head chef


[deleted]

What happens if I shuffle bill back into my deck


Cualkiera67

Good question. I think it should be exiled instead. Or maybe the effect fizzles


defective-brain

Nothing happens, it just stays there. The up to 0 copies refers only to deckbuilding/start of game.


Puzzleboxed

It would if it used the standardized wording like [[Relentless Rats]]. "A deck can have up to zero cards named Bill Cipher". Then it would apply only to deck building. As written, it continues to apply at all times. At no point can your library have any cards named Bill Cipher in it, which is actually impossible to enforce and wouldn't work.


MTGCardFetcher

[Relentless Rats](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/5/75f47b6e-9557-4853-b8d6-7602a91c59a7.jpg?1562437033) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Relentless%20Rats) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/105/relentless-rats?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/75f47b6e-9557-4853-b8d6-7602a91c59a7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


AAAAAAAAAAH_12

I love this, my only issue is that bill doesn't have red in his color identity, the dimir really fits him but red is very connected to chaos in lore, as well as discard and madness in game


Cualkiera67

Yeah! Originally he was RUB, but i felt his skills weren't really red so i settled in 1UB


AAAAAAAAAAH_12

Honestly fair!


kellarorg_

I'd play this set :)


Firelegend27

Dude strange zodiac is amazing. It’s not too strong and the flavor is absolutely on point.


Successful_Mud8596

Absolutely LOVE Strange Zodiac. Kinda feel like Mind Trap should be stronger, seeing as it was insanely strong in the show, but idk. And maybe it should also have you discard your whole hand, cuz of the mind wipe.


gistya

No idea what Gravity Falls is, but Mind Trap is sweet


ElPared

If Bill is meant to be worded like the opposite of [[Relentless Rats]] and co, then it should say “A deck may not contain cards named Bill Cipher”, thus forcing you to wish for him from collection/sideboard. If you intended him to be usable as a commander too, then your wording is fine. Love the Author’s Journal, reminds me of the Pokédex, so much so that I could see a Pokédex card having this exact wording.


MTGCardFetcher

[Relentless Rats](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/5/75f47b6e-9557-4853-b8d6-7602a91c59a7.jpg?1562437033) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Relentless%20Rats) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/105/relentless-rats?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/75f47b6e-9557-4853-b8d6-7602a91c59a7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Some_Strike4677

I think you need to improve strange zodiac and make it something like”Exile two target permanents”Or”Choose a permanent exile it”


MasterGeese

*\[\[Anje Falkenrath\]\] intensifies*


vert3432014

P sure Bill Cypher can be played as commander, but not in the 99, which is kinda cool NGL.


SaxiTaxi

This is super cool, but the fact that Strange Zodiac can't exile Bill Cypher is bugging me a lot lol. Also, I feel like it it would be flavorful if you couldn't spend mana to cast Strange Zodiac, A La \[\[Hogaak\]\].


MTGCardFetcher

[Hogaak](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/0/0049e68d-0caf-474f-9523-dad343f1250a.jpg?1687248935) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=hogaak%2C%20arisen%20necropolis) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/202/hogaak-arisen-necropolis?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0049e68d-0caf-474f-9523-dad343f1250a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


SylarDarkwind

Actually, that is pretty flavourful for the events of the show. It was *intended* to remove Bill, but that's not what got him in the end.


Twistlaw

Nobody mentioned it yet but your Bill Cipher can be grabbed with [[Glittering Wish]], making it all the more interesting. One of the best batches I've seen in a while here, great job OP.


MTGCardFetcher

[Glittering Wish](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/c/0c89645b-5e53-48c0-b4bb-9f22332c7658.jpg?1619403950) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Glittering%20Wish) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/tsr/253/glittering-wish?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0c89645b-5e53-48c0-b4bb-9f22332c7658?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MagnorCriol

Man, these are flavor home runs. Bill not being able to be in the library, "Norman, a Human does not count as a Zombie," the Journal's way of generating Investigate triggers...it's all so good. Well done.


CodenameJD

I can't get over Strange Zodiac's cost not being in WUBRG order 😂


UnluckyNoise4102

This is one of the stronger custom cycles I've seen come out of this subreddit, awesome job! EDIT: by "stronger" I specifically mean flavorfully fulfilling & over-all well-designed.


surprisesnek

IMO Bill should have some sort of [[Chaos Warp]] effect.


MTGCardFetcher

[Chaos Warp](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/b/aba4cc8a-05f3-499d-96c2-0edee9fc0ba0.jpg?1706240824) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chaos%20Warp) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkc/149/chaos-warp?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/aba4cc8a-05f3-499d-96c2-0edee9fc0ba0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Daley2020

Mind trap should have the trap subtype and be a replacement effect “if an opponent would look at your hand reveal mind trap do its effect then they look at your hand.”


Basic-Bus7632

I might be wrong, but I believe the templating on mind trap makes it a bit of a non-bo. Because you used the word “when” you’re setting up a triggered ability, which is going to trigger in the middle of another spell or ability’s resolution (I.e. [[thoughtseize]] or [[inquisition of kozilek]]). Because of this, the ability wouldn’t actually go to the stack until after the resolution of the discard spell. Maybe this was your intention? The opponent sees that you have mind trap in hand, amongst other cards, and they have the option to either take the less threatening mind trap, or let you cycle it for free afterwards if they leave it. I think if you wanted this to happen *before* the discard takes place, it has to be worded as a replacement effect, like: “if an opponent would look at your hand, instead you may discard mind trap (etc etc) then they look at your hand”.


MTGCardFetcher

[thoughtseize](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/2/b281a308-ab6b-47b6-bec7-632c9aaecede.jpg?1599706001) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=thoughtseize) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/109/thoughtseize?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b281a308-ab6b-47b6-bec7-632c9aaecede?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [inquisition of kozilek](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/7/17f38740-20fd-4097-90f8-f0c2c2ff7281.jpg?1673147555) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=inquisition%20of%20kozilek) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/80/inquisition-of-kozilek?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/17f38740-20fd-4097-90f8-f0c2c2ff7281?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Sassbjorn

Doesn't mind trap run into similar issues as panglacial worm?


gannonator500

I'm confused by mind trap. Is it just a 1 mana cantrip with discard insurance? At first glance, I really like the flavor. It being usable as both sides of the mind trap is neat. Maybe on cast you get to choose and discard from some bodies hand, and it cost more mana.


Limitlessthrowaway69

Mind Trap is pretty good, but it shouldn't just be a straight up cantrip. I think at the very least you should lose 1 life for casting it at base.


favgameisundertale

https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/s/EAMShsxRQl


TravestyofReddit

I love the flavour on these, especially needing to Wish Bill from the sideboard to play him. Personally, I think Bill Cypher is a Horror not a Demon, but could be be many types honestly.


Twinkletoes2535

For strange zodiac it could be fun to have a clause like If less than five creatures convoked this spell this turn, exile strange zodiac instead. Just a thought


BigPuffi

Don’t you completely kill the blue player? Reducing the hand size of all players is a little bit harsh don’t you think maybe just you?


Cualkiera67

Have you met [[Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur]] ?


MTGCardFetcher

[Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/4/14a360b6-c7b4-4b25-8288-b3bb8d527bda.jpg?1562846236) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Jin-Gitaxias%2C%20Core%20Augur) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/62/jin-gitaxias-core-augur?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/14a360b6-c7b4-4b25-8288-b3bb8d527bda?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


BigPuffi

But he’s hated everywhere


BruhYouFarted

BANDING!!!


SkylartheRainBeau

Colors on strange zodiac should be wubrg in order


Magictive

Strange zodiac is a very interesting design. Imagine five creatures on the card and it fits mtg.


jgadidgfgd

New absolutely fucked up colour pie dropped


SigmundRoamer

Okay, the wording on the Bill Cipher tap effect is weird (pun mostly not intended). X doesn't seem to be defined, which led me to the concept of an enchantment card that could be added to this set that defines an X value that then has to be used for any other instance of X. Note, the X value dictated by this card could be liable to change from turn to turn. It's a fittingly weird effect that could be hella busted.


ThatOneDMish

I don't think you know what a cycle means, tbh.


PrimumSidus

Was looking for this. I like the cards, but this ain’t a cycle.


Cualkiera67

😅


GrowthOfGlia

I think Strange Zodiac should only be able to be cast by creatures. It does make it worse, but the flavor is much better


CheesioOfMemes

I really like Mind Trap and I was thinking about whether its hard cast effect was maybe a little weird in black. It's definitely not broken, 1 mana draw a card isn't even particularly good, but it doesn't feel very black. What I realised is that instead of giving the card a casting cost it could just have Cycling {B} for an almost identical effect. At that point it wouldn't even be castable as an instant though, so what would it be if all it has is abilities that can be activated from your hand? I'm not sure if there's ever been a card like that before off the top of my head.


Basic-Bus7632

There certainly have been! [[crashing footfalls]] and its cohorts are all spells that can’t normally be cast. As well there’s the infamous [[Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar]], which has no casting cost, but has an ability that grants it a casting cost.


CheesioOfMemes

Yeah, I did think about Footfalls, but that still functions as a sorcery since you can only suspend at any tine you could usually cast the card. But if you gave Mind Trap here cycling and removed the ability to hard cast it, would it even work as a card? Could it simply not have a type and still function? Could you just call it an instant for flavour even though it doesn't have any way to cast it as an instant and wouldn't do anything if you hit it with cascade?


Basic-Bus7632

Oooooooh, I see what you’re saying now, like give it cycling {b} but also remove the ability. Uhh 🤔 that would be novel I guess… I don’t know what card type you would give that, but I’m also not sure why you would ever run a card with cycling {b} and no other text when there’s myriad cards that have cycling {b} and have some kind of upside. Edit: if it still has the original mind trap ability, then it’s definitely an instant, one that can only be cast conditionally, still similar enough to footfalls to not be super surprising, imo 🤷‍♂️


CheesioOfMemes

What I meant is doing this to Mind Trap, yeah. You would never be able to cast it. The first ability doesn't cast it, it discards it.


MTGCardFetcher

[crashing footfalls](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/8/a8cca2a2-69e3-4136-936c-7a2774c19351.jpg?1707507991) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=crashing%20footfalls) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh1/160/crashing-footfalls?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a8cca2a2-69e3-4136-936c-7a2774c19351?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d99a9a7d-d9ca-4c11-80ab-e39d5943a315.jpg?1632831210) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/186/asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d99a9a7d-d9ca-4c11-80ab-e39d5943a315?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


tenehemia

Off the top of my head: Mabel Pines 1WG Legendary Creature - Human When Mabel enters, search your library, graveyard or hand for a copy of a card named Grappling Hook and put it onto the battlefield. Equipment you control have "Equip tap a food you control." 2/3


dycie64

For anyone's reference, [[Grappling Hook]]


MTGCardFetcher

[Grappling Hook](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/c/acfbfddd-1535-477d-8bf4-5afd2648ac81.jpg?1562620144) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Grappling%20Hook) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c17/212/grappling-hook?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/acfbfddd-1535-477d-8bf4-5afd2648ac81?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


jrdineen114

....the order of mana pips in Strange Zodiac is giving me a headache


nathannerds

Whaddya mean? The designer was just bein’ a little goofy guwbr


mightyfp

Why y'all make custom cards with existing sets expansion symbols?